Do you know the difference between mold testing and mold assessment? They couldn't be more different. Watch our fun, informative video and learn to talk the talk like a pro.
We paid $1000 for 5 mold spore air tests and 5 swab tests. All came back completely normal. My wife had just tested positive for high mycotoxins so I knew something was wrong. We then did a mycotoxin test in the house and the results were through the roof. Air tests usually miss the really bad black type mold spores because they are too heavy and sticky to do much floating around, but are kicking of mycotoxins. People are taking such air tests thinking they are in the clear and are missing the most toxic molds. From my experience, besides the mold assessment, an environmental mycotoxin test is absolutely crucial.
I appreciate the insight from your end. While I don’t share the same thoughts of a Mycotoxin test being crucial, I do agree that too many individuals are misguided into air samples providing all of the answers they’re looking for. Unfortunately, every type of sampling has its limitations. It’s important for professionals to understand the limitations with each type of sampling method and to then inform their clients for what can and cannot be expected from said sampling method.
@@IAQJosh I have no comprehension on why a mycotoxin test would not be the most important test to be done. The labs that do the testing told us that it was of the most importance that any mold removal company had a guarantee that mycotoxins will be within an acceptable level after they are done. This has been a very embarrassing situation for at least three of such companies in the area. It is the mycotoxins that cause the health issues and rarely the mold spores themselves. It is extremely odd with all of the medical papers showing the dangers of mycotoxins and the fact that you could not even sell a bin of feed that has been contaminated with them, that the average mold remediator does not take them seriously. If a spore test shows high levels of toxic mold spores, the chances are extremely high that mycotoxins have been released and will not be removed from the mold removal alone and will actually usually be worse after disturbing the mold. One such company actually admitted that most of their customers who take mycotoxin urine tests before and after had higher levels after the mold removal. This is a very sad situation that most people have no idea about because they do not have the money or recommendations by their doctor to take such tests.
Thanks a million! I have mold in my pantry closet ceiling (I live on the top floor of a building) and your video really helps me to make the right decision!
Really good video Josh. I have listened to ALOT of talks by IEP's and yours was the most straightforward. I need an inspection and probably remediation done here in North Florida. To find a good inspector, what would be your top 5-10 questions to ask in vetting them?
Can I have the top 5-10 questions to ask in getting a good inspector for remediation? How to tell if the hygienist assessment is done by a third party lab? Insurance company is getting result from company who supposedly did the incomplete mold remediation.
Hi Josh I absolutely love your videos, please keep making more! By any chance you can share the brand or link to buy the bigger hard case with the foam?
Is it important for the mold inspector/tester to be licensed or certified? Someone just used an air quality test here in my apartment. I thought the little dishes were set out by some. What's the difference?
The Petri dishes (little dishes) are used to support growth and culture microorganisms (such as mold/fungi). This could be useful if you’re looking to know the specific species. Spore-trap sampling (commonly called air sampling) is used to collect a portion of the fungi/mold spores that are floating about - providing you with a snapshot of what’s going on within your air quality (from the viewpoint of mold spores and hyphae only, at the genus level). Both have their place in collecting relevant mold/fungi data. As far as whether or not an inspector/assessor needs to be certified or licensed, that would depend on your state laws. In the state of Florida, one would need to be a licensed mold assessor to perform mold-related investigations. Personally and professionally speaking, I feel that anyone procuring mold samples and performing investigations should be sufficiently knowledgeable of building science. This knowledge can be derived in a number of ways - most commonly through board certifications and research.
i had a mold in air vent and hvac system and I cleaned up with mold killer after I was getting irritated nose. Once I cleaned up, I started coughing. Then I got airduct cleaned, fogged twice...nothing seems to work. I fixed the root cause of the mold and there is no visiable mold in hvac system any more. Is mold accessment still good idea?. One of the IAQ specialist I talked said it would be useless to hire mold inspection at this point and I am quite confused who to hire. My family cough so..I am really in need finding a solution.
