A manufacturer needs to do both. It needs to be painted or e coated and then a wax coating over the top. Up here in the north east on all fords I coat the frame with a wax coating to help prevent rust and even after a couple years in the snow and salt it still looks brand new
I live in Canada and we undercoat our trucks here to help fight corrosion and the undercoat seems to make the wax droop and fall off. The painted frames are the way to go. I wish GM would wake up and listen to their customers
I live in the salt belt in Canada and GM frame's rust the most. I drive a huge amount of ram, ford and gm fleet vehicles. Any GM truck older than 2007 is rusted out and frame with hole's.
I never knew that, but I’ve always owned Ford trucks. Seems odd to me as well. Seems like it could easily get brushed off when driving through brush or off road.
Well obviously they all rust eventually, but here is Michigan the waxed frames rust 2x quicker than the E coated frames from ford and Ram. We had two Silverados and it would rust within a year or two, even with proper care and maintenance. Everyone I know that owns a Chevy or gmc complains about it.
Hi Mr...I work at the plant that your frame was built in. In St Thomas Ontario Canada. Lots of salt up here.😭😭.. they have used this wax since 1999.. so these frames are dipped totally submerged in a wax tank it's very hot. So there is no place were there is no wax. We have frames that have sat outside in the sun for years the e-coated bolt on parts are rusty but the frame looks like new. The wax has its pluses and minuses. Both my 2002 and 2007 Chevy Silverado fram has held up great. Good steal. And that's saying something in Ontario. Anyway if you have any questions about the process there might be a video on utube about it. Look up Formet Industries. Magna. Or ask away. Have worked there since 1998.
That was one of the first things I noticed on my 23 Silverado 2500 was the coating on the frame, and wondered how it would hold up, I have a 2011 f150 I bought new and the frame still has most of the coating with minimal rust, and I’m in southern Ohio where we do have a fair amount of salted roads in the winter.
Wax frame is great as long as you don’t power wash it all the time thinking your helping. I worked in public works and we had a robust drive through wash with underbody spray. Kept corrosion at a minimum but not much wax left at end of life on the GM’s.
Very accurate. Pressure washing is the worst thing you can do to it. Just normal water pressure rinsing it off is good enough. I would personally assume they went with E coating or paint or whatever because the wax does look dirty but it seems to do a good job.
My Gramps used to say on a quiet night you can hear a Chevy rust, and he wasnt wrong. In a couple years these trucks will be well on their way to rotting out. But hay the heated steering wheel is bomb.
I would think that coating would come off with debris Hitting it while driving exposing the metal. Seems like it’s a quality issue that other trucks are winning on. Your thoughts?
I would have to disagree with with your analogy. We are in the northeast with plenty of salt and liquid calcium. Trucks that have E coated frames corded and rot many times quicker than wax coated frames. I believe the product that G.M. Uses is a product called Waxoil and can be sourced on the internet. I have it on hand and touch up anywhere I see any missing which happens when I put it on the lift for service. As far as getting greasy hands, that’s what they make hand cleaner for.
I’ve seen the opposite. Every wax coated GM frame I have owned looks terrible after a few years. E coated fords I have owned look much better, the bodies would rust but not the frames. Now with the aluminum body we will have to wait and see.
Here in Wisconsin, the GM frames start rusting first. It's almost like the wax disappears when salt and road debris wear it off. Then it has little to no protection to prevent rust.
I’ve owned two silverados and they both started rusting out after a year or two in Michigan. I know so many gmc and Chevy owners that complain about this problem. You definitely are being bias if you say the e coated frames rust faster because that is a absurd and incorrect statement. The only reason they do it, is because it’s cost effective for the company and them stating it’s “self healing wax” is absolutely not true either. I’ve owned Toyotas and fords and their frames still looked excellent after a years of Michigan’s salted roads during the winter.
The GM wax on my 16 2500HD 6.0 is from the northeast and plowing snow still in new condition/excellent you know why? Fluid film/wool wax is your best friend I dose it heavy every where in all panels lol 🤣👍😎🤛
It would be interesting to see if a truck with that coating fares well in the rust belt vs an e coated frame. From what I’ve seen visiting family in Iowa, body panels rust out way faster than frames. It’s not uncommon to see trucks less than ten years old with big rust holes in the body. It seems that with all the advancements in auto technology, that battle has been lost!
@@MrTylerg506 do you own a lift and $1000 worth of application items to do the job? Not everyone can just apply Woodwax I paid a guy $250 a year until his prices skyrocketed. Now I letting it rust...
@@lastcall170 I’m lucky because I do own a lift so it’s easy I would rather have it all greasy and coated underneath and no rust instead of rust falling in your eyes
I heard a GM engineer say it was better than paint, not sure why, doesn't sound right too me. It does work fine in the south though. Does anything work in the rust belt other than coating the underside once a year ? I haven't ever lived there but I would be a nervous wreck owning a new 70k truck of any brand after the pictures I have seen of vehicles there.
