How To Run Your First Ultra Marathon- Training Plan and Long Runs 

hey, great video but would love to know also how you put the strength training and so on during the training session

@@nadhirulatiq5526 I'd suggest adding 1 or 2 strength sessions per week (start with one, eventually go to 2x). From the plan suggestion in this video - I'd suggest adding it to Friday (which was a rest day at first, but eventually became a 'normal pace / low mileage' day) or Monday (which was the rest day). If you do some miles the day of strength training (which I typically do myself) it's good to use those as a shake out/warm up. Slow pace, maybe 1-2 miles only. Strength session. Then a short and slow run. For me it helps with recovery (I think...no scientific evidence, just how I feel... honestly that may be 100% psychological). I don't think it matters so much which day - but what I'd highly advise against is doing both speed work (or intervals, or hill repeat - basically those Tuesday/Thursday in the plan I proposed) and strength session the same day. Higher risk of injury, and likely won't be able to push either during the high intensity run or the strength session. Doing a strength session on either Saturday / Sunday (back to back long runs) sounds like a terrible idea too. I wouldn't be as worried about injury if you do the strength session BEFORE, but your long run will just be miserable... Plus, time is a factor. For me, it's hard to dedicate enough time for my back to back long runs - it'd be harder to had a strength session. Hope that helps :)

100% and 4) in particular really resonate with me!! When you KNOW you can do it, you find a way. And the opposite too - when you doubt yourself, every obstacle becomes “evidence” that indeed you can’t to it!

Thanks! I’m glad I was able to put a few more together in the past few weeks while I’m not racing!

Thanks - you bet! And let me know if there's any topic you'd want to see in the future!

Awesome! Congrats and good luck on the next one :)

Glad it was helpful!

Glad it was helpful!

Good luck!

Ca fait plaisir!

Welcome on the channel! Good luck in your training and feel free to reach out! Plenty more tip video coming up

Glad it was helpful!

Thanks! It's coming up so fast - it's all very exciting!

Thanks for watching :)

Thanks! But it's still you doing the hardest part - putting in the work!

Camino ! That sounds absolutely lovely:)

Glad it's helpful

Thanks! Hope it's helpful :)

Glad it's helpful!

Merci!

12 months is a smart build up time! Good luck!

@@runningwithsimon Thank you 🏃🏃🏃

Good luck! Plenty of time to train hard until then :)

Thanks! Glad it's helpful!

Thanks! Glad it was helpful!

Thanks! Glad it was helpful!

Thanks :)

Great - good luck!

That's a great race! It's also probably a great choice given the very generous cutoff...as long as you are very self-reliant (aid stations were very far apart)

That is my back up race of the Florida keys 100 does not work out if I can't find a crew .

That's great, thanks! I think that's one of the thing that is great about this sport - I always still learn from other and vice versa. Helping each others! Have you decided what will be your next race?

@@runningwithsimon I am pacing and crewing for a friend at Javelina Jundred in Arizona soon then on to my 10th 100+m race at Rocky Raccoon 100M in February. Both in the US.

@@user-bs1lj3kv7h cool good luck! Yeah I know them, I'm racing Javelina this year again (4th) and did Rocky Raccoon last year - it's a very fast course!

Thanks! Glad it's helpful :)

I think the % of race goal will vary depending on the distance. Someone racing Cocodona 250 probably shouldn’t be doing 175 miles week, and someone doing 5k could do more than 3.5k a week. It’s also that I think although fitness has to increase slightly when going for longer distance, it’s “other things” that become more important. Like to be successful at 100 miles, it’s not that you need legs that are 4x stronger than marathon, but fueling properly becomes exponentially more crucial (and challenging). Doesn’t mean you shouldn’t put in the mileage obviously, but solving those other things is the X factor.

You're welcomed!

Glad it's helpful :)

That's great! Solid mileage, good job :)

Gotta trust the process! Doesn’t mean ultra ever go smoothly, but you’re doing what you’re supposed to!

