This is an underrated review and reviewer. Clearly answering questions we want, and providing accurate opinions without regurgitating iFi and Drop’s websites. I clearly don’t have either any of the mentioned products however I spent 2 nights trying to find the answers that this man researched on his own and answered to their entirety. Thank you sir
I bought the Zen Signature a few weeks ago. I had no idea it came with the £99 iFiPowerX, so despite the difference in sound being minimal (yet better), it was a worthy buy (£230 from Ebay), so arguably £130 for the actual unit. The build of the unit is better. The buttons don't rattle like they do on the standard CAN. It feels smoother and it looks great in the dark blue and black. It's giving a slightly better sound to both 650 and 660's. The LED holes in the case are smaller though and the LEDs can't be seen unless you view it head on. It's a keeper....and so is the regular CAN.
This is one of the best reviews I've heard about anything! Informative, balanced, thorough, objective - I'm going to hold-on to my existing Ifi combo, thanks Andrew
Those people who purchased ZEN CAN SIGNATURE may find this review uncomfortable but I do agree with the guy's review. My HD650 sounds better in XBASS mode of ZEN CAN than in HD6XX mode of ZEN CAN SIGNATURE giving unnecessary hi-frequency brightness to my HD650.
thanks Andrew for not hyping FOTM and putting yourself on the line in this review with the potential of upsetting drop.... and that's exactly what I think about this drop stack... way overpriced for a now average/good headphone.... for the price i'd go for schiit modius/magnius or THX789/SMSL Su8 etc.....
Thank you for your nuanced review, which adroitly addresses an issue which influences my listening experience and needs. A 107mm rocket blast and lightning strike resulted in hearing damage that I thought had ended my audiophile hobby. Now I can use devices like the Zen, combined with an Ear Studio ES100, FiiO M5 and either my Audeze LCD-1, iSine10, or Sony MX4 to truly enjoy music again.
Good review. Was having constant issues with Windows not recognizing Zen DAC via USB and gave up on it for months. Finally revisited and discovered issue was the non iFi power supply that I was using for the DAC. Disconnected DC 5v power supply and issue instantly disappeared. Skipping the power supply now on DAC and just power it via USB. Glad to have combo back. Using with HD560s and very satisfied. Also nice to free up a power socket.
Thank you, I've been wondering about this because as you can probably guess I went with the Zen DAC V2 and the Zen Can. I was very torn between which to choose for my HD6XX's. On one hand I wanted to believe that the Signature would be a lot better for them considering that stack was around $250 more than the total cost of the normal set. You've made me very happy with my decision because I really don't like those treble peaks and so far I'm loving using the non-signature version with my 6XX's. I have both the Base Boost and the 3D enabled running balanced from the 4.4 TRRS and the sound is the best I've ever heard my 6XX's sound. So in a way not only did I dodge a bullet on Treble but saved myself enough to get a Pariat Balanced cable and still have around $150 left vs that Signature set without giving up anything I'd want as shown from your testing. Very cool and thank you again...
I've had the non-drop stack and eventually sold the Zen Can. The Zen DAC v1 is completely fine for the HD600 and R70x but the truebass button is best left off. I can't wait for the ifi Zen One Signature w/bluetooth feature. Maybe a comparison with the Neo iDSD? Both have Bluetooth and the zen one with zen can comes in close to the Neo's price
Got a standard version of CAN today and after some brief listening I am very happy how XBass and 3D work with my HD58X :) And I am glad to see I do not miss anything important with having non-Drop version as I prefer standard characteristics anyway :D
@@trixniisama initially I had a Sennheiser GSX 1000 gaming dac/amp, but it had a mediocre DAC and I had to connect CAN to the amped output, so it had a double amplification and occasional distortion because of that. So I searched and searched and came to conclusion that in this price range only Zen DAC makes sense due to RCA and 4.4mm outputs and I needed both of them - RCA for desktop speakers and 4.4mm connected to CAN of course. However, for Zen DAC I actually went with Signature version. Mostly because I wanted a dedicated DAC, not another dac/amp combo like silver version of Zen DAC is, and having so many unused headphone sockets would look silly too. I have no idea if there is any noticable sound difference between silver and signature version of Zen DACs, but I figured having better power supply included with Signature and supposedly better grade components won't hurt (besides maybe wallet). Schiit Modius is another RCA+balanced DAC in this price range if you need it, for me in Europe it is hard to get and ifi has launched Signature versions outside of Drop across the world, so that was the only sensible option for me. But probably silver Zen DAC is absolutely fine if you don't mind having 4 headphone sockets
I had no idea these existed and I thought I researched Zen products fully. I bought the Blue and CAN (regular) last week for my 650s and 660s and happy with them.
