MANCHURIAN LEGACY -- A History-First AoE2 Expansion Proposal (LAVAnilla Episode 5) 

That thumbnail made me click really quick...

That thumbnail took my breath for a sec lmao

Man, this game is going to keep adding more civilizations for years to come.

Great video! Jurchens (and Tibetans ofc) are top of my list for new Asian civs, and there's a lot to like about your Jurchens build. Lower attack delay for CA is a great bonus that I rarely see suggested, and Iron Pagodas are a must-have

I almost fell off the chair when i saw the thumbnail, 11

Later the Full China DLC with all ethnicities 😊 and in that you can add the siberian and japanese ones

That thumbnail nearly gave me a heart attack xD

I’ll really enjoy watching this after work today. So excited!!

This is awesome man. I was so excited when I saw the thumbnail haha

well done thumbnail! This is my approach to Jurchens: Cavalry Civilization -Unique building: Hunting Hut(replace house), Automatically collect nearby 5 tiles fish and animal corpses(not include sheep, collecting speed ≈ 1/2 villagers). The first one is free to build, then for each hunting hub you already had, +5 wood cost. -Animal corpse decay 50% slower, if it is within 5 tile range of a house/hunting hut. -When a cavalry unit dies it heals nearby ally cavalry unit by 5. (radius of 3) -Cav Archer can be Trained in Feudal Age, but have less attack and speed. Unique Tech: -Feudalize: You can no longer build Hunting Hut, change all your hunting hut to house. Enable house. You and your teammate gain team bonus: When your farm runs out, or an opponent's farm is destroyed, gain 10 wood. -Sinolization: Team bonus works 200% for you. (some wont stack) Unique Unit: -Banners: Trained in Castle. Expensive Heavy Cavarly Resistant to monk, Each nearby unit you control reduce its ATK, each nearby unit your opponent controls increase its ATK. Regional Unit (for Korea, Japan, China, Jurchen and Vietnam): -Bamboo Shooter: Replace Hand Cannons. Cheap melee Infantry that has a charged atk. Charged attack is ranged and like hand cannons. Fully upgraded melee is about long swordman. Team bonus: houses builds 50% faster

As far as likeliometer I agree. If the forums have any predictive power, it seems that something in africa would be the next DLC, but Jurchens and Khitans to me seem like the lowest hanging fruit, and I'd expect them soon......unless the CCP doesn't like it.

This is perfect

This was really really exciting, especially to see the art (it made it feel like it was already on the way)! You have amazing marketing skill, and a new subscriber. The way you teach us history by tying the techs/units/bonuses/buildings to the historical civilization is terrific. I never knew about the Jurchens but after looking them up I'm like yeah those guys belong in AOE2 I hope this happens, and you get picked up by the DE team! Great work

I just very recently discovered your experiments on revamping and creating new civs for AOE II. It is a great work, detailed, balanced between attention to history and thought experiments on what could be fun to play, quite the equilibrium and the whole thing backed by sources and a synthetic presentation ? As we say in France "Que demande le peuple ?" :) Thanks for your work, I subscribed

I really hope you become part of the AOE Dev team. So much good ideas from your videos. Thank you so much!

Hell yes! 😁

Hi Robby! I'm extremely pleased with the new type of content: I binge-watched all the Lavanilla playlist on my laptop in a day and this video is my favourite out of all of them, followed by the Mountain Royals remake. I think you're doing a great job and I think that you're handling this shift in content quite well. As an history nerd and game designer myself, I really like your Civ-Theorycraft content, especially because I can use it to discover new topics and civilizations of the past; however, I always struggled with your game-design phylosophy. It's radically different to what I'm used to do and what I like, too much boundary pushing for my taste. I think that one of the core strenghts of AoE2's game design is its "building blocks" or "LEGO-style" approach: through the use of a really small number of generic units, with clearly defined strenghts, weaknesses and gameplay, Ensemble studios was capable of portraying a lot of history and gameplay into the game at the same time; yes, there are a lot of wrong or weird things but, in a lot of ways, they managed to create the feeling of commanding a famous civ of the past in "its natural habitat and strenghts". For example, you're going to spam cavalry with the Huns or you're going to deploy incredibly strong infantry and skirmishers with the Aztecs. The generic unit system, with its rock-paper-scissors design, it's incredibly solid and easy to pick up but also extremely customizable, as time shown. That's why I do not like the introduction (or substitution) of too many units or complex new game mechanics that kinda "get in the way" of this game structure. I think that it's possibile to pack a ton of flavour, history and gameplay using the original system as a base, a system that it's still far from being stagnant or lacking in options IMO. So, yeah, I can finally see your work portrayed in a way that resonates with me and the game I love, thank you very much!

