The key design feature that you need to keep in mind when analyzing the 2 different systems is that the single track needs significant ballasting on the front of the tractor to keep the weight displacement spread evenly, where the 4 track system does not need that additional weight. If a single track system is insuffociently weighted on the front end, it will cause the majoity of the weight to be pulled to the rear of the unity and therefore cause more compaction.
The steering pattern of the Case also plays a role. The driver can arc the case to give it some percentage of anchor, while maneuvering the forward movement.
There is more to take into consideration here. Weight of tractor, horsepower, I think the set up on CaseIH is better track wise than JD. My brother worked for CaseIH and they did a plow test with a Cat Challenger set up similar to the JD and they put the plow as deep as it would go in the ground and the CaseIH pulled it. Challenger sat and spun.
I used to run a challenger MT 865 it had tracks like the John Deere and turning it was much more responsive and faster than the quad track which made it much easier to operate. And your mud they both get stuck with the quad track was much harder to pull out due to its weight.
i have operated both deer and challenger track machines they cant be beat for power and smooth ride and they both turn fine under load but when you think about it how often do you really turn under load you rise the implement up when you turn and yes i have seen quads stuck too nothing is unsinkable.Cat also has a hydro hitch when put in float makes it turn under load really nice,ps hit the diff lock and drive right thur the slop
After perusing the nebraska tests for fuel consumption comparisons, I can't find any discernable difference in fuel consumption. Both, at max power get about 15 hp*hr/gal (drawbar power). Technically the Deere was listed at negligibly more, but it is tough to find apples to apples comparisons so I would consider them equal. The comparisons were for the two tractor models in the video.
@cmajoen thats weird we used to have three case tractors and a john deere: two 285s, a 270, and a 8220 the 270 completely crapped out on us, one 285 is constantly breaking something (i mean a bi-weekly ordeal), and one has caught fire, and the worst thing thats happened to the john deere is that the pto sensor comes unplugged every so often in the sunflowers i also have to mention that theyre all about the same age the john deere isnt more than a year older than the cases
Seems they both can do the job. My question is which company can offer a better deal to the farm to make our food prices slightly less? Getting a weeks worth of food at walmart shouldn't be $150. Just my opinion.
The cost of a tractor will not influence food prices at all. A farmer gets a tiny margin of what the food sells for at the store. The markup goes almost entirely to the processing and marketing of the food. Crop prices that the farmer receives are determined by world markets, not the end user.
Matt S Point taken. I'm actually a mushroom farmer in Colorado. We don't have the need for such large equipment. However, the equipment we do have greatly effects our profit margins. I jumped conclusions and assumed it was the same for larger scale farms.
Sorry, I did not realize that you are in the food production industry. I would have to assume that your mushroom farm is very intensive! Still, does your mushroom crop get sold for less at the store when your cost of production goes down? Just curious
Me and my dad are big time wheat farmers in the panhandle of Texas and we have tons of these case quad tracks 16 combines and lots of other tools and we can pull out a crop pretty efficiently
Matt S That's a loaded question, and depends on how you want to look at it. If my farms size remained static, yes. It would lower the consumers cost without a doubt. But, my focus currently is to be Krogers sole supplier of fungus on the west coast. With every efficiency gained, profit is gained as well. And that profit goes into growing larger as a company (selfishly) and does not lower the cost to the consumer.
how would you explain the wire between the john and the "tatra" then? It's attached higher on the tatra than the deere, that means the tatra actually are pulling the back of the deere up = bad traction for the deere. And what about the big ugly box on the tatra? are the tatra's standard weight 14 tons without box? or with box?
Therefore, indentation or ridges in the soil will negatively affect the track-to-soil contact, lessening floation and increasing soil compaction. on a QUADTRAC the ground PSI is 5.6 pounds...
Yeah they even look alike two flat tracs on one and 4tri tracks on the other. Steering also the same your right they r the same thing in different colours
@duane2072 to mantain better track-to-soil contact, JD and Cat or "two track tractors" must add ballast (weight) to the front and to the side of the tractor. Adding the additonal weight to the front of the "two track tractors" increases soil compaction as well as operating costs. Therefore, indentation or ridges in the soil will negatively affect the track-to-soil contact, lessening floation and increasing soil compaction. on a QUADTRAC the ground PSI is 5.6 pounds...
The quadtrac is by far the best tractor on the market it is good in dry conditions and it is great in wet conditions and will go where no other tractor will go and it is very hard to get is stuck. but now there are 3 different quads out there is case, new holland and now john deere just put one out but i will always love the RED.
John Deere blows. We had both on our farm and the Case is a far superior machine. Just purchased a new 620 quad and also have a 535 quad. Awesome machines in my opinion.
@AZTD1 I plan on taking the tour one day. I have talked to a local JD rep that has, but If I took it today I would see that the smallest tractor they make is 65 horsepower (respectively). I didn't need an internet search to know what's made in America. I have a firm grasp as to what I'm talking about. Look; Deere, CNH, AGCo, they're all global corporations that have employees worldwide. They don't care about "made in America" as much as we do. Waterloo Iowa just ain't what it used to be.
