I was forced to watch and debunk Madara vs Aizen (DEATH BATTLE - Naruto vs Bleach) 

B r u h unlucky

Bloody hell.

Ouch

Hmmmm

They fear you

@Bewoop and black zetsu is part of kaguya's plan, so everyone looses, including the viewer because kaguya is fucking trash

@@dumbdenki3164 nah she wasnt nor is the viewer

Spideyfan and Bewoop and this was all part of darth jar-jars plan cause he likes to cost troubles.

Otsuski God: are you sure about that 😐

@@sgwaris8853 boruto isnt canon

I saw the change in his face expression... it is so sad.

Omfg, DB's calculations such bs. Because they ignore powerscaling and just clacs how big the explosion, not how strong or its dp. Like they calced before that 2nd resurrection Ulquiorra is stronger than Transcended Aizen. Such a pile of bs.

They seem to assume that the mangaka also thought about how many kilotons of TNT their character's punching strength is. The power of a character in this artform is based on the power system the author has explicitly put in place, regardless of whether or not the results are accurate to real world science. If the mangakas actually measured and calculated the density of every mountain and every rock before they drew it, they'd never finish their manga. That's why comparing a power system in a story type such as anime to how things work in the real world is like comparing apples to oranges (unless said power system is explicitly based on the real world)

@@emberdragon4248 true

Tbf, anyone making calcs would be cringe. Mainly because bias will always be there. So those arguing about this wouldn't be any better.

It's so stupid. There are all kinds of death battle match-ups where the combatants shouldn't be able to kill each other (OPM vs. SCP-682, for example) but these guys will always assign a winner based on something absurd like, "He made roots grows really fast once," or "He was shown to be damaged in a dream sequence" or "This character that objectively has massively fewer attacks actually somehow has more attacks, therefore they win."

Yeah, but they do still have a point of Aizen never shown to be under and break out of any “illusion”. They did use a bad example, though.

@@migarsormrapophis2755 SCP-682 is complete bullshit from what I hear so it’d probably win

@@nutnut6161 I'm pretty sure they wouldn't be able to (permanently) kill each other (OPM and SCP-682, I mean). SCP-682 his been killed countless times, but it just resurrects itself like its nothing. A battle between them would probably look like OPM one-punching SCP-682 over and over and over, and SCP-682 reforming over and over and over, but SCP-682 doesn't have any amazing damage powers, so they'd just be locked like that forever. SCP-682 might also adapt to OPM's punches at some point, hard to say, it's an uncertain power interaction, but even if SCP-682 were to adapt at some point, it still wouldn't be able to damage OPM. SCP-682 would win if they weren't bloodlusted, in which case OPM would just get bored and give up at some point. If they're bloodlusted and they have to kill one another, then the battle doesn't have a conclusion. I'm sure if DB were handling it, though, they'd come up with some number for OPM and some number for SCP-682 and say "Oh boy, looks like Combatant A's number is bigger than Combatant B's number, so I guess that means Combatant A wins!"

@@scottvgamer1163 finally someone who thought the same thing as me

Every single naruto death battle is wrong lmao

What about Obi Wan vs. Kakashi?

@@Surgyous374 How could you be certain?

@@WorldArchivist Death Battle broke their own rules with that one so technically speaking it should be null and void. Their rules clearly state they only pull from canon and Disney shoved 95% of what Death Battle used for Obi-Wan into non canon years ago

@@WorldArchivist that's quite an exotic couple of challengers,not gonna lie

It's just so funny how bad their research is😂

@Rimuru Tempest Absolute facts

@Rimuru Tempest No you're absolutely wrong, Mugetsu didn't disintegrate the left half of Aizen, he completely removed him from existence and the dude willed himself back.

Ceros' are lightspeed?

@@slimer44producciones3 I mean ceros are spiritual "light" fired off. Saying that they're made of light but not moving at light speed is a interesting claim. But even at that the Bala is supposedly able to move 20x faster than the cero. When people like urahara can just dodge those things people are moving well beyond lightspeed. People like to say it emits light but the books literally say it's a spiritual light fired by menos grande and espada

Yeah and she is literally the greatest healer in bleach the only person who do better is Orihime who just rewrites reality so injures never happen in the first place

Yep, there is never a case where Aizen's illusions have been dispelled and only the Quincey king ever realised that he'd experienced an illusion, mostly because he could see through time, rather than that he directly noticed anything.

@@TheArcSet yup, Its disappointing how they did a "research" to databook of naruto saying raikage is speed of light while not go into deep lore of Bleach.

@@prof.leo0246 still that's normal in the Naruto world. KS=genin lvl genjutsu. Both affect the 5 senses.

They did and I agree with what they said lol

And it was a better video. I believe DB only wants people to fight with each other at this point. I stopped watching years ago.

No one there was willing to say who they thought had the better chance of winning, but Seth at least gave me the vibe that he favored Aizen.

@@yorecf9641 I watched their debunk and they definitely said Aizen had a better chance of winning due to Madara having no way to kill him leaving the only win conditions for Madara being sealing Aizen.

@@l.k.4186 that’s what I meant. I just pointed out that they themselves said multiple times, “We aren’t saying that one would, for sure, beat the other since they both have win conditions.”

Not mention that Kyoka can affect a God who can resist power null lol 🤣

@@justsomeguyworkingatmcdona6817 Technically, Kyoka Suigetsu can cast illusions across space-time and all dimensions negating the true omnipotence of a literal god to see all of time and existence including all possible futures.

Simple conclusion if you look it up not a single person in Naruto is universal you look up bleach you got Yamamoto the zero division captain Quincy King and Azien you look up Naruto's universal levels they say there is none

@@zeroking6444 The most cringe argument those Narutards told me is TSO can negate regeneration and erase existence therefore Madara stomps and they also low-ball the Hogyoku lol. I mean I do believe that Madara has a chance of beating Aizen but if they seriously want to make Madara the victor there are better win conditions.

@@justsomeguyworkingatmcdona6817 like bro he survived getting his soul obliterated multiple times that's why they sealed him like these imbeciles

Just because you can see multiple timeliness doesn't mean you're immune to illusions, Aizen clearly made him see a false timeline.

