Can't really know if they're honest until we see independent testing. Them saying there's no performance improvements can still be dishonest if it turns out it's -10% slower.
I would agree that you need independent testing , but in this case they’re not hyping, them up and they’re saying there is no performance improvement. so if anything, maybe they’re just not going into great detail. So I would agree with Paul that there’s definitely less distrust.
@@mmremugamesmm it's interesting that the 5600/x is the budget favourite now, I found it super solid and my niece who does data analysis turned down a great Prime deal on 5950x, saying the 6c is fast enough. Well that was a bad decision as when it's suddenly not fast enough instead of a drop in upgrade to the build, she'll be needing CPU, mobo & DDR5.
@@RobBCactive depends, the 6 cores is fast enough may be because the tools she uses predate the 8 core standard for cpu's we have now, it wasn't that long ago that an intel i7 had 4 cores/8threads and was the market leader, admitted AMD offered 8 cores but they were not really 8 cores, yet, going to 16 cores on the same architecture when you only need 4 to fully saturate you gain very little from actually going over that count, you'd be surprised how many DAW's didn't support more than 4 cores until a few years ago.
certainly should be, but I guess Intel’s so overrun, that they basically just ghost you instead. What could have been a simple one or two day back-and-forth took about a week, then I was told to expect a call within one business day… It took nine business days. And on that day they told me to expect another follow up in one business day… on four business days and counting. They’re either not trying, or just so bad at it and so overrun that they’re basically inept. And the worst part is, prices to purchase new from Amazon have been at all-time low. If they had just offered me even a partial refund three weeks ago, it would’ve saved their own time and money, and certainly would’ve saved me a ton of time and headache.
Same 💩 with streaming services, if they stop or the licensing changes from the studios then you no longer have access. Physical media is the only guarantee that you own something.
Well de-facto they are able to do it, but you are able to sue too. In the USA the law is the First Sale Doctrine, and makes this pretence at a license illegal, even in the USA (it is entirely illegal in the EU), because if they shut their servers off, you can't connect. The game still runs, but can't connect. Your claim of physical media doesn't cut it, either, because now the physical media is just a download code, you are still required to connect online and download your copy, what you got is NOT the game. Your best option is go GoG, because you can save a copy and if it stops working on the OS, then it stops working on the OS, but if you installed it on an OS you never change, then the game will keep working.
@@timsession6736But then they can make you do anything and have any opinion or streets it is. Dont want the jab? No money. Dont want to drive the truck? No money. Dont want to go protest Trumpists as ordered? No money. Oh and since you rent everything and own nothing to be happy, people will come by tomorrow to take your bed, tv, cutlery, furniture, every little thing. Gotta love rent all right?
@@blakecasimir many games don't have DRM for the base game but there's usually at least some functionality that's tied to the Steam DRM, like additional DLC content. With GOG, you get everything DRM-free.
@@blakecasimir I know what you mean, as I've run steam library games in the past directly. However Steam IS the DRM and you cannot obtain the 'license' without paying them for it and using their platform in the first place. I regret buying Cult of the Lamb through steam and should have done so with GoG.
I can't wait until every gets over their AI infatuation. My company is doing a project to explore it and set aside €25.000 for it which will vanish into the pockets of some slick talker with a power point presentation. My company is too fucking cheap to pay programmers to automate some tasks but surely this AI stuff will magically solve everything.
This is the third "AI Revolution" that I've seen. Well, at least that the tech industry said that we were on the eve of one. The first one (late '70s-early '80s) at least gave us some decent AI-themed movies, such as Short Circuit. The next one (mid-2000s) did as well (Wall-E). This one may give us a few new power plants...
