OP tiliting off at the end is hilarious considering legacybuff should know your deck doesn't win out of nowhere but can hose reanimator out of nowhere. playing thoughtseize + exhume on the same turn on turn 2 or 3 instead of chaining on 1 then 2 would have avoided a feel bad/given perfect info
I think the problem is that playing oops is all in. In this deck even if your opponent forces the manabond thats just a 2 for 1 and you can keep playing.
@@gxmoyano Definitely. I was just being cheeky. Oops All Spells just does one of those things I really like, which is: Cast spells. It's why I like Storm decks, lol.
I was excited for this one and you delivered. With so much interaction for Dark Depths out there, I like the idea of swapping out DD & Crop Rotation for an Urza's Saga package.
On the Conversations you've been offering over the past two or three videos about Mono Red Prison, I'm 99% sure that THIS deck in particular is why we've been seeing such an influx of the deck in Legacy. It's good to stop with Chalice, and of course, Moon just kills it if Boseiju doesn't show up.
If they're banning ANYTHING from this deck, it's going to be Manabond. This is the only deck that abuses it, but it's also not the biggest problem deck; that title still goes to the worst deck in Legacy, Delver.
@@DarkestFiction I don't think Manabond is that important to the deck. Yes it's good, yes it facilitates nuts draws, but if you replace it with Mox Diamond the deck doesn't become that much worse -- Mox Diamond allows you to Mulch at turn one and is pretty good with non-nuts draws. If I had to ban one card (and yes right now I wouldn't), I'd ban Crop Rotation. With more and more lands being printed, tutoring any of them for G seems overly good.
Nice gameplay. At 31:03 i would have gotten the karakas. Make them work extra hard to play around it. I also tend to board out some depths on the mirror, most times they can marit lage on your land.
Haven't watched this yet, but really enjoyed Phil's play and will be keeping this tab open to get to in the near future! Really wanna buy this deck so bad, but that means I need a 2nd Tabby, and, well, we all know how that goes.
It's weird to hear you refer to the mirror as "the deck playing Mox Diamond is the 'slow' version" That really cements the level of degeneracy we're considering in this deck.
r2 g2 from 38:20 forward you could have just rotationed for stage and pushed with a 20/20. very aggressive, but you require your OP to have stp or to make them crop rotation for wasteland
in g3 round 1 couldn't you use maze of ith on your attacking zombie that was blocked by a creature (after that creature received protection from black for mother of runes)?
For those who watched, this is comment is open for criticism, as I'm not an expert, but do really enjoy lands archetypes. So something of note I saw from watching a Jarvis Yu video on this. He mentioned that the primary kill condition in the deck isn't DD combo, but crapping out a bunch of zombies, which is contrary to most mainstream lands builds. This deck's inevitably and ability to stabilize vs. fair decks is what makes it so powerful, along with the 12 "draw 2-4 for 2 mana" cards in the deck. The weakest matchup for this deck is combo, which is why Manabond is so important to out-combo them and why the sideboard is tilted slightly in the direction of combo hate. Shaving Exploration over Manabond is more correct for this deck because your primary wincon is erupting a shitload of zombies from your Manabond trigger. In the combo matchups, the gameplan changes to just protecting yourself and getting a Lage, sp boarding out Field is usually the way to go. Show and Tell is still the worst enemy of this deck, but historically that's been the case. Loved the video Brian!
imo waterlogged grove should be nurturing peatland for those edge cases where u have an untapped land and want to surgical. also the second taiga could be a karplusan forest but i guess its not fetchable so really its a personal tech
@@music00soba I think cycling 2 vs cycling 3 matters more than paying black for Surgical so I disagree (especially with Loam to cycle multiple times in a turn)
Seems like it could consider a one of mana severance in the sideboard. Can set up some pretty crazy lines. 1U Sorcery: Search your library for any number of land cards, exile them, then shuffle.
Against GW Depths, I think that Surgical is an easy pickup, since they start to fill their yard. You're working on your yard, but they do that also. You can eat any problem out of their yard, mostly Wasteland is the biggest target, but nailing down a Depths if one hits the yard, it seems worth that. The problem is finding cuts because this deck wants to be degenerate and Toxic, but it would be worth looking at since you're already doing grave stuff with Endurance.
Tabernacle isn't super important to this deck anyways because it usually punishes your own zombies plan. Imo lacking it would cause you to lose maybe on the very fringes only less than 0.5% of games.
I like the concept of lands being mana source, control and wincon. But WotC should put a kataki effect for nonbasic lands on a white creature with MV 3... just saying...
With the acknowledgement that I have a huge soft-spot for manaless dredge, I think this is just a fun quirk of legacy. I do agree with @Dreg that this deck should be given the mantle of "Lands" dec for legacy given how it's the most land-heavy dec now. I know it won't given loom-assault didn't take it away from the current "lands" dec when it bubbled up again a few years ago but meh, I'll call it lands.
M1G2 it seems pretty obvious to just get Tabernacle in the face of the million creatures and 3 lands with Crop Rotation. And saccing Maze seems like a terrible idea; you basically can't lose as long as you have Maze/Tabernacle so you force them to draw a Wasteland to even get to play. Gaining 20 doesn't feel worth it.
yeah agreed, D&T doesn't have any particular creatures in this matchup that are impactful besides prelate on 2 and stoneforge getting Kaldra. being able to halt their development in conjunction with Maze seemed free. Inevitability was coming with the winding way in hand. With rotate for tab it feels like the only threat is 5th land pay for kaldra + cataclysm which was quite a ways off + you can just keep Maze in Hand then you choose Tab as your land and D&T is now on one land and needing to rip several lands in a row to even function. That game felt kinda unloseable :/
Then they can still get you with Marit Lage. Or by controlling the board with Maze of Ith + Tabernacle and then bolting you every turn with Flame Jab + Life from the Loam. I'm not saying that Necromentia isn't good, but it's not a win either. Personally I'd rather just cast Blood Moon / Back to Basics / Ruination / Price of Progress / Cataclysm.