@@devanplays3509 Maybe, though Aizen did make the point multiple times to people who also had op illusion powers that they were still nothing compared to his. Let's also no forget that Genjutsu is controlling the chakra of the target and that causes the illusion, which is why Madara is so resistant to it with his eyes. Meanwhile, Aizen's sword takes control of every sense you have, be that higher dimensional vision or your ability to sense your own chakra. You need an extreme amount of stupid and ass pulls to get around it because of how op it is.

@@nilok7 Ocular genjutsu can take control of you're 5 sense not just your Chakra and even directly attacks your brain. Madara can break out of that types of genjutsus.

@@devanplays3509 That's because genjutsu works by infecting someone with your own chakra, even ocular genjutsu works on this principle and they only work because the people of the naruto world have chakra networks which are intertwined with there biology, no chakra net work means you can't be affected by genjutsu and since chakra net works were the resault of connection to the god tree it impossible anyone outside of the naruto universe to be affected by genjutsu based upon there inner workings.

@@devanplays3509 Then why couldn't he predict that he would be made to see a fake timeline?

Because they use them for parodies and reaearch, and while they do put the flashy content, they don't use enough to get copyrighted, meanwhile he just copy pasted the part of the fight (aka, the death battle part), gave no credit and used it for monetary gain And also because copyright sucks

Not Death Battle itself but Rooster Teeth. Idk what happened with Rooster Teeth because they used to be cool with people reacting to their content but it’s pretty sad and pathetic.

I think it was the background song, they did pay brandon yates the make the song for this battle, its called hollow dreams if you are wondering

Because they're Transformative, this isn't. Also, it wasn't death battle, it was rooster teeth

Ya that’s true but for the sake of the battle they are comparing spiritual pressure to chakra saying they’re basically the same thing even though they aren’t

@@izduckii8143 thats bull. its not called even squared battle its called death battle.

Tatski was able to withstand it for a bit so surely madara would withstand it

But Tatski has spiritual pressure

Not a lot but she has enough to see them

Aizen stronger than soul king is a bullshit that I never heard before

@@marcomilillo2001 maybe, maybe not, again death battle were the ones to say it

@@christophermonteith2774 Wouldn't that be Multidimensional than Multiplanetary? Since Yhwach was pulling dimensions together.

@@cuauhtemocgonzales2530 it could be, but the word world is a bit vague. it is at least multi-planetary though

@@cuauhtemocgonzales2530 I've heard of arguments regarding mutli-planetary output vs universal output for example the soul king could split and divide the universe into three dimensions, but I'm not an expert on bleach lore, I do have friends who've gathered alot of evidences regarding arguments about these though.

Balas are 20 times faster than that and Kisuke was dodging those at the beginning of the Arrancar Arc.

Cero isn't light speed. It's not a laser of light but rather a laser of energy. Having said that, yes Aizen is way faster. A Captain was able to move faster than a human could see, Ichigo then moved faster than a Captain could see with his Bankai. Aizen then moved faster than Bankai Ichigo could see with the Hogyoku. Which assuming that their eyes are good enough to keep up with their own speed, would mean that Aizen with Hogyoku moves several times faster than anything Madara would be prepared for as a human even with enhanced eye speed, he's still only kept up with other fast moving humans. Never anything on the level of gods.

@@mefisbalorgames3694 one of the databooks quite literally referred to a Cero as, “A powerful, spiritual light fired by Menos Grandes and Arrancar.”

@@yorecf9641 yeah, that's kinda what I meant, but I understand where he's coming from

@@yorecf9641 to be fair lasers are bullshit in most mediums because you get a lot of people dodging them that have no business dodging anything that fast.

That only works on absurdly weaker beings

@@sk47moxie59 Madara is

@@maganoparkins5201 No

@@Zanuk No

Madara does not even have reiatsu he would be destroyed by just gettting near aizen.

that was because pain wasn't a sage, by the end Madara was a sage

Madara is sage, so absorbing nature energy has not negative impact.

@@KhaosFrosty The point of my comment was that absorbig energy you aren't prepared for can eb lethal. Nature Energy is one he became capable of absorbing after becoming a Sage, but we can't guarantee that he can absorb what the people in Bleach use without exploding.

@@KhaosFrosty but madara "absorbed" aizens KIDO barrier, in normal edo tensei form..

- Madara tries absorbing Aizen's spiritual pressure midbattle and fuckin implodes into bits - Aizen : *Smirk*

Saitama kills both Kaguya and Aizen with One Punch, man! ;D And afterwards he scrunched his brow and groans, "Ah! They were both so annoying!" And everyone agrees and cheers for the Caped Baldy finally and permanently getting rid of two stupidly OP characters, one who ceased to be interesting about halfway through the series thanks to his stupidly and needlessly convoluted plans involving stuff he couldn't POSSIBLY have planned out ahead of time (Aizen), and the other who should never have been there in the first place (Kaguya)!

@@Alondro77 and then u have caped baldy who has no character development whatsoever :)

@@bababuu4408 Saitama has ALL THE DEPTH! He's so powerful nothing can challenge him! I can totally relate! ;D

@@Alondro77 Madara erases Saitama

This thread is funny

Ok let’s end this spiritual pressure debate. It’s the same thing nen from hxh like if your physical strong enough you can quite literally not be bothered by it. Like wasn’t ichigo spiritual pressure so large that aizen thought he didn’t had any and like everyone near him was just fine.

Nah madara stomps

@@suru7064 I this your argument? Just because they didnt feel it it becomes useless? Even tho we've seen humans die just being near Aizen. And those humans also couldnt feel Aizens Spiritual power.

@@suru7064 Name me 1 non Nen User who could kill a Nen User

Fax plus they said naruto beats ichigo and they said Garra loses to toph Ichigo and Garra should have won both of there battles

i mean popeye vs saitama was great

@@SuperMandibleclaw If you say so. I'll be honest. IDK if you're trolling or if that's actually a fight because I gave up on Death Battle a long time ago so I've only seen a handful of episodes since Goku vs Superman.

@@MRCrazyKorn Saitama vs Popeye is legitimately good. Also you’ve only seen a handful of episodes yet you say their quality has dropped so much?