I would like to know, is the sound really that different using the 660s with 4.4mm between the Zen Dac and the Can ? Another question, how would you compare the 650s and 660s ?
@@trixniisama I'm still yet to try the 4.4mm between - not to mention a balanced headphone cable. Those two things are next for me to buy, so I'll let you know. I'm looking forward to testing them.
I also have a smilier setup with the HD600, HD6XX & HD650 with the Zen Dac V2 + Zen Can “ Using Audio quest Cinnamon USB to replace the standard cables taking advantage of 4.4 balance cables so clean and powerful step.
@@fatdoi003 I've owned both the Darkvoice and the Lyr3, and the Lyr3 is the way to go if you can afford the price difference. The DV is excellent, but in my humble opinion, the Lyr3 is next level-especially with Sennheisers.
@@XtianApi No, it's less tubey for sure. The Lyr3 is more like a good solid-state with some extra tube magic sprinkled in. More detailed/precise than the DV, but definitely less tubey. The DV is big and bold like a Lamborghini. The Lyr3 is more akin to a Porsche. If that makes any sense. Haha.
@@jamesbittle469 yes that does make sense. Thank you. I am sensitive to Bright or highly revealing headphones so all my cans are warm baths, so I think I would have trouble hearing mild tubes. The only tube amp I have is a portable Little Bear B4 balanced(not really balanced). I can hear the tubes, but it is very subtle
btw if you plan to use low impedance headphones you should get Non Signature versions cause Zen Can is for high impedance headphones no reviewer mentions that where with the regular stack you can use just the Zen Dac v2 for IEM and low impedance headphones so if you don't have or don't plant on getting high impedance headphones like 50 ohm or more the Zen Dac v2 is what you need if you have high impedance like headphones you also need the Zen Can thats why this stack is made like that Nor Drop nor Ifi mentions this
Admittedly I do not own either of these particular stacks. But I do have 6XX's and Sundara's. I'm sure the Drop version is a fine set up but the marketing and pricing of it rubbed me the wrong way. It struck me as a bit of a cash grab and a means to cash in on their large group of 6XX owners. Those that may not be as deep into the hobby and simply want a better sound experience compared to the average consumer. Such a demographic is prime for some savvy marketing. I don't like to be so cynical but people have got to eat of course
Drop/iFi made the wrong calculation on thinking 100k people who bought $200 headphone will want to spend $500+4.4mm connection/headphone cables.... if they target the Focal Elex/Clear/Eligia users, they may have more success with that stack......
Thorough, well-reasoned and presented as usual. I've seen Axel Grell mention the design brief for the HD650. It was a damping exercise to create the kind of headphone listening experience you describe - easy to fall into the music with, unfussy. The other headphones in this lineage can't be called harsh or sharp, but the 650 is the kindest and gentlest of them. When I got a pair of the original HD580 Precisions (which I still have), I thought they were awful. It was my first go at headphones and with the best gear I had - some nice DACs and a Pete Millet tube hybrid amp - the HD580s sounded like someone had stuffed cotton in my ears. I gave it another go with the 6XX. Same thing, but worse'ish. Poking around a bit, for me certain pairings have made for a very rewarding 6XX experience. Especially the Bottlehead Crack with certain tubes, pair with a nice DAC, came together for a sound character I really like. There are a few other non-tube amp/DAC pairings that I enjoy, too. Yes, a headphone like the Focal Elex (which you mention and I also have, along with some others) is technically just a more capable device, but as you also mention in this review, when it's good the 6XX is a keeper, offering a beautifully easy and satisfying experience. All those different flavors, and so many good ones to savor.
The Zen Can is my very first headphone amp, I'm extremely happy with it. It is too powerful for my ATH-AD500Xs, so I'm running -12dB gain systemwide. Planning to get an iEMatch for them (yes it is a glorified resistor pack, but it's a very nice glorified resistor pack) as it should fix my exact problem with this combo (amp way too powerful for cans). They do scale incredibly with the amp, it's like I've never heard them before.
Did you compare the sound between the 2 amps? Signature was supposed to have the power supply wasn't it? And the Signature used upgraded parts. Could you tell the difference?
