I mean you wouldn't normally expect something that's purchased in a groupbuy format to be refundable right? Plus, I personally think it should have been fairly clear from day 1 that their version of the Zen amp/dac was a pretty horrible deal.
@@4lc441 Oh, it's a perfectly fair thing to say Drop must tell people up-front their purchase is non-refundable. If they're willing to sell a product then they should make damn sure people know that money will never come back. But, that's the nature of the beast.
Hmm, for a week now I've had the combination of ifi Zen DAC and Zen CAN at home. After that time, I was left with mixed feelings. In fact, this combination enhances the sound of my Sennheiser HD660s by giving it more space, clearing the highs and contouring the bass. Without any XBass or 3D. Likewise, the Beyerdynamic DT880 (slightly modified with the inner padding of the Tygr, insulates the treble a little), which it gives a clear bass boost and which is even more precise in the middle and treble range, also without pressing any additional buttons. But that's it, because for all other models in my possession, either the bass is emphasized too much; Tygr, DT770, DT990, DENON AH-D9200. Or he mercilessly overdrives the drivers at certain frequencies, up to the pain threshold; BLON BL20, Hifiman Sundara, Deva, Ananda, Arya, Grado RS2e, GS3000e, Sennheiser HD800s and Focal Clear. ChiFi In-Ears, which are usually already quite clear in their tonality, overwhelmed this combination by 80%. So in my opinion it is very important for this combination of DAC and AMP which headphones I have, because especially with the planar magnets there were no satisfactory results at all. And as a "high end" combo, these two parts do not go through with me!!! Especially since I actually own higher quality DAC-AMP combinations that are not significantly more expensive and do not cause any problems of this kind. But that's just my own opinion, everyone can see that very differently !!! Correction !! I apologize for the statement made above; I connected the two devices with one of the chinch cables supplied by ifi, which must have been broken. When I tried the Zen Can on other DACs and other input port´s today , the results were excellent, so I exchanged the cable and have now achieved completely positive results. The Zen DAC reflects the quality of the connected DACs almost perfectly, so I only have the tonal quality of the respective DAC with enormous power. I have just connected the HEDDPhone and am very satisfied with the interaction with my Questyle CMA Twelve Master, which I use as a DAC. It also multiplies the qualities of an Audioquest Dragonfly Cobalt into significantly higher output power. So I am very satisfied now. Sorry again for the first impression i gave !!
@@sebastianmeierr.1757 In principle, I can recommend this combination with the HD800s as a warm sounding Option, but should mention that there are sound enhancement options to Drive the Sennheiser, but they are all more expensive.
Yes and no. Zen DAC can drive most headphones, but with the CAN, harder to drive headphones seem to open up quite a bit more. After listening to DAC alone, and then DAC+CAN with a variety of headphones, the difference is big enough for me to get the stack.
@@agoogleuser9025 a preamp is basically just volume control, yes. It outputs at a signal level, not speaker level. You could not power a pair of normal passive speakers with this, you would need to send the signal to a power amplifier.
@@agoogleuser9025 The ifi does every job that a JDS Atom does, but it is also a DAC. If you only need a DAC to pair with the JDS, then I recommend buying a dedicated DAC rather than this, which is a hybrid DAC/preamp/headphone amp. The Topping D30 and Schiit Modi 3 are both good.
Im 6 mins into the video, never watched you before and I already ordered my ifi Zen Can on Monday and now I subscriped to your channel because you manage to be technical accurate and also fun to watch!
Running a pair of HD 6XX's off a FX-Audio X6. Been thinking about picking up the Zen DAC but was really interested to see how it stacked up to the Zen CAN. This really helped out.
@@agoogleuser9025 Overall, good on my end but this is really the only Dac/Amp combo I have used. Bought it based of a review from Z Reviews and some other RU-vidrs. I am running power from a wall outlet and input from my PC via the USB cable. I don't have to push the volume knob much past a 10 o'clock position.
Thankyou bruh...I expected the inference ...even my Magni with zen Dac is mild difference only...but I can use 2 headphones simultaneously...of course power difference will be there ...with Zen Dac and Magni 3+
Looking at this amp from the standpoint of its internals alone it should give very good performance although I'm a bit leery with the use of a Dual ganged volume control in providing true balanced capability to the output on it's own.My guess they manipulate the balancing thru active circuitry probably with Op Amps.Have to admit that I had a itch to get one thru Drop but refrained just could not see their asking price as a good value and I'm now glad that i did after viewing your video. Went and ordered it thru Bloom Audio for the $80.00 savings will be using this and a Topping D50 DAC as a desktop setup just want to thank you for providing your review and thoughts on this device well done.
I'm guessing you have tested it by now? I also just got one and I'm having a problem with the XBass/3D Button. This button is really sensitive and it often skips one of the settings on my unit. Did you have a similar experience with yours?
@@NoThemeReviews Is that really a fair thing to say though? Their most popular audiophile offerings are for the most part genuinely good deals: the 6XX, 58X, HE4XX, etc. Yes the $500 ifi stack is hilariously overpriced, but almost nobody bought it.
