Making backyard crucible steel 

In the late 1970s there was an article in Scientific American magazine about research done at a University in Scotland on crucible Damascus steel. Part of their findings were that the most common mistake made in working the steel was overheating it, which burned off too much of the carbon. They found that the super high carbon steel became malleably plastic when heated to a moderate cherry red color. They also found that running a square cross sectioned billet through a roller mill as it cooled from cherry red to king's purple created a carbide matrix within the steel that was so fine it was only visible under an electron microscope. Footprint Tool Company of Sheffield, UK (out of business since 2009) adopted the technique and made some of the finest quality wood chisels and hand plane irons ever available. Several years later, Fine Woodworking Magazine did an article comparing wood chisels from England, Japan, Germany, and the USA by metallurgical testing. The Footprint chisel, when micro-sectioned, had the highest carbon content of all, and was the only one for which the carbide grain size was not given because it was beyond the test equipment's ability to resolve. My 40+ year old set of Footprint chisels, which I carefully hollow ground on a slow turning wet wheel as soon as I bought them, have kept a good edge like no other blades of any kind that I have ever experienced. They have been honed from time to time, but have never needed to be reground. My finishing stone for honing is a natural black Arkansas oilstone. I will tell you from experience that there is nothing more pleasing than shaving a 3/8" wide curl off of the end grain of a piece of white oak with just hand pressure!

*Points to broken glass.* "Pieces of my love life right there." A man after my own heart. Lol.

I love it when people show their struggles because it helps us all. Thanks for a great vid!

Crucible steel is fascinating, especially so because of the history.

Vanadium was the key to the original Wootz. Great stuff man.

Experimenting with various processes and techniques is how we learn what works and what doesn't. I think these sort of videos help others learn more about the craft and the more we, as artisans, share our experiences and techniques, the better it is for us all. Great video mate. Keep up the good work.

I'm not a blacksmith however, I'm a scrap recycler, prices have been very bad, so I've been trying out casting, been great so far but I've been looking into steel and cast iron, haven't found anything really. Until I ran into these woots and forging methods. Very helpful

Doesn't the crucible need to bleed the pressure as the air inside it heats up and expands? It probably ruptured due to internal pressurised super heated air. Either way, great video and good to see the experimentation. Another thing I saw recently was vanadium needs to be present for carbides to precipitate (with repeated heat cycling), forming the wootz pattern and giving the resulting metal superior properties over carbon steel. The video I saw mentions 0.05% vanadium by weight, so absolutely miniscule concentration, but without it, the carbides will not form.

This was most definitely a win. The failures are lessons. And you still made high carbon steel.

For your first go at it, it looks good! I like that you follow a scientific process in your video. Introduction, methods, results, conclusion.

I think you did a great job. Couple of points: crucible was larger than most. Pieces of steel were largest that I've seen, most were extremely small pieces. The glass has been crushed glass instead of large chunks. Wishing you the best of luck.

You know Ive watched a good bit of your videos I feel like at this point, and I don't know if I've left a comment. I just want to say, you do a great job. You are clear, and to the point, and no frills, but in a good way.

When you added the refractory clay you needed to leave a hole to let the gases vent.

Since you're going at it with the history that would be awesome to see you make some bloomery steel.

Hey friend! Ive always struggled with my high carbon steel welds cracking. After some research, ive found that the higher the carbon content, the less heat the steel can tolerate without losing structural integrity. These repetitive forge welds have to be done at the lowest temperature possible otherwise it will break apart

If you learned anything, it is a success. You're the goat my guy! Keep it up!

