Sam, I absolutely love your videos. They’re fun, informative and there’s always something different to keep you going. You and the railway have kept me company through many happy hours (and some difficult ones). Now, thanks to this excellent tutorial I’ve finally serviced my first loco and have brought a sad, seemingly near death Class 29 back to energetic life! Thank you for doing what you do. Here’s to many more joyous years of Sam’s Trains!
A nice clear video with some good tips Sam, well done. I hope I don't seem big headed but here are a few suggestions that have kept my models going for the last 43 years :) delete if you wish, no problem. 5:51 add in a brush between the teeth with an old tooth brush, removes stubborn grime and any bits stuck in there. 7:11 may I suggest instead of super glue use something like RS Pro Blue Thread locking Adhesive, super glue breaks down under heat also this stuff will only cure where it is airless so if you do get any slashes it can be easily cleaned off. 10:42 wheel removal on the plastic side only, a medium flat blade screw driver can be used to gently pry between wheel and chassis to get the wheel off, work around it bit by bit to make sure it comes off evenly. 17:25 oh, I'd personally not recommend any kind of abrasive on commutators, the micro scratches caused will cause brush wear and will fill with debris, this will cause heating due to resistance mate, hope its ok to say?.
Thanks a lot for the tips Mike - much appreciated! I'll definitely use some of those! I've heard the same thing about not using anything abrasive on the commutators - but I once tried it experimentally on a very badly tarnished one, and it doesn't seem to attract dirt any more than others do - the scratches seem to disappear again after a quick run and another clean... and then they really shine! Thanks for watching - Sam :)
I use a very small Minicraft grinder (with a wire wheel inserted, not a grinding disc LOL). It only runs on 3.8v and is extremely gentle, yet tough enough to polish the surface of commutators and wheels.
Have a problem with one of these on a tender which is puzzling me and wondered if you could help. Motor runs on test when touching the two brush covers or the live connection terminal and neg brush cover. I cant get a neg contact off the wheels or motor body though . Any ideas??
Just done this for the first time following your guide and - other than a pesky spring - all has gone swimmingly. Just done a Hornby class 37, an HST power car and the Duchess of Abercorn all in about an hour. Happy days! A *lot* more locos to go!
Really useful, I successfully managed to resurrect a 30 year old HST and didn't lose any brush springs! It ran badly after the service, and turned out I pushed the wheels on the axles too far, which increased friction. Many thanks for this and your other videos.
Thanks Sam. I am returning to the hobby after many years (decades!) away and this was a very useful guide for me now that I am about to get out all my old locos again and will need to do this stuff! Many thanks.
Good work cleaning up these mechanisms Sam. Some tips I use. (1) If you can get rubber grips for the jaws of the vice so they don't bite into anything you place in the vice, but they will grip without marking the item. To knock out the wheel axle's, get an old same diameter metal mini screwdriver (like you have on your bench) and then Dremel off 10mm or above the Phillips (star) or Flat blade. File flat the surface and to clean off any bares. You now have one instant axle tool. Use wire wool to clean copper gear cover, brush spring retainers and clean the axles. Eek, the Draper/Dremel in use, no, no, no just in case of an accident to you or your model. Better to use a Fiberglass Pen cleaner to clean the commutator surface and continue to clean out after. When replacing the wheels on the axles, add a very tiny spot of modellers grease or oil inside the axle holes for free running. If you have an OO Gauge back to back checker. Put it between the wheels and tighten up the wheels in the vice until the gauge fits in & out semi-tight between the wheels backs to re-gauge them as usual. I hope these tips help you Sam and your readers out.
Thanks a lot John - I like the rubber grip tip, I'll be sure to look into that! I have used fibreglass cleaners on armatures before - but they don't do as good a job as the Dremel - I know it's a bit dodgy, but I've done it for years with no problems! Thanks very much for these, Cheers, Sam :)
Terrific video Sam, thanks. On mine I found it enough to clean the commutator with a cotton bud through the upper hole in the engine cover (masked here by the capacitor) and so avoid having to remove the engine cover and the wheels - doing a thorough clean of the commutator would always be best, but that cut-out seems to line up nicely to allow the cleaning of the area that the brushes make contact with, which was enough. Spinning the central gear while holding a cotton bud dipped in surgical spirit against the commutator removed a large build up of muck that immediately freed up the mech. A spot of oil here and there and the previously seized motor was running again. Your video gave me the confidence to have a go and glad I did.
