Howard Asks Chuck to Retire | Better Call Saul (Michael McKean) 

Meanwhile Chuck was born with very little, worked for everything he had, and turned into a great lawyer, but over time, became a terrible leader.

Right? At the beginning I thought he would just be another slick "LA Law" character in a finnicky suit. By the time he meets his fate it's heartbreaking because he's one of the only decent guys in the whole BB universe.

Great storytelling by Vince, Real good misdirection

Him and Chuck were always my favorite characters. Also the best morally of anyone from the show.

@@_ArsNova chuck is not on the list of best moral characters

It's so wild how Vince Gillian is able to play with these characters. Jesse Pinkman was never meant to make it past season 1. Howard was originally written to be the villain and Chuck to be a sympathetic character. But immediately he was able to see these characters and and actors and how they play off each other and completely rewrite the script.

lol. I’m rewatching it now. I just finished season 5. I feel so bad for Howard. Also, I always knew Jimmy was selfish but on the rewatch it opened my eyes to what a scumbag he mostly. I tend to now think Jimmy would have always turned to Saul no matter if chuck gave him the job at hhm or not. Jimmy was basically addict and could be sober for a while but always relapsed.

@@EJD339 I mean, probably, but it was his mistake to make, not Chuck's. Chuck denied Jimmy that chance not because of the firm, but because he never believed Jimmy could change, which actually made him go even more to the "dark side". In the end, Chuck is the one who couldn't change and Jimmy did (granted, after many many mistakes).

Right

Howard is a gent.

Your grandma played in BCS? That's cool

He seems like it

she definitely nailed the corporate politeness down to a T! She sure deserves more roles as an attorney in more shows

Wait, what? Seriously?! That's so cool! Yes I've heard that too, that Patrick Fabian is a sweetheart.

That's a lie because it was actually my aunt in the scene. Stop with the bs

IDK. I hate Chuck as much as anyone, but was what they were doing legal?

@@liljackypaperIt’s a grey area, but yes. Chuck has become a huge liability because he’s mentally ill and making mistakes on client work (untrue but still). The fact that they hid his condition from the insurance company for a long time also works against them thus the raised premiums, however they also added a compromise where Chuck’s premiums are raised but he needs supervision.

@@liljackypaper It was a result of Jimmy pointing out Chuck's insanity. Yes Jimmy was a shit for pointing it out but Chuck is still insane.

I've seen people like Chuck... they're ego's get in the way of company profits and growth.

@@NormAppleton Jimmy wasn't shit for pointing it out. Chuck let that mental instability project off on Jimmy for years instead of simply acknowledging that he had a problem. There's super subtle moments in the flashback scenes (such as Jimmy passing the bar) where Chuck displays the exact same discomfort as his electromagnetic sensitivity whenever Jimmy does well. It was pure fucking envy from Chuck to Jimmy that caused his condition. The better Jimmy does in life, the worse Chuck's condition got. They are directly linked. To finally point that out to the public after decades of covering for him to save his own ass after Chuck literally tried ruining his life is fair game. Jimmy wasn't in the wrong for that at all.

Just let him retire in peace

Chuckenberg

This does apply to Chuck much better than it did Walt

did you just copy Mike's script little bro?

Excellent ! I see, what you did there. Mike final, damning speech to Walter - "say my name". Well done.

He never allowed jimmy even to try at all.. He is scared for real

Holy man . I never thought about this aspect.

Howard is straight shooting here -- he doesn't shy away from making difficult decisions in a respectful way. Chuck was too erratic & proud by this point to listen to reason :(

And that deep down he knows Chuck shouldn’t be practicing law when he’s mentally ill. He’s been uncomfortable with his condition for a long time but he kept his mouth shut out of respect, and for the firms reputation, but now that it’s out in the open…

"he never changes," chuck believed jimmy would never change because it is in fact chuck who could not change, which only further pressured jimmy to remain on the path he was on

In the end, Chuck really only has himself to blame for his demise.

@@matthewriley7826 Howard knows the firm is leaving themselves open to class action malpractice suits given that it's now knowledge that they've been covering up that one of their name partners is unfit to practice law. And the transcripts of Jimmy's disciplinary hearing only really reflect poorly on _Chuck_ because thanks to Jimmy's chicanery, everyone now also sees him as an incredibly petty and vindictive man.

