Just one small tweak, glue on both pieces and then give a twist on assembly, that's what we did for water and sewer lines, the glue (solvent) actually dissolves the surface and both sides fuse together, but for your usage here your parts are plenty strong, love your channel
That crossed my mind as well. AVE has a brilliant and artful command of the English (and French) language along with one of the sharpest wits and intellects on the internet. A bit crude in his content from time to time if that stuff bothers you.
This is AvE's pyro channel. :P You know, +ElementalMaker, if you start doing hilarious AvE impersonations it might get you some exposure. You two have the same voice and accent.
SAFETY NOTE: DANGER ******* From my personal experience, I was doing the same thing you are, cutting the PVC. What happened was the pipe must have rotated a bit and the blade caught the pipe. The PVC literally exploded sending shrapnel all over the shop. One piece caught me just below my eye and one on my cheek. Some blood. So make sure to clamp the pipe so it doesn’t move.
I did something similar last year for making black powder. Unfortunately mine was underdeveloped whereas yours is overdeveloped. I was ghetto and used drill bits and bb's for my medium. Great job man!
I had some teeth fly off a Carbide Tip Sawblade running it backwards. Might try a Fine Tooth Steel Plywood Saw Blade. Getting harder to find them as everyone wants Carbide.
Interesting concept! You do want to be careful when cutting plastic. I know a guy who had a kickback on a tablesaw. It broke the plastic into shards when it kicked back and instantly removed some fingers.
Just a idea: The balls are round, the lifters are cut square. On each lifter there is a dead corner where the balls do not have any chance to hit the material. Material falling into this corners at the lifters will not be milled. One can get your mill way more effective if the lifters edges having the same radius as the balls. In effect there will be no "dead space" where material can hide from beeing milled. Taking this to the top of no "dead spaces" within the mill, the lifters need to be round even at the ends where they touch the sidewalls of the container. How about that? In the end one need to have a container what does not have a single place where the milling-balls cannot get in direct contact with the container wall at all. ;-)
You could angle the lifters in alternate directions, that way everything will move from side to side all the time, less chance of hiding in the corners.
Definitely headed to get the stuff to make. Just got one idea for you. Instead of using a collar and a reduced insert, you can use a 4” to 3” reducer. By doing the reducer you will significantly reduce the cost of construction and make the jug easier to clean out.
I've made a couple that way, but given the size of my ball mill cabinet this method makes more effective use of space and gives more lifter surface area. Definitely can just use a reducer though
I was thinking about making four 6-in barrels for my ball mill out of 4 in pvc, then I read somewhere that somebody was concerned about the buildup of static electricity inside the barrel. Have you ever heard of that do you think it's an issue.
THIS information is hard to get and this video is a good starting place. I found a book that contained about a dozen pages on milling with this type of mill in London England(only 3 other copies available that I found 2 in U.S., 1 in Canada). I built a ball mill about 5 years ago. The mediums that I grind are not limited to alumina and iron, but also include Flint, Kaolin's, and feldspars. My craft is pottery. I am starting with 50 to 325 mesh and need about 450 mesh products. The PVC pipe did not offer enough rigidity(too flexible as built in this and other videos). I cut the pipe and added enough couplers to get a double wall pipe. This cut my mill time by two thirds. The tumbler vanes inside did not work for my project, they kept grinding off round and became ineffective. I soon found the RPM on the mill and volume to fill the mill jar made all the difference in the quality of the finished product(no vanes needed). The ratio that I am using is one third each medium, product and (yes someone asked), one third air! The most critical factor is the inches per minute you are turning the jar. 60 RPM on a 4" and 44 RPM for a 6" jar works very well for me and you will need to experiment with your products(with some math you can come up with 1 speed drive that will turn both 4" and 6" at the same inches per minute or above RPM). Faster speeds work too slow and slower speeds did not grind at all. I never used the rubber PSI testing cap/cover. I used the screw on cap. If you do the screw on cap, make sure to put it on the mill so threads are turning in the clockwise direction(I had one that came open). For liquid products use Teflon tape to seal the screw on lid. I have jars from 8 ounces up to 2 gallons grinding volumes. The 6" 2 gallon(product, medium and jar) weighs in at 65 pounds when properly filled. I priced the 8 inch PVC and it became to expensive to build(6 inch end cap approx. $15.00, 8 inch cap was $55.00) OUCH!! One comment below brought up static discharge, YES it will happen. Make sure you are grounded!! If in question, ask an Electrician who is certified to take a look. Mine is grounded thru the electrical hookup. Just seem the easiest. Best of luck out there and always SAFTY first. Mickey
Great video, built one almost the same. Used an old skate board truck and rollers instead of a conveyor roller and a red, 4" soil line test plug to close it up. Just tighten the wing nut and you're ready to go.