Absolutely amazing video! You've come incredibly far, you should be superbly proud of yourself!

love the video I just had a thought, and i was wondering why you do not include some gameplay clips in your videos. When i first descoverd your channel, i almost clicked off because i thought it was just some rushed PowerPoint made by some random guy who did no research. of course, now i realise that is the exact opposite from the truth. However, I think some stimulant is good for your avridge 15 year old boy like me who, while finds your videos amazing once starts watching them will struggle to commit to a long 40 minute power point lecture (not to be rude but some people may see it that way). I am not complaining and i understand it would be really hard work with the editting but you could be celebrating 1 milion subs not 1k becouse that is how manny you truly deserve. I hope i do not come across as overly critical this your channel. After all you're the one with the 1.5k subs. Keep up the good work. 👍

Thanks for the video, I would purchase the DLC you propose! About the last bit on China: Yes, there is a potential geopolitical issue... but mostly, splitting China is, much like splitting Turks, a Gargantuan task! :)

Крутое видео, так держать!

Robby man you only get better and better! What a video! Congrats!! I really hope you were part of the AoE team, you have such great ideas. I loved the idea of making a whole expansion build btw

Absolute banger yet again 🔥 can't wait for those other Korean civs

Nooo i want my spliting of Spain ,in Castille , Navarra ,Aragorn and the Emirate of Cordoba first and a better campaing of the reconquista or the aragonese expansion around the mediterranean sea. With almogavars , "jinetes" genitours for every one.

Take my money now. LOL Just awesome format and legit looking. For a second I though we were getting a new DLC. I think you gave the devs their new DLC. Just great overall. Keep up the great work.

Haven't really communicated with you or watched your videos due to my health issue (got a quite severe infection/allergy with my left eye), but wow you got some amazing builds and ideas. I also got some interesting ideas for the Jurchens and the Songhai, and I'll probably start writing them on the Fandom page once I recover. Stay tuned!

Damm this is easily your best work so far Robby, congrats! I'm really busy currently, so I can't comment as often/detailed as I used to, but this and the last couple of videos have been a real blast. At a quick glance, all the features and civs really seem well-thought-out, feasible and not completely broken. A ranged Scout sounds scary on paper, but with its stats being shite in DA and being very expensive for FA, I don't think it would be to oppressive outside annoying some villagers. Late Game Khitans sound pretty broken, but I think the 2 population space and high costs of the Pishi and their average eco would somewhat balance it, and you always have the option to beat them before that. They really might be your best build so far, and I like them, just like the reworked Jurchens, Silans and Koreans. Definitely big respect for going so in depth with your builds now and being willing to make compromises for more feasibility and better gameplay, which does take a lot of efforts to work out all the details and nuances and is definitely more challenging than throwing some crazy ideas together. This could as well be an official DLC and I would 100% buy it. Hope you are doing great and the newly spawned villagers has gotten Loom by now. I had lots of fund and would have keep watching with "just" the civ builds from about a year ago, but I'm definitely curious about and looking forward to what you have in store for us, more videos like these would be awesome.

