Probably not I mean it’s essentially a Monster Cross, I don’t think folks really do hit that hard ground on gravel bikes, on my Norco search so 35mm max I generally only see MTB very rare to see Gravel bikes unless it’s my one club mate who also has one! I personally like the old school MTB feeling of gravel bikes, but would I love a FS gravel bike? Yes would I buy one? Probably not!
Wait till Dirty Kanza can only be won if you’re riding a suspension gravel bike. In my opinion it’s the beginning of a future direction for gravel. Much the same as dual suspension and hardtail MTBs both have their places.
Gravel events in my area incorporate a lot more offroad "MTB worthy" sections that will make for a punishing experience on a rigid bike. In regards to the frame I say yes, but a simpler lower maintenance suspension design like a Moots YBB Softtail or Cannondale's new Topstone Carbon would be of more interest to many. In regards to suspension up front, that is a definite yes from me. I use a Fox F29 modified to 60mm of travel on the speedy bike and a Rock Shox Paragon on my go anywhere touring rig.
Then,right now what I has to do is to fit a 34-50T crankset + a rigid fork + 1set of 700c×38 gravel tyre on my 29er mtb..oh, plus one drop handlebar and we good to go🤣
Nah, not even: go on e-bay and score yourself a touring frame for like 50 and bolt a drop bar on it. And chances are that you'll get coil springs instead of pneumatic ones, so you can actually go there _and back_ without rebuilding your bike.
A guy here in the Philippines, who owns TT bikes in the past changed into an XC MTB with aero bars and rides along with his fellow road bikers. His reasons? Maintainance for MTBTT bike is cheaper than original TT bike. His name is HC MavErick
@@jackdumanat49 That never works properly. MTBs/straight bar bikes are much longer than drop bar bikes and you run into compatibility issues with the shifters and derailleurs if you're putting drops on a complete bike. It can be done, but it's a headache, and even after spending a bunch of money and time you are still riding a bike that fits bad. I know that some people claim they love their drop bar converted MTBs, but I also know that some people like to have intercourse with donkeys, so... I agree tho, it seems like manufacturers are just trying to reinvent the MTB. I fell in the same trap too. I bought a gravel bike and after a while I was thinking about how I could fit bigger tyres, lower gearing etc. I was looking at drop bar frames that could take 2.1-2.2 tyres, bigger rotors, stuff like that. Then I realized wait a minute, MTBs exist for a reason. After a while an MTB, even "just" an XC one makes more sense. Also, not everyone has just miles and miles of gravel roads. A lot of the time I need to ride much more rough dirt roads and trails to get to the gravel bits where an MTB will do way better. But still, i'll always love quirky big tyre drop bar bikes.
@@HollyBoni I built a rigid 29 inch MTB with dropbars using a combo of ultegra / XT / XTR and I love it. In fact I believe that larger tires are the solution, and not FS for gravel...
AG Coarseman You should try the feeling of flying peacefully through the air on an mountain bike. Seriously, roadies don't think MTB can go fast, but I bet you can go faster on some descents than you'll on a road bike.
if you need suspension on your gravel bike, its time for you to get a mountain bike maybe just something like lauf fork or suspension stem i can understand for long stins
Sure, if you don't mind the aerodynamic drag and tire weight and rolling resistance. It's a case of different horses for different courses. If you ride 80% singletrack and 20% fire road, an XC mountain bike is the way to go. But if it's 50/50, I'd start leaning toward gravel, because fire roads are just no fun on a mountain bike. If you ride 10% paved roads, I'd say things are decisively in favor of a gravel tire. My mountain bike is fully rigid, which is eccentric, but maximizes fun on the trails I ride most often: moderately technical singletrack with frequently heavy foot traffic that precludes high speeds. But even though I run some of the fastest rolling MTB tires on the market, it feels like I'm dragging a boat anchor when I have to ride pavement.
That's like saying if you want your slammed road bike to be more comfortable, get a dutch bike... You don't need to go to the extreme to solve a problem. Often a halfway house is the best option.