Hi Sam recently serviced my hornby western diesel in same way that u demonstrated in this video now she runs like new best it's been in three years many thanks dan and Kaitlyn 😁😀
Good drills Samuel, his vid helped me take apart my "new to me" 47, which has a bogie mounted RF motor. As expected, very nasty and sticky in there so twenty minutes of cleaning the cogs out and connectors. And wow massive difference, less power required to get moving, smoother running once underway and for some reason better navigation of point work. Can only assume this is because there is less resistance inside the inner workings fighting the natural resistance you get when passing through frogs. Good show old chap !
Had my first attempt at dismantling the motor encouraged by your clear instructions in the video. You were right about the springs! Just going on eBay having spent the last 30 minutes on my hands and knees looking for one that got away :-). Great video. Thanks.
Ahh that's such a nuisance John - I've done the very same thing many a time, sometimes it can't be helped! You can buy a load of them, then it shouldn't matter too much if you ever lose another! Thanks for watching - Sam :)
The early "Silver Seal" Ringfields only have 3 gears. The are a bit different to pull apart, but still east enough. Thanks for the great update to the overhaul/maintenance process.
I do the same with my ringfiejd motors ,I find them easy to service unlike now I wouldn’t dare take apart some of my latest Bachman or hornby but thank goodness they just need a clean and the odd drop of oil ,I too have amassed lots of spares I got a non runner from hattons it now runs like a Swiss watch ,all the best Sam ,Mark 😊👍🏻
I am new to the hobby so have much to learn but just as it is with our cars being serviced , then servicing your locomotives is obviously just as important so watching how sam does this and then buying the correct tools to do it what i shall be certainly doing ? Paul
Electro-lube is my new favourite word 😂😂 Good advice about not catching your hand on the wire wheel. I was once using a big one on an angle grinder to clean something and caught myself. It chewed through my glove and the flesh beneath it. It was a fun trip to A&E though, there was a drunk chap with two policeman. Only in Essex!
haha oh mine too!! ;D Ooh yeah - if it grabs your clothes, you're done! Sorry to hear you got caught - that does sound very nasty mate! Thanks for watching - Sam :)
Hey Sam thanks for this, i saw your earlier ringfield vid and was not sure about bending the spring retainers. Now i have seen you do it i think its time to work on my early 125 i've had from new but has been in box in the loft since 1996! Unsurprisingly it didn't run too well when i came back to the hobby a few weeks ago. I look forward to getting through your other vids
I thought I'd just add something I've discovered this evening whilst trying to get an old Hornby Western working properly again, and it's a STRANGE one: Problem: Would work fine in one direction but in the other, over a few minutes would slow and stop, drawing no current. Tried all the normal stuff, new brushes, springs, cleaned commutator, lubricated etc. and no change. Solution: Clean away corrosion on the under side of the brush spring retaining leaves. Obviously the corrosion was acting as a dielectric and allowing current initially but becoming less conductive over time when the current was passing in one direction.
I watched. I learned. I applied the knowledge (thankfully I didn't have to bend the brush tabs) I rejoiced in how comparatively low-maintenance my old Marklin motors and drive trains really are.
OK Sam, I had to extend my quota to 3 Videos tonight, after seeing this one! 😉 Fascinating. That drive looks just like the 1964-1993 Bachmann Standard Line here in the Colonies!! I really enjoyed that, even though I've been servicing my Locos for over 40 years! 😳😳 One thing... I would strongly recommend NOT using a wire wheel on the Commutator. It leaves an uneven surface, not always visible to the naked eye. This is far more critical on the "pancake" type Motors like this one. Instead, find a VERY fine Grit (2000-2500), rigidly mounted Sandpaper. I mount mine on a trimmed Popsicle Stick. *Gently* rest the Sanding Board across the Commutator whilst spinning the gear on the opposite side. Like your method, you'll not want to remove more than a very trace amount of the Copper! But with practise, this will yield a nice, FLAT Comm, which will run smoother, and extend Brush life. 😊 Like anything of the sort, try it on an old dead Motor, if you have one. ✔ Carmine ✈🚂🚙
haha glad to hear that mate - that's very interesting, they must have adopted a similar mechanism then! I've been using wire wheels on the commutators for many years now - and the results have been excellent - ones that I did years ago still wipe perfectly clean very easily! :D Thanks for watching - Sam :)
Many people have used the same method you use... Nothing wrong with it. They're hearty Motors, although not the smoothest at crawling. The flat sand method helps slow speed control.... slightly. 😉 But I'm a firm believer in whatever feels better for YOU!
