Laying a block edge course 

UK paving talk on Facebook is a joke for those who think they know better, but you do do get some friendly critism of advice which good.. No need for bitchinness.

Thanks for the confirmation, Paul!

What is the mixture to make this dry mix?

Do you have a picture??

Into every life a little rain must fall, but it's the sunshine that people such as yourself bring to my work that keeps me going, no matter how many idiots feel the need to make a public display of their ignorance. Thanks, Llyr!

Tony McCormack really good clean job, nice one pal. It does make me laugh reading the comments, I'm a builder from London 😊 thanks again

I

Nice

My only suggestion for next one is a belt. Also that seems expensive having to use that much portland or concrete. Can i use like sand, playground sand and top it off from there?

There's always naysayers and trolls - ignore them. I'm glad you found it useful!

Van Blue filimhd

You're very welcome!

You're very welcome :~)

Andrew Ovenden I agree

I'm a psychologist; that's your Autonomous sensory meridian response (ASMR); isn't it the greatest!

Good luck with it - send me a photie when you get finished!

Thanks for the kind words - if I'm known for anything, it's my 'matter-of-factness' :~)

I'm assumed the 'hose' is perfoarted to allow water ingress, but if so, why bury it within the concrete, where little water can penentrate? It would be better positioned just inside the edging, buried within whatever fill material (soil/lawn/gravel/etc.) is being used. Good tip, though, Caoimhin (a name more normally seen in Tipperary than Texas!)

Steven Smyth -I kinda feel the training started in the middle and didn’t show the final product. How about showing us how to set up the string line too.

I know lol just get a 2x4 and hammer that down...you don't wanna point anything that we rely on for sensitive accuracy..

They would, but that bonding isn't essential to the performance. The haunching is the critical component, as it is that, along with the rest of the concrete mass, which provides the restraint. The blocks are merely the 'icing on the cake' - it's the concrete beam formed by the bedding and haunching that's the real functional part of the construction.

...and you are obviously a person of excellent taste! :~)

You are very welcome :~)

There are *so* many regional and local names for that type of sand. We refer to it as concreting sand, but it is also known as sharp sand, grit sand, bedding sand, and as you pointed out, screeding sand, plus many, many more - read about them here - www.pavingexpert.com/aggs01.html#sand - The official name is the flows-off-the-tongue "Gf85 0/4 (MP) fine aggregate"....but we call it concreting sand :~)

no gravel spotted when levelling. it is mortar not concrete

Please read the explanatory text, the linked wbsite page or any of the dozens of other messages asking the very same question.

When it's just between two points, as long as the string line is taut, it *will* be straight. When there are more than two points, or when there are intermediate points, then an explanation is given on this page of my website - www.pavingexpert.com/setout01.htm#straight

To ensure it bonds to the bedding concrete and makes for the strongest possible undowelled day joint. Laying kerbs/edgings onto a wet mix is very, very tricky

Thanks for the kind words

@@TonyMcCormack you're welcome, may i ask a question, do you know the best place to buy metal road pins? so far i have only been able to find wooden ones and they dont seem as good for setting out accurately? thanks

@@ronanduffey Greenham Trading, Parkers, York Survey Supply - lots of links to good suppliers on the Tool Supplier Listing page on my website: www.pavingexpert.com/links14 ....naturally, this assumes you are in Britain

Thank you for the reply, sorry did not see the traders page on your excellent website, and yep in England!

@@TonyMcCormack I used the road pins very successfully on a patio and block paving project thanks to all your information. Moving onto a block driveway next. How would I haunch against a fence of a shared drive? Is this a scenario where the splash strip is useful (noted your website comments!)

You could if you wished to, but how "presentable" is that side face? Some pavers have prominent spacer nibs that might detratc from the finished look, but then there are plenty of pavers that are 'nibless' and might be ideal. If you like them, then that's all that really matters!

@@TonyMcCormack I'm using simple brick pavers and I only ask cause that's one of the two options I have other then cement and would like to know which would hold better. If it were available here, I'd definitely do plastic or metal edging cause of the more cleaner look that it provides.

@@brokenbutterfly3178 A concrete bedded edging offers firmer support than any plastic or metal edging system (unless they are bedded into concrete), but bvear in mind that concrete as an edge restraint isn't suitable for all countries. Those experiencing significant frost heave need a different strategy than the one we use in Britain and Ireland.

@@TonyMcCormack thanks alot. I think I'll use pavers as edging since getting a clean look with concrete is a bit of a task. Plus, I wouldn't have to worry about redoing the edges after every few years. Thanks again and I hope you have an awesome day 😊

How will you get the sand and a level block next to the edging if its bedded into concrete? Youd need to chip away at all that excess on the inside or the main paved are near the edge would sit proud.

Yes to all your questions! Although this particular edge course was used as a retainer edge for a lawn of artificial grass, the principles are the same. You can read much more about the block laying process on my website - www.pavingexpert.com/blocks2.htm - where each of your questions is addressed and answered far more fully than I could manage here....

As explained in the supporting text: it's a semi-dry mix that relies on the natural moisture in the aggregate.

+Teri Guerin You're welcome

As long as you don't undermine the paving units and leave enough in place to keep them locked in position.

Exceptionally careful chiselling and an acceptance that the clayware will probably break, I'm afraid!