@@4lc441 I wouldn't jump up and down and proclaim Drop is a good place to shop. Yeah, I grant the 6xx is a good sounding headphone. But that's not Drop's doing--that's all Sennheiser. Same with the other headphones. The power of crowd-purchasing certainly allows for cheaper prices, and Drop can achieve that. But not always. Regardless, the mere fact that Drop may have been successful in some cases does not change the fact they are abysmal with customer service, honest product descriptions, or with competitively low pricing. Often you'll see Drop products that are a FEW DOLLARS cheaper than the same thing sold elsewhere...but you'll have to wait longer to get them...and the warranty may be questionable...and refunds are non-negotiable. So--yes, I think it's fair to say that Drop is a merchant that should be used with significant caution and trepidation.
Glad I didn't get cucked by massdrop on this. Will be picking up one of these to go with my ZEN DAC, then grabbing one of the 4.4 to 4.4 short cables from HartAudioCables
Try not being so critical of visuals when talking about audio gear. The RNHP was repeatedly shown throughout the video, so you know what it looks like. I don’t have time to waste keying every visual with audio. This isn’t my job. I do it as a hobby. Try to keep your criticisms of things like this tempered.
I initially was using the Zen Dac for my Ether CX and found it to be plenty capable but switched to a Topping DX7 Pro a few months ago. I loved the clarity improvements with the Topping's included DAC, but the Ethers are a pretty neutral headphone and was missing the enhanced bass from the Zen Dac. Once I saw the Zen Can launch edition was coming out I ordered immediately and have been using it with the Topping running in DAC only mode and the results have been amazing. Running balanced out they easily drive the Ethers to painfully loud levels around 1 o'clock without any additional gain. The XBass is fantastic and doesn't overpower the rest of the range. Only complaint is that xlr to 4.4mm interconnects are pretty obscure at this point still. After seeing the reviews for the Drop version, I don't see how it could be worth $80 more especially when it's tailored for a use case within their own eco-system "the 6XX stack". Also when the drop ran they were charging $89 for a 4.4mm to 4.4mm interconnect, so take that for what it's worth if you wonder what they think of their customers.
@@NaveedKhan-bs1sc On the DX7 Pro, you can access the settings menu by turning the power off from the switch in the back, then pressing and holding the volume knob button down at the same time turning on the power from the switch. One of the settings lets you choose between preamp and dac mode.
I have the Zen Dac and love it together with my AKG 702 (power from Zen Dac is enogh for AKG 702). For me it´s not clear if there is an improvement in sound using the Zen Dac in combination with the Zen Can or if only the power will be increased. Would you say it´s worth it to buy the Zen Can additionally for 170 $?
If your headphones get sufficient power and you like how they sound, I don’t think it makes sense to spend another $170 for an amp with more power. If you plan to buy higher impedance or less sensitive headphones, then maybe the Can might be useful.
I own the Zen Can but does any one else's unit make faint crackling noises when not playing music and turning up the volume? Its apparent on all the gain settings just not sure if its normal, thanks.
Ok so first time I’ve watched this channel. I really like your review. As long as I keep my eyes closed. I find the video, not at all connected to the soundtrack as far as I can tell, rather distracting. That’s because the visuals are also interesting, if slightly less so. I doubt that it would sustain my attention with no volume. But as I say, closed eyed, overall a very interesting review.
I actually have the Zen Can & Dac stack, and really enjoy the warm sound signature. I especially like listening using the bass boost on the Can, the one on the Dac is way to much for me. I also had the Schiit stack to compare and returned it, I much preferred the Zen stack sound. Thanks for your review, you gave me much insight.
I'm in the market for a Dac Amp stack or combo, NTR suggested the 789 & 887 as well as the Magni. I'm undecided. One of many reasons I enjoy NTR's reviews is his transparent perspective, plus his disdain for the "marketing scams" from many well known dealers and their review minions. The other reason is he owns an Argon like I do and that's the hard one to drive. I can invest up to $500 tax & shipping included for my stack but I have yet to make a solid decision. All this to ask, what from the Zen stack helped you decide over the Schiit stack? no pun intended.
@@Leo.SKDXL05 I actually really enjoyed the warm and more musical sound signature of the IfI stack, which is common with the Burr Brown chip. The Schiit stack wasn't worse it was a different sound signature, it was more analytical and precise, which many prefer but not me I guess. I guess it all depends on what you prefer as a listener. Even when I'm listening to reviewers comment, you have to take into account there personal bais based on there personal preferences. I bought from both sound signatures from Amazon since they have a easy return policy. I listen to them both side by side and kept the one I liked best.
I don't have the Ananda and can't speak about that headphone. But the Ananda is a very easy headphone to drive. I cannot imagine why adding the Can would increase performance. The Dac has plenty of power for low-impedance headphones like the Ananda. There's a lot of misunderstanding perpetuated by Zeos and his type. They constantly claim more power means better--and that's simply not true. Once headphone drivers get sufficient power for peak performance, they don't behave any better merely because they get more power. Adding more power might make the drivers perform differently from how they were designed--the Sony MDR-Z7 has that distinction. But this isn't "better" in any way--it's simply pushing the drivers to function beyond what the engineers envisioned. In short, no, I don't think the Can is a worthwhile purchase for low impedance headphones.