I just tripped over this video as I was doing a major service on a dead Hornby Class 25 and Lima Class 37. I’m not convinced that using a wire brush on the commutator is a good idea, especially no a steel wire brush. Apart from any broken bristles getting attracted to the magnet, if it’s still in place, it is very abrasive. If you’re going to use this method you would be better off using one with brass wires. The same applies to the wheels, so there is less chance of damage. On the commutator you could try a small drop of liquid metal polish on a cotton bud, or a small piece of Brasso wadding. If there is scoring then a very fine wet-and dry paper to smooth those out then polish with the metal polish, followed by IPA/lighter fluid to clean any residue. I can’t add a photo here, but a couple of minutes with metal polish does a really good job, without the wear a wire brush may cause to the thin copper contacts.
I'm Canadian & have a Hornby intercity trainset I received as a gift while living in the UK back in 1980. I'm working on a layout & have been having performance issues with my train. I enjoyed your video on care & maintenance. I think I broke the clips holding the motor cover on while detaching the short wire on the left hand side, if you're are looking at the motor facing the brush contacts. The motor still works with the cover not in place due to my fault, & I thought of using a small piece of tape at the top of the motor housing to keep things in place. I also thought of using small screws at the spots where the cover fastened. I don't have a replacement motor or cover. Let me know what you think. Thanks
Hi J, thanks very much for the comment. Yes those clips can easily break - I've had that happen once or twice too. Provided you can keep it still by other means, it should be fine! Thanks for watching - Sam :)
7:14 - have you considered using a light threadlocker for this (for example, TL243) rather than Superglue? Appreciate I'm probably 5 years too late to suggest this...
I just performed this operation on my class 37... the brushes were worn DIAGONAL! I think I need some new ones. I also want to clean my Class 33, after doing some basic maintanance to it, it sparks like crazy when running. However, although it looks like a ringfield, it's a considerably different design than that. I can't even remove the bogie from the chassis, let alone the motor from the bogie...
haha yeah - definitely some new ones are in order! Ahh interesting - I'm not sure about the class 33.... are you sure it isn't a Lima one?? Thanks for watching - Sam :)
I think I see the problem which I have, your cog is hard up against the body. On mine the shaft appears to be spring loaded loaded and therefore cannot be fully engaged hence the spinning. Any ideas?
Hi Charlie - the spring effect will most likely be caused by the brushes/springs pushing against the commutator. If the gears aren't meshing, the gear need to be pushed further on the shaft - has the gear become loose at all? Thanks for watching - Sam :)
Think I am snookered as I put a touch of superglue onto the shaft as suggested and cannot get the cog any further on it push the shaft without it springing back
Hi Sam could you please advise as to which lubrication ( grease ) to use on old & new Triang/Hornby gears and motor as I am new to this hobby? Regards John.
Hi John - I've used silicone grease (the thinner the better) for a few years with good results on gears! For bearings, hemline sewing machine oil used very sparingly does a great job, Thanks for watching, Sam :)
Hi Sam thanks for this - a very good logical explanation. I have serviced quite a few of these motors in a similar way (except for the wire brushing bit) but I have an unusual issue with a couple of them recently that I don't understand. They run much quicker in one direction than the other. Even without the gears attached! (just the motor as per your initial testing after cleaning). In both cases I have also replaced the brushes and springs. I wondered if you or anyone else on this thread have encountered this issue with ringfields and why that is or how it might be fixed? This equates to the engine (an HST in these two cases) running much faster when going backwards on the track than forwards.
