The goal of this video is to have a nuanced discussion about a show I absolutely adore, that I feel has room to grow in all of its representation, including its central Asian influence. No one is saying the show is inherently racist or needs to be canceled, so cool your jets a bit if you're feeling defensive about that. The possibility of ninjago having room to be even better is extremely exciting! So let's come at it with that attitude! My asking this might be a lost cause, but if we could try and be respectful in the comments that would be greatly appreciated :)
As someone from Asia , I’ve never really seen Ninjago as representation in any way? It’s really just aesthetics, and the lack of it in later seasons never really bothered me, though I did find all the quotes of wisdom reiterated throughout the show pretty awesome, like the “never put off till tomorrow what can be done today”, and “as iron sharpens iron, brother sharpens brother”. They kinda reminded me of idioms in Chinese culture, like “一寸光阴一寸金， 寸金难买寸光阴”, stuff that rhymes and gets repeated sometimes to remind others of certain values. The only thing that really put me off was when they called what Nya was wearing a kimono. To me it looked very much like some vaguely traditional Chinese dress cause of the collar. No kimono has that sort of collar. Tho in my knowledge Chinese dresses with that collar don’t usually have a wrap around the waist, so maybe it’s a modernised traditional dress??? Yup please Ninjago never do that again Edit: ok looking at the dress again now with the pants she wears underneath and the long slits it actually looks kinda Vietnamese?? Yeah I still don’t get it Also the fact that the show is about ninjas which is Japan inspired but Nya wears a lot of traditional Chinese inspired outfits lol I kinda miss Nya’s old outfits tho😅 cause they were a bit more feminine but she was portrayed as quite badass with Samurai X and stuff. She could look pretty and kick butt at the same which was pretty awesome to me
This is how I've always seen it. Yes, Ninjago is heavily inspired by Asian culture. But it's not actually asia. It's a fictional realm, and in this realm, most of the world just happens to seem Asian. So I think the reason why they're steering a bit away from the Asian inspired look, is because they want to emphasize that this is not Asia. that its a fictional world that's a combination of eastern and western culture. Kinda like San Francokiyo from Big Hero 6, or the world in Fullmetal Alchemist. And I know Lloyd seems pretty white. but when you look at his parents, they both seem Asian to me, and apparently some ancient Asians had blonde hair, and some geneticist believe blonde hair might have actually originated in asia. So, consider that Lloyd's family is ancient, the blonde hair kinda makes sense. I don't know. I don't see it as that problematic. Tho I'm not Asian, so my opinion isn't exactly valid XD. But I feel like if it really offended people, it would have been canceled a long time ago.
You could tell a lot more thought was put into Monkie Kid with as it’s heavily based on China. I’m not Chinese or an expert I’ve seen many people praise it for embracing the culture but also being accurate and not displaying any negative stereotypes. Ninjago on the other hand feels like a mush of American and ‘Asian’ culture and keeps going back and fourth between China and Japan with little to no research
I’d argue that Lloyd is Japanese, or at least half Japanese due to his family having clearly Japanese names. And how can you say Lloyd acts white when you have Jay right there?
It frustrates me, because the cadence of the joke so clearly reads as ‘Nya is the normal one, and Jay is the weird one who wants to wear a dress!’ even though the dialogue itself is… so close to getting it right.
Ninjago's an Asian-inspired cartoon fantasy world. If as a viewer you think this show is meant to be an authentic portrayal of Asian culture then I don't think that's the show's fault. This show is ninja/Asian themed because it was fun. As long as we're all having fun and acknowledge that cartoons aren't reality. I don't think there's a problem with that.
I agree, in the vid she seems so conflicted about this “issue” even though it’s really not a big deal. The show is just “based” on Japanese culture. Nothing more, nothing less. The show is loosely based on many cultures and that’s fine! It’s supposed to be for everyone.
@@jaydenjitzu6878 I know right. It's not a political or cultural issue, it's a creative one. She's overthinking it imo. (No offense, Kitten, you make great content and you're a legend!)
@@YaboiFoxTale It is a creative decision, but it's a creative decision that involves pulling concepts and culture from real life places, with real history and baggage attached to them. So when the show inserts these real life things into its world building, I feel it should at the very least try its best to be respectful of the stuff it's using. It doesn't have to be an accurate portrayal of real life, but it shouldn't be actively perpetuating stereotypes or misinformation in the process either- especially because it's aimed at kids.
@@ParachutingKitten You know what, I guess that's fair enough. Personally if I was in charge of Ninjago world building I'd probably try to do the same as you, be more accurate. There's this fanfiction I read once that had a little word dictionary at the beginning to explain all of these Asian culture references they had put in there and personally I think it really meshed with the world of Ninjago and I'd love to see something like that in the show :)
I felt that season 6 of Ninjago was heavily influenced too. Djinn’s are an Arab concept that originate from the Middle East, and most of the time they revolve around Islamic theology. Yet, none of that felt represented in any part of the season other than Nadakhan’s accent and voice. His crew was even more white washed. Don’t even get me started on FlintLocke. It’s as Texas as you can get with him.