AI is in the "gimmick" stage. It is entering the "wait, this is bad" stage (science AI reprogrammed itself multiple times, to do things the scientists didn't want it to do) We are at least a decade away from "this is useful and doing stuff we want AI to do"
With hitting a wall with Moore's Law because we can't shrink nodes much more then AI is the only way forward if you want to see large gains in generational performance Or you can just settle for mediocre gains like we are seeing with this generation of CPUs from both AMD and Intel
Thanks for the shout out to the Tampa Bay area. Definitely could have been worse but lots of recovery to do. Tons of people still without power and gas is available but requires lines to get right now.
Got to witness Hurricanes Helene & Milton first hand as I live a bit South of Sarasota. Helene was heavy on the water damage and Milton on the wind damage, unless you live near the water. We were lucky and only had a couple of screens rip, but a friend of mine on the water had his pontoon boat blown off his lift and thrown into his house with Helene. His whole house was flooded with around 5 ft. of water. Milton hit him with both the storm surge and more wind damage. Unbelievable amount of damage all over the West coast of Florida and even inland in places like Orlando. Say a little prayer for everyone who suffered during either storm; it really does help. Thanks
This Intel gen being within 5% of the 7800x3d would be a huge win. However, the slides I saw had the u285 slower than the 7950x and the 14900k in many games, and neither of those CPUs are on par with the 7800x3d. I feel like they're still being deceptive, but by claiming to be behind, they're avoiding some scrutiny.
We need new legislation though. Sure, you have always have purchased a license to use the software. It is the "revocable" section that needs to be made fair to the consumer. Technically, you could purchase it, and then the software company can immediately revoke your license, leaving you no recourse, and with a loss of your money. That cannot ever be tolerated in the marketplace. What needs to happen is that the software company, when revoking your license must fully refund the money you paid for the license, every cent. Otherwise the CEO and every company officer is guilty of fraud and have a minimum of a 10 year prison sentence associated with that fraud.
Oh yeah, full refund, you'll get that. And when they close shop and file for bankruptcy, you can hold your breath waiting for your check. You'll get it though. They "promise" to refund. Even with a bank-like system (FDIC), you still wouldn't get it.
100% Correct: If a Company takes your $$Money & then Revokes your Right to Use their Product, that's Fraud: Taking Money & Not Delivering a Product or Service!!
I wish people would learn that EVERYTHING digital is temporary. It doesn't matter if you "own" a digital product or just have a license. It is vanishingly unlikely that companies hosting the files will do so indefinitely. We already see this with music. I doubt games will be any different. Unless you maintain your own backup copies locally, you can't count on a game's files being available wherever you "bought" it any longer than it's popularity keeps it profitable for the seller to pay for storage and distribution bandwidth.
Yes, and the license "scam" should be banned. If it's not a perpetual irrevocable "license" then it MUST have a term in which it is valid. Like a rental.
@@longjohn526 yes because the creator would like to screw over the consumer and not the bean counters. Dude, no creative like the license scheme. They want you to buy their product and use it. They do not want you to copy it or sell copies of it, but that's the extent of their interest. Only companies like the license scheme because it ensures they can limit what you can do with their "product" and limit how much time you can "use" their product before they can "force" you to buy a new one.
10:57 25th anniversary already? I remember the disappointment finding Geforce 256 geometry engine computation was slower than contemporary Intel CPUs like yesterday
"... Tame the four horsemen of the cpu instability apocalypse." Superimposes a picture of the Teletubbies. 🤣😂🤣😂🤣 I'm too old for Teletubbies. But very impressed they are even known about over in the US. Four less likely horsemen are impossible to imagine. "Mr Bean for President" might be a suitable analogy (by a huge stretch of the imagination).
Oh brotha, Teletubbies had quite a large following over here. We do get a little gem from you guys every now and then. Also thanks for: Dr Who, Mr Bean, Monty Python and of course Poirot. All great shows that made their way here from across the pond.
A lot of British shows were on public access channels like PBS when I was a kid i remember watching Red Dwarf and not getting the the plot until 30 year a later 😅
I actually had a Geforce 256 and remember the tech demo of a chrome ball reflecting the scenery around it. Also Halo was supposed to launch on PCs with this card but Microsoft decided it made a better Xbox exclusive; I was not impressed.......
