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Is the Canon C100 Mark 2 worth it in 2020? Watch this before buying! Sample footage, specs breakdown 

Jeremy Ying
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3 окт 2024

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Комментарии : 127   
@JeremyY
@JeremyY 4 года назад
Despite being released in 2014 the C100 Mark 2 should hold a spot on every professional video producer's arsenal. Because sometimes a tiny mirrorless camera just won't cut it. Fight me on this. If you want to jump ahead: 0:37 - Reasons why C100 IS relevant 4:56 - Arguments against C100 (and why these arguments are dumb)
@MikeEdwardsphotography
@MikeEdwardsphotography 4 года назад
Hands down the best "Reason Why" video on RU-vid. Well done Jeremy. Definitely fits our budget and checks off all our needs. Thanks again.
@johnnyfitzlive
@johnnyfitzlive 4 года назад
It's a great camera, you'll love it. The only knock we've had when using it is the lack of good slow-mo options.
@JayFingers
@JayFingers 4 года назад
Yes!! OK, I have been watching video after video, reading review after review. I think I gotta make that move, pull the trigger, and cop the C100. Thanks for sharing your thoughts on it!
@bauerfilms4832
@bauerfilms4832 4 года назад
THIS is how a review is done. Not self-indulgent, fast passed, answers every relevant concern, makes fun of pixel peepers and spec snobs. Sub earned, look forward to more from you.
@johncl27
@johncl27 4 года назад
add to those reasons (all good ones) the dual xlr inputs and inbuilt ND filters...still a very capable camera!
@JeremyY
@JeremyY 4 года назад
Absolutely agree!
@OneOrbit
@OneOrbit 4 года назад
Hell yeah!
@DavinciHD_
@DavinciHD_ Год назад
You literally gave the perfect analogy. C100mk2 - A good employee that shows up to work on time and doesn't complain. You literally answered every question I had. I plan on using this camera even in 2023 as I start to retire my Lumix cameras. Definitely Sold me with this video
@JeremyY
@JeremyY Год назад
CMV: The C100 mk2 is the AK-47 of cameras.
@DavinciHD_
@DavinciHD_ Год назад
@@JeremyY even better analogy. 🤯
@ColorfieldMedia
@ColorfieldMedia 4 года назад
Great video. Even though I own few 4K and 6K cams, I will NEVER give up my Canon C100s. Just the internal ND filters alone are worth the price of admission.
@johnnyfitzlive
@johnnyfitzlive 4 года назад
This was really well done man. The C100 was my first "pro" camera, and I will always love and recommend it (especially for Doc or talking head work). I totally agree that people spend way too much time knocking it for silly reasons, but I will say, however, that it does present some pretty big issues when it comes to easily capturing B-roll. It's too big to throw on a normal gimbal (we actually bought an old-school double handle ronin for this) and it can't shoot at high frame rates. We were always able to get passable B-Roll, but when we added a GH5S/Ronin combo to our gear, the perceived production value of our work increased exponentially. 60/90 fps moving gimbal footage slowed down to 24fps just looks so damn good/expensive. It's incredible how much more footage I now have to work with when editing, and the clients can't get enough of it. All that being said, it's almost painful to use any other camera once you get used to the C100 in the field. Amazing handle, tons of buttons, incredible battery, built in ND Filters, external audio controls and XLR inputs. The thing is amazing, and it will always be relevant as a talking head machine. So I guess C100 gang for life, but also buy a small 60fps b-roll camera/gimbal combo.
@Sutterjack
@Sutterjack 3 года назад
Good point - I have a Crane 2 gimbal that does work with the C100, but the weight and hassle isn't worth it. EOS R makes a lot more sense with terrific image for this purpose.
@Sutterjack
@Sutterjack 4 года назад
This is still a very good camera - note that Canon still sells it and the price is still pretty up there. I own one and still love it. This is a workhorse camera - very reliable with great image quality despite it's limitations. The files grade remarkably well for the 4.2.0 8 bit and the small files sizes are a joy to work with! Yes I wish it had 4.2.2 10 bit and 4K, but it doesn't! Oh yeah, you can shoot 8k on your new Canon R5 - - FOR 10 MINUTES. I think your client will understand while you're icing the body before your next take! With the cooling fan in this body I've NEVER overheated, even in hot sun. This camera is just so well designed with the layout of controls and menus, lightweight, and rugged. BUILT IN NDs - HUGE! Even the yet to be released C70 doesn't even have a EVF - WTF? This camera is just great and still relevant for the majority of content that's going to end up on the web.