Wish the zen stack cost that much, as in Australia we pay $1000 ! I just ordered my set of HD6XX from drop, for $250 Australian but the normal price of the HD600 is $500+ here !
Constructive input here: If you're going to be saying something as repetitively as "HD-6XX" in a single video, I think that you should state in the very beginning that in order to avoid the monotony, you're going to refer to them in the video as "the HDs", or whatever. It would make the video far more pleasing to listen to, and it would probably cut almost 5 minutes from it (lol). Seriously, though, just a suggestion. Thanks for all of the great info! Sparks
Been heard both zen v2 stack and zen signature, even while being non-analytical, zen signature sounds clearly better. The signature sound is cleaner, and more resonant over zen v2.
I personally never heard any differences out of cheaper DACs. With my UD301 I started to finally appreciate them. It's maybe 20% better compared to my PC.
From my understanding under 1k there are very few dacs that actually sound like a upgrade from lets say a Modi. From what I hear its basically just Modius and Bifrost 2 that stand out (with one other dac I can not remember the name now).
Just a bit confused. First, you said that the bass boost button will over boost the bass on the 6xx, then you found out the 6xx button does has the same effect as the bass boost button at low frequencies? Am I misunderstanding something?
This video focused too much on 6xx and eq of signature amp. How about regular zen can sound. It's different from most other amps. Class a discrete amp and they say it's trickle down from flagship pro ican. Currently the ''budget'' amps are: schiit discrete schiit discrete class a schiit, jds, topping opamp solidstate and now this one zen can discrete class a Also zen dac is quite different too. Burr brown chip and gto filter. magni 3+ vs l30 vs asgard 3 vs zen can vs thx789 would be nice video topic or e30 vs modi multibit vs zen dac vs ESS dac?
Can you do a video on why one might choose IEM's vs In Ear Headphones vs Over Ear Headphones(closed back) vs Over Ear Headphones(open back). I've seen videos of all 4 on your channel but if I'm looking at new headphones and looking to spend 500$, why would I choose one or the other? Currently, based on what I've watched from you, I'm looking at the HD 6XX together with a high quality amp.
It depends on what you need. For more open air, clean, clear go with open back. Downside is you can’t bring this outside. Closed back is for a noisy environment. Soundwise, depends on the price, usually performs less clarity and open air sounding compared to open back. IEM is for convenient. With IEM, you don’t have to worry about your hair, and it usually runs pretty easy without the need of amplifier. Soundwise, IEM is pretty intimate because it sealed your ear. Pretty much like the closed back headphones (again, depends on the pricing). So overall, it depends on your preference
Aren't IEMs and in ears essentially the same thing but with a different shell design? You get closed backs for passive noise isolation if you're in public (same thing w/ IEMs but less portable), and you get open back for quiet listening environment.
since i like your reviews a quick question i recently bought the focal celestee and i also own the hifiman ananda. For my home listening i listen through my laptop with a dragonfly cobalt from the tidal app. will i hear any diference if i would buy the ifi zen dac 2 or the dac 2 combo with the can2 or will it be a waste of money? Thank you very much greetings from greece
3 года назад
Now we have new ZEN DAC signature V2 for about 300$ with USB only input, is it any better than previous with such premium price ?
Good review, I'm currently looking for a DAC headphone amp combo. I have roland ua-m10 thats no longer compatible with mac. I wished you had shown the back and went over the connections. Is it a good match for a MAC OS, and I believe it's yes, but I don't feel you really said YES!!! you can definitely turn off that 6xx/3d crap.
Hello I'm using the Hd 6XX for gaming and been using the Sennheiser amp only. I'm not getting that power. I am looking to upgrade to a amp and dac, would one of these in your video do the trick?
I ordered 6xx and received it last week, first listening immediately caught on what you guys call 'Sennheiser veil'..i don't enjoy it, so muddy, so boxy and closed, my journeys continue... what do you guys recommend for jazz recording? i want large soundstage, just a light mid bass, great natural mid, and have top quality for treble and high, for under $300 -400? let me know, (currently eyeing Sundara)
I got HD660S, no “vail” at all, same sound stage, very natural sound, which is great for classical/jazz. As HD660S is only 150 ohms, the Zen DAC v1 ( no Zen CAN) drives it very well with the 4.4 mm balanced cable which HD660S came with.
