Is the McLaren F1 Overrated? 

Hahaha

Real mogul moves alert!

Doug Pelosi?

It's still funny that People don't call the new Supra a real Supra because it uses a BMW engine and BMW Chassis, but nobody calls the McLaren F1 a "BMW" despite it using a BMW Engine and even some other smaller Parts. I guess BMW isn't bad after all if it comes to the F1. Nevermind Gordon Murray still praising BMW to this Day (including some new Models) Prost & Cheers from Berchtesgaden in the Bavarian Alps

He bought 2 F1’s?! God damn his auction site has made him rich af.

User name checks out.

It's already A Thing now. He can't stop.

And dip them in 10wt 30.

Doug is also the type of guy that would completely lose it if someone else rested their biscotti on his Carrera GT, regardless wether it had a napkin/paper towel under it.

@@richgallagher725 Truth. But, to be honest, so would I.

Aston Martin used similar on their 1990s v8 Vantage

Yeah and the F40 has round lights. I don't think they look bad. They do their job and you can see them.

Particularly the XJR-15 taillights which they show in the video, which look they're from a Vauxhall Somethingotother and are awful. The bus taillights are great and may have been quite lightweight compared to other OEM options.

Nah. The F50 has the perfect rear circular tail lights.

Round lights are timeless.

the race between the F1 and a Veyron they did on top gear a long time ago was really cool. wicked how fast it is and was winning until the veyron's hp advantage kicked in

With a manual too!

yeah because everyone stopped using na for top speed

Thank you for the opinion X AE A-12 xd

@@tattttu9 this wasn’t built for top speed, all the others were

The F1 LM replica (it's awesome) has those rear ligths as sole original items. And its BMW V12 is sortof close.

Agreed. The only think that looked like an afterthought was the front turn signals IMHO.

There are several supercars using bus tail-lights such as the Lamborghini Diablo, Saleen S7, and Pagani Zonda. In fact, these cars are worse since their tail-lights are from tractors.

Let's be honest, a quarter of this car's legend status was forged with Clarkson's "What you are about to see, is the difference between a really really fast car.... and a McLaren F1" played a few million times. Everything I built this car up to in my head (and probably a lot of similarly aged car RU-vidrs) came from Top Gear.

Rowan Atkinson is legendary for daily driving his McLaren F1 simply because he liked driving it. He also wrecked it twice and reluctantly sold it because it had gotten too valuable to keep driving. It might be the highest mileage F1.

@@natesmith8020 just speaking for myself, I didn't even start watching Top Gear until the 2000's. I worshiped the car from the get-go because of the central driving position (I had dreamed of a 1+2 sports car for years before that) and the top speed blowing away the previous record. Back in the mid-90's I actually told a friend of mine whose dad had just sold his stake in a telecommunications startup for $10+ million that he should buy a F1 "as an investment -- I don't think you're going to see anything with that level of engineering-as-art come along again for a very long time, and the speed record may never be broken." The latter assertion was of course disproved by the Veyron (although the F1 is STILL the fastest naturally-aspirated car), but the former certainly proved correct.

@@nerva- I agree 100%, even wilder is the F1 - wasn't even purpose built to be the fastest car... it simply became the fastest due to its engineering - wasn't even purpose built to be a race car... and yet it won le mans I think that's what makes it legnendary, you have to think, to become the best when it wasn't even your focus, while all other manufactures purpose built to make it the fastest, to make it the most competitive race car etc etc... the car that dethroned the F1 was the Veyron... and guess what? before the first pencil was drawn, they already set out to make it the world fastest car in terms of top speed, that was the purpose, but not the F1.... That's why I think the F1 sits at the top by itself, nothing like it before, and nothing will even become like it after....

i work with a few of the designers who helped design the f1 and some of the stories you hear are amazing. the truly did not care about records during deign. they just wanted to build the best and most practical super car possible with the technology available at the time. The funniest thing is they arnt even happy with the final product. they say with more time they could have ironed out more flaws with the car. but the chase of perfection is never finished and eventually you have to ship the cars haha. but for me the floors within a car is what gives it personality. My susuki swift doesn't have Bluetooth so i have to use a cigarette lighter Bluetooth device that emits radio frequencies. it works well but if i dont play music somehow pics up coil whine from my engine which changes pitch as i accelerate. its a very weird qwerk which is almost unique to my car but that what makes me feel a connection with my car rather then it being a lump of steel. People that look at an F1 or a vayron and pick out floor or niggle and say this is poor design work have probably never worked in automotive engineering. Designers are aware of these issue but sometimes you just have to accept that something is the way it is in order to deliver. so i value those qwerks because i like to think about the time spent acknowledging the issue and i like the fact that some designer is out there frustrated about that part and that i understand their struggle

11 years*

The XP5 prototype was modified to beat that record ... so it wasn't really a stock car.