@@nutnut6161 Bruh... I'm almost 30. I've bin watching death battle since it started. The quality started poor, got better, became great, than started to plumet. I think I first started to notice the quality drop with the Raiden vs Wolverine fight. After that I began to notice how they would consistently ether get lore rong or just egnore different parts, power, lore, xcetera in order to give the aposing fighter a leg up. I stopped watching after the Superman vs Goku fight because I got sick of the poor fight animations and the fact that they would do as stated above (ignore certain parts of the characters). So that's how I know they dropped in quality and why I say I've missed episodes.

But can Aizen use Chakra feet?

chakra is alien genes....

@@TheBoostedOne-h9o no it’s physical and spiritual energy look up any explanation of it

Madara can't absorb reiatsu its a completely different energy source

@@pacmiller7564 not completely different just like 50% it’s just spirit energy

No shit

There really aren't that many they're right with

@@misheil7322 true

time huh... thanks for the tip

@Projekt Zero what’s that supposed to mean

That said, Aizen in theory should be strong enough to release it without calling it's name every time. I'm just going to ASSUME that was the case here, for the sake of "They were lazy and didn't want to mess with it"

Isn't that was before he had the Hogyoku tho.. current aizen and Kyoka Suigetsu are fused now

@@s0sa1ty Precisely. He *is* Kyouka Suigetsu now. He can just choose to put you under illusion by you looking at him

@@majoratwili7312 yeah. He did that to Ywach while still bound by all of his restraints in Mugen.

Fun fact after fighting mugetsu ichigo he evoled and became one with his zanpakto which allowed him to use his shikai without having to show his sword since he and his sword were one in the same, this got rid of his one flaw and was even good enough to put a being that can see and change every possible future under the effects of his shikai

Doesn’t Madera truth seeking orbs prevent even spirits from regenerating there for the Hogyoku wouldn’t work? I didn’t finish bleach so I’m not to sure on all the details.

@@stevenrageanimation3311 All of Bleach battles and abilities are soul based techniques so even the most weakest Zanpakutou is on par with the TSO jutsu, not to mention the Hogyoku can't be destroyed no matter what.

I see, thank you

Also the TSO is a weapon. Not a jutsu

I mean, there are characters that could erase Aizen from existence but it's not Madara no one from Naruto.

Kidou is very similar to Chakra because there both spiritual energy

@@devanplays3509 The spiritual energy in Bleach is different than the Spiritual Energy in Naruto, though. They work completely differently, to the point where they literally have different names in japanese, "spiritual energy" just being a rough translation of the concept for convenience's sake. In Naruto it's literally described as "derived from consciousness", while in Bleach it is derived from the soul itself. Saying "well, they are both spiritual" is just a lazy oversimplification.

@@Lookin4aBoxToLive "You know these two different things? I'm going to say they're the same."

@@Lookin4aBoxToLive Chakra is litterly spiritual and physical energy, your oversimplifing Chakra here

@@migarsormrapophis2755 they actually aren't.

All facts

@@pacmiller7564 purposely didn't put a single opinion.

@@kyleanderson449 😂😂😂

@@kyleanderson449 everything you said IS an opinion. Just shows you haven't watched Naruto, are extremely biased towards bleach and know that your puny character gets no diffed by even the lower tier Otsusuki's like Urashiki or Toneri.

@@pacmiller7564 don't encourage him. This is nothing but fake. None of this is true and Aizen gets folded by a sharingan genin. Sealing tags that sealed LITERAL immortals will work on that guy too.

So many attacks in Bleach destroy the soul. It’s not anything big in the Bleach verse. Its literally the Quincy’s whole thing and Aizen can regenerate from all of it. Proven when the Soul Society tried every possible way to execute him when he was captured and couldn’t do it. Not to mention the Hogoyoku (doubt I spelled it right) never left Aizen and could have continuously evolved him to get stronger.

@@Warlock_Lelouch i guess the truth orbs are kinda like hakai in some for or way then. Like a shit off button for existence

@@tash5186 eh sure but the problem is that while the TSO’s have been described to nullify chakra, there by leading to the destruction of those resurrected, the Hogyoku has been said to use a power completely different from Rietsu. So the TSO’s shouldn’t have any effect on it or it’s healing abilities. Not to mention Aizen’s skikai should still effect Madara. Yes Madara has sharingan but Aizen was able to hypnotize a person who could see every possible outcome of the future and still tricked the guy. I’m not saying its impossible for someone like Madara to figure it out, but it would have been a way bigger of a problem and factor in the fight.

@@Warlock_Lelouch well it was stated that hagoromo used the truth seeking sword or something to "shape the world" also I agree that illusion/genjutsu stuff is kinda stretch but once again. I actually think that in a 1v1 or fights let's keep the general power system somewhat interactable and scalable to each other using feats done in their own universes. Cus technically speaking on one Madara should even perceive aizen all the while aizens pressure should be enough to beat a human. and madara's limbo clones can't be sensed by aizen. But both being in the same teir of higher dimensional power in their own respective universes are interactable. I personally even thought aizen should speed blitz madara ez but I guess scaling to jutsus and highballing both characters make them scalable.

@@Warlock_Lelouch that implies that Aizen regenerated from all of that. It’s very possible he just tanked it and the secondary effects couldn’t take place because he wasn’t hurt in the first place. An attack can’t destroy your soul if you’re too durable for it to hurt your soul at all.

Or litteraly any attack in bleach because all attacks damage someones soul and physical body Also can we appreciate that the truth orbs basically work the same as Gin's zanpukto and that didn't work on butterfly Aizen yet alone monster Aizen

@@darkousdragon1166 they don't. It should do WAY more damage. Granted he can't be killed ANYway. But if kekkei tota can atomic dismantle you (see how I LITERALLY just wrote the name...) then kekkei mora should be soul erasure on par with hakai.

​@@jameschristopher2540na particle style don't affect reishi

those orbs stops ninjutsu so the edo tensi stops regenerating not aizen since he dont use that

That is true. It's also kind of irrelevant to the fact that they matched up a one-man-army-zombie to the guy who replaces the god stand in and now holds all of time and space together with his lifeforce. Or why they let Madara do things no character in Bleach, even the god, was able to do. Or that lightspeed is a slow c-tier feat in Bleach.