I think it's worth noting that the sky Pirates all came from VASTLY different backgrounds, so it makes sense for Flintlocke to have different cultural themeing as opposed to Nadakhan, it gives the group a more rugged, "outcasts banding together" feel like it's supposed to have. That said, yeah, I'm not religious but I have heard critiques regarding Djinns in media in general. I guess people are less vocal about it since Ninjago... isn't really known for accurate cultural representation. At all.
@@BATMAN-zw8nf I am an Arab Muslim and I confirm the accuracy of what you said. The wishes and tea pot thing was just a fantasy thing like the tea pot of alaa aldeen مصباح علاء الدين, the whole concept was a myth in a certain period of time thousands of years ago. But however it’s quite fun and interesting to read about. And also, eid mubarak😅
Off topic but this vid is edited really well! It’s really cool seeing someone’s skills in video making (if that’s what you call it) get better in real time
4:44 That is...not even a kimono. The collar and whatever the bottom half is supposed to be (leg slits? drapey front??) suggest maybe a Cheongsam/qipao or Tang suit? But that is emphatically not a kimono. Kimono don't have that kind of collar in any universe. Nya,, my girl,,, what are you talking about...
At the end of the day Ninjago is for everyone and it’s just BASED on Japanese culture. It’s job isn’t supposed to show representation but it’s supposed to be fun for all types of kids. It’s a LEGO show with YELLOW people. It’s not a big deal. If this show had a similar concept with Peruvian culture (I’m Peruvian btw) I wouldn’t care at the least because it’s a freaking AWESOME kids show that’s loosely based on my culture. I call it a win-win!
Honestly I'm not sure what to think about that. On one hand, this is a show that does use asian influences, but on the other hand, it's a fantasy world. Of course, everything we make takes influences from something, so that's just a given. Ninjago may have started with asian influences, and it certainly carries that throughout, but it's pulls a lot from a lot of things. It's very much an amalgamation of ideas and cultures. To say that it needs to be fixed to better portray asian cultures, is kind of odd considering this doesn't take place in asia? The show has ninjas, samurais, and an asian-inspired setting because it's cool, and kids like stuff that is cool, and I believe that was their reasoning to begin with. Is it wrong to take from other cultures for use as entertainment? I wouldn't say so considering thousands of movies, shows, stories of all kinds use foreign settings despite the writter not being from said place. I would have a problem if it was having a negative effect but as a kid, I never thought any less of asian cultures because of this show, and as you said yourself, many people never even associated the show with that, which is ultimately a good thing. To say the show needs to be fixed, I don't really agree with, as I don't believe it's broken. Ninjago is its own world. Influenced, yes, but not in a negative way. You can say the characters are coded (especially zane... ba dum tsh), which I can agree with , but based on what you've said, wouldn't Lloyd be at least half asian anyway, since his dad is the brother of Wu? Design aside, that would be the case if we go with what you said. Personally, I've never heard anyone perceive the anime-inspired segments as racist though, so that was a new one for me lol. I don't think that crossed many people's minds, so it's probably all good. Really the perception of the viewer is what matters. If the show was obviously racist and offensive (just making an example here, not saying it is), then yeah it would be a big issue, but the fact that not many people have brought this up just shows that people have not perceived it as such. In other words, the show is mostly inoffensive and is passing fine. Hasn't activated those red flags for most people I would say, especially kids who just think the show is cool, and don't think much about all that other stuff. Character and writing-wise, sure the show can DEFINITELY improve (just overall really, not even exclusively on the representation side) and I'd like to see it do so. I really respect your opinion though in the community so I'm glad you talked a bit about all this. Even if we don't totally see eye to eye on this, but perhaps I'm misinterpreting what you meant, so maybe you can correct me on that.