@@grumpynerd well you could get a second set of wheels and fit gravel tyres or what we used to call dual purpose in the old mtb days. Gravel tyres will be no good in serious wet , muddy tracks either. The industry is trying to build the everymans bike which the hardtail 29er was touted as previously. My trails are xc so i b have a dedicated xc bike my road riding is leisute and fast group hence a road bike. A road bike with more clearance would allow gravel ability with a crank change. Ideally id get another fully rigid gravel bike but can't justify that outlay.
@@grumpynerd Depends,of course,on the type of gravel roads near you. We have lots of gravel roads here but they arent the smooth ones they show in videos for gravel bike rides. Gravel can be deep,gravel can be rough. It can be almost too steep to pedal up along with deep gravel,thats what happens around here a good bit. So far I like my 29'r XC Kona pretty well for gravel. Makes fast rough downhills WAY fun.
@@bradsanders6954 Same here. We have pretty clean rail-trail paths here in southeast PA. I recently switched to a hardtail XC bike from cyclocross bikes. Not getting rattled on the straights and having a true granny gear and having more traction on the turns is, for me, worth the aero and rolling efficiency hit. I do miss the drop position though...
Essentially this is the same scenario we encountered way back when mountain bikes first introduced suspension. In the early days I prefered a rigid mountain bike then as suspensions evolved I much prefered the suspended bikes. From the perspective of a recreational rider I definitely see the benefits of the MCR now and into the future.
This is a great take and I agree, for mixed terrain riding this sounds really cool. I live in Scotland so we have plenty of hills and rugged trails but I also enjoy doing road/cyle path cycling to get to those places (rather than taking a car) to me, this bike and the others like it seem like a cool option to have available.
I just got back into riding a bicycle. My old Peugeot that my big brother gave me in 1988 for my 25th birthday is a road bike. I tuned it up and trained on it for a few months and got my first James renegade gravel. I'm loving it! Thanks for your show. Y'all are truly inspiring!
Anthony B to expand on that, you’re able to have the speed of a road bike with the capability of a gravel bike (which is just a road bike for mountain bikers)
Sir Si. You really must be the best reviewer/commentator of cycling . Well spoken, clear, informative with just the right amount of personality. Very appreciated .
Remember when it was weird if you saw a mountain bike with drop handle. Crazy how things change. Have to thank all those pioneers though that didn't give a crap what people thought.
I can tell you first hand more suppleness on your average gravel bike feels great! Anything less than 40mm tires and your missing out on some real fun. But I can’t imagine needing any more suppleness than the 650B x 47mm tires on my Open U.P. I bomb down gravel descents with no problem and don’t have to lock out anything on pavement.
@@CanIHasThisName You know what? For me half rodie half MB I hate suspensions and how much they require attentions and money. I want my simple steel bikes back :(.
I would go with the full suspension on gravel. I just feel out of place and feel like I’m putting excessive strain on a rigid bike off-road. And I’m just worried about getting a puncture the whole time, even though I never get them. It’s extra stress I don’t want. I also think we’re going to see a lot more suspension for road as well. Especially for touring and gravel exploring type bikes, I think we’ll see some form of suspension. And they’ll probably mostly be e-bikes too. I think people who aren’t riding for competition will start taking comfort a lot more seriously.
I think if they managed to come up with a half-way house of half the suspension travel for half the weight penalty, and not loosing so much of that direct feeling, I'd be interested.
I love you GCN. I'll admit, I was surprised that the MCR was slower. But I'm curious: if the test had been longer, say 30 minutes or so, wouldn't the MCR have pulled ahead? Isn't the point of that extra suspension to help in the longer run, when the body is fatigued and running on willpower? I'm a fan of the simpler more stripped down bike (for aesthetics and maintenance purposes). In fact my main gravel bike is a retromod Peugeot PN-10 from 1973. But... I'm also a fan of accurate info and I'm afraid the hasty conclusion from this video is that full suspension gravel is slower. I'm not so sure. Anyhow, could you do that test again? hehe ;)
Full suss looks great, more choice is always better. The extra comfort will probably be more attractive to those of us carrying a bit more wear and tear, with less of a desire for KoMs and looking towards more fun.