😂

You people are sent down here to defend me against these characters and the only one I've got on my side is the blood sucking lawyer! - John Hammond.

I mean, they do have legitimate grievances here. HHM concealed Chuck’s mental illness from the insurance company for a while, and it’s on the public record that he had a breakdown and is screwing up on important documents (untrue but still). He’s become a huge liability.

@@matthewriley7826 Yeah, but they are doubling on "all" of their practicing attorney's, not just Chuck. And it didn't matter to them how good they were for 25 years straight, they'll look for any excuse to increase rates whether they're at fault or not. They didn't even bother canceling Jimmy's insurance even when he's not an active lawyer and requested them to cancel.

@@gamma-ray9996 They weren't looking to raise the rates. They were looking to drop HHM. They knew that with Charles at the helm, it was only a matter of time before HHM got hit with a massive liability lawsuit.

“👁👄👁” -insurance agent

Ironically Jimmy was a practicing lawyer during a brief time when chuck had retired and before his suicide. Chuck wanted to keep jimmy from practicing law, yet in doing so he prevented himself from practicing the law.

Surprised Breaking Bad didn't sue them considering this show is an obvious ripoff of it. The main character is obviously based on the lawyer from Break and Bad.

@@ninjaguyYT They can't keep getting away with it!

@@ninjaguyYToh boy do I have some news for you..

​​@@ninjaguyYTi heard the original title of this series was Finger Bad

@@ninjaguyYT Break and Bad cracked me up! Bravo Ninjaguy!

I'M SMARTER I'M STRONGER I'M BETTER

@@juicetimer SLOWER WEAKER MIDDER

@@juicetimer”you’re not the real lawyers….I’m the real lawyer.”

​@@gman987I am the lawyer and I can exploit whatever loophole I want

I love Mckean's one time portrayal of a psycho clown in Star Trek Voyager.

Same for Breaking Bad

Same for real life

They're real life villains.

Same for me

(In Jesse Pinkman’s voice) They can’t keep getting away with it!!!

I'm actually Chuck's biggest critic. I hated him the entire show and the way he treated his brother. But I'm actually with him on this one. He was within his right to separate from the firm if they were going to force him to retire.

@@liljackypaper Maybe. See, I’d be more willing to understand Chuck’s apprehension for retirement if he’d stuck around to hash it out with Howard. Howard had been going along with Chuck’s campaign at every step of the process…from the time he developed his medical condition…from his willingness to block Jimmy…to his obsessive need to sabotage Jimmy…going so far as to hire a private investigator after staging a meltdown…when they should have just cut ties with Jimmy and moved on. But the ensuing circus kept looping Howard and the firm back into the McGill feud; and it was starting to become too much. The Mesa Verde debacle was also pretty bad for their brand. Howard was giving Chuck an “option”…and also venting, in his own way: he wanted Chuck to know that things had gone too far. Howard could not know just how much Chuck NEEDED to be able to practice law…essentially, the only thing that kept him functional (and was a tool for him to justify his superiority complex; but that’s another issue). Retirement was a suggestion on the table; but there were other options…though Chuck was ready to get into another legal tussle. Howard was getting exhausted just trying to keep up.

Howard tried to work out the best for everyone, and what Chuck did was treason of the highest order. You don't legally blackmail your partner who you've known for decades.

"...The first instinct you have is to sue me? To _sue_ the firm?"

And it also reveals that Chuck doesn’t respect Howard as a partner and probably never has.

Tbf, being a lawyer is all that Chuck had LEFT. Late 50’s, divorced, no kids, hates his only family member left. Chuck had nothing to live for🔥🔥🔥💀💀

​@@lukekiely2450 he was narrow minded. Sad.. sadd.......... SADDD

The thing is, there wasn't more to life than lawyering for Chuck. It was the only perspective he had left. That's why his forced retirement made him relapse again, especially after cutting ties with Jimmy with his famous "You never mattered all that much to me" line. He had NOTHING left to live for.