Hi Jason. Couple of questions for you… Other than the irritated nose, did you or any other family members have other symptoms - more specifically, a cough prior to the mold cleanup? Assuming no, consideration for the “mold killer” and fog products contributing to this cough should be in play. I can’t tell you how many of my clients have worse reactions to chemicals than they do mold. Assuming there was a cough prior to your attempt to mitigate the mold source, you should consider that there is still another source. I’m in the process of putting together a methodical approach to sampling, which will be specific to folks combatting mold-related illness. You may absolutely want to consider hiring an indoor environmental professional to perform an assessment. Furthermore, I would be happy to share with them the approach that I would recommend for focusing in on the possible sources for mold within your home. Feel free to shoot me an email to further discuss - josh@learniaq.com
Im a real estate professional in Illinois and I had a client who had a mold test done. The levels reported in the basement were 246 for Penicillium/Aspergillius or something like that. That reading per the report says moderate and indicates inconclusive. My client attempted to get a mold company to do an assessment for safety but they stated without any mold visible there was nothing they could do. Needless to say the deal fell through because my client was nervous about the Mold test reading. My question is given that level found on the mold test for that type of mold, was that home uninhabitable or potentially dangerous to live in?
Hi D J! To start, only a medical professional would be able to give advice as to the safety of living within an area impacted by mold. As mold professionals, we can provide guidance, but determining whether an area is dangerous to be in is beyond our expertise. With that said, it would be helpful to know if the 246 is the number of spores per m3 or the raw count - as this would be the difference between something that we may consider to be acceptable vs. concerning. If the mold testing was done using a DIY kit, I can understand why there may not have been enough information for understanding. However, if a mold-related professional performed the testing, there should have been a better explanation of the results. Furthermore, a mold assessment contractor should have absolutely been able to perform an assessment, even without visible growth. The majority of the assessments that I perform have no visible indication of a problem - merely occupants complaining of symptoms, etc. Ultimately, more information would be needed to provide any insight specific to your situation. As far as the type of mold itself, this is a very common mold to have within an indoor environment, as this will naturally occur both indoors and out.
Hi Josh, this was so informative. My daughter and I developed CFS. Yale can’t even provide a diagnosis. For her it is so severe she is bed bound and has had to drop out of high school. We have a mold smell and quality air purifiers have helped somewhat. I feel better when I’m away from our house. Can you recommend any one in Northern CT? I’m a microbiologist by training, so a lot of things I understand. We are pretty desperate to get some answers and don’t want to be taken advantage of. We appreciate any help.
Hi Kristen. My apologies for the belated reply. I’m so sorry to hear of what your family is going through. I do have a colleague that services your area, however, I think it would be best to understand specifically what you’re looking for. If you wouldn’t mind, please send me an email so that we can further discuss and I can connect you with that colleague of mine - assuming he’s a good fit.
@@IAQJosh hi, my husband located a couple spots and is in the process of removing it. We also got a moisture meter. But I’d still like to get your expert opinion, can I have your email address?
Hi Josh. I “liked” and subscribed! I very much appreciate your comprehensive videos. My question seems to be out of the ordinary after watching several of your videos and reading all the comments. In my apartment, I had a heavy a/c return vent leak that flooded a good portion of the back of the apartment. It took them 40 days to send out an A/C repairman during this flooding. I was never given fans nor was there any suctioning up of all the water. It smelled horrible-awfully musty, and made my daughter so ill she had to move out. My little well trained dog seemed to be effected too, and would occasionally urinate in that area? I ended up covering the areas with rugs and blankets. It’s been 2+ years and there is no moisture, but the carpets are thickly ‘stained’ with the old mold. I’ve been struggling mightily, health wise since almost the beginning of the flooding to this day. I don’t need to find out from where it came, or if there is mold. 👉🏻I do think I need to know the amount of spores and what type I’ve been living with? Would the “Mold Testing” be sufficient?👈🏻I’d be ever so grateful for your knowledgeable response. Please and thank you so much.
