Thanks for sharing. If there is not likely going to be a Hybrid Petrol version of the Prado, you have saved me wasting my time waiting for it to arrive.
None! The Prado Altitude model gets the new Stabiliser Disconnect Mechanism, which works very differently to KDSS or e-KDSS. If you want KDSS on a "Prado" you now have to buy the Lexus GX550 Overtrail ($122,250 before on-road costs), which has the feature. Here's our explainer on SDM vs KDSS: www.chasingcars.com.au/news/car-technology/new-toyota-prado-to-drop-kdss-in-favour-of-new-sdm-tech/
US hybrid version lacks a third row, so you're gonna loose some versatility too, as well as towing capacity with the petrol-hybrid. Guess its gonna be 4-pot diesel all round. Gonna miss those 6 and 8 cylinders of old...
All Toyota hybrids in Australia as you pointed out are about reducing fuel consumption, the US version of the Land Cruiser Prado hybrid is about increasing power and torque, not about reducing fuel consumption, because Americans tend to be more concerned about power and torque than fuel consumption. We don’t like thirsty 4WDs hence why when Prado was sold with both diesel and petrol versions, diesel was much more popular and why Toyota ended up ditching the petrol versions. Apart from emissions, Toyota probably also thinks because US Prado hybrids don’t provide fuel consumption savings that they won’t sell as well as they’d like and reach the sales targets they would want.
I think if I had a pick, it would be the Altitude. Although why you have to wait for the second from top model to get a rear differential, is beyond me.
Altitude is the model that starts getting proper off-road credentials with the multi terrain select and rear locker. It will be around $97,500 on road.
@@LordSothMajere It is expensive and you can get far more luxury for less with other models like heated and cooled seats, premium leather, sunroof, digital rear view mirror etc. But they are not a Toyota and that's really important to a lot of people. I am also hoping wait times are less than a year 🤞
The minimum 10,000 unit sales to justify making a RH drive version of the petrol hybrid just doesn't make sense considering Toyota are already building a RH drive Prado on the factory line but with the diesel. Surely there is minimal changes inside the cabin, just take the diesel RH drive Prado and fit the petrol hybrid engine & drivetrain. 10,000 units would be necessary to justify converting to RH drive a vehicle that currently only exists in LH drive such as the Tundra. There would be thousands of soccer Mums in the big cities that have no need for diesel or 3.5t towing capacity, crazy not to have the petrol hybrid as an option for Aust.
I might not of made the subtleties of that point clear enough. The way the story was related to me, the engineering work simply has not been done on that combination of the hybrid powertrain and the new Prado chassis for right-hand drive deployment. So Toyota Australia would basically have to cover that re-engineering cost to make the engine itself ready for RHD in this chassis, and then recoup that spend with the sort of sales we are talking about
I don’t believe you would have read that at this stage. Like us, the Brits are only taking the Prado with the 2.8 diesel 48v. Same with NZ. Same with South Africa. No 2.4 hybrid for RHD in any of those markets. Perhaps if all those countries decided to take the 2.4, the amortisation cost would be lower, but Australia would easily be the highest sales volume.
@@chasingcars Australa is not the only RHD market - there is still the Japanese domestic market, the Uk and Ireland and much of the Commonwealth that will require the RHD versions. So its not just Aussies picking up the tab
@@AnarchistBogan It was ok in the last of the 150s, but this new Prado is near 200kg heavier, and without power/torque bump I believe it will be a slug. It really does need an overhaul in the power/torque numbers to interest me.
Yeah, well picked up and a bit of a disappointment. Only Altitude gets rear diff lock, and Kakadu swaps it for a rear LSD which operates differently. Basically if you want it sorted out of the box you'll need to go for Altitude.
@@chasingcars I know, disappointed ... I have front and rear LSD with Quadra Drive II on my 2007 Jeep Commander CRD with V6 3.L engine which produces similar power output what the new Ford 3L V6 does.
Tom is right the altitude is the model that starts getting proper off-road credentials with the multi terrain select and rear locker. It will be around $97,500 on road.
The engine is a disaster. Surely Toyota could have put the 300 series Six in it without it cannibalising the bigger Grandpa car!! I really wanted to buy this. Now I don't
Tom, excellent review ❤. Now that makes complete sense. No channel has cover Prado that good. Keep up the good job, Tom 👍🌟. Always rely on your channel for factual and honest reviews.