@@NoThemeReviews Yes that's what I though so as well, thanks for confirming! Your reviews are so informative, subscribed and liked! More power to you brother!
@@NoThemeReviews Is this point about the Ananda with DAC consistent for the Sundara? Been debating on buying an amp to stack with the Zen Dac. Thank you for your advice
While we can understand the bad taste with the massdrop debacle, rest of the world are not affected by it. Also, the review should be based on the product's performance to price. Clearly when matched with the Zen DAC, the Zen DAC+CAN is a very attractive price performance package. I have it and the stack drives the Sundara noticeably better than the DAC alone. It's worth a look.
Very nice. About the Argon, you said this drives it well with a louder volume - is there another amp you've tried that already drives them that way at lower volumes? Does it become more or less the same at low volume if you just enable the bass boost, or is this something different?
No, the bass boost simply provides a few decibel increase in the bass. The overall loudness of the headphones does not change with the bass boost. As for alternative amps, surprisingly the NX4 drives the Argon--though still not as well as desktop amps. The 789, 887, Monolith THX Desktop, and Darkvoice can drive the Argon. This is simply one of those headphones that requires a whole lot of power. I'm not convinced it's worth the hassle if you don't already have the headphone.
i can tell you that ifi Zen Can is a Perfect Match with Fiio K5 Pro and Sound BlasterX G6 but if you have any of these you really don't need the Zen Can
i love the zen can great amp and the ability to connect it to 3 different dacs at the same time is great allows me to have my PC and all 4 consoles hooked
Ifi zen can or rupee Neve headphone amp? My LCDX Sound very harsh over 7k when used w Neve using line out of the Apollo x using balanced xlr. Thank you
Have you tried the ZEN DAC MDA function with Tidal Master files? Would like to know how it decodes the music files. Also which do you recommended the ZEN DAC of the Schitt Magini Heresy with Modi 3 Combo?
ive recently started looking for a new dac and/or amp after almost 10 years and the options are so overwhelming I probably won't end up buying anything lol. the one I have is an Audioengine d1 and it works perfectly but 3 years ago I got some Hifiman HE400i and the D1 powers them ok but on quieter music I do find myself maxing out the volume and wishing the amp was a little more powerful. at the beggining I just wanted a Schiit Magni but then you start seeing all the improvements that have been made in headphone technology in the last decade so then you suddenly are considering spending $300 on an amp and getting a new $250 dac just have bluetooth or whatever and then you sit back and think "wait, how did I get here?" haha. Sorry I just wanted to vent. thanks for the raw honesty and straight to the point videos that help people like me get a little grounded while thinking about all this... I'll probably just get a Magni 3 and save up my money to upgrade the headphones to an Elex or something like that eventually
@@NoThemeReviews thanks a lot for the reply! Anything you prefer for $300 or less to drive the 400is and future-proof in case I upgrade to something harder to drive down the line? either stand alone amp with rca out or amp/dac combo. I'm trying to do as much research as possible to hopefully make one purchase and be satisfied for another decade haha
I don't have the P-II but it's the same thing as the Aiva. The Can is just a tad warm. On the Phoenix it adds just a slight bit of bass reverberation and decay. On the Aiva it actually helps elevate the otherwise light bass response, especially with the bass boost. There's overwhelming power for both headphones.
@@NoThemeReviews Thanks, I'm trying to make a decision on my first set of planars around the price point of the P-II's; any suggestions will be appreciated.
@@smilesrs8516 What type of sound signature are you looking for? The Aiva sound is not to everyone's tastes. Planars also don't dig deep into the sub-bass.
I find it odd they have 4.4mm output on the zen can and iFI doesn't selle a 4.4MM to RCA/XLR...what powered speaker has a 4.4mm input??? Why make the customer have to get a custom cable made? I assume the didn't use RCA out to save space...
I'm not going to opine whether one sounds better than another; it's a subjective preference. The BTR5 is overhyped and under-delivers. Unless you really must have a BT dac, there are much better options in build, usability, and features. If your headphones work fine with the BTR5 and you don't need more power, then there's no reason to buy the Zen Can. If you plan to buy more power-hungry headphones or want a powerful desktop amp, then the Can is certainly a good option.
Have you tried the hip dac? If so is it any different from the zen dac? I want to get one of them and if the trade of is 20$ for the option to go portable then that is worth it for me, is there any difference in sound signature or anything else?