I just bought the ifi zen can signature mz99, i own the beyerdynamic dt 1990pro and grado sr80x, do you think that the zen can signature 6xx would be a better match to my headphones?, or it doesn't matter because neither sound signature is adecuate
Not warm. The DAC won't change the FR. But a lot of people prefer a more analytic sound to pair with the hd6xx. Burr brown DACs are often more relaxed.
That’s probably the best choice so far if you want to stay with the Zen line. I hoped they would a Signature Can w/o it being tailored to Sennheiser. According to their ex Chief Engineer Thorston they’re milking their best product meanwhile they scramble to find a way to maintain iFi as its currently known for affordable products which now may be a thing of the past.
HI! Thanks for this excelent review! Congrats for your channel I like a lot. My question is: the Zen Can it's enough for connect to a Chord Mojo without losing any details or it's better go for a more priced amp? Thanks for all!! ;);)
@@TheHEADPHONEShow HI! I have a AKG K701 and yes is for use the xbass and 3d. But the more power are welcome. I saw your comparsion with the portables daps versus the Ifi Micro and Chord Mojo and was very interesting, the same comparsion using the lines out connecting to a desktop amp will very very interesting too. Thanks for your reply ;);).
Amazing review, really good work, spot on! Not sure which setup I would enjoy more but all the information is really valuable. Right now I am running Zen Dac together with a power supply and balanced cables for my HD6XX (which is giving me enough of power if not going crazy with EQing). I will avoid the Truebass button from now on. EQing using EqualizerAPO & the Peace gui is working really well for creating a sound you like. Zen Dac + Zen Can and keeping the headphone SE cable is perhaps the better option though (but slightly more expensive). Cables being rather for expensive for the Zen series and hard to find which is annoying, making everything less budget for sure. The 4.4mm is not very common yet. If buying both a 4.4 - 4.4 cable for connecting the amp and the dac together with a balanced cable for the HD6XX it gets rather expensive and I didn't even mention the power supplies...
You can't recreate the '3D' effect just with EQ unfortunately. There are some tricks to enhance the perception, but I do feel there's more to it than that. I'll be posting my EQ for the HD6XX soon though.
Does anyone knows how the zen can signature sounds with other headphones than the Sennheiser 650/6xx? I got Beyerdynamics (990, 150), NAD Viso HP50 and other headphones. I am interested in how it sounds with other headphones.
But what's great about the signature edition Zen CAN is that, instead of just buying a $100 amp and using eq, you can spend an extra $150 for the convenience of just having it be a button you press..... What a deal!!!!
I ordered the Sennheiser 6xx from Drop, and also bought it with the Zen Dac amp, to power it. Do you suggest I get the I get the Zen Cam Amp with it ? or do suggest something else instead?
@@tomboii7355 I have owned both the regular Zen Stack and the Zen Signature Stack and I must say I do notice better sound quality, on the Signature Stack. I believe the Signature Dac is the reason, you get a much faster, punchy, and clearer sound quality. It's not major but it's noticeable.
I hope someone sees this. I saw the 660s sold along a Zen can signature, but the pack didn't have the dac, so it wasn't the full stack. Is it still ok to get the set like that with just the amp?
I've just ordered Zen CAN (non signature model) with my Sundara's. Should I get Zen DAC aswell, leave it as it is, or get something else? Will be using it to connect to my desktop (highend, if that matters).
@@TheHEADPHONEShow The thing is that I am creating a setup from the get-go. I was aiming towards the Zen Dac, coming from the same line-up. But than again Motu M2 interface crossed my path (with ESS Sabre32)... If I would want a mic upgrade in the future aswell. And since I saw you handeling both the Sundara's and the Zen Can, I was wondering what would be your pick for a DAC, that is within a resaonable price, compared to the overall package. Love your channel! Best regards from Slovenia (EU)
The only Dac at the moment would be "125dB SNR AMP-UP Audio with ALC1220 & High-End ESS SABRE 9118 DAC with WIMA audio capacitors" from the motherboard.
Also, could I do both 3d and xbass on the original can and then eq the harsh peak down a bit, or would that end up messing with the improvements in soundstage? I'm really just trying to figure out how to get the best of both worlds.
@@TheHEADPHONEShow The question is if he needs it. The Sundara is pretty easy to drive and also connecting the Zen Dac to a power supply will give it slightly more power. I don't think the Zen Dac deliver power up to the specs running USB powered?