I have just purchased the Rawland xSogn Gravel bike (I’m 6’1 and it was the only large frame available for sale in the U.S.) so I had to buy it. I only went on it for one ride and I could already tell you that it’s by far the best gravel bike I have ever ridden. 😊
I'm all for choice, and am sure someone will buy it. For me though I'll stick fully rigid: my gravel bike is used as a road bike which is capable of ring taken down some lighter trails and it's great fun!
Funny because people were saying the same thing about Gravel bikes a few years ago. Even on this channel, some were saying they would just use their road bike to do gravel riding.
I don't get much time for pleasure riding and I like to make my daily ride to and from work as exhilarating as possible. So, for me, the MCR looks like the ultimate commuter bike. I often wonder what damage I'm doing to my bike and wheels as I hop on and off curbs (not condoning doing that of course) and crash through London's many potholes. I grew up riding mountain bikes and only recently switched to road bikes, but old habits die hard.
@@THE_W0RLD_1S_Y0UR5 You don't lock a bike, in public, in London? Despite all the bike carcasses everywhere? I left my new bike out once and the saddle disappeared on the first night, and the lock was attacked (but held) another time. How exactly do you define "public"? And what kind of garbage bike do you ride that nobody wants?
@@KimonFrousios I actually have 5 bikes of varying value, both monetary and sentimental. But my most expensive bike I would never lock up for any period of time, I have learnt my lessons previously. As I said, I am in the privileged position of being able to take my bike into work and have space in my flat for it (or 3 lol)
i have honestly been waiting for this to happen, since many of the cross country profesionals are riding full suspension bikes and they win often do i think just give this some time and i think theyll soon be the norm. i also think that gravel races will become more technical as this tech matures. but honestly, i personally thought that a hard tail gravel bike with front sus would become the norm before the full sus bikes would start ariving on the market.
I’m about to turn 50 and started riding a bike again because of knee problems. I’m in decent shape but was very worried about how my breathing sounded after a long climb because no other videos I’ve seen had riders breathing heavy. Thank you for not editing that out and making me feel normal
my idea of perfect gravel bike is: steel frame, 700/650bX40-50, if needed suspension seatpost and / or stem (cane creek or red shift) . Simplicity, effectiveness, durability, fun...less is more
This was a nice surprise when jumping on my trainer this morning. You see I bought this full suspension gravel bike used, and unseen halfway across the USA in Arizona. I thought I would give it a try instead of renting on an upcoming vacation. Three vacations not renting pays for it is how I justified it. Thank you for flying all the way to Colorado for this fine review!
More like an old timey XC bike with all the modern components. Modern XC bikes are 100% mountain bikes. Not just in geometry and riding position, but also in handling. You can ride Enduro tracks on them. Not competitively, but you can.
Or its a road bike for XC Mtb guys. I was seriously considering getting this but it came out a bit late, I instead got a traditional Fat Chance Chris Cross for road and single track riding
Pity you all stayed on the smoother bits. That trail has some nice rocky singletrack in the trees. Would have been nice to see how it handles it...love fort Collins though, nice to see it filmed so well!
While cool, the MCR complexity level is at a 10. A Moots Routt YBB with a Lauf brings that complexity down to a 3 with similar results. The squish probably isn't as good but not having to deal with lockouts, suspension service, and a boat load of bearings, it's a winner in my book.
I'm awaiting delivery of one of these now. I mostly got it for comfort and versatility. I have ridden a basic commuter for years but stopped riding and wasn't even sure why. A year or so I bought a bike for my son that is pretty lightweight and had front shocks. I took it for a spin, and fell in love with the suspension. I can't wait to start riding again!
