I agree shaming people isn’t nice but, Rawvana had a vegan doctor tell her to take antibiotics. That’s all she had to do and she decided to eat meat instead. I’m not cool with it because she’s known for promoting veganism AND making money off it. Im not going to ignore my feelings about rawvana in order to make her feel better.
And it's not about "shaming other people" - it's about holding them to their own professed (and MONETISED...!) standards, and calling out bullshit where it's due.
I don't believe shame is good, bit people should be hold accountable when the are making a profit out of it, which was Rawvana case selling a vegan challenge while believing that same diet caused her health issues. I believe her followers felt scammed (that s what I read most). The main problem with Rawvana was that she lied. Had she said she just got tired of veganism and decided to eat whatever, I believe the outcome would be different. However, she blamed on the diet when her other choices. Also, as you said, these people that decide to quit are the ones getting attention and being used against the vegan cause. Anyways, we are judgemental beings (even if not verbal). We judge artists, politicians, family members, etc.
From what I have seen, the majority of angry people are just upset that she wasn't honest with her audience when she started changing the way she eats. There is some criticism that she chose to eat animal products instead of just taking the antibiotics like her doctor suggested. She has this purity complex about not getting "A natural ingredients" in her system. I do have compassion for her though, I agree that it's not easy for her, and that's probably why she wasn't honest at first.
People are mad and tearing Rawvana down bc she duped them. She was selling her vegan bs while not being vegan herself. These 'said' influencers dont have integrity.
The issue is not a lack of compassion the issue is that she knew the diet that she was promoting with all the fasting and cleanses were not right but yet she continued to push this content and meal plans to make $ and her complete dishonesty... she should have come forward as an adult and said I have made u educated health choices and now my body is paying for it.. this could have been a very teachable & educational moment in the vegan community but yet she choose to lie and be deceitful while still making $. I can sympathize with her but also she needs to be held accountable for her actions.
I don’t think she was being deceitful... she had a problem and was given advice by authority figures and was a victim of what I call the milgram effect. She was second guessing her previous approach.
I feel so sorry for rawvana, Bonnie Rebecca and Megan moon . The drama and backlash and public shaming is unbelievable and I worry it can drive people to suicide if they are unsupported . This magnitude of scrutiny and opinion and lack of compassion is unprecedented. It’s truly the Darkside of social media
They put themselves in the public eye. That’s what they wanted. They lied and cashed in on sentient beings which is disgusting. Why don’t you people have compassion for the animals seriously
Leave it to you to remain a class act in a situation where people are treating someone or someones less than human. Kindness, grace, and compassion can go a lot farther.
There is a quote from Anne Marie Bonneau Zero Waste Chef: 'We don't need a handful of people doing zero waste perfectly. We need millions of people doing it imperfectly.' In my opinion this can also be said about veganism. Of course it would be fantastic if every soul on earth went perfectly vegan overnight, but wouldn't it also be amazing if millions of people try the best they can, encouraged by each other, even by the perfect vegans? I also believe shaming people is not the answer. Love, compassion, help & encouragement are. Much love xxx
To each their own. We can only take responsibility for ourselves. Thank you for widening the conversation to judgement. Not to be trite, however judge not lest you be judged.
If it concerns any other injustice, would it be exactly the same? or is it different when it comes to speciesism? Do we allow more flexibility? There's a fine line.
Exactly; if one is an ethical vegan, one is not lax with standards like this, giving people a free pass for all kinds of bullshit, read: inconsistency and dishonesty and feeble-mindedness, like this.
@@MrsShimmyOnDown Unfortunately I've been hearing too many who say have stopped speaking up due to being labeled 'militant' etc, and not from nonvegans but from other vegans. Or take it one huge leap further and basically cower not wanting to be part of the 'label' vegan (that's helping the animals and not confusing one bit) In a world where speciesism is just part of everyday life.. we need to be crystal clear and stop the confusion where we can, no matter how many times we are bunched in with those who are actually being rude. It's about the animals the actual victims! Thanks for speaking up! ✌(ᵔ‿ᵔ ͡)❦☯¸¸,.♡ ҉҉
The issue many ppl have with honey is that..Honey is the food for bees and when we take their food we have to replace it with something which is usually sugar water or corn syrup water , this keeps the bees alive for a while but isn't the perfect food that honey is.
VeganRevolution they make the honey to eat. Sometimes too much is stolen and they die if the beekeepers don’t give them sugar blocks to eat instead. Often, if the honey is mass produced the hives are burnt out to prevent swarming.
