Just a heads up before you watch the entire video - I don’t mention any Rolex (not that I normally do) but just in case anyone is coming here expecting that. Enjoy!
Most everyone else on RU-vid will have covered Rolex days ago anyway...sometimes it's good to talk about differing brands just to give others a chance to see what else is out there 😁💯
I hate to say it - I feel like part of my passion for the hobby died this year ... it's the prices. It seems like the brands have been jacking up the prices to ridiculous levels - way beyond inflation. It's not just the watch industry - but I'm just tired of it. I think I'm going to hit pause for a while.
Especially considering most brands other than a few depreciate like hell...might as well buy some of these non hype brands on the secondary market for 60 percent off lol
Sorry to hear that. There are cool things coming from Longines & Seiko later this year that’s still under embargo that maybe you’d find cool too. But thanks for still checking out the video and hope there’s still some watches that bring the fun and passion back for you!
I think they are just bringing out the big guns this year to flex on the other brands but I’m probably wrong hopefully they have more affordable pieces trickle out throughout the year
@@bdegrds that's true, but certain brands have always depreciated more slowly than others, thus, part of the hobby also entails minimizing your loses imo 💯
My favorite release this year is JLC’s Reverso Tribute Chronograph. I’m not a fan of the typical skeleton dials and chronographs look. And yet this is the first one that subverted my expectations on those typical designs. Well done on their part - definitely on my list in the future. As for the boutique exclusives, Richemont has definitely been notorious in the last couple of years in making some of their well sought after pieces boutique exclusive - VC, JLC, etc to name a few. I don’t think it’s a good move in the long run. I wouldn’t have even considered JLC a few years ago until I got to see it in person in my AD. ADs help market brands to customers and now Richemont wants to rake in all of the profits. They’re biting the hands that fed them.
I think Cartier is the second or third most popular watch brand in the world by sales. Kind of makes sense given how are ubiquitous some of their pieces are. If you want to get a square or rectangular watch you likely going to look at Cartier or JLC. If there are still some people who do not take them seriously then they're just fools. I own a Prasha gmt and it's one of my favorite watches outside of my Blancpain leman dual timer.
@@draakisback The second largest watch brand from Switzerland in terms of sales value, i.e. money. Interesting to know which brand it is in terms of watches sold. Tissot?
It might not be your case but I do think it’s better to do boutique only to reduce flippers. I loved what Czapek did by allowing 1/3 of their watches to be order directly by the client
I would love him to do a larger video on the value prop of a jewelery store / AD as opposed to a boutique. I'm sure a lot of brands see that they call pull more value out of each sale if they sell watches at their own stores vs someone else's but there's also surely some benefits ADs and jewelers can provide (maybe they can connect buyers to watches who otherwise wouldn't have interest enough to go to a boutique?)
I got try the Chronograph in the London boutique last week and wow, how beautiful. Unfortunately my budget only extends to a Reverso classic although I am still very happy. JLC is truly a terrific watch maker.
In my opinion, nothing beats being able to help a local business. Yes I am fortunate enough to spend money on watches, they are expensive toys essentially, but with that said, the local dealer employees people who live in my city and thats what is most important to me. The employees are able to create a living by selling these brands pieces. Also where I live (Pittsburgh PA), we dont have brick and mortar watch boutiques. We use to have an Omega boutique but that closed, now we just have two large and well known authorized dealers. The one I frequent and have created a great relationship carries Rolex, IWC, JLC, Cartier, Tudor, etc and it stinks to find out some of these awesome watches from W&W wont end up in their showroom and I know for a fact, I wont be anywhere near one of those brands boutiques anytime in the near future so whats the point of the release if you can only get those watches in major cities.
It varies from country to country. In europe and US retailers have a major foothold. In asia people always prefer boutiques and official company showrooms, not just for watches, for clothes, gadgets etc
Thanks for the honest video not many dealers and bloggers are this honest. Cartier ...yes ...how are you finding some of the interchangeable straps? I bought a DLC 2 months ago thru an AD and I love it, but when I went to change the strap for the first time the press button on the side of the clasp fell off! I went into The flagship store in my town SYDNEY and was told oh I see you did not make the purchase from the Maison etc implying that the AD may have mistreated the stock etc. Instead of just swapping the buckle over, because it's very apparent that there is a manufacturing issue with that particular buckle. I was given the 2nd class citizen experience as I have to prove that my watch is genuine by handing the entire piece over for 2 weeks for their assessment. Talk about boutique only! Your thoughts as an AD?