@@NoThemeReviews Hey, I was wondering how the monoprice THX portable with Dirac Sensaround sounds in contrast to the 3D+ on the Zen Dac. Also wondering how the LCD-2F is enhanced by the XBass. I feel like my LCD-2F's have bass that is muted a bit by the large pads. My Oppo PM-2s have better bass. my earcups vibrate. I don't get that impression on my LCD-2F's
@@GameOfDecidability They sound a bit different. Both do basically the same: decrease bass and increase treble, but in different degrees. Both are highly dependent upon the headphones and music--and in my experience, I have yet to hear any combo of audio and headphones that sounds pleasant with iFi's 3D or Monolith's Sensaround. xBass does boost the LCD-2F's bass, but only in mid-bass. xBass doesn't audibly alter sub-bass, in my experience anyway. All Audeze headphones suffer from lack of full, neutral sub-bass. Plus, the faster-than-natural transience sometimes makes bass sound lighter than it actually is. A warmer dac, such as an iFi, will slightly affect decay, and application of xBass will provide a somewhat noticeable difference in mid-bass. But, as with anything, your music and proper amplification will also play some amount of role. Earpad changing can have a more dramatic affect. So, if it's more bass you want, check out one of the many Audeze earpad alternatives.
There is zero difference in sound quality over SE vs balanced. That's an audiophile myth that has been debunked over and over again. The only difference is power output. Above 32 ohms, the balanced output is noticeably more powerful. If you have low-impedance or easily driven headphones, balanced isn't going to make any difference. If you have something like the Argon, then balanced would make more sense since you get the extra power the drivers need.
The Can does provide enough power to drive the 880, but the bass and clarity is not the same as with a high output impedance amp--which tends to provide tighter bass, smoother mids, and slightly better clarity.
@@NoThemeReviews thank you man. I would like to buy the Beyerdynamic a20, but it costs 150 euros more than this ifi zen CAN (200 euors in my country). The high output impedance amp improves the sound, but is this improvement like night and day so to justify an increase of +75% in price?
@@TheSteve57 Lol. I can't help it. "Upgraded" gear release cycles are as synchronized as your wrist watch. iFi did just release a Ver 2 of the Zen Dac, so I wouldn't be surprised if the Can got similar treatment. I have no idea what they could possibly add to make a "Version 2" enticing.
I wouldn't say it's a "better" idea to get a neutral dac for the Can. You'll get a slightly different sound signature, that's all. If you want to get a marginally warm sound to your headphones, then the Modi+Can stack would be a fine option.
@@NoThemeReviews thanks didn't know if the both devices being warm would make the sound a little Muddy? I'm going to get a hipdac for mobile use, I'll use that at a tuned volume and see how it sounds first before deciding on tne dac
Do you know the relationship between gain setting and power output ? I'm confused about this concept. For example i have SBX AE5 soundcard and THX 789 amp. Their loudness (gain) pretty much same (single ended) but THX 789 have about 4x more power according to ASR. I find this interesting. I guess manufacturers can choose higher gain for their weaker amp but what is the shortcomings of this ? Is it possible to have 0db gain but lot more power output ? Zen Can have 18 db gain setting. THX 789 have 16db in balanced mode but THX 789 have much more power. 3.5W at 50 ohm, Zen can 1890mw at 64 ohm and it's probably exaggerated spec. So Zen can is louder but THX have more power. A90 gain is 15.5db and power is 4.8W. Magni 15db 1.6W, Asgard 15.6db 2.5W. Magnius 14db 3.2W These are all highest gains. Lower gains another dilemma we don't know how much power available there. There are some graphs on asr but hard to read. Magnius 0db: 348mw THX 6db: 800mw i guess A90 6db: 1.2w
iFi's manual tells you the specific gain db boost, but does not mention the power for each gain setting. Logically, the power consumption increases with incremental gain adjustment.
@@NoThemeReviews Thanks for the reply but that wasn't my question. I find this power/gain relation interesting or i'm missing something badly. But my takeaway is more power but less gain is better. For example Heresy high gain is louder than Magnius balanced high gain but Magnius have twice the power. 15db with 1.6W vs 14db with 3.2W. So twice the power but less loudness or i'm missing something.
It sounds pretty disorienting when you refer to the sound signature of the DAC. Aren’t DAC’s supposed to have no sound signature? I could understand you referring to the amp of the Zen DAC (weird name since it’s not purely a DAC), but it seems like you’re referring to the actual DAC’s within the Zen Can and Zen DAC. I could be wrong. I’m just confused lol.
Eh, the test setup was a bit convoluted. I could have made it simpler but somebody would have complained. You’re not wrong about the Dac issue. I think you’re referring to 1) my conclusion about the amp’s sound signature, and 2) my conclusion that the amp adopts the sound signature of the relevant Dac. Dacs do have their own sound signatures. In the last several years companies have been pushing neutral or analytical dacs but that isn’t a rule anyone has to follow. iFi uses Burr Brown in some of their devices and those dacs are known for their warmer, analog sound. ESS Sabre are known for their overly analytical nature. AKM until recently were grainy and had underemphasized bass.
hello i just got this paired with a5+. i just connected it via usb and a 3.5 jack into the big jack adapter right into the "Unbalanced" slot. Do i have to do anything else for optimal result?