@@Elberoth they only changed the rev limiter, it was mechanically identical.

And still the fastest naturally aspirated car

@@Lianpe98 still a modified car. They decided to risk blowing the engine up, to beat the record.

Mostly he complained about the crazy value causing insurance to be prohibitively high...you have to pay insane amounts to drive it on the road.

Although the maintenance is tremendously expensive, its not as expensive as many probably think (and especially not as expensive as some video on youtube tries to convince you to think it is…). Yes, bodywork for example is a lot of dough, but just keeping it running and giving it a good car life is way way less $$$ than one would assume. yeah, as pistonburner mentions, insurance is a thing. but, as it loses not that much value if you throw it in a ditch (and economically cant be totaled), there are multiple owners who do liability only and have a separate collection insurance which only covers the parked/stored car.

@@maxheeschter3009 I'm also going by the words of a previous owner. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-EsKDGdcb6BQ.html

@@maxheeschter3009 gas tank bladder has to be replaced periodically and is prohibitively expensive. But it’s also worth a lot so the maintenance costs become a wash.

​@@maxheeschter3009 it will cost you about 50k a year on average in maintenance without you ever even driving it. Its an incredibly expensive car to own.

Yes but is it 20million unequal is his question. It's value or perceived value has exploded in the last couple of years. Compared to others cars of the similar era it's not even in the same solar system anymore.

Uh. gordon murray t.50

he's putting on a show for this video, it was his plan to end the video in favor of the mclaren. Doug is a businessman.

​@@christianb1707 While true, the fact that this car was created by the same person speaks volumes about how unique it was and still is. I also thought the F1 is kinda overrated but considering for how well it held up except in track performance really shows how good the car is. I think the only car that even comes close to holding up in certain aspects is the Jaguar XJ220. 7:46 at the Nürb even in this day and age is nothing to sneeze at. Especially with 30 year old tires.

t50 is the updated equal

Lol

Thomas Bscher is that man. He was not just a 'banker' but also a gentleman race car driver. He actually convinced McLaren to take the F1 racing and himself drove the McLaren F1 GTR in the BPR GT championship in 1995.

@@Andynath100 I remember the story of how Thomas Bscher persuaded Ron Dennis to do the race version. Basically, he pestered and pestered until Ron basically caved in and said "As it's you, Thomas, yes, we'll do it". However, Ron Dennis is a sharp cookie, and went on to say, "Of course, you'll need one for the road too". Which is how Bscher ended up with a road going one too, and used it for commuting. Apparently, the time he saved on his commute paid for the car! Paid off for McLaren too - the legendary win at Le Mans wouldn't have happened otherwise, and it meant that when they more recently said they were going to make road cars it certainly made everyone sit up and pay close, close attention.

everyone month? was he driving to other side of the planet

@@hassyg4083 it’s about a 115 mile commute which he ran at over 200mph for about half of it. Rather like you or I driving to work in 1st gear everyday, we might need a service every month. By the way, I did take my FZR1000R Exup to work like that for one journey, 70mph in 1st at 11000rpm. My ears were bleeding and so was everyone else’s around me!

Exactly. The F1 actually had 3 different door mirrors. The first handful had mirror from the Citroen CX, the rest had VW Corrado mirrors and the few who had the high mounted mirror option were from a BMW Z1.

It had 3 types of mirrors. 1. Citroën mirrors (on prototyps and early production cars) 2. Corrado mirrors on later cars 3. Bmw Z1 mirrors, only 3 F1 has them.

And the doors were inspired by a quirky obscure little Toyota

@@Lord0fPvnder obscure and obscure. It was the Toyota Sera, basically a Toyota Paseo with modified doors 😂

Agreed !

Is it tho?

Doug made only horrible, invalid and incorrect points about the tail lights.

@@pistonburner6448 well he was correct in that they are a stock bus tail light. It's just that no one cares.

@@Smith1980 No, that was incorrect. They are automotive tail lights. It just so happens that in addition to cars, some companies used them on buses too.

@@pistonburner6448 duly noted. I meant " stock taillights " used on buses. (or at least happens to be used on buses amongst other things) But your correction stands

Sort of, he ordered it from Paul Rosche that worked at BMW at the time, he used the V12 from the 8 series as a starting point, but it was severely modified.

