As serious as the topic is, I still thinking about the young emperor cutting his sleeve to avoid waking up his partner. For some reason, I find that cute.
@@yourplaylist3411 well you'd better understand traditional written Chinese to read all those stories. Earliest oral record was that Huangdi (the commonly recognized founding father of Chinese culture had Luantong, which is similar to ancient Greek people those older adults usually keep a young companion). To the very early official history record, and most famous ones are Longyang (龙阳) a person who is the "male concubine" to his king, Fentao (分桃) a story between the "male concubine", Duanxiu (断袖) the story mentioned in the video. There's another famous poet describing the Chu King favoring skinny waist in his palace, "楚王好戏腰 (The Chu king loves skinny waist)，宫中多饿死 (many starved to death in the palace)", what is to be emphasized in this is that this "many" means many male officials and male servants. Another sentence from a poet "嬛嬛一袅楚宫腰(xuan1 xuan1 yi1 niao3 chu3 gong1 yao1)" to describe some beauty has light gestures and shapes. Till the Song dynasty, there are also males doing prostitution in capital cities for living. Most of the Han emperors have male lovers, officially, all the way to modern Christianity and western laws infiltrated into China. Some other stories: 1. Wendi Of Han (刘恒 Liu2 Heng4, the name) and 邓通 (Deng4 Tong1) 2. 潘章 pan1 zhang1 and 王仲先 wang2 zhong4 xian1 3. 刘邦liu2 bang1 and 籍孺ji2 ru2 4. 刘盈liu2 ying2 and 闳孺hong2 ru2 5. 刘彘liu2 zhi4 and 李延年li3 yan2 nian2, 韩嫣han2 yan1 There are of course many more stories. There are also many terms to describe relationship between one man and another: 1. 勇巴yong3 ba1, it looks similar to another term 男male 色(originally means color) favoritism 2. 兔子tu4 zi, rabbit or 兔哥tu4 ge1, brother rabbit, this is still used in somewhere southeast of China. A funny story “有与小官人厚者，及长为之娶妻，讲过通家不避。一日撞入房中，适亲家母在。问女曰：‘何亲？’，女答日：‘夫夫。’” Translation: "there is someone who has close relationship with another young man, married the young man a wife, they agreed to not be bothered by notifications by visiting. One day they entered the house when the mother in law was there. She asked:'what relative who he is?', the wife answered:'husband's husband.'"
As a Chinese gay person, I have to say that this video is very informative and what it said was basically true, but with all due respect, I have to say it's a little bit misleading. You guys have put too much on describing the governmental issue in the video, which makes it looks like another movement aim to embarrass the government, and making things a little bit political. Yes, the government DID crack down the show "Addiction" from the medias, but not only because it's gay, it's basically against their conservative mind of keeping the teenagers from any sorts of controversial romantic relationships, like they censored the straight romance show "Boys Over Flowers" a few years ago. Just so you know, the government do allows people doing media business targeting the LGBT community, like the designated social network apps like Blued, Xiandan TV, gay entertainment platform like Fun-Town which producing tons of gay theme shows, movies specifically for gay community, which even could consider it an innovational gay friendly business environment in the world. More and more gay theme entertainment products are produced everyday in China, companies are investing real money in the market, if the government do mind the gay influence towards the society, they would not allow this to happen. It's a huge thing to have a government converts its marriage policy towards same-sex accommodable , it will face great pressure from the conservative society of many backwards regions. Considering China is considerably large both population and geography wise, and a huge portion of the Chinese population still is uneducated or say pre-developed. But actually, in most of the major first tier cities, being a gay openly in working environment (well, middle class and above ...), or in the social network is no big deal, people have no problem at all to associate with gay persons (but within families, it's another story), or at lease won't step in your way while you enjoy your ways. My point is, please do not try to poke the government since there is no official persecution on progress at all, better not let them feel like the LGBT community is a trouble maker, and as you know there are certain NPC members are proposing improvements on the LGBT rights in The Two Sessions each year, so the LGBT is not left over while the country is developing rapidly in every way. The old conservative society needs its own pace towards a more opened mind, since they are not aggressive like those religious countries, while Chinese culture do not have natural homophobic ideology, etc. I'm not saying you guys are not doing a great and meaningful thing, I do admire your devotions and efforts. But political wise, I suggest to progress the movement peacefully and wisely. Pushing it too hard might cause the originally mild environment get intense. Like the recent Taiwanese same-sex marriage movement, the LGBT community and the activists were basically manipulated by the DPP for other political benefits, which made the gay friendly society suddenly disrupt and push the conservatives to a hostile point, that was not something progressive for the LGBT community. I hope you guys would keep up the great job as always, and choose every step wisely. Slowly but soundly, you guys are making history!