Did you notice the bass feature to be less heavy handed on the non signature can compared to the non signature zen dac? I heard the can does the bass a bit differently . I just got the hip dac with my sennheiser 600, it’s very pleasant but am considering the zen dac and can. I do like the xbass function, I feel it gives the impression of being in a car with a heavy sub. This is kinda what’s keeping me from other DACs and amps. Also I do really like I suppose the warmth of the brown chip. I can listen with no fatigue whatsoever. That being said, you still believe eq can properly fix the bass and have it sound natural? Like a sonar works type of eq? Maybe you recommend another dac to go with the can? I was looking at schiit but also heard some say it really isn’t better than ifi at this price range of a bit over 100. I also did consider the a zen can with maybe a schiit modi but a again have heard the modi isn’t that special. I also considerEd the zen dac with maybe a Hersey BUT I have heard it has a lot of distortion?
Is anyone able to tell me if I can get the "enhancments" tab in the properties of your playback device in the sound control panel with the iFi Zen DAC V2? This is the tab with loudness equalization for footsteps in fps games like mw2/warzone. TIA
Should be. IFI have explicitly said that Zen Signature set is "very good" for HD660s (but just "good" for HD700, even "poor" for HD800, while "excellent" for 6xx) and I believe the non-signature version will perform somewhat similarly since its output power is same.
@@Kai-P Well i was planing on get some AKG K712 and people told me that the Zen Dac does not have enough power to drive them... Whether it's true or not, I don't know ...
@@PakoPnF I would at least try the DAC alone first before getting the CAN. Don't know the headphone, but 62 Ohm should also work pretty much everywhere. And before spending more on electronics, I personally would prefer to spent more on the headphone.
@@PakoPnF Got the ifi Zen DAC today, it drives my Focal Clear (55 Ohm, 104 dB, not too different to the K712 spec wise) at my loudest listening volume at 2 o clock without "power match". With power match there is even more headroom.
Yes. Chrono did a review of it on this channel. I did one over a year ago as well, bottom line is that I found it quite sibilant. With EQ though it can sound pretty good I think.
I have HD660S for classical/jazz. As HD660S is only 150 ohms, the Zen DAC v1 ( no Zen CAN) drives it very well with the 4.4 mm balanced cable which HD660S came with.
i've spend some money to test lots of dacs and amps i've tested Ifi Zen Dac v2, Signature v2 same for Ifi Zen Can and Signature Zen Can and without a doubt the Non Drop version that is 100 Euro cheaper for both is better or the same so i don't know why drop is doing this SCAM drop version should've been $50 Less then the Non signature version then sure yes but even for same price No but they are even $100 to $125 more expensive depends from where you buy them Hell No plus the drop versions out of 2 Zen Can one had grounding issues and i know 2 ppl that had issues with their Zen Dac Signature v2 and replaced with non signature v2 so don't fall for drop scam
Listening to the review, Fiio k5 pro and a sub 150 dollar tube amp would be a better investment for someone having 6xx, to have all base covered and with some headroom for upgrading.
@@springroll58 yes. So if you want a solid state sound you can use k5 pro amp Portion along with dac. If you want tube sound you can use rca out and use k5 as dac only.
@@prabinpaudel5572 I just ordered an hd6xx today. And when that arrives, I'll be getting a k5 😀 Been researching amps all weekend and I think I'm just gonna go with a k5.
It is bang for the buck but it gets more expensive if you buy a power supply from iFi and a quality balanced cable for your headphones. Conclusion: It depends
@@MrMakatech Right! It also depends if you plan to get a bunch of 4.4 male connectors and build the cables yourself. Not applicable for everyone, but I don't think it's particularly hard and cheaper option.
I can totally see a newcomer to the hobby going "Oh, well it says 6XX on it, so this must be the best amp and dac for my 6XX." And that's what bothers me the most. That this glorified eq button takes advantage of those who are just getting into the hobby.
With over 100 thousand units sold, the Massdrop HD6XX headphones are a massive success. _People chose to buy them_ due to the massive hype and the perception of value. Now Drop and ifi are offering a good DAC and amplifier to match the headphones. As with the headphones, no one is 'being taken advantage of'. It's just capitalism at work.
It's tough because they're also discontinued. But I may do a review at some point. I think it was an interesting experiment that unfortunately didn't work out. But it's important for companies to challenge convention with new ideas, and it certainly did some things (like comfort) extremely well. So now I'm looking to mod it a bit and see how I can maybe improve the tuning.
What??? Yeah sure bass boost just for 6XX... $$$850k, got some beachside property in Kansas to sell you!!!$$$ $$$500$$$ Monolith THX desktop amp, mic drop..........