@@MatheusSilva-qm1ft layout design sure, but if Gordon says it was built from scratch, I tend to believe him.

​@@MatheusSilva-qm1ftit has nothing in common with the 8 series v12, not even the block, biggest similarities are with the e36 m3 3.2l Euro evo engine, S70/2 is basically two s50b32 engines mated together.

@@r129r16pfl technically the E36 has half the F1 engine as it came first. It is not two mated together.

@@JJJJuice Murray is a genius no doubt. But he's also a salesman. Watch his T50 and T33 vids and he is selling HARD. I don't think he lied per se but I do think he leans on his mystique and monetizes it. Not saying he shouldn't just that he's well, a salesman. "From scratch" and "used the same layout" are opposing statements.

Some older lambos (1990s-2000s can go over 200 with under 600hp on a naturally aspirated v12

Do some research you’d be surprised

@@cablevamp3163 tell us

627*

​@@Nocturnal39 the difference between 200 and 241 is like the difference between 120 and 200, drag increases exponentially with speed.

First generation VW GTI are still that good 💓. And the E30 M3!

Plus, the timeless looks..

1. It's 0-60 time is beaten by countless of other cars, and same goes for top speed. 2. The F1 has less racing achievements than most other cars. The various 911s and sports saloon, beat it in most catagories. 3. The sound is good, sure. But it's not that different to any other V12 with the correct exhaust. 4. Miura, Countach, Diablo, Murcialago, Ferrari F40/50, XJ220, EB110, Porsche 959, to name a few.

​@@rickg8015 timeless!

Rowan owns one.

It's still overrated, it may be glorious but so is every other legendary and overrated supercar, other overrated examples include the Ferrari F40 and the Bugatti Veryon

Somehow I missed out on that school trip. Wouldn't have minded to see and hear that. It's a bit odd to see such a high top speed for that (claimed) peak power. And then it's a 3-seater to boot.

@@NeurodivergentSuperiority I disagree, this was the first money no object version of a no-compromise, pure engineering solution. Practical with more than two seats, room for luggage / golf bats, every effort to solve engineering issues such as heat dissipation, high speed stability and effortless performance instead of straining the limits beyond a durable engineering solution. It was a easy to drive at 30mph as it was to drive at 200, you didn’t need to wear earplugs or get your clothes dirty on the unfinished carbon fibre bodywork or lack of carpets. It was the million Euro car and started the trend for perfectly engineered cars such as the Spyker and Konigseg.

@@gbphil Get over it

Gordan says his new version is better

Yes it is

Still is

Aren't taillights certified for road use in general like they do in the States?

@@LouisSubearth I'm no expert - just relating what Henry Catchpole said when he reviewed an F1 alongside a P1. A possibility was that they'd been alright on that old Bova bus when the bus had been newly certified, but when TVR / McLaren picked them up years later, perhaps the standards had moved on and they were not approved for new applications. I can certainly imagine that an inspector - getting a good chance to look over a 240mph super car - might not have dwelt on the exact approvals lineage of the tail and indicator lights! I mean, had that been me I'd not have been looking at the taillights at all, and would be telling the manufacturer about the extensive amount of road testing I was about to have to do (months of it!).

of all the useless creator podcasts that exist, doug is the only one that I would watch, and he doesnt have one :(

Yes! It also won the BPR GT drivers championships in '95 and '96 beating the F40LM and the EB110s that Doug mentioned. The series was reformed into the FIA GT for '97 when the CLK GTR and Porsche 911 GT1 caught up and beat the F1. They were hardly designed as road cars first though.

@@Andynath100 and both of them took elements from the f1 lol

Even the Diablo GT had 300ZX headlights.

Carrera GT has the same headlight switch as a Skoda Citigo. I know this, because it's also the same one as in my Cayman and my friend who owns a Citigo won't shut up about it 😂

Good luck finding one these days. All these stupid paddle shifting thingies out now. But good request, in driving theres nothing more gratifying than shifting your own gears. Becoming one with the drivetrain !

McLaren F1 any time for sure...

@@MrTresto And I wouldn’t blame anyone for having that preference. The F1 just played no role at all during my and many others upbringing in the early 2000s so it never struck a cord with me. Again - generational thing.