I am an ex muslim and I tell you that muslims copied this story and said that Mohammad was sleeping and his female cat (Muezza was her name) was sleeping on his sleeve. When he woke up to go to pray he saw it sleeping and cut his sleeve. When he came back from the mosque, he saw the cat and it bowed to Mohammad as a sign of greatfulness. That is why Mohammad gave cats a good place in Paradise and, some say, granted cats seven lives. --- Of course I don't beleieve it, but muslims in general do.
Homophobia is the actual foreign concept... If fellow Chinese can look towards their own history and realise we have been much more accepting in older dynasty than the western world until when we were introduced Christian and Islamic values...
My Greek is quite rusty, but "homo" means "the same" (like homogenized milk, which is the same all the way through), and "phobia" is a fear, usually an irrational fear. "Homophobia" might then be translated as "fear of yourself" or "fear of something like yourself". It is a very irrational term. Why not call these people what they are: hate-filled bigots!
MarcellusTheGreen yes the meaning of homosexual in it's originality is weird to us and different meanings have been applied to it. This word was made about 2000 years ago, it's bound to change it's meaning in time like all words do. Take the example "faggot" which everyone finds offensive in North America because it's implied as a derogatory word to gay people. However you can't be mad at it's origin as it used to mean bundle of sticks .....so if you are going to attack a word for it's true meaning, why not use this as an example as well? I don't get what upsets people more, the current meaning or the original meaning.
Same applies to India. Hinduism is not homophobic at all. But the British rule in India changed the mindset of all the Indians. Homophobia was a concept brought in from outside. Now, they have moved on . We haven't .
Sex doesnt always get more open in our history. Chinese started to be conservative on sex on Ming dynasty. in Han dynasty, remarriage and homosexuality were not taboos Actually, homosexuality was common in the roman empire. it started being persecuted when the Christianity struck
John Doe Well in the case of the romans it wasnt technically same sex persay. There was still bride and groom. But a man could hold the place of a bride. For an even better example i reccomend the egyptians, which funny enough are the reason why jewish thus christians later hated it.
The Abrahamic god and his followers are shame for humanity. I left the Christian religion 6 years ago and my siblings did it too. Now my nephews and nieces are growing up free from this cult.
Isaque Amaral This is too aggressive a line to take. While I am an atheist, trying to force people to believe anything doesn’t work. They have to make up their own minds, the best you can do is try to be calm and rational when talking with them.
It's probably way more than just 5%. Like... here in brazil is estimated 11%, but only after the society started to get a little bit less bigoted against LGBT... It still have a lot of prejudice here, and a lot of ppl in the closet... So I imagine that's even bigger than 11%. Hope that in a near future, all over the world that being LGBT doesn't mean to have less rights and not feel safe. All my Support for the channel and the community in China
But I thought Brazil was very open and accepted to gays and lesbians? Like, compared with the countries around South America like Peru at least. Especially in Rio where I heard people are more open (lots of Pride Parade, and even drag queen shows / Miss Gay beauty pageants are popular)?
Yes, Brazil have a lot of pride parades and a big LGBT community that actively fight to gain their rights. But is also a majorly christian country, with lots of homeless gay people and with one of the highest index of murders motivated by homophobia and transphobia of the world. In that matter Brazil is a country of big contrasts. LGBT here suffer with a violent society, but can also find shelter. And slowly things are getting better because of those who fight for our rights. As a gay man in brazil I do not feel safe, but things are now 1000% better than when I was a teen in the early 2000 =]
Andre gaytan, yes! Come here, you are super welcome =] As any other place in the world here there is the good and the bad part. But overall I love my country and I think you'll enjoy it a lot too
i am gay in china，but all my family，teachers and friends give the best wishes to me and my boyfriend. Maybe china is not good enough，but not bad！At least，we have no danger in this country，we are normal human beings in China
Honestly, it's such a shame that China has this attitude towards LGBT, because when you look at the history Ancient China was so gay and progressive but because of western influence it all became so conservative and closed-minded. Hopefully China's LGBT community will only grow stronger.
