I worked on one of these shows in New Zealand as a production assistant about 15 years ago. We were filming the first episode where 300 contestants turned up and would be whittled down to the final twenty or so. They had all sent in their audition tape which had been watched by the producers but this was the firs time any of them would perform on camera. Our job was to get them to sign the paperwork and then give them cards with their name and contestant number on it, they would then wear this card pinned to their cloths for the day. Some of the cards had a small coloured sticker attached. If anyone asked what the stickers meant we were told to say nothing. Actually the producers had already decided who was to be filmed. the talented performers got a sticker and the truly awful got one too. the mediocre got no sticker. The producers wanted to highlight the talented kids and the embarrassingly awful, no one else mattered. It was all very dperessing watching the contestants come in, all excited, not knowing that the results had already been decided.
@@waynesmith2287 true its all our fault, I think the show I worked on was a year or two after the very first NZ idol thing. We are deeply sorry. Luckily we also produced some great music. too much to list here but at the moment Aldous Harding, the Beths, and Alien Weaponry are currently touring. if you check them out and dont like at least one of those names I will eat my hat.
When I did The Voice years ago, I learnt a very valuable lesson. I realized I had been so focused on making it, that I had lost my way in the important part, which is connection with my music. I left the show determined to focus only on the creation of art and overcoming the noise in my head that said I had to be famous to matter! X
The whole "X factor & Idol" genre of shows died here in New Zealand almost over night when two judges (Natalia Kills & Willy Moon) attacked and humiliated a contestant. The country was so disgusted and the backlash so huge that the whole talent show genre disappeared altogether.
I love Tom Petty's savage takedown of Idol and Voice and all them. "In my day if you told people they pick the biggest rock stars on a game shoe you woulda been laughed out of the room"
Wow, this is really enlightening. Thanks for the peak behind the curtain and telling us about your experience with Idol. Oh, and that jacket is GLORIOUS!
One of things I love about music is hearing a song and being able to tell who is singing it because they have such a distinctive voice (or which band is playing it because they have a certain style or sound). With these talent shows the judges weed out anyone who sounds different and you end up with a group of contestants who sound similar to each other. The shows themselves seem very unkind. I watched the first few back in the early 2000s but disliked the shaming. Also, there are a lot of parents who tell their children they have amazing voices and are genuinely shocked when the judges say otherwise. Either they are lying to their children or unable to distinguish between good and bad singing. It is great to build up your children but outright lying doesn't help in these situations and leads to heartbreak.
"Unkind" - you're dead-on there, and it's actually more important than simply being unpleasant to watch young people inexplicably being treated like shit; no one is going to 'Idol'ize someone they watched getting trashed and talked down to, week after week, as if they were a bunch of talentless hacks. I mean, can you imagine the world falling in love with Beyonce after watching a bunch of never-hasbeens berate them for weeks on end? It's just not gonna happen. On top of that, if anyone displays even the slightest bit of backbone to the judges, they invariably get this stern talking-down to, as if they were disobedient children. My favorite part, by far, is that the most successful RU-vid clips of any of these circus sideshows are, invariably, the people with real personality or the complete walking disasters.
I agree about parents feeding their kids' egos. If the kids are really talented, get them proper training first, then let them get into local talent shows, like their schools. Don't throw them on television where millions of people are watching and judging only to be let down because there are a thousand other contestants that might be a lot better. It's sad for the kids.
Star Search winner Beth Hart was offered to be a judge on a TV singing contest and she turned it down when she saw American Idol belittling the contestants.
You are a man of many talents. Been a fan since the beginning and looking forward to seeing you again in Portland next month. These "talent" shows are all about shock value. Unfortunately, it makes scenes like the "pants on the ground" guy one of the most memorable moments.
Not related to this topic at all but I just wanted to say that the music you and The Darkness contributed to Katie’s/Grace’s Amazing Machines never fails to make me smile. Love that you did that (and I hope you got paid again when the show changed its name!).