Thanks a lot David, appreciate it! That's interesting - have you tried taking measurements of the resistance of each winding? It's possible that there's a fault there - each winding should measure within 0.1-0.2 Ohm of each-other, if they don't, that indicates a possible fault! Thanks for watching - Sam :)
Thanks Sam for the reply - yes I did measure the windings - all normal. The only thing that I can think of is that I need to try your wire brush trick: because there is still a little bit of ingrained dirt in some of the scratches on the armature and maybe these are not symmetrical... further cleaning is the only option left at this point because it seems electrical rather than mechanical... cheers David
great video - can anyone confirm what voltage these motors are? I want to service one for a friend. I havent got track or the transformers to connect to the track - but I have a DC power convertor which I can adjust to any voltage
Hi Sam, great video, and really informative. My son and I love your channel and all the videos you post. He's a big fan. Quick question. I want to service the ringfield notors in his trains, would you mind telling me which bearing puller you used in the video or make a suggestion as to which type would be suitable for the job. Many thanks. Daniel
That's lovely to hear Daniel, many thanks to you both for watching! If you do a search for 'pinion puller' on Ebay, you'll find the one like mine! :D Thanks for watching - Sam :)
Hi Sam! So my grandparent's friend gave them some Hornby things and also an old Hornby county of Norfolk in the blue livery and it's a ringfield motor ran loco. The motor you showed in this vid had 4 wheels but mine has 6. I'm a younger modeller and my grandparents are finding me locos and rolling stock in a nearby auction house. Most things are used and quite old. If you can tell me anything about my class 47 that would help. Thanks for reading :D
Hi John, thanks very much for the comment - yes some do have extra wheels, but they're usually just dummies if they're on this design. If the extra wheels are driven, then you most likely have an ex-dapol model, which are a bit devilish to service! I tend to recommend just a drop of oil on the moving parts on those, and hope that does it! Thanks for watching - Sam :)
Hi Sam. Have a problem with one of these on a tender which is puzzling me and wondered if you could help. Motor runs on test when touching the two brush covers or the live connection terminal and neg brush cover. I cant get a neg contact off the wheels or motor body though . Any ideas??
Hey Andy - on some models, there's a small wire that connects the metal brush retainer to the chassis - can you see one on yours? That left hand brush should be live to the chassis, so if it isn't, you'll need to find a way to put a wire in, which should sort that for you! Thanks for watching - Sam :)
Great video! Just spent a very satisfying hour servicing a ringfield on a 25ish year old class 37 (which previously squeezed and stuttered) - now runs like a charm 😀 Next up my even older HST. Any advice where to get gear pullers from?
I bought a hymek off ebay, and then I didn't run it for a year. Now I tried running it, and it makes a squeaking sound and i see sparks. And I even saw some smoke coming from it. Do you know what is wrong?
My advice would be to try everything in the video - if it's still not running right, there may be a problem with the armature :( Thanks for watching - Sam :)
Hi Sam. Where did you get the gear puller from and how much did it cost? I'd suggest cleaning between the commutator segment with a pin or similar implement. You don't use a gauge to check the back to back distance? Do you have any problems with locos shorting over points?
Hey! I bought it on Ebay I believe - it's not brilliant but it does the job - it cost less than £10 I reckon! Yes, if you're not using the dremel to clean the commutator, then you can do - though the gaps are large enough to clean using cotton. A gauge is not needed with these units, since the chassis acts as a gauge: get the wheels too tight, and they'll bite, get them too lose, and the gears won't mesh properly! Thanks for watching - Sam :)
Really interesting Sam I never dared open my ringfield motors be before but you’ve demystified them Thanks Do you have similar servicing videos for all makes of engines? Also what make of oil do you use? Keep it up, good luck 😊
That's great to hear Jon - hope you can give it a go! I have videos for quite a few of them yeah - there's a maintenance playlist if you're interested. I use Hemline sewing machine oil! :D Thanks for watching - Sam :)
I haven’t touched my railway stud in years All the stock , tools , paint and materials has all been packed away for 12 years now I have engines from so many different manufacturers Triang, Hornby Dublo,Lima, Bachmann Dapol etc and a few odd ones ones too I can’t wait to get it all back again and make a fresh start 😊
Hey Sam. Just picked up a Hornby Diesel D7101 (Bear) with this motor in it. I serviced him all up and everything and he ran great up until a few hours ago. He will start to jerk, slow down greatly to a crawl, and then die. He'll start back up again if I jiggle him around a bit, but if I stop him from running or interrupt it in any way, it'll happen again. I cleaned the track, the wheels, and all the pickups. The motor hasn't burned out or anything, so what do you think this could be? Asking since he's literally the same diesel as in the vid just Bear-ified, lol. Thanks! - Jack
That's awesome Jack - sorry to hear about the problems, try cleaning the commutator again, but don't use any oil on the front shaft - maybe the oil is causing problems! Thanks for watching - Sam :)
Subject R399 tender for Flying Scot R398 - 4472. How do I separate the motor unit from the chassis of the tender? The heavy metal motor frame has number S4565. There does not appear to be any clips/springs/catches. I wish to take out the armature as there is some physical restriction to free rotation.