Unfortunately, Chinese history wasn't exactly "progressive" in terms of equality for different demographics due to the persisting influence of Confucianism. If you want an ancient civilization who was supportive of gay/lesbian relationships, just look up ancient Greece. There was a lot of influence from gay people then, such as Sparta's "Sacred Band" regiment and the poet Sappho. China was very advanced in terms of technology and trade, but it wasn't the most tolerant ancient civilization.
Wrong. So is the classical era of the "evil western" civilizations. Look at life in Greece in its golden age, and you will see how gay western men used to be (although funny enough, they indulged homosexuality because they viewed women as lesser beings, thus activities which are considered homosexuality by today Abrahamic religious views, were then seen as companionship between healthy men). Feudalism and empires based on religions are what created the social prejudices against homosexuality. Saying that the "evil western" civs. ruined the "progressive" Chinese culture is the common thing I heard from politically active, but historically ignorant folks like you. The Chinese culture had already no more been "progressive" at least after the Tang dynasty. How could you call a society, in which women are destined to serve their husbands and forced to bind her feet, so that they become deforming small, a "progressive" society, by leftist standard, again?
Eli N.S Ancient Japan, although patriarchal, was indeed very gender fluid or had touched upon it. However, during the height of the Edo Period, the shift to a stricter hierarchy has definitely made gender/sexual fluid notions taboo. One of the best evidence to that was before Kabuki, theaters like Kyogen and Noh require men and women as performers, even playing cross-dress or playing a different gender entirely. So technically, Japan's older era had impacted their own history before European imperialism came.
Homosexuality is not a foreign concept. Homophobia is. Even back in ancient China , same sex marriage was non-existent, but homosexuality still persisted. As long as the family lineage is carried on, a person is free to do what he wants, but albeit a secret. Even the major religions of the time did not forbid or abhor it, instead following tolerance.
Yeah, but I suppose only for men. Any potential mentions of lesbians in ancient Chinese history/literature? I'm curious about the topic, as women were generally married off and had less liberty, but on the other hand perhaps some educated courtesans (like Xue Tao or Li Ye of the Tang Dynasty) wrote of female same-sex lovers at some point in history?
@@Vict0r1984 I don’t think lesbians were oppressed very much in Chinese history, I mean homosexuality and heterosexuality are treated similarly for both genders in Chinese culture.
@@Melcor2304 Maybe theoretically (I don't know that much about confucian ethics), but practically while a man could just go anywhere and in some dynasties there were even brothels of male prostitutes, a woman, once married, would have no way of leaving her husband's home on her own, so she would have little chance for lesbian intercourse except with house servants and/or other concubines of the same husband. (which would be VERY risky even in the unlikely possibility that both of them were gay...) I think courtesans however lived in an environment where it would be very hard for anyone to police their sexuality, so about them I think you are right that they would be oppressed less, and I'd expect especially the educated ones who painted, wrote poems and practiced the four arts (qin, qi, shu, hua) would've written at least once about lesbian love, but I've never heard of any such thing anywhere in China before the Republican government of Sun Yat-Sen... That's why I asked if you knew of any ancient Chinese sources that mention the existence of gay women - I'm baffled how rare this is in a culture that fully embraced male homosexuality for long periods of time...
@@Vict0r1984 as far as i know emperor's female concubines would live together and would even share bed. Bc emperor had like too many concubines of both genders some would die without even meeting the emperor so for two male or female and male and a female relationships were pretty common.
Yes please! I am from China myself, but support the LGBTQ+ since I was small. I still haven't confirmed my sexuailty yet, but my parents are super supportive of the LGTBQ+ too! ( sorry for broken grammar)
I'm lucky enough to have a loving family that fully support me. When I came out to my parents, they said I can either "correct" it on my own, or start a new life in a western country. I never had a choice because being gay was never a choice that I could make. My parents gave me all their savings just so I could study, work and live in the US. Wish I could stay in China and fight for a life where I can live my true self, but that 18-year old boy didn't have that courage. So huge thank you to this channel for telling our stories. Not sure if I can live long enough to see the day when same-sex marriage becomes legal in China, but I look forward to that day (BTW, cheers to Taiwan for the amazing progress!)