That Rage Against The Machine xmas no.1 was one of the greatest music fan moments of my life. I had grown up on RATM amongst other bands, and honestly, it was just an amazing chrimbo started by that. I had not listened to the charts for years prior, and was glued that Sunday evening. I travelled from Yorkshire to Manc on xmas eve to visit family and was blasting RATM all the way.
I don't know about that. Star Search winner Beth Hart found a way to perform with people she listened to on the radio and on records without the "fame" of winning on Star Search. Her real big break is when one of her video recorded concerts went viral among the music industry. Even the story behind the concert could be a made for TV movie. Adam could have hooked up with the right people without the show.
I almost cried when I heard you sing that first song. That gave me goosebumps because I'm so use to your rock style in the Darkness. I wish you would explore singing to music way out of your comfort zone.
Hey Justin! Thanks for posting your experience with these ‘talent’ shows. I was on The Voice Of Germany in 2014. After signing 100 pages contract and weeks of pre-filming auditions, I (apparently) ‘beat’ 30,000 others to secure my slot at a ‘bootcamp’. There I ‘learned’ how to sing from ‘coaches’ who were in truth no different in age and cabaret / working mens clubs experience from myself. Did I mention I was 43 at the time? At least 20 years older than most contestants. After filming tons of behind the scenes footage and interviews with my friend and daughter, I was offered / advised - the chance of a lifetime! I would appear behind a giant shower curtain to surprise not only the judges, but the crowd too. As a result my 15 minutes of fame ended up being around 20 seconds 😅 Yes I made my TV debut… and no one could see me 🤣 Am I bitter? No, I can look back and laugh. Simply by chatting to some of the crew I knew going I barely had a chance to make it the final because of my age. I was too old. But more disappointing than ‘losing’ was the lack of support from the team afterwards. I didn’t expect much, but they offered no advice or assistance whatsoever at the end. Out of sight out of mind - on to the next 🤷♂️ My advice for anyone thinking about auditioning? Go your own way! Despite my experience I’m still out there doing my thing… Anyway here’s the shower curtain thing - ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-Wts_bgrXC9I.html www.the-voice-of-germany.de/video/41-michael-antony-austin-i-wanna-dance-with-somebody-clip
I've seen a few youtube clips from the voice Germany. And ofc I know the format. In my country it was only on for a year, but I've seen it from other countries. But I have never ever seen a curtain hiding the singer. I thought the meaning of it all was that the coaches wasn't supposed to see the singer until they turned, not until they run behind a curtain. Anyways you got a great voice and I hope you're still doing music- on your own terms.
People that wonder “why these terrible singers think they can sing so well?!" don’t realize these “terrible singers” passed numerous auditions before they ever got in front of the cameras and TV judges. They were led on and set up for failure and ridicule.
I always wondered about that. I could play guitar and hear myself and think "yeah, I'm not very good at this", why can't some of these awful singers hear themselves recorded and realize they're terrible? Has everyone they've ever known tell them they're great even when they're bad?
But that's part of the "show". It what makes "good TV"…. I laugh just as much at the judges as I do the contestants for then not having a ear for talent...
To be fair, these people self select by showing up. Anyone who's seen these shows knows their a ridicule angle at play so I can't feel too sorry for the terrible singers.
The precise reason I could never watch those shows as an amateur musician it made me feel horrible that they made people with less talent or skill the butt of the joke. It is cruel. thanks for speaking up about it. It is damaging to music in general since it discourages people from trying to attain more knowledge and skills. Music is not a competition and shouldn’t be treated as one.
Never knew you were so involved with American Idol. I've watched a few of them...I too always felt terrible for the ones in audition that had their dreams dashed. This was an eye opener. Nice jacket btw.
