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MGB Engine warranty strip down: Customer confronts us with his opinion 

Barum Engines
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27 сен 2024

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Комментарии : 440   
@johnrussell5245
@johnrussell5245 Год назад
If you change the rings and they change the PCV, then when the smoking is cured they'll say it's because you changed the rings and they'll refuse to pay for the strip down.
@davidcoyle7125
@davidcoyle7125 Год назад
Thats just what i was thinking. Perhaps after the engineers report, insist on customer accepting that theres no engine fault and accept to pay for all work as its not under warranty again every thing in writing and payment before collection.
@julianhoskins5158
@julianhoskins5158 Год назад
Like Lee says, they are going to run it with new rings but the old broken pcv valve so if it still smokes they'll fit the new pcv valve which will prove it's the pcv valve that's causing it.
@Honky_Konky_Phooey
@Honky_Konky_Phooey Год назад
100% pcv valve, at 50 miles the rings are not bedded in but still not at fault. State of that diaphragm it’s bloody obvious oil is going to be sucked through causing smoke 🤦‍♂️
@matthewharlowehrscyclespor668
@@julianhoskins5158 my concern is that once new rings are installed the client will refuse to pay for any of the work irregardless of a failed PCV valve. I truly believe Barum engines is now working with disingenuous players.
@sampsonsunny6298
@sampsonsunny6298 Год назад
Obviously rings not sealing. Either wrong rings, ie tension clearance ect or cylinders not round, oval. Engine should have been checked for compression and leak down test. Blue smoke was reported in original complaint. Possible 2 faults with engine. Mechanic from customer should have done tests to diagnose issue. Barrum engines should invest in engine dyno, so they can break in engines and catch any issues before calling engineer for reports ect. It's a good selling point and can provide extra service to customers.
@kelvinrf
@kelvinrf Год назад
Poor bugger trying to keep everything in sequence while you are questioning him. 😂
@johnlawrence9066
@johnlawrence9066 Год назад
Can't understand why a customer would spend serious on a rebuild and then use the old external parts . As I said in previous comments , that's why I run my rebuilt engines on a test bed for a couple of hours . I can then control speed and load , as well as checking pressures / temp . etc . Keep the videos coming.
@lorditsprobingtime6668
@lorditsprobingtime6668 Год назад
@kelvinrf I was thinking exactly that myself. He was trying to concentrate on keeping to an exact pattern, counting as he went to make sure he didn't miss any and along comes this hoppy fella shoving a camera in his face and trying to talk to him at a time when SENSIBLE bosses know to STFU and not distract you. I know it would have really annoyed me at least lol.
@corythomas4427
@corythomas4427 Год назад
I was yelling at my phone telling him to shut up while the poor guy was trying to concentrate...he just kept interrupting him...
@jfro5867
@jfro5867 Год назад
@@corythomas4427 yep, there’s a time to ‘zip it’. Some people just don’t get it do they 🤷‍♂
@yaabaa
@yaabaa Год назад
It looked to me like he got distracted at 9 around 1.42 then changed it to 10 but luckily checked them all again anyway...
@chrissavage5966
@chrissavage5966 Год назад
Funny how so many comments think the same as me - the guy will fit a new PCV then blame the rings. You are going to have to make sure that doesn't happen and you certainly can't trust the bloke - he has an incentive to find you at fault.
@danielbridson8534
@danielbridson8534 Год назад
This MGB man wouldn’t know what a PCV Valve was if one fell out the sky and hit him on the head
@rudyparson4010
@rudyparson4010 Год назад
I hope you're there when they do the first fire up.. with the broken PCV valve back in
@nickbea3443
@nickbea3443 Год назад
And charge them for your attendance if not your fault
@JustAlanJohn
@JustAlanJohn Год назад
I've owned a few MGB one I brought because it's was burning oil the person I brought the MG from tried a few garages they all told him he needed a recon engine. I got it cheap decided to give it a full major service myself. The PCV was totally full of slug and the rubber was perished badly took her out for a good run and all cleared up. And I agree with John Russell 100%
@davidellis279
@davidellis279 Год назад
Some people might disagree with your comments on the machining marks on the head and block surfaces,gasket manufacturers used to say it was better to machine like that so the gasket had a better grip than a smooth finish which I tend to agree,I’ve overhauled quite a few of these MGB 1800 five bearing engines and never had a problem with them,I have found that they suffered from the oil seals on the inlet valves had perished and spilt allowing oil to be sucked down into the inlet manifold when idling or on the overrun causing a plume of blue oil smoke when the throttle is opened for a couple of seconds,I assume you did the valves and put the new o-ring oil seals in place,it’s an easy mistake to make when assembling the head,some engines had inlet valve seals that were like upturned cups,just a thought.
@ChrisJones555.