Not really, correct me if I am wrong but the truth seeking orbs only nullify ninjutsu, that is why Edo tensei minato and the other edos died or couldn't regenerate once they got hit with one, there whole existence was a product of ninjutsu(Edo tensei). But a lot of things were overlooked in this fight for both parties.

@@Austinfdp and Aizen can't affect the Naruto verse because their souls aren't the same. Naruto souls are different and don't become shinigami. So Aizen can't hurt Naruto verse

@@xxdemonkiller69xx5 no because 5 nature energies combined isn't just going to 'nullify' genjutsu. Unless KS is just a genin lvl genjutsu and a sealing tag that sealed edo tensei can also easily seal Aizen.

Yep, all handwaving and allowed interactions for the sake of drama aside, giving Madara the ability to do something no-one in Bleach was able to do, even the God stand in, is just stupid. Aizen's hypnosis has never been broken, so it's silly to just say, he has to be able to break it, or there's no battle.

He did want to lose against Ichigo yet the Hogyoku wouldn't allow it, were it not for Kisuke, Aizen would have ascended further

mf wanted to lose and still almost won thats crazy​@@nonamehours6428

are you MOTIVATED?

The difference between battle of morales is that it's considered these characters are being pit with each other in a fictional narrative, morales are off, they shouldn't be acting like they should, that's how usually vs battle standards work.

And in term of having more? it does have the win, provided there are certain criterias that have to be met But in logical reasoning, power > over abilities. An example is like batman can't win against a person who could nuke a planet in one punch. Because he is physically incapable of doing so.

Logically Madara stomps tho

aizen isnt just fast. he literally can teleport.

I don't know about number 3, but given Aizen's level of power, breaking out of Madara's Genjutsu should be easy, and even if he took fatal damage because of trickery, he can easily regen from it given how he regened from Gin's Bankai.

@@espurrseyes42 I wasnt to sure about number 3 I thought I heard that he couldnt bc of his blade somewhere but it might have been false still tho genjutsu wouldnt be very effective against him. And exactly they never even did his bankai or shikai(dont know if I spelled this right) they only used him hollow form pretty much. They just did anything possible to make it look like madara would win using false information or nerfing aizen so he doesnt win it's stupid and that's why no one that knows anime likes death battles they dont use accurate information

@@dragondraco1670 They also didn't use Blood War Arc feats. I guess I get it, as that arc is about to get animated, but that arc in the manga has been done for years now.

@@espurrseyes42 ya its ridiculous now a days

@Ayame When did Aizen gain the ability to freeze time? Is that when he gained the hogyoku (sp), or during something else. I'm going mostly off of the anime and have only just starting reading TYB. edit: TYBW

@@launchbeats191 it’s an power he and other characters had since the beginning which is why I brought it up, it’s never used because literally freezing time isn’t that powerful in Bleach. It’s a Kido that Tessai used with ease, and if Tessai can use it then Aizen, Kisuke and Hachigan can at the very least

@@ayame8095 OOHH, thanks for jogging my memory.

Yeah that is quite a write up. But it begs the question, if Aizen is immortal which he absolutely is and the only way to beat Aizen is to seal him.... Then why even include him in a *DEATH BATTLE* to begin with? Characters like Aizen should be banned from Death Battles. According to vs Battle, Aizen has 2 types of immortality lol.

Seal a soul😂 like what happen on madara before almost got seal.

@@sorrybroo8303 if you remember, madara is technically a corpse walking due to the dark world resurrection so he would be able to see the soul reaper via bleach logic

@@hipnyah Actually no that's not the case at all. Both Madara is immortal and Aizen is immortal. How? Well he goes from edo immortal to normal. Then gets so6p lvl regen which tanked might guy and juubi final form regen. Gedo maze also gives sooooooo much life force that incomplete juubi Obito tanked something crazy. First Obito only had 7 tails+a little piece of 8 tails. 9 tails? Well from ginkaku and kinkaku. The rest was Bee with 99.99% of 8 tails and father-son kcm both had like idk 95% (just random numbers... haha). Point is he tanked what killed every jinchuriki combined! He got all the tailed beasts taken out of him. Then he did the rinnerebirth which is an instant kill. Gedo maze's insane life force couldn't save him, he had so6p chakra (hence the tso's he had+giving his ms to Kakashi), Naruto's yin yang. How did Nagato survive for a bit? Well he had Uzumaki charka+life force+senju lineage+he died.... There is no surviving that, unless you try to actually argue that Nagato is above Yin-Yang manipulation, his chakra is stronger than that of an amped Uchiha with Six Paths Power OR his life force is above that of the Gedō Mazō, or what REMAINS which even let Hagoromo survive getting 9 bodies extracted (and apparently he was unconcious for a month?). Kurama's own statement was something like 'he'll be so weak it's like he's dead. And he won't budge for several months just like the old man (Hagoromo)'. How did he survive? He had BZ and Madara also has BZ.... He also has the FULL Juubi minus half of Kurama from Minato. Now Bee survives by using the 1 tentacles chakra (of Gyuuki) to survive (he does it thrice against Otsusuki and Sasuke too) so that's negligible. Madara also has yin yang release and so6p sage mode which is already> Night Guy. That's before tanking another rasenshuriken+kekkei genkai. Idk how to say this but before MKCM, before so6p sage mode, b4 kumite that negged Pain, b4 mastering rasenshuriken the first time he used it he fought Kakuzu. Now Hidan and Kakuzu had a bootlegged immortality but he was pretty tough. Naruto neg diffs a guy whose lived in Hashirama's time by celullar deconstructing him. Now it's pretty much molecular deconstruction and it's only wind+rasengan.... Kekkei tota only 3 elements is already atomic hence the name atomic dismantling. Then there's the divine tree. Madara claims he can't be killed and Sasuke actually cuts him in half. He casually beats Obito and does his own thing xd. He then gains a rinnesharingan and he doesn't use it just the genjutsu aspect of it. But from what we got of Kaguya the ninjutsu aspect is plenty (I think). Anyway, if he can turn off the edo can't he also turn it on?