I think the whole Pop Idol thing is a perfect combination of British and American idealism and that's why it's successful. We love an underdog over here, someone who can pull themselves above their station... and in the states they love a dreamer, and they love the idea of a meritocracy. A singing competition where the lowly everyman can achieve the success that these Pop stars have by out singing or out performing everyone else is perfect. Pop and Rock stars were always these idols, and considered far away and detached from the common man. I think now though its popularity is waning a bit because pop stars are more accessible and considered more like "real people" in this age of social media, that and you can make a hit record in your bedroom.
And also, because everybody knows that the dream is a delusion. Finally people are starting to realise that the idealism and the hard-working stuff is largely manufactured bull crap. In the words of George Carlin, it’s called American dream because you have to be asleep to believe it. That’s not something worth cherishing. It’s something worth slashing your wrists about.
It is all bread and circuses. Though I was always struck by the fact that every time a rock singer turned up the first thing they were asked was whether they could do something else, a question not asked of r'n'b singers or torch singers or pop singers...
Those shows don’t just affect the contestants, they affect everyone who has fear of singing publicly, who sees the public criticism and thinks that they can’t try because they’ll be humiliated. I wish they’d never been invented
@@danieljillings8183 Definitely, it's because so many people are telling him off about it. What's your first response when someone tells you what to do?
Thank you for sharing!! I hate those talent shows and knew there is not substitute for good old fashioned hard work to get there. That is such a scam though for them to exploit people in that way.
"Star Search" with Ed McMahon was the earliest big production TV talent show I can recall . Ran 1983 -1995. A laundry list of contestants went on to become household names.
i remember trying out for Idol around 8 or 9 years ago and the process just wasnt worrth it. Took 7 hours for me to audition for the first round of judges and be told no even though there were groups of people singing to crowds outside the venue and i did and was told id definetly make it through for having such a strong voice. Felt like it was just completely pointless when i can just go out and apply to different clubs and events to sing at and get more out of it at the end of the day.
I have an American Idol story from 1997, five years before the show first aired in America. I'd just finished recording an album in Hollywood, and had just received the first run of CDs when Nick Menza of Megadeth invited me to the "Concrete Convention" in Burbank. It's basically a music industry gathering, kind of like NAMM, but with minimal focus on gear. Jackson Guitars was there. Rush was there, sans Peart, to receive a 30-year lifetime achievement. There was this one room where they promised to listen to demos and give pro industry critique! I pushed into the room where there was a table with a boombox and 3 people sitting behind the table. Simon Cowell was one of those people and I didn't know who he was. They had a box on the table where people would throw their CDs. Because I didn't get in very fast, my CD was close to the top. They pick the first CD and play ten seconds of it, before Simon stands up and says, "Who is responsible for this?" The guy who owned the CD stands up, and Cowell proceeds to rip him a new one. It was so bad that I was thinking "Don't pick mine!" the entire time. But eventually, he DID pick my CD and played about 20 seconds of it. He says, "It is painfully obvious that money was no object, because you have the best studio musicians available." He was correct, as I had hired Steve Caton from Tori Amos and the late Bobby Birch from Elton John. Then he asked me, "What's the name of the band?" I tell him that it was just me and the singer. And then, he said THE MOST ironic and weird thing, given the fact that American Idol is all about singers with no band. He said, "IF YOU HAVE NO BAND, THEN WHAT'S THE POINT?" I replied, saying something about how we wanted a top-notch product to attract top talent. He accepted that and let me off the hook. As luck would have it, I bumped into him in the parking lot, and he apologized for being so rough. Based on this experience, I am convinced that I participated in an early test to see if the American Idol idea was viable.
I don't like Simon Cowell. He gets pleasure from publicly humiliating people for trying to do something he can't do himself, and making money out of it.
You are absolutely right. About 20 years ago my brother wanted to participate in the Dutch Idols. He first had to audition in front of another jury. These judges believed that my brother could sing beautifully, but he was not what they were looking for on the program. So they deliberately let participants through to the next audition, which will be on TV, who can't sing very well. But thanks to that first audition, they think they can sing really well. So sad that these people are laughed at.