I agree I Ford GT Porsche Carrara GT Lamborghini Murcilago too and I actually do like some 90s cars for me the king of 90s supercars is the Lamborghini Diablo all of them I feel the eb110 didn't get a chance don't like the xj220 originally it was appropriately rated now it too is overrated vector was overrated all in my opinion though

Nope. I was born in 2006. It's not a generational thing. Both the CGT and the Enzo, specifically the Enzo, are absolute turds. The Enzo was bettered in every way, experience included, by the 2013 Laferrari. The Enzo weighed 1.5 tons, which is quite a lot for a car with nothing in it. Like nothing. The gearbox was the worst piece of junk of all time. Not a manual with the feel and not even a dct. The CGT is also a overweight porsche el camino. The 918 was better in every way, including how it sounded. No one talks about this, but unlike the CGT, which had a fake Lemans v10, the 918 literally had it's V8 picked up from the LMP2 racecar porsche campaigned all over the world, including at lemans.

@@thehumanoid6543 exactly you were born the the late half of the 2000s of course you'd appreciate the 2010s cars you are actually maturing and have the ability to appreciate anything at all your comment is kind of negative I love the 2000s supercars while having respect for older cars and acknowledging they newer cars are better they had better be they are newer technology has advanced also the Enzo is lighter then the Laferrari p1 and 918 3000lbs is light for a car even supercars and hypercars. My thing is you can have your favorite group of supercars while appreciating and respecting the cats that came before and after

It was in their Park Lane show room. Whenever I walked past I would stop and looked at it in the window for a few minutes. The gold leaf in the engine bay always held my attention! It was there for a year or two. I would laugh at the ridiculous price (I think it was about GBP 900k) and wonder at how Maclaren were daft enough to think anyone would pay that much just for a car!

Actually it's Still the fastest NA car

How long ago was that?

Wasnt also the fact that he was with jay leno?

@@mrbillcollectaLike 3 years ago

i would be impressed too if i was being driven around by jay leno in his 20 million dollar car, doesn't matter even if it was a tuk tuk if its really worth 20m in the market.

He also loved driving the LFA and called it overrated. Enjoying a car doesn't mean that it can't be considered overrated.

Damn I spent all my money on the F1, I had exactly 25mil$. Now I can’t afford to fix it…

The T50 wasn’t discussed enough imo

​@@charlessloane definitely agree, especially since it's the successor, and has more modern technology and the hindsight of the F1

@@fast.biking_freddy it actually has very little modern technology in the car but modern technology was used in designing it to make pretty much the same basic recipe much better.

@@zvonimirkrajina2211 idk the hybrid system is pretty modern and so are the fan systems, but yeah lots of modern engineering too

In one of the latest T50 videos, Gordon Murray states that it uses ordinary, off-the-shelf road tyres.

Was going to point this out. I don't believe the F1 is overrated, but as you said, even Gordon admits that it has flaws. The T.50 is going to be his "halo" car

No it's not I think it's the ferrari 812 comp

@@mikainaidoo938 yes, it is

There is a naturally aspirated Honda Civic running 8s in the quarter mile. There's less money into it than a McLaren tire change. I think a clean Civic looks way better than the McLaren

In terms of top speed, it is still the fastest naturally aspirated production car in the world. The 812 comp doesn't even break 220 as standard, it's geared for track. Some (probably not road legal) modified civic is for a serial production car, so doesn't count.

@@TheRoverspeed yes, Mclaren F1 can crack 240mph with rev limiter removed

How can it be a fusion of things came after it? 😅

Several owners have already said that F1 is not so good, that it does not have high-speed installations, is not good at cornering, and only won Le Mans because the BOP at the time destroyed the performance of the competition, but there are several videos of races in which the BOP was more liberal and the F40LM, XJ220S absolutely destroy the F1 GTR and F1 LT ! F1 is just a lot of marketing

The mixed fusion of Koenigsegg and Pagani. I'm sorry how? Koenigsegg's very first CC prototype was in 1994 and Pagani's first car the Zonda debuted in 1999. The McLaren F1 was unveiled in 1992.

@@electrikoptik I'm not saying it looks the same, it has the elements of those two

@@alienxthemostpowerfulficti2888 How does it have elements of them when it predates them?

The F1's legend was definitely helped by its win at Le Mans on its debut. A great car yes. But when other manufacturers caught on there was no contest. CLK GTR/LM>911 GT1>F1

Exactly. I always thought it was bizarre that Jeremy Clarkson, a massive nationalist who should automatically love the car, never did too much just because it was expensive.

You can get a lot of nice cars for $20 million

If you have to look for other options rather than McLaren F1. Then you aren't ready to buy one. Atleast money vise. (Not you in particular, you as in general)

F1 owners already have those and more.

@@AndrasMihalyi touché