@@hipnyah plus there are plenty of feats that could put Madara around Aizen. And kyoka suigetsu isn't better than even genin lvl genjutsu. So how will it affect Madara? Really it's just that bleach verse doesn't have the hax to dispel it. But Naruto dedicates 1/3rd of the system to genjutsu so yh.

I don't know much about these characters, but I can tell from your comment that they've done the exact same thing here that they've done to other characters I do know a lot about. DB likes to take power interactions that are at best uncertain and at worst unknowable and just say, "Well, we've decided it works this way, even if that doesn't make any sense."

@@migarsormrapophis2755 The one I like to point out, because I dislike it the most, is that one feat they say Cloud has. Such as him being supposedly "30 times faster than the speed of light", or some other bs like that. All because of Bahamut Zero flying to the planet, for the stationary boss fight, that one time in that one cutscene.

@@byronlyons3548 That does indeed sound like the exact kind of bullshit I'm thinking of. One of the worst cases ever was with Ben 10. In addition to massively under-scaling many of Ben's feats and using the weakest version of Ben while using the strongest version of his opponent, Ben 10 is a character who is explicitly capable of sensing when others time travel and alter his timeline, (something called the Sotobro effect) _and they even mentioned that in their analysis,_ and they show him getting defeated because someone time travels to kill him before a fight begins. DB loves to ignore extremely important facts about a character and focus on one tiny little detail from their lore that's generally inconsistent with the rest of their character and use that to justify whatever they want.

I don't get controlling at the soul level vs controlling at the physical level, could you elaborate that?

@@byronlyons3548 there are multiple statements that make FF7 characters are light speed, to ftl to mftl tho?

Double god is a pretty good description of Yhwach honestly but on the bankai thing, it’s likely that Aizen doesn’t have it or that it would be a downgrade from his current power. He faked what his shikai did to everyone so he easily could have created a fake bankai, due to bankai being less about power and more about your connection to your zanpactou. Aizen never actually strived to become more powerful in his life except to fuse with the Hogyoku which ended up fusing him with Kyouka suigetsu, making them one in the same, so even if he had bankai that would be like drawing power from your sword while he currently is his sword. He either doesn’t have it or is stronger without it so that isn’t that good a point. The first one is valid though, Yhwach can see and alter every future there is, yet he wasn’t able to see a single one where Aizen used Kyouka suigetsu on him since Kyouka suigetsu worked perfectly in an infinite amount of futures. An omniscient being wasn’t able to detect a flaw in Kyouka suigetsu but apparently “oh no, fancy eyes that negate the altered perception of other fancy eyes” can just break out? I love Madara but that single feat from Aizen shows that Madara would not be able to counter KS

@@ayame8095 Sharingan don't even negate Genjutsu. They let the user see Chakra, which allows them to see disturbances in Chakra signifying a Genjutsu. It helps detect a Genjutsu, which aids in breaking it, but doesn't directly break Genjutsu barring any specific abilities of a Mangekyo that could allow it to directly break a Genjutsu.

@@ayame8095 on aizen's bankai, it's more likely that it's just the kind that is situationally worse (a good example being shinji's which could make him get attacked by allies or shinsui and shuhei almost killing themselves) but without anything to go on that's just speculation. Aizen said that he had reached the peak of shinigami power which is why he wanted the hogyoku, what you were saying was more of kenpachi's mentality of "if I tired it wouldn't be a challenge" while aizen wanted all the power he could get since he wanted to kill God, and ppl like kenpachi fuse with their zanpakuto as a part of their bankai so it's unlikely that he couldn't use it due to being fused already.

@@espurrseyes42 well with what I said I was referring to the fact that Rinnegan are immune to ocular genjutsu but yeah, the Sharingan would be even more useless against KS since Kyouka suigetsu fundamentally works so much different than genjutsu and even if you know you’re in it you can’t counter it unless your Yhwach or are touching KS

@@shadowkishi6127 like I said b4 Aizen's KS is nothing more than a simple genjutsu at genin lvl in Naruto. Plus edo's which are truly immortal got no diffed by a sealing tag. Madara only needs 1 tomoe sharingan+1 sealing tag.

I am hoping this is just a troll. Though if it is I do applaud you for making fun of dragon ball.

Evaporated by what? Is he water and is going to condense back to water from gas form?

don't remember souls regenerating either, in Naruto. also, was the harm done because of chakra nullification, or because it can harm souls? because the pop up is saying one, but they are saying another. either way, not enough

@@christophermonteith2774 I’m not saying madara would win, but that’s the logic they were using to explain why the truth seeking orbs could kill aizen

@@megabladechronicles962 true, that is what they ware saying. i was more curious on which falsehood would be what they are stating, that madara wins from nullification with it, or that he wins with the destruction with it. both wouldn't matter too much, but cant help but wonder, also wasn't against you, in case the wording makes it seem like it

@@christophermonteith2774 all good, I misread your comment

Yet Hiruzen's head and torso is fine after the soil was released, despite that being blown off by those Truth Seeker Orbs. So, are we really sure about the spiritual logic behind that?