No offense but to keep it 100 I'd prefer to buy a "special" watch directly from the manufacturer if possible. They save the boutique only pieces for their own stores because the experience is usually superior. It is akin to buying from a used car dealer with multiple car brands on the lot vs a dealer who only carries the car you want brand new or CPO. I have bought from both types of watch dealers but I usually save the "special" watches for flagship stores of the particular brand I'm buying. As a customer, I am usually doing more of the work to obtain a watch directly from the manufacturer than I am when it is a multi-watch dealer, but still, the experience is superior. As an example, when buying from Cartier directly, I am offered champagne or tea service. Just my two cents since you asked.
You are being very diplomatic on the treatment of dealers being sidelined on so many of these new watches. Do not like this concept of brands trying to create a little clique of buyers. Making you and your clients second class customers.
I think going boutique only is a way to control supply and back door discounts that can hurt brand equity. It’s frustrating for the brand and the customer that buys from a boutique to see watches discounted. Not saying you do that but know that other multi brand AD’s do.
Sorry but some watches have to be discounted to get out the door because they are obscenely priced. For example, the Oris Propilot X line is WAY overpriced and every AD is selling them for $1k (at least) under the list price of $4k+ Oris doesn't have boutiques I think, but the same principle applies. Overestimating your own brand equity is the problem, not ADs offering discounts.
@@fark69 that might be the case but the point stands. Brands can control supply of over prices or under priced products better to protect secondary market prices and brand equity.
I see both up and down side of the BT only situation: 1. Watch market is doing so great that, now it's not only a sellers market but even a manufacturer's market! Can't blame brands for trying to absorb as much profit as they can by selling the watches themselves! 2. Consumer is going to pay more, no more discount from AD as you can't even buy the piece you want in the first place... My struggle: Me and my family have been a loyal customer to a specific AD in our area, always the 1st point of contact about watches/jewelries for the last 30 years. Yet recently we bought very few pieces from the AD, the special models that attract us collectors in the first place are not arriving the ADs! Then you go to the BT and you are treated as a complete new comer, if you want the in demand pieces, start from scratch and buy yourself up, not a game that I can afford
My favorite release is the JLC chronograph and the Chopard Alpine eagle salmon. I love Chopard's micro rotor movement. That's a horological classic movement. I'm a little disturbed that the brands seem to be shutting out the retailers out of meetings and viewing the watches. I know brands are moving to boutiques and they keep doing these boutique only watches. They will never replace retailers because they can't be everywhere. Also unless someone lives in or visits the city that the boutique is located in, they are shut out of purchasing certain watches. I don't know what the brands long term plan is but they need to discuss with the retailers how they see this working, but being Swiss, I don't think you will get clarity and transparency from the brands. I just feel you are in an uncomfortable position at the moment.
Thank you for these video updates! Would be great to see an in depth review of the rose gold 34.5mm overseas! Also look forward to some more discussions on this "boutique only" issue... I guess its a business decision brands have to make, but to not show the watches to retailers just because a piece is "boutique only" doesn't quite make sense... as the retailers still are presenting the brands to their customers, and how can they do so if they don't have a full picture of the brand's catalogue? Just my two cents :)
Great recaps. I love the IWC but at that price point I would start looking at the GP Laureato 38mm because of the case size. If IWC ever makes a 38mm version it would be the perfect choice for the skinnier wrists out there.
I badly want the IWC. It speaks to me. I love the design. And I am an engineer by trade, so that's fun. I think it should be priced similar to the Defy Skyline though from Zenith. Even Zenith throws in a rubber strap as well, which would be nice here. But at the current pricing, it's hard to pick the IWC over a GP or Bvlgari. I still might though... Lol
Great video well done! Regarding the boutique only, i think there is several points that must be mentionned. 1) the experience. I live in Switzerland and i can tell you from people i know that the AD experience is terrible. Staff not having any knowledge about the products they sell, not being nice. On the other hand i hear that official boutique experience are far better and a lot more client orientated. 2) the brand image. Apart from Rolex & PP( for the lucky ones ) the brand image is usually completely destroy because of AD massively discounting watches because they just want to sell as much as possible. This kills the different brands and one thing that is important to mention is that now brands are able to sell watches without any discount but meanwhile give a proper experience and therefore client feels more valuable which should be the most important part. I don’t think that AD are ready to work on that and therefore brands are going away from them for those reasons. That’s what i think is going on here. The btq only is also a way to control the market and to handle a lot better the flippers. Cheers mate and once again, really cool video!
WRT to the IWC Ingenieur's date wind from 01-09, I absolutely love the fact that the date window is balanced as you pointed out, much like the GO's PanaMatic Lunar's date window. I have a near vintage GO Sport Evo with the panadate window and it too is balanced from 01-09. Can you imagine paying for an ALS - Lange 1 and all you see is a blank space on their date window from 1-9. IMHO, it's hideous looking and UNBALANCED. A good decision from IWC. BTW, a great vid - thanks.