@sharmaji1474
@sharmaji1474 4 года назад
You got me on 'why a handle costs a hundred dollars' 😂😂
@JeremyY
@JeremyY 3 года назад
But why does it, though??
@Dijah
@Dijah 4 года назад
love the way, how u explaining, it's make me happy :D lol
@JeremyY
@JeremyY 4 года назад
YOU make me happy!
@jacobnobbe.
@jacobnobbe. 4 года назад
same i loved the comedy of it all
@gtamediaproductions1
@gtamediaproductions1 4 года назад
I am so glad I bought one of these several years ago. Still a fantastic camera. Screw DSLrs. Showed up to a shoot with a dslr once and confused a lot of people. They thought I was a photographer and not the videographer. It was so annoying to deal with. I've been doing this business for almost 30 years and pretty much felt embarrassed without a real motion camera. It's ok if you are doing it for a hobby or making skater videos, home videos, blogging and so on.
@JeremyY
@JeremyY 4 года назад
It's especially painful if your client wants to preview a shot and you have no choice but to show them the clip on a tiny, dim mirrorless flip out screen. Yikes.
@threethroneproductions5498
@threethroneproductions5498 4 года назад
Men I must say, you are good at this. Well detailed and informative review. I have been waiting to buy a C200 or C300 but I will get a C100 mark ii to start using a cinema camera and thanks to you. Your newest Subscriber
@JeremyY
@JeremyY 4 года назад
Hey thank you that really means a lot to me! Share your vids once you get out there.
@jaijacobphoto316
@jaijacobphoto316 4 года назад
Love this. Love to see more vids on this camera.
@JeremyY
@JeremyY 4 года назад
Will do. Any specific C100-related things that you wanted to know more about? I'm an open book hit me
@Troy_Sent_A_Message
@Troy_Sent_A_Message 4 года назад
@@JeremyY Specifics on slow mo workflow and exact settings you use when using slow mo?
@spectaculer350
@spectaculer350 4 года назад
@@JeremyY please make a comparison with eosr!
@OneOrbit
@OneOrbit 4 года назад
Couldn’t agree more! I would also add that the C100 II is very light weight. We’ve shot for 9 hours straight with this guy no prob.
@JCGascon001
@JCGascon001 3 года назад
canon owes you, for preserving the value of that old but still relevant model, great vid mate !!
@JeremyY
@JeremyY 3 года назад
Thank you! The C100 Mk2 still gets the job done and has never failed me and my team. To this very day I haven't come across a cinecam that matches the C100's value-to-quality.
@bradencw
@bradencw 4 года назад
didn't have to call me out in that intro jeez
@DESIGNS-vo1mt
@DESIGNS-vo1mt 4 года назад
Definitely need more vids like this. Thanks
@ChringyTechTalk
@ChringyTechTalk 3 года назад
Ha, great video man! I enjoyed the pacing and humor. I just picked up a used C100 Mark ii with XEEN 16m and 50mm cinema lenses for a crazy good price (and only 109 hours on camera). Super excited to start filming with it even though I have an EOS R also.
@JeremyY
@JeremyY 3 года назад
C100 ii plus Xeen cinelens gonna be killer. Got any sample footage I can check out? I want to see that in action.
@ChringyTechTalk
@ChringyTechTalk 3 года назад
@@JeremyY just picked it up 2 days ago so not yet! Soon though :)
@jaimeibanez2840
@jaimeibanez2840 4 года назад
This video was super solid!! Thanks so much for the info.
@JeremyY
@JeremyY 4 года назад
Thank you for checking it out, my dude.
@nooooddy
@nooooddy 3 года назад
Great video, editing, pace and points 👍
@gereral1_jackofalltrades
@gereral1_jackofalltrades 3 года назад
I could not afford c100 6 years ago so I bought its cousin g30 or know as xa25. Produces same images but has fixed 35mm lens. Fstop 1.8 to 2.8 and produces beautiful footage. I had to go the rail, monitor, atomos route added weight to my setup but built it over 4 years as my youtube channel grew. I've got 23 grand in bank and am pondering getting on as I own 3 canon lenes for t3i. Like a kid in candy store...... the 8bit 1080p is amazing on my canon g30 into atomos puts out 422 8bit to ssd drive into davanci studio for easy creamy butter editing right off the camcorder. Use zoom h5 for xlrs. At the time when I bought g30 it was 1200 bucks and c100 mkii was 5500 bucks. But now they are 1800 used so I'm waiting tell they drop to 1500 then I'll byte.