​@@lukekiely2450he had Jimmy aside from his demeanor he's a really good brother and friend, Chuck's superiority destroy all he has left

@@lukekiely2450why did he divorced i wonder

"You can never trust a chicanery addict."

"Perhaps in the future he'll consider working for hi.....oh right."

Chuck McGill later sets up an old guy to blow up Howard, causing him to walk out of a room with half his face missing.

​@@memestealer6348😂😂

Nah. Gus was being sinister. Howard was being caring.

And I'll never understand why people in this position can't just find other things to do or enjoy: Jimmy decided to open his own Cinnabon Franchise (I know he was hiding: I am not talking about that.): Chuck could have just as easily just done something that was busy, fun and low pressure, like open an ice cream shop or something.

​@@WasserkaktusHave you ever really been that passionate about something?

@@debrachambers1304Still he had options, he was a well respected attorney and Howard had a teaching position lined up for him for something he’s passionate about: the law. He would’ve had a vastly more active life and still had friends and colleagues rather than burning his bridges.

@@matthewriley7826because he was mentally Ill.

@@matthewriley7826Teaching is a FAR cry from doing. For Chuck, quitting being a lawyer would be like abandoning your own child.

wait.... people see hank as the good guy?

@@tommerker8063 he was

@@yourmum69_420 hank wasn't the good guy, definitely not the way Howard was. He disobeyed rules and was a tyrant in the way he did things, just for the right reasons. Howard played by the book, respectfully, and for the right reasons.

@@alyx1a IMO, Hank was a relatively good guy given his profession. When you're dealing with scumbags and criminals day in day out, you can't do your job very well if you're gonna be soft and played by the book. He could have allied with Walt and used his position and inside information to become one of the big Kingpins of NM, but he never did.

@@louieg7676 I agree with the first part of your message, he definitely is much closer to good than his colleagues in- and out-of-universe haha. And of course he could have also gone the hyper supervillain route as you say

Other than the possible drug problem, yeah, I'm inclined to agree.

Aye. Before that point, he was firmly on Howard's side, but Chuck was throwing haymakers at the wrong time, and destroyed any chance of negotiation or compromise. It was Chuck's Way or the Highway at that point, and that's not a good place for a lawyer to be.

i was looking for a comment on this expression howard had He looked baffled that Chuck took control and ended negotiation like it was only his decision to make

Heck, Jesse could've just said: "Yeah man, whatever. Turn me in then, let's see how the cops and your family like the fact that you didn't tell the DEA that immediately but instead came to my house first, trying to blackmail me into cooking crystal with you".

@@devanov3103 whatever the reason for Jimmy to pursue the law was, he did his best to fit in. And got constantly rejected on the basis of his past not his current capabilities. The whole monologue to Kristy was exactly about that. When someone is treated unfairly it evokes sympathy. I don't think people approve Jimmy's reactions to all of it, but the whole situation is a reason for sympathy. Denying it on the basis of 'world sucks, deal with it' is really weird because in his on way he deals with it and you still disapprove.

Pragmatic... well yes, to protect his image and the firm. He wasn't upstanding or honest, he let Chuck manipulate him for years and hurt and mistreated Jimmy and Kim. He wasn't a bad guy, but he was slimey and also didn't shy away from some manipulation of his own... actually a very stereotypical lawyer.

*"YOU, AND YOUR PRIDE AND EGO! YOU JUST HAD TO BE THE MAN."*

​@@drysoup3017 I've noticed there's a lot of similarities between chuck and walter, and I'm sure the writers knew this and is why jimmy was so bitter during the last few episodes, almost assaulting the man with cancer, possibly even fatally. To him the man with cancer represented walter, and in some ways walter represented chuck. Jimmy just couldn't NOT scam him.

@@20tetsuo77that’s probably why Saul sought out Walter. He probably unconsciously reminded him of Chuck.

chuck did everything to himself, especially by denying Jimmy purely because of his jealously and vindictive pettiness. He entrapped Jimmy and called himself moral and ethical, all the while saying he's doing it for Jimmy. He never wanted Jimmy to get beter. He wanted Jimmy to be a mail clerk failure, because that's how he saw him.

