@@GregRohr thanks my ancestor did have problems with debt but even with all that he went to three different university's in Scotland and after coming to the states he was very anti-brit and got into law school people like Wilson is a dime in a few especially in todays world
@ethanschmid4104 1:30 yeah I the part I was amazed that the script writer added in the part about him be a lawyer well know during his time, if I had one wish I would had gone back in time during the war to meet him once
I like this scene. James has been the puppet to Dickenson's puppet-master for too long & he finally grows a backbone & stands up to him for what he knows is the right thing to do & not what others want him to decide
I'm sorry to ask this, but did he? He says in the scene that he's voting for independence because if he voted against, he and Dickinson would be the only ones remembered for it, forever. If he votes for, he's just another voice in the majority demanding America be free.
@@stratisification This part is fiction, for the drama. The real Wilson gave his vote after a delay so that he could go back to his constituents and find out what they wanted, which he did. That's why he voted Yea.
This is a great musical and this moment is a great moment of plot, but it's not quite true. Franklin and Wilson were both pro-independence. Even though Dickinson was anti-independence, he saw Independence coming one way or the other and didn't want to stand in the way. He abstained from the vote and let the other Congressmen vote for Independence. There was a lot more to Judge Wilson than the spineless little man shown in "1776". He eventually became one of the first Supreme Court Justices.
also, he was very active in the Constitutional Convention, for which he is (I think) much better known than for either his Supreme Court service or the Declaration.
Sidenote about this: during Wilson's legal training, his preceptor (essentially his mentor -- an older lawyer who took him under his wing as it were to teach him how to do law "right") was in fact John Dickinson. Dickinson actually knew Wilson for longer than he (Dickinson) had known his own wife.
Franklin's manipulation of this scene is so good and so well-written. First he waits til the very last second so as to throw Dickinson for a loop. Then he moves closer into Thomson's view, so that he'll be called on first. He knows Wilson, being seated and always in the shadow of Dickinson, will be called on last. If Wilson were called on before either of the other two, the gambit wouldn't work, but he's counting on Wilson's anonymity in more ways than one. Then he lays it all out for Wilson, with the "every mapmaker in the world" line being particularly well-targeted at Wilson's desire to avoid the spotlight as much as possible. Finally, as Dickinson gets increasingly more condescending and nasty, Franklin becomes increasingly supportive, offering Wilson the shelter he needs to break with his pal Dickinson and vote in favor.
Oh actually I can make this EVEN worse, thanks to a biography of Charles Thomson that I'm currently reading. Charles Thomson started out his political career as essentially a Ben Franklin Sycophant, but they completely (and messily) parted ways over Franklin's response to the Stamp Act (popular opinion in Philadelphia being that Franklin had essentially allowed it), and part of the reason for that was John Dickinson. Dickinson didn't particularly like anybody when he was in his late 20s but Franklin was a particular target of his ire and that and the fact that Dickinson and Thomson were both VEHEMENTLY against the Stamp Act naturally drew them to each-other. Thomson was basically Dickinson's only friend for a good eight years (most of the 1760s), and to be a little hyperbolic Thomson essentially left his first wife "for" Dickinson. By 1776 Thomson and Dickinson were still extremely close friends, and Franklin, being friends with Dickinson's wife (and having been friends, before she died, with the first Mrs. Thomson), would absolutely have known that. That basically turns this scene into Franklin making Thomson essentially complicit in the worst thing that's happened to John Dickinson for like... six or eight months.
In the play, it's because the NY legislature couldn't decide what instructions to give their delegate. In the play, after this scene, the delegate basically says, "The hell with the NY legislature. I vote yea."
I believe at the time, the law was that NY couldn’t actually vote, though they could attend the meetings. Maybe the filmmakers didn’t want to specify that, so they just had them say “New York abstains, courteously”
This was no easy decision to make, in any case. If he votes nay, then America stays under the tyrannical thumb of George the Third; yet, voting yay-even not bearing arms-he lays his very life upon the altar!
