WOTC Exec: "Thank goodness we're finally getting past that Open License PR nightmare." Secretary: "Some RU-vidr just spoiled half of the next set of our children's card game!" Exec: "Send in the Pinkertons."
@@ryanstewart2289 I said targeted not rated M. Something doesn't have to be rated M to be targeted for adults. Additionally I was very polite and you are being rather rude for no discernable reason.
Wizards of the Coast/Hasbro has managed to attack fans to the point where I will not support them, event tangentially. I will not purchase DnD products, whether by WotC, or by other companies. This extends from the DnD movie, to video games. I'm aware this will negatively impact people who have no say in WotC/Hasbro decisions and policies, but I feel it's the only way to clearly express my displeasure in the only method corporations will notice: through my wallet. In the same vein, I heartily support Paizo and the ORC license they are creating to replace it, and expressed my approval with them via my wallet.
Seems they forgot these are Player Characters they are dealing with here. We never do anything quietly or as expected. Your customers will 100% leave the table on a disgusting DM, don't think the great WotC are immune. Games nights certainly would be better with D&D and MtG. Only if they are going to respect their player base, though. There are easily more game options than pizza places.
Like I said. No retailer gets those packs three weeks out from release. It doesn’t happen. A week, maybe. So, he had to have gotten them from a distribution company. Those are the only folks who get the product that early. Unless he got them direct from WotC.
Wotc has not lost me as a player, i still play magic the gathering and dnd as much as i can, often once a week. I am, however no longer a paying customer. I havent bought a new dnd book since circa october 2022, and i havent bought magic cards since september 2022. I proxy magic cards and if i need new dnd stuff ill just pirate it.
It's amazing, like WOTC suddenly decided to go out and discover all the ways it could antagonize and alienate its fanbase. Not that I've been buying much WOTC product in recent years, but that number has become zero for the foreseeable future. Plenty of other TTRPGs out there. a lot of them much better. But then, there always have been.
I'm still waiting for the next WotC controversy. What will they do next? Set gamestores on fire? At this point I'm grabbing a bag of popcorn and watching the trainwreck unfold. At the time I was still angry at them for magic 30th. Magic was slowly becoming a trashfire when they introduced universes beyond and were abandoning gamestores and price gouging. Later all this stuff happened with the OGL. Then the pinkertons, it goes on and on.
Those are only two of about five big PR blunders WotC made in the last few months. Actually, I'd characterize the "undermonetized" comments as a separate blunder. The "white males can't leave fast enough" and the terrible RU-vidr summit meeting were also just as big of a blunder in terms of respecting the fans.
Yeah. I’ve seen the vids from the creators. WotC pulled out of GAMA years back. They are not attending GenCon either. I think they need refreshment courses on how to deal with the public.
I'm not watching this closely, but I have noted the trend to use intersectional politics within WOTC and D&D in particular. But to hear that they openly declared "white guys can't leave fast enough" shows what they think of me. And I'll be happy to help them reach their goal of zero white guys.
If it was just the OGL crisis that WotC had done, I'd have given them the benefit of the doubt, and would still support them. The Pinkerton fiasco though? No, I'm dropping WotC and Hasbro as product providers. I'll still play D&D 5e, as I already own the books and it's the system I'm most familiar with, but I won't play "One D&D" or buy any of their supplementary books from here on. If I join a D&D esque game, it'll be 5e, Pathfinder 2e, or Apotheosis. The greedy wizard has raised the wrath of the adventurers, and now must suffer the consequences.
Correction, OGL v1.0(a) was already released, way back with 3.5e. What Witches of the Shore did was release an SRD of 5e under the OGL. An extremely restrictive SRD. Furthermore, the OGL was used by other game companies to allow their players, and other small companies, to distribute content for their game(s). All they needed was to put portion of their game in the OGL as an SRD. For example, Evil Hat Productions has their FATE RPG under the OGL. So, when WotC ran around with "copies" of OGL v1.2/1.1 , it pissed these companies off as WotC clearly said "the only SRD you may use is v5.1 (and any other we add to the license), all SRDs released under previous versions of the OGL can't be used, and those versions aren't going to be valid". This was an attack on the TTRPG hobby as a whole, but the moron executives who initiated this "plan" only saw the OGL as a hindrance to their performance bonus. _That's_ why so many entities have since joined ORC... they had no choice... to protect _themselves_ they must abandon a slightly flawed, but usable license.