@ChrisJones555. Год назад
The best thing you can do is put a gallon of fuel in the car followed by a lit match, and then he can really see it smoke. Good luck, you're right. It's definitely the pcv valve.
@tellitasyouseeit7555
@tellitasyouseeit7555 Год назад
Lee. DO NOT change rings. You are giving in to the mechanic which will bite you in the ar... Wait and see Engineer with engine as is, and let him know the feedback from the B series engine builders/ mechanics of the past, then take a decision.
@BILLHOVER
@BILLHOVER Год назад
Spot on, Do not give them a get out of jail card by fitting new rings, doing that your acknowledging they are the problem, leave well a loan.
@andrewwasson6153
@andrewwasson6153 Год назад
Agreed! It’s only got 50 miles on the build and the rings look about what they should look like. My dad and I built a few of those engines. We put around 1000 miles on them when running them in. My dad had a pretty rigid break in schedule. A closed PCV would absolutely push oil through.
@stephenrowlands843
@stephenrowlands843 Год назад
In addition to my previous post: The rings will not bed in uniformly around their circumference as the stresses involved on the piston (rings) to the motion of the crank are not uniformly circular. They will therefore bed in at different rates accordingly. Simple evidence of this is the fact that worn bores wear differently across the stroke direction compared to perpendicular wear.
@gordowg1wg145
@gordowg1wg145 Год назад
The rings rotate in the grooves as a natural reaction to the movement up and down the bore. However, you're dead right about the major thrust face wearing monre than the minor, and the longitudinal wear - in line with the pins - is usually the lowest.
@jasoncree4262
@jasoncree4262 Год назад
Should have done a compression test before the head came off ,then checked the valve guides/seals . I think it's the pcv taking oil and fuel in and out the crankcase if its always open
@sttutoob
@sttutoob Год назад
Put it back together as is with new pcv. If you put new rings in they will change pcv anyway and blame you leaving you to foot the bill. I would risk you having to double your labour time to prove it isn’t the rings
@gavinralph2910
@gavinralph2910 Год назад
Fairly normal for the graphite coating to wear off at different intervals around the rings during early run in. For starters the side loading on the rings/pistons is greater on the power stroke side of the piston, so yes some parts of the rings will wear / bed in quicker than other parts. (exactly why bores go slightly oval with wear) Same can be said with pistons that have graphite coated piston skirts.... On the diesel version of the BMC 1.8 + 1.5, the factory eventually fitted a second breather fitting to the valve cover to help the engine breath....and avoid swallowing its own blow by oil. A must for all performance BMC'S.
@julianhoskins5158
@julianhoskins5158 Год назад
Yes those engines are known to be tricky for good breathing
@-108-
@-108- Год назад
You don't know.
@jasong9695
@jasong9695 Год назад
That mechanic doesn't have a clue that piston would show burn blow by if it was leaking past the rings, a slightly leaking pcv valve will burn oil, let alone one in the state it was in
@gr122ly
@gr122ly Год назад
This is interesting, I used to build a good number of engines a few years ago. In my opinion and experience tells me that you truly need to run an engine in for between 600 and 1000 miles before any conclusions on rings not seating. I know i am probably old school but with the best will in the world you will not get perfect fit from machining and new rings. This is why we run engines in to give everything a chance to bed in. When it has done those miles you can then get a better visual on fit. Far too early in the cycle (50 miles) to be blaming rings or machining etc. Further these PCV things I deal with on lots of different cars and they will exhibit tremendous amounts of smoke at times. replace and the fault will be gone. I truly think it should have been replaced as a matter of course when fitting the engine back in the car. The other thing that occurs to me is if said garage admitted it was a faulty PCV could be a £80 valve was all that was needed in the first place. 🙈
@Years-qy7me
@Years-qy7me Год назад
100% right ✅️
@Karsandklassics
@Karsandklassics Год назад
Modern tolerances and machines means there is absolutely no reason why these will smoke for a certain amount of miles. I know the garage this car was at and they build various bike engines and he knows what he's talking about. The PCV valve being faulty wouldn't allow it to run well and start well. Also, all you gotta do is flop the cap off when it's running and see if it's vacuuming the crank case. All I'll say is that my friend hasn't got a RU-vid channel full of warranty claim videos 😂
@johnjones4825
@johnjones4825 Год назад
I agree on the PCV valve. My Dad had an Austin1800 back in the late 60s, early 70s. On one of our trips to South Africa from Zambia, the car started randomly spitting a huge cloud of smoke every so often, I don't remember details, I was only 10 at the time. The smoke was so dense, a following car pulled my Dad over to see if all was ok. Turned out it was the PCV valve (which I do remember looking just like the one on that MGB) puking a blob of oil into the manifold every 10 or 20 miles, or whatever it was...