As a bisexual (British-born) ethnic Chinese who has recently moved back to China (edit: who used VPN), I'll just say I saw your comment Alex Lee, and was touched. :)
The web series is called addicted and thank goodness it's available on youtube and other websites + two novels on wattpad. I prefer the novels since the web series left so much gay scenes because its in china.
repeat As a Chinese gay person, I have to say that this video is very informative and what it said was basically true, but with all due respect, I have to say it's a little bit misleading. You guys have put too much on describing the governmental issue in the video, which makes it looks like another movement aim to embarrass the government, and making things a little bit political. Yes, the government DID crack down the show "Addiction" from the medias, but not only because it's gay, it's basically against their conservative mind of keeping the teenagers from any sorts of controversial romantic relationships, like they censored the straight romance show "Boys Over Flowers" a few years ago. Just so you know, the government do allows people doing media business targeting the LGBT community, like the designated social network apps like Blued, Xiandan TV, gay entertainment platform like Fun-Town which producing tons of gay theme shows, movies specifically for gay community, which even could consider it an innovational gay friendly business environment in the world. More and more gay theme entertainment products are produced everyday in China, companies are investing real money in the market, if the government do mind the gay influence towards the society, they would not allow this to happen. It's a huge thing to have a government converts its marriage policy towards same-sex accommodable , it will face great pressure from the conservative society of many backwards regions. Considering China is considerably large both population and geography wise, and a huge portion of the Chinese population still is uneducated or say pre-developed. But actually, in most of the major first tier cities, being a gay openly in working environment (well, middle class and above ...), or in the social network is no big deal, people have no problem at all to associate with gay persons (but within families, it's another story), or at lease won't step in your way while you enjoy your ways. My point is, please do not try to poke the government since there is no official persecution on progress at all, better not let them feel like the LGBT community is a trouble maker, and as you know there are certain NPC members are proposing improvements on the LGBT rights in The Two Sessions each year, so the LGBT is not left over while the country is developing rapidly in every way. The old conservative society needs its own pace towards a more opened mind, since they are not aggressive like those religious countries, while Chinese culture do not have natural homophobic ideology, etc. I'm not saying you guys are not doing a great and meaningful thing, I do admire your devotions and efforts. But political wise, I suggest to progress the movement peacefully and wisely. Pushing it too hard might cause the originally mild environment get intense. Like the recent Taiwanese same-sex marriage movement, the LGBT community and the activists were basically manipulated by the DPP for other political benefits, which made the gay friendly society suddenly disrupt and push the conservatives to a hostile point, that was not something progressive for the LGBT community. I hope you guys would keep up the great job as always, and choose every step wisely. Slowly but soundly, you guys are making history!
I saw online that a lot of manwa with lgbtq content were cancelled, other were censored. "China" for example censored all the lesbisn relationship of the two, and the same happaning with a series that i love, revolutionary girl Utena. But my point is, seeing a lgbtq relationship with no malice being censored is bad. I don't think that kid aren't exopesed in media with "healthy" hetero relationship.
My father in law is a gay Chinese man who married a woman. His mother ran a business so he was expected to start a family to keep the business running through the generations. It's more like a contract though, and they have "partners" outside of the marriage. Also, Taiwan is an independent state that recently legalized same sex marriage. Homosexual Chinese should go to Taiwan. ^.^
I mean, it's legal in Taiwan. If you're going to include it in the map, you may as well say that it's legal there, right? Or maybe the video just is older than that/
I used to want to study in china but honestly the massive amount of hate towards the lgbt community is very discouraging (edited) I'm going in a few months anyway😂
العُـنقود Honestly i was feeling very hurt when i made that comment because it was just after i had been harassed about being part of the lgbt community by three chinese people, sorry if it seemed rude
Elise le Roux yah if you ever feel like the US is too racist and bigoted just remember in china you cant legally be gay and in Japan you cant legally show any other culture but Japaneseese ✌
Itz Jordyn That’s what you believe and I understand that, but being LGBT isn’t wicked behavior. I am not going to give a whole lecture on that, but being LGBT is how we are and is by no mean bad.
