INDUSTRIAL METAL Essential bands debate with Liisa Ladouceur | LOCK HORNS (live stream archive) 

3TEETH is a new Industrial Metal band

There's still a lot of potential for industrial metal. I feel like it can still be taken to a whole another level. There's not that many bands that play this style of metal nowadays.

It's bugging me that the NIN magnet is upside down. The first "N" is not supposed to be backwards. None of the other bands magnets are upside down. What gives?!? Lol... End rant.

I'm a huge fan of Industrial Metal (and Industrial in general), so I'm going to write a long post that hopefully sheds some light on the music. Basically, it's hard to define Industrial Metal because it sort of splinters into two categories: KMFDM-style Industrial Metal - Extremely rhythm-based, more groove-oriented, usually electronic-influenced, and features a "dancey" sort of vibe. This is the style of Industrial Metal that went mainstream, so when most people think of Industrial Metal, they are thinking of this. Godflesh-style Industrial Metal - Heavily influenced by 80's-era Swans, this style is a lot more abrasive. While most Metal bands use guitars for riffing purposes, Godflesh used guitars to create soundscapes, giving the music a more textured, atmospheric sound. The music is not really "dancey", but has more of a crushing doom/sludge/drone sort of vibe (Author & Punisher, who were mentioned in the video, are a good example of this). As a result of this splinter, you get bands that sound nothing alike being categorized in the same genre, which is where a lot of the confusion and uncertainty comes from. I'm a much bigger fan of the Godflesh-style and have a lot of favorites that weren't mentioned, but they are fairly obscure though and probably wouldn't be considered notable/influential enough to appear on the chart. I do think Strapping Young Lad are unquestionably Industrial Metal. Most of Devin's influences are Industrial Rock bands (Killing Joke, Cop Shoot Cop, Grotus) and SYL sounds to me like a heavier extension of what they were doing. SYL even did a Cop Shoot Cop cover on their City album ("Room 429") As far as new bands, it's hard to make recommendations because although there are a lot of Industrial-tinged bands out there these days, a lot of them are hybrids. Stuff like Blut Aus Nord (mostly the 777 series), The Axis Of Perdition, Corrections House, and P.H.O.B.O.S. These bands combine Industrial with other genres, so it's debatable if they are Industrial enough to go on the chart.

Marilyn Manson should definitely be added, I don't think there's any arguments that Marilyn Manson is industrial metal, and they're one of the largest bands on the list.

Just off the top of my head, five bands I would mention... Soulstorm, P.H.O.B.O.S. Dogpile, Sonic violence, Dead World.

I wish I was around for this discussion. 16Volt, Bile, Cubanate, Die Krupps, PIG, Vigilante is a great new band, The Berzerker should of been added. FLA only had a couple albums that were industrial metal. The main problem with this sub-genre is most of the bands are well hidden in the underground.

NIN is not strictly industrial metal, but they have a lot of metal tunes. especially pre-2000.

Does it bother anybody else that the NIN logo is upside down?

I'm proud of a spotify platilist I made featuring industrial metal Big 4: Ministry, Godflesh, Fear Factory and KMFDM; big names: Rammstein, White Zombie, Killing Joke; death and black metal with industrial elements; Zyklon, Anaal Nathrakh, The Berzerker and bands that carry the true industrial metal more traditional sound like Red Harvest, Mechina, 3teeth. Plus most of the bands mentioned here.

KMFDM!!! Very underrated band. I think they are one of the best industrial bands and they are still rocking to this day.

Awesome. Interesting show as always. Hail Bangers TV.

Nine Inch Nails may not be metal per say, but they're incredibly important to the genre, I'd keep 'em on.

Mad props for Author and Punisher shoutouts. This is a good example of a newer band that is doing something innovative enough to be worthy of note. Watch his videos to see why. He's a one man band.

i love how lisa explained that industrial is its own world that evolved absent metal and then joined into metal. i think that explains more the evolution of goth, and synthpop. which synthpop is very similar to industral metal but without the hard riffs

I loved your first film!! Dad bought me it and watched it several times!!

I want an episode of this with Liisa's goth tree! Maybe on her own channel though. I haven't read her book, but from what I could make out in this video, there's a lot of stuff there I feel doesn't belong. I loved this episode, this was the first episode I watched after a discussion with an acquaintance (and now it's 7 AM, whoops). I happened to mention to them that Liisa wrote a book with a goth family tree, and they linked me this series, and in the first one that caught my eye, there Liisa was, wow! I agree with her on everything here.