You’ll struggle to get 7.9litres/100km out of these things. Sure, on some trips you’ll get better than that, but very rarely (usually at 60-80km/h without stopping). I got a Prado last year and after 23,000km have averaged 8.9litres/100kms, with multiple 900km round-trip country jaunts.
I think Toyota really dropped the ball by not having the option for the round headlights. They look so much better. The rectangular ones look like an afterthought. Rectangular light in a square hole with a filler piece of plastic beneath the light. Just looks out of place
@@andyalways8081and people like you can have your modern out of place looking rectangular headlights on your retro inspired car. All I'm saying is it would have been nice to have the option
@@rjbiker66yes but the headlights will need to be from another right hand drive country. And that might prove difficult trying to source lights from Japan or South Africa...
@@andyalways8081 You and everyone that shares your opinion can still have your out of place looking modern rectangular headlights on your retro styled car. All I'm saying is that it would have been nice to at least have the option for the round lights
totally. wish they could offer a launch edition with 7 seats and the retro grill. even better, take away the adaptive suspension, sunroof, and the JBL, and put in a locking diff.
I don’t doubt the Prado will sell strongly, but I do have considerable doubts Toyota could convince 50% of Prado buyers to choose the hybrid if it is down on towing and doesn’t save any fuel.
so comparing new Prado GXL with Everest Sport V6 for the same price, Ford looks like a clear winner for specs ... Toyota has the "new model" vibe and reliability going for it
It definitely appear that way. The Everest does have some sketchy dynamics in wet weather on *some* of its OEM wheel/tyre packages, but the V6 has heaps more grunt than the Toyota four-banger. I suspect the Toyota will be a bit plusher inside and perhaps a tad more refined overall (engine aside). Looking forward to a comparison, obviously!
Unless I missed something no version comes with 17" wheels. The best option for towing for some people, easier to match van and car wheels for spares. VX looses the rear locking diff? Altitude looks good as a 5 seat option, shame about the sun roof, another thing to leak rain and dust. Hope this model has a good range. I still hope for a full diesel with two tanks for the van towers, dont know if a hybrid will have the range for outback towing. After all they are not all just used for people movers To me it looks like Toyota are specking these more for city use than country towing.
I agree no mention of 17" wheels. To me this indicates their intended market which is not off road at all if no 17" option. If no 17" or subtank option these will just be city cars
All my times off roading I have never once seen anything like a Land Cruiser, Lexus LX nor G Wagon on the back roads. Thats what they’re made for but people aren’t taking $100k vehicles off road and on back roads. What’s the point of them then?
Don't worry when these $80 to $100k vehicles end up being $20 to $30k vehicles on second hand market in 10 to 15 years time, they will end up in the Outback.
Immagine this car costs 190k - that is what I pay in the Netherlands. The difference is taxes, majority an up as a the CO2 output panelty. A dieselhybrid with a significant cut in CO2 would indeed be nice
I am a Toyota fan, and i have a VX Prado already... but if i was being charged these numbers, i'd be looking at a BYD Shark or something else like a Tank 500. Price has gotta return to sanity, c'mon mannnnn.
I'd take a 90 series or any other Toyota Prado over a BYD any day of the week. I wonder if you are not fully appreciating or understanding what you have already? I'd guess engineering is not one of your favourite topics, and perhaps neither is NPV analysis. That's okay, but please, don't swap your Prado for anything less.
Looks great and I’m sure reliability and build quality will be up there, but I am disappointed Toyota haven’t worked hard enough on a hybrid diesel! This means there will be a lot more disappointment when the new hilux is unveiled next year!! From a very disappointed Toyota byer
The old engine with the new equipment especially the base land ceuiser prado will be very reliable. We know that that the 2.8 diesel is very reliable and easy going. A new hybrid might have been less reliable.
I think you'll find that the hybrid for the US Land Cruiser (Prado) is an IForce Max like you find on the Tundra. The "hybrid" system on coupled infant of the transmission and is there to provide more torque and off the line performance. It is NOT intended for fuel economy, just a way to provide more "power" without the large engine displacement.
Sure, none of that goes against anything I’ve said however. The combination of no fuel cut + lower towing means it’s an uphill battle for Toyota to justify bothering to bring the Prado hybrid here. Sure, it has more power, but will enough buyers care about that? As I said, 1 in 2 Prado customers would have to select the hybrid. Not sure power alone will do the job, and that is all it’s got.