It sounds like we can at least agree on the basics: Ninjago is fine currently, but it could do a lot better Now to clarify a few things. I'm not trying to say that using real life cultures in a fantasy setting is wrong- that would be impossible to uphold and completely undesirable. But I do think that when you are using pieces of real culture, you should take extra care to show those pieces the respect they deserve, because they come with a lot of real life history and baggage. In many ways, I think your comment about them using the aesthetics mainly because 'ninja are cool' and kids will gravitate towards it is a good point for explaining my position. Because while that motivation isn't actively malicious or offensive (and that's great, especially considering there's content still out there that definitely is) I don't necessarily think it's the best mindset to have while using real life marginalized cultures to build your setting either. Like maybe there should have been more to the thought process than "this will be marketable to little boys!" because that comes off a little like you just want to use the culture for money. Not actively degrading a culture is definitely an important part of representation, but positive stereotypes can still be damaging, and neutral in tone misinformation will mess up the public's understanding of a culture. These problems are more likely to stem from ignorance than malice, but both are capable of doing damage. Honestly, obviously offensive content that sets off red flags may be less damaging because it does get caught in your filter of 'being wrong'. Smaller problematic depictions that slip under the radar are the ones that have the ability to impact our perception, and that's scary to me. The very fact that our perception is shaped by the things we can not perceive necessitates that this be about more than just general audience perception. I think the standard should be higher than "it's probably fine". Yeah, ninjago is passing fine, and that's great and all, but I want it to do better than that! I want it to have actively positive representation! I want it to feel like a love letter to the cultures that inspired it! My statement at the end isn't necessarily about ninjago being broken beyond repair, far from it. It's about how it's sitting on such a fine edge of representation that I'm not sure what the ideal in the scenario would be or look like. And yeah, with a blended fictional culture it's gonna be tough. But I believe that ninjago can do it so much better than it is currently, even if where we're at right now is maybe, technically, fine. Anyway, I hope this helps flesh out my opinions a bit (and comes off as earnest and respectful as I mean it :). I really appreciate you taking the time to share your honest thoughts.
@@ParachutingKitten thanks for the clarification! That's a good point you bring up about red flags, as sometimes the things that slip by can subconsciously get to us. I think that overall, this was a very worthwhile discussion to start, so thanks for doing that the community. Looking forward to whatever's next from you!
I figured this show is a product of its time, given that it aired in 2013. While not a justification, the conversation of whether a piece of media was culturally sensitive wasn’t particularly loud. Now, I’d like to think that the conversation is a lot more present. However, I can’t deny that it doesn’t sit completely right with me that various aspects of different cultures are taken and thrown together to make some sort of agglomeration. To be fair, Ninjago is sort of stuck dancing on this line of whether keep taking influence from cultures or separate from it. If anything, I kind of would like to see more Lego series that are based on specific cultures, like Lego Monkie Kid. There’s dozens of interesting and unique stories that could be told, while providing better representation.
I feel like just the concept of Ninjago sets it up for failure on the representation front. I'm European so I can't really comment on the Asian perspective specifically, but stealing the aestethic of a culture and slapping it onto a fantastical setting without keeping any of the actual culture is something that happens all the time in media. If "poorly researced melting pot of stereotypical medieval European Aestethics" can be a fantasy setting, is it that big of a crime if the same method is used to make an Asian-inspired setting? I think wether this kind of thing is okay or not depends on how creative the setting is, how much respect the storytellers have for the cultures they're borrowing from, and just how much inaccurate rep each individual viewer is willing to put up with. Ninjago has been kind of lacking in the creativity and respect department from the very beginning, which means they can't really win. Because either it would have to commit to the fantastical setting and start divorcing itself from the cultures is has borrowed from, which isn't possible without drastically changing core aspects of the theme, like the very title. Or it could lean in to portraying the cultures respectfully, which would also be a challenge, considering how it has already portrayed parts of the cultures in ways that are inaccurate at best and offensive at worst. I think LEGO has realized this though, cause Monkie Kid looks like a successful attempt at telling a Chinese story with both creativity and respect.
I don't think it really represents one group of people. sure, it takes inspiration from Chinese and Japanese culture, but it does so with others. such as the island of the keepers, with Hawaiian inspiration, (why do I always think of the pizza when writing this word?!) Ejyption inspiration from Aspheera's old tribe, Anglo Saxon/English inspiration from Shintaro (with a lot of lotr references put in there, just to make sure we were aware of it. thx writers) with also the explorers club being off of English steryotyped people, with Zane also sometimes slipping into an old English accent, and many more. so if we try to say that Ninjago is just Asain representation, we'd pretty much have to include all of the other rep as well, and just end up in a cluttered puzzle. this all comes down to the point and purpose of Lego. its not just supposed to be for one group, its supposed to be for everyone, and represent everyone in the world. that is the very reason why their skin is yellow, believe it or not.
In no way am I trying to pinhole Ninjago as only having to be just Asian, it obviously pulls from a lot of different cultures depending on the season (especially in later seasons). However, the primary and original influence of the show is HEAVILY Asian inspired, and it forms the cultural background for our main characters. The title is "/Is It/ Asian Representation" for a reason. The question isn't if its the only influence, but if it's an influence that, when present, is being done effectively and respectfully as to constitute positive representation. And this could be said for all of its influences. Are the island people any form of positive representation for pacific islanders? It plays into a lot of stereotypes as well. Does the never realm serve as positive coding for native americans? It's a complicated topic that perhaps doesn't have any concrete answers, but I think Ninjago definitely has room for improvement.