Full squish gravel is a bit of overkill IMO. Elastomers in the head tube and seat stay as well as tire choice/pressure would be the better choice again IMO. Handlebars being shaped/tuned or tuned seatposts also are nice😁
My typical gravel ride is between 45-60 miles. I always try to incorporate as many different riding surfaces as possible to keep it exciting. Out here in Oregon we have rutted logging roads, washboard farm roads, technical single track, old asphalt strewn with unavoidable pot holes and very rough pit run stretches. I've been riding the Diverge Evo for two years which has a 20mm spring in the headset. Often I question why not use a full suspension xc race bike instead. Well it's the gearing. I cannot find a frame that with accommodate a 40 tooth front chainring that is great for long descents and flat road sections. If someone made a sub 20lb. Xc MTB that did I'd buy it.
COME TO FORT COLLINS AND DO A MEET AND GREET! I would have loved to say hi since I have been a die hard fan since the “what not to wear and eat” era. Even an organized group ride or something would be really fun to attend and could give Niner more traction on their new bike 😉 glad you enjoyed the trails and flavors of FOCO.
Yeah, I have been saying for a while the light weight rigid xc bike we road in the mid 90s were gravel bikes of today. The bar end position that has been banished by most mountain bikers who were embryos in the 90's is basically the hood position.
I'm definitely a traditionalist. I love my 1990s hardtail GT MTB. Smallish frame, high seat post gives a fast, nippy and responsive feel. It is fun, strong and not too heavy. Great for touring on cycle trails with semi slick tires.
Manufacturers have been toying with suspension for rough road races for a while now so it does make sense for gravel and off road riding where an XC mountain bike might be a little bit overkill (especially as they’re becoming slacker with more travel due to increasingly more gnarly World Cup courses). I do however think the Niner MCR is just the beginning and that future designs will be sleeker and lighter as everything else in this industry. What they have done very well is keeping the front triangle wide open for full frame bags, just like a “normal” gravel bike. For now though, I ride a steel frame with 650b wheels and Redshift Sports Shockstop stem and seatpost for comfort over the gravel roads. Seems like a happy medium between road and XC.
Why can’t anyone ever just comment, “ Cool! Another option for someone who needs/wants it! But NO let’s whine and cry about it. I know, l know, you don’t even need a “gravel” bike period! “Just the bike industry trying to sell you something you don’t need.” 😒 Meanwhile I’m going for an adventure ride. Linking road with gravel with dirt with single track with double track on conservation land with...
well for adventure rides there is some loss of area inside the frame triangle where you could put a bike bag previously, and depending on how far and remote you want to go, it's better to opt for something simple that you can maintain, you don't want a roadside rear shock repair do you? But other than that, it is a bkie made for that sort of thing I guess...
Can I really like the ideas of a gravel bike and not ride it on gravel? But allow it to be my road bike? Is it fast enough to keep up with the roadies?
Wow, I'm impressed. First it was recumbents, now suspension! I thought these where bad words in GCN circles! I wish this was available years ago as the roads where I'm from haven't been paved since there first paving and are full of pot holes patched or otherwise. Dirt and gravel roads are smoother then the "paved" roads we have here.
went from germany to the southern french coast this summer on a cheapo steel road bike with 32mm tyres.. had an absolute blast. only thing i was missing was a granny ring for the climbs. and more power banks ;)
Aaaaannnd Trek has just unveiled a new kind of rear suspension for XC softail bikes, wich looks better for gravel than a proper shock like this one. Bad timing for Niner maybe .. And is there a bottle cap as a steering cap in those bikes ? Nice video btw !
Ever since I put aerobars on a full suspension mountain bike I've been waiting for something like this. Thanks. Probably a very good mixed surface commuter.
For those of us that enjoy engaging in more than one cycling discipline the MCR ticks a lot of boxes. Exploring the road less travelled in more comfort enabling longer time on a bike with less fatigue. Thats a winner in my book!
I wish you had done another timed run on the MCR, dampening the suspension on the flatter sections. I ride a Cannondale Slate and the 30mm of front travel is brilliant. I often switch it on and off on the fly on a given ride.
Put riser bars on that and it's a mountain bike. You're not fooling anybody with all your talk of geometry, we know an MTB when we see one, and this looks suspiciously like the GT Helion.