Love the series, cannot wait for the thrash ep :)

Love this tree! Some of my favorite bands!!

I don't know... To me Static-X first two albums "Wisconsin Death Trip" and "Machine" have that industrial metal structure.

What about front line assembly

Nice Death Angel shirt Sam.

very nice to see Liisa debating, hope to see her more again

Do bands like Genghis Tron, The Berzerker and Plague Bringer count, that have a grindcore influence?

Would have love to have seen Misery Loves Co. They were AMAZING.

Reaktor 4, Sektor 304, Skin Chamber, Dodheimsgard, Samael, Scorn, Thorns - names that need to be on that list.

What about Pain? I always thought that they were an industrial band. Or are they only relevant to northern Europe?

It'd would be cool if it was available as a podcast! Show is still awesome!

StaticX is industrial metal band. So much skinny Puppy on the first album fist band I heard and called it Industrial Metal

wow, dissing Die Krupps, influenced the whole entire, German Industrial scene

As far as later industrial metal goes, I think Red Harvest is underrated. Sick Transit Gloria Mundi is a killer record.

I would like Lisa's book. Any links as to where I can get it?

Any chance of adding a Post-Metal genre? Or more episodes after Mathcore? If not, is there anyway to hear about some other choices in the tree such as AC/DC and Motorhead in NWOBM vs. Early Metal UK like Priest?

A few interesting newer bands in the genre who have taken the sound in some different directions: Autokrator, Tyrant of Death, and Umbah.

For the record, I was half-joking about Static X being disco. That was based on Static X's own admission that they're music is described as "Evil Disco".

Do they have a category for folk (and perhaps pirate) metal ?

KMFDM could be on here, though I know its a little more rock with dance stuff, I think the two FLA albums count as Industrial Metal too

okay so I missed the stream, and I know that the set a standard to have a guitar to count as industrial metal, but Author & Punisher is absolutely savage, and my favorite industrial experience

Another thing I noticed happening is electronic Bass music plus industrial plus rock-metal, is getting mixed. Like Celldweller/Circle of Dust, Blue Stahlli, Zardonic, voicians, Rabbit Junk, and some Pendulum songs like “Comprachicos”.

will you be doing a show on Power Metal ?

I feel like you could make the argument, and it's a stretch or it depends on how you wanna cut it, that Full of Hell might qualify by blending Power-Electronics and Grind/Hardcore.

Dear Banger, When you revisit this please consider Mortiis, one my favorite industrial metal bands. In my opinion a band aligned with the definition of Industrial Metal. A great band from Norway that was inspired by the darkness of black metal but embrace the industrial part. The band has been around since 1993. One other band which should be strongly considered is "Kovenant" with a "K." Another Norwegian band influenced by black metal with industrial elements. This band's balance between Metal and Industrial teeters to the Metal side. Strong sci-fi influence in look and lyrics. There are some cold sounding female and male clean parts wich add to the space vibe. I know I am commenting on videos really late, for that my apologies. I recently discovered the channel. I loved Headbanger's journey and I am so glad the legacy is moving forward. Thank You to Sam and the whole Banger team, \m/ Cheers \m/!!

I love this about metal fans, if they arent playing in metal band or listening to their favourite metal band, they are debating bands and genre with passion. Love it!

Lisa, good job @ ringing the bell that the most important portions of the show & weighing in on the lest important part of metal; ie needing guitar, calling BS ass list. Subscribed tho, so not a complete troll....

I don't think you can discount Prong by saying they are groove metal if you have White Zombie on the list, stylistically they are very similar. If anything Zombie is the more groove oriented band.

There is actually a new industrial scene from Europe and especially from France... Bands like Herrschaft and Shaârghot are not really famous yet, but they're craving for it and really bring fresh air in this scene.

If you go to bandcamp page there is alot of newer industrial metal bands but probably just not mainstream so that why people don't know much of any newer ones.

Thanks for reading my input during the show! Will these changes evantually lead to a changed tree or can we have a site page that shows all the branch in some way? I can only find your tree via Wikipedia and google images.

Deadstar Assembly, Psyclon Nine, Crossbreed, Front Line Assembly, Dawn Of Ashes, Celldweller, Hanzel Und Gretyl, Columbine, Gravity Kills (Ind. Rock), Stabbing Westward (Ind. Rock).