Depends on overall width and type of paving. Blocks can be bound or unbound construction, but, generally speaking, flags are bound. Loads and loads of guidance on the main website - www.pavingexpert.com/blocks2.htm

Thanks. I'Il take a look.

Tony McCormack fuck you and this McCormack!! go back to writing books cuz that driveway luks like dog shit wrapped in 🐈 shit

As I've replied to dozens of others asking the same question, the details of the concrete mix are provided on the accompanying web-page referenced in the video

Thanks, found it on your site. It's excellent btw!

Set up a taut string line as your level guide. It's important to lay the blocks to a consistent level/plane, and so much easier for the grass on the lawn to adapt to suit the edgings, rather than vice versa!

Give it 48 hrs then see if you can push a screwdriver into the haunching with ease or does it offer resistance? If it's not too easy, then the haunching will be fine, but if the screwdriver slides in with ease, it will probably needs replacing. My best guess is that it's probably just the outermost 10mm or so of the haunching concrete that got over-wetted by the rain and remains a little softer than desirable.

Will do. Thanks for the guidance.

All is fully explained on the linked page

Yes - it frequently is!

I like to think of myself as a professional. Mind you, I've only been laying paving for 47 years so still a a way to go.....

mixed mortar

You need a minimum of 100mm of concrete, really. I know some people use just 50mm but this often cracks and fails, so we never use less than 100mm.

If the clay is firm (can't leave a bootprint in it) and reasonably dry, you could place concrete directly onto it for a driveway project edge course, but if there is any doubt, dig it out, build-up with a sub-base material, then place the concrete.

Probably not because there is insufficient depth of concrete to resist frost heave. It's designed for the temperate maritime climate of Britain and Ireland.

@@TonyMcCormack thank you for the reply. I was worried that might be the case. I'm guessing I'll have to dig down and create a base with gravel and sand to set the edging properly for my climate. It's hard to know.

Always lay the blocks to a straight line, not to match the ups and downs, humps and hollows of the lawn. The grass will adapt over the years, but the concrete-bedded blocks are immovable. Follow any fall or slope on the lawn, but keep to a straight line. I wouldn't bother mortaring the joints.

@@TonyMcCormack Many thanks , for the quick reply.I will do as you say. Thanks Again

On the website - follow the link in the descriptive text above

We don't have HD or Lowes in Britain or Ireland, so I don't know what they'd call it. It's sharp sand with optional 6mm or 10mm gravel, and Ordinary Portland Cement (OPC)

Thank you, really appreciate it. I should be able to find them.

It depends on bed depth. There's some guidance in the table here.... www.pavingexpert.com/edging3.htm#lay, but that little project of mine used almost two barrowfuls to bed and haunch 6 linear metres. Two bags (20kg) of grit sand per barrow plus a quarter bag of cement (5kg)

Tony, that's really helped thanks, but just to confirm the ratio- your 6m edging used almost 40:10kgs? If so, I reckon 160:40kgs should be adequate for my requirements.

No: Just spotted my mistake - it needs 10kg of cement to make a 4:1 mix with 40kg of sand. So, two mixes @ 2x20+1x5 = 80kg sand + 20kg cement to lay the 6m, including haunching. There was a bit left over, but if you reckon on 4 times as much, so 320kg sand plus 75-80kg cement, you'll not be far off.

@@TonyMcCormack so Mortar, not concrete.

Concrete. Cement is a component of concrete (and mortar).

It doesn't really matter, I suppose. I always prefered laying onto a sub-base because it saves on the amount of concrete used and you are sure of getting the correct depth. Others will lay over the sub-grade, but that often requires the use of additional costly concrete. They argue, though, that the concrete race then acts as a retainer for the sub-base...but sub-base material is cheap, compared to conceete, and I was taught that it's better to have some lateral spread on the sub-base rather than have it precisely the same width as the pavement under construction. If you look at road-building, the improvement layers, the geo-textiles, the capping layers, the sub-bases always spread beyond the edge of the pavement, so that's how I always build my edge courses.

@@TonyMcCormack thanks for your reply, also thanks for your website it is very helpful

Any aggregate under 20mm would be OK. Use a 1:2:4 mix ratio - 1 cement to 2 fine aggregate (sharp sand) to 4 coarse aggregate. Lots more about bedding concretes on my website - www.pavingexpert.com/mortars.htm#mixos

Tony McCormack thanks very much I'll take a look

Yes, a DPM will help maintain w/c ratio of the concrete, when you pour it, and protect the underside of the concrete from aggressive groundwater, once the path is completed. Extend the DPM so that there is 200-300mm spread beyond the outside edges of the path and lay your brick edgings onto a concrete bed placed directly onto that DPM.

The bedding mix is what we refer to as "semi-dry" - there is sufficient residual moisture within the fine aggregate (coarse sand) to hold it all together when it's compacted, and, once it has hardened, no worm, ant or beetle (other than a Volkswagen!) is going to make the slightest impression on it. Read more here - www.pavingexpert.com/layflag3.htm#s1

@@TonyMcCormack haha 😩😂😂

It's the correct bed depth and haunch width for a restraining edge. I'm a professional paving installer with over 45 years experience. Why would I skimp and do a weaker job on my own garden?

just because you are a professional doesn't mean that you're right...that is a lot of concrete on and in the ground for one level of brick as a garden edge...

In this case, I'm right. You can build flimsy edge courses if you wish: I prefer to do it correctly, in accordance with the British Standard.