Agree. Its so easy to say yea i fuxked up, looked at my ult and relaxed, mb. No one would hate him. Happens. Even inspired can say i fucked up. If you play it off like ur never wrong it comes off so socially unaware and cocky
@@jal-kx6tmyeah that sounds so aus xD But man I really don’t get car sponsors for games. I think the sponsors would work way better if players actively used those things. For example in soccer when players do wear new shoes, fans will buy it xD But how does team liquid ace the enemy make me want to buy a new car???? XD
I’ve never really cared for sponsorships. But the other day I was strolling through Walmart and saw some Pagoda egg rolls. Bought them and air fried them. Those things slap! I love that LCS introduced me to the Pagoda egg rolls.
@@tinecchi3648 The idea is that if you're looking for a new car, Kia will be on your mind whether that's not or 5 years in the future because you had a positive opinion of them due to LCS ads, even if that opinion isn't fully conscious
I was glad for the Bwipo portion because the way Bwipo and Inspired talked about Jensen and the mistakes they made during the back end stuff was so delusional so I'm glad Meteos called the nonsense what it was.
When you guys spoke about the Dig interview, you should of thrown up a clip of it. I know this drives views away from the clip but it makes this show better and I'm sure the audience here would appreciate it
Another hype regular season matchup from the past was TL Doublelift calling TSM boosted and Bjergsen saying "I'm just gonna try and shut him up". TL leaves up reworked Akali and TSM first picks for Bjerg and then he goes 14/1/5. That was a good hype match.
I cannot fathom how 2/3 people really said that social status has even a shred of significance when it comes to the GOAT conversation. “Mahomes > Brady, you see his twitter following?”
You're saying what Azael is saying, and it's not what Kobe and Meteos are saying. It's not that social status is everything, but it does matter a little bit. All else being equal or close to equal, a player's impact on the scene can be the deciding factor.
Agree with Azael, following doesn’t mean shit in the GOAT conversation. It’s all about performance, consistency, and the you influence/change the game.
I kind of disagree with Azael about social reach not being part of a GOAT conversation. Michael Jordan doesn't win in every statistical category ever, whether it's total championships, points scored, or shooting percentage. But his impact on the sport at large is undeniably the largest of any player in its history, so having great statistics and great career moments on top of that make it hard to argue against him as the best. It will be hard to top Doublelift in that regards, and I say that as a person who generally doesn't like him at all.
Jordan might not be the literal top in every statistical category, but the conglomerate of his stats still make him the greatest player of all time regardless of his social impact. If there is a stat that exists, Jordan likely is near the top or number one.
Here's the thing about bwipo's response in that video: if he had just also memed on himself and inspired, it woulda been fine. But the fact that he got salty about the comment about him, defended inspired, and then shit on busio just means that he was being serious about it and that's' REAL weird in a meme content piece. Just calm down, man. You're here to fuck around and laugh at yourself and your team, not start even more beef in your team. I suspect that FLY is gonna run into the dardoch problem and if they do, I won't be shocked if they don't go to worlds.
I'm pretty excited as an NA fan for worlds. TL has been playing at a consistent high level for the last 4 months and proved they can at least compete internationally at MSI, C9 has the crazy high ceiling if they can figure things out as a team, and whoever comes out on top of the DIG/FLY beef should have some nice momentum coming out of playoffs.
Cant wait to watch LCS Sat and Sun, totally not Thursday Friday. Jokes aside I am rooting for Dig this season. 100% would love to see Dig and TL at worlds. I agree, they just have that vibe about them that makes it hard to root against them. Also I really want dig to do well, since we are losing two more orgs would be a shame imo to lose dig. Shoppify hasnt done enough and IMT feels like they are just happy they cant finish 10th.
I think it will be mostly decided by fan base/ viewership. Like I think SR and Immortals are the most likely to get dropped even if NRG end the split below one of them
Yeah immortals best year was.. their first one? Where they went like 17-1 2016 spring and then goofed it in playoffs I think? Then 16-2 summer 2016 (double RR BO3s) and goofed playoffs again. Then 2016 IEM Gyeonggi they actually made it to semifinals? But since then it’s been like perma mental boom lol That roster had Reignover, Huni, Pobelter, WildTurtle…
Goat topic - if we look at, as an example - Ali being the goat of boxing... did he have the best W/L rating? no, but he was great & revolutionized the sport with his own style & energy. He also did a lot for his people and was idolized for what he stood for. If we take that type of ideology to League of Legends. Doublelift came the closest to winning a tournament with the major regions (MSI) He was the UZI of NA, but he fell short at Worlds every time. I think he had the advantage of being one of the early big names. His spicy comments, made him polarizing, & has a highlight reel of huge plays in clutch moments. With all things considered. Strictly bringing it back to NA, with the number of titles under his belt & everything I mentioned above, I think he does stand the tallest in the goat conversation. I'm by no means comparing Ali to Doublelift, but I'm basing my take, off on how I perceive public view on Goat's status. This is also my opinion and not fact.