Gotta have the Tangut Xi Xia in there as well (though they're in what is now norhwestern China). Just call it something far eastern related. UU for the Tanguts could be the Iron Sparrow Hawk. It's medium cavalry unit lighter than the Iron Pagoda. Still armored but mobile shock cavalry. Fully armored rider, unarmored horse, faster than Paladin line. Maybe give them hussar level speed. "The Iron Sparrowhawk cavalry of the Xi Xia Empire was heavy cavalry that became achieved an almost legendary status whilst still in use. They were said to be able to walk hundreds of Li a day (one Li equals approximately 500 meters and 1,640 feet) or thousands on horse. They were most adept in sudden maneuvers and arrived unexpectedly at their enemies like lightening striking. Upon encountering enemy forces in the open, the Iron Sparrowhawks often formed sudden charges on the opposing forces." They were part of the imperial forces, and was usually away on campaign. They were especially noted for their endurance and agility. It is said that they would also had a way of attaching their lances to their armored horses so that even after the rider was slain, the horse would have still thrusted into the enemy ranks.[ The even heavier cavalry of the contemporary Jin (Jurchen Jin) dynasty, the Iron Pagoda Cavalry, which was likely the heaviest shock cavalry the far East would see, is thought to have been directly influenced by the Iron Sparrowhawks in both military tactics and equipment.

On a separate note your Slavs vid had me thinking about the long shot civs. My idea was making them like vassal or foederati or treaty civs where on the map a settlement of that minor civ is placed and to get its bonus or UU u have to defeat them or maybe just the Town Center. Similar to AoE 3 but your not building a trade post but you have to conquer them to get their bonus or UT. Just a way to bring the long shot Civs into the game.

Snow Leopards are already in the game. Maybe add Yaks and Takins...

ggs!

I swear I heard him say Kingdom of Valheim

The Khitan tech cost bonus is really weird in practice, especially in a mirror match. You end up with two players constantly check their tech costs to see if their opponent has researched a tech first. It doesn't sound like very fun gameplay to me. Something like "technology from the previous age costs 40% less" would have a much more straightforward gameplay purpose.

Wait what 😮😮, ah You got me 😂

Wait so what upgrades would Jurchen CA have? Persian crossbows can be trash units because they lack the Imp upgrades

I was hoping theyll add the teutonic order which is different from the holy roman empire

I feel like Chinese should have an Imperial Age upgrade to the Fortified Wall: the Great Wall, buffing their hp and armor as well as allowing archers to garrison and shoot arrows.

First here

Great video, Robby! And that thumbnail certainly doesn't hurt. Looking good! Three civs is a lot to comment on, so I'll stick with just the Khitans: Ensign: Looking good, man! Look-in' good! Bonuses: - *Rubber band techs:* I like this idea, but maybe 40% is a tad high. We'll find out if/when it can be properly tested. Also, will it work with enemy free techs as well? - *Double armor effect:* Nice and simple. Excellent! Although, only the cav archer getting it from archer armor feels a bit... weird/off? I get that you're going for "cavalry" bonus armor, it's just strange. Probably just me, though. Moving on... - *Mounted unit bonus attack:* Their old team bonus made into a core and ditching the footwalkers? Don't mind if I do! Wait, how would it work technically? Since skirmishers have bonus against both archers and cav archers, do the cav archers get +2 against skirms? Fully upgraded, they'd kill and E-skirm in two less hits. That's nothing to sneeze at, but I don't think it's too strong either. - *Team bonus...es:* Two, TWO team bonuses?! You mad lad, Robby! It's quite cool, though, and fitting with their dual governance theme. - *Expensive enemy fortifications:* Well, well, well... well, well, well, well. Considering this is no longer busted like the year 3000, I'd say it's a win! - *TC = moneh!:* I like the idea... but maybe 100 gold is a bit much? You can kind of see it as getting the stone cost reimbursed (if you squint, cross your eyes, and stand on your head - but still!) It's a nice variation of the Britons' bonus, but as a team bonus it seems slightly too strong. Again, this might just be me. Unique/regional units: - *Pishi:* 2 pop? 2? Pop!? Why are you doing this to me, Robby? (