@Lord-hoboco777
@Lord-hoboco777 Год назад
Would have made sense to replace the pcv valve first before even stripping the engine down talk about a customer that knows F/A unless he knew its the pvc valve and is paranoid now of any damage done from fuel flushing the bores he's pulling a fast one on you to cover his own mistake
@tam1381
@tam1381 Год назад
I have never known for there to be an out break of common sense. You are spot on.
@ethelmini
@ethelmini Год назад
Faulty PCV would make it run lean. But, if the mixture has been adjusted to compensate it'd be even richer with the throttle open.
@Ralph2
@Ralph2 Год назад
Make sure he doesn't fit a similar looking but functioning breather valve on the rebuild. I can see where this might be going....
@MDAdams72668
@MDAdams72668 Год назад
Yup he's gonna get raped if he does anything but say NOPE my work was good and get an engineer to sign off o it
@joseywales88758
@joseywales88758 Год назад
Try and be there when they start it with old PCV I would be very surprised if it doesn't blow smoke, if you're not there they will try and blame you, good luck with it Lee
@hiscifi2986
@hiscifi2986 Год назад
Some engines require a non-detergent mono-grade oil for the running in period. Using a high quality multigrade oil will really slow down the running in process.
@enwri
@enwri Год назад
He's going to try to fit that diaphragm properly in that broken casing, make sure it isn't when it's run again. It was pulled right off it's seat and never closing properly. The broken part isn't really necessary if the diaphragm is seated correctly.
@IJ-E36
@IJ-E36 Год назад
Who would've thought an engine that hasn't ran long enough to bed the rings in with a broken pcv system would burn oil... Be damned if I'd be putting rings in it, clean it all tell him to use mineral oil and fix the pcv, if he complains let him re ring it..
@vincentrobinette1507
@vincentrobinette1507 Год назад
Check the ring gaps! As well, check the piston clearances between the piston skirts and cylinder walls. In the past, I've had problems with the intake valve guides. I ended up putting "umbrella" seals on the intake valve stems, and that solved the problem.
@davidcowley1823
@davidcowley1823 Год назад
I'll say it again, it's the PCV valve 100% Do not change the rings, they haven't had a chance to bed in. 50 miles is no where near enough to bed them in. So, a gaping gap in the PCV valve is not a problem, that diaphragm cap is supposed to fit flush so as not to draw oil through. What planet is the customer on. If you change the rings and rebuild the engine, I'll guarantee the customer will fit a new PCV just to save face. Then pass the book onto you.
@Karsandklassics
@Karsandklassics Год назад
I CANNOT WAIT to see what everyone says when he puts a video up saying they accidentally bored it to the wrong size 😂
@williammccarthy5696
@williammccarthy5696 Год назад
Put the pistons back in the block make a plate to bolt to the top of the block to seal the bore and do a leak down test on the bores if you want to know if the rings are good or not .
@The_MostHigh
@The_MostHigh Год назад
Yeah 100%, otherwise if put new rings in the customer can take engine away and say that solved it when in reality it did not and they changed pcv and then they can say they want work free
@KrustyKlown
@KrustyKlown Год назад
You mean a compression test??... baffling why they didn't do a compression test BEFORE tearing down the motor.. if that was good, there would be no reason to tear it down.
@trevorwoods2580
@trevorwoods2580 Год назад
@@The_MostHigh Lee has the car so he can see what it's doing when it's all build up
@williammccarthy5696
@williammccarthy5696 Год назад
@@KrustyKlown No a leak down test you use compressed air and a set of gauges to tell you the percentage of leakage past the rings.
@stewatparkpark2933
@stewatparkpark2933 Год назад
The rings haven't been run in yet , it's only done 50 miles .
@markchester7584
@markchester7584 Год назад
You should always do what the customer wants. Just make sure they understand the cost implications and what you’re willing to guarantee.
@boosthit811
@boosthit811 Год назад
3 compression rings plus the 2 oil controll rings. No way they are the issue imo. The customer is insisting because he's a slippery turkey trying to get out of it.
@paullangford7078
@paullangford7078 Год назад
Don`t forget that the exhaust could have a lot of oil in it and may take a time to burn off and clear. Until then its going to look like its smoking what ever you do.
@iansmith7929
@iansmith7929 Год назад
For an A or B series engine, have a look at the valve guides, and if necessary, replace. Also, check the valve spindle diameter vis-a- vis the guides. Finally. make sure the valve seals are in good condition.
@Billydevito
@Billydevito Год назад
PCV, rings, uneven wear. I have seen them all cause smoking issues. Once I stripped a recently built engine that was smoking to find the second rings were installed upside down by a very experienced engine builder ! When looking for the cause of an issue, I check everything!