@@asdf0747 "and I was very proud!" he was proud that jimmy was "in his place" in the mailroom like a monkey in shackles (instead of with a machine gun). He didn't want him to grow, he wanted him on a leash because he didn't trust him to roam free without biting someone. But the leash is exactly what pushed him further on that path.

Fr

Did you forget the part where Walt's *PRIDE AND EGO* (the entire point of BB) makes him turn down the Gretchen's offer to cover his treatments

Nearby people will help if one lets them help... Jimmy was taking care of chuck day in day out... But chuck ego blocked Jimmy in letting Jimmy help chuck

Dude all his close confidants said to get help a long time ago. Chuck’s pride was keeping him sick, not anybody else.

Patrick Fabian's delivery of that line and the expression on his face is so damn good. You can tell that yes, while he wants Chuck out due to the stability and reputation of the firm being put more and more at risk the longer he stays on, he also legitimately wants to help Chuck. He's not just worried about the decision-making skills of his business partner, he's fearing for the health and sanity of his friend, probably more so than how Chuck's mental state is affecting the firm and it's clients.

@@lukeraymond6927Mike - “ *YOU* and your *pride* and your ego!”

He also mistakenly believed he could overcome it through sheer force of will. But mental illness is more complicated than that, and you need to seek help.

It is a crime that no one got an Emmy for BCS! Lalo, Gus, Nacho, Chuck, Jimmy nor Kim....a crime!!

not funny :(

💀😂

@@durpanda123it’s halarious

Chuck: "Lalo? Sounds like a nobody."

@@durpanda123didn't laugh:(

Omg this is hysterical

Which makes the ending actually a redemption for Jimmy. Don't really know why some people hate it. Just because it's less cool? If Jimmy did continue his bargaining hustle at the end he'll just be miserable again after getting out of prison. The only way forward for him is to pay for his crimes.

he kept up the charade because it was a coping mechanism. Constantly berate himself with work to give him no down time to reflect about the past (he even falls asleep banging hookers). He surrounds himself with low lives as clients because they are the opposite in character as Howard so they remind him of Howard as little as possible

@@acidmana6141I didn’t hate the ending, I hated how it was forced or how he was caught in the first place. Sure Saul couldn’t keep his hands to himself and ego played a factor in his downfall, but how the hell did an elderly woman who barely could walk and doesn’t know a thing about computers, was able to uncover that he was Saul and moreover gain Superman sight to read the car number plate perfectly mind you? I told myself it was utter bullshit and that Vince was forced/bored of the series so he had to half ass the way that Saul gets caught. Because throughout the series we saw characters like Saul get outsmarted or outdone by formidable characters not some random very old woman.

Chuck also had envy

That'd make Howards sin Lust. Lust as a sin was defined as a extreme want for something in a social relationship that it consumed them. In this case, his lust to appease everyone

Howard had pride too when he treated Kim like crap in the beginning

@@pencil6965 I'm not saying Howard didn't have his faults and flaw's. But the way he tried to give Jimmy back his own place at HHM after he knows what Chuck put him through. Only to have Jimmy sabotage and destroy Howard, All because Jimmy couldn't "accept" his share of responsibility for his brother's brutal death. Jesse wasn't the rabid dog, Jimmy was...

agreed, howard at least showed clear effort that he was trying to be and do better, but kim and jimmy became worse@@BillyBones-ui9ck

As he said, it’s the straw that broke the camels back. He’s been uncomfortable with Chuck’s illness for a long time now, but kept silent out of respect. But now that it’s out in the open he’s mentally ill, there’s no way he can justify keeping him on without tearing down everything they built.

Well, he knew letting Chuck practice again was a risk to the firm even at the Mesa Verde hearing after it fell apart, thanks to Jimmy, Howard watched Chuck have some sort of electricity reaction.