Open transparency time. I don’t feel bad for Olivia Jade. The audacity to be raised in a world where privilege is so present in your everyday life that opportunities are literally just placed in your lap while black moms are vilified DAILY for being bad moms for applying for schools outside of their districts using family or friends that live close enough to use their addresses. Just for the hope of providing their babies with a better life. I can’t allow myself to feel empathy for that situation when so many others are given jail time for simply not being rich or white enough to have the best lawyers 🤷🏾♀️. In terms of Rawvana, what you eat is a very personal thing. Blessings to her choices.
Pepperly I understand how you would feel that they are not the same. Its not easy for people who are not affected directly to understand how far it travels. This situation is like many situations that occur in Detroit, California and even here in Chicago. The only difference is that family is high profile and rich so a lot of the details are likely to be hidden. Not saying that this kid is at fault, and I would never say that. What I said was I don’t feel any sympathy for her or that situation. I’ll have a more empathetic response when I can be directed to one, just one, article or news story where Lori Loughlin, her friends, her husband or anyone in her immediate circle has voiced their support for any injustice that has happened to black people, or people in a lower tax bracket.
I agree.. well said. I think people need to ask themselves 2 questions before speaking online (or in person) 1. Would I say this to their face? And 2.) How would I feel if they said it to me?
I would do more research on honey. My main issue with it is that we’ve brought in this European invasive species, 30-90% of the native bee population has died(depends on geographic location). I had to write a lovely paper on it, and I also used to eat honey cause I thought it was good health and environment wise. Just.... do more research please. Have a great day! Also, nice perspective.
As a biologist, I can say that while the non-native honeybee does displace native bees, there’s really no way to pollinate our food crops with native bees. In our modern world, we need honeybees to pollinate many fruits and veggies.
Amber Nichols oh I agree, our food system is also negatively impacting bees, mono- cropping especially since there’s the constant compaction, pesticides and no habitats to break up these fields! I come from a Agricultural background so I know there are ways to encourage native species to populate an area, we just need to notify the other farmers of what they can do bring in those beneficials which will help reduce the cost of renting the hives and pesticides. It’s just all about being informed. Thanks for the comment! 💜
See us tearing each other apart? Ffs she was NEVER VEGAN! Plant based only So no vegans are going after other vegans in this instance because she WAS NEVER VEGAN
Thankyou for this. If anything, it's great that this has proved that some vegans are not imbiciles, don't think they know it all and can listen to a doctor.
A true vegan is committed to helping as many people on the planet transitioning to a vegan lifestyle as possible. Attacking and bullying people from not being a "perfect" vegan is pushing them away. To draw people into the community - offer them compassion, help them find solutions, support their efforts, champion the positive aspects of their behavior. When a new person comes into the vegan community they take baby steps. They change the diet, then clothes, then household products - makeup etc. We encourage them! Consider that vegans who slip - are still in transition. Support them. Help them. Do not punish them. If you do, you push them farther away from the community and you are accessory to the crimes against animals.
Please stop water down the massage she just got caught! ,some people do get away with many things!Now she can move on and live with the good confidence an$ may improve her health not live with the lies.
Yes this is so true we all have faults and should leave the judging to God. As for eating honey there is no harm in eating honey if you choose Did you sleep honey anyway and there is no harm done.
Thank you so much for sharing this video. It was beautiful and thoughtfully and no fully expressed. I have been following you for more than 6 years now on RU-vid- and I really appreciate your mature response and your opinion on what’s been happening in the vegan community of late. Keep sharing your message. Thank you so much. 🙏🧘🏽♀️🌺☀️🌴
@@lishkat1167 sadly it's the greater RU-vid vegan community (with of course the wonderful exception of the uploader here and a few select others) that spew ableist and misanthropic BS. My friend ( a vegan youtuber who avoids the mainstream vegan RU-vid community) says "if you're a vegan and you care only for animals, you are not truly a vegan, because it's a win-win-win situation. Veganism isnt just about the animals, it's our God given home, the Earth, and our own health and well being. If we want to bring people back, let's encourage them and get them at their level."
If u r a RU-vidr and live publicly there's no way there won't be judging or shaming when all goes down. It's part of our social media lives now. And she made money of promoting raw vegan but ate fish and eggs. If she didn't feel caught she wouldn't hide it on the video. And she's still promoting it. So
Yes... but I am confident a lot of the attackers are not raw vegans, but people who just like to attack them and this revelation is just the thing they need to justify more attacks
Compassion was one of my first reactions too. That and wanting to be helpful because i truly think she can find healing on a vegan diet. Agree with your message about shaming. It's like people forget we're all connected and all imperfect beings.