@GrabTheSnacks
@GrabTheSnacks 4 года назад
i love mine and i'm still learning it each day
@alkevinzmedia
@alkevinzmedia 4 года назад
Haha ! I love this video man! 👏👏😁😁 My C100 is the best employee 😂
@dcchavez97
@dcchavez97 2 года назад
It's crazy how in 2022 , the C100 mark ii still sells new at retailers and many other cinema cameras that came after, are discontinued for a newer version. I think Canon tried to answer with a newer version with the Canon C70.
@JeremyY
@JeremyY 2 года назад
And the C70 has cheaper feeling dials and overall lesser build quality. And it has mini XLR instead of the C100’s real XLR. The C100 is the AK-47 of cinecams.
@dcchavez97
@dcchavez97 2 года назад
@@JeremyY agree.. truly battle tested and still kicks
@TRAILSAMMLER
@TRAILSAMMLER 3 года назад
Thanks man. I really enjoyed your video.
@IndiCros
@IndiCros 4 года назад
I feel like this camera would still be relevent in like 3 years
@ocubex
@ocubex 4 года назад
Have had one for 4yrs, thinking of buying another...
@gtamediaproductions1
@gtamediaproductions1 4 года назад
Me as well. Looking into a second one. Love this camera!
@IndiCros
@IndiCros 4 года назад
@@gtamediaproductions1 The only thing that would stop me from buying this is if a camera with the same features or better came out for the same price, lol.
@JeremyY
@JeremyY 3 года назад
The C100 is the AK-47 of cameras. And I mean that in the best way.
@IndiCros
@IndiCros 3 года назад
@@JeremyY It sucks how expensive they still are, but I can kind of understand why, lol.
@DanielEarl
@DanielEarl 4 года назад
The only people who don't like this camera are pixel peepers and/or brand loyalists. The only benefit of 10 bit over 8 bit that I can see is that 10 bit doesn't have color banding, but that only happens when you grade the footage too heavily!
@jacobrobertdesio9265
@jacobrobertdesio9265 3 года назад
I mean, having billions of colors is superior to millions.
@TonyVic
@TonyVic 4 года назад
After watching tons and videos and researching a tons of sites, I think this was prob to the best overall review of why I am learning more on the C100 MII. I like what you said at the end because you were talking exactly to me--I have been told "get the 4k, 6k 50k (haha) 10 bit cam.." blah blah blah and I was falling for it, I won't lie. But I truly love the C100 I have worked with it before but never really owned it myself. I love Canon and maybe I am a little biased to it. How do you like the slow-motion capability? Regardless, thank you for a great and very comprehensive review.
@ruff1draft
@ruff1draft 3 года назад
Been thinking alot about the Canon C100 Mark 2 Canon C200 Mark ii, Canon 90D and Canon 80D. And also about the Panasonic Gh5, Panasonic gh5s, Panasonic S5 and Panasonic S1
@JeremyY
@JeremyY 3 года назад
Heh that's a big shopping list. Are you a video shooter or hybrid photo+video shooter?
@yourbuddyaj
@yourbuddyaj 3 года назад
I think the over-all versatility and feature set of the GH5 makes it the best camera for MOST people but the C100 is superb at the features it does offer.
@JeremyY
@JeremyY 3 года назад
Agreed! And I say that as an owner of a GH5 and C100!
@dlovisuals
@dlovisuals 3 года назад
Thanks for an informative video! Been eying the C100 mk 2 for the price. While I do shoot on 2 R6 cameras, I mainly use for photo or vlogging and I’d love to learn how to shoot better video on a cinema camera.
@JeremyY
@JeremyY 3 года назад
The C100 Mk2's value is unbeatable. And when you experience the C100/cinecam form factor you'll have a hard time going back to your R6. R6 is solid but takes a backseat for the serious gigs.
@ruff1draft
@ruff1draft 4 года назад
Absolutely beautiful.