I was making on very similar to that and I decided it was too much. So what I did was just cut the PVC and put two test and plugs in them they're more expensive than the caps but they work awesome so all you really have to do is cut the PVC to size and you're done. I don't use any lifters and my aluminum comes out just fine so I don't know why I would do that but I digress
Hey I love your new benchtop and I just wanted to make a side comment doesn't that PVC glue set up in about 15 seconds? that has been my experience anyway, I realize you have to push hard initially because of the "push out" as they call it on the can that you are using in this project. This occurs from the chemical reactions taking place between polyvinyl chloride as I'm sure you already know.I was just surprised you didn't just hold it in place for 30 seconds and then move on to the next rotary lifter fin. on the instructions for that particular can it says it's ready for complete full pressure after just 2 hours, I know because I just finished three projects back-to-back and all of them involved that particular glue. which brings me to my last point,...they do make another product which I eventually ended up using because it's clear and you don't need to prep the PVC it cleans it and glues it all in one step, it's called "Fusion single step" made by Oatly company and it only takes one pass with the swab, anyway that's all I have thank you I love your videos.
They make a 4" test cap that fits inside the pipe itself and tightens up by turning a wingnut. It works by squeezing a rubber disc between two plates. Bill of materials might be lower cost depending on your area. I'm going that route but haven't actually tested it.
@@mrt9749 It works well, I've tried it in the meantime. I also have a simpler design with less vibration, using 3d printed sheaves slipped over the top of the container. The container then is suspended by the belts as it rotates.
@@mrt9749that’s what I’ve been grappling with: a neck when no lifters or balls are, but powder certainly could accumulate. The jar is clever and well constructed: that one area has me perplexed
Considering black powder, how much powder is optimal fir this size jar. I'm experimenting at the moment and making small test batches. 100 - 200 grams a batch.
Metal liner would be nice. Milling aluminum to a fine powder is unlikely at a steel pvc interface. The milling is occurring when ball strikes ball. Milling time might be significantly reduced using something like one of those little fat camping propane tanks cut up as a liner....you can still glue in some liners.
I love this tutorial video. you are blunt and humorous at the same time. awesome video. I am making several of these and will gear them to run simultaneously from an electric motor. thanks very much for this channel.
One advantage to the Harbor Freight jars is that they are quiet. I built this jar and it is noisy. Sounds like rocks is a water pump; but it does do the job! I am going to build a box for it to muffle the noise. Thanks for the design!
Absolutely agreed. These are noisy as hell but work incredibly fast. The hardcore fright jars are super quiet, but take much longer for the same level of milling.
What an exceptionally good "how to" video that you have made here. This is better than some of your others and I've noticed you've increased the viewing time of this video because that's what a lot of RU-vidrs are doing lately, which apparently is the latest trend by you tube channel owners, which is fine by me. But anyway I love how you have really good camera angles showing every step of the way just an overall excellent job you have done thank you so much for this great "how to make a rotary tumbler video".666
Hello. Had you ever tried a metallic tumbler? I have 4 inches pipes, and accesories... but I´m afraid about contamination. Any suggestion? Thanks. Great video.