I feel people are expecting C9 to be prime skt or some shit. Bot lane definitely looks better and their macro is way better than spring. Just stop the dumb over aggressive plays and random deaths. These things should be easily fixable.
I sort of disagree with what Kobe and Meteos are saying about scrims, because I feel like players that limit test in scrims actually help improve the league. If you are playing against someone who is limit testing in scrims you yourself will improve your ability to punish the mistakes they make. If someone is just outright trolling in scrims thats another thing.
I hate the narrative has shifted so much since when they were playing. Bjergsen was always the goat for most people when they were both playing. He dominated NA for so long and got international recognition equal to DL. DL had much better teams when they were apart facing off, playing with people like Impact and CoreJJ. But now that Bjerg retired everyone is just looking at DL still soaking in the limelight and forgetting the real GOAT was always Bjergsen
Honestly it's a completely insane take to try and take social media into account for greatest of all time. It should be best player not all this other nonsense wtf lol
This first segment is boring asf can we please acknowledge Impact’s achievements without stroking DL more. And the social media presence is just a weird take
I think GOAT discussion should be specific to role considering how much more of a team game league is. Impact is indubitably the GOAT of NA top laners.
"looking at the team without the player and showing how valuable you were" Aren't most of the teams Doublelift leaves immediately better? Leaves CLG, CLG wins LCS with Stixxay, Leaves TSM, TSM wins LCS with Wildturtl Leaves TL, TL goes from 9th to 1st in the regular season with Tactical
Does Bjerg owe these guys money or something? In what world is DL better? He has less MVPs by far for a reason. He was playing on stacked rosters where guess what he wasn't even the best player! They had Core JJ winning MVP and the best weakside toplaner of all time holding things down. What a ridiculous comment by Meteos to say that being born domestically in the US makes you the GOAT. DL is closer to falling to 3rd behind Impact/Core/Blaber than he is overtaking Bjerg. These are such absurd arguments without even getting into the whole ridiculousness of the social media presence which simply doesn't matter at all.
@1:21:00 thank you Meteos for pointing out Bwipos behavior. That man’s arrogance knows no bounds. He won 2x lec splits and had a worlds finals appearance. All 3 accomplishments as a rookie in 2018. Hasn’t won a split since. Yet his ego is so massive you’d think he has caps / impact / perkz / doublelifts levels of trophy case.
I may be in the minority, so take this in context with other feedback you get: I love the dive, been listening since the beginning. Sometimes I just have to skip a few minutes when 'discussions' verge on arguing. The difference socials makes on GOAT discussion did it for me this time. Doesn't bother me when there is disagreement... But like each give an opinion, mayyyybe one 'rebuttal' each and then just move on. It starts to feel too much like I'm listening to an ego need for approval on your opinion. I'm sure that's not really it, you guys are all awesome and friendly and all, but it's just not enjoyable to listen when the disagreement is belabored over too long. Hope this came off and constructive feedback, keep up the great content! Much ❤ Azael, Kobe, and Metoes!
Saying social influence has no effect in the whole GOAT thing is just flat out wrong. Why is Jordan, LeBron, Messi, Ronaldo, Serena, Federer considered a GOAT? Terrible fucking take.
I would have to say Impact atm isnt the Goat but I think he pretty close to Doublelift. Impacts laning. team fight presence, His sheer ability to outplay when it matters and Even carry if everything fails. Double lift is the Goat atm but his return a few Yrs back was just tragic. They didnt do anything. And He retired shortly after tht. But if impact continues on this track i would say he could be the LCS Goat.
I personally think the Skarner rework was really successful. Previously he played as a walking Ult bot to lock one enemy down and felt really unimpactful to the game. You could do nothing by yourself. But now, Skarner is actually really fun to play (i only play him in JG). Having unique gank paths is always fun to play as a JG, and being able to build full tank and not feel completely powerless is good. Just tone down the numbers a bit so people stop whinging about him top lane and should be all good imo.
Man, I'm still frustrated that they gave bjergsen that goat thing or whatever over dlift. Don't get me wrong, I like bjerg, but they have relatively similar careers and dlift just won more titles on more teams. I feel like dlift objectively should have gotten the award. It's not like it really matters, it was just really weird to me.