@@chasingcars Yes. Enough buyers will care about more power. 150kwh, in a 4wd of this weight and price in 2024 is crazy. I was 100% in for one until I saw the pathetic engine figures. Tank 500 it is.
@@chasingcars my point was in response to your comments about the new NEVS and total fleet emissions, this "hybrid" system would work against Toyota in this respect and as you stated, a big ask to get 50% of total Prado sales.
6:57 U.S. $ to aus $ yours are cheaper than the ones sold in the U.S. and they come out of the same factory and shipped x the oceans ....... we get taken by Toyota and the dealers mark them up $5000-$30k U.S. over sticker
I actually don’t blame Toyota for this. They do talk nonsense sometimes. But this is an Aussie marketing issue. Rugged vehicles with poor towing capacity have a marketing problem - even if (yes) people don’t often tow 3500kg with a Prado. But especially on the economy / CO2 point, that’s just a fact, rather than anything Toyota is trying to parrot. If the hybrid doesn’t cut fuel use, it won’t help on the NVES front, so why would you kick in the funds to bring it here if there’s not some very compelling other reason?
What Toyota will do is sell more Hybrids and offset the pollution the Land Cruiser and Hilux range has with a diesel and pay nothing to the Government, for the next few years until the threshold comes down far enough to start costing the consumer. My guess is people will just pay while Toyota keeps pulling down the CO2 of the rest of the fleet to minimize the impact. Either way resale is going to be epic!
That's definitely possible - the only problem being that the thresholds (as legislated) actually do get quite tough on the 4WD side very quickly. 210g/km in the first year is easily doable, 180g/km in 2026 is OK… 150g/km in 2027 is genuinely quite tough. By the same time, the passenger car limit also gets very, very difficult without going to PHEV. So even Toyota will struggle within a few years if they plan to still sell 200g/km+ 4WDs and utes. The winner, as you say, may be the people that purchase at the current prices - if OEMs have to jack up the retail price of high-CO2 vehicles to pay emissions penalties.
It seems wild to me that anyone would buy a non-electrified vehicle at this point. Be it some form of hybrid or fully electric. I can only imagine what we will be paying for fuel after 5-10 years of owning a now new car.
That may well be accurate, but if the hybrid Prado (in its current form) doesn’t save fuel, why would you buy it? Maybe for the big increase in power, but that’s probably it.
Keeping the old 2.8-litre diesel engine with the outdated 48-volt light hybrid battery, I can see how not using advanced technology can make the vehicle more reliable, but why has the price gone up so much? It also lost a rear differential lock relative to the older model
I have owned 2 Prados, all new starting with the 2010 and then the 2018 model. I use this mainly to tow my boat which is about 2000kg. This is a chore to say the least but I do love these vehicles. I was going to buy the new Prado - no questions asked - BUT - seriously, the same breathless shitty 2,8 litre engine but costing $20.000 more for a GXL than I paid in 2018? Plus on roads?> You have got to be joking! Every vehicle owned by my family is a Toyota but I will not buy the new Prado with the same underpowered old engine!
Surely the vast majority of buyers would prefer a modern petrol hybrid that is more exciting to drive over an ageing diesel with more towing capacity. Especially when so many will never tow anything more than an occasional box trailer. Missed the mark imo.
Surely the vast majority of buyers would prefer a modern petrol hybrid that is more exciting to drive over an ageing diesel with more towing capacity. Especially when so many will never tow anything. Missed the mark imo.
Saying it's engineering, nves, and towing are excuses, the real problem imo is no 7 seats..... need to find another place for the batteries. Definitely prefer the hybrid tho.
I would have jumped at the petrol option if it was available. I tow in tonnes not 3 tonne. Should be cheaper to service and run over time as no egr system complications, adblue. A 4 cylinder petrol engine would suit a huge amount of Prado buyers. V6 would be less desirable as traditionally thirsty through Toyota like the v8 diesel and petrol engines
Overpriced for what it offers. Whilst the exterior looks nice the interior doesn’t especially in that price point where other manufacturers are providing luxurious interiors. I definitely wouldn’t be rushing out to buy this SUV. Also the Lexus GX550 isn’t much better, 6 cylinder turbo but comes standard with a tiny 80L tank. Also the GX550 cannot be driven due to issues with the sunroof. Add that in the US the Toyota V6 engines are blowing up and you have to wonder is Toyota losing that tag of being reliable?