Hi. No, it sounds like you hooked it up as you should. As for "optimal" results...well...if you want the best sound quality you can possibly get, then balanced connection is technically the best way to go--but you need a balanced source for that. Frankly, I think RCA connection provides a better connection than 3.5mm since RCA tends to be less noisy. Moreover, your 3.5mm connection is highly dependent on the amplifier on your A5+, which may not be of the best quality. Anyway, assuming you're a new audiophile and have no idea what I'm talking about: don't worry about it. Enjoy your music, and I hope you like this amp.
@@dokanyon Unlikely you'll hear a huge difference through speakers like the A5+. You'll want to check it out with high quality headphones. I have the Zen DAC+CAN and A5+ as well.
I'm planning to buy an AMP for my two headphones: Denon D5200, HD58X. I have dragonfly cobalt. With d5200 I enjoy it, but for the 58X I feel weak. Others suggeted to buy an AMP. I'm thinking about SMSL SP200 and Zen CAN. What would you recommend? Thanks!
What are you going to use as a Dac? Using the Cobalt as the dac and plugging a 3.5mm cable to RCA is not a particularly good idea. Such cables can easily transmit noise, depending on your environment and quality of the 3.5mm jack. Even a cheap dac will cost you around $100. Factor that into the price of the SP200 or Zen Can. You may be better off buying an all-in-one unit like the Zen Dac. If you feel you really need more power, then the Can is a more affordable alternative with more features than the SP200. Frankly, the SP200's build is not particularly impressive and the THX hype is nonsense.
@@NoThemeReviews Thank you for the fast answer. Yes I'm planning to use the cobalt as a dac with an audioquest jack to rca cable. Honestly I'd prefer the ifi CAN over the SP200, just the reviews of SP200 were too convincing to me..
I am also having a similar issue. I am quite happy with my dragonfly cobalt, but it lacks the power to drive the Hifiman Sundara. So considering the Zen can. Just I am not sure what is the best way to connect the cobalt with Zen Can.
My integrated amp only has preouts for connecting a headphone amp so I would use the volume control on the integrated amp rather than on the Can if I had one. Does the Can produce a lot of hiss if the level is set to max? Does adding gain on the Can produce a lot of extra hiss or is it better to add gain and reduce the volume on the Can?
Ah, the age old question of source volume vs amp volume. I think the typical response is that your source volume should be at max and you should control amp volume. But I've not experienced any hiss or distortion from the Can at max volume--not to say I've been listening at max volume for more than a few seconds. I could be wrong, but it's my impression most audiophiles would tell you to keep your integrated amp volume to max, and control volume on the Can.
@@NoThemeReviews Thanks for the response. Yes this seems to be what a lot of people suggest. It's good to know that it doesn't seem to add much/if any noise to the circuit at full whack as I'd rather do it this way round. From my perspective I don't think it is a very practical way of doing things to set the integrated amp to full volume as I'd run the risk of forgetting to turn it down every time before switching back to the speakers and might risk blowing something (maybe my eardrums! ;)). I'm really surprised that if integrated amplifier manufacturers are going to omit headphone outputs and line outs from their products that the headphone amp market doesn't respond with an option for bypassing their volume control.
can you use rca cable that come with zen can to connect with zen dac，and use 4.4mm balanced cable on headphone to achieve balanced？ or you have to get 4.4 to 4.4 cable which i can not find in my region… does that make big difference？
After searching hard for 4.4mm interconnect.. found and bought a "quality" one at Aliexpress. www.aliexpress.com/item/4001226702899.html?spm=a2g0s.9042311.0.0.a7c24c4dv40Iwb It works well with Zen Dac and Zen Can.
i just bought the zen can with ipower adaptor, my adaptor unit wont plug all the way in like on your videos, i have tried pushing it but no budge, too scared to break the things. also i have noticed some "weirdness" with the input option. the RCA input somehow sounds quieter than the 3.5mm SE input. its like 6db difference also did your unit exhibit some volume imbalance? i cant even use my IEM to the zen can on the lowest gain because of the imbalance
Yes it gets warm. If yours feels like it’s about to melt, there is definitely something wrong with either the power supply or the amp. Send it back for an exchange ASAP.
@@NoThemeReviews hi there i have asked the store and my friend who have the zen can, all of the zen can unit there and my friends unit exhibit the same things like my unit (the ipower plug not plugged flushly, and a different volume between rca input and single ended 3.5mm) ..... regarding zen can sound signature , did you notice the upper treble seems like a bit "boosted" with the zen can? i test the zen can with dragonfly cobalt and zen dac using hd600 and dt990 edition 250ohm the dt990 treble on the zen can somehow sounds more shrill and murderous to my ears
Yeah all of that sounds like you guys have faulty units. It’s entirely possible you and your friends got the same assembly batch with faults. If the power cable won’t plug in properly then that’s a huge issue by itself. I suggest you contact iFi immediately and ask for an exchange. As for the sound, all iFi products have a U-shaped signature and there is a slight treble boost, but whether yours is more boosted than mine, I have no way of knowing.