Thanks! I'm really trying to show more what I think is the reality of the sport - which is simply 'ordinary people doing extraordinary thing', but that it's very achievable! And that we're all here to help each other! And hey - I know it's a bit cliche, but what truly matters is to work on yourself and be happy! Comparison is the thief of joy. Trail running is not meant to be a pissing contest - ... that's what ironman are for (quite literally it's a pissing contest - from your wet suit to doing it all over a fancy bike)

I feel this. I work a physical job and it’s soooo easy to overtrain and get injured. It’s also the best thing because I get a ton of time on feet walking

Haven't done nutrition or hydration yet. Big topic, working on both but it's going to take a little bit of time. Nutrition you have to trial and error for yourself for sure. I'd say for me, it fluctuate through time. At first (maybe 10ish hours) I can mostly rely on carbs and things like gels, gummies, sport drinks. But eventually I have to mix in solid/salty/fatty otherwise I'll be sick. Things like ramen, grilled cheese, chips, bacon. Oh and for some reason, coke always work - from beginning to the end. So I save that for later in the race when I struggle with food. As for fluid - depends on the weather. It's good to drink tailwind or anything with salt. If not, may need to take salt pills on hot days

Bonne suggestion, merci! Je ferai un episodes sur ca eventuellement!

Hey Kevin!! Congrats! Were you also thinking of Fat Dog too or am I confused? That's such a big topic! The "what" is so hard to find - I'll be happy to give suggestions as to what works for me, but in the end it's such a try and error. If you eat and don't puke it - sounds like a good choice. But even some times, what has worked in the past just doesn't work today (e.g., Leadville for me last year)... I know for me when my tummy is not happy, some of my 'go to' are ramen noodles, mashed potatoes, avocado and grilled cheese. And coke. But that's just me...

@@runningwithsimon Fat dog is out of the question this year now. I have my eye surgery on the same day. Thanks for the advice, this is the first time I suffered from a GI issue, I was known for my iron stomach. lol

Hi Jerry! Good luck :) I think I just answered on IG. Are you still searching for a race? Some of my favorite races are Aug / Sept - not necessarily the easiest but a lot of mountain races.

Good suggestion thanks.

@runningwithsimon Great content all around though, love the videos!

Sorry to hear that - hope it's better now...

You got this! Good luck :)

I must admit that the plan does seem quite light in that the longest single run is only 20% of the intended ‘race’ distance. I’m very new to all this though so I’m not doubting the plan or the guy’ experience, just verbalising my own thoughts on it I guess

​@@Nick-B78 Thanks for the feedback. I think it's totally fine (and normal) to explore when you are starting - pushing your limits to see what is and isn't productive and/or sustainable. We're all slightly different, and I certainly encourage finding your own limits (within moderation and being mindful of injuries). I still had to give actual numbers based on my experience but also from many others, these are fairly reasonable/normal/middle value. It's not by any mean the max one can do so and you can try higher. You'll just have to find your balance maximizing fitness, but minimizing risk of injury and takes into consideration time constraint given we're not pros. That said, I don't think it's controversial that anything above 30 miles is counterproductive (so only 30%) and that 70 mpw is usually plenty. I'd also suggest looking at the full back-to-back mileage (your 100 miles race will likely take ~24hrs, so it's fair to consider both days mileage). So 36 miles, which is half of weekly mileage. You could definitely do more, as mentioned I will sometime go to 26. I've done 2x26 in the past, and that was totally useless. It's better to have a 50 milers race in your build up phase. But you don't HAVE to, and at some point, quality beats quantity. If you have extra time, an extra weekly strength training session will likely help more than adding 5-10 miles on Saturday. Even Camille Herron says she doesn't go above 26 in training (which is less than 10% of the mileage she put in her 48hrs record). I think the one thing to be extremely careful of is the "hero workout" mindset proposed by some. Maybe it works for them, but maybe they’re built different? Because I can tell you not just from personal experience but countless others that it’s a trap. Little benefit, high risk of problems and not sustainable. I’m a strong advocate of training smart (which doesn't mean you aren't training hard too). It’s not as impressive but works better

@@runningwithsimon Hi Simon. Thank you for your detailed reply, it’s much appreciated. I guess something I hadn’t considered was the idea that the cumulative distance of the back to back training days was definitely a much larger portion of the intended race distance that would likely span the same period of time which definitely makes a lot of sense. For me personally, I’m looking more around the 50km race distance to start with which I sincerely hope won’t take me 24hrs 🤪 I think with that in mind, I probably would look to increase my distance at least a little more to something maybe around 30% race distance but also incorporate at least 1 ‘practice’ event of something around the 50-60% distance a good month or 2 before my A race. Currently, that A race is a 50km in mid-July and I’ve seen a 28km event I might consider going to in 5 weeks before.