Love to listen to your thoughts 💭 What you are saying really resonates with me, it’s really sad and unfortunate to see not more compassion from viewers of the ex vegan videos. Watching just some of the response videos you can see that people have very different perspectives on the situation and highlight different things that have been said. For me it’s just an interesting case to investigate, why didn’t it work for them? How can you solve these problems on a vegan diet? It would be nice to see more comments that offer support and help even when pointing out that we can not accept the torture and murder of animals. Imagine the comment section was just filled with advice and recommendations and accounts on how to thrive on a vegan diet, as well as taking responsibility, accountability for our actions and last but not least heaps of support and understanding and sympathy. We must remember the reason why there was even the chance of the people falling back, because of so much PROPAGANDA and vested interest! Thanks ☺️
Thank you! It's bad enough we get it from outside our community. We should know better. Be supportive and encouraging for people doing their genuine best.
My experience with Cyber bullying: Recently I been getting bullied about some swatches (on march4) that I did. I specifically said I was having trouble and couldn’t capture how pretty they were, unfortunately they went viral. My content was stolen almost by every beauty news outlet and website.. absolutely without my consent. Some people even made memes with my pictures to bully the owner of the brand, the brand and me. It has been the worst cyber bullying I have EVER encountered in my years of being on social media platforms.My DMs, Comments, email and social media platforms were filled with hate.This experienced almost made me give up on everything I been doing for years for the animals. I’ve been cyber bullied before big time,but this time it was just ridiculous I was getting threatened over arm swatches. I know what it’s like to get talked about publicly.It does not feel good at all. It messes with your mental health.
Whitney you were actually one of the first vegan RU-vidrs I ever watched. You inspired me to push myself out of the safety of vegetarianism and into veganism. I follow many vegans now but I think what keeps me always coming back to your videos is you’re truly a kind soul and it shows ❤️
Well put. I can’t imagine the turmoil she must be in right now, to have your whole audience turn their backs on you like that, it must be horrible. While Rawvana’s choices are disappointing to me, I understand struggling with health and diet. I hope she’ll find her way back to veganism, but perhaps with a more balanced diet so she doesn’t feel like she needs to eat fish and eggs. In the meantime, shaming her will do nothing constructive. I wish her well.
I think rawvanas ' fans ' are angry that she recently pushed a 21 day at Los program for vegans and wasn't being honest . Like an athiest telling you to pray for a miracle.
I absolutely agree with you Whitney. I don’t agree with shaming others -it’s so ugly. I don’t agree there is ever an instance when it’s ok to shame someone. Ever. The internet voices has become so complex ...I think it shines the light on how angry people are and cruel....ultimately bc they -themselves-don’t feel loved.
I appreciate all of your comments and you sharing your thoughts with me. I'm sorry that you chose to unsubscribe, but I respect you doing what you need to.
@@EcoVeganGal I don't respect you piercing a gelatin capsule and endorsing a nonvegan company, nor this tolerance of unethical behaviour from these recent ex-vegan youtubers. I used to respect your work, but these last two broadcasts have utterly disappointed me. Please check your ethical integrity.
@@MrsShimmyOnDown Yes i thought it was all about moving away from speciesism and not make excuses to keep being speciesist as long as possible or going backwards.
Thank you. I stopped watching and just read comments you seem to be in the same mind frame as I am. I was getting annoyed. The animals deserve compassion not these liars. Plus let me say it once more. THEY WERE NEVER VEGAN!
Idk. I think you’re being way too compassionate. What do you mean, “what she’s going through?” Do you mean getting caught with fish on her plate in her friends video, forcing her to come clean? And then come up with a bunch of excuses? And let’s not forget that she was making vegan videos during the time frame she wasn’t vegan. You seem nice but when it comes to these fake vegans, I prefer Freelees response.
Whitney is compassionate with these fakes, but not compassionate with the animals who have been eaten by them in the past few months (or however long they lied to their audience and customers) and will now be eaten by them moving forward; not one word of compassion from Whitney towards these animals.
Whitney is compassionate with these fakes, but not compassionate with the animals who have been eaten by them in the past few months (or however long they lied to their audience and customers) and will now be eaten by them moving forward; not one word of compassion from Whitney towards these animals.
The biggest problem with what she’s doing is, because of her large audience, more people will be thinking it’s fine to eat animals. I can see it now, “gosh, I have a headache, I need to eat some animal flesh.” She’s a role model for excuse-making. I would have been better for her to stop making content and then eat flesh if she wishes. I worry about the animals first and foremost.