Friend I am a retired national Plumbing-HVAC Wholesale manager and know some things to help you and those who are going to build this tumbler or mill. Instead of using a 4x3 pvc-dwv flush bushing, REPLACE it and the 4" PVC-DWV coupling with a 3X4 PVC-DWV hubXhub Increaser! It would prevent there being a ridge in the body that traps materials and not allow them to come out like you show here trying to shake them out! You also would not need the small piece of pipe either as the pvc black testing cap you have here with the worm gear clamp will just clamp onto the 3" end of the increaser. Why must you even use the 3" parts anyway? Why not make the whole thing 4" pvc-dwv or 6" pvc-dwv if you wanted a bigger mill. What I would do is use 4" dwv sch40 pipe and a 4"female adapter with a 4" ips pvc clean-out plug as it is MUCH cheaper that than black testing cap. Also the screw on CO plug would go on and off easy and fast! If you want any help on this materials just ask as I am retired but was in the industries that sold these materials for about 48 years! If you need something to keep the materials in the chamber while it is being milled look at an inside fitting cheap testing plug that goes inside the ID of PVC,so you could place the plug in,unglued,and then the female adapter,unglued,and screw the 4" CO plug into the 4"female adapter,and there you go!
I'm thinking by the time he took the clamps off the lifters, the glue was set up enough that re-clamping was unnecessary. Fittings are pretty much good to go after a few minutes.
Hmmmm I made a homemade tumbler thing this summer, but this looks much more efficient (and looks less like a paint can with rubber bands strapped around for grip)
that appeared so good... are you sure you can split alluminium untill get a fine dust? do you use alluminium foils? . Where did you get your steel balls? Thank you!
Itd work well with a lathe. Do a 5lb batch, no worries really. Static will be controlled when everyhting is grounded with a grounding rod in this case, you would go out of your way and run a wire direct
be careful brother, those damn bandsaws WILL bite you eithout a fence/push, its not a matter of if, its a matter of when and how badly, ask me how i know heh
Not all the technical jargon talk just straight this is what you do, and this is how you do it nice job and keep up the good work but I do agree with some of these other people and what they suggested for a static electricity inhibitor or some type of ground device to keep from having a substance unintentionally detonating or flashing depending on what you're working with
Bobbie Kincaid I appreciate it. And yes if milling a Pyrotechnic composition it might not be a bad idea to use an anti static spray, although I have never had any issues.
Hello, how many grams of bp do you can mill in 3 hours? I have little mill, he can make only 200-250 grams bp in 3 hours of milling.. with your jar design , do you think I can mill like 700 grams of bp ? What is weight of your media for loading half of this jar? Thanks a lot , goodbye elementary ;)
Awesome video! 1st let me just say I'm clueless about these things. I want to make a rock tumbler on a very tight budget using a furnace motor I already have. Will that be too much/large of a motor? You mentioned static in a recent comment. How does one ground themselves? And is there another affordable way to make a drum where static isn't an issue? Last... what is the weight capacity of your drums? Sorry for so many questions. I really am clueless. LOL! 🤣 I'm now retired and recently became interested in making jewelry from rocks/gemstones and need a tumbler. Thanks again for a great video! 👍
Static wont be an issue at all for you if your just tumbling gemstones. That was only an issue here because aluminum powder is flammable. I would need to know the specs on your furnace motor, can you see what RPM and HP rating the motor has? Weight capacity of each drum is probably around 15 lbs, which is way more than you'll probably ever need. I use mine with lead and steel media for they need to handle the weight.
IF YOU LOWERED THE BLADE GUIDE ON YOUR BAN SAW TO JUST ABOVE THE WORK YOU WILL GET A LESS BURR CUT ON THE WORK / AND USE A PIECE OF WOOD TO PUSH THE WORK THRU THE CUT SO YOU DO NOT CUT THE TIP OF YOUR FINGER OFF / VERY PAINFUL FOR THE REST OF YOUR LIFE WITH NO FINGER TIP
This works great on my small rock and polisher tumbler. Well done on both of us bud. I sure hear you on clamps. I have over 2 hundred and still run out, LOL. The agitators are perfect and I don't get any chemical reactions to the rubber barrels. I save them for rocks now and do my silver in this.