This genre has so much potential but the bands often fall flat, either being too metal or too electronic. Striking a balance is rare... I think the best band for the past decade has been Turmion Kätilöt from Finland!

I've only heard slight hints of nu-metal in Static-X's sound, mainly in the records that were written with Tripp Eisen during his tenure in the band. The albums with Koichi Fukuda all have a more aggressive and heavier sound, with a huge emphasis on industrial and groove.

PAIN needs to be on here. Also, one band that is moving the genre forward is XERATH, they have strong sounds of Symphonic, Progressive and Groove metal, mixed in with their industrial sound. Check them out!

I'm happy Author & Punisher made it up there.

Sister machine gun. Was such an underrated band and fantastic Metropolis is one of my favorite albums in industrial metal of all time

One band that seemed important in the mid nineties was Misery Loves Co. They certainly influenced me at the time

If you're talking about ESSENTIAL industrial metal bands, it's really only 5: Ministry, Godflesh, KMFDM, Fear Factory, Rammstein. Those 5 are the most influential and probably the most popular. White Zombie is groove metal.

I understand that the industrial metal tree was hard to talk about, but Static-X does count as industrial. They fit the category perfectly. Even in the later days of Static-X before they split the industrial elements were there.

Oh and also...how soon is the Deathcore episode going to be?

I would like to also add some bands not to forget to mention on the industrial metal list: Diabolus Rising / Dawn Of Ashes / Von Mollestein / Swamp Terrorist / Gost.

7 years later I will suggest the Swedish/Dutch band "Peace Love & Pitbulls". Released their debute album in 1992.

Holy shit why I didn't know about this awesome stream?????????????????? D:

Mechina, Sybreed, Pain, Celldweller, Breach The Void, Mick Gordon, Deathstars and others were excluded... Also there are many alt metal/industrial hybrid bands that could potentially fit here, everything from Static-X, Linkin Park, Marilyn Manson, Adema etc.

I can't wait to see which category Gojira is going to be put in.

The Amenta ,Red Harvest ...newer bands that should go on the list

There are a lot of bands can be tagged more than one label. Fox example, in my opinion, Fear Factory's music has elements of industrial metal, death metal and groove metal.

A few comments here: 1. The Berserker is one of the (if not the) prototypes for cybergrind, kind of like Fear Factory and SYL pretty much set the template for cybermetal (and bands like Sybreed, Mnemic, The Interbeing, Raunchy, Dagoba, Oblivion Machine, etc.). I'd argue that both cybermetal and cybergrind are offshoots unto their own at this point. 2. Most people thinking Killing Joke didn't turn into a heavy industrial band stopped listening to them at some point in time. They've made some seriously heavy shit in recent years. 'Hosannas From The Basements Of Hell' is one of my favorites from them. 3. White Zombie never felt like an industrial metal band to me. It was early groove metal. Drums, guitars, bass, vocals. No loops, not a lot of synths, no obvious editing. There was some heavy use of samples, but seemed more for the sake of Rob's love of movies than to too awful much of fusing of electronics with metal. Rob's solo stuff is far more industrial metal, or heavy industrial rock since Sam requires all metal to be X amount of 'thrashy" to be metal... well, unless it happened BEFORE thrash that is. :-p 4. Nine Inch Nails, as popular as they've been, is a somewhat experimental industrial rock band. Like Liisa says, other then Broken, there's not much ripping or chugging guitars anywhere in NIN's catalog. It's a lot more progressive in certain ways than anything, just in the unique ways he puts stuff together. 5. There were a crap ton of GREAT industrial metal (much less debatable than nu-metal or straight up EBM/industrial) that were around during that time: Circle Of Dust, Drown, Misery Loves Co., Ugly Mus-Tard, Red Square Black (John 5's band before Rob Zombie), 2wo (Rob Halford doing industrial with John 5), Klank, Treponem Pal, Skrew, Shotgun Messiah (later), Skold... the list can do on-and-on if you dig. It was kinda a thing. 6. Nailbomb was an industrial metal project/album. It was exactly what Max and Alex were trying to do. Guitars were looped on samplers, drum machines, etc. 7. I hate Manson. I really do. But, his band IS a heavy rock band that most definitely has some roots in industrial... not near as much as others, but it's there, mainly in the production. And frankly, you need to ditch the 'Shock Rock' category all together. It's nonsense. It's not a type of music, it's an aesthetic. There's no musical identifiers for shock rock. It's like "pirate metal" or "viking metal". They're essentially just folk metal with a pirate motif, or a viking motif, etc. 8. Where the fuck is Pain, by the way?