I've never been blessed with the opportunity to smith, but vids on the subject are something of an addiction of mine. Watching this vid, i already get a sense of foreshadowing in your choice of wrought iron as your base material, because you dont know what impurities are present, like sulphur, phosphorous, etc. Cant make a silk purse outta sow's ear ... gotta start with silk, and the best wootz blades of the day all seem to have come from very specific region supplied from a very specific mine, per al pendray's vid. I'd have guessed that a better way to stack the odds for success might be to start with materials of much higher/known purity that replicate the ore of the mine in question (if not the best quality ore you can mail order than perhaps powdered steel and then add al pendray's magic 1% of vanadium). Just thinking aloud. I wish you the best of luck, and look forward to perusing the rest of this vid as well as any others you have on the topic. 😄 6:40 yeah, like I was saying about leaving the steel in large chunks not being a good approach, you can still see the outlines of those chunks in the result. Filing it smaller, and supplementing with pure powdered steel would have sped up the melt and facilitated a more homogeneous result. As is, the resilt looks more like canister damascus than raindrop wootz. Still a bold endeavor, and very instructive - we learn by trial and error. Props to you, and thx for the opportunity to watch.👍👍👍

When you learn from an experience it is a success. Very interesting

So damn cool. Plenty of failures yes, but your working so far at the extremes of backyard smithing in temperature that the end result was awesome. I think we all start to see why it cost a small castle. They didn't have a ribbon burner or cast to start with. Very impressed, will eagerly watch how this goes.

Tired but happy. That's good!!!

I'm really excited to see what you can come up with. Live and learn, I definitely look at it as more successful than not. Very cool. Thanks for sharing.

Is there a way to add the carbon once the steel is molten? If so, adding some aluminum will "kill" the steel and help prevent all those air bubbles. That is what steel makers use to make steel (or they may use silicon). Limestone is also used to provide the insulating slag on top, so perhaps after melting the steel, killing it with aluminum, add the carbon and then top with crushed limestone or limestone / dolomite mix and keep firing long enough for the carbon to dissolve (I have NO idea how long that might be without stirring / mixing). Cool to see this done at home!

Excellent upload, thank you!

I totally like your channel! To see your Project and your knowledge that you share with us you rock! Definitely one of my favorite RU-vid Channel

Little tip it turns out vikings would actually use bones of an animal or an ancestor to imbue the sword with their spirit but in reality the carbon from the bone helped turn the iron into steel maybe something to try.

Useful video I thought these didnt exist anymore

Mean, this is something I want to try in the future. It’s possible the steel also took carbon from the crucible - being graphite which is also a form of carbon. This might have been the cause of the rupture. A Ceramic/Aluminium Oxide crucible might be worth a look over graphite :)

Great attempt!!!!

It's a success in that you learned from it. Need to temper it before working, allow to cool slowly in the crucible, and vanadium is the secret according to Al Pendray.

What a cool project!

What quality could be expected from melting nickel plated washers, nuts, bolts, and bits of steel wire? Being a trucker, I often see plenty of scrap washers, nails, bolts, nuts littering the locations I deliver to, and thinly made steel wire from rfid seals used is common enough. The goal would be to test how viable scrapping might be. Also, might including blue glass that has cobalt affect the quality any?

That was awesome! You set out to make crucible steel and by God you made crucible steel! I didn't think you would pull it off but in the end......Naw just F@cking with you, never doubted you for a second.

The things you learned can be considered a success in it's self i think.

If it did not work, but you learned something. Then it is a successful failure. Remember, FAIL is an acronym for First Attempt In Learning. Cheers mate.

Why do you use wrought iron and not just regular steel?

Maybe not perfection, but that was definitely a success!

I usually learn more from my failures than if everything goes just right. Pretty neat. Keep trying.

Were longswords made out of crucible steel? If yes then i know what to make my longsword out of

I'm first this time your videos are awesome john thank you for making these great videos i watch them all the time you just keep getting better and better

Honest question as I have not forged anything in my life: what keeps the crucible from becoming a bomb or a least rupturing when you seal it? I know it keeps oxygen out. However what keeps the air that is inside it from heating up, expanding, and causing the crucible to rupture?

insightful and entertaining. The spark test on the ingot was superb! definitely going to give this a go someday - thanks for sharing. What will you use the billet for? Keen to see...!

Even though it maybe wasn’t a complete success it’s still awesome!

Great video, we learn everyday. I'm hoping to smelt iron or steel in the next month or so. Gotta video that! Thanks for the post

That is so cool!

What are you going to make with it? Most of the videos I’ve seen they always break the crucible so I don’t think that matters

Nice! As long as ur pleased with it its a success. ur content is always great!