In the end, you're going to hurt everyone and it applies to both brothers

Chuck did care about Jimmy but saying he loved him isnt true. He was always envious of Jimmy throughout his life. Jimmy had a charisma and charm that Chuck wished he had too. He hated that Jimmy was his parents favorite eventhough he was the "ideal" son. And this is pretty much solidified with that scene in s2 i think where they have dinner with rebecca and jimmy ends up impressing her with his charm. And then later at night chuck tries to do the same but fails. Chuck always liked to feel a semse of control over jimmy and always wamted him to be his subordinate. So when he does find out that Jimmy passed the bar, there was nothing left for chuck to be good at, jimmy too was now a lawyer. Instead of being proud of his brother's hardwork he brings him down, instead of being happy for him he denies him a job at HHM. And i dont think amy loving brother would do shit like this. Sure he cared abt jimmy and his future and he did want him to get his life straight but not out of love

And also brings out the booze cuz he knows he has bad news for Chuck…

Because he's happy making others compromise to accommodate him, but he won't compromise himself.

Someone with Chuck’s ego would definitely be insulted at the insinuation he needs to be babysat. To him these insurance reps have no business to tell him how to practice law cuz they are not on his level, and they need to be “corrected”.

Life of a character actor. They don't always get the accolades. Heck sometimes people don't even know their names. Their "awards" usually amount to being always employed, always in a role doing something.

Also known as the Margo Martindale effect

When would've been the "right" time?

His hand was forced. Howard simply couldn't indulge Chuck's plan for swift and vengeful litigation against the insurance company. Since Chuck wanted to work on it right away, Howard drew the line and put his foot down.

@@Delta_Aves Its all part of theatrics for the show's sake, I am sure any normal person would've waited until Chuck was a little bit more calm.

Chuck was demanding the firm start senseless litigation with their insurance provider that very day. Howard was backed into the corner and had no other choice. If that letter had gone out it would have started a chain reaction that would have seriously damaged the firm. Not only would they have likely lost that case, they would have had issues getting other insurance to cover them because they launched frivolous litigation against their previous provider. Furthermore Howard knows that once Chuck starts down a road he never stops. Looking at his treatment of Jimmy shows that. He spent years trying to destroy his brothers legal career, and he would have spent years trying to get absolution for this perceived grievance with the insurance company.

Chuck was about to call in a multitude of associates and declare war on the insurance company. Howard needed to stop him dead in his tracks or risk embarrassing him in front of the firm and spreading rumors.

You may be missing the perceived slight. If you're a practicing lawyer with several years of conquest in the colosseum, it's difficult to take regulatory actions lying down. I know it's ironic: I would call what they are doing inhuman considering we're talking about lawyers. At the off chance that Chuck is actually performing good and honest work, what he's going through on behalf of Jimmy is definitely chicanery. But I digress This is a structure that suggests that the house is them and you get to watch from the outside While I don't disagree that they are being generous, it's always the case with political structures that they need to control the narrative strictly and with strict upheaval. Asking a senior partner to sit in on cases is as good as hiring a replacement lawyer who doesn't have to do any of the work Apply this to any other career, not only does it water down your reputation, it's the same feel. Someone else gets to take their time instigating your life's work. It's like having a familiar spirit follow you around, reporting your habits. Again, the idea that as a free man, someone else, even if they are a part of your firm, gets an insider view on your process Oh and the point about billing. In this life, money is all about importance to the brand. Even the mice bear a cost to operations if they associate with your building. It's not just about fielding interests, it's also about time This is why corporate structure is so harsh on the bottom rung, everything that affects the bottom line is a cost that they will extract from somewhere. You'd think it would be new business or expressions of venture capitalism that make up the difference. Nope; daily expenditures are the roadmap toward future projections So imagine a private enterprise like a firm, which reinvents itself to be on the cutting edge of fiscal returns, is in bed with a regulatory body. The house always wins They are telling Chuck that having quirks to his character is a liability and don't have enough respect for him and his hallmarks to ease him into their proposition. Again, at cost to the firm Howard is in a tough position. Chuck is at risk of losing his life's work

@@ramblincapuchin9075 This is not a “quirk ” this is a borderline psychotic breakdown waiting to happen (and it did). The insurance company no longer wanted to raise the prices after Chuck left. I think this had nothing to do with money and everything to do with liability. Yes Chuck would feel humiliated I’m not denying that but I am saying when he says “we” he no longer represents the best interests of the firm

But as Howard points out, any work Chuck does will have to be supervised by a partner who could be doing other work for the firm and they can’t charge the client for both. It also looks bad for the firm when all of a sudden a senior partner needs to be supervised by another one for work they do and they lose confidence in their service.