Hi Robby I have a new Idea about a dlc named Aoe2 Legends of the North Campaign Featuring 1) Vikings civ- Harald Hadrada campaign 2) Scotts civ - Robert the Bruce campaign ( New units - Claymore swordsman good against cavalry available at castle age in castle, Lochabar axe man available at age 4 as an infantry counter in barracks ) 3) Irish civ - Brian Boru campaign ( Unique units Glassgallow an infantry unit available in caste age which is counter to heavy infantry with trample attack) Hobelar - An unique upgrade of light cavalry available to Scotts, Irish & Britons Woad raider - A regional unit available to Scotts and Irish Varangian guards - A special unit available in Harald Hadrada campaign that can build longboats in water *Hope You Like*

As someone native to Northeastern China (aka Manchuria), I think this would be a terrific idea! That part of the world has an immensely rich history that could be exploited for the campaigns.

really cool idea

so the manchu vs the samsungs

Oh wait, I forgot to list appearances. Well Sillans and Koreans we looked over recently. Kaesong is the only Sillan scenario as things stand and Koreans nowadays are covered in Noryang Point, Kaesong and Shimazu scenarios. Khitans are primarily present in Genghis Khan's first two scenarios and the forgotten Kaesong (in the latter they should probably replace the Jin with Liao) and a possible appearances in Kotyan Khan 2, as per the last video. The recent Victors and Vanquished does feature the Kara-Khitai in Seljuk, as the late-game nomadic invading force, although this player is shared with Pechenegs and Uyghurs, the Khitans always appear whereas those two vary based on who you ally. Also, there's Kara-Khanids in this scenario, although I think these should be some form of Turkic civ. Also, I think they should appear in Temujin, but they don't, currently. Jurchens thus have only Genghis Khan 3 from old scenarios. Aside from that, the recent Temujin scenario features the Great Jin again, so that's a second appearance, both of them being the Jin dynasty. There's really not many other appearances that are viable. I was hoping the enemy raiders in Noryang Point could be Jurchens, but they seem to have been more inclined to help the Koreans against the Japanese during this period, rather than to fight the Koreans. If anything, there's an instance of the Japanese attacking the Jurchens and being aided by some Korean troops. As for further civs, I don't know. Some kind of Siberian civ might make geographic sense, as the region has the least available ones currently. Also, very nice Khitan flag choice. Very elegant.

CORRECTIONS: - I am dumb and the Snow Leopard has been in the game since RoR. I genuinely had no clue lol

I was thinking A LOT about Teutons civ, and it bothers me because it is bascially some strange take on teutonic order . In my opinion we NEED to split germans and italians in some sort of Holy Roman Empire DLC. For me the German split should look kinda like this: Saxons, Austrians, Swabians and Teutons/Prussians (representing teutonic order) and non-german but german-related civs of Dutch/Flemish and Swiss. We could also think about Bavarians, Franconians and other germans but we cant have everything. I actually thought about some of them and came up with pretty cool designs with regional unit od Landsknecht (imperial-age gold-cost-only infnatry) The venetians, the lombards, neopalitoans and even Umbrians (representing papal states) are great italian candidates for some rly good civs to add to this hipotetical "Holy Roman Empire" DLC. I think you should consider making videos about some of em.

Great video! Maybe another idea for a expansion proposal could be Thrones of Britannia (Split of the Celts into your builds on the Scots, the Irish and The Welsh) plus briton rework, maybe(?)

I wish we could get the Irish and Switzerland as well as a Russia and Philippines. I think it could be quite fun.

Fantastic video you show the image from the thumbnail to Aoe 2 they will believe that a new DLC has been announced. Great unit but I feel some conflict form Liudanshou and Iron Pagoda and the fact that both have a blast radius unlock from the beginning unlike Byzantine Logistica and Slavs Druzhina or Battle Elephant takes great bonus damage from the spear line and is slow. Liudanshou is a Cavalry Archer witch may attack faster than but archer line and skirmisher and can have max +4 armor so you can see the massacre. Iron Pagoda why not go more extravagant like their first attack to reduce the movement speed.