@gizmo6164
@gizmo6164 Год назад
Lee, shouldn’t you invest in a mahoosive, intimidating spot light to shine on Paul whilst he’s under interrogation? 🤷🏻‍♂️ You could probably claim it back against tax as workshop equipment. Win, win. 😁
@robbiejsaris3586
@robbiejsaris3586 Год назад
Just thinking out loud.. Once you have completed your investigation and given the engine back, what is stopping the customer replacing the PCV and then claiming you had done something to stop the burning oil and refusing to pay for any work because “warranty”? If that makes sense…
@eddieMurphy11111
@eddieMurphy11111 Год назад
hope the knee is getting a lot better , i would have got a engineers report before putting new rings in but that is life thanks for the video
@nickbea3443
@nickbea3443 Год назад
He is! 12:05
@Hoss5678
@Hoss5678 Год назад
Just a detail item, piston gudgeon pin snap rings should be clocked at 12 or 6 and the smooth side towards the pin. If they did not clock them right, they were probably unaware of the rough and smooth side of snap ring. Keeps up the good work Chaps!
@getahanddown
@getahanddown Год назад
Smooth side (sharp edge not the rounded / pressed side) should face out to resist the pin load.
@Hoss5678
@Hoss5678 Год назад
@@getahanddown Wrong, do your research!!
@Hoss5678
@Hoss5678 Год назад
@@getahanddown This is right out of JE-Pistons site, one of the biggest and best Mfr. A word of caution: snap rings are manufactured with a smooth and rough side. Be sure the smooth side faces the wrist pin.
@TheOwlGuy777
@TheOwlGuy777 Год назад
I put myself through college in the early 80's building these wonderful engines.
@philosmond9688
@philosmond9688 Год назад
Hi there Did anyone pull the pipe off the pcv with the engine running this would have given you some idea of the blow by. Please remember years ago these engines used to have a pipe to atmosphere for crankcase ventilation (good old days). I think it might be a good idea to crack test the head well it's off just for peace of mind . Also 50 miles isn't anywhere near enough to bed rings in especially with modern oils . These are just an old mechics thoughts hope it helps Regards Phil
@STANLIZ4
@STANLIZ4 Год назад
Seems a good way forward, hope the customer knows he going to be paying for the labour, new rings and independent engineers report if it continues to smoke with the pcv valve installed as was.
@jimcraig6523
@jimcraig6523 Год назад
In properly sealed rings the wear pattern is not necessarily spread across the full face of the ring as most "enthusiasts" think. Most top rings are barrel faced where only a portion of the ring at the widest point is actually in contact with the cylinder wall to allow proper lubrication of the bore and ring. Therefore only a small part of the ring should exhibit wear and any of the top rings showing full face contact would be considered "worn out" so only a small part of the ring will exhibit wear. A top or second ring that exhibits full face contact should be considered "worn out". How MGB man did the initial run in is important as it should not be done at idle speed which can glaze the bores but at min 1500 rpm varying the speed continuously above this for the at least 30 mins. The engine should then be put under varying loads normally on the road if no test equipment available for 50 - 100 miles. With modern rings particularly coated rings this should be sufficient to see them properly bedded in. There are varying schools of thought on use of lighter bedding in oils for this process.
@HuntsChris
@HuntsChris Год назад
Wouldn’t all three rings have to show no wear plus the oil control ring for your client theory to be true? I reckon your client is trying to save a bit of face, but is making things worse for himself by not preparing to consider it could be the pcv. Don’t change the pcv at all, save that for a future solution.
@burtlandcastor8359
@burtlandcastor8359 Год назад
Most rings have a taper. Those "marks" are normal run-in indications.
@jasoncree4262
@jasoncree4262 Год назад
No proper tapered rings will not compress if they upside down you won't get it in the bore
@burtlandcastor8359
@burtlandcastor8359 Год назад
@@jasoncree4262 Sure.
@jasoncree4262
@jasoncree4262 Год назад
@@burtlandcastor8359 yeah I'm sure.,they won't compress in the piston grooves which are also is tapered you wouldn't get the piston in past the ring in the bore .if it designed to be a tapered ring the tolerances are too great it won't go in
@jasoncree4262
@jasoncree4262 Год назад
How do you check these Mark's to check the wear when running in ,normality the mark is either a dot even seen a N on the up side of the ring
@jasoncree4262
@jasoncree4262 Год назад
@@burtlandcastor8359 sorry could have sworn I read a comment ,that the rings got installed upside down in this comment in a previous video, ,probably the tapered you mentioned and marks
@rgthomson1
@rgthomson1 Год назад
Do the PCV only and put it back together, doing the rings first could give you a head ache with the customer saying it was the rings all the time, looking at it the rings are fine and that leaves PCV
@cedriclynch
@cedriclynch Год назад
I have a Sherpa van with a detuned version of the same engine as the MGB. It does not have a PCV valve but it does have on the left-hand side of the engine block a box stuffed with what looks like a pan scourer that blow-by gases pass through on the way to being fed into the inlet manifold. The Haynes workshop manual makes no mention of this device. Oil drops stick to the pan scourer and drip back into the crankcase. On one occasion the engine started making large puffs of blue smoke on changes of speed. I found that this was caused by the pan scourer being bunged up with sludge (I don't think the previous owner had changed the oil very often) so oil drops were getting right through the device and into the inlet manifold. I cleaned the device out and fitted new innards that actually are a stainless steel pan scourer, and this completely cured the problem.