I agree with you; I hadn't even noticed it before, but 2 digits certainly look better balanced than 1. I wish watch-designers would go further & also balance the placement and colour of the date window. There are watches costing thousands, where the window is a basic plain white square positioned lazily at 3 'o' clock, and normally cutting something off. It looks so much better when the date window is placed at 6 'o' clock, and the colours match the design language of the rest of the watch.
Loved the video! Appreciate you going into some of the interesting business decisions this year. I’m personally not feeling all these integrated bracelet watches. Feels a bit over saturated. Loving the new Santos medium color options. And nice suit!
Cool detail regarding 01, 02, 03, etc. I haven't seen it mentioned in any other video I've watched so far. It's referred to as a 'leading zero,' and it's commonly utilized for industrial, data, & engineering applications: quite common in computer programming especially.
That Santos is just perfect. So well done. Well planned and even better executed. The whole idea of boutique only is annoying. That's just stops the customers from comparing it with competition.
As an engineer myself, we all learned it from school that the SI (or ISO) date format should always be either YYYYMMDD or YYYY-MM-DD. So my guess is that the IWC designer is following the SI date format of using double digit for the DD.
I'd prefer to buy from an AD that can be more flexible with discounts and I can build a relationship with on many brands. But I understand Cartier wanting to do boutique only, it helps them tighten up distribution, increase prestige, and capture more of the margins.
Most ADs are not discounting because the brands eroded their margins. Stores dont buy at 50% anymore...closer to 70% so they need that full 30% margin to keep the lights on
I do actually prefer boutiques over dealers since day 1. I have seen many people getting screwed by dealers due to “bundle sales” yet didn’t get the piece they wanted ultimately. I’m not saying it’s happening at your store but it definitely happens a lot in the real world. Unlike dealers, your purchase history speaks for you worldwide at boutique. Thus for me I take boutique over dealers and it is just my personal humble opinion.
IMO, the "experience" is better at a boutique IF you're a valued customer who is allowed to buy what you want. It's unrivaled. But for the avg person, bigger retailors are a better experience because so many boutiques place restrictions on customers who haven't spent 50k there
Great video! I finally just received my allocation of the Cartier Santos Dumont in yellow gold with blue lacquer. Any interest in doing an unboxing video at the Cartier boutique?
On the point about double date digits on the IWC Ingenieur, just wish to mention it is the same on my Glashutte Original. Yes, does look better without an odd empty space, especially when the background color of the date discs does not match that of the dial. Just my opinion.
So, when he was told that many watches are boutique only, and that he can't have them, he felt like me when I was in a Rolex AD to ask for a basic Rolex OP ? Justice is made :)
I can see why "Boutique Only" might make sense for truly limited production models, a small number allocated across their entire AD network means each store only gets 1 piece. But it doesn't seem like that's the direction with models like the IWC, with a common movement used in other models, it should be available to all AD's. Selling direct and the high price point are an IWC cash grab attempt, maybe we'll see how that works out. If they can't sell enough Ingenieurs , we'll probably see them at AD's in the future, and discounted. It's hard to know how the market will react after a few months or year of being out. The reaction to the price has been very negative, but IWC may have played this game on purpose, and limit units and play the scarcity card to support higher prices.
Just subscribed to your channel and really like your reviews and presentations. Now I want a Cartier Santos because of your videos and I never thought I would say it. Your Santos looks amazing on your wrist. Looking forward to many more educational reviews from your channel. Thanks!
Thanks for the sub! Glad you’re enjoying the video. Feel free to email us if you’re interested to purchase a new Cartier Santos from our store! Sales@caratco.com
IWC take. Super odd. But it kinda proves my point from all the years why I never been a big IWC fan with their overpriced pieces. The new Ingenieur is no different. Not selling a comparably hot piece for them through their ADs kinda shows what they think. “Thanks” for helping us through the tough times, but now as we have an in demand piece you can not sell it. ADs should team up and put pressure on IWC. And its exactly as you say if you live in a smaller city with no boutique but an AD you can not get it and need to travel for it? An IWC? I’d prefer buying through my AD 100 times. I think they overestimate their brand a little right now.
The IWC is just to expensive for what it is. This trend of moving to boutique only; I think it will hurt some of these brands. IWC is a very popular watch brand in Europe but in the US I know it's not that popular when compared to other brands. And the fact is like if you live in the middle of the Us, most of these brands don't have boutiques anywhere nearby. You need to go to major cities like Chicago, DC, New York, LA etc. It makes sense for Cartier and for vacheron but not so much for chopard and IWC. A lot of companies want to copy what patek or AP have done where they've made it really difficult to get those watches outside of their boutiques because it's a very easy way to handle artificial supply. It also stops the quagmire of Rolex APs doing back alley deals and rejecting customers. Anyway I love the overseas in 36, the Cartier Santos skeletonized micro rotors, and the Grand Seiko lake bewah watches the most. If zenith had waited to release their defy revival at watches and wonders then it likely would have been my favorite watch of the show. Though that being said I am not the biggest fan of the bracelet as much as a normal bracelet.