I was wondering, I've found a bunch of rusty nails (some really old, wrought iron, some recent, steel). There a way to make steel or wrought iron out of them? Could this be a way?

U need a very small hole in top of the cap on crucible. It works great. And it looked a bit hot. At lower temp it let's the carbon roll on crucible and the glass on top to collect impurities. Other than that great job. I like your set up.

So... a word of advice making crucible steel from another smith. #1 USE ZIRCONIA CRUCIBLES they are rated to handle the higher temps TWO you need to be able to vent GASES just a small hole... this is why the crucible ruptured literally exploded from the internal gasses... 3 I love the ribbon burner for a crucible.... or a forge with a forced air burner you really save on fuel and the temps required for smelting steel are achievable with propane.

I saw a RU-vid blacksmith put a finished knife inside an iron case packed with charcoal powder and flux. Is that possible to? If so it would be easy to cut a piece iron and grind it into shape before hardening with carbon later. Would love to know your opinion on that. I usually just quench my tools to harden them myself because store bought item like planer blade or chisel are poor quality steel.

Nice job very cool keep it up!

What if you sliced it into 1/4” pieces on a bandsaw like lunch meat and restacked it and pressed it in a hydraulic press at welding heat?

Just an idea John with the steel that is not as good as the worked billet, you could use some of it as rivets or pins to make a project just that bit more unique

That is amazing.

I was thinking of trying this, but I have alot of rail road spikes, I'm wondering could I use those, cut into pieces, and charcoal, I'm curious would that make a decent steel

Well done sir! Isn’t it exciting to try things like that just to see if it can be done?!

It's a success

Never clicked a video so fast

NICE!

I'd say it was a success, don't worry about the crucible those things always rupture and crack randomly.

Will you ever try making crucible steel again?

Awesome thank you for sharing

This shit was dope man!

Wow you did pretty dam good please keep trying i wanna see more :D

Quick question, can you make a laminated steel of 5160,s5 and l6 . I ask because those steel on paper seem like a good idea due to extreme high strength and durability just stand alone while being oil quenched steel and have pretty much the same quenching point for maximum strength.

It sucks that your crucible ruptured and your furnace got messed up but that steel is awesome!

You've participate at Forge in fire?? Nice experiment!!!

very cool man

Uthbert viking sword cool reference great documentary on it on Netflix

I don't know if you know already but that borax destroyed your crucible, I tried this many years ago and did not succes. I had pit in ground with rocks, and after a while one rock had molten on to the channel where my air came in shutting it of lol. Well definitely will try agsin

did you make or buy that crucible? and if you made it what did you make it out of?

You actually didn’t have it in long enough because of the bubbles which means the gas reactions didn’t finish Edit: It might also have been the borax that ruptured the crucible or caused the bubbles

Wootz isn't a Synonym for crucible steel it's a special kind of crucible steel edit and there were cruciblesteel made in persia

Just found you, love it, keep up the good work!!!!

how did they measure 20 grams so long ago? im sure they had some measurements, but grams?

Do you ever sell pieces of your experimental steel?

What state are you in ? I'm always lamenting the lack of smithing hobbyists to meet up with in my area (Long Island, NY). Id happily work for free in exchange for being able to learn and have fun (i'm retired).

Would this be the same as making a bloom, but in a more controlled environment?

A good go at it though

Hey John, First off thanks for all your videos. Really appreciate you share your knowledge. You said that there actually are only a view real ulfbert sword made from crucible steel or, real Damascus or whatever it’s supposed to be called. Do you have any reference of those swords? Me and a buddy had a conversation once whether actually anybody checked on the steel itself whether it could be real wootz from Damascus, or whether that is even possible. Many thanks, Lenni

Where do you get your crucible’s ?

I would call it a success

I'd really like to see a channel called "If you were a time traveller" that had a main purpose of if you actually were a time traveller and got to the bronce age, how could you build electric generators, motors, forge high carbon steel, work stainless steel etc. Basically seeing whether or not you could fast forward an ancient people through technological progress just by knowing how it's done. In this here case it's a matter of how to find iron ore, how to make a crucible, how to build a furnace hot enough without gas and so forth. I'm sure there's a video for each of those steps but I'd love to see someone do it A-Z

Bad ass !! Keep it up

Did you add vanadium?