@jonkristianstre1073
@jonkristianstre1073 Год назад
Make some sort of marking on the pcv for controlling if it`s been tampered with after the engine leaves your premisses.
@KrustyKlown
@KrustyKlown Год назад
Test the ring fit in each cylinder .. insert each ring one at a time, square it up with a piston... then put a light behind and look for light leaking through at cylinder wall. A NEW quality properly fitting ring in a Round line honed cylinder will have NO LIGHT leaking through, and will then seat quickly on break in (unlike the rings you showed here in this video). Getting proper ring fit in a true round bore is essential for high performance, that is the foundation of a good engine build.
@jonnycorsair1964
@jonnycorsair1964 Год назад
Great to see a precrossflow on the channel Nice looking engine just need to get the paint off those gasket faces !!!
@donaldhalls2189
@donaldhalls2189 Год назад
I had fitted an engine I had rebuild and put it in the car, Panel Van, the bloke had done 800km by the next morning, we changed the oil, about a week later he rings up saying it's consuming oil he said he was ringing it in up to 80km/h the engineer said to thrash it like you would normally drive it, saw Agro the owner of the Van later, he said he had already done million km's and still running like new, all other engines he only got 400000km before they blew smoke, all the best to yous and your loved ones
@donziperk
@donziperk Год назад
If it not the PCV check the ring tension in the bores. I was building a Datsun motor and had used Deves rings on them for years. We fired it up on our test stand and it smoked bad. Couldn’t get it to stop and never seen that before. Took the engine apart and everything looked good except the ring drag in the bores seemed low. Put back together with Hastings rings that I had kicking around. Problem solved. Upon research I found out Deves had been sold and quality had taken a hit. Been using Hastings ever since with no problems. So check that as a possible problem.
@paulg9483
@paulg9483 Год назад
As you already mentioned I would question the running in oil used, good video chaps.
@andrewtiefry5990
@andrewtiefry5990 Год назад
Some people have to blame issues on something. I run all my engines I rebuild as hard as I possibly can. That seems to treat me very good. If it's going to blow up it will if not they seem to run for a long time. Keep it up
@johncollier6899
@johncollier6899 Год назад
MG OC UK The PCV valve has a finite life, when it fails it is usually the diaphragm that ruptures, the effect of which is to apply full inlet manifold vacuum to the crankcase, which can pull significant amounts of oil into the combustion chambers fouling the plugs as we as resulting in high oil consumption and oil smoke pollution. If you have a PCV valve and experience stalling when the cap is removed, or a large vacuum is felt, then the valve has probably failed. That is if you haven't already noticed high oil consumption. Other problems can be oil and combustion sludge inside the valve restricting the movement of the diaphragm or blocking the valve. After-market valves and those used on other vehicles often have a plunger instead of a diaphragm which removes the main failure mode of the MGB valve, but they can still stick open or closed and get gunged-up. The advantage of this type over the MGB type is that under crankcase pressurisation from excessive blow-by the valve will close to prevent air being forced into the inlet manifold from this source so weakening the mixture.
@derekbeardsmore3866
@derekbeardsmore3866 Год назад
I removed the PCV, diverted the breathing via the cabs and problem was solved. No smoking and now normal oil consumption.
@stclairstclair
@stclairstclair Год назад
I worked as a GM mechanic and had a lady lie and say her truck was using oil, it was not, but the insurance inspector for GM bought her a new long block, the inspector asked me if I wanted her engine, a beautiful young 350, I brought it to a machine shop and installed it in my IROC, I made 375 hp on $1300 bucks, I still have it with only 4K on the motor.
@KensSmallEngineRepair
@KensSmallEngineRepair Год назад
50 miles is not much, a new set of rings with mineral oil, run it under load, Happy Day!
@rodsdmba1571
@rodsdmba1571 Год назад
torque to angle takes bolts beyond yield such that all bolts have the same tension. Thread and head friction is wildly variable and resulting bolt tension is likewise all over the map.
@ronniebibby1283
@ronniebibby1283 Год назад
100% it's the pressure control valve and the customer knows it blaming the rings is his way of getting out of the bill for your investigation. I would bet he never checked the pcv before he fitted it. Don't fit rings wait for the engineer's report .