The HD600 series are very warm, dark-sounding headphones with emphasized bass and treble. Maybe the HD600 is different--I don't know since I don't have them. But the other in the series are not neutral, not by a long mile. The Zen Dac has a slightly warm sound signature, so does the Can. As for pairing of the headphones with the iFi products, you can achieve very good results with just the Zen Dac, which has plenty of power for these headphones. Don't get misled by Zeos' BS.
No Theme Reviews I haven’t got my 600s yet so haven’t got a chance to test it myself, would the ifi zen dac be a good entry into a dac/amp combo with the zen can as an upgrade in the future ? Or would u recommend something like a schiit stack or jds stack?
@@GameBrosTMT The Schiit stack is a good, affordable option, especially if you get the Heresy. That's the only Schiit amp that doesn't have the typical Schiit harsh sound. But a Schiit stack will cost over $200, and for less you can easily get the Zen Dac, which has more features. I think the Zen Can is a fine addition to the Dac, but don't recommend combining the two. The warm signature of the Dac makes the Can a little muddier. It's not a huge difference, and you may not notice or actually like what you hear. For a starter, I think the Dac is fantastic value. If you have headphones up to 300 ohms, I simply cannot imagine you will need an amp upgrade like the Can. If you have something like the T50rp/Argon, then yes, a much more powerful amp will be required. But for most Hifiman, Audeze, Sony, Monolith, Grado, Meze, Focal, Beyerdynamic, Philips, Denon, Sennheiser headphones, the Dac is plenty powerful.
@@NoThemeReviews I only whant it to par with my pc for gaming and spotify. My headphones are the SPH9500, ATH-AD700, AKG K500 all about 32oms. The iFi dac is the best thing that exists for that price ? i dont need the power supply right?
I'd be careful WHICH Dt880 you get. If you're leaning towards the 600 ohm variant, I suggest you watch my video regarding its power requirement vs output impedance. If you get the 250 ohm variant, then any of the three products you mentioned will be plenty to drive them and the Phoenix. By the way, the Can is not a dac, only an amp.
@@NoThemeReviews is there a combo or stack youd suggest under 250? I figured the schiit stack might be the best bang for the buck but i havent decided on the headphones yet and i would probably either get the 600 ohm version if i had to pick one. I figured i could save a bit of money if i got the Phoenix since i dont need as much power. I also think im talking myself in circles so im sorry for the inconvenience
@@dudeekill4win Well...if you're getting a 600 ohm variant of the 880, then I'd stay away from any of the usual suspects. The 880 requires high output impedance, and Schiit doesn't do that; neither does any other major brand, for that matter. I have both the 600 and 250 ohm variants, and there is very minimal difference in performance between them. It's simply not worth the effort and stress finding the correct amp for the 600 ohm version when the easier to drive 250 ohm is nearly the same in sound.
@@dudeekill4win I think the Phoenix is a fantastic bargain, one of the best headphones currently on the market. The only issue of concern is comfort. The earpads are on the smaller side and the clamping for initially is a little uncomfortable. There's no way to change the earpads. I know people have complained about this...but, if you keep the headphones on a block and just wear them as normal, the headband will loosen and the headphones will be more comfortable.
how does this compared when im using a steinberg ur22c to power my beyer dt 770 pro 80 ohms? will i hear a difference? Im using it for watching movies/gaming
I don’t have a UR22 and can’t say. But specs say it provides 6mw into 40 ohms and has a 150 ohm output impedance. If you feel that the interface gets the 770 loud enough and you enjoy its sound, then you shouldn’t think about spending more money. However, I assume the reason you have an interface is because you do recordings. In which case, it may be useful to have a standalone headphone amp/dac. Unless you already have a dac to connect to the Can, you’ll have to buy that piece of gear as well. As you can see, this quickly adds up. I would suggest looking at alternatives, if all you want is a dedicated headphone source. The Zen Dac is cheaper and will easily drive your 80 ohm headphones, and has an excellent dac as well. Or, you could buy something even cheaper-like the FX Audio Dac X6-and get clean, slightly analytical sound. I hope you can tell I’m not trying to sell you on the Can. Maybe your particular needs are different from what I gather from your comment, and if so, let me know. If my reading is correct, then I think a dac/amp combo will be cheaper and more useful to you.
Yes, Drop pulled a fast one. Another review compares the 6xx version vs. the normal edition. Conclusion: Even for the Sennheiser HD650, the normal edition sounds a little better. No reason to go for the 6XX edition, at all. It is almost a scam.
Agreed. It was downright unethical for Drop and its very specific collaborator/co-conspirator to hype the Drop version especially when they didn’t do a comparison to the Dac.
Amp/dacs do not have anything to do with soundstage. Soundstage is entirely dependent upon the original recording and your headphone performance. The only influence amps have for soundstage is power output. In other words, if an amplifier does not have sufficient power for a particular headphone, then that headphone will not provide its best sound quality, including its best soundstage reproduction. Regarding whether this is "good for gaming"--that is an entirely subjective question. There is no amplifier or dac tuned specifically for gaming. The Zen Can provides ample power for most headphones, and has a slightly warm sound signature. How you experience the sound depends on what you listen to and your headphones.