Thanks for mentioning Hurricane Milton and the help needed down here. We are a resilient bunch down here and believe it or not we were overall very lucky with this one. Our governor and local officials are doing a great job in getting things to us and we have thousands of linemen from all over the country helping us get the power back on. That being said, a lot of people need a lot of help and we very much need anything that anyone can help out with.
Really hoping that reviewers including Paul keep the 5800x3D on review charts along with the 7800x3D when posting the results of the Arrow Lake benchmarks. There are still 3 different x3D options available on AM4 for new builds. Curious how they still hold up being older and with DDR4. (also interesting for people still running them to see if a full new build to AM5 is worth it.)
Those of us old enough to recall the early days of PC gaming gladly take Steam admitting your purchase is just a license as they allow you to install on anything, and as many times as you like. In stark contrast to the old days of physical CD/DVD PC game purchases that also came with a printed license key, but you could only install it a few times before the key became useless and you'd have to resort to cracking or DL'ing a crack for the game you already bought. That is, unless it happened to be one of those publishers that allowed you to play to "renew" your key for more installs later on. I have a stack of discs I can install, but only with cracks and lots of community update patches to make them run on newer hardware.
While I don't wanna see intel die entirely, unfortunately they have burnt their bridges with me. currently on my 4th 14900k and i cant even remember how many bios updates and I'm over it. Wont ever be building a pc using their cpus again and I'm sure I'm not the only one.
Here too. I was going to build with i7-14700k, but now I don't trust Intel, even though they say the problem is 'fixed', again. So, it will be AMD on the next run.
I'm more interested in CAMM2 than anything else atm. Supposed to launch on motherboards this year.. I'll be curious to see theory turned into numbers and charts.
Thanks Paul. One thing to note is that the integrated AI that comes with your new 5090 is that it will be "training" on everything you have and do on your computer. Watch out innovators, scientists, architects, artists, you tube creators.
Intel must be pretty confident to price their core i5 like that, specially after starting performance is the same as previous generation and having a shitshow of not respecting warranty claims for half a year until they were pressured so much that they had to.
I'm really surprised that NVIDIA hasn't offered optional 'time-share' buy-ins to their customers for nuclear power plants, so that gamers can power their newer generation of graphics cards.
It's amazing how there is an order of magnitude increase in some of the specs between the GF256 and the RTX 5090. I guess by 2050 when the SKYNET-TX 50900 launches, it'll have 32TB of memory running at 1PB/s bandwidth, consume 5KW of power, 80 Trillion transistors, and cost a cool $20000 - $30000
They're not that honest. They omitted games where intel previously dominated due to the poor latency. Also they tested Ryzen and 14th gen with HARD power limits for performance tests, and avoided comparing power draw to ryzen at all. Day 1 reviews will be even worse than what's shown here. also clearly they used games cherry picked that are tuned with APO.
I think the reason as to why there is such a wide gap between the three cards VRAM amount (32, 16, and 12) is because Nvidia will eventually add new cards like Ti or Super versions with different amounts of VRAM in between the initial release. Seems logical to me anyway but who knows. Time will tell.
We shouldn't need a 90deg adapter. The PS cables or the GPU should have a 90deg connector built into them. I'm a little behind on 9th gen Intel, so maybe new ones do?
arrow lake launched 1 year late, arrow lake refresh and royal cove cancelled. Panther lake replacing arrow lake refresh only showing slightly better performance a lateral upgrade. We're balls deep back into the 7nm+++ era.
Great video guys! Ive veen saying the same thing to everyone for years about Steam and not actually owning the game just license. When discussing i always mention how we would pay $50 or $60 for a game, recieve an actual game disc or cd, case and directions. Niw we pay the same price or if not more and recieve an imaginary invisible game disc/cd , case and directions. Stay well guys!