@duck1946
@duck1946 Год назад
Lee get a few tubes of engineers tell tale marker.(bright blue,red or yellow)a little dab is all that is required,when your customers see this they may think twice about interfering with components ! Before i retired i worked at an aviation engine rebuild facility and our enginers used this on things like cylinder base nuts and carb and magneto bodies after overhaul, even when lives depend on such components never trust the customer!!
@Mr572u
@Mr572u Год назад
Gap each ring one at a time, to the bore they are going to run in. Particularly, the oil scraper rings.
@redr1150r
@redr1150r Год назад
Many years ago I rebuilt the engine out of my MGB-GT . I noticed the lifters showed signs of the face hardening chipping. I didn't change them out, because no one around had any, and it was our only car at the time and we needed it back on the road. I put the lifters back in. One day I was going home, I was trying to keep up with a friend that had a Ford V-8 Falcon with a 289 ci. in it. He pointed to the back of my car, so I looked in the mirror , and I beheld a great cloud of smoke and my oil pressure read about 5 psi.. That was it for my engine. I unscrewed the pressure relief valve cap and I could feel the the pressure relief poppet was stuck. I started the car and tapped the gas. It popped out with some oil onto a news paper that I put under the car. Sure enough, embedded in the poppet was a flake of metal from one of those lifters. A great lesson learned and my wife made sure that was end of my MG adventures. 🙂
@ASelman
@ASelman Год назад
What are the replacement valves? are they correct diameter? Check stem clearances and fit to guides and seals. A waisted or reduced stem on original seals will be a smokey problem.
@harveywade4112
@harveywade4112 Год назад
About 25 years ago my mate had his mk1 golf engine rebored due to heavy smoking , re assembled and still the same, with original PCV was fitted, after new one zero oil burning,this is 100% PCV issue
@WidowUK
@WidowUK Год назад
Talking of MG’s my neighbor came to me as he car was leaking oil. On inspection the oil was extremely thin like water and one could smell it was more fuel than oil. As it was parked pointing down hill my thoughts came to the carburettors was allowing fuel to follow after it was parked up on the hill. I’ve now put a new float kit in both carbs and flushed the old oil out and a new filter. It’s been ok for a week or more and it’s done it again. I’ve now ordered an electric cut off valve so when electric fuel pump in boot turns off the new valve should cut the fuel off stopping it. Now this car has a new 1800cc engine replacement because the old engine seized up destroying itself so I think this was the issue that’s been past on from old engine to the new engine. I’m not sure if anyone else has had this issue with an 1800 tc setup on a hill.
@glennpowell3444
@glennpowell3444 Год назад
Sorry I am following this MG lump story but for the life of me still cant understand why you didnt repair that valve first and then establish what happened.?In your video it clearly shows its knackered?.....You have instead stripped the block again.Whatever your customer thinks is wrong start with the obvious? Your chasing your own tails in pointless circles?
@markpetniunas198
@markpetniunas198 Год назад
I have found this problem once in the past. Had a vintage car customer that had a worn out engine that pumped/burned oil and smoked a lot. I did a full complete overhaul put engine back in and it still smoked when it got hot? The problem was the exhaust pipes and muffler on the car were full of oil and carbon from old engine. I ran it in the parking lot at 3500 rpm for an hour or more and eventually it all cleared out. Only time i have ever seen this problem, made me a bit nervous, turned out ok in the end. Just a thought.
@mawe42
@mawe42 Год назад
Paul says it in my opinion regarding the rings, its not been broken in yet. It probably been running crap so they haven't been able to drive it properly. It needs to be driven briskly to hard right away.
@rockster1967
@rockster1967 Год назад
If the customer was that clever he’d build his own engine.
@richardprice9165
@richardprice9165 Год назад
If it was me, I would have refused to touch the engine until the pcv problem had been corrected, my money is on that would have fixed it. When diagnosing faults always start with the easiest things first. Saves time, money and stress
@kennygray1115
@kennygray1115 Год назад
Could you remove a few rings that are still black in places and put them in the bores then measure the gap and or see if the ring touches all the way around the bore? Would confirm that the bores are not ovalled !! Good luck
@michaelperry4308
@michaelperry4308 Год назад
I did my apprenticeship on these and would say the rings aren't bedded because it is sucking so much oil from the PCV they are not contacting the bores enough TO bed in.
@e30mark
@e30mark Год назад
I've a 1967 MGBGT, the previous owner put a new engine in it because of oil usage. The new engine used oil as well, it was the valve at fault, probably nothing wrong with the original engine!
@FixxxerKH202
@FixxxerKH202 Год назад
I wouldn't change the rings and I would bring it to a dyno with the broken pcv and run it on the dyno for diagnosis and setting the carbs and charge it all back to them when it shows it's the PCV. His argument is nonsense about the rings because you can clearly see even where it's shadowed that the ring is still making contact with the cylinder wall on a section of it. The rings typically move in the slot in the piston and only contact on a small edge due to the side clearance of the ring to the piston groove and eventually the rings will wear and make more contact later in the engines life. He can't be that great of a mechanic if he's putting a reconditioned engine into a car and didn't go through and at least check and clean the pcv prior to running and tuning the carbs. In my eyes changing the rings is admitting fault when it is not your error.