@AZTD1 No, you don't understand anything correctly. I said there is no American made utility tractor under 65 horsepower. I am fully aware of the "M" series John Deere tractors. The other utility tractors are made in India and the fancy sub-compacts are made in some freaking where that isn't America. Yanmar powered, you figure it out.
Ive owned red and green. I like my Case IH better than my JDs. Only reason why I buy JD is the dealership is alot closer and if they dont have parts on hand 90 percent of the time theyll have it by close that day or first thing the next morning. Case give me less emission and sensor problems.
Between these two designs, regardless of "brand" which means nothing today, the Deere looks simpler to maintain and more reliable, with less to go wrong.
Ben Lake Well I mean the red one has an articulated frame (complicated) and four track pads. The Deere has two track pads and a solid frame, simpler and inherently more reliable!
cristiandemirel1918 Yeah lets not for get the the Case Quadtrac has a near prefect 50/50 weight distribution when under a full draw bar pull... combined with locking diffs... the two track system is for cavemen
krrrruptidsoless the only reason why case didint continue to full pull is because as it was dragging the shit out of that Deere the Deere was piling up the dirt behind the tracks and eventually made a small hill behind him.You can see that when he backed up at the end.Case won this,there is no arguing about it
It would be close. A D9 weighs right at 110,000 lbs whereas the Deere weighs 44,000 and the Steiger weighs 51,000 for a total of 95,000. I don't know but I imagine the D9 has more aggressive tracks so I would agree with you. Though, if the traction is close usually both get bogged down as the smaller tractor gets drug backward and digs a hole for itself that the stronger tractor is unable to pull it out of.
@cmajoen hes right we tried john deere its twice the price to operate per hour and has more plastic on the deere the the case ih the deere is more expensive for more plastic
That John Deere weighs 40,000lbs while the Quadtrac weighs 58,000 pounds. Big difference, and im impressed with the deere for holding its ground so well! Im a die hard John Deere man, but love those beastly quads at the same time. But for practicability the john deere is much better as far as ground compaction which makes it a much more job oriented tractor, unlike the quad that can pull anything you throw at it. overkill if you ask me. the 4 track articulation is a great design none the less.
And, the soil conditions matter, and the track design matters. So, it is really not that simple. One thing that is almost directly proportional to traction is the total weight applied though. Also, despite what most people seem to think, horsepower has essentially zero relevance.
@AZTD1 No, you're wrong again. CNH Global's headquarters are in Burr Ridge Illinois. I don't know for certain, but it may be the test facility of the original Farmall farm. You're not telling me anything I don't know about the Netherlands and Fiat, but you should know Fiat is majority stakeholder and not the sole stakeholder in CNH Global.
You guys do realized that both Case and IH no longer exist right?? The last IH rolled off the assembly line in 1985. Red vs green may have been an argument our grandparents had, but it's not valid anymore. They are all the same multinational/globalized companies with pretty much interchangeable parts. Also, the IH had four treads on the ground, not two. Also, the treads on the JD were longer than the more compact treads of the IH, better torque, not a real test.
@bigcow29 Case is a global company just like John Deere. Their tractors are made all over the world. All utility tractors under 65hp are made overseas somewhere. The Quadtrac is an American made machine.
Hey... Guys... we are all in one brother hood "farmers" Does'nt matter if its red, green, yellow or blue.... It always gets the job done... A world with out farmers, is a hungry world...;)
are they just talking about deere bringing out a quad trac style tractor or are they demoing it already? there has been talk about that for 2 years now and i havent seen anything
maybe in just the big tractors case wins, my brother works for the Nebraska Tractor Testing Lab, so he test them, and case have alot more problems with theres compared to john deere, case may have a tractor with more power, but hows it gonna pull anything sitting in the shop all year long?
Just a little longer tracks on the Dere and i bet it would be a fair fight. The track area on the Case is larger, that's why it's winning. The Case still loses to an APC though.
To my eyes they were both spinning and gaining nothing. The quad pulled ahead till the driver in the deere let his foot off the clutch. Then they both just sat and made dirt piles behind them.
I shouldn't have said you were saying stupid things. However, what makes one tractor out pull another? If in the context of a tractor pull it has no dependency upon horsepower. Horsepower only determines the rate at which a given load can be pulled, not the size of a load. The size of a load is wholly dependent upon traction. Traction is a function of 1. Weight 2. Dozens of other variables including soil conditions, tire/track contact surface area, tire/track wear, tire/track design, etc.
@wandyamull I would have to dissagree with this statement... operating costs on a Case are less then John Deere I have found out... My Case tractors have lasted longer and have had fewer repairs then my JD ones... also parts for Case tend to be less expensive then JD as well... this is my viewpoint having owned both kinds of tractor brands
@fjnunesaz Let's be honest now. International trucks are still part of the original International Harvester. They probably make the best mid-level, utility diesel truck. I know they don't have the refinement of a Peterbuilt, but man they can rack up the miles.
The only reason the case won was because it has more track surface area in all 4 tracks on the ground were the john deere only has 2 tracks on the ground.