@@Nick-B78 I think around the time I did my first 50k, I was at around about 40 miles per week, maybe little more. The biggest difference is I was not doing back to back long run, but my longest was still about 20 miles on saturday

Yes, I do! That's what I was trying to say by 'it's not only running'. But I'm not anywhere near as regular with it as I'd want to but aim for 1 or 2 a week. For the schedule example I gave, I'd do it on Wednesdays and Mondays. Nothing very scientific about it, it's mostly that I have more time on those days, and also want to avoid doing that on the same day as high intensity.

Good luck! Do you have a specific race in mind?

Great! Have you decided which 100?

@@runningwithsimon We have a trail here on the west cost of sweden that called Pilgrimsleden. And its just for "fun" running and challenge my self and hopefully lift the mental illness question among the people and what the forest gives for energy.

Congrats on the progress! A 70miles long runs weekly is a lot indeed ... just watch out for injuries!

@@runningwithsimon Hi thx, I have a Mortens Neuroma injury since 2019 but have learn to live with it, was running in Altra's before but since they don't have a GTX road or even a proper GTX trail shoe I bough a pair of Saucony Ride 15 C`GTX and my foot is doing so well in them when I run I'm even now looking at the Xoudus Ultra 2 as they look even better

You can switch some of the speed work or intervals for hill repeat. Make sure to have strength sessions 1-2 per week.

Not sure if you saw this video - but if you are preparing for a hilly race, would suggest adding some of this. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-d7umfn5yXCU.html

Sweet congratulations!

Yeah that's smart. Pace is everything for sure! If you go at your race pace, no matter the distance, you're really pushing your body at its limit!

I don't typically do this, but it meant I ran 6 miles at about 9min miles, and took a full hour in between of doing whatever else. That was mostly just because of the extreme heat. If I recall correctly, the 3x 60 min break, once I went to eat, once I went to apply for a Whitney hiking permit, and last time I went to check in my hotel. Normally I'd just run that without break, but it was 105-110F and I was not adapted to heat yet. Walking outside for those 60 min would have been almost dangerous. Your water gets hot within 20-25 min. I drank my two bottles in less than 1 hour - I'd need to carry much more.

Yes, so what you are looking for is high intensity/short period of time. Which there are many ways to achieve. So for intervals that's basically it. Shorter 'burst' of high intensity, with rest period in-between. It really doesn't necessarily have to be on a track (I never do that), but at least somewhere you can go full blast (so not a trail...). 6x800m with ~2 min breaks, but it can also be based on time too (which is simpler if you are not on a track). The total distance isn't so much what matters here, but rather the intensity. And overall, that's a 40ish min workout (but do include a warm up period). For the hill repeat, you simply need to aim for the same effort-wise. Burst uphills, cool down on the downhill. Rinse, repeat. Overall 40ish min. I'm a big fan however of using something is relevant but available. If you are going to race trails with a lot of elevation gain, hill repeat are better than pure intervals. If where you live is flat, you can still find solution. For example when we lived in cambridge MA (which is super flat), we'd use the stairs from the Harvard stadium. A 'lap' took about 40 min so that was perfect.