Like all the GCN vids, this one is another treat to watch! I enjoy all the experimental projects and bikes you showcase. I would love to give the full suspension a try. I think the future of gravel bikes (with full suspensions) are looking good. I have found that many of the older riders (myself included) prefer the more gravel orientated stage races. Less agressive terrain but still long distances, in which case a bike that delivers a smooth and fast (yet sturdy) ride will be preferred. I honestly think the gravel bike is the bike of the future because of its dual application on road and gravel. I was in a specialised bike shop a few days ago and I was dumbstruck at all the cyclo cross variations currently available. I wonder if suspensions will ever come into play on tarmacs...
Ok...that rear suspension lockout is really cool. I am a traditionalist, but if I were riding a lot of rough stuff (and had the money) I would be tempted by the full suspension bike to use as a mountain bike, since doing big jumps and high speed downhill isn't my thing. I like the looks and all the mounts on their traditional gravel bike, too. And that it has the guides for dynamo wiring is awesome for touring/multi-day adventures.
It's a continuum: [road] sprinter bike to aero bike to climbing bike to endurance bike to gravel bike (CX is around here somewhere) to hybrid/flatbar bike to [MTB] hardtail bike to XC race bike to trail bike to enduro bike to downhill bike. It's an infinitely dense like where you can always find/make a bike in between the "established" categories.
Global Cycling Network in a way. If you think about a rainbow, the light refracts into all different wavelengths. The visible light on the rainbow ranges from 380 to 750 nm. Continuously. But we see about six district colors. Bikes are that way, there’s bikes at every spot on the continuum, but we only see six categories.
I'm guessing it will do/sell well. If I didn't already have several full-suspension XC bikes, and now a comfortable rigid gravel bike, I would consider adding the MCR to "the collection".
Excellent video Simon never disappoints ,,horses for courses as far as full suspension goes , I am tempted to get. Louf fork but will have to wait and see
Cycling Marketing Department: I wonder how many different categories of bikes we can trick people into thinking they need? Cycling Community: Holy crap a new type of bike....I MUST HAVE IT!
Normadic N tbh, how much difference 5mm of rubber is going to make? I’m not sure if you are serious but in case you are, not all roadies will take 28mm tyres but I run standard tubes in mine without any issues. Conti 4000 are nearly 31mm blown up. Most disc brake bikes take bigger tyres now, gravel or not
@@normadicn5700 23mm tires are just fine. You're certainly not going to go any faster with 25 or 28mm tires and I suppose they're more comfortable, but only if you're going on bad roads
Four seconds difference... that's just noise, statistically speaking. The difference may have been that you were fresher on the first go round (with the rigid bicycle). Or that the rigid bicycle just felt more "normal" to a roady. Cool comparison, but, it may just end up being a decision based on the type of outings you think you might most encounter.
Agreed. Few of these comparisons have any statistical validity without replication and randomisation. Rider could have been more tired, conversely more familiar with the course. Perhaps the weather was warmer for the second trip, or a stronger wind. At the least, the trial should have been repeated with a different order of bikes used. Better would be to repeat in randomised order several times and t-test to see that variation due to chance was not bigger than variation due to the bikes. Sorry to be boring. A fun, quite useful video all the same.
@@merlinthebikewizard4392 Only the modern ones. The 90's MTBs had a short frame and monstrous long stems with up to 130mm. Perfect fit for drop bar conversion with normal stem. ;)
I am a very old school rider. I have 4 bikes, City, Fully, Race MTB and a Road Bike. Last week i was in the Swiss Alps, riding Mt. Passes. and decided to mount slicks on my Hard Tail Race MTB. I left the Rock Shock on the bike. Yes, it was heavier than the road bike.... Slower than the road bike... I ran of gears on the descents... And i got passed by a bunch of roadies. ;-(. So what were pluses?; I did two passes in the rain, and the disc breaks worked very well.... It was stable on the descents... It was more comfortable.... I am returning to sports after two years of injuries, so comfort and stability (vs agility) and breaking were the reasons i went with the MTB with slicks. It worked great. I was able to do 6 passes in 3 days. (Susten, Grimsel, Furka, Gotthard, Oberalp, Lukmanier). Yes, at times i did miss the efficiency of a road bike. NO; Fully Gravel Bikes are not a thing of the future. Better to with a Hard Tail MTB and small tires. The longer chain stays adds comfort and stability and the long seat post, short and long frames gives added agility.
