The thing that got me though was that moment when I realized they were taking game mechanics such as leveling it up, getting party members and effectively making them actually part of the story and making them such a dark thing
"... trust in your training....trust in yourself.....never doubt what you have done..... all your decisions have brought you to this point..." that quote just breaks me.....
Well it is of course a metaphor for all of us. In all of our journeys, all our decisions have brought us to this point. That's some brilliant writing, far better than most of the junk in Hollywood!
Even though this was before clone wars and the clone wars, it’s like a combination of both Qui Gon’s lesson to Anakin to trust his instincts and Maul’s statement to Ahsoka that every choice they made led to that moment.
Funny. This made me feel sorry for her, and the whole Sith as victims of a terrible misconception. At least the Jedi tries to control it, but a Sith is always a string doll, of someone else that manipulates it. Like Vader was to Palpatine, or its just downright acceptance to live a lower sphere. It is a terrible parasitic condition. Kreia protects the exiled just so she could feed on her as seen in the end.
She's a philosopher incarnate. A lot of her philosophies are almost like a blend of Nietzsche and Hegel - the criticism of categorizations AND the dialectic nature in which she conducts herself.
Very good scene. Kreia was quite possibly one of the most interesting force users. Someone who deconstructed everything about the Force, choices, the very nature about the Star Wars Universe. She knew almost everything about the force, while hating it all the same.
wow, when i first played through the game as a kid i didn't get it but now hearing it again as an adult my mind is blown. the game writers took basic rpg gameplay like leveling up and companions, took them and then turned them into a story about corruption and influence. It's just beautiful. Lily if you are into Fallout (completely understandable if not) in the final dlc Lonesome Road of Fallout New Vagas the writers do something similar with the narrative, twisting playing the dlc itself as a bad choice the player is making but a choice they will make none the less to squeeze every bit of content they can out of a game. in completing the dlc you lose, in just playing the dlc you have lost.
Obsidian clearly puts a lot of focus into their narrative and trust the intelligence of those playing their games. if only every developer took a similar approach. Either way i love when games do this type of story telling, gives me chills.
anyway Lily if you like this type of narrative it might be worth it to you to play through Lonesome Road or at least watch a playthrough if playing a game like New Vagas isn't your thing.
Yeah it's like a dark twist on the "power of friendship". Usually that's a good thing but here it's kinda dark to think the player character is alive and growing only thanks to his companion's energy.
Hell this whole Game deconstructs a lot of things. Like how one person can get stronger by killing, how they are able to draw and bend others to their will even if the don't notice. Changing them, compelling them to actions they would otherwise avoid, or disagree with.
This... this was the moment I realized Star Wars could be something more. From the start Star Wars has always been an easy good/evil light/dark kind of story, but KotOR 2 showed me that the Star Wars Universe could be so much more complex, if it truly wanted to be. (KotOR as well, but to a much lesser extent) The movies can screw themselves, THIS is the kind of story I want to see more of in Star Wars. Lily, I know commenting on a video you made clear over a year ago may be a long shot, especially since MLP, and to a lesser extent Korra, seem to be more your focus. But, would you perhaps consider making a video on why KotOR 2's writing works so well? Why Kreia works so well? And, if you have the extra time, why the movies don't capture any of it even in the slightest?
I think the movies have several lectures depths only the characters can't be described as deep as in a video game you need to put most pieces together like clone wars and some novels/comics, the story telling of how the republic fell into an empire was astonishing if you begin with from darth plagueis novelization and watch those clone wars seasons in between those movies for example
Kreia never wanted the Jedi dead just to see their own hubris, but unfortunately they could never see past there blind devotion to doctrine, cutting them off from the force was her attempt to make them see the universe for what it was but the shock killed them, having the force ripped from them killed them.
@@vexile1239 correct. She showed them the very thing that the exile had to confront, and unlike her, and like so many other Jedi could not willingly sever their connection. And like the Jedi before at Malacor V they died
if you are not light-aligned but still left the jedi masters alive (entirely possible to do), instead of saying "because you were afraid," kreia will say "because you had no choice." interesting little change.
What’s heartbreaking is that you’re pleading and begging for zez and kavar to an extent, but especially zez, to side with you because he understood so well what you’ve been thru yet he chooses to stand with the corrupted council because he’s scared and feels alone :(
I just love these SW games. Hands down my favourite Star Wars games/story. Really sad that the third one got canned, because it sounded so interesting.
There is one thing in this game that I noticed after playing... most times I went full lightside (very easy for me to do) or full darkside (extremely difficult for to do) but I never went the path of the "grey" jedi (je'dai) or maintained the neutral alignment like Kreia did (at least to this scene) because if you noticed she needed to centre herself on more than one occasion and the journey she was on with the exile should not have exhausted her to much but here we see her so tired and exhausted at the start of the scene... I think that from the very beginning she was actively resisting the influence of the force bond with the exile which left her physically and mentally drained at least until she was able to free herself from it
I remember getting a bug or something in this game that made it to where this scene didnt happen i walked in talk to the counsel and left to finish the game and no one died ( as in the part with keria didnt happen and the council was still standing when i left) XD, i thought i was like the ultimate good ending so i kept trying to get it in every playthrough XD
I never played the Knights of the Old Republic games and being a Star Wars fan, that seems like a sin. I did however, get in the MMO Old Republic which I really enjoyed cause of its character driven stories based on which class you picked(Sith Warrior, my favorite). But this scene crazy philosophical in the ways of the Force. There are so many ways that the Light side and Dark side can be interpreted. I believe that there must be a balance between the two which Darth Revan believed.