Because they love salt on their popcorn, lots and lots of salt

Im going to go into extreme detail about how much DB got wrong in about Bleach, and some of the misconceptions Naruto fans have about the matchup and energy systems So, something that was explained pretty much instantly is that regular humans cannot see, touch, hear, taste or smell a plus soul, Shinigami, Sinner or Hollow but they can all interact with humans because they interact with the soul itself, not the body. When a hollow picks a living person up, what is actually happening is they’re picking the soul up and the soul chain connecting the soul and body together drags the body with it. When Ichigo lost his powers after using the Final Getsuga Tensho he could no longer interact with spirits. He could literally walk through Rukia without realizing it at that point. And in the first episode you can see Rukia walk through Ichigo’s bedroom wall. Their bodies are composed of Reishi, condensed spiritual matter multiple times denser than the matter our world is made up of. When Ichigo loses his powers and becomes a plus soul to get them back with Urahara he finds it more difficult to breathe because he has no more Reiatsu than any newly dead person (also Reiatsu is spiritual energy generated by the soul itself and no two people have the same Reiatsu). Without Reiatsu to alleviate the pressure it slowly crushes you until your soul adapts and starts actively producing Reiatsu to counter that pressure. Now onto chakra. It is made up of two vital components. Yin Chakra, the ‘spiritual’ energy and Yang Chakra, the energy of vitality. I put spiritual in quotation marks there because it is only spiritual in one sense of the word. The enlightened sense of the word. Sakura is showing her only use here to basically explain what the energy actually is, and since she is both a licensed doctor and one of the most book smart characters in the series, I think it’s safe to say her word can be trusted (especially since it is verbatim what the books written by the author and in universe doctors say). Chakra exists in two forms. One is produced by the cells themselves and the second, ‘spiritual’ energy which is intensified through training, experience and knowledge. Hence, spiritual in the enlightened sense of the word. Sakura, Sasuke, Hinata and pretty much every character in the series have more Yin Chakra than Naruto does while he has more Yang chakra than pretty much everyone in the entire series. Seperate, Yin and Yang chakra are fairly weak. But when combined they become much stronger, more fluid, adaptable etc etc. Reiatsu is strong on its own, when used in the world of the living it’s destructive power is akin to a bomb while restrained, tearing entire buildings down with zero effort. And this is actually pretty scary considering Japan’s buildings are incredibly sturdy to withstand earthquakes, tidal waves and other such natural disasters. In America a simple clash between a Lieutenant and a Gillian would leave the city/town looking like a hurricane had swept in. Now we go on to the Truth Seeking Orbs (we’ll get to the Rinnegan, Sharingan and Aizen himself in a bit). The Truth Seeking Orbs purpose is to effectively unravel Chakra as it hits, returning them to Yin and Yang Chakra and dissipating them. They do not affect souls. When the TSO hit Edo Tensei Minato it unraveled his body from the point of contact but when it came time for the Jutsu to end his soul was completely fine. The only reason they took damage was because they were basically Chakra Homunculus, their bodies completely composed of energy. This means the TSO are actually not going to affect Aizen at all since he’s composed of Reiatsu, not any form of Chakra. And no, the TSO aren’t going to affect Reiatsu because despite being able to unravel Chakra, they are incapable of affecting Senjutsu Chakra at all. They are quite fallible for all their strengths. They are only really useful against regular Chakra since it’s only strong when combined but Senjutsu is strong without needing to mix with regular Chakra. Their entire purpose is to unmix Chakra, leaving it useless. 1/2 or 3 Ah shit I accidentally deleted the other half or so, give me a minute. RU-vid doesn’t like really long comments apparently

A lot of people like to claim that the Rinnegan would allow Madara to see Aizen because he can see limbo clones. Except that’s not the case because they’re made out of Chakra, not Reiatsu. The Rinnegan has the ability to see all Chakra, which is why it can see the Limbo clones, but it can’t see the souls themselves. It CAN interact with them as we’ve seen multiple times. It is capable of removing a soul from its body and even bringing the dead back to life so long as they do it soon enough, but the sheer amount of energy it takes just to do that would exhaust or even kill Madara. It killed Pein to do so using the Outer Path to bring Konoha back to life and he was an Uzumaki, people known for their exceptionally strong Yang chakra which allows them to safely contain Kurama within them. The Human path is only able to remove a soul from its body which is useless on Aizen since he is literally a soul. Even sealing him in the King of Hell doesn’t mean anything to Aizen who can dimensional travel via Garganta or Senkaimon. It does not absorb souls either, it’s only able to move them and seal them in the King of Hell. But even if it could, Hollows can do the same and Shinigami are very much resistant to such a technique which makes it useless on Aizen who is so far above such a technique it’s honestly pretty ridiculous. Now the Sharingan. People seem to believe that the Sharingan would make Madara either immune to Aizen’s illusions or allow him to break out, however the fundamental differences between Reishi and Chakra alone debunk that. The reason why is that Chakra is a physical energy present in the human (or animal or Bijuu) body. It has a direct link to all of the persons body, from the nerves to their brain.Reishi exists alongside the physical realm but split apart, the soul doesn’t actually do anything in their bodies until they die unless they are born a Quincy/Fullbringer in which case they have the ability to manipulate ambient Reishi and condense it even further into Reiryoku. Reiryoku is extremely condensed Reishi, even more so than Reiatsu and if it hits a soul, the Reiryoku will poison them, slowly destroying the Reishi around it. This is the reason Quincies we’re considered such a threat, because their Heilig Pfeil or Holy Arrows were made up of Reiryoku and the second it hit a soul, that soul would be completely destroyed, never to reform or enter the reincarnation cycle. That little tangent will come in handy later I think. Anyway, back on topic. Aizen’s main ability, Kyoka Suigetsu, allows him to effectively rewrite a persons senses so long as they see his Shikai release. When Aizen was setting up his plan to betray the Soul King he made sure to show as many Soul Reapers as physically possible his Shikai release as a demonstration. From the Captains and Lieutenants to the students of the Academy to the squad members he left nobody out. He made them all think his Shikai produced abundant volumes of water and let him manipulate it, like the Second Hokage or Kaien Shiba. He did this by making all their senses, from sight to smell, believe water had been produced by his blade. They could touch the illusion and feel the water, even taste it but it wouldn’t nourish them. The only way to escape it is to either be touching the blade as the Shikai releases or not see it. Not even out the corner of your eye. Which is why Tosen, being blind, was a major thorn in Aizen’s side, he needed to use all his cunning and charisma to make Tosen loyal to him since he couldn’t use his Shikai on Tosen. His Shikai is so thorough that even people not under its power can’t break you out once you’re under its effects. When “Aizen” fought the Captains and Vizards Ichigo could only watch in horror as they fought. Because he could see who they were actually fighting, the hypnotised Hinamori while Aizen chilled out where she was supposed to be. Aizen blocked any sound or movement Ichigo could have made until he decided it was time to reveal his deception once more and let them hear what Ichigo was saying while dissolving the current illusion to have some fun of his own. Even though Unohana, one of the most skilled medics and fighters the Soul Society has ever seen with the single best Reiatsu control in their world, could tell she was under an illusion after a century she simply could not break it, his Shikai was simply too powerful. It didn’t even need him to reapply it, Kyoka Suigetsu would stay active permanently. Even Juha Bach, the Almighty who can see every future timeline and change them as he pleases could not see through Aizen’s hypnosis. And he’d known about Aizen’s Shikai for centuries yet never once did he see that he’d been ensnared just because he saw it in a vision of the future. He didn’t know until Aizen let him, nor could he break the illusion. Aizen still had him under it even after he became the Soul King, the being that stabilised reality itself and had supreme control over it all. Kyoka Suigetsu in its Shikai, it’s weakest state, is comparable to the Mugen Tsukuyomi except it simply can never be broken. So the Sharingan is pretty useless there, even Sasuke and Madara could be affected by the Mugen Tsukuyomi and Kyoka is at the very least comparable to it. Now onto Aizen himself rather than his Shikai. Aizen is basically living Reiryoku right now. It’s not explicitly said but his mere presence can and will destroy any soul significantly weaker than him without any effort. Aizen walked past a regular human in Karakoram town and erased him. He didn’t even DO anything, the poor guy just went. When a Lieutenant class Soul Reaper went to move Aizen after he was imprisoned he lost his hand just coming within a few meters radius. Because of his new strength he was so strong that nobody could harm him without being on his level and even then, the Hogyoku (which is straight up a reality warper capable of bringing even erased souls back to “life” as it were, which happened with Aizen after Ichigo erased him with the Mugetsu. You can actually see his body slowly be consumed after being split in two by it) would just reject it, heal Aizen and make him either more resistant to whatever it was that harmed him or straight up immune, while also giving him a Zenkai like power boost. Gin Ichimaru’s Zanpakuto, Shinso, has the ability to turn into dust and reform over a distance of a few miles. This dust is made of something similar to Reiryoku, it’s property is that whenever that dust is left behind inside a target it devours them from the inside, leaving a massive hole several times larger than the shard itself was. When Gin used it on Aizen, he blew his entire torso to pieces and snatched the Hogyoku from Aizen’s new gaping chest wound. Aizen let’s Gin run for a few minutes and then shows up completely fine, nearly kills him and takes the Hogyoku back. It turns out that Aizen does not need the Hogyoku anywhere near him anymore for it’s powers to help Aizen, it now works for him regardless of distance. He only wants it in his chest because he likes it, there is no need for it though. Now onto their speed feats. Remember when I said that Reishi is denser than normal matter? Yeah, that also means air resistance is significantly higher. So all the speed and strength feats DB gave Aizen are significantly lower than they actually are since they’re doing it under much higher pressure. Which is also a reason Shinigami are given seals to restrict their power while in the world of the living, since they can so easily destroy everything when their job is to keep the living from dying early. It would be counterintuitive to go full power if all it will do is destroy human lives. And yes, Ichigo does have his own limiter. The Substitute Badge is both his way out of his body and his limiter, controlled by Squad 12 and adjusted as needed. It’s the only reason he hasn’t completely destroyed Karakura Town by accident. Also, the battle in the world of the living actually occurred in a pocket dimension with a fake Karakura Town made entirely of Reishi, which is why they didn’t need limiters and didn’t destroy everything instantly (though the Town was completely decimated after the battle). I would go into the correct calculations but I really can’t be bothered, I’ll leave that to Seth the Programmer. Even if he gets it wrong he’s still closer than Death Battle ever will be. Found the other half