Elmina Holcomb that's not only what I believe, it's the truth. Now tell me, are gays that parade themselves nearly naked, cross-dressing and performing other sexual acts in the streets not bad?! That's disgusting.
Itz Jordyn I don’t think it’s okay to perform sexual acts in public or wear really little clothing. Any person can do that regardless of who they are and it’s still wrong. We were born in to the bodies we were given and we will always be the same person. We have the choice to do right and wrong. Expressing LGBT isn’t bad, because it is hurting anyone or anything. It’s the phobia of it that hurts others. Anyone can act violent or do bad things regardless of how they identify themselves.
I'm just gonna say that the emperor who cut his sleeves off (and the clothes of an emperor are extremely important in ancient China) is the best boyfriend ever
Great video, but don't include Taiwan in the map of China, as different political realities apply to these two areas. Same-sex marriage has been legalized in Taiwan.
I’m from China, and I respect and love the lgbt community so so much. Every day I hear mean comments about the lgbt community and i am so sick and tired of it. love wins y’all
You just gotta admire the doublethink claim that Taiwan is a part of China, and yet equal marriage, which is illegal in China... is also legal in Taiwan?... Huh? It's almost as if your maps have no claim on reality whatsoever.
Same sex marriage is not illegal in China. Rather, it is not legally defined. There is no law that specifically prohibits same sex marriage. The current marriage law in China is not interpreted by the government in a way that covers same sex couples.
Because of how the law works, I think it was grossly oversimplified for the sake of not having to explain it all to westerners who are coming to this video for information.
@@Jane-id4oq I think, when the law was established, it was actually to protect women's rights, as this made it so that male and female had to agree to the marriage for it to take place, thus protecting women in rural areas, who may be forced into arranged marriages with older men or their family members. That may have been the point, hence the highlighted clause of men and women. Obviously they could have said both parties, tho it may have been a lack of foresight. You may find that china's youths are quite open to LGBT communities, more so than you think. It's not as if homophobia doesn't exist though. I'm writing this 2 years into the future, and hundreds of thousands of people have signed an official petition to legalise gay marriage. I hope that it would be legal in the future.
I m a Chinese, to be honest, yes, it s very difficult for a chinese to get access to thoseforeign information of LGBT or other things. The government has reasons about that. Although things are getting better now, as a gay it is really difficult for me to tell my family that I m a gay, cuz I will be abandoned by my family and be seen as a psychopathia. Family is very important in chinese traditionla culture which leads to "xinghun".So if LGBT want to be accepted by the public, we have to depend on those people who was born after 1995, cuz they have a more open-minded mind, which is really helpful for the spread of LGBT. 加油！
How did Chinese BL works even existed/survived in this country?? And I mean this in the sense that I am impressed and also confused as to how so much art- and literary works that promote or contain homosexuality manage to thrive in the Internet with how strict their society and government seems to be about this topic. Does that mean that the gov's power or control is not as strong or absolute regarding the Internet as it is on mass media like TV broadcasting?
I remember reading a chinese person's comment on something (I don't remember where) but they said something about just using VPN to get on blocked websites and that apparently a LOT of the younger generation do it so mehhh?
Okay, I guess that is kinda mehh. But I'm still impressed because it's not like the only BL works there are on the internet and are produced by the Chinese are online fictions -- there are BL movies and series (actually, they're more like shounen-ai but anyway, that still suggest homosexuality), BL manhua (printed and digital), and even BL cosplays. The community and media is not really quiet, you know? I'm not sure if it's huge or actually just a small number/population, but the culture is thriving!
Dream Cardigan oh it's HUGE, it starts out with one girl in the class who likes BL, then her best friends, and then just friends... and slowly even some guys joins in
Whoa! Man, I'm starting to doubt the video's relevance to the current times now. The video's posted/made in 2017 but the things stated seem so outdated and mythical now. I guess @SonnyGoten89 was right!
Yeah thats right. It sounds really harsh, but people are always trying to find the way. There is a lot of great BL movie actually. "Bawang BieJi" and "Chun guang Zha Xie" are fantastic movies. They are also produced in 90s. The medias never being "banned" that much. People finds everything that is "banned" and post everything on internet. The enforcement is never that strict.