I am sympathetic towards her. It's a struggle. What bothers me the most is more than half the people that are shaming her aren't even vegan or pursuing a vegan lifestyle. They just want to troll.
Daniel Kon I agree and have left that message on her videos and the videos of those who are going out of their way to shame her in video content. Glad to find I’m not alone. This whole thing is way overblown.
Didnt watch it all, but thank goodness, the voice of reason! I'm not vegan and don't watch your vids these days but now I remember why I'm subscribed. Your compassionate, balanced view of people and life. x
You shouldn’t feel like you have to apologize for having some honey, or Rawvana for eating some fish. If a carnivore eats no meat for a couple of days doesn’t mean they’ve become vegetarian.
as much as we say it’s about the animals, most of the talk is about the people. I think just stick to the message of veganism and grow the supports for it. There aren’t enough vegan nutritionists or doctors that can help people with bowel issues so that they can do the diet part of veganism the right way and not hurt themselves with things like fasting.
Bullshit; Rawvana consulted a vegan doctor who recommended antibiotic therapy to her for her SIBO while remaining on a vegan diet. But she chose to betray the animals, in favour of not taking antibiotics.
I love Dr. Klaper's theory of acquired dependency being the cause of the common occurrence of vegans going back to animal products. His theory reflects the problem with the omni diet prior to veganism being the cause of the problem, validates that animal products are capable of offering a health improvement, takes away the shame & stigma of "failing" at veganism, and offers a dietary action plan on supplementing with some eggs or fish and THEN returning to the vegan lifestyle for a period of time. The beauty in this scientific perspective is that it allows people to live a mostly vegan lifestyle and only eating small occasional portions of animal protein. The labels on dietary practice and the pressure of self-righteous vegan community members establish restrictions that prevent people from entering the vegan world.
@@EcoVeganGal Dr. Klaper brought this out in an interview with Plant Based News. Not sure why no one is talking about it. Its a revolutionary insight into the omni to vegan transition process. He needs to write a book about it! Someone does!
@@agingintobeauty He said it was mostly just the "chewy salty" experience he himself had craved and had been missing, i.e. conceding that it was NOT some underlying nutritional/health benefit that drew him to the nonvegan food; whereas these recent ex-vegan youtubers are positing a health benefit... read (on the flipside): a health downside of the vegan diet, thereby slandering and defaming veganism to a mass audience they previously acquired (and financially gained from) through presenting themselves as 'vegan' to the world.
@@MrsShimmyOnDown No. Dr. Klaper cited "acquired dependency." This is not a craving. This is a condition where the body gets used to a free handout - like when people are given thyroid hormone medicine and the thyroid stops producing those hormones. Acquired dependency can cause deficiencies in the body that can become life threatening! What he posed is a theory but it is based in scientific understanding and it not only confirms what these vegans are saying (they can get sick after going vegan, they can feel better after eating animal products) but, if he is correct, it will also help people stay on the vegan path. Currently, if a vegan eats some animal product and claims it helped them, they are beaten up and thrown out of the community. Dr. Klaper suggested that they may be able to overcome the condition with supplementation and eventually be vegan. His path helps vegans, builds the community and addresses all the issues. I say we give his theory a respectful level of deep consideration.
@@agingintobeauty To quote him verbatim: "But it was mostly just that chewy salty texture I craved, more than anything else, I think", from the recent Klaper interview with Plant Based News that you yourself above mentioned. His stance is decisively differentiated from these recent ex-vegan youtubers, who posit - explicitly or implicitly - the claim that there's something nutritionally/healthwise wrong with a diet of vegan food.
This comment section seems full of people who love to be wrapped in cotton wool and desire to never be held accountable... so they're willing to afford others the same spineless approach. But that's humans for ye. :(
So fish don't matter to you? That isn't a big enough issue for you? So glad I found your channel so I can now avoid it. Also, I'm pretty sure that murder is worse than shame. Ask the animals if they would rather be shamed or killed. I have an idea on what they would pick...
Look... sometimes people cant thrive as a vegan. We are HUMAN and we are top of the food chain for a reason. It's the way it's meant to be! Ex vegan here
Colette(familypeacelove) lol Your response is very uneducated. Do some actual research and you’ll realize how untrue your statement is. The (familypeacelove) in your name is a joke right? Cause there is no peace for the animals if you pay for their murder and you sure as hell have no “love” if you eat dead bodies.