Ya know, when I was writing this I didn’t think it would be so long lol, but long story short, DB’s research team should be fired for how much they get wrong. Either on purpose or because of incompetence I have no clue, but my point stands

​@@reaperofthings I appreciate you the effort you put into this, along with keeping your response civil. That being said, it would've been nice if you split this up into more comments and/or multiple paragraphs, since it's a bit hard to respond to all of it. I'll respond to both comments separately, and in several paragraphs, divided into addressing individual points. I wouldn't call myself an expert on Naruto, and definitely not one for Bleach, but I'll do the best I can. Obviously I'll focus mostly on Naruto for that reason. I agree with what you said about both reiatsu and how Soul Reapers and humans interact for the most part. However, Soul Reapers do often interact with solid surfaces in the human world, implying their intangibility is by choice. Death Battle definitely got that wrong, but this doesn't matter for Madara regardless. He scales beyond Itachi's Susanoo, which could grasp his Totsuka Blade. Said weapon is stated to not have a physical form, and is officially listed as an astral offense. Given Susanoo are corporeal creations, it stands to reason that Madara could touch Aizen even with his intagibility. While chakra's nature is kept mostly vague, what we do know about it points to spiritual energy not being enlightenment focused, instead being tied to the soul. The following thread goes into detail about this: vsbattles.com/threads/chakra-and-the-soul-for-naruto-at-least.109635/. Long story short, chakra and souls are highly connected, which wouldn't make sense if spiritual energy wasn't soul based. This is backed up by several different types of ninjutsu which interact and comprise, as well as the returns of dead characters being reliant on chakra. Sakura's statement doesn't contradict, as it simply provides the manner in which one's spiritual energy can be increased. Even if it was contradictory, these other statements and feats hold more weight. With the above information in mind, the Truth-Seeking Orbs have plenty of evidence pointing to them being effective against Aizen. To address the counterpoints you provided, Minato's soul was still damaged as he went to the afterlife. Even if this weren't true, his body was a shell constructed by ninjutsu, which is also made up of spiritual energy. The Orbs erase whatever they hit from existence as well, rather than just unraveling it. Madara's even have the same makeup as Kaguya's, which was going to erase an entire time-space. The Truth-Seeking Orbs also are not incapable of affecting senjutsu, as shown when Six Paths Obito blocked senjutsu enhanced attacks with TSO shields. Even if they couldn't, the similarities between reiatsu and chakra mean this wouldn't matter. Given the similarities of reiatsu and chakra, it should be clear that their differences wouldn't matter in regards to Madara seeing Aizen. Madara's Rinnegan being capable of this is further supported by the fact his Limbo Clones were on another plane of existence as well, something Aizen can't claim. The Rinnegan can also see indivdual souls, showcased by Pain, Nagato, and Naruto (who saw and touched his own soul despite not having a Rinnegan thanks to being in KCM, something Madara could replicate with the Ten-Tails' abilities).