What a heap of sh!t Prado design..... Toyota told me 'take it or leave it' in buying a 300 cruiser...........so I went and bought a Patrol Warrior...Best decision I ever make.....and saved 40K
That's your 'kind' explanation of the real reason why Toyota is not bringing the hybrid version to Australia. The other reason is that the now released Tank 500 hybrid outguns the Prado hybrid in powe and torque.
100k for a 4 cylinder diesel with a 48v alternator - however which way you look at it it is not great value is it and I think anyone that gets one of these over a second hand 200 or 300 series has some strange priorities.
looks great , Its a Toyota , would you want to be in anything else for your round Australia trip , this thing will sell like hotcakes for years to come , hydrid or not
As an American who drives a GX 460 in because it's the only way to get a Land Cruiser Prado in my market I feel really bad for you guys because you're losing the KDSS system on the Toyota for it to be exclusive on the GX550 now
That engine is disappointing, but the price is ridiculous. But Toyota know their market and Toyota fans will complain, but in the end they wont be going elsewhere Edit: actually that Lexus GX is looking like a decent deal compared to the Prado
ELI5 - if the petrol hybrid makes so much more torque than the old diesel, and the vehicle weighs the same, with the same brakes etc etc, why would it be rated at 2700kg towing? What else goes in to that calculation?
One thing you missed mention is that the government is bringing in Euro 6 which the current 2.8 won't meet. They would have to do alot of work including ad blue to get it to meet the emission standards if it even can meet them. This obviously can't be done overnight. Toyota is in abit of a pickle here it's not just the 250 series but also the Hilux that's in trouble.
More power, more torque, same fuel consumption, can tow as much as I need and anyone wanting to tow more than 2.7tonnes should be looking for a bigger option anyway . The hybrid sounds like a good option but I can understand that marketing it may be a challenge.
It will be interesting next year when all ladder frame vehicles are exempt from luxury car tax. Do you think Toyota will drop the price or keep the extra $$$$😂.
From the ATO website: The LCT threshold for 2024-25 is: $91,387 for fuel-efficient vehicles. This is in line with an increase to the motor-vehicle purchase sub-group of the Consumer Price Index (CPI) $80,567 for all other luxury vehicles, in line with an increase in the ‘All Groups’ CPI.
I’ve got a deposit down on one. My biggest gripe is that the gxl only comes with seven seats. Bit of a shame they dont come stock at that badge with 5 like they have done for the last ten years. But not a huge deal I suppose. I’m really excited. Love the look of the new shape and dont really mind the engine as I’ve driven that Hilux engine for the last year or so
This NVES is going to be disaster. Once every day people realise how much more expensive vehicles are they’ll riot. A hybrid would lose the third row seats too.
Wouldn't it make more sense for Toyota to release the Prado with the V6 twin turbo engine as another option? It would be interesting to see the sales numbers v's the 2.8 Deisel.
Just took delivery of my 2023 Prado Kakadu in Crystal Pearl with black leather interior. Was one of the last new Kakadu's available for $99,990 before on road costs. Was stoked to get a brand new one & think it looks way better than the boxy FJ Cruiser looking 250 Prado. Another reason besides the looks is the 150l fuel tank & rear mounted spare which I'm sure is a massive positive to have for those outback adventures & road trips compared to the new 110 litre offering.
Compared to US-specification petrol V8 or V6 engines, the turbo-petrol hybrid cuts fuel use. The problem is that Australia always had the half-reasonably-frugal diesel, so the turbo hybrid doesn't cut fuel use or CO2. Looks like we would need a different hybrid Prado for it to make economic sense locally. That said, the diesel isn't perfect - at 209g/km, it's right on the 2025 NVES 4WD limit!
That towing statement needs to be scrutinised. I’d like to see a proper vehicle engineer talk to the diesel vs petrol option. The marketing guy is just that a marketing guy. He’s not going to have any power on what comes to oz. But he will be pushing what he can sell.
The only statement that was made was a recitation of the maximum braked towing weight the Prado hybrid is certified for in the US. It’s not an opinion. Further, probably worth pointing out that your “marketing guy” assumption is an uninformed one: the person you’re talking about is also head of sales for Toyota, a position that effectively decides what products the company brings to Australia, and in what format. Not exactly a powerless ad-man.