12VHPWR has been a PoS accessory not "a PSU accessory " !! Intel still has plenty of wiggle room for misleading claims with qualifications like"of the CPUs targeting 125W TDP" when the PPT is 250W which may be the true power consumption in Intel's tests and using slow memory for AMD. Intel also have a fundamental problem of using expensive node and packaging to lose or narrowly win versus AMD's 4nm offering that reuses a 6nm IOD and has proven V-cache tech with 3 years of refinements waiting in the wings. Meanwhile Turin launched and outclassed Granite Rapids with 64c hitting 5GHz on 50 cores at a TDP of 400W. Remember Raptor with P+E-cores going well over 300W for 32t not 100t?
Is it just me who is baffled at the 5070 not for its 12gb vram, which I already expected, but by the rumors of it being $600 or more for a slight performance increase over the 4070ti which is the around same price and performance with tweaking of the best 4070 super models? I've criticized Nvidia before for some of its bad launches (4060ti comes to mind) but this would set a whole new bar at 0% increase in CxB and max power over the last gen. Feels like post Sandy Bridge Intel.
I wrote the following comment under one of your videos back in January. Of 2019... "Well, assuming INTEL started designing their new CPU(s) just after RYZEN first came out (and yes, it has to be a new design, refreshing and pushing will not cut it anymore), we 're looking at 2,5 to 3 years from today until they hit the market and that's assuming that everything goes according to plan, which is doubtful given the setbacks they have been experiencing with their new fabrication process. Let's say another year, a year and a half for platform maturity and for the software to catch up... That's 2023 at the earliest. Oh, and they also have to be competitive in price, which of-course they will never do, INTEL being INTEL. So, yeah, AMD's window is huge..." It seems I was overly optimistic, even knowing INTEL's previous record... Anyways, a new beginning that was due years ago, we'll see.
Im quite interested in these chips and if it isnt actually even worse than 5% I quite like their honesty. Ive been on AMD for roughly 15 years now and Ive always been supporting the underdog. With Intel struggling right now I think its a good time to switch back if the price is right. Always remember theres only Intel and AMD. If one is gone us gamers a seriously screwed even with ARM slowly trying to creep into the gaming market but currently still mostly failing.
The 5060 Ti and up should have at least 16GB VRAM at this point, but I think Nvidia doesn't want to give us that because they want to sell more 5080 cards. It will be interesting to see what AMD and Intel can bring to the table. I fear they will once again dissapoint, but there is a slim change that they might dominate the mid range market this generation
I wonder if Intel will ever release a hypothetical Core Ultra 200G lineup that uses the Lunar Lake iGPU. It would be a good Ryzen 8000G competitor. A possible "Core Ultra 3 225G" for $100, 4P Cores, 2E Cores, with what is basically an RTX 3050 built in. It would be a killer deal for ultra budget gamers. Turn two $100 parts into one singular $100 part, and half the cost as a result. Here is what I'm thinking: Core Ultra 9 285G - $400 (2.5-5.0GHz, 8P Cores, 4E Cores, RTX 5060 speed iGPU) (obv the 5060 isn't out yet, but you get the idea here) Core Ultra 7 265G - $300 (2.4-4.8GHz, 8P Cores, 2E Cores, RTX 4060 speed iGPU) Core Ultra 5 245G - $200 (2.3-4.6GHz, 6P Cores, 2E Cores, RTX 3060 speed iGPU) Core Ultra 3 225G - $100 (2.2-4.4GHz, 4P Cores, 2E Cores, RTX 2060 speed iGPU) Increases space for a larger iGPU by cutting down on E Cores, and cuts down on cost by lowering boost clocks
I wouldn't hold your breath on Intel cannibalizing their own GPU division by selling both parts for less than the cost of one now. Also, what kind of magical unicorn RAM is this using that an iGPU can keep up with a 5060?