I follow Open D6 and am interested in Cepheus. Neither game has an easy path off of the OGL to ORC or CC. (Though Cepheus has a chance of finding a new home last I heard.) I agree the attack was on the industry as a whole. There is a massive amount of OGL content owned by defunct publishers. If the OGL went all of that content would become inaccessible to publishers and creators.
@@nodansland303, Pathfinder and Starfinder are midst their own struggles to get off the OGL... unfortunately, Piazo realized that a lot of Pathfinder _Lore_ and monster design are based on D&D 3.5e... so, they need to strip _that_ out prior to putting it in ORC... otherwise Witches of the Coast will summon their CR 30 Lawyers... and _no one_ can defeat CR 30 lawyers! It's probable that the CEO saw the OGL as another version of the GSL... and never bothered to learn anything more about them... so just thought the OGL was a license between Witches of the Shore and content creators... *Shrugs* I hope that CEO got fired... but we all know that's not how corporations work.
I prefer their old monetization plan: putting out content players want to buy. If they do this, I will buy. If I don't want the product, I will spend my money elsewhere.
I'd advocate for giving reviews for Dungeon Crawl Classics, Ryuutama, Fantasy Craft, the Star Wars d6 game, Black Hack, Call of Cthulhu, and OSR games.
What NoTC, I mean, WoTC should have done instead of all of this is try and contact 3rd party companys to make their stuff official. WoTC makes cash, 3rd party makes cash, and everyone is happy.
Don't forget how during the Cancel D&D Beyond Subscriptions push they removed the unsubscribe button for a little bit and made the process harder to find to cancel your subscription... so like... that was cool.
People need to stop feeding this Beast. It's the players that are doing all the R&D and the Corporate lawyers claim Copyright to those ideas and charge the players to play. They make it an adversarial instead of cooperative effort. I think a community based standard could easily gain traction such that it is outside of proprietary grasp as with "General Public Licensing".
while I generally agree, the OSR is not free of problems, the number of nazis and rapists is the first thing that comes to mind. But also there's shit like Lamentations of the Flame Princess which is much like a pizza cutter, all edge and no point.
Got 3.5 and 5E. I don't want to support them anymore. Don't have to and won't. I will still be running the games though. It outlived TSR, the game's outlived the founders. I don't mind the name D&D, no longer being synonymous with TTRPG's. I want this game I love, to outlive the greedy WizBro.
A Correction: Hasbro explicitly said from the very beginning that OneD&D was not intended to be a "new edition" of D&D, but that it was simply a revision of 5E, and that D&D from that point forward would no longer have "editions", at all, but simply be "D&D". At no point was it ever suggested that a new edition was in the works.
I think the move to a digital table top is a terrible idea. What sets D&D apart from video games is that is not a video game. They need to double down the table top aspect, the in person experience. Make affordable miniatures and terrain and don't rip people off. Most people will pay $10 for $2 worth of plastic if it cool and they have fun with it. But $25 $35 for that same piece of plastic you just drive people away. I think warhammer is the same it can be a fun hobby putting together a table and terrain but most people see the price tag and can't get into it.
I am not paying for virtual playing pieces, either. Skins? They are deluded. I play an online game over Facebook Messenger every Thursday, so what do I need a vtt for? Virtual terrain? It will never be better than a player's imagination.
I don't buy WoTC products anymore and I don't think I ever will. There's no coming back from what they did. It's time for more responsible companies to take the spotlight and market share.
Yeah, I think that toy is busted. I'm all done with it for a bit and will only run through something if we feel like it. No more purchases; they are ungrateful and grasping.
Ya WotC dropped the ball this year. One thing after another. I will not move on with their new edition. I’ll stay with the 2014 5e and 3.5 plus other RPGs too. Ya WotC keep shooting them selves in the foot
Eventually, that is my goal. I want to release series of "How to play X" with a 3 part video for each. It is just finding the time between a full time job and putting out videos. But yes, I would love to.