@@NoThemeReviews nice, thanks! based on ur reply I can assume that sound stage with ifi zen can will be better, than with default (inbuilt) laptop dac/amp, because it will simply give headphones enough power to operate on its full potential. and advanced DAC or DAC/AMP is not needed if u already have a powerful amplifier? am I right? I have an other question: I have player sony zx507. I love how it sounds. however power output is not great especially on 3.5 end, thus I want some amplification without changing the sound of sony (sound signature, eq and other dps effects). if I connect sony dap via 3.5 to 3.5 or 4.4 to 4.4 connection, will change the sound of sony dap? how will it effect sony sound?
@@olexandrs6639 I'll answer your questions in order: 1. You're correct that soundstage is influenced by how efficiently the drivers get power. As long as your headphones get power for peak performance, you don't really need to worry about other components affecting soundstage. The original recording is going to be a significant factor, obvious. You don't need an "advanced" dac or dac/amp. If all you have is CD-quality music, then there's no point in spending more money on dacs that render DSD. Of course, each dac has a slightly different tuning. There are warm-sounding dacs like the Chord Mojo, neutral dacs like the NX4 and Soncoz LA-QXD1, and analytical dacs like the ones found in the Monolith THX and Earmen TR-Amp. Each of these will slightly alter the sound. 2. Depending on the power your headphones or IEMs need, you could probably be satisfied with the NX4 paired to the ZX507. You could also do the same with the Monolith THX Portable, or iFi Hip Dac. All of these have slightly different sound signatures. The NX4 is pretty neutral, and likely won't alter the original sound much, if at all. The THX is a bit more analytical, and you might hear slightly greater instrument separation and treble emphasis. The Hip Dac is slightly warm, and you might hear a marginal bass and treble emphasis.
@@NoThemeReviews that's what they said when they had it at RMAF last year they even had a little graph next to it. That's what makes it more specific to 6xx cause it's a very mid-centric set
I have never heard truth from companies at RMAF. It’s all hype. Whether the EQ actually is different will be determined by someone who can compare with the Zen Can. Drop has not earned trust, and the failure or refusal of the reviewers to compare the Drop Can to anything else makes the whole scenario suspect.
I really hope someone can send you The drop pandas. Those have been hyped by every reviewer. I ordered them, but they only gave me an estimated sep 30 date arrival. I feel like I'm gonna get duped.
Ha. Drop won't send me one and I won't pay Drop for the experience. I'm going to keep my mind open about those headphones, but I have a strong suspicion all is not well in Denmark (Hamlet reference).
@@NoThemeReviews They won't send you the pandas because you're not not gonna kiss drop ass. That's what worries me. These reviewers were flown in to a private event. Also people say headband is uncomfortable and weighy. Conform is a major factor of wearing headphones. I don't care how good it sounds if I can wear it for more than an hour.
@@epicmike3915 I figure that just as with the Vokyl Erupt, once the Panda's start arriving, people will off-load them on eBay. I'll probably snatch one up there.
Do I exist or have I been sent to purgatory? Please let me know I am still real. lol........Nice review btw, Drop has been screwing people over left and right the past couple years. I'm still pissed from their old Elex replacement pad drop that went to shit and has yet to be remedied for me.
Eh? Who sent you to purgatory? When Drop first arrived on the scene I avoided them because it looked like a scam operation. Then when it got real big, I gave them a chance with a few products. I got what I paid for, but the whole experience wasn't better than buying from Amazon or a hifi retailer. The problem with Drop (besides their awful, hype-reliant marketing and misleading statements) is that it is a vote-driven website. I keep seeing products that have little relevance merely because some people want it; on the flip side, I see people going crazy over stuff that is either not cheaper (or as in the case of the Zen Can, more expensive) yet people have to wait much longer to get. Drop could be so much better, but they don't care.
I am planning to use standalone dac/amp combo. Does this Zen Can have dac capabilities like burr brown chip or is it only a headphone amplifier which must be connected to a dac to perform well? I am new to this audiophile community and can't figure out properly so your help will be much appreciated 🙂
No the Zen Can does not have a Dac. You will need to connect it to a source like a phone, computer or DAP. Or you will need a stand-alone Dac for your computer.
@@NoThemeReviews so the output from my pc will be enough but the audio quality will not stand upto an actual dac like the Zen Dac. My budget is 150$ so clearly I cannot buy both Zen dac and can. What would you recommend to buy first ?
I have no idea what your PC audio capabilities are. If all you listen to is Spotify or Pandora, then you don’t need a dedicated Dac. If you listen to DSD or better than CD quality files, then you’ll need a Dac capable of rendering those higher resolution files. Getting a Dac doesn’t make your MP3 files suddenly sound like 32-bit Flac. The Zen Can is overkill for most people. It’s the newest shiny toy for audiophiles who lack common sense and hype everything they see. The Zen Dac is a far better option and can easily drive the vast majority of headphones on the market.