@@tim3172 honestly it doesnt look like intel's dedicated gpus are going to go anywhere, they might aswell bite the bullet and make some really good desktop apus
@@tim3172 also it's clear you havent heard of Intel pushing big on extremely fast memory for Arrow Lake, educate yourself before trying to make a point
@@RobloxianX If their consumer grade GPUs flop, they can always just use the silicon to make enterprise AI cards. Nvidia has complete monopoly on that now with triple digit % profit margins. At this point gamers and consumers are an afterthought who get the scraps, while the big boys buy all the $30,000 AI cards. And not too long time ago Nvidia had some +2 year backlog on those from reservations alone. They have no reason to even try to compete as more demand there is for their gaming GPUs, fewer chips they have for the enterprise cards where the profit margins are. Expect Nvidia to release ridiculously expensive gaming cards and them to not even care that much whether the things sell or not, and in an emergency they can price drop the 5090 a bit to sell them too to smaller-scale AI clusters as its 32GB VRAM makes it suitable for it if the price is right. If Nvidia could just flip a switch and turn their gaming GPU division to pump out more AI GPUs at 1:1 ratio, they would, and would only make a few token GPU paper launches this generation to keep their brand somewhat alive, while 95% of the production would go to AI cards. But much to Nvidia's dismay, there's more to making GPUs than just chips, so they can't convert their gaming GPU assembly lines to make AI cards, at least any time soon. This is at least my uninformed opinion which I made the F up while typing this.
Tbh I only thing there being honest because the numbers are low and stagnate enough to where they really can’t fumble the numbers to much this year just sounds rather meh for CPUs.
The new Intel processor low power features I feel are a real plus. I would have bought the 14 core had I waited, but I just bought a different system a month ago. I upgraded my old X99 6950X so anything would be faster. The 13th and 14th Gen sort of soured me on the new 200s and I don't really trust them out of the gate.
Gonna be wild when 9800x3d is 15%+ performance over intels new chips while still using similar or less power. What is REALLY wild is paying for a new platform when 9800x3d will drop into the main board with a 7600x or whatever. Why would anyone choose intel now? Please tell me?
...someone who needs the extra-cores and higher clocks for multi-core tasks and doesn't care about a negligible 5% gaming performance, given the much bigger performance for everything besides just gaming at pretty much same or lower cost? And no, you couldn't pay me to use a 7900X3D, much less buying one.
I am looking build a new rig to replace my old 2016 x99 rig. The deciding factor on AMD or Intel will really be which offers the better PCIe slot choice. I only need two M.2 and two SATA ports but need the slots for all my enterprise Optane drives that I like to use.
Well download sites giving away cracked stuff are therefore in the clear, since it only gives code, not a license, and the code is not sold, so the damage is zero, right.
Intel is at least trending in the direction of less power draw (which will also result in less heat) and if you look at the performance versus the wattage used in that area they are showing a big improvement in performance for the wattage used to get there. Another thing is this is a new architecture for Intel and usually anything new requires several generations to mature into its actual capabilities. Look at the difference in DDR5 ram speeds today versus just a couple of years ago when first introduced and in SSD read, write speeds and even storage capacity as that medium has matured. What pc needs right now is for a top tier GPU company to step forward and challenge Nvidia because without competition in the top tier Nvidia can stagger performance as it wishes among it product line and also charge whatever price they want for that upper tier performance and as a gamer you either pay the jacked up pricing or go to a card tier that does still have some competition in the market. I do think that with Nvidia jacking the 5090 up to 32gb vram they are making a statement the 90 series cards are not really meant for gaming as their primary use and the 80 series is actually their "top" tier gaming card. Rumor does have it that there will be a 24gb 5080 "super" coming at a later date. Whether that Super version will have a further unlocked chip with better closing the gap somewhat to 5090 performance and when it may actually launch and what it will cost are all unknowns as well.