Hey, I do civ concepts for AOE4. I’m really confused with your concept here - I thought AOE2 only had one unique unit per civ? How can your concept have so many new unique techs, units, and buildings?

I'd like to take a moment to talk about the Jurchen Heavy Cavalry Archer, and I guess also trash options in general. Having Heavy Cavalry Archer that are fully upgraded, have less frame delay, and cost no Gold sounds a bit broken on paper, but taking the Jurchen's Post-Imp trash options into account, they really aren't. They're certainly strong, especially when supported by Hussars, but they're not really a unit you can spam freely like other trash units since they're still quite expensive at 100 total resources, especially since the Jurchen Post-Imp eco is quite weak, with no bonus and missing all of the Imperial Age eco upgrades, not to mention still having a terrible Spearmen-line. I think the main weakness of Jurchen trash is civs with strong Hussars like Bulgarians or Tatars, or even Magyars and Slavs that can more easily produce them due to having discounts or top tier farms respectively.

Second I guess.

I wish this was in the game !

Great Idea! In addition I would consider to rewrite Han Chinese to become more defensive civ.

When will this expansion be released?

I think Chinese gamers would be excited about this too. FYI, one of the campaigns that they should have for the Khitans is the story of Yelü Dashi. You should read it, it would make a great campaign.

You wanna give the mongols a ranged dark age unit? Mongols already are able to apply pressure earlier than most but you wanna buff their early game?

Better malay dlc split the malay and also added native Australian

I want to see how far they can split the nords

Would really like to see a tanguts build.

난또 진짜 dlc 나왔는줄 알았네

Khitans, Jurchens, Tanguts, and Tibetans should be released as Dynasties of China and the current "Chinese" civilization renamed to Han. Either or Options A or B: A: -Khitans -Jurchens -Tanguts -Tibetans -Han B: -Liao -Jin -Xixia -Utsang -Song

Tibetans please!

I do not understand why developers do not pay moders and "theory crafters" and just fire a load of employees. They would just get loads of free material for no work. Just seams like a win to me. Some people would not want getting paid they would just be honored.

I dont think the korean heungdeoksa is a useful tech. You usually don't go for the castle age unique tech in castle age, and by that time, +4 LoS is not too useful. It's just a buffed portuguese bonus at that point. I'd use my resources on units or aging up. Regarding the one vill per university tech, I think it's too weak too. Usually you just go for ballistics and chemistry early on, sometimes for masonry in late game, and rarely tower upgrades. That's roughly +4-5 vills by mid imp. Sure, cheaper and early siege engineers gives +1, so around 3 extra vills in castle age. I see it like a nerfed bengali bonus, which isn't that great. The team bonus is neat though. I like the concept of a tech oriented civ.

que primero personifiquen "como se ven las unidades " campeones inkas es vergonzoso, se ve horrible en el 2024

我確實有被這縮圖嚇到 身為東亞的玩家 我非常希望有此擴張概念!!

Jurchen not Manchu

Beware the Kara-Khitai, they are without honor

...Scout Archer... a ranged scout to start with... ...the sheer amound of micronerd harass would win games on it's own in Dark Age.

Yo and Vivi will be blocked /_\

They sadly can't add the Tibetans for political reasons but the Tanguts are a good proxy since they're closely related to them and have similar cultures. The Jurchens deserved to be added in as well.

I would prefer that they do visual reworks to the civilizations that already exist than to add more, there are already like 50 civilizations it is impossible to remember everything

read maruchan

The balance is not strong with this one.