Ah that's a great question! And not straighforward to answer. Even just "is the 80 / 20 applied to your weekly mileage, or weekly time working out?". And as you said, shouldn't the warm up and cool down be part of the 'slow miles'. Being a rule of thumb, the 80/20 is really just directional - 81/19 and 79/21 is fine. And the point is really simply that you should do most sessions and time and miles at low intensity/low pace, and about ~2 speed / high intensity work per week. The mileage itself matters more for the long run as you need to increase gradually, whereas for the speed work (or hills), it's more about session time (and intensity) than mileage. For example, if you compared 2 hill training session, aiming for same duration and same intensity, but one is on a steeper hill (~40% vs. 10%). The workout with the steeper hill would naturally be much slower - meaning less miles - but in terms of impact on fitness, it's similar because it's as straineous. So the way I try to organize it is if my speed work was calling for ~5 miles, that'd mean a total session (including some warm up cool down) of maybe 40-45 min. But if it called for 7 miles, I'd convert that to about ~60 min total session. About 10 min warm up + 10 cool down, we're down to 20-25 vs. 40 of the intervals, or such.

I think that's fairly personnel, but I wouldn't change my plan. We don't lose fitness that quickly. I personally only taper for a week, but it's also not like adding one week of training will make a massive difference. So it's personnel, but I would just follow the training I already had. It's normal to deviate sometimes from the plan, and unless it's massive (e.g., injuries preventing you from running for several weeks), I think the plan is still the plan.

Hi Daniel! I actually did my PhD in Sweden (Karolinska) and really miss Sweden... Anyhow - feeling you about covid and lost of motivation. I hope things are getting better. Totally agree about working towards a specific goal - finding the next adventure - something that is "an ambitious challenge"...a little scary but also motivating. Something you know you wouldn't be capable today, but you'll put in the work and get there! I'm working on a couple of movie to help with that, as right now is "planning season" for next year racing. And what are the unexpected new challenge at various distance. You're spot on... Nutrition: it's always important, but get drastically more important when racing 50 miles or above. AND drastically more difficult. First, it's to practice fueling in training/long runs. Second is to have somewhat of a plan so that you don't overeat or undereat during the first few hours (e.g., "I'll take 1 gu gel every 30 min, and drink tailwind only"). Eventually however, that gets impossible. You either shit yourself or puke. When you start feeling that things are changing for the worst, you need to rethink what you eat. Potentially eating less too, but trying to at least get something. For me (and it's so personnal, you have to find what works for you), but for me, I can have carbs at first for like 10 hours. After that, I need to switch to more salty/fatty/solid/warm food. Ramen noodle, mashed potatoes, grilled cheese, bacon. All work pretty well for me. Some people will need to start earlier rather than later. Coke, for reason I can't comprehend at all given it's pure sugar/carb, works well both at the start and finish. I also carry both water and tailwind (or any brand) with me, particularly for hot race. Tailwind is best because of calories and salt, but if my stomach is upset, water can help me at least keep drinking (and I'll take some salt pills for electrolyte). That doesn't solve the calories, but at least it solve 2 of the 3 problem. Finally, if you reduce your calorie intake, then it can be smart to slow down a bit to avoid crashing too bad once the calorie deficit catches up to you. Overheating: You can try heat adaptation training. Some dry sauna (which are plentiful I presume) works well. I have a video on that. But short summary is that if you have a race in heat coming up, you can start 3-4 weeks ahead. That WILL increase your sweating rate, so you'll need to get used to drinking more and potentially more chaffing. But it helped me for Badwater where temperature were sometimes above 50C. Oh, and the difficulties with heat is not just feeling hot. You mentioned puking above - eating is much harder. Alternative training/cross training: I'd separate strength training (leg day you mentioned) and cross training (alternate training you mentioned). Strength training is key to injury prevention - so this should be part of your 'running' schedule. Squat, lounge, toe raise. Don't neglect core either. There's a billion variety of those - as long as you have 1 or 2 session a week going through those muscle group, you'll be good. I tend to do 3x15 or 5x10 for each. Cross training - that's different. It's good and I recommend. But if time is a factor (and it is for me), I often have to focus on running, and cross training is more an alternative when I can't run instead (e.g., I'll cycle if I have heel pain, maybe swim if I have knee pain). So that at least I'm still maintaining cardio but not aggravating an injury. But otherwise, it's just so hard to find enough time to do both. Hope that's helpful! Simon

​​@@runningwithsimon Funny how the world works. I RARELY ever comment on YT and when I do it turns out to be to a person with relation to Sweden. If you ever wanna come back and combine with a race I can recommend Kullamannen 100 miles. I am born and raised where the start is and live 1.5-2h drive away these days. If you decide to go and neee any support or even housing don't hesitate to hook me up. I am gonna sign uo for 2025 myself, already got my mind set on it. 2024 is too agressive considering my current state. Thanks a ton for your lenghty reply, I actually instantly found your heat adaption video after posting my first comment. I was not aware you could heat adapt with the help of sauna. I will take all your advice with me. It seems I got the grand scheme of things somewhat figured out but I am lacking the experience to understand what works for me and nutrition. Gl with your future races!