@@reaperofthings With the immense gap in chakra reserves and power between Pain and Madara, the energy cost for removing one soul would be negligible. I do agree however that the Human Path would be useless on Aizen for the reason you mentioned. The King of Hell does not seal its target however, instead it instantly kills them. It's mechanics are too vague to say it would work on Aizen regardless though. The illusions are a bit hard to compare for both sides, so I could see why you think Aizen's are better. Aizen's illusions are certainly far better than Death Battle portrayed, that's for sure. However, the same could be said for Madara Madara's visual prowess scales far above the likes of Tsukuyomi, which allows the user to alter reality, light, color, time and space. In addition, Sasuke, who at the time was massively below Madara in visual prowess and other regards, could survive and (debatably) break out of Tsukuyomi. Even the basic genjutsu of the Sharingan can produce some similar effects to Kyoka Sugietsu (albeit with far less potency and finess), and Madara can easily counter those. I'm personally of the belief Madara can at least compete with Aizen in this field, even with his feat of manipulating Yhwach. While the Almighty could let seem see every timeline, how that exactly equates to illusionary power is hard to quantify. It's certainly very impressive, but given how Madara scales off ludicrous genjutsu, I find them pretty comparable. While the Hogyoku can warp reality, to what extent isn't very clear. It has never shown any offensive capabilities reliant on reality warping, and it's hard to tell if it has much influence on Aizen's healing. I do agree that Aizen's regeneration would be useful against Madara, though not infallible for previously mentioned reasons. I won't comment on the other stuff you talked about with Aizen's regen since I agree with what you mentioned. I also agree with your points about reishi and how that affects Aizen's strength output. The calcs for both vary a lot, so I won't take a hard stance on that. I will say that I believe Madara can at least keep up with Aizen in strength.

how did they contradict themselves specifically?

@@sk47moxie59 Watch The Ink Tanks Ben 10 VS Green Lantern Debunk, The guy there is way better at explaining the situation of Death Battle as a whole.

at the death battle or nux?

@@sk47moxie59 this guy

@@goldvictoroff fax

What’s worse is that he thinks he’s funny

Examples?

So you support Death Battle 100%? Got it

@@mr.hazamayukiterumi2909 No? I don't support them 100%, they're fallible like everyone else-- I do think they put more effort than most, especially those who critique them, but that doesn't make them perfect or always right. Not supporting the reasonings behind others arguments doesn't automatically mean I support everything the opposing side does or says, I just take issue with one especially.

If they did their research more than 99% of us, they'd have known that Aizen is pretty much unkillable, surviving complete disintegration from Gin's Bankai and snatching of his Hogyoku by evolving into his 4th form, tanked Mugetsu and only losing because of some Kisuke sabotage, and was sentenced to be sealed away in Mugen because there was literally no way to kill him. *BLOOD WAR ARC SPOILERS DO NOT READ!* They'd also know about 1000 Year Blood War Arc information, like Kenpachi, who's much weaker than Aizen, cutting a meteor in half with his Shikai (so Madara's meteors ain't going to do much) and surviving being pulled into the vacuum of space in his fight with Gremmy while Aizen himself managed to put Endgame Yhwach, who could see all possible futures, under Kyouka Suigetsu without him noticing and survived getting absorbed by him to come out of the final battle alive and get sealed back in Mugen. And keep in mind that Kyouka Suigetsu even before all the Hogyoku stuff was OP, being able to put people in its illusions from seeing its release and that effecting staying on its victims no matter how long its been since they were first affected (Vizards were in it for 100+ years) and its only weakness being touching the tip of the sword, which is still nigh impossible given a successful touch could just be another illusion.

@@espurrseyes42 They literally mention some of that-- And do take that kind of thing into consideration-- What you have an issue with is wether that consideration changes their verdict or not, and if you decide it should and they decide it doesn't, then they're wrong and you're right. Hell, none of the feats you even mentioned here are Far Beyond or in some cases even At All beyond stuff Madara has done. I'm not even saying they're Definitely right in all regards-- But you're also not making any kind of solid case either. Hell, I swear half the people complaining are just Bigger Fans of Bleach, and thus know more about Bleach than they do Naruto, and are basing half their arguments on that. And goddamn it, In-Universe ability to kill a character does not automatically equate to the same kind of difficulty in killing them Outside-Universe-- Just because nobody in the Soul Society could do it, does not mean Nobody in Fiction or by using any means that don't exist in the Bleach Universe do it. That isn't how that works.

@@null7198 I'd say regenerating from literal nothing and somehow still being alive after Supergod Yhwach ate him puts him above Madara in durability and backs up what I said about him being unkillable. I'd say Kyoka being unbreakable save for a specific action made nigh impossible because of Kyoka's powers is above any Genjutsu feats Madara has. So again, Aizen takes this. And this is coming from someone that likes Naruto more than Bleach. So good job there assuming the critics are Bleach fanboys. Just admit you don't know shit about Aizen or the verse as a whole.

Apparently Aizen is the most powerful being in all of fiction and no other character could touch him-- that's what I'm seeming to get from this comment section lol.

It's called distinctive capacity. And also you're right. In your own way, because it's all about how to scale the characters.

That’s cool and all but… why think like that when you can make a cool fight scene between them like this and one minute melee lol

They did just use his old look for the anime-only watchers with the anime continuation so don't worrie.

To be technical, there's never been a time where anyone, even the god stand in, dispelled Aizen's hypnosis. Though you are right about hacks abilities being basically nullified by dilution when the target's energy vastly exceeds the skills energy. Still, despite infinite zombie energy, I doubt you can compare that to the guy who now holds all of time and space together with his lifeforce.

The Death Battle Actually Creates its own Music for the fights. If you wanna listen to them: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-QlKXxQTsUSE.html

@@sk47moxie59 I’m talking about nuxanor not death battle who I’m pretty sure is using songstress music from hollow knight.

@@crispinravlin4256 ohhhhh