@@ParachutingKitten Does the never realm serve as positive coding for native americans?" I would say no, since they are more inspired off of the Mongols, than the Eskimos of America, with their clothing and village style. though it does hint at some inspiration. of course Ninjago has room for improvement, with representing different cultures, I agree, but I think that since its never really important to the story, and usually only with background design, its pretty fine to brush over when making it. and since its a kids show, sometimes steryotypes make it more enjoyable to watch. such as the Explorers clubs accent, and their obsession with tea. though that obsession is also technically with Wu, which actually makes sense since tea was invented in china, but back to the point. I would say that the show is more culturally inspired, than that of the actual people. it makes representation of culture, than the people living in it, to leave room for a mix of different cultured accented characters. which was what I was trying to get at, in my earlier theoretic. though I do apologize if it seemed a bit dismissing, and ignorant, with how I phrased it.
As an Asian I freaking loved this show not just for the cultural part but the overall. I do get a little upset that artist make there skin color darker I told this to my dad about it but when I said legos are yellow he laughed becuase Asians are known as yellow 😂😂😂
Yeah, I adored the movie and a big reason was the multicultural representation at its center. It was gorgeous. Honestly I like the show’s potential more than anything. Like the best seasons by far for me were 8-10(well 10 was rushed rip but it was also the end of the og series so I’ll give it a pass as they were probably canceled at the time) and the heavy Asian influences in the art styles and the characters. And I swear to god if they only fucked up the fact about kimonos so that they could be “woke” with Jay correcting her, I’m gonna fuck up. As a queer, nuerodivergent, disabled, white person I can say they’ve missed the mark by miles half the time. I hope they have other creative leads working on dragons rising with Andreas, cuz man has some fun ideas but fucking has a terrible time effectively producing them. Like, the best thing about this show was it’s missed potential and definitely Pixal (and Zane but poor dudes been benched the sequel series). And the fandom, the non-homophobic/racist side of it. And the movie. It got such a bad rap at the time, which is a bummer cuz it’s simply a fucking really well done fanart au (essentially). Well, the irl bookends to the movie are kinda rough but I digress … huh I had more to say than I thought. But I loved the way you did this video and conversation starter. And thanks for letting me infodump about one of my current hyperfixations
This is a show about spinny lego ninjas who ride dragons and fight snakes. I didnt think that this was a discussion that needed to be had, but good video nonetheless
i think the part about the anime is 100 percent fine, they have lego skin because they are lego characters, it isn’t meant to be realistic, it’s mainly just a funny test of what the show would look like in different animation, i don’t find ninjago racist in any way but rather just starting as an asian inspired show back in 2011 because they should the show would only run until 2013 but when it continued they made rebooted, a season where the whole city gets a makeover and since then i think they focused less on asian culture but hints of it throughout the show
In context, I agree the anime is fine. I'm not trying to call it out as racist or cancel it or anything. I 100% see where its coming from. However, presented out of context, the asian characters in the anime with yellow skin might come off as offensive, and you can never control who might stumble across your content out of context- especially since they aren't presented with any other lego features. In universe, yes, we have an explanation for the asian aesthetic fading after season 2, but doesn't it kind of seem weird that an upgraded and technologically advanced city implies that the asian coding be removed? Idk, Tokyo in particular seems like it would be a great technologically advanced inspiration for a robot takeover season. It's not a huge deal, but it's a little thing, and there's a lot of little things like that about the show.
@@hannawhite7605 Monkey Kid definitely has deeper asian roots, but its 2d animation also portrays them as legos, with claw hands and lego proportions and stuff, as opposed to the anime sequence which attempts to make the characters look specifically human. It's a fine distinction, but I do think it bares some amount of weight. That extra context being built into the animation helps, for the same reason ninjago's CG lego figures don't warrant criticism, it's clear that they are legos.
@@hannawhite7605 that's the thing. I think labeling it as definitively "bad" or "not bad" is a little reductive. Is it an offensively bad thing we should feel bad about? No, of course not, but in the future, I don't think I would recommend the show do it again in the same way. I would definitely recommend taking a more monkie kid style approach so that it can be as accessible as possible, even out of context. It's important to not vilify it, but it's also important to notice the room for even better awareness.