@@danieljohnsson1862 Thanks - really appreciate the offer!! And glad it’s helpful and good luck. Don’t hesitate to write if you have any questions in the future.

Thanks! 40-55 miles every week? Sounds like you already have the base you need! Good luck :)

Thanks! I spent longer than I can admit putting this one together...

Did you see my interval video? ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-fi7SXN4MQpo.htmlsi=xQhNM-LuDJ_xt57j There's a 'soft' limit to distance (or time) and repeat for interval. Because the goal is not distance, but rather intensity. If your resistance is higher, than you should go faster - not longer. I like doing 8-10x 1 or 2 min + 2 or 3 min recovery. 10-15 min warm up and 10-15 min cool down. Or 4x 4min with 4 min break. Your pace for 1 min interval is not the same as 2 min or 4 min. The 1 min should be something you would not be able to hold for 2, and so on. That pace, as you keep training, will increase. But it's a full on effort. I go by time myself, but distance like you do is totally fine too.

@@runningwithsimon I watched the interval video today it was really informative. I'm going to switch to time intervals next interval session. Thanks again for your help and content 👌

110F with high humidity sounds brutal - I don't think I've ever been close to that. I'd still try some heat adaptation (see prior video), but honestly not sure how you would cool down - humidity will make sweat much less efficient because it won't evaporate, and convection cooling won't help because air is even hotter than you. I'd make sure to drink plenty of cold water (or electrolyte/sport drinks), would try to find a way to either use ice (e.g., in sleeves and/or buff and/or hat). But that's all not super practical. Not sure for Loup Garou - maybe. I really liked the race, the people were really nice. And there isn't really any other race around that time I'd rather do - so it will really depend on my work schedule.

@@runningwithsimon i just watched your previous one! It does help and so does your comment. Now that you mention it, cooling down is the issue. I am not incredibly fit, but fit enough to do a few half marathons, with the goal of a full next year. It is impossible to do Zone 2 HR training without walking for me and I'm losing out on volume. I will be doing one lap of the loup garou, I'm super excited for that! I think if i use it as a long run, it will fit nicely into a training block if I commit to a full marathon in 2024 season. See you then if you do!

Exactly - it's so hard to find time/energy when you factor everything else, and that's why you have to make the most of your time... What's the race? Is it 8000m, if so, niiiice!

@@runningwithsimon julian alps trail run in slovenia in september. arround 108 miles with 26 200 feet elevation. My goal is just to finish in time, in any way possible, nothing fancy. Im 38, but acctualy starting to feel like school test is getting closer: cant wait to take the test and at the same time still not learning enough:)

haha congrats! Yup they're great! I sometimes forget I wear them! It's gonna be perfect for Badwater given I don't need to carry much

I'll looking into it. In the meanwhile, I think Sage Canaday had some pretty good ones on that

Yes you can. The result won't be the same but it'll work out OK. And it's best to do what we enjoy. Check out people doing hybrid training for more detail on how they do it

I'd aim for 40-50 miles. Have you seen this video, could be helpful! ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-5r906h6wkwY.html

@@runningwithsimon I'll check it out, thank you sir

Honestly, you could go for it today (depending on the race and your time expectation of course). But yes what you describe is exactly what I'd do. I'd just work it backward / reverse engineer it - it's true there is no need to maintain your ~70 for too long, so I'd plan to reach it and have a full 3 weeks at 70, 1 week taper, then race. And work it backward "reducing" the miles backward until you are back at what is your typical week today.

Seems very appropriate with summer coming in hot!