Hey there! Thank you for liking and subscribing. I'm glad that you're finding value in the content I've posted. To start, I'm sorry that you're dealing with these issues within your apartment. Before I get into answering your question about testing for mold, I encourage you to toss the area rugs that you have. Although you can technically clean rugs, unless these are heirlooms or have some other irreplaceable traits, I can't see much of a point to hold on to rugs that have endured water damage and sat with mold for some time. You may have already made up your mind that they are trash, or even tossed them by now. If so, kudos on that decision! Now, moving on to the mold testing/ assessment phase. First and foremost, you need to decide what your goals are with this prospective service. If you're working with a physician and they want/need to know what type of molds are present and their respective quantities, then some level of mold sampling would be recommended. Are you trying to focus on the damages sustained from the flooding a while back, or are you wanting to have an idea of all potential water and mold related damages within your apartment? Assuming it's the latter, a quality inspection is highly recommended. Testing/ sampling aside, a trained professional using handheld meters, flashlights, etc. is far more valuable in identifying concerning areas and issues. Although it may be tempting to go with straightforward mold testing, based on the much more affordable price points, you may just be throwing money down the toilet if it's not providing you with the answers you seek. Here is a quick Venn diagram that I threw together, to share with you the differences between both services, on paper. Sometimes it helps to see things written down. www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/q0lyyjuy5frm6nrcgo1p4/Mold-Services-Comparison.pdf?rlkey=jo8e6ief5noq76o7mnihxtr5n&dl=0
@@IAQJosh Sir, you are so appreciated! Thank you so very much. Do you have a company in Phoenix, Arizona that you would recommend? Please and thank you. May abundant blessings be upon you. [Edit: And your Venn diagram was extremely helpful. Thank you so much, again sir!!!]
The only individual that I know of in that area is one by the name of Brandon White, who is an industrial hygienist with Environmental Forensic Consultants. This gentleman is also an instructor with Reets Drying Academy, which is a well known educational firm within our industry. I would contact his office, explain your situation, and determine if he and his team would be a good fit. 623-687-7933. Be sure to ask questions and do your due diligence to screen them and ensure they're a good fit - especially because I cannot vouch for them based on first-hand experience.
@@IAQJosh Josh, sir, you are such a wealth of information and a great blessing to me. Thank you ever so kindly. I will do my research as per your videos. You are so appreciated!
I know that smell all too well, Jake! Using adsorbent tubes and other forms of media for VOC collection, some labs can evaluate the MVOCs (microbial volatile organic compounds), which are compounds that are present during the metabolism of mold/fungi and bacteria.
A discussion of measurement results is why I clicked on the video. No mention of numbers or result extrapolations. Microbial sampling and analysis has significant limitations and may not be a predictor of indoor air related health problems. There are currently no industry or legal standards for acceptable microbial concentrations in buildings. I led and performed IAQ surveys in USAF as a Bioenvironmental Engineer. That was 14 years ago. Today I have a buyer for my home who just provided me the results of the indoor air inspection. WOW. The contractor highlighted the lower level number 27/m3 in red as MAJOR elevated Stachybotrys black mold. The exterior was 13. The upstairs was 13. And the other molds were the same 13 & 27. The mold tested with the rapid air sampler can not be differentiated as viable or not. Meaning it isn't growing. The budding mold number is Hyphal and it was not hyped up in the color red. Unlikely to do remediation with these numbers. A Captain in my USAF flight would go out on IAQ calls to the residences at Langley AFB (oldest AFB in US which sits on an Estuary) and he would swipe the black mold with his finger and eat it. Capt Gormely was very popular with commanders when this story got around. My realtor recommended a guy from his business group who can test. Test what, where, and what does the remaining inspection say about moisture. Where were the surface moisture meter readings? The inspectors emptied out a 12 X 12 basement closet then did a mold test. Hmmmm no wonder they found spores.
I'm doing research into mold and assessment. If you have time sooner or later, would you like to talk a little about the field. I'm gathering information to build a product for school.
Hey Kyle! Sorry for the delayed response. When you say labor test, what are you referring to? Assuming you’re referring to mold testing/sampling with the quickest turn around time, spore-trap (air) and surface samples that are analyzed via microscopy by labs tend to be the fastest. This is excluding other mold testing technologies like Instascope and Mycometer which will provide real-time and near real-time results.
There was water in basement due to malfunctioned sump pump during rainstorm. We removed the water ourselves because nobody was available due to flooding in the community,but finally was able to hire a company to remove the carpeting and base board and they used a commercial dehumidifier for about a week. We have since continued to use regular dehumidifiers keeping it at a level of 30 to 35% humidity. There is no smell at all in the basement. Do you think a mold inspection is necessary ? Thank you!