So, I know that mulligans can put you into the ground, but isn't it almost 100% right to mulligan into a manabond? You run 8 draw 4's to fill up your hand, and worst case you just get 3 or 4 lands into play to beat up on Daze.
I honestly don't know. I did a lot of experimentation of what a keepable hand looks like in this league. You get the Reanimator effect of always having a turn 1 with 5 cards vs. taking it a little slower and having a back up plan.
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Hey there!! I have a quick question since I'm a total noob when it comes to the legacy format: In round 2 against the deck with ramunap excavator and wastelands, would it be worth it to bring in surgical extractions? If not, why?
When to bring in Surgical is hotly debated in all formats where the card is legal. I don’t like having a card that doesn’t impact the board against a deck with that many creatures and a combo-kill with Marit Lage.
@@BoshNRoll thanks a lot for the answer, as i have no idea about how the format works for now, I was really curious, not affecting the board or interacting with it is definitely a reasonable explanation!!
So wait, standard delver decks don’t run delver of secrets anymore, but the deck with delver in it is specifically “blue delver.” Magic naming conventions are my favorite
I know smarter players than myself have tweaked this deck to a competitive level, but I would love to see a version with a few cycling lands to give you more instant speed draw to interact with and protect your loams. Especially seeing as you "only" have the 4 loams and no other source of land recursion like crucible. If you can reliably cast and protect loam, it is often a draw 2 or 3. I could see swapping a mulch or two for a cycler being effective. There are cycling dual lands from Amonkhet that only cost 2 colorless to use, there's tranquil thicket that only costs G, and blasted landscape that cycles for 2 and is a colorless land but enters untapped. For that matter with only loam in the deck you are particularly susceptible to surgical and have no other way to recur your lands. Would having a copy or two of crucible (or some alternative) in your sideboard to diversify your recursion sources be worthwhile for the grindy matchups that like to pick apart you deck/hand? Glacial chasm seems like it might be a decent sideboard land for super aggressive burn, agro, or combo decks. Sure, it costs you a land + life each turn to keep it around, but it completely blanks all damage that would be dealt to you in the meantime. I have a "fun" commander deck where the primary win condition is to play chasm and then cast a Hurricane effect for 40+ damage to the whole table. Lastly, as a direct answer to tokens like Merit lage or creatures with +1/+1 counters, what about 1 copy of Mystifying maze instead of 1 Maze of Ith? Yes it's MUCH more expensive to activate, but it flickers the creature rather than untapping it.
For context: nearly all of my edh decks end up being lands decks to some extent, and my favorite of those decks is my mono-green turbo-fog deck. Zero infinite combos, but it can produce over a few hundred mana a turn through the commander Sasaya, Orochi Ascendant (she basically can turn basic lands into cloudposts). So I've spent a decent amount of time over the last few years digging through the good and bad ways that a lands deck can interact with combat and creatures.
I think this version cares less about protecting loams because of 8 mulchs, maybe I'm wrong. The traditional mox diamonds Lands lists do play sheltered and tranquil thicket to protect loam tho. Old lands lists have played most of what you've suggested at some point afaik (except blasted landscape since it doesnt make coloured mana). Crucible I think is not particularly strong since Loam is already a powerful engine and mulches are draw 2-3s. Grindy matchups are usually very easy for Lands; the tough decks that you need sideboard cards for are usually combo (hence large numbers of sphere of resistance/mindbreak trap type effects). Glacial Chasm was in old lands decks but I think it's only decent against burn, which isn't that popular nowadays. Field of the dead is very good at stopping aggro decks, same with Tabernacle. Combo decks currently tend to kill without dealing damage (thassa's oracle, tendrils of agony) so chasm doesn't stop them usually. Problem with mystifying maze is that it costs a lot, 4 mana is not trivial even for manabond/exploration decks. Flickering also is only really relevant vs Marit Lage (which you can answer normally with Maze, Karakas, and your own Marit Lage) and it's straight up just bad vs D&T. Maze of ith not making mana does come up quite a bit but yeah 4 mana to activate that effect is just too costly. In EDH you probably just have to have a much more diverse splattering of Lands cuz of singleton restrictions, so it makes sense but I think for Legacy the reasoning is just that the deck needs the most powerful disruptive lands and then some singleton crop rotation bullets that can perform a unique but necessary role (like Karakas, Bog, Tabernacle)
there are some but personally after running this deck for the last month 36 lands feels wayyyy better for those critical early manabond turns. the additional 4 spells that only net you one card on cast just makes your mulch ratios pretty terrible imo.
I don't think it's the most toxic deck either. There's pretty crippling hate out there, like Back to Basics, Ruination, Blood Moon, Price of Progress. If by "glass cannon" you mean that it dies really hard to specific cards, then agreed. Although in the absence of those cards, it's not that fragile, because you have a Loam + Wasteland plan, a zombies plan, a Marit Lage plan and you can even slow down the game with Maze of Ith + Tabernacle.