Older video I know, but I've watched it a few times and have finally made a PVC jar. It looks like you have the low pressure cellular core pipes. This is what I used seeing as the solid core is difficult for me to find (I don't know why.) I guess if you have a jar for each chemical it isn't a big deal, but don't you have a difficult time cleaning those edges? I ended up sealing off the edges by loading it with primer (seems to partially dissolve it) and added a coat of cement over it. As a matter of fact, I actually ended up loading the whole damn inside with primer and cement to fill inevitable gaps between lifters / pipe fitting edges. Don't know if that was a bad idea. I think the PVC in the cement has other plasticizers in it making the final product a littler softer than the pipe / fitting PVC. I hope it doesn't wear off in a pinch. It does however seem to be very durable as it takes a bit of sanding to remove it (yes I made a mess.)
i get almost as much from your comments as the video. its important to have good commenters! WHO IS {AVE} what do they mean about ground? if its in plastic i would think their is no problem but i suspect you tell that in anther video,
A piece of construction string pulled back and forth with some force cuts PVC pipe without making a mess of PVC shavings. You don't need to clamp the ribs in place, just apply hand pressure for a couple minutes until the glue sets up, literally, 2 minutes. The plastic will soften and the glue mixes with the melted PVC and it cures in a couple minutes.
New er sub, I enjoyed the build, and the intro was nice. I've been going threw your vids and if you ever want to collab hit me up, cause well, check out my channel. Not as killer as yours but I like your style
I was thinking of a similar setup with a similar motor for or the purpose of making antique muzzleloading propellant. My concern, some mill for up to 24 hours and was wondering if that motor would start to overheat when running for such an extended period of time. What is your experience with this setup so far?
I used a motor rated for continuous duty. It does still get pretty hot to the touch, but it has plenty of air flow and distance from the mill jar that the heat isn't a concern. I've let it run for days on end without issue. As long as your motor is continuous duty rated you should be okay
Can I ask what diameter extruded aluminum bar you used and is it solid core. I would imagine with the weight of a full ball mill jar you would want a bar that is rigid to reduce bouncing and vibrations.
@@chaecoco2 I used solid 5/8" 6061 aluminum rod, it is sleeved in between the pillow block bearings with some thick 5/8" ID rubber hose for grip and vibration reduction
I know its old post but for anyone making one of these I found instead of using the outer rubber cap they make a "test plug" that goes inside the pipe that has a large wing nut, so no tools needed and keeps media in the drum and not in the opening. The cost was nearly the same. Also if you are creative you can split a piece of pipe then heat (just oven 220F for 10 min) and flatten it....cut the circle (I have a lathe) so you have a flush end cap and doesn't take up capacity. Then you don't have a bulky ends from the factory fittings.
thanks I just finished my ball jars , I have a brand new 1/4 hp 110 electric motor i plan on using but ? what size pulleys and what do i need to control the speed ?? thank you Gary
I have read that if you rotate your ball mill jar too fast, the contents inside the mill will just be thrown against side of the mill jar from centrifugal force, which will defeat effective milling. I ran this through a RPM calculator, and got 530 RPM, which does seem rather fast. Have you had noticed any problems spinning the ball mill this fast from the standpoint of effectiveness?
@@ElementalMaker Thanks for your input. I am getting everything ordered to put the milling machine and mill jar together. Supposedly, you get cleaner burning powder using the PVC mill jar and brass media. If I can cut the mill time down, that will be an added bonus.
The edges do get a little fillet after some use but overall they hold up shockingly well. That being said I only use these occasionally, if it were running every day it would wear way faster.
Brilliant! I just used my homemade tumbler jar for the last time and I didn't want to make another one like it (only lasted about a dozen uses) but can't afford manufacturer made stuff. Just have to pick up the end fittings in the morning and I'll be back in business by tomorrow afternoon. Thanks!
Even air-float chemicals need to be milled together. Try mixing standard black powder just air-float chemicals and a shake in a cup, vs milling the same air-float ingredients together for 24hrs in a ball mill. The difference is astounding. I dont know what you mean about water soluble...
Now, not having tried this and basically stumbling over it while looking for a diy forge/kiln (only for melting small amounts of silver/gold and perhaps enamelling) I found this. I take it that I can use this as a tumbler to clean up metal I'm working on? I guess I better watch til the end before the daft questions (I know, women think differently from men and I sometimes approach things from a completely different angle to what would make sense to the average guy...but I kinda know what I'm aiming at and there's often method in my backwards approach (lol if you can't baffle em with brilliance, then confuse em with lots of words lmfao!) Seriously though you seem to have a lot of videos that interest me. I really just want a small kiln/forge for silver/gold, precious metal clay and enamelling. I have a cabin (its just about ready) with a small workshop beside it where I will be doing most of my metal work and anything hot or noisy that my neighbours in London wouldn't like. I also work in copper and bronze but these are usually confined to the precious metal clay. I need something where I can do lost wax casting and similar.