I'm actually really glad someone's talking about it. Even for someone who isn't Asian (like myself) it's... kinda obvious Ninjago has a bit of a problem in general. And I want to preface with that I don't mean to call it "racist" or say that it's a horrible show and should be canceled/that you can't enjoy it, I still enjoy the show, and that's exactly why I want to critique it. The entire idea behind LEGO is creativity, and Ninjago amplifies that with giving the viewer a lot of creative freedom and room to think. Which includes thinking about the flaws and how they could be fixed, or how Ninjago could improve. So, let's talk a little bit design. Ninjago is basically one half of a formerly whole landmass that... got split in two. Which isn't entirely important for the moment. The landmass itself has a lot of different climates and locations that don't entirely match up with many real world countries, and this is sort of exemplified by the difference in culture. For instance, Ignacia and Jamanakai draw more cultural inspiration than other areas. Then you have clearly fictional things like Shintaro, which draw inspiration from a variety of architectural styles and high fantasy to create a new culture. Which is cool, and it's kinda purposefully left sort of vague for people to run off with and feed to their idea monster. But these locations... are rarely used. Instead, what see the most of is Ninjago City and the seasons themselves... yayyyy... Ninjago City is the outlier in that all around it you have these east Asian inspired cities and people surrounding it, but then the city itself is VERY american/western. Like, culture shock much??? Imagine going from Ignacia to see an event in Ninjago City and suddenly everything is western. In the middle of the part of the continent that is mostly east Asian/Asian. Now, America is a country that is kind of a hotpot of cultures and people, but the reason this is an issue in THIS context is that it makes no sense and feels shoehorned in for the sake of appealing to western people. Since most of the show takes place in Ninjago City, and next to none of the other locations HAVE japanese culture, and yet we still see the Ninja wearing... well... Japanese clothing and weaponry and such yet never actually appreciating Japanese culture beyond cast away mentions or branding, it is definitely a form of cultural appropriation (lUsing another culture or religions outfits, jewelry, ceremonies, practices or brands as an outsider without caring to uphold the cultural significance of it). This is EVEN more prevalent when there is no reason for such a westernized depiction. We don't know of any cultures or cities in Ninjago that actually have American, or even English coded cultures (outside of the Explorer's club). It has no reason for being there, even if it were a China town situation. It's just a really strange choice. Having an American styled city/culture is fine. But having it be front and center to the point it eclipses the culture you are using to advertise your product feels pretty scummy. Because yes, Ninjago is a kids show, but it still uses cultures to sell and advertise their products without respect for the people of that culture. Which is not only tokenizing it, but also pretty disrespectful to East Asian culture, and specifically, their people!! It's a kids show, right? So do kids not have the right to feel themselves represented in media? Many different kids shows and games nowadays DO incorporate different cultures into their world and do so in a well researched and respectful way. Just take a look at Pokemon, or Splatoon 3. Both being massive Nintendo IPs which mainly market to the same exact audience as Ninjago does. Being a kids show is not an excuse. Like at all. And that's without touching on Ninjago's characters. Now, due to lack of canon skin colors and not wanting to generalize cultures, I wouldn't say Ninjago has whitewashed characters, especially since foreigners, immigrants and/or people from mixed cultures do exist, so you can't say much on them without it treading the line a bit. I do definitely think Ninjago has an issue in specifically how it chooses to portray things though. Like, I feel like they just should've leaned into the cultural inspiration. It feels like they were going back and forth on "Well should we give them representation or stay safer by appealing to the west" and just sort of haphazardly got stuck in the middle. If Ninjago had different cultures that evolved on the different parts of the continent, that were either like Shintaro - A culture that whike inspired is still it's own thing - or like Jamanakai or Ignacia, leaning more into the asian origins, and having at least a few more characters actually represent that culture, then you wouldn't have as much of an issue because not only would the world feel more coherent and actually, you know, not shoving a bunch of cultures in only to never pay attention to it, but villains like Chen wouldn't be as off putting or out there because he wouldn't be one of literally the only Asian characters in a show trying to use Asian influences. Even then, it would still have a fair variety of problems to work out I'm sure, but it'd at least be better than the current state. Plus, you know, the writers need to do more research into the culture they're taking inspiration from. That's just my take though, I'm bad at explaining stuff...
@@hannawhite7605 Because if you are very deliberately using Asian culture to sell your product and then not actually properly representing it, that's pretty disrespectful towards Asian people. Kids show or not, if it wasn't seen as profitable, then it should never even have an Asian basis if all they were going to do is appropriate it. The argument of being a "kids show" isn't valid at all, like I said, just look at pokemon, one of THE best selling franchises of all time, filled to the brim with different cultural inspirations and representation, having fictional worlds that are clearly their own, but also respecting the original referenced culture and making sure those people feel represented.
@@hannawhite7605 My issue is not that they have Asian ideas, it's that they use it as a marketing tool. They use the ninja concept as a branding tool, but the show itself shows little to no japanese culture, or accurate portrayals of it. Now, mixing fiction and real life is fine. But that's not what this is. They took japanese concepts and then made most of the series American/western. Not to mention, this show is aimed at children. Children who have likely not watched any form of japanese media or anime before, asides from maybe pokemon, which isn't as japan inspired anymore. The point is, it's not difficult for them to educate themselves on the culture they are using. Either they aren't doing it out of pure laziness- which would send a very bad message - or it was a design choice to appeal more to western audiences, which is cultural appropriation. There may be a lesser of two evils but neither reality is good for a show directed at a young, impressionable audience.