Only just started watching but...they realise the NIN logo is upside down eventually, right?

Any of the last three Shining (NO) albums are truly innovative industrial metal albums with a lot of jazz influences, would definetely argue that if any new band should be added to this list it's them!

Cubanate and Bile and Treponem Pal and Hanzel und Gretyl and Rouska thank you

I know this is an older video, but I just saw it, so it's new to me. As far as newer bands for this list, where is Hanzel und Gretyl? Also, as far as the stuff out of Germany, Eisbrecher might be a good add to this list...

i think this is a very accurate list for industrial metal.wudnt mind if u included kmfdm as well.but still a solid list

Yeah, Mnemic should have definitely been mentioned, and I think there is definitely a case for Shining being linked to industrial metal, especially as an evolution of the genre since they kept asking for something new.

Also I believe Fear Factory, hands down, are the purest form of Industrial Metal

Mortal? Chatterbox? Klank? Drown? Brainchild? Circle of Dust? Lots of the lost gems, and there's many more.

I've watched this episode 6 times now

Surprised not to see any mention of Industrial Black Metal with stuff like Blut Aus Nord, P.H.O.B.O.S. (somewhat), and The Axis of Perdition.

Fall of Because, Nailbomb, Christdriver, Eisenvater, Landfill, Spine Wrench, Skin Chamber, Sin, Bleed - I really miss these bands in your video.

Bands such as Skin Chamber, Circle Of Dust, Meathook Seed, Bile, Skrew, etc... in my view, wouldn't exactly go on the "official tree". But I would put them on a list for those who wish to go even deeper into Industrial Metal. As for Swans, they deserve a nod, just like Killing Joke, for being influential on some Industrial hybrids, including this one. Nailbomb is not industrial enough to belong. It kinda sounds like "Arise" with some industrial elements.

Wow. No one in the chat or anything caught that you missed the whole industry-metal thing in Finland. Bands like ...and Oceans, Turmion Kätilöt, Scorngrain, Trollheims Grott

you guys forgot "PAIN" peter tagtren's industrial metal band.

Front Line Assembly recorded essential industrial metal album "Millenium". Also Laibach's "Jesus Christ Superstar" wasn't mentioned. And no Treponem Pal? Strange. And of course you forgot great industrial black metal bands such as Samael, Blut Aus Nord, Mysticum and Kovenant.

The Young Gods and Swamp Terrorists. They're both Swiss bands and are so metal, they don't even have guitar players.

What about PAIN, Crematory, The Kovenant? You mentioned Oomph, Deathstars...yet there are so many bands wich should be on this list and YES, they arent't from America for the most part.

Nice video but I have to say you guys miss lots of European band such as deathstars, lame immortelle,dope stars Inc and others, but I think fans of this kind of music needed this video so thanks. One more point deadstar assembly a good American industrial band...good luck

Everybody check out the band called “KLANK” the album “Still Suffering” year 1995 it’s badass ! Should be on this list for sure !!

Not an expert on the genre, but always enjoyed it! While prob not so much the metal side....no honorable mention of Einstürzende Neubauten, is surprising!

Honorable Mentions: Grotus, Psyclone 9, Earth Born -Malformed, Red Harvest

Where is Sybreed?

Mnemic and Sybreed were very much industrial metal influenced while they existed. Synthetic Breed from Australia is pretty much industrial metal. Maybe not too famous bands, but I think they were/are popular in the last ten years.

I think one of the most important bands in industrial metal history was Die krupps. Many bands got influence from this band, also Rammstein, who copy a Tier´s riff from The Dawning Of Doom (Die Krupps).

Was Combichrist mentioned?

think Turmion Kätilöt should have a place on this list

Well it's a year later, but I would have liked the mention of Scorn, Meathook Seed, and Treponem Pal, as some early 90s Industrial bands

Pitch - shifter - Industrial, was the bridge that connected the two.

and what about circle of dust, argyle park, Ap2 , Berzerker, old, red harvest

MALHAVOC!!!!! yes...thanks for the mention

Good to hear Malhavoc brought up in this discussion.

What time did this start?

One thing is industrial metal xd but proto industrial bands are: cabaret voltaire, die krupps, skinny puppy, nitzer ebb, bigod 20, front 242, lol

Die Krupps is a major influence and definitively industrial metal! Thre should be a deeper view on industrial metal, it defintively deserve it