Hey there! Couple of factors to touch on. For starters, water intrusion from the exterior of a property, especially at ground level, increases the likelihood of introducing contaminates into your home. When this happens, it’s good industry practice to remove all porous materials that were impacted by this water (carpet, drywall, insulation - to name a few). While a mold assessment is typically performed when there are concern(s) at hand, there is nothing to stop you from having one performed at this point. More importantly, if you were to elect to have an assessment performed, I would lean toward an environmental assessment - which would cover the evaluation of other microorganisms, like bacteria.
@@IAQJosh , thank you for the information! I forgot to mention they sprayed the whole basement walls,floors with antifungal/antibacterial spray at the time of carpet removal. I also sprayed the whole place with Concrobium spray few days later. Any thoughts on that? Also, if it is still advisable to get an environmental assessment and/or mold assessment, how can I find somebody reputable? Thanks again
While I cannot speak to Concrobium, as I have no personal experience with that product, I can say that any products that provide disinfection can only do so when they come in contact with microorganisms. In other words, if bacteria is forming behind the wallboard within the basement, the wallboard would need to be removed to access these areas. As far as whether or not you should still have an assessment performed, that is completely up to you. This comes down to your personal preference. Do keep in mind that bringing out your average assessor will generally return average results. You’ll want to find someone that is passionate about what they do, and will undergo a thorough initial interview process with you. Without this, they would be guessing at what they should do and where.
In the event that you’d like me to see if I can recommend anyone within your area, feel free to shoot em an email with your whereabouts. I’m happy to check in with folks in my circle. Josh@learniaq.com
I had mold in the grout in my shower. I cleaned it. But i still have alot of mucus. Tickling my throat. Alot of coughing. Where can i get a test to find out if its in the air.
Hi Mike. While there are certainly options for testing for mold in the air, the information you’ll gain as a whole isn’t all it’s cracked up to be. Testing for mold in the air is merely a portion of the big picture in many instances. Truth be told, I run into more situations where there is little to no mold spores within the air, and yet there are major mold-related issues within the property. Have you considered hiring a professional to perform a proper mold assessment? This would involve mold testing/sampling as needed, but also include a thorough investigation - which is worth it’s weight in gold.
My ermi test says to not live in the house, the inspector did one sample test with tape and it was high but the air tests were low , he doesn’t seem to think it’s an issue . He did his outside sample and it was lightly raining that day, will an outdoor sample have higher or lower spores on a day that’s a bit above misting ? I wonder if that threw off the testing . He told me I must be getting sick from mold elsewhere but all the surface testing is high , just not the air samples
Thanks for the excellent question! First and foremost, ERMI testing/reporting does not dictate whether or not an individual should live or not live in a home. In fact, the ERMI score in general is not necessarily a figure that professionals and consumers alike should be looking at. EPA states that ERMI testing should not be used to determine if there is mold impacting an indoor environment. However, as a professional, I can understand how we can use the data within an ERMI report to assist us and others in determining the extent of mold indoors. With that said, ERMI or a-PCR sampling alone is not enough. Now that I’ve said all of the above, I’ll get off of my soapbox. 😆 Surface samples are an excellent choice in evaluating surfaces within an indoor environment for fungal impact. Air samples are also a good tool, but understand that these have limitations. There are many instances in which we will find “acceptable” air samples, but find a major underlying mold impact. I see this all the time with HVAC systems. As far as your question about the impact of rain to air samples…. The more moisture we have in the air, the less particulate we’ll find floating around - mold spores included. It’s very seldom that we find much or anything on air samples when it’s raining outside.
A licensed of qualified (if your state does not require licensing) mold assessment contractor or industrial hygienist is who you’re looking for. Many companies will perform mold testing services, but much fewer companies perform quality mold assessment services. The company I recommended to you in the other comments section is where I would start - if I was in your shoes.