@stevebray71
@stevebray71 4 года назад
I've been doing ALOT of research recently on should I buy the C100 mk 1 or the mark 2 or even spending a tiny bit more & going for the C300 mark 1 & because most of the time I'm filming on my own & I'm disabled I've decided that the C100 mark 2 actually ticks all the boxes that I'm looking at. The DPAF being 1 the main features because of the C300 only being manual & because although I can't run lol 😂 the focusing is the main reason. I film things where people say "how did you get that shot" but because also having filmed with a dslr & having the trouble with time limited to 30 minutes at a time, even my broadcast Sony HD camcorder only let's me film upto 60 minutes because of having to change tapes but that will still help me being a b-role camera where the constant running feature isn't necessary. 4 K as u said is over rated by a lot of people but having a good quality video as well as outstanding audio without having to use a separate recorder to provide +48 v to a decent microphone all helps to change the choice of should I use a dslr or a dedicated VIDEO CAMERA. Thanks for the great video & you've gained my subscription looking forward to seeing other videos you've done
@JeremyY
@JeremyY 4 года назад
Firstly- you're badass and stay awesome. Second- I totally agree with you that having everything needed to produce professional content in ONE package is the way to go. No worrying about record limits means one less thing to worry about while shooting, and that's always a good thing. And there is a time and place for external audio recorders, but most audiences can't tell the difference between audio recorded internally vs audio recorded externally, especially if you're using the C100's preamps which are close to mixer quality.
@stayfocusedmedia
@stayfocusedmedia 3 года назад
You just convinced me today in 2021
@JeremyY
@JeremyY 3 года назад
It'll hold up in 2021 just as well as it would in 2020!
@vpr5562
@vpr5562 3 года назад
But relevant... for what price?
@vanzetti7
@vanzetti7 3 года назад
Great video - I shoot on a BMPCC original and buisness’ are asking me for some work but I am so nervous that they will frown when they see my tiny set up. Thinking of upgrading to a professional looking camera.
@JeremyY
@JeremyY 3 года назад
A professional-looking camera commands respect on the worksite. Period. People see a big camera, and get out of your way. I've had so many shots ruined because some doofus jumped in front of my a6500/5D Mark 2. They either didn't "see" my camera or didn't care enough to see it. But they clear out when I have the C100 on the job. Sure, smaller mirrorless cameras or BMPCC shoot beautiful footage but that does nothing for me if people don't treat me and my shooters with the space and respect they need to get the job done.
@plinden
@plinden 4 года назад
The con arguments, so funny!!
@DeepBluesphere
@DeepBluesphere 4 года назад
I'm absolutely agree with you!!!
@hakooon
@hakooon 4 года назад
Great video! Subscribed! :)
@LifewithDusty
@LifewithDusty 4 года назад
Great vid ! I subscribed
@kamilliberte
@kamilliberte 2 года назад
Thanks fot this video. Helped me alot with my decision to get 1 :D What lens do you recommend to start with as a allrounder setup? 18-35 Sigma?
@JeremyY
@JeremyY 2 года назад
Canon EF-S 17-55mm f/2.8. Has good reach and it’s stabilized. This lens alone got 80% of my shots. Never liked the 18-35 Sigma. Not stabilized, zoom between its 18mm and 35mm focal lengths is virtually identical.
@kamilliberte
@kamilliberte 2 года назад
@@JeremyY thanks mate!
@La-verdad-aunque-duela
@La-verdad-aunque-duela 3 года назад
Loved it!, thanks!
@AlexLopez-iy4by
@AlexLopez-iy4by 4 года назад
Thanks for helpful video.
@jayacustico9518
@jayacustico9518 2 года назад
I really enjoy this video, and I suscribe to your channel. I love your documentary about the migrants. Nice job
@JeremyY
@JeremyY 2 года назад
Thank you Jay- I love getting this feedback.
@christhompsonphotography6783
@christhompsonphotography6783 3 года назад
Yes.
@JeremyY
@JeremyY 3 года назад
100%
@emilydombroffvideos
@emilydombroffvideos 2 года назад
Great video! Do you shoot with both the C100 and GH5 and match them? I have both cameras as well and have had different degrees of success! If you do, what settings do you use?