Do you know how to repair cab lighting in a old hornby class 47? I took the body off but not sure where all the lighting wires go or if you could show a video with lighting wiring? Many thanks paul
Hi Paul - the bulbs usually have two wires coming from it, one sometimes with a diode. One wire needs connecting to one bogie, and the other wire goes to the second bogie! If you get them right, the bulb will turn on only when the engine runs forward! Feel free to email me a photo of your arrangement, and I'll take a look! Thanks for watching - Sam :)
@@SamsTrains thanks sam I'll send some photos I've got one bulb working but the other one is the problem as it doesnt appear to have enough sockets on the motor. They both have diodes one from each end. This is how it is theres a very short wire which plugs in from the silver socket to the front of the motor. One bulb fits at the back of the motor, the other cable from the front light goes into the back bogie. There is a cable then connects from the back bogie into the other silver socket in the motor. The back lights one fits in the back bogie (nearest to the rear lights) as it's a short cable but on the original hornby clas 43 diagram it shows the long cable coming from the rear light ( with the diode)going into the front motor bogie but I cant figure out where it can plug in because all the sockets are already filled think that makes sense.?
Hi sam, i have a Flying scotsman with a ringfield motor which 1. doesnt seem to get current through most of the time... 2. makes a horrendous racket when it does go and slows down too... any ideas? Love your videos, Will
Definitely try a full service, and check the contacts between the loco and tender, possibly cleaning the loco axles - that's often the cause of issues! Thanks for watching, Sam :)
Sam'sTrains I think the connection between loco and tender is broken as it's just one pin that goes through... This was my first ever model and it hasn't run for 13 years after being rebuilt several times... It started to run this morning, going round 30cm before cutting out... It isn't powerful enough to even push the flying Scotsman body. I might have to buy a new one.
Hi Sam, bit of a odd question but i just got a brand new Bachmann Toby and he runs really smooth but also really slow. I have to turn my controller upto 60+% to get him to move at speed. Does yours do this or does mine sound like it needs work done to it?
Hmm, I'd say that's pretty normal - that can be an indicator of a fault with the motor, but mine is slow too, so I'm sure it's fine! :D Thanks for watching - Sam :)
Hey Sam, super helpful video!, just wondering where you picked up the vice that you used in the video, as I cannot find one with a wide enough jaw, or either it is too massive and expensive
I wouldn't clean a commutator in the way that you did. The 'black' is almost certainly carbon from the brushes and as this is carbon it is an excellent electrical condutor so apart from wiping with ipa or similar it's not neccessary to abrade the commutator.
Hi Jack - it could be an issue with the motor - try re-cleaning it, and reapplying the oil, but only in tiny quantities! Does this happen when you power just the motor, without the gears? Cheers, Sam :)
Thanks for the super video Sam; most informative. I've gained a renewed interest in my dusty railway collection during lockdown through watching your excellent channel and your content and the alarmingly pained noises my locomotives make when set upon the track have spurred me on to service them. A quick question. Where can I find the oil applicator you use? Thanks in advance and long may the Sam's Trains channel keep steaming!
Thanks so much Thomas, that's really lovely to hear - good luck sorting yours out! I use a Gaugemaster one - if you do a search for Gaugemaster oiling pens on Ebay, you should fine them! Thanks for watching - Sam :)
Hi Sam, nice video and servicing. I have challenge for you Make a video while speaking in Indian English and discribe your thoughts about Indian railway.😁😁💙💚💛💜
Thanks lot Richa - haha, what would Indian English involve?? You mean an Indian accent?? I might get into trouble if I did that ;D Thanks for watching - Sam :)
Hi' sam do you no how to fix my train it is going so slow and it's comming smoke frome the motor ore the battery plz can you help me if you dont understand sorry it is because i am from sweden
Sam'sTrains Hi Sam. After being carefully stored away, in the original packaging, since purchase in 1986, I have decided to return to modelling and running my R.042 LNER 4-6-2 Loco No. 4476 ‘Royal Lancer’. It has a Hornby Ringfield motor which is in the tender. Removing the tender from the chasis was fine but, I need a little advice regarding the removal of the motor from the wheel chasis. Can you help please?
Hi Sam, great video! I was just wondering if you could do a video on how to service the Hornby class 156? If you want to but don't have one I can send it to you. kind regards, TheNorthern323.
Do check my live servicing streams - there's a good chance I did one already, if not, I'll add it to my list of video suggestions! :D Thanks for watching - Sam :)
Eugh... that's one HARD brush! Good it's a simple diesel, if I used that on my models there'd be no handrails or details left! For your more delicate models I hope you bring out something softer? ;)
haha - I've used that brush on even modern steamers - if you're careful, it doesn't harm them!! I don't go crazy on the delicate ones like that though ;D Thanks for watching - Sam :)