I will always prefer the philosophical/political themes portrayed in the prequels and other material from that era, than the super simplistic good rebels vs evil empire rethoric.
I was always wondering how Kreia had this magic "cut off from the force" ability, but now I wonder, was she simply just forcing the feelings that the exile felt onto them, only for it to be so strong that it killed them?
Man, Rei would have just told them they're wrong and obliterated several worlds to prove otherwise. The Exile was done dirty. We live in a world of shit.
I think Kreia was developed enough in the force to be a grandmaster of the order, & for that reason, in her era she figured enough to be a sith lord/lady just in order to save the Galaxy because neither grandmaster nor knight discerned (or perhaps just never wanted to confront the math). I think the story is still being written. I don't think the writerrs of this story/conversation were thrown out.
She never wanted to save the galaxy at all, she was somewhat of a grey jedi studying all aspects of the force, though she did lean on the dark side a bit more for her views of opposing the force rather than working with it. Her true goal was never to protect the galaxy, it was to eliminate the force entirely to break free from the will of the force. Although there is free will within the star wars universe it is only to a certain degree, the force has a will of it's own and works in mysterious ways to maintain balance and stability. Anakin Skywalker is said to be a creation from the will of the force itself to bring about balance. Krei wanted to essentially remove the guiding hand of the force and create true free will.
Darth maul plagiarized Kreia, Kreia: every decision you have made has brought you to this point Death maul: every choice you’ve ever made has led to this... moment...
cool but context is something im gonna need. i played the first game but couldnt kill the final boss cuz my own character was under leveled and i never played this one. should i?
Yes, you definitely should. Being under-leveled won't be a problem in this game. And while KotOR 1 will always hold a special place in my heart, KotOR 2 is my favorite of the two, as it moved beyond the cliche and the tripe and makes you question some deep-seated Star Wars ideology (thanks in large part to Kreia, the old woman here who just kicked the Jedi Masters' asses).
Not quite. The Jedi, because they feared going too far beyond their comfort zone, only had a partial understanding of what the Jedi Exile was and the danger (or lack thereof) that she posed. They did not wish to kill her and were not going to; they feared that her growing connection to the Force would function like a beacon for the dark presence (i.e., Darth Nihilus) they knew was out there, that they knew they needed to deal with, but that they also knew they were completely unprepared to face at that point in time. They were going to sever her connection to the Force (when done right, it does not seriously harm a person at all) so they could continue to assess the situation from afar and finally prepare their next move. Kreia, on the other hand, condemns them for never going far enough to discover the cause of the dark presence they felt, and for never truly understanding what the Exile did, what she really is, and why she did what she did. At Malachor V, the Exile knew instinctively that to retain her connection to Force in the face of such overwhelming pain and death meant she would die too. And so, without even thinking about it or knowing she was doing it, she severed her own connection to the Force in order to survive. So, to Kreia, the Exile is the living embodiment of her philosophy-that the Exile is a genuinely free being and that life _can_ exist apart from the Force. So where the Jedi Masters see the Exile as an aberration that needs to be fixed (and you can't really fault them for this, because they don't know any better), Kreia sees her as a beautiful incarnation of true and free life. This was her desire for the whole galaxy, a galaxy free of the Force controlling everyone and everything. In her own words: "She brings truth, and you condemn it? The arrogance!" Thus, to prove her point, Kreia turns the Masters' judgment upon themselves (i.e., she severs their connections to the Force). Only they die when she does so. They could not comprehend life without the Force, having lived their entire existence tied to and reliant upon it, that its loss was too much to handle. In Kreia's estimation, they we weak in the very thing that made the Exile strong.
As much as I love this game, I can never sit down and come back to it because the slog of the opening of Peragas and Telos 4. Especially since Peragas is a long and convoluted way of the game telling you that you are being hunted by the Sith, and you forge bonds through the force, and Telos is just there to establish that the Jedi are in hiding, and you were kicked out of the Jedi, and it takes up a solid quarter of game leading to horrible pacing issues where the entire rest of the game is taking place at rocket speed compared to the opening 3-4 hours. It's especially bad compared to Kotor1 where the opening established a lot more, wasn't as crushingly boring, let you make decisions about things other then the history, and possibly most importantly let you interact with the world, all while taking up a substantially smaller part of the game, since of the 15-20 hours it takes if you are just doing the main story and nothing else you can finish Taris in less then 2 hours.
I adore the game, but those are absolutely valid criticisms. Obsidian Entertainment does seem to suffer from pacing issues in general. I've never played it, but I hear that as a regular criticism for Pillars of Eternity.