From what I've seen, the only way to keep it at bay is to keep the salt washed off in winter and to use a lanolin undercoating like Fluid Film or Woolwax every year. Repair Geek has a lot of great videos on undercoatings, and how to use them for the best protection. I think his tests ended up putting PB Blaster's undercoating as the best, and it's also very similar to Fluid Film/Woolwax.
I have a 2022 Chevy Silverado RST with the diesel it’s a great truck but I for the life of me cannot figure out why GM sticks (no pun intended) with this wax coating technique it is so vulnerable to well everything breaching it from everyday road debris to just rubbing up against performing maintenance like using a hoist they really need to get with the e-coating technique like Ford and Ram IMHO.
Hey friend You should check out Pickups Plus with Tim He bought the same exact truck as you He has a service bulletin from GM about oil usage in both your diesel trucks
My question is, those who had their frames rusted out, or severe rust. How much cleaning or rinsing of the truck did you guys do after driving thru all those salted roads? Just curious Because, during those snow storms and driving thru the salted roads. I’d take my car (no truck) probably twice a week to a wash bay and spray it down. Do you guys think doing that would prevent all that rusting everyone is complaining about? My wife and I own Toyota/Lexus trucks now. I rinse her truck down pretty much every week, after a salting. I LOVE the GMC AT4X but, all these videos are scaring me, keeping me away. My heart desires it but, my mind won’t allow it!!!
I like the idea of coating the frame with that material but I wish they'd put the coating on a paint frame instead of a bare frame. Why would they not paint the frame? That paint other gm frames.
I live in the rust belt, it took roughly 16 years for that coating to dissappear, now after a good road salting or day on the beach my undercarrage gets a good washing, granted you cannot get every nook and cranny, but 21 years later and the only rust holes I have are the rockers. That up to like 2007 all rot in that area.
Ever since you started this channel you seem to have a thing for the wax coating on these trucks. It seems to be a thorn in your side honestly. I don't think most ppl care. I'm neither here nor there on it and think most ppl aren't even aware of it. It's fair to say even th e coating on your truck can still rust as we've seen on trucks of old, the paint only lasts so long in the elements, and when it chips moisture as you see can get underneath and rust away.
I don't disagree with you my friend. I actually point out your exact point throughout this video. I only made the video because many folks asked about the frame coating in 2023.
GM Just won't change they ways on a lot of things.Reminds me of the British motorcycles, and sports cars of the 60s and 70s, they refused to change, and there theory was[ if you don't like it don't buy it], and look what got them.
Hey friend I have a 2019 Chevy 1500 high country 6.2 bought new to tow our 8,000 # trailer with The trailer is all led lighting When I leave the 7 pin connector plugged into the truck, the trailer lights strobe, when in park. Chevy dealership tried to fix it 3 times but couldn’t. So I took my truck and trailer to a GMC dealership and plugged my led trailer into one of their new GMC trucks and the trailer lights strobed. They all couldn’t believe it and they tried to fix the problem but couldn’t So I still have the strobing issue when parked. The big issue is the backup camera on the trailer It strobes a picture on the monitor in the cab
Works okay in the south, down here once it all comes off years down the road you get a semi rusty surface frame. I have an older model that has surface rust but is fine. Older GMs up north don’t seem to last as long 👎🏻
In New England the GM wax coating does not hold up well to the salt and brine used in the winter. The e-coated frame treated with woolwax or a similar product is far superior.
This coating GM uses sucks. It will harden over time and flake off. My 2006 Freightliner M2 has a painted frame, and it has 200k on it and very little rust spots if any with never having an underbody wash. My 2015 Silverado with 100k on it has an awful lot of rust on the frame.
Your literally complaining about surface rust which is no big deal buy a can of spray paint for 3 doll hairs and spend 5 minutes spraying over what you don’t like no big deal.
@@smileyguyz Exactly. For anyone that does not believe it go look at South Main Auto's channel at all the super crusty GM's he works on in rural NY. They all get crusty but GM seems to be the worst. I will also say my 2019 RAM with its painted frame has no rust on it at all where my last GM that i had for less than a year had rust spots on the frame when it was brand new and it got worse over time. I live in the north east where they use plenty of salt BTW.
@@deltabravo1257 you must live in the south. In Michigan, corrosion ages most vehicles quickly. Southern vehicles are prized up here like freshwater Michigan boats are prized down south. Salt is the enemy.
Traded in my ‘03 f-150 with zero rust…now my ‘22 Silverado has significant rust visible on the frame both sides just behind the transmission. Looks like it’s peeling? Dealer tells me it’s not a warranty issue?
Wow living in the south and I’m sure it’s the same way in the north east and everywhere that they put salt on the roads in the winter this could be very bad once it’s been scratched off
On my 5th new GMC, Sierra, 2024, and yep, GM is still using this poor treatment. With fifty miles on my new truck, I applied 1 gallon of fluid film. This application yearly will keep the frame and underbody components rust free forever!
Great video, been a long time follower. I think a great opportunity for more of this type of content is reaching out to agencies that have fleet vehicles in extreme environments/conditions. I know a lot of life guard and fire departments have response vehicles that live on the beach and all will be within 100 yards of salt water their entire life. It’d be interesting to see how they are holding up and what their vehicle of choice is.