A mixed success? Hmmmmmm I think you deserve an A for effort and don't beat yourself up over it. Try try again. Good video friend...

What's the recipe you are using

should check out penray. if you think provos was in depth. a farrier making swords for princes and kings. I don't know how much his knives cost. you did all right . listening to yr method and approach you were close.

people worked down blooms that looked much worse. If you used a press or trip hammer to lengthen it and fold it a few times the original issues would be gone. doing that by hand I dont think is worth the time verses make another can with lower heat etc

What is a "wagon tire"?

Ok that is fecking Awsome lol

Was this lump charcoal? Or some other kind?

Why no vanadium?

Pieces of my love life 😂

Add some moly and vanadium and you’ll have Magnacut.

what is the white paste that you covered the crucible?

How do you determine the amount of wrought iron and charcoal?

Not exactly a failure. you wanted to make high carbon steel and that is exactly what you got. Also not much different then the steel the Japanese used to build swords. It was hard and brittle also. Thing required is a ton of patience and a whack of folding to get the impurities out. Problem with modern man is we go to a shop and buy steel free from impurities. You can literally cut out a blade, shape the edge on a power grinder, harden, temper and stick a handle on it. If you are set up this is done in hours. The old way even seen in video took not only days to make the steel it took days to form the blade. Better blades were weeks. It's not that we can't do it today. The best efforts lack the patience and then comes the excuses. I actually get a kick out of folks when they do something the "traditional way". OH, ya we are going to do this old school "BUT". There is always a "but", some way to short cut or make the process easier and more convenient for themselves. Folks have to understand that to do things the old way and to end up with the identical product there are no such thing as short cuts. You can go on youtube and watch modern Japanese sword smiths doing it the traditional way. They start with a pile of steel bigger than the crucible steel you made and they heat and pound and fold repeatedly and by the time they are done with it the majority is on their floor. That is just 1/2 the material used because that huge pile they started with is either the inner core or outer sheath. Twice the amount of material is used and most of it ends up on the floor by the time they get the impurities out. That why they have one or two apprentices to help with the hammering. There was a piss load of hammering. I'm not trying to criticize. Just saying if anyone is going to try and repeat what artisan professionals did back in the day then they have to pull up their pants and eat their Wheaties. You could be the best knife smith in the world today and not possess the humility and patience to even apprentice under a sword smith then. I bought a 1953 caterpillar road grader last year. I had two roads to build. One for my mother and one for my son. While I had never run a road grader before I do have a ton of experience on all sorts of heavy equipment of the more modern sort. Most folks really have zero clue how much hydraulics contributed to make our lives a cake walk. After 2 months straight I was as sore at the end of the day on the day I finished as I was the day I started. No power steering helping with those massive tires and manual knuckle buster gear boxes to maneuver the blade all day every day. It was just damn hard work. A humbling experience to say the least. The old way works just as good as the new way. It does the exact same job. The difference is what is required of the person to get it done. I gained a ton of respect for the generation that ran these machines all day every day for years. They had to be built like tanks. Every road I drive on now I think about the fact that every mile of the foundation of these roads were probably built by those men on those machines. Take some modern grader operator and make him run that old machine instead of a new one and he'd quit the job because the 20 or 30 dollars an hour he'd get today wouldn't be considered enough money. It's the same thing making steel and building blades. What we do in an hour took them a day or more of hard labor. Impurities today are removed in the foundry. Pored out as bucket of slag on the ground. The blade smith then had to heat, beat and fold the steel out of the slag. You made good steel! But that was simply a bit of prep and propane, rather than days of cutting wood and feeding a fire. Now comes the hard part. The patience and hard work for hours and days to get that steel out of the slag. Other than a power hammer there is no way to short cut that process. heat, beat and fold until the impurities are gone and the edges no longer crack.

Woots Damascus came from one mine in jordan. The pattern comes from a very suttle amount of an element that was in the ore. Awsome job. Maybe using iron powder to fill the voids and tapping the crucible to settle it would help with the air pockets.

Tires and charcoal eh?