The new JLC & Cartier skeleton got my interest but overall I decided to place my order for a KUDOKE 3. Independent watches always brings new ways of telling time. Regarding who to get from, not a big deal for me whoever gets its first for a good price
Rolex is trying to branch out, I don't mind. I actually want an OP 41 with the celebration dial, but I agree, I wouldn't pay the asking for the emoji day date 36, but 6400 for an OP 41 (assuming I get one at retail) is very doable 💯
IWC ingenieur lol. its a decent watch but that price point? No way. They need all hands on deck to sell that watch. Forget making it boutique only, they r gonna need a lot of help from retailers to help to sell those watches.
Ive ordered one through toronto boutique. They are sold out already. Now comes the wait. Can't be longer than rolex's 12 month and waiting for the gmt II. I have a daytona and date just, still a long way down the list, lol.. The industry is bananas at the moment.
Boutique seems like the manufacturer is making a point to leave AD out of the distribution. Exclusivity is a factor but it means less customers will have access to the goods. I guess is the cost of doing business.
Thanks for the video Derek. Yes its unfortunate that the trend is towards selling to boutiques only. You deserve an equal opportunity to sell watches especially focused on the Asian community in Queens. I think its shortsighted.
What are the pros and cons of making a watch available at retailers vs boutique only from a watch company's perspective? I know profit margin is higher in boutique. Anything else?
I prefer boutique where they deal with only one brand ….ADs with multiple brands play games with customers …I can be certain to get a piece from a boutique without any shady business
@@chia-mingyang5804 Yep but theres a certainty that a rare piece goes through the boutique instead of "you will be on the list" for a piece which the AD knows may never come
Very disappointing W&W, prices are going parabolic yet the time pieces look worse and worse. Microbrands are the ones really innovating in this space. Only one I love is the Laurent Ferrier ones but just too much money for me unfortunately.
Ingenieur is priced $2-3k too high. The new VC 34.5mm looks disproportionate compared to the 41mm, the dial looks too small compared to dial, at least on the SS model. I bet we will get a 37mm in next year or the year after. The blue medium Santos really pops out. Great video.
Nope, not the IWC. Great looking watch but you're getting the same ETA style movement as a Baume & Mercier at 3x the price. Absolutely not deserving of any place in any top 10.
Yikes, the airplane on the Cartier Santos Dumont Skeleton is cheesy. If you like it, that's all that matters. Different strokes for different folks but the Jaeger-LeCoultre Reverso Tribute Chrono will be the watch that collectors covet.
Great video - I think in midterm the brands are overloading the market with too many new editions. It is simply too much. Will the customer digest this? Just my personal opinion. This boutique only is the next weird sales strategy. Why do they want us to force to go to their boutiques and not check it out with our long time AD sales guys? I am a business guy myself and would never hurt my customers in such a way. Some brands are now out of scope and make me save some money. So what, it's ok.
This is a long game for IWC. Demand in SS integrated bracelets sports models has increased yet there is not enough supply to keep up with demand. Some people will not want to pay grey, wait years, or care for the brand and want a great looking watch with no bs waitlist and fair value. Boutique only is only way to ensure the watch doesn’t get sold on discount, or listed below retail in the grey market.
The idea that selling through boutique will keep the value of the watch high is wrong. The watch has a value in the eyes of the market. If you price too highly your most loyal customers have to bite the bullet and when they resell their watches a few months / years later the real market price gets shown and that sours them off your brand. IWC cannot force their products to be more valuable than they are in people's eyes. They can only try to match pricing to where people expect it (maybe a bit higher)
"Boutique only is only way to ensure the watch doesn’t get sold on discount, or listed below retail in the grey market." also potentially a way to ensure the grey market doesn't buy up the supply from their backdoor buddies and force people to pay double retail as we see all day in the market.
Boutique only is good like you said for some brands (JLC) but IWC isn’t there yet. $12K for that piece is too high (although they will sell them out) for modified ETA no micro adjust. A miss.
I've been buying and collecting watches for over 60 years, that being said, I find this boutique only thing total BS! I like Rolex watches and actually started my watch collecting with a gold GMT Master, at the time that watch listed $1,350.00, I paid $750.00 through a friend at Rolex! I became a customer of an AD in my town and dealt with them for over 35 years. About 6 month ago Rolex pulled the business from this dealer after they had spent close to a 1/2 million dollars renovating the store to suit their needs! They're opening a Rolex boutique near by that is NOT owned by Rolex, it's owned by London Jewelers. Initially my impression was that all the boutiques were owned by that brand