No I didn’t do the update. I usually don’t install firmware updates until many months later. Firmware updates have a habit of causing issues and I’d rather let others have the frustration
lol I understand it is a nightmare but it's a major upgrade in the audio source i would recommend people that have the zen dac to do so they won't regret it! as long as they know how to do it. well thank you and keep up the good work
Hey, jut seeing this, what's the actual difference with the ifi zen dac/amp combo, just the power for headphones and the fact that it does apparently not contain a dac? I've been searching for a DAC/AMP combo and some Open backs, the combo for under 180$ and headphones for under 150$, but I'm not really experienced in the audiophile world, was planning to buy something that might power 300 ohm headphones in the future, and pair it meanwhile with some fidelio X2's but I don't really know if it's a good pairing or if there's better options for my budget, hell I'm not even sure how to see if an amp can run X headphones, sometimes I see ohms, and sometimes I see wattage VRMS or other kinds of units!, and it has me all confused + seeing products like this one you presented, that look basically the same as the ifi zen dac, make me cuestion more what is what, would love to hear some opinions or advice from you, peace!
Yeah, the principal differences between the two is power and a Dac. The Zen Dac is quite capable of driving 300 ohm headphones. In fact, there are only a handful of headphones it struggles to effectively power. The Can is not essential by any means. Considering your budget and plans, the Zen Dac might be more appropriate of the two. You could also consider the Fx Audio Dac X6-it’s much cheaper but also has fewer features. That’s the first place I usually start people off when they don’t know how deep they will swim into the audiophile waters. The Can is more future proof in regards to pure power output. But without a Dac, you’ll have to add cost to get the amp to function. There are some good dacs around $100, but Dac + Can will blow past your budget. If you decide to go with the Can, then two decent dacs are the SMSL Sanskrit (~$110) and Jolida Dac ATC Mini (~$80). Both have RCA output and no frills like MQA. The Sanskrit will decode DSD (though DSD is a spurious “upgrade” that costs far too much). The Jolida decodes only 16-bit PCM, which is CD quality. The SMSL is neutral and is a very good cheap Dac. The Jolida is discontinued but still found on eBay and Reverb. It has a warmer sound signature. Both are excellent and cater two different sound preferences.
@@NoThemeReviews Thanks a lot, what do you think about the ifi Zen + Fidelio X2 Pairing then? Or another set of open back cans you might really enjoy under the 200$ price point, unfortunately I need references as the most I have tried of "audiophile" stuff is the M40x's and the Tin T2's but some people told me it's a bad Pairing "cause they're both kind of warm and I've seen your review and others saying well, it's "warm" but not as much or in the same way, if it fits better and it has me quite confused
@@jonathansanchez3494 Yeah, the X2 is definitely on the warmer side. I think it pairs fairly well with a more analytical amp/dac, but we're talking about personal preferences. The Zen Dac + X2 sounds very pleasant, though you do hear melded sub-bass and mid-bass, and the vocals are a bit recessed. If you like that type of sound signature, then you may be quite happy. Any particular reason you're thinking of the X2? There are a number of excellent options of various types for less or about the same money: MDR-MA100, Philips Fidelio M1mk2, Fidelio L2, Sennheiser HD 579, Grado SR80e. And if you can stretch your budget just a little bit more, then the Sivga Phoenix is an excellent headphone--though comfort might be an issue, depending on your head size and shape.
@@NoThemeReviews Well, I've seen a lot of people recommend it for it's vivid sound let's call it like that and it's V-Shaped sound, I also was thinking about the Hifiman He400I 2020 Edition, wich goes for a little bit more, but seems to be planar (Don't really know the difference, but the impedance is similar, so I guess it shouldn't be a problem?) and people praise it for it's sound, at least the past year editions, as for sound signature, I'm not a basshead or something similar, but don't like to hear super cold or analitical stuff, I'm much better with something that isn't as "loyal" as it should be, but I can enjoy more, plus gaming is a necessary evil this time, That's why I wanna try some open back cans, I'm gonna check some of those suggestions you gave me too! And how about the Fidelio X2 + Topping NX4DSD, saw your various videos on it, and seems your quite liked it, it will be for mainly desktop use, as I got gifted a pretty nice DAP, so don't think portability might be a problem, keep in mind I still want to power up to 300 ohms, in case I buy high impedance headphones in the future, it's all about future proofing hahaha
No amount of 3D holographic super surround matrix technology is going to bring the 6XXs sound out of your head and create some resemblance of a soundstage. If you own the 6XX, you've made peace with the idea of having your music firmly stuck inside your tiny ear holes without any room to breathe. I know, I was there... once, some time ago. But I escaped. And I discovered a whole new world of music. A world free from claustrophobia and tiny ear hole people singing to me. Sound coming from all directions, enveloping you, images emanating from the depths of the black background, far and near. No 3D button needed and the thought would be laughable... the headphones have it built in already. This new world I learned has a name. But the name is usualy only given to the brave few 6XXers willing to escape from inside your head. This land is called Arya. Now go fellow 6XXers be brave! Join us in the land of spacious 3D music!