...maybe, but it wasn't a cocobolo..

@@ralphlozano9177 Cocobolo isn't really that fitting imo, way too wild and the colors are too intense. Zebrano as well. If you want class and a non-distracting look, I suggest european oak or european maple. A combination of oak and maple looks very nice too, a big board of oak with maple inlays.

It’s hard for me to pick which one I like the mostn

​@@derek_3054why choose ?

And also symbolically how he’s “in the dark” arrogantly believing the company will fall in line to their whims, downplaying how difficult and costly the legal battle would be.

Eh it would’ve fallen on deaf ears. Kim called him out in season 2 for his treatment of Jimmy, didn’t do a damn thing.

Ya this is something Kim chews out Howard for in their argument at the restaurant. Howard knew she was right letting Chuck practice again puts a risk to the firm

@@DaScorpionSting his blind loyalty to Chuck was his undoing in the end. It all could have been prevented if Chuck was institutionalized.

That was the compromise they suggested, however it’s not that simple and carry’s its own problems. Notwithstanding Chuck’s agitation at being babysat, Howard points out another partner would be busy supervising him rather than doing important work for the firm and they can’t charge the clients for it. This also makes them look bad in front of the clients when a senior partner needs supervision.

Essentially these firms have huge insurance for malpractice and in case one of their own is injured or can’t do the job. However what happens when a big company like HHM screws the amount that they have to pay for the insurance is astronomical. It not only would affect their practice but their employees too. Chuck trying to sue their insurance company is hands down the dumbest thing he can do and would destroy their company and they would still have to pay them.

True, though it was inevitably going to happen eventually. Chuck had a very public breakdown and it’s in the transcripts that he’s mentally ill and making mistakes. Howard was doing damage control with all of the clients because he knew they could easily find out, Jimmy just hit the gas pedal on it.

And Chuck keeps escalating it. He keeps making small problems even worse by trying to control everything. He would not have lost Mesa Verde as a client if he just let Howard do the talking. Likewise, Jimmy would have lost his case against the bar if only Howard and the detective testified on the break-in. And then again when The insurance company found out about Chuck’s mental problems which they are legally supposed to be know about. All they asked was for Chuck’s premiums to be raised and have an assistant on cases. But of course, Chuck blows it all over again by lashing out. Dude has got the charisma of a snapping turtle.

So did Chuck on not seeking proper help

he orchestrated it.

Well, Chuck's ego also kept him from getting proper help

@@DaScorpionStingarrogance not ego

True, but it’s also complicated in that Howard wanted to avoid a PR nightmare that a senior partner is mentally ill and seeking treatment. And Jimmy felt he owed Chuck so he couldn’t justify “betraying” him like that. But all it did was make the problem worse…

Ya like he believes in the law, but when the law catches up to him, well, look how he responds

Not to mention the insurance company has firms on retainer in case someone wants to try their luck and take them to court, it would promise a long difficult legal battle. And your firm gets a reputation where other insurance companies will avoid doing business with you.

@@matthewriley7826Chuck nearly destroyed HHM way before Saul and Kim would do the same.

But to betray the one who told him the secret of the D's name?

Except Chuck's threatening litigation to this one carrier would likely poison the well and make them have a difficult time finding a new carrier in a city as small as Albuquerque.

@@TheLewistownTrainspotter8102 Nah, that is going to reflect badly on HHM more than the insurance broker. Especially when HHM is suing them just because one of its co-partners detests having an assistant when it has been proven he is mentally ill. That is a huge violation of their contract on HHM's part.

He had the decency to at least pour Chuck a drink first.😂

He didn't know that it was Jimmy who got the insurance to go after Chuck. Neither did Kim until he confessed at the end. Cheryl will make sure some of Howard's reputation is restore with her lawsuit against Kim.

@@DaScorpionSting very true I guess that's why the confession was so important

Well I think that was more punishment for them concealing Chuck’s illness for such a long time. And they only threatened to raise them but also offered a compromise, besides Chuck has become a huge liability and more difficult to insure.

people can be so greedy