Maybe it's easier to touch up vs painting a frame? Maybe it withstands rock chips and self heals? (You should reassess your scratch test after awhile) Would be interesting to hear a GM engineer on the benefits. I'll agree the mess is the biggest detractor but most people don't do their own wrenching anyways anymore so let the shop deal with it.
Great video and thanks for sharing the information. I was about to purchase a GMC Sierra Heavy Duty. Not anymore! Thanks, but no thanks! I'll look at the Ford Super Duty or Ram Heavy Duty instead. I will not buy a GM HD truck as long as they continue to use the wax coating method.
I had bought a 2022 GMC Sierra 1500 elevation brand new in Maine. I try to take really good care of my vehicles with wax and polish. In the winter I would take the truck to a local car wash and pay to spray the underneath once a month. A little over one year of ownership and 30,000 miles, I was completely disgusted to see parts of the frame were bare and rusted. People could not believe the pictures I shared of the rust for how new it is. I sold the truck. I will never buy another GM truck again as long as they continue to use this horrible method of coating.
I'm a mechanic in East Pennsylvania. We typically get some salty winters, but not every winter is bad...GM truck frames do not hold up out here. The coating typically wears/flakes off and leaves bare metal. I have inspected dozens of 2007 - 2013 GM trucks with horribly rotted out frames. Most come in with patches, and new holes from rust. Awful frames. Every newer GM full size I have messed with, has had the coating peeling off, and rust all over. I'm a Chevy guy but I'm not sure I'd buy a newer GM truck...they are rotboxes in a salty state...
Powder coating is the worst thing you can do to a truck Frame. Once it chips, water gets between the metal and coating and rusts. The water works its way down the metal and causes more rust.
@@zell863 yea it's so strange that it's this waxy coating. I just bought a brand new GMC, and I was switching out the rims, and where I placed the floor jack, the wax smeared off. Seems like such a shitty old technology to be using
I live in Canada the e-coatings or paint one winter its all ripped off. My dad had a chevy from 2003 and untill last year was the first time I saw it wearing out. At least with the wax you can take it off if you want with gas and hit it again with surface shield. With paint or coatings trying to get it off is alot of work. Your e-coat still looks good because you don't get the hard winters.
I get so many mixed reviews on both from folks in the rust belt. Some day the salt gets under the Knox coating and causes it to rust unseen, some day ecoat doesnt work well. As a matter of fact, read the comment that was left right before yours from a gentleman in East PA. Overall, I believe ecoat is the better tech. Also, don't think that because we don't have salted roads we don't have salt here. There is more salt in the air and in the humidity on the coast than you might think. Everything rusts out here very quickly.
The material is self healing. If it gets scratched the surrounding wax will fill in scratch over time. This may be why they continue to use it over other methods. Other methods if a scratch occurs then it stays exposed prone to rust.
I myself do not see the problem with this coating. 2007 silverado 150,000 miles in Wisconsin winters with all the salt on the road and the frame is fine
I don’t really see a big deal with the coating that GM uses a can of spray paint is cheap and getting under your vehicle is something people should regularly do.
You cannot spray paint on wax, You have to wait until it falls off to have bare rust to paint, even ziebart fell off the 2013 after yearly reprays. 135,000 light transportation vehicle and frame is done and separating.
I watched both your videos regarding this topic, in the first video you said that you would most likely avoid GM products until they came up with a better alternative for the wax coating, I am curious what made you change your mind where you felt comfortable buying the GM product? I have always driven Ford's but I am considering purchasing a GM product, however the waxed frame makes me a little nervous. How did you reason that the wax coated frame would suffice over an ecoated product? Thank you.
Why GM!? WHY!??? You make a great truck other than this. Planned failure so you can sell more trucks? Guess this is why we don't see 1,000,000 mile GM trucks.
And this is why I will not own a GM products in Ohio, this coating does not hold up and that crap stops regular rust proofing from bonding, I can’t tell you how many GM trucks look like they’re 20 years old and my 17 Ford truck still looks new.
I live far north and own 6.6 duramax and 5.3 6.2 2.7 and baby max 3.0. All my trucks don't have any rust. The old ones I have are still running solid. Fords and rams around me, rust out way too early. I owned all brands and found gms are the best
@@michaelpanacheese604 You are lucky. Every GM i have ever kept long term have rotted the frame pretty badly. We do lots of road salt here in New England and even when well taken care of they rust. All brands do it but GM just seems to be the worst of them. My 97 1500 at 9 years old you could poke a screwdriver thru parts of the frame where it was unsafe to operate any longer. It went on the scrap heap. My 06 1500 the overload bumpers literally rotted off as well ad the spare tire carrier. The rear half of the rear half of the frame was rusted badly as well. My 2014 the entire frame was coated with surface rust after one winter, i didnt have it long enough to let it rot out. If i ever owned another GM i would have it fluid film'd every year.
I have a 2009 3500HD that I bought new. It hasn’t rusted. An orange frame is a sign of a truck being driven extensively in salt and deicer covered roads. Any truck will have the problem.😊