@JeremyY
@JeremyY 2 года назад
Hey Emily thank you. Yes I do shoot with both C100 mk2 and GH5. Main difference is in dynamic range (C100 has 2 extra stops of dynamic range). But if you add more red/orange into your GH5 footage's skin tones and reduce its yellow tint it should come pretty close to the C100 footage.
@emilydombroffvideos
@emilydombroffvideos 2 года назад
@@JeremyY Awesome thank you! Can you share what color profiles you typically shoot with for both cameras? I have experimented with a few on each but am always researching what others are doing. Thanks again!
@bramskilove
@bramskilove 3 года назад
Hi Great review thnx! What lens do you use for the c100?
@JeremyY
@JeremyY 3 года назад
Either the EFS 17-55 or the EF 70-200 F4 Mark 2.
@ATreeForFive
@ATreeForFive 3 года назад
Would you guys recommend the C100 mkII for real estate work ? The C100 thicks all the boxes (except 4K, but still, I could always upscale in post) as long as it shoots up till 60 FPS
@JeremyY
@JeremyY 3 года назад
If doing panning shots on a tripod- definitely yes. But if you're the type of shooter who does everything on a gimbal- no. Because the C100 does not balance easily on most gimbals.
@domenicomatteoorlando5840
@domenicomatteoorlando5840 3 года назад
Hi!! Thanks a lot for this video and sorry for my horrible English but I have a question for you: I found a used C100 Mark II with 1190 hours of recording.. I came from a Sony a6300 and I've got 0 canon lens.. Is a good idea to buy it??
@JeremyY
@JeremyY 3 года назад
Hey Dominico- first off your English is very good and you have nothing to apologize for. :) That all depends. What $price is the seller asking? Some tips for buying a used C100 Mark 2: bring a flashlight so you can thoroughly inspect the camera sensor for damage and dust. Bring an EF lens (I know you don't own any, but see if you can borrow one from a friend or colleague) and test the DPAF autofocus speed. Ensure the lens mount is nice and tight. Make sure the top and side grips can be properly assembled with no play/jiggle. And test the camera in a quiet area so you can listen for any weird noises, like loud cooling fans. Test each button to make sure they all work. As long as the camera can pass all of those conditions you should be in pretty good shape.
@caseyonlocation8257
@caseyonlocation8257 3 года назад
Hi Jeremy, great video, thumbs up! Question please. Is it true that when recording long time videos, if the clips is larger than 2GB in size, the camera will automatically split the video into smaller files? If this is accurate, I find this disappointing. Here's an excerpt from the B&H site on the C100ii specs: "The camera records video to SDHC/SDXC cards using AVCHD, a high-efficiency codec that has quickly become a standard in both the professional and consumer video markets. Maximum bit-rate is 24 Mbps. Video files greater than 2GB are split into multiple files while recording, which are automatically joined together upon import using Canon Data Import."
@JeremyY
@JeremyY 3 года назад
That only happens if you record in AVCHD. I switched my C100 mk2 to output to MP4 instead of AVCHD mainly because AVCHD is a total pain in the ass to work with. Hope that answers your question. Thanks for checking out my vid, btw. :)
@TVperson1
@TVperson1 4 года назад
I'm looking at this for low light short films because my GH5 has fixed pattern noise and I can see it in dark scenes and on blank walls when panning. How does does the C100 perform on chromakey with an external recorder? Also, I noticed you're over exposing some of your shots, perhaps if you used the ND and brighten it up in post, you'd get those details back.
@stevesiroissr6165
@stevesiroissr6165 2 года назад
After watching this video, I have decided to go with the EOS 100 MK ii. I am wondering though, for a decent lens, It will come with an EF 24-105mm. For filming inside breweries and street interviews, would you stick with just that lens or recommend anything different? I see there are a few lens's out there for this camera, IE 24mm, 50mm, 85mm prime lens as well as the EF 16-35mm, EF 24-70mm and EF 70-200mm. Im just wondering if the stock EF 24-105mm will be good.
@JeremyY
@JeremyY 2 года назад
The 24-105 f4 is just "ok". It offers good reach but nothing spectacular and all of its footage is just... average. I never bothered with that lens despite it being available for quite cheap everywhere. Instead I used the EFS 17-55 f2.8 and the 70-200 f4 ii. Those two lenses captured 99% of my best footage. I prefer high quality zoom lenses over primes.