I have got a 1l container for building a ball mill, and I am going to use it for grinding aluminium to powder. For 100g of aluminium, what size lead balls would I need, and how many?
Oliver Robinson you may be better off with ceramic balls. They will grind more effectively and not contaminate your aluminum with lead. Use enough to fill the jar 1/4 to 1/2 way with media. Make sure you read up on the hazards of making aluminum powder. It's very prone to spontaneous ignition if you don't do it correctly.
Oliver Robinson that's an awesome idea. Never even thought to use those! I wish I could give you an answer but I have no idea. If you use them definitely let us know if they worked! The worst that I could see happening is the balls breaking apart
May want to try Daisy POWERLINE 1/2" GLASS SLINGSHOT AMMO. They are an almost undistructable ceramic that looks like white marbles, I've shot then at trees and even brick with about a 30-45 pound draw slingshot and never found one broke or even chipped. They come in about a cup of 100 at sports section at Walmart, etc.
been a plumber for 40 years. The only reason we use primer is because we usually have to put a 10 foot of water head pressure test for the inspection. You could more than likely leave the primer off. just be sure the pipe is clean. Plus the primer does no good if it been on the pipe for more than a couple of minutes. If you put the primer on and right after it dries you can feel the tackiness for the pipe. That's what makes the primer work for welding the pvc together. He did a good job. Really good videos.
I forget the exact rpm, but if you can find Lloyd Sponenburgh's book "ball milling theory and practice" I used the same 1725 rpm motor and reduction he suggests in that book. It's a great resource if your building a ball mill
It should work without heating, as aluminum work hardens and should break into smaller and smaller particles. What milling media are you using? And what kind of ball mill?
I read about how to make an industrial tumbler out of a rear axle of a big semi truck with the rims and tires in place. You want to cut an opening in the highest part of the rim to load rocks. The article said a cover is not needed but I always thought if I was going to do one I would have a hinged door sealed with inner tube rubber. The idea is to set up a motor geared down so the tires rotates slowly and all the rocks stay in the lowest part of the tire at all times tumbling over each other. Each tire can hold about 100 lbs of rocks and you have 4 tires going at all times each one with a different grit. Always use same tire for the same grit. You rotate the rocks once a week and you have a 100 lbs of polished tumbled stones each week. I have been wondering if you could use quartz sand as grit for the first stage to do the rough rounding off? I am posting this on all videos about rock hounding to spread the idea, if this is you channel and you do not like that let me know. The fact that the tumbling will all take place in a rubber tire should help keep the noise down. The rocks should never touch the rim. I have suggested to people that they make a sound proof shed just big enough to be practical so the noise will be minimized. Plus the rubber in a tire is thick and should absorb a lot of the noise. Also you should have a small fan on the motor to keep it cool. A high quality motor will be a must as it will run 24 hours a day. I am no expert but with the proper gearing the motor should not be under too much stress. I would sell the tumbled stones. Once tumbled, you grade them by quality and type. Some would be really valuable. I bet you could average $10 usd per pound with just good found material and more if you have high grade material. Definitely not for the weekend rock hound but if you sell stones or want to, what a cheap way to start. You could tumble other people's rocks for a fee or shares too. You could make one with car tires for a smaller scale operation. There has to be a lot of people with a 30 year in the making, 3 ton pile of rocks out behind their house. With this they could see results from all that collecting.
I have a choice of media between stainless 1/8 in. balls or ceramic 15mm balls. Which would be better for milling black powder? Thanks a million for sharing.
I'd go with stainless given its additional heft HOWEVER, the stainless steel must be spark-resistant, non-magnetic steel in the 300-series. Alloys 304 and 316 are the most common stainless steels of this type. Proceed at your own risk.
Clamping overnight is completely unnecessary with the PVC dope. It is a nearly instant chemical weld. literally just hold it by hand for about 10-20 seconds depending on humidity and temp.
I find the lifter bars will detach if not held for more than 20 mins or so. They undergo some pretty serious forces in the mill. I just did them overnight for good measure, plus I was going to bed.