@@hannawhite7605 I don't want Naruto 2.0, I never said that. Ninja does not = Naruto. I simply wish they weren't as culturally inconsiderate. But you don't seem to really understand the issue at all, so I think I'm going to end this conversation here.
Personally I don’t believe that Ninjago should even try to correctly or incorrectly represent any real world culture. 😊 They are not Asians or Americans, there are ‘Ninjagians’ ‘Ninja-ish’ or how you like or call them. It’s true that the show takes inspiration from real world cultures, ethnicities, myths anc legends, but what work of fiction doesn’t? Why should they (the characters and ethnicities) be a perfect representation of the real world when they were never meant to be? It’s not even set in our world, so why should look like our world? Who are we to say what a Ninjago person’s ethnicity and culture should be? How should we know? Of course, the only way we can comprehend a fictional world is by comparing it to our own, but what right do we have to demand that that I follow our worlds standards and perceptions? In fiction I believe there are two laws: logic and physics. Logic must stay the same where ever you go in what ever world you create, but physicists can be what ever you want it to be. To me, it’s seems logical that a fictional world with a completely different history to our own, with its own origin story and its own unique set of humanoid and non humanoid life, should have a totally different and unique approach to culture that does not necessarily to mirror our own. In conclusions, my opinion has been that there is no ‘western’ vs ‘Asian’ in Ninjago. Ninjago, and all the diverse cultures and peoples of that fictional world, are a culture unto themselves. ‘Representation’ is not required or needed.
What even are the ethnicities in Ninjago? There are Serpentine, Shintaro peoples, Oni, dragons hunters, Djinns, etc. even among Serpentine there are different kinds.
I feel like Ninjago is more of a “any sort of young boy could be represented here” but it was made with an American audience in mind, so reflected some tropes of cartoons like that. All things considered I think the Asian aspect does seem to be focused more in newer seasons tbh
1:40 this has sent me spiralling down a rabbit hole of Lloyds birth… Sensei wu is obviously Asian coded, by relation that would make Garmadon Asian too. So how is Lloyd the byproduct of that? Even weirder still, where does Lloyds blonde hair come from? We’ve seen both young Misako and young Garmadon and they both have brown hair. Does Lloyd dye his hair? because his movie redesign has brown eyebrows.
The blonde hair probably comes from FSM who might had blonde hair when he was younger OR it came from Misako’s parents or grandparents. It’s mainly genetics and such. Lloyd just managed to get the recessive gene (blonde hair) instead of the brown hair gene like his mother and father.
Thanks for talking ab this, I think it’s been somewhat of an issue for a while now. Like, yes, Lego intentionally doesn’t give characters specific skin-tones/races(?), but when they’re intentionally trying to incorporate parts of real-life Asian culture, they could do better to accurately depict it, instead of having stereotypical subtexts. They get some stuff, right, ig, don’t come after me, but, like you said, there’s room for improvement.
I think the best way to "fix" NinjaGo is putting more effort, care, and, most importantly, research, which, to me, is the main problem of NinjaGo. If you're gonna take some aspects of a culture and put it into your work, then do research on said culture so you can present your work in the best way possible. I have a character who is Mexican, and i did a little research on Hispanic/Latino and Latina (or latinx, if you prefer) stereotypes bc representation is something i deeply care about. PS: So, according to Google, you can be a full Asian (and full black) and still have blonde hair and/or blue eyes. It's just rare, so it's more than likely to be recessive genes, so i guess it makes sense for Lloyd to have blonde hair. He may also take it from the first spinjutsu master since he and Wu have lighter hair color while Garmadon has a darker one. Edit: just to avoid confusion, I was searching Mexican stereotypes to avoid falling into one that's all
**incoming essay** I think Lloyd is mixed and has hazel eyes (Garmadon is Eastern Asian and Misako is European). My HC is that he’s a natural brunette (which he thought looked very neat as it made him resemble his dad). However, as a very mean prank, the Darkly boys forced him to dye it blond which made him look a lot more like Wu (hence why he always wore a hoodie back then). He decided to keep the blond hair during s2 (he didn’t want to see his dad every time he looked in the mirror, and he was starting to grow into it) and he’s never bothered to change it since. **essay over**
1:41 personally as a korean kid who got into the show in the early 2010s I got so pissed off Lloyd became the star of the show by the end because I was rooting for Kai since he was working tooth and nail to prove to everyone else he would be the green ninja. At least I was kind of glad that the final shot of the final battle was mostly centered around Kai and kind of implying Kai was the protagonist all along, and kai's and Master Wu's master-apprentice relationship is the main focus of the show, but I was still mad. Now as an adult I kind of see the message they were going for, that not everything goes the way you want it to and you can't always be the center of attention/you have to be kinder to kids younger than you, give them the proper attention, be a good role model, and protect them. Personally I didn't believe lloyd to be white, his hair being blonde for the same reason the first spinjitzu master's, Wu's, and Angels in the bible are shown to have blonde hair and fair skin (because they're divine beings of light who were around during the creation of the world), but the fact he completely stole the show and was potrayed as a spoiled brat really rubbed me the wrong way.