That was exactly my niece’s experience 13 or 14 years ago here in UK. She’s a really good rock singer and had chosen to sing a Guns’n’Roses song. The jury told her she had a very good voice but they didn’t think Guns’n’Roses was Pop Idol. Yet while waiting for her pre-audition she’d heard very bad singers nevertheless still being put through to the main audition. She wasn’t happy, and never even wanted to ever audition again in following years
@@MightyJonE I hope your niece continued singing? My brother sang a Robbie Williams song during that audition, even though it wasn’t his cup of tea. He still sings, but he is more a theater kinda guy.
I'm going on on tour across North America with The Darkness in March & April - we are playing 33 shows! You can get tickets here if you want to: www.thedarknesslive.com/tour-dates/
A thoughtful video, thank you. I feel that one of the greatest battles in our world right now is real vs. fake. Authentic vs. phony. Technology has given a huge push to the tide of phoniness that seems to pervade everything these days. What makes these kinds of shows so dangerous is how they are fake to their very core. The selection process, the judges' reactions and emotions, the illusion of there being any meaning to any of the evaluation or competition - it's nothing but phony from start to finish. To watch such shows is to spend time in a complete state of phoniness - eyes, ears, mind, spirit. It's so corrosive to the survival of art, or any cultural priorities that provide an ecosystem for art. It's why I fell in love with The Darkness from the first time hearing them, but can't spend a minute listening to the superficially similar bands who are either satires of the genre or direly humorless soundalike products of the grunge era. The real thing is exciting to those who can still tell the difference.
I had considered that the contestants had songs written for them. Not a fan of the format anyway, but just singing for fun is really underrated in my view. I went though my whole childhood being told I couldn't sing. Much later I joined a classical choir as an alto and really enjoyed it. A few years later I did a performing arts course with singing and passed it. I got compliments from one of the Inspiral Carpets, which seemed genuine (though he did say "you made it your own 😂). More recently I sang with a more informal university choir and it was really fun. More people should sing for fun 😊
I love that you used to do jingles! I remember watching ‘Katie’s Amazing Machines’ with one of my boys and jumping around with excitement after seeing The Darkness in the credits. Just epic! 🤘
When Adam's FYE album was on its way, a handful of song titles were leaked, one of which was Suburban Decay. It's been 13 years and I still feel cheated. I love your This Urban Decay demo of the song! :D
I tend to believe that TV viewers taking pleasure in someone else's disappointment and failure is a form of therapy; it permits people to anonymously and safely 'rehearse' the process of failure, and it strengthens their coping abilities when it actually does happen to them in their lives. But I'm no doctor :o) Love your channel!
A former co worker of mine was on American Idol twice. He didn't make it too far but he told all about his experiences. I am a semi pro local musician in my area and I'm glad I have an indie rock voice so I would never consider going on a show like that because of what he told me.
My 2nd cousin tried out for The Voice a couple times but didn’t get through, even though they always complimented her … I told her she was better off on the DIY circuit… She met a boy and became a gigging married couple and is much happier
Moon Walker reaction video would be great. I found out about them through your videos actually haha. Someone recommended them, now I love them. I guess they're another band you've put me onto
Wow. Life. Honestly I've never paid a lot of attention to such music "venues" sort to speak cause I don't watch TV at all, but of what little I heard of them I always got the sense that bad performers were an integral part of the show. Some talent comes up here and there and the non-TV watching musicians and music enthusiasts hear about them, but it's like 5 people or something out of hundreds that have participated in these type shows. Much love to you Mr. Hawkins!
That RATM campaign was great. They played Download Festival the following summer and it was biblical. Never forget that air raid siren before they began playing.
Thanks again for sharing your views: they're insightful indeed! Reality-TV is not the same as music. If you don't have anything to do with them anymore, well... so much the better! Great tone on that closing theme - Cheers!
I've heard that they've sometimes used 'pitch incorrection' just to take the piss. The production team might already have decided who 'should' be able to sing or not.