It's flat road. You can convert to time on feet to adapt. How long would it take you to do those long runs, and do that instead. I do that to some extent nowadays because where I live is hilly (10 miles is at least 1400 ft). BUT it needs to be a relatively similar physical exertion - if the trail is super technical and you can't really 'send it', it's going to be great to practice footing, but not ideal for fitness. I assume you said for the long runs because you'll do your speed work on road? (which is exactly what I'd recommend).

@@runningwithsimon I am just making sure I understood everything correctly. i am not that smart. Thanks for taking the time to respond as well as make the video.

@@Smashycrashy There's no bad question - I'm always happy to help

Good job! So the first workout you mentioned (1.5 hour at 6k / h) that'd mean like 9k in 1.5 hour? If it's on road and flat, it's a bit on the slow side. But it could be right for you if that's what you need to stay in zone 2. Eventually the speed at which you can go and stay in zone 2 will be faster, but for now, you are doing the right thing. Similar for the second one - I wouldn't call it "speed" work but "hill work" and it serves the same purpose and is great. 1h in zone 4-5 using hills (instead of speed) to stay in high heart rate zone. Overall you'll likely get faster on both type of workout, and the way to do that is to keep in the direction you seem to be taking :)

​@@runningwithsimon Thank you for the reply! I have been running randomly for 5 months without a plan. Sunday I had, thanks to you a plan, I did a long run and I always got to zone 3, probably because I am not well trained? To get myself into zone 2 I had to jog at a speed of 5.8 km/h. This was on a treadmill. On my "speed" day I will change between hill run outside, 5K and 10K i guess? Next I need a plan for interval training on thursday. Could you make a more detailed video on speed and interval days?

@@Ozon29 I will make one of these some day for sure!

It's hard to know why - but are you drinking enough, and including electrolytes?

The white hat with flaps? Outdoor Research - Sun Runner Cap

I think that's more of a stride for road running - which I hardly ever do (except in training but then I"m running)

Depends on the mileage I do - but essentially "as fast as I can". So if my speed work is a 10k, I'll go at a "10k pace". If these are intervals, it's going to be faster.

If you don't do back-to-back long runs, I'd push the long run a little more than what I wrote (and maintain the same weekly mileage). Closer to the 26-30 miles (you can convert to whatever time/pace fits that bill for you, but something like 4-5 hrs). So maybe saturday do this, and sunday a shorter / low pace run in the 7ish mile / 1 to 1h30. It'll be important to have some experience in longer events / running / racing to practice fueling. So something like a 50 miles race.

Depends on the run. Depends on terrain and distance. Pavement vs. Trail (and for trail there's a lot of variability). I have about 5 different types. The one I had in this video were Joe Nimble's Pilot 1 - which are very sturdy and have big cushion, which is great for Badwater 135 (same shoes I used for Badwater and Javelina 100)

550km without a single minute of rest at all? That's impressive...

I didn't say Not a moment Rest in a 5 day rece ! I Said The LAST 2 DAY WITHOUT SLEEP ! THANKS FOR SHOWING YOUR THOUGHTS AND LACK OF KNOWLEDGE! THERE'S NO POINT IN ASKING YOU ABOUT ULTRA MARATHON! IF YOU THINK 43 MILES IS ULTRA. WHEN THE RACE I'M ASKING ABOUT IS OVER FIVE HUNDRED MILES LONG !

Why Don't you Show All Your Responses?

You're right - I've never done a 550 mile race and I've never heard of "australian style" before. Sorry for my advice not being helpful - trying my best. All my answers are visible, but you have commented on multiple places. Good luck on your race - let us know how it went. ps: nevermind you are right, a few answers triggered RU-vid anti-spam, likely from link sharing and multi-posting. I still think sleep management is the most important difference when going into 200+ distance, but feel free to disagree

The shuffle is the most efficient way! it's been studied you might want to Look into Cliff Young I just came off a 16 hour Child Search ! That Turned into a Body Recovery!

lol I guess that still counts as "landing"

@@runningwithsimon haha good one. I seriously gotta rest more tho, before the injuries start preferably lol