Not to sound mean, but I really don't care if it shows Asian representative or any representative as I just want to enjoy my show. Also, I have never even thought Ninjago is showing Asian representative. If you want to say that they have made Ninjago show less Asian representative then that's fine, but then you have yourself asking if the show itself is racist, and I don't want to dip my toes in that. (Idk if this whole text makes sense as im very sleepy and tired rn)
Kai is the main character thru season 7. He’s not always the focus for that season. And obviously Lloyd is the leader. But it’s pretty clear Kai is portrayed as the main character between his speeches across the first 3 seasons and the dynamic with the pact to protect Lloyd in season 5
Well to me I'm fine with everything except dragon's design i still don't know why there Europeans at least in the first season they're hades was looks more like Asian dragon but now they didn't anymore💔 Well at least we have monkie kid now that show doing everything so good 👍
I felt the same way when I started to realise Ninjago was problematic, I spent so SO many days creating fanfiction and AU's and story that feel slightly pointless now, and I kinda drove me crazy trying to find episode in Australia, me and my sister started watching it in 2019? I think and I spent so so long on the internet trying to find s3 to s7 episode because our tv channels didn't bother to air it, and when I gave up on Ninjago, a month or so later all seasons became available on Netflix, Me: 😡😤🤬! And there's so many more reasons I don't like Ninjago and more including the story, I'll talk about it in the replies,
WARNING: if you really like Ninjago I don't recommend reading this due to you not liking something that brings you joy. Ok, so I've found, bad drama, gender stereotypes, a general mean feel and hardly any character development in the story of Ninjago, the ninja themselves are cold and snarky to each other in the beginning making fun of everyone which I get if you just joined and don't know how to behave but they still make fun of each other to this day, like best friends be like that sometimes but say/do nice things in return, they hardly ever do that, (#ToxicVibes😶) and they make fun of Zane a lot to, not just for wearing pink🙄 but just him being a robot, to think of it they make a LOT of robot jokes
Pt2: I feel like it's almost android racist??? Mean I saw I debate when I made the same point about Zane, it started as the whole "can robots feel?" "But he doesn't mind" "their not being mean if their aren't many bots" thing, and I know but the show says Zane doesn't want to seem like pure codes and 0 emotion, but they still nail in the fact that "haha he's a robot, he doesn't have trauma, let's hit him" and it feels like it kinda makes fun of people who are like him, who may have are nero-divergent(me) or autism, (which is not what they intended but is still feel like their on thin ice) and this constantly makes me feel bad for him, speaking of trauma that brings me to next part
PT3 (sorry if this is annoying yous) The characters hardly have any trauma from bad things that have happened, they will bring it up now and then but will move past it and nor deal, cry or get extra mad about these events, and because it's a KiDs ShOW they won't do that, the specifically bring the drama to keep the older dramatic fans involved but not have after effects to keep younger audiences, it's cheating the chance of a good story/development so they can get more money (like Zane and the ice empower's past in the book) Their is other shows that can somewhat do the best of both which makes a good story, now for the last part, one specifically about the topic of the video
Pt4 🥴 And yeah, I do feel like the disregard the culture due to, again money and keeping the fanbase (ya can't keep everyone happy) I am happy they put in LGBT Sally in this who is bi, for their LGBTQ community but they don't fix the mistakes in the past and still use strict gendered things, (why do they have to keep pointing out Nya is girl??) And, oh god the anime scared me, they didn't use anything unique, Nya isn't muscular, at ALL, they aren't proper proportions for their age (I mean the other could be adults but Lloyd should at least still be a teen, not sterlloyds)Zane is terrifying, when he's the nicest ninja (again, he's trying to be more human, well he sure doesn't look like it😳) and we don't know how old they are, which is minor but still! I'm sorry about this long long rant, just needed to get it out, I've found comfort in a new show that is ethnic, proper balance between drama and comedy and character development, Monkie kid please don't hurt me to. Good day and good on ya for reading this!💖⭐