Soon they will put flat bars on these, wider tires and change geometry for offroad use. Ist just some parallel evolution :D I mean the first mtbs originated from roadbikes as well 😂
For me part of the beauty of gravel bikes is durability and simplicity. Can’t help but think if you need suspension a 29er mtb would be the way to go. But hey, why not, what a cracking bit of kit! Does make me feel a bit old though, I hung onto my rigid mtb for years scoffing at those elastomer forks...
Hi GCN ....Opinions from the Phililppines...hi everybody, I would just like to share my thoughts about full sus "gravel bikes",and I think that my sentiments are also shared by other filipino bikers as well. I reay do think that having an affordable full sus bike would greatly benefit my country and our bikersas well (not to mention, the manufacturer that would also look at this as a viable market). You see, while the rest of the modern western world get kicks out of riding in "rough surfaces/gravel" our bikers deal with this on a daily basis, our "paved roads" will be already be like being in gravel for people that our not from our country (I know its funny, but its unfortunately true, hahahahh) Many of our citizens here would like to just bike to work but find hardtail mountain bikes as too cumbersome in terms of weaving the bike in and out of traffic, also because these people already felt the hassle of the bike "being too big" they also feel that it is more of hassle to park as they see mountain bikes as being "big and heavy" .If filipinos would have an option to have an alternative aside from hardtail mountain bikes (that have front sus) as a viable evryday mode of transportation, I am pretty sure that more of my countrymen will get into biking. This will of course have 2 benefits, no. 1 would be that our country and countrymen would become heathier and the second will be that country's economyw will greatly improve. As I dont see the state of our roads improving soon, having a bike with "roadbike like" geomtry that offers the most comfort given our roads will be the best thing that we can utilize as a tool. In this aspect, this bike that we know of as a full sus gravel bike can be a full pledged commuter bike here in the Philippines, and I am not saying this cause I think that full sus gravel bikes are cool(althought, I really think they are.hahahahha). I am just stating the facts that if a bike company would have a look in this market ( shout out niner!!!!!!l ) they would not only have a healthy profit , they will also have claims that they helped improve a nation's development, now how is that as an entry in a company profile, right?! This is provided of course that the manufacturers will be able to provide filipinos with great prices. I understand that in the bike manufacturers perspective it is not that simple, ( there are other factors like logistics , r and d etc etc)but if these big name brands will not be able to give an affodable offering then its just 2 things, first. Its because the manufacturer just cares about profit and money, and second, their engineers do not know what they are doing. Thanks for your time in reading guys...peace love happiness to evrybody!!!!!
I love my gravel bike, it’s fully rigid, narrower tyres than my mountain bike. It makes tame fireroad and single track rides more enjoyable. I fail to see why a full sus gravel bike is needed, I may as well use my xc mtb
Isn't the Lauf to springy without actual damping? From the point of view of driving dynamics, the undamped Lauf should have less grip on bumpy terreain than a damped fork and in some occasions even less then a rigid fork.
I'm super excited to hear about the full suspension bike. I'm currently riding a gravel bike (Bergamont Road RD 7). But during my last tour I hit quite a couple of cobble stone streets. Traveling straight through Germany that is something entirely unavoidable. And it's not something that you want to ride on, especially if you carry everything (tent, cooking equipment etc) with you in late autumn. Therefore, hearing about any potential improvement of gravel bikes is fabulous. The only question remaining is: can you mount a Tubus on the front wheel for low riders such as the Vaide Road Master Front bags?
At this point isn't that just a mountain bike with drop bars? To be honest it is more of a mountain bike than my current mtb. I still rock a trek carbon 9700 mountain bike from the mid 90's. No suspension, and a triple.
MCR is a niche within a niche to be sure. Probably would be a very good tool for things like Rollins Pass or the Switzerland Trail (both rails-to-trails) where the terrain is a little rough for a rigid bike but not quite enough for even a 100mm XC race bike.