@johnhanson8442
@johnhanson8442 Год назад
The rings look fine and I would put them back in. I would do what the customer wants with the rings and fit the original pcv valve. If it doesn’t smoke (which I doubt it will)then it will rule out ring problems then fit new pcv and you will be able to charge for your labour.
@jamesplotkin4674
@jamesplotkin4674 Год назад
First off, did you get a tear-down and reassembly charge up front? And if not, I'd have insisted the PCV valve be replaced before any further head-scratching. Also, did this punter use synthetic oil, as that will delay bed-in of the rings. And third... how the F is anything conclusive after only 50 miles? This guy sounds too thick.
@lanceboyle4255
@lanceboyle4255 Год назад
The spacer on those oil rings can be tricky. Check that the ends are butted together and not overlapping
@TheBlibo
@TheBlibo Год назад
The oil was rather black for only 50 miles had they used an after market oil treatment, its an old tech old material engine it was probably designed to use 20W/50 or 15W40 mineral oil and as said start it and drive it just normally at normal traffic speeds for about 150 miles. I don't remember these engines ever having a pcv valve only a short hose from rocker cover to air filter housing or venting to atmosphere
@MrBradfordchild
@MrBradfordchild Год назад
So you pulled a whole newly rebuilt engine apart instead of changing out the pcv? Genius!!
@kbrickell4732
@kbrickell4732 Год назад
The godeon pin circlips are not orientated to stop them closing under very high revs
@thomastaylor1283
@thomastaylor1283 Год назад
Running in engines is it needed now a days with the oils available. The only engine I tried to run in was an 1100 a series with power max pistons road race cam and a mg 1100 head on twin 1 1/2 su and an Alton yellow distributor. Start run 15 min change oil and filter 50 mile no hard throttle change oil check valves torque head at 300 miles change oil filter oil check head then steady road use to 600 to 1000 miles started burning oil at 700 miles. Had block sleeved and rebuilt with new rings told to just keep it below 6000 rpm for 100 miles.did not burn a drop after 300 miles just needed gear box because of drum brakes and over rev on down change. This as in the early 89s. Met Raif Broad of Broadspeed mini and for ford angle box escort he ran in engines by start it check timing mini 3/4 rev jack up put in gear and bed in 1 or 2 sets of brake pads original cooper then run at full throttle for 5 to 10 minutes cool check head etc change oil and filter. Then race it or give to client.
@davespinks4992
@davespinks4992 Год назад
Throw the rings, bust the glaze on the bore, the bore and the rings will glaze up if a standard oil has been used like it’s supposed to do to protect the parts from wear, your bedding an engine in and should use a running in oil which allows contact and rings to bed in achieving maximum compression. Using a standard oil engines can take thousands of miles to bed in, always recommend a running in oil and keep it topped up to its max, and when it stops using oil is a good indicator that the engine has run in no matter how long it takes, then use your standard oil. PCV’s and gauze breathers account for a lot of unnecessary rebuilds and that engine doesn’t look like it’s been burning a lot of oil and would certainly point my finger at the PCV. 👍
@steve0680657
@steve0680657 Год назад
Maybe a rougher hone in the bores to bed/match rings to bores more easily.
@MrKornhole
@MrKornhole Год назад
Gotta let the bits run in. With such a short run time on the engine all of the moving parts just haven't had enough time. Good luck.
@antburrows3101
@antburrows3101 Год назад
If the carbs are over fuelling on the mgb the compression rings will develop dark areas
@donk0405
@donk0405 Год назад
Surely you'd leave the rings so you know whether or not it's the pcv ???
@johnb9394
@johnb9394 Год назад
I would verify the valve stem clearance too
@shanerorko8076
@shanerorko8076 Год назад
It's not the rings, it's likely glazed the bores. I bet that either the owner or the mechanic has let it sit idling for too long. When an engine is new it is crucial that it sees load, I do a 5 minute coolant warm up then a 20 minute drive. The first 20 minutes is the most crucial to have it out on the road, I also vacuum fill the cooling system to cut down on bleeding time. The High Performance Acadamy has a good video on bedding in rings. I will then drive the car for about an hour, after an hour it can do some small hills for 70% throttle load low rpm driving to bring the load in on the rings, after about one and a half hours of bed in it's good for normal grandma driving for the first 300km then it should be good.
@mykline1
@mykline1 Год назад
On that smoking engine you need to see it put back in the car set up the way it was before with the bad PVC, if not he will claim it was the rings. Then you will be stuck with the labor and parts cost instead of the shop that didn't check external parts like the PVC.