I hate the idea of expension in current times. It'll either lead to failure or alienating the DE audience. As for me who already spend ton of money on this game i really don't want the HD shenanigan repeated.

china forks won't like this

I don't like Khitans civ at all. - Firstly team bonuses that are applied as nerf to enemy has way too much potential for civ picky play. It would also badly synergize with 10x (but whatever, mods shouldn't be a argument but given AoE2 modding scene I will allow myself to present as one). - Bonuses should not rely on things that enemy is doing directly. Also I think it would be nightmare to balance and implement. Also passive 0 skill bonus. - 2 pop units are bad for AoE2. It is not AoM neither AoE3 and makes no sense to restrict army size by making certain units more population costly, especially when it is pushing the AoM/AoE desing into the game that does not have same mechanics as before-mentioned to actually counter-act and justify high popspace cost. And reasoning between 2 pop cost is just weak. Like many units, Pishi is not exception to its being nobility nor handpicked. - I heavily dislike Pishi. Way to cheap to elite, way to easy to actually obtain bonus (like in late game having ~4 TC is simply easy + you can literally build it anywhere so there is no risk/reward to this unit compared to Leiciai. - Losing Iron Casting actually is ok.

Not elegant at all.

I want byzantine varangian guard mod pack.

Hi Robby I have a new Idea about a dlc named Aoe2 Legends of the North Campaign Featuring 1) Vikings civ- Harald Hadrada campaign 2) Scotts civ - Robert the Bruce campaign ( New units - Claymore swordsman good against cavalry available at castle age in castle, Lochabar axe man available at age 4 as an infantry counter in barracks ) 3) Irish civ - Brian Boru campaign ( Unique units Glassgallow an infantry unit available in caste age which is counter to heavy infantry with trample attack) Hobelar - An unique upgrade of light cavalry available to Scotts, Irish & Britons Woad raider - A regional unit available to Scotts and Irish Varangian guards - A special unit available in Harald Hadrada campaign that can build longboats in water *Hope You Like*

Hi Robby I have a new Idea about a dlc named Aoe2 Legends of the North Campaign Featuring 1) Vikings civ- Harald Hadrada campaign 2) Scotts civ - Robert the Bruce campaign ( New units - Claymore swordsman good against cavalry available at castle age in castle, Lochabar axe man available at age 4 as an infantry counter in barracks ) 3) Irish civ - Brian Boru campaign ( Unique units Glassgallow an infantry unit available in caste age which is counter to heavy infantry with trample attack) Hobelar - An unique upgrade of light cavalry available to Scotts, Irish & Britons Woad raider - A regional unit available to Scotts and Irish Varangian guards - A special unit available in Harald Hadrada campaign that can build longboats in water *Hope You Like*

Hi Robby I have a new Idea about a dlc named Aoe2 Legends of the North Campaign Featuring 1) Vikings civ- Harald Hadrada campaign 2) Scotts civ - Robert the Bruce campaign ( New units - Claymore swordsman good against cavalry available at castle age in castle, Lochabar axe man available at age 4 as an infantry counter in barracks ) 3) Irish civ - Brian Boru campaign ( Unique units Glassgallow an infantry unit available in caste age which is counter to heavy infantry with trample attack) Hobelar - An unique upgrade of light cavalry available to Scotts, Irish & Britons Woad raider - A regional unit available to Scotts and Irish Varangian guards - A special unit available in Harald Hadrada campaign that can build longboats in water *Hope You Like*

Hi Robby I have a new Idea about a dlc named Aoe2 Legends of the North Campaign Featuring 1) *Vikings civ*- Harald Hadrada campaign 2) *Scotts civ* - Robert the Bruce campaign ( New units - *Claymore swordsman* good against cavalry available at castle age in castle, *Lochabar axeman* available at age 4 as an infantry counter in barracks ) 3) *Irish civ* - Brian Boru campaign ( Unique units *Glassgallow* an infantry unit available in caste age which is counter to heavy infantry with trample attack) *Hobelar* - An unique upgrade of light cavalry available to Scotts, Irish & Britons *Woad raider* - A regional unit available to Scotts and Irish *Varangian guards*- A special unit available in Harald Hadrada campaign that can build longboats in water *Hope You Like*