@stevesiroissr6165
@stevesiroissr6165 2 года назад
@@JeremyY Thank you for responding so quick. I am looking at those also, but i am stuck. Looking at f4 vs f2.8. all of the f4 type lenses are literally $1000 less expensive, and i want to shoot videos. I don't know if the aperture from f2.8 to f4 is worth the price.
@JKFLASH
@JKFLASH 2 года назад
Still good in 2022?
@JeremyY
@JeremyY 2 года назад
Yes it is! The % of video content viewed on smartphones has gone up since I uploaded this video. Only challenge might be fitting it onto an L-bracket if you want to film in vertical format.
@Owlbot
@Owlbot 4 года назад
Hey man check out the OWLCOLOR Profile we made for the C100mkII! Matches the Canon more in-line with an Alexa :D
@patrickjenner3211
@patrickjenner3211 4 года назад
Hey dude, do you have any sample footage from an external recorder or MP4 internal recording? I'm considering getting one of these for autofocus and run and gun situations. I have a GH5, but it doesn't have internal ND or half decent Autofocus or XLR ports.
@JeremyY
@JeremyY 4 года назад
I don't. Wish I could help you with that, but I just never saw the need to slap on an external recorder when using the C100.
@rayetoile1720
@rayetoile1720 4 года назад
Are all these reasons still hold for the c100 Mark 1? Thanks for any comments.
@JeremyY
@JeremyY 3 года назад
Most of them do apply to the Mark 1. Except: Mark 1 doesn't have a 4K sensor, so while it's footage is still nice it isn't as sharp as the Mark 2. Also loses a bit more quality if you choose to crop in during post-production. And Mark 1's low light footage is a bit noisier.
@1123adam
@1123adam 4 года назад
so i was thinking of getting of one of three cameras either the zcam e2c / blackmagic 2.5k / or the canon c100 mark i ... still decdiing but i leaning to zcam e2c my buget is around 1000$
@JeremyY
@JeremyY 4 года назад
My only advice to you is: consider usability and prioritize it over specs. Cool if the Xcam feels easy and natural to use, but I doubt that it can ever hold a candle to a proper cinecam.
@sharon66699theking
@sharon66699theking 4 года назад
True.
@paullevine7230
@paullevine7230 4 года назад
Are you able to upgrade the normal canon c100 to dual pixel?
@JeremyY
@JeremyY 3 года назад
Yes. But if you can try to find the Mark 2 and buy it used. I've used both the Mark 1 and Mark 2 and really do like the 2 better.
@BONLEV
@BONLEV 4 года назад
but it has no auto iso. I shoot lot of events I have to zoom in and out. So how you do this?
@triethylborane49
@triethylborane49 3 года назад
Use a constant aperture.
@simeonpetrov594
@simeonpetrov594 3 года назад
Manually with our hands, eyes and editing skills. Reframe that frame. Quickly!!! 🤝
@westmanog1679
@westmanog1679 4 года назад
Bravo 👏
@charlesBenincasa
@charlesBenincasa 4 года назад
Heres the million dollar question C-Log or WideDR ?
@JeremyY
@JeremyY 4 года назад
Wide DR if I need quick turnaround time.
@Owlbot
@Owlbot 4 года назад
@@JeremyY Trick question, OWLCOLOR :P
@charlesBenincasa
@charlesBenincasa 4 года назад
OWL BOT LOL..... I’m going to purchase your Picture profile but before I do my only concern is how soft c-Log compared to WideDR. I’d your color profile sharp like WideDR??
@simeonpetrov594
@simeonpetrov594 3 года назад
C-Log! If properly exposed this is the best in terms of noise levels and dynamic range.
@willschwerd6034
@willschwerd6034 4 года назад
I'm looking to sell mine if anyone is interested! Good bundle with extra batteries + lens
@Sutterjack
@Sutterjack 4 года назад
I like the whiney voice- lol - yes I bought one for personal use in 2019 after using one at work for 3 years - A WORKHORSE - some many things to like, not least of which COOLING FAN and BUILT IN ND FILTERS! Yes it's obsolete in many ways, but it was so well designed it's hard not to love it still.
@nicholasolivas317
@nicholasolivas317 4 года назад
1:45 for real??
@JeremyY
@JeremyY 3 года назад
Yup. Camera cages are stupid expensive. And just... stupid in general.
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