I care not about the gap between the 90 and 80. I understand that not all workloads can benefit as much from scaling out, that power is a part of performance and that the 90 card will not be twice as fast. That being said - the 70 class is a 256-bit 16GB card just like the 80 class card. Anything 192-bit is 60 class or laptop. Period.
@@laloajuria4678 Nope, it isn't a license. That's the law. The EULA is not a license, it is a contract anyway, and you do NOT need a license to install and run the game you bought any more than you need a license to read that book.
25 years ago 😅 Stop remind me of how old i am 😶🌫 I still have my : Creative Labs 3D Blaster Annihilator Pro GeForce DDR in box sleeping in the attic 😴
I love to hate ngreedia, but the memory being gddr7, wouldnt less be ok in that case? The bandwidth should definately be higher. Can someone please explain to me if this doesnt matter? I really want to understand.
They are. They're part of the now-cancelled Royal Core project, which would've eventually produced cores that could each split themselves into groups of, IIRC, 2 or 4 "threads" on an as-needed basis by the scheduler.
Arrow lake seems nice, but it’s going to be the only chip on that platform?! No thanks. I’ll wait for Razer Lake. I always go for the toc not the tic anyhow. They created a lot of thermal headroom with this redesign. Razer lake will probably be awesome.
Why SHOULD nvidia get to have a nostalgic moment while shafting every owner? Sadly, they have total control and monopoly over the market for now, but the second their monopoly is broken by a reasonably priced, high performing, industry standard competitor, I'm gone. So I guess I'm stuck with them for the foreseeable future. Discontinuing the 4090 is low though.
I think i heard there still are more VIAs then first Thought. They are hidden in the CPU Cores now. But dont Quote me on that, i just read that yesterday or something and i am not sure about it.
I wonder what the overlocking potential will be of the new Intel chips. It doesn't seem they touted that from what I read. Interested to see benchmarks.
@@high-captain-BaLrog Geez someone's been living under a rock. I know AI is a buzz word everyone wishes would die already but the boards apparently have an AI that can automatically find the best settings and target stable voltages to make it easier to overclock your board.
So ... Intel knew their 13/14th gen CPUs were trash and they needed a complete new design ... any Nvidia with that 12@#€%^ connector is a certified NO-BUY for me as long as they use that one 😂
bare minimum 12gb of Vram on cards but we need options for 16 and 24gig there's nothing worse then trying to play a game thats maxed out your vram and is now trying to offload, rip 8k and 4k gaming
Intel has been at it a while. It is better to exceed promise of performance than the other way around. Since the 1980s, that is about as far back as anyone knows. No over clocking and cooling makes the difference. If you can't keep your hand on it it is over 80 degrees C and thermal degergaytion has begun.
And what does thermal degradation imply? That a CPU is only going to last 20 years instead of 40? Cpu's last far longer than any users will keep them for regardless of thermal degradation
There is *literally* no such thing as thermal degradation. (That's how you spell it, btw.) ICs degrade because too much *POWER* is pushed through them, which breaks the copper traces over time. The junction temperature is there specifically to *NOT* cause issues. CPUs use the temperature reading to determine if the CPU is getting too much *power* for a given situation. *NOT* if they are "ToO hOt" or "ToAsTy". All of the components in a CPU are literal dozens to hundreds of degrees from the CPU temperature causing an issue.
I'm calling it in 2024. You heard it here first, folks. Zen 9 X3D chips are gonna be shipping with 64 layers of 3D V-Cache, totaling 4 GB. Around the same time NVIDIA's 70 series gets upgraded to 16GB of VRAM, I reckon.
Personally i prefer a slow Intel decline to the point they have EQUAL market share with AMD and arent able to coast on coporate "sunk cost" fallacy any more (i.e. we have optimised for Intel for many years, so why consider changing). Then we would have both battling with each other and Qualcom / ARM for our business?