Hear me out, folks: Remember the Merge? Master Wu implied once that something among the lines of that has happened before. So what if Ninjago started out as an “Asian majority” realm (hence some traditions), but then merged with an “earth-like” dimension which brought in people of different ethnicities? Anyways, here are my headcanons for the ninja (or at least what they’d be if I was the one writing the show): Kai and Nya are eastern Asian. Jay is probably Caucasian Zane technically doesn’t have a race, but he looks black mixed with eastern asian I think it’d be cool if Cole was South East Asian (I saw someone draw him as Filipino and it looked very neat :D) Now about Lloyd: **incoming essay** I think he’s mixed and has hazel eyes (Garmadon is Eastern Asian and Misako is European). My HC is that he’s a natural brunette (which he thought looked very neat as it made him resemble his dad). However, as a very mean prank, the Darkly boys forced him to dye it blond which made him look a lot more like Wu (hence why he always wore a hoodie back then). He decided to keep the blond hair during s2 (he didn’t want to see his dad every time he looked in the mirror, and he was starting to grow into it) and he’s never bothered to change it since. **essay over** Honourable mentions: Skylor is European As much as I love Pixal, I have absolutely no idea what she’d be, someone please help. (On an off topic note, I think it’d be cute if she had curls/defined waves! It’d definitely set her apart from Nya **stares intensely at whoever decided to let those two have the same hair piece**)
I never really understood the term "coded". Ninjago is where they're all from, they can all have any hair color but most of the character's skin is yellow. All of their ethnicities are the same. Even Wu who has the more cliche asian appearance was blond when he was younger.
I duno hoss calling it represnation seems too much for me as its just a kids show barrowing asian elements from different cultures hell some of it's not even asisan as they are. Arabic concepts Celtic concepts Native American/Canadian concepts Greek concepts british and norse concepts and a few of american concepts too. Its just a combo of different stuff to make a fictional world feel more fleshed out its not realy representing folks as its not really doing so well and thats because it isnt trying to in the first place. Heck even the things in this show are combos of different stuff. The Curesd Realm seems to be based on Hell, Hades and Purgatory with its very extistance being a lovecraftian nightmare. The Oni in name are based on the asian folk tales but share simularity in design with the modern view of demons. Bansha is based on banshees from celtic folk lore but she dress like some sort of asian warrior. nadakhan is based on arabic Jinn's but also of the classic dracula love story along with leading Pirates that sound British or American and dress in a combo of both asian estectic and British pirate garb. The master of Metal sounds Russain. Ect This isnt anything new in life as multiple stories and fictional worlds are based or inspired on a culture or a combo of many. It all just done to have a more richer and more interesting pupulation of characters and stories that dont have to limit its self to culural norms but takes all of them and forges a new one out of all the lore of these creautures and places.
Most of this stuff doesn't bother me, because it doesn't really impact the story, but I've always disliked the idea of The Balance Between Good and Evil, because it makes the Ninjago universe kind of depressing. It basically says that evil is a natural part of the world and can never be truly defeated because otherwise it would disrupt the balance. I think this comes from a misunderstanding of Yin and Yang and trying to map Western and Christian ideas of good and evil on to it. I've heard that Ying and Yang aren't supposed to represent good and evil, but are complementary natural forces. It also doesn't really work with Christian views on good and evil either, because I've heard that many Christian scholars say that evil/sin isn't a natural part of the world, but a corruption of good. Also, the Overlord is clearly meant to be a Satan like figure, but instead of being a fallen angel that isn't super powerful, he's an immortal god like figure nearly as strong as the First Spinjitzu Master. Although, I'm not an expert at all on Yin and Yang, and don't mind being corrected if I'm wrong.
Yeah, I adored the movie and a big reason was the multicultural representation at its center. It was gorgeous. Honestly I like the show’s potential more than anything. Like the best seasons by far for me were 8-10(well 10 was rushed rip but it was also the end of the og series so I’ll give it a pass as they were probably canceled at the time) and the heavy Asian influences in the art styles and the characters. And I swear to god if they only fucked up the fact about kimonos so that they could be “woke” with Jay correcting her, I’m gonna fuck up. As a queer, nuerodivergent, disabled, white person I can say they’ve missed the mark by miles half the time. I hope they have other creative leads working on dragons rising with Andreas, cuz man has some fun ideas but fucking has a terrible time effectively producing them. Like, the best thing about this show was it’s missed potential and definitely Pixal (and Zane but poor dudes been benched the sequel series). And the fandom, the non-homophobic/racist side of it. And the movie. It got such a bad rap at the time, which is a bummer cuz it’s simply a fucking really well done fanart au (essentially). Well, the irl bookends to the movie are kinda rough but I digress … huh I had more to say than I thought. But I loved the way you did this video and conversation starter. And thanks for letting me infodump about one of my current hyperfixations