Well that depends on the type of recommendations you’re looking for. I’m a chatty patty who loves to discuss operating procedures, methodology, etc. Where are you currently at with your assessment company? What element of assessment could you use some recommendations with? Feel free to email me, if you’d like to chat offline. Josh@learniaq.com
How long take to know the results for mold? , someone came at the house and did the test with the air machine , is been a week and l still weating for a result
Hi Celeste. The answer to your question depends on a number of factors. Unfortunately, these factors should have been discussed with you by the environmental professional that came out. 1. The location of the lab where the sample(s) are being analyzed - whether the lab is local or out of state. 2. The type of analysis requested - standard microscopy or culturing. If a similar pump to that shown in my video was used, microscopy would be the only option, which doesn’t take very long to analyze. 3. The turn around time (TAT) selected by the professional on the lab chain of custody form. Personally, I would reach out the the individual that was out to your property and follow-up.
@@IAQJosh Yes, That's the Only Reason I would need this. I'm so sick when I'm in this house. Some of My Symptoms includes, Headaches, Post Nasal Drip Congestion, Stuffy/Runny Nose, Severely Itchy Red Watery eyes, Wheezing, Cough, Dry itchy Skin, Extreme Chronic Fatigue, irritability, Muscle aches, Sharp shooting Pain in My Back and Legs, Morning Stiffness & Aches & Pain in My Joints to Name a Few.
@@IAQJosh Based on what I learned here I didn't know that there is a difference between a mild test and Mold assessment. I have had Someone Come out and did a Mold Test in My House which came back at normal Levels. I moved for Apartment where I lived and had this Problem and bought a fairly newer house (Built in 2006) with the hope that My problem would go away. But it didn't, it continued. I have explored every other possibility that could be causing this problem, from Removing My carpet, Cleaning and Disinfecting My HVAC And All Surfaces in the house, Cleaning & Disinfecting My Furniture. I continually air out the whole house just in case I have any VOCs or Possibility of Formaldehyde anywhere, Still I'm Sick as hell, all that didn't solve anything or even make Me feel better. I don't see any Visible Mold anywhere, I've read that the Mold test Alone Might not be conclusive enough to identify Mold. So now I'm looking for Mold Assessment in My Area and every company I talk to does not know what I'm talking about. Unless it's the same as "Mold Inspection" which is what they say.
@@nedunonnyp704 Got it. I’m so sorry to hear what you’re going through. Mold inspection, assessment, and investigation are often used interchangeably. It’s not so much the name that matters, but the scope of service. The single most important part of the mold assessment process is the visual inspection - in my professional opinion. Knowing where to look and how to use tools like flashlights and borescopes to your advantage is second to none. Beyond that, identifying areas of moisture is a very important step - as we cannot have active mold without a moisture source. While there may be “old mold” present, finding and eliminating moisture sources will limit continued mold development. When you speak with mold professionals, simply ask them what their scope of service is during an assessment/inspection/investigation. If you want to be a little more layman than that, simply ask them what they will be doing as part of the service. If they lead with discussion about mold testing or sampling, that’s often a red flag that they focus more on testing than the actual involved work - which is a comprehensive visual inspection. Another way to rule out “mold testers” from true mold professionals is by steering clear of competitively priced services. One thing I’ve learned is that the “in and out” mold professionals try to be competitive, whereas professionals who understand the value that they bring to the table often won’t be competitively priced. I’m sure you’ve heard the saying “you get what you pay for”. Mold assessment is no different. Do your research. Ask these professionals about some of their more challenging assessments. Ask them how important they value the mold testing/sampling phase of the service. Ask them if they try to identify the source of mold within your home, also know as identifying causation. These questions alone will often weed out average folks from exceptional individuals.
Environmental Forensic Consultants 623-687-7933 - Office line Brandon White is an instructor within our industry and came highly recommended from a colleague of mine. He and his team should be able to take proper care of you. Please do let me know how your experience goes. You’re welcome to email me directly. Josh@learniaq.com
Aeroqual Series 200 handheld w/ Ozone OZL (0-0.5 PPM) sensor Amprobe CO2-100 Carbon Dioxide handheld meter Fieldpiece STA2 In-duct Hot Wire Anenometer Honeywell MiniRAE Lite+ handheld VOC monitor Particles Plus 8306 handheld laser particle counter Reed R3001 Pitot Tube Anemometer / Differential Manometer Buck BioAire Bioaerosol sampling pump Tramex Moisture Encounter 5 moisture meter Delmhorst BD-2100 moisture meter Vaisala HM40 Thermohygrometer Flir E85 Thermal Imaging camera While I swapped out some of the above instruments since this video aired, this is what is in the cases shown within this video.