I've moved on from WotC. I'm focusing on Critical Roles games and learning Pathfinder tomorrow through Gen Con online. I'm so much happier. I felt like I was in an abusive relationship.
Playing Pathfinder right now. Will soon try Starfinder. VERY HYPED about starting Shadow of the Demon Lord as soon as I wrap my 5e campaign this year. Maybe earlier.
What we need is for large portions of the ttrpg community to move beyond feeling compelled to associate with the name Dungeons & Dragons. The hobby has never been more dynamic, we've never had more options, its never been easier to make and release (or even just make for your table the game that suits YOU) YOUR OWN ttrpg, there have never been more free ttrpgs ...and we've never had more games that are roundly better than D&d than we do now. Its the mass draw to D&d regardless of all of the options and fantastic games outside of it that keeps it the 800 pound gorilla, and it existing as the 800lb gorilla regardless creates the arrogance and brazenness we see within the brand.
I’ve been a magic player since 1999, but more on and off (never played for too long otherwise I would probably be beyond broke and in debt, but always came back). Last time I played was about 2017, recently I’ve been having the urge to play again but seeing how things have changed it feels a bit strange to me, and the record I’m ok with things changing, after all the game has to evolve. Been thinking, probably I’m out of touch or don’t understand the game scene anymore but i don’t really feel welcome to return to the game… and doesn’t feel I’m much welcome into the TT role playing scene either (well this last one because I only know D&D and pathfinder, I feel like I’m entering the role playing house and just before I say “hi” a chair comes flying and crashes on the wall that’s right to the door, most of the people inside the house are already fighting each other way too hard it even resembles that scene from American chopper and it seems it won’t be too long before someone wearing a suit with the WotC logo on the pocket will approach me and have me sign some legal papers).
Do you have a local game store that has any play groups? I know when I ran mine that I really strived to have GMs that welcomed everyone. We had a ton of different games on different days. If not, I would check out anything online in your area (Facebook, Discord etc) to see if there are any meet-ups in the area.
As a Magic player, I can say that I'm permanently done with Magic the Gathering. One of their best artists was fired because she "liked" a supposed alt-right post on Twitter... Then things unbelievably got worse from there. There's something very wrong at WotC.
I have some very good friends who were in the MtG community that have spoken of it's "tone" change to more toxicity than previously. When I ran my store, I had great MtG players, and then the dregs who were just loathed by most. It happens in lots of communities, but, yeesh. MtG just seemed the worst to me.
I'm pretty suspicious of the idea of a Wizards VTT with a subscription fee. Don't get me wrong, I have nothing against VTTs in general, I just don't see them launching their own without screwing it up somehow. Especially in the area of microtransactions. Who's to say they aren't going to sell you exclusive artifacts or monsters that would usually be in a rule book, now split up and priced individually so that you can "make your tabletop experience unique" or some other marketspeak justification. Or exclusive skins for your monsters priced like their "Secret Lair" series in Magic? They probably won't do those exact things, but I would place money on them doing something equally stupid. And in the end it's all just noise. You don't need the DnD dice or the DnD minies or a DnD beer koozie. The game has almost died (TWICE!) because someone was trying to extract more value out of it than it was able to give. You would think the execs at Hasbro were smart enough to pick up on the pattern, but here we are.
I am a cheap bastard, I will never pay to play a game online. I do not care how marvelous the system and graphics may be. The pretty pictures will never compete with the splendour of my own imagination. I have piles of old books and magazines full of content that can keep me playing for decades in multiple systems already.
@@zednumar6917 Fair enough. I actually found playing DnD over Covid harder when I used Roll20 because I kept trying to make everything look pretty when all I really needed was to make it legible. The DM's best friend is imagination.
What you described is basically what they were suggesting in that quote about making DnD make money like video games. A live service wealth drain where fun is not part pf the product anymore.. .
I read the quickstart guides for the Shadowdark RPG and fell in love with the system, so I am not interested in 5.X D&D anymore. I may buy the core books as collectibles, but I am unlikely to ever play the new system. Professor Dungeon Master has declared July to be Independent RPG Month, so I am taking the plunge and exploring new systems.