The problem with 100T is meech is not upto zven or Yeon . One of things they relied on was senna last split but the same recipe wont work this patch. Its going to be easy for other teams to just mark Quid and River as they are the playmakers.
Stop blaming armao, ur midlaner shouldnt ward that way into sej azir no flash, always ward over walls. He playin like jojo or summit when he first joined league, no respect which makes lane easier but also makes u a gank target
I’m so excited for dig fly because of the drama but a huge huge reason is cause it’s best of 3!! It makes these tense moments more tense and exciting. I hope it’s a banger and that dig comes out on top, go Zven!
No way, that's the third esports I am following that has someone make the "Well GOAT for me is about social impact/what they did for the game" argument because they need to move the goalposts to keep their favorite as the GOAT (or in this case make it so it isn't even a conversation instead of DL being the GOAT, but others maybe being close soon) Glad Azael pushed back against it, he has the same conclusion, but seems to be the only one actually thinking through the question and coming to an answer that way, rather than having an answer immediately and then looking for a way to explain it.
No matter what, if you’re putting things to a vote, popularity will always be a major factor. That’s why (while I understand his point) it’s a very idealistic vision, but it’s not realistic. Perfect dreams situations are good on paper, but in real world scenarios, humans are highly emotional when making decisions. It’s not just with esports, it’s with any voting system, down to elections for the local school class president.
I mean I think doubelift or even bjergsen deserve credit for their impact on the game because of how much they drove the metas for LCS whereas Impact has never really done. He definitely is one of the most consistent players ever though
Doublelift is definitely the GOAT. After the tragedy that happened to his family in 2018 Spring the week before Finals, he was still able to hold strong and win the series for his team when any other person would have been mourning. He is LCS!! 🐐 X
@joshpointoh It's one of the reasons I've always thought he was the GOAT, not even because of all the championships and highlight plays, but the strength it took to show up on stage and perform when something so undeniably horrific had happened to his family.
Kobe makes a good point on how people are so inconsistent about those org changes. TL is Curse, NRG is CLG, Dig is Clutch objectively based on how the teams transferred. Geng is not Samsung, they just bought the slot and the players, no other team where this happens is considered the “same team” except them lol
If the staff is invested in the interviews and stuff, lets get a staff Q&A segment with a couple players! Could have a camera angle to catch staff reactions. Would be funny to get some troll or drama bait questions from them.
I think impact is the goat top laner because of his longviety and accolades however I don’t think he is close to goat status. Imo the reason for this is one there have been many splits in impacts career where he wasn’t the best top laner but one of the best. Also his playstyle and his champ pool does not do him any favors as well. He has historically been a role player who frontline and defends his team better than anyone other top laner. That doesn’t mean he can’t carry, but the extent to which he has to carry on teams is so small given the lineups he played with in the past.
I have nothing against doublelift i've always been a fan...but isn't it ironic meteos explaining what he prefers in a goat to be someone selfless and pushing the team when that couldnt be farther from what doublelift is lol...maybe im on crazy pills.
IMO Doublelift is not really contending with Bjergsen for LCS goat. Doublelift was always a good ADC but there is a reason he only has 1 MVP. He was always good, but his rosters were always GREAT. IMO the GOAT discussion should be about an individual’s impact on his team’s title chances across time, not on team success. Put Sneaky on doublelift’s rosters and most of those teams are still winning tons of titles. Replace Bjergsen with anyone and TSM is a nothing organization with nothing to speak of after season 3.
Just ignore his last two splits 😂. I'm not denying his legacy but as someone who started watching in season 10, I couldn't understand for the life of me how this guy is the goat. I get it now after watching a lot of old seasons, but man I can't forget him TPing back to lane as Ashe without buying items during Worlds. Then he flames him team mates in interviews. I know that is a small window of his career and even now I recognize his legacy but as someone who stepped in during that brief period I was so confused.
@@462seb I would never try to argue that he isn't/wasn't extremely flawed XD But the part of him that drove the flaming side is probably the same part that has kept him in the game for 13+ years at this point. I was most invested in LoL/esports from 2013-2018 and then just recently got back into it and still need to catch up on a lot haha.
@@462seb watching more team comms and the co-stream with meteos and sneaky made me realize doublelift was just a good mechanical adc player. his game knowledge and macro seem inferior to other pros, especially the junglers.
Impact is definitely the GOAT Top laner, but he’s never been considered the best player in the league (or even top 3 tbh), hard to be the overall goat with that
I mean name a played who's had as much international success as Impact who you consider a goat. He's also come close to winning MVP of the split several times. He's also won the League 6 times, 2 without Doublelift.