@186scott
@186scott Год назад
I would have said the pcv as well and if it was due to the rings evidence would be visible when you pulled the pistons out as it would be oily in with the piston rings (not including the oil scrapers) also looking at the inlet ports and back of valve heads would be an oily carbony aswell as opposed to a nice Carbon film or my engine I rebuilt (alot of new parts) was smokey for a while and then cleared up as it burnt off all the protective oil/film on the new parts but putting a load on the engine clears it up
@ronprout4550
@ronprout4550 Год назад
I had a Morris Major with a very modified 3 bearing mgb motor 120 bhp at the wheels only 2 compression rings 11 to 1 comp 2 gal Benz in 5 super 7000rpm 1inch vent tube in side panel into catch can no smoke
@GARDENER42
@GARDENER42 Год назад
When everyone who knows anything about the MGB engine says it's the PCV but the customer still disagrees & asks for new rings, it sounds more like they're trying to find a way of not paying for the stripdown & rebuilding...
@christurner6430
@christurner6430 Год назад
Are you sure the head bolt torque settings are for lubricated threads? Normally the threads should be clean and dry only. Lubrication will substantially increase the applied bolt tension.
@darrendean21
@darrendean21 Год назад
At 50 miles those rings have not even begun to bed in yet, they don't need changing.
@stevek3036
@stevek3036 Год назад
If the MG compression rings were blowing by then the sides of the pistons would show tell-tale stains?
@paulmuff9883
@paulmuff9883 Год назад
Two things that add together that can make it smoky not to mention the fact it’s not been run in yet, with the valve being no good/ scrap he will no be able to set the correct mixture on the su carbs = probably running far to rich and also with the valve being scrap there’s probably back pressure being forced in to the head = oil being forced down valve Guide’s , ps the rings, pistons and bores are not yet bedded in yet also, he should have let you know of the problem, then running it in for a 1,000 and re-assess if problem was still there .
@raycollington4310
@raycollington4310 Год назад
In addition to what's been said and it looks to me the piston rings have had no chance to bed in. Do we always know these engine rebuilds always have the correct dipstick and hence the right amount of engine oil, as well know what too much oil will do.
@andersbjornson3544
@andersbjornson3544 Год назад
A test run without the PCV would be good I think. Cheers.
@thomasclassicandmodern
@thomasclassicandmodern Год назад
Put a set of rings in it if the customer insists but then tell him you want to Then fire it up with the pcv valve blanked off. Get an emmisions tester on it and I'll put money on it it's running as rich as hell. Ring bedding won't take place with a pcv valve that's sucking in oil, which has clearly been shown. Long story short the garage have dropped a ball by telling the customer he needed an engine rebuild in the first place and now they are trying to save face.
@Travis141123
@Travis141123 Год назад
Run it in proper with conventional oil, then test crankcase vacuum and cylinder leakage if oil consumption is abnormal.
@shaundadson8302
@shaundadson8302 Год назад
Added a comment to the previous video and forgot to mention the oil. As Paul commented in this video definitely a 20/50 with zddp in these old engines, or running in oil, (Millers, Minispares, Rye oils, Westway etc do 20/50 to this spec). Be interesting to see what is found if you have the oil analysed - hopefully he didn't use a semi synthetic or full synthetic oil as that would be an oil burner from the start. Also did forget to mention the valve stem oil seals - the ones in most of the gasket sets are rubbish now, (even Payen), so I normally use Viton ones, (which I source from Gaskets For Classics), as these seal the valve stems much better. Also use them on the exhausts as well as inlets. Normally try to partially run the engines in before the customer has the car back. Normally take the car round lanes and B roads to put a few revs and load on it followed by deceleration to load and unload the pressure in the engine to bed the rings in, which has always worked for me. As Paul says being too gentle, or leaving it ticking over with no load is definitely not the way to go.
@phitsf5475
@phitsf5475 Год назад
Why would you face those parts again if the flatness measures fine? What has surface roughness got to do with a head gasket doing its job?
@danlearned6199
@danlearned6199 Год назад
Just wondering?? The fella torquing the head studs on the aluminum head I have to wonder...Is this an aluminum overhead cam conversion for the MGB motor?? Often thought that'd be a good update.
@paularnold9625
@paularnold9625 Год назад
All those had pcv valve problem had one fully raced from 1500 to something like 1790 about 10 years ago got rid of pcv valve in all of them catch can job dun
@ashleyweston5420
@ashleyweston5420 Год назад
Regardless of the ring condition the PCV's are (imho) rubbish, vent the engine with a catch can to avoid carboning up the head going forward. Back in the day I put vented mine to atmosphere, end of problem and clean inlet ports for ever. Ok that wouldn't be acceptable nowadays hence the catch can suggestion.
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