I don't consume much social media outside of youtube, and even then not much of that, I was not aware of the WOTC exec saying white males should leave, I guess I'm going to learn pathfinder now.
I have tried to watch CR on twitch/YT and I just, don't get it. It seems (and likely is) very scripted? Not sure if it is just me thinking that, but yeah. Have lots of friends that enjoy them and watch them, but, not my cup of tea.
As a Gamer since 1982, I've seen it all. One of the things from the Glorious Days of the 1990's Internet that I wish I had kept, was the essay of a Professor who was also a Nerd, talking about how there was a War between the 'Art Nerds' and the "Math Nerds'. (This was around 1998) He said that if the MATH Nerds won, they would cause a tremendous increase in the popularity of Gaming, but because they focus on the Secondary Aspects of Roleplaying (Rulebooks, Stats, Spells, Items, Etc...) instead of what RPG's are ACTUALLY about (Player Agency- Players being able to tell their own unique adventures through the medium of the world the GM had created), they would ultimately choke it to death. Things seem to be going that way. I do know that WoTC conning players into believing that PnP RPG's are like Software that requires 'updating' was a stroke of marketing & production Genius. As it is FAR easier to jiggle Maths around, than to create a constant flow of original story adventures for GM's to use.
You forgot about Kyle Brink's Racist apology tour. Also, the fact that WotC has been sending Pinkerton thugs after their customers. WotC won't get my money. Neither will Paizo. Removing dark elves is just silly.
ToV is 5e with "changes" I purchased the PDF on the kickstarter, but I really am ambivalent about it. I will definitely check out the Shadow series though. I have not heard of them before. Thanks!!
@mythicodm I really like Demon Lord but they will be coming out with Shadow of the Wierd Wizard which will improve on what Demon Lord has. I backed ToV n agree it is just 5e with tweaks. 5.25e
Paizo told everyone to buy their core rulebooks to spite Wizards then pulled a bait-and-switch by making those books immediately obsolete less than a year later. They openly admit their core rulebook was so huge and unwieldy it was a major mistake and they are glad they can replace it now. The Player Core won't even have the barbarian, sorcerer, or monk. It only has eight classes. You have to buy the 2nd Player Core to get those. Talk about monetization! This is the excellent company you support now?
Technically, you will never have to purchase any Paizo products. They are all free on Archives of Nethys and Pathbuilder is updated with all of the content as well. I know lots of folks personally who have not purchased any Paizo stuff and play the game.
Well, not matter what, I will never support pirating or illegal means of getting the products. As a former games store owner, and a theatre manager, that is just a no-go from me. If you want to use it, pay for it. If not, come up with your own stuff.
@@mythicodm If the monetization actually went to the actual creators instead of the owners, you might have had a point. Unfortunately the creative minds behind these games have already been paid by the time the product hits the shelves. WOTC literally sent hired killers to rob a customer. Fuck them. They lost any legitimacy as a legal business the instant they made that call, they're no better than the drug cartels.
Why are you repeating all of this? Who is left out there who hasn't heard this? If someone does want to know this history, there many dozens of other videos already.
You could go down the list of things the OGL "allowed" and it was in the same order as the list of exceptions to copyright that used to live on the .gov website. Really wish I had screenshotted that page. But that aside, why is it, do you think, that they are now pushing for a strong Digital Only and Virtual Table Top (video game) style of business? My bet: because the IP laws for Video games and digital copies are different and largely untested. Same scam, same rent-seeking behavior, just from an angle that can't be so simply shot down in court. Ditch them and homebrew everything. Get it published and out there before they start claiming that they own every rule ever invented. They're looking for a world where you pay Hasbro 50$ a month to play any game ever, and giving them attention or money is how that is going to happen.
Yeah, I 100% refuse to give WOTC a cent... Aside from buying the D&D movie on Vudu, I admit; I like the movie and it felt like a passion project by fans, not a big corporate product. In any case, though I may be DMing 5e some time, I got my only 5e books used on eBay, and I won't be supporting WOTC by running my game.