Taiwan, recently, allowed gay marriage and has much more gay rights than in the mainland, without any doubts. I don't know why you included it on the map, lol
so that’s where the term “cut-sleeve” came from !! i was reading mo dao zu shi (grandmaster of demonic cultivation) and i saw it several times but i didn’t understood why it meant gay,, but now i know !! but that’s really sweet, the emperor’s robe must’ve been worth a lot and for him to just cut it off to avoid waking him up? that’s so- wow
Baozi and Hana are a BIG part of Chinese lgbtq+. They’re really good. Recently they spoke about how they got banned from a live streaming app because they “talked about homosexuality”. The thing was that they just talked about relationships in general not specific about homosexuality. They’ve Twitter, Instagram, RU-vid & Facebook (I think). I don’t remember how long they’ve been together for but I think it was around 10 years which is amazing
I love how they didnt say the name of the tv show but drew the clothes perfectly well...honestly if i had never watched addicted heroin i would still be clueless about how things are in china
If North Koreans can get access to American DVDs through the blackmarket, then you can be sure the Chinese also have (easier) access to "banned" items, especially like in the video where the narrator mentioned the Chinese knows ways to access Facebook, Twitter, Instagram through other means (i.e. VPN)....
2:49 I used to watch that show and I was really annoyed when I learned that it wouldn't continue.The story was really well written and the actors were really good at representing a homosexual relationship, it didn't seem fake at all. I still hope that one day they'll make a season 2 but it's been years and I don't think they'll ever continue :( but this video was really informative :)
the video includes Taiwan in China. that's would make people misunderstanding. The truth is, Taiwan is a place with one of the most LGBT right in Asia. The same sex marriage is going to be legal in Taiwan soon.
Great Video! Can I upload it to bilibili, the popular video website in China. I've never seen your videos on bilibili. And there're many gays, lesbians, and others who focus on LGBT.
yes he does. but god views those who are gay as naughty children and he is the father. we can't understand why it is wrong. it's like a little child who tries to drink hot milk. when you are a kid, you don't see why it's wrong. your parents tell you "don't, it's bad for you, you'll burn yourself." however, you may thing, "why can't I? it's my decision, it doesn't affect you, what's wrong with you huh? it's my decision, i can do whatever i want!" but like i said, God loves all of us
Itz Jordyn BEING GAY IS NOT A CHOICE, IT'S WHO YOU ARE BY BIRTH. THIS IS JUST TRUE. So please don't make an idiot of yourself. It's not a choice. It just isn't.
And actually if we're speaking about sinners, we all are sinners. And the Bible says every sin is the same in God's eyes. So you're same as them and you have no right to judge anyone.
What!? China is an atheistic country!? I though it would have a high number of Buddhism! I've heard that at some point the past, Chinese people were very superstitious. Also, Emperor Ai cut off his sleeve because when he woke up from a nap with Dong Xian, his sleeve was stuck under Dong's head. Rather than waking him up, he cut it off.
Atheism is a lack of belief in deities or gods. You can practice the Buddhist philosophy but still not believe in god. Not all religions rely on the existence of gods.
Can you enable me to add subtitles in Brazilian Portuguese? Here in Brazil there are many fans of dramas like Addicted who would like to better understand how things are in China, but they do not understand English. I tried clicking on add translation, but a message appears saying that it isn't enable in this video.
2:50 in case anyone is wondering, that Chinese drama is called Addicted. You can watch all episodes with subtitles at Viki App free. But ahhh addicted was so cute and funny but sad 😭😭💖
I’m from Hong Kong, which IMO is not a part of China. And I hardly know anyone form the LGBTQ community. Yes they exist here, but until very recently I’ve never met any of them in real life. There’s a lot of pressure to get married and ‘settle down’, especially in the mainland. I’m super proud of them accepting who they are and showing it, hopefully, we’ll grow as a community to see acceptance and emotional vulnerability as strengths and not weaknesses
My favourite part was when Taiwan is shown as part of China and the narration fails to mention that the Legislative Yuan is on its way to make Taiwan the first country in Asia to legalise same-sex marriage via a democratic vote.
So I know that social media’s and RU-vid are blocked in China but how do Chinese artists/singers have their own RU-vid channels and instagrams????? I’m just curious, someone please answer if you know how
I read somewhere that traditionally most asian countries accepted homosexuality but then changed when westerners came to their countries and brought their own beliefs. It's depressing...