I have a friend who can sing and play guitar well. He tried out for this show. They liked his music but when asked about if he would talk about the early death of his mother. He said no and they didn’t ask him back. So they want a sob story as well. It’s not really about music.
Exploitation is one of the worst human traits. Some people exploit the talented and now they can even exploit the poor sods with no talent. Your videos are hilarious. A true bright spot in worrying times.
Simon Cowell...apparently went to the studio when West Life were recording, played the triangle, got credited as a 'musician' and made £100K. I can't muster any hate for that...firkin boss move!! :-))
Love the channel dude! Just moved to Nashville. Packed up everything and went. Just gonna grind and put out music until goals are reached. I’m About to release my first album. Fan of your music and channel. We have strikingly similar musical taste. Cheers!!
It’s taken 4 days, but Justin is finally down to the apple core 😃 I remember that first series of Popstars. Out of it, chart toppers Heresay were born - one of the singers, Kym Marsh, years later became a regular Coronation St actress. On Popstars Nigel Lithgow famously castigated her for putting on weight, telling her to lose it. Think that very first series also brought us the ambitious but cringingly cocky singer Darius
@@zeeinajar I’d forgot she’d withheld that info at first because she thought it’d be an issue. But I seem to remember Lithgow telling her it’s fine. Since then, there’s certainly been many single mothers auditioning who don’t hide the fact, and even admit they want success on the show, to give their child a better life
Came here because of a recommendation by @501chorusecho (Tom Bukovac aka Uncle Larry aka Little Tommy aka the Session Man). Needed a few of your videos to digest and get used to. But now I‘m hooked. Thanks for the content.
Maaaan, this is what RU-vid ‘commentary’ (if you can call it that) videos should be like. The high energy, super edited and over the top RU-vid videos are rubbish. You’d never see MrBeast pull up his trouser leg and scratch his bare knee or take a bite of an apple mid sentence. It’s like you’re just having a sit down conversation with him and I love that.
fun stuff I do pop by some time well music is the hardest thing to get in too I am with you on this one nice to see you doing this stuff all the best Nash
Justin, you are a superstar. Seeing you on youtube and having a youtube channel is, at least to me, like having Bill Clinton having a go at being a youtube star. I can sing but I know I can not sing as well as you. I had piano and guitar lessons but I you have put in the work to be famous. I hope you are not giving up on a career as an entertainer.
After my vocal coach worked with me I started coaching others, I do this for free. I don’t believe in charging for peoples passions. I like to inspire and push them to do what they love. Let me tell you this, ANYONE can sing. You just have to work hard, be dedicated and take criticism and mold it to progress and get better in your craft.
let's just keep it at "most". i have met some people that are literally tone deaf, they could never sing even half decent even if their life was devoted to and depended on it. i do agree that many people can be taught to sing half decently though.
That's why I'm more interested on that "The Voice" format, where those who get to be on that stage have to prove some talent, training and commitment beforehand. It's less a variety show than a talent scouting. "Sing Off" was also a pretty good one, attracting a choirs and capella groups to show real talent.
Totally agree, Justin, but re:your comments about the "stopping" of Xmas number ones, which is the only time we really look at and take notice of the charts. See LadBaby. Four consecutive Xmas number ones, all for a worthwhile charity (and yes, they get fame, but how can they do it without the fame?). They have been totally ignored by the music business, no mention at The Brits, and certainly no accolade for their achievements after the fact. Also (musical geek switch in) nice to see Paul Morley without him actually saying anything (I'm a Trevor Horn geek!) and great connection with Adam Lambert. He is indeed a megastar-if he's good enough to stand in front of Brian and Roger, he's good enough for me-and no, he's not a replacement for Freddie, he's just keeping the songs going in his own style. We did sit on the stage at Queen Nottingham 2015, and could have reached out and touched him-we did meet Brian and Pete backstage! Thank you for your great videos. Keep them going
Kid Rock isn’t the best person to take advice from. He grew up extremely wealthy and had an unlimited amount of money backing him. He would have never been famous otherwise