Sending sample to a lab lets you know if its a benign type of mold or if its a mold with mycotoxins that can have serious health effects. We treat each mold job as if it has mycotoxins and get into action rather than wait for lab results.
Depending on your definition of “affirm”, I will answer both yes and no. Can an assessor objectively affirm that there is mold, without testing/sampling? No. However, an assessor may affirm with a high level of confidence that something is mold, subjectively speaking. I for one will often make professional judgments on what is or isn’t mold, based on characteristics I can see and touch. The biggest limitation comes down to reporting, as an assessor should only make statements that they can defend. So long as an assessor is clear about their findings, both objectively and subjectively, statements may be made that either affirm or elude to mold being present.
Again, good video, but I don't share your thoughts on certain statements. The two that concern me is one, sending the report from the lab to your client. I feel and I do this all time, and teach this, is to write a findings report that explains conditions at the subject property. If the mold testing inspector just forwards the lab's results to the client, he's doing nothing. Second, unless your certified and experienced in mold remediation protocols, and, also have participated in actual remediation, you should not be writing protocols. After I finish a job with inspection and tests that does have issues, I send my reports to a remediator that I know and trust that's in an adjunct relation by industry. Look carefully at the legal side of this. If I do the above, write the protocols, use my remediator of choice to execute, it may result in a conflict of interest. I'm in Illinois. The Illinois of Department of Regulations would come into play here.
Hey now… Fortunately, we as professionals, consumers etc., don’t always have to agree. 😎 Not sure where our thoughts differ, as I too am not a fan or professionals simply turning over lab reports to clients. Furthermore, I 100% agree that it should be a prerequisite to have mold remediation experience before becoming a licensed/certified mold assessor. If it was up to me, I think a minimum of 2 years of verified experience would be a great start! What you’re doing with your remediation colleague isn’t a bad idea at all. In fact, I think it’s commendable that you’re not just writing a protocol and shooting it out to a client - especially if you don’t have any mold remediation experience. Didn’t get a feel for your remediation experience (if any) in your last comment. The fact that I have a background in mold remediation certainly makes for a realistic approach when writing my protocols.
Hi Charlie! While I don’t personally know anyone that services that area, the below contact was recommended by a colleague that I know and trust. I would recommend reaching out to this company and discussing your situation with them. Make sure that they sound like they’re a good fit for your needs. Please be sure to let me know how your experience is with them, should you choose to hire them. I’m always looking for reliable companies in other areas to refer. Springfield Quality Services: 417-323-6235.
Unfortunately, costs will vary from one location to another. Also, costs may vary dramatically from one company to another, based on credentials, experience, overhead, etc. With all that said, average cost for mold testing per sample is around $100 here in South Florida. For a mold assessment in this area, you’re looking at anywhere from $400-$800 for an average size service.
@@IAQJosh Man that’s crazy. In Oklahoma each sample is $25 to test. A mold inspection/mold sampling is $400. Not sure how much I am old assessment would cost
I’m not sure how someone could charge as little as $25/ sample, when laboratory analysis of the samples starts at that pricing on up. Nevertheless, you’re just confirming the variability in pricing within different areas. Thanks for sharing!
@@IAQJosh No, I’m saying the laboratory charges $25. We charge $400 for the inspection and you get two or three samples with that just depends. I was wondering how much a mold assessment cost
Stupid marketing scam! Licensed mold contractor just means they took a one week training and passed a quiz or less. Just tell people if they have mold, how much, where and the steps to remove it and how much it will cost. You are making yourself sound like a doctor or scientist when you don’t even have a bachelors degree.
I feel like your not a very educated person.... Mold does affect your health. He's not promoting to be a doctor or a scientist. As the certifications go, its not just one week and pass a quiz its years of experience in the mold industry by actually doing the mold remediation yourself. Get educated please. Quick Google search will help you. Thanks.
@pl2604 Ohmygoodness! You were not forced to watch this very informative video. I personally, am very grateful for his experience and sharing it with us. I’m hoping you will have a happier day tomorrow, in complete sincerity.
Hi Alfredo! You’re welcome to reach out to me in my cell: 954.629.1856. Text is always the best, but as long as I’m expecting the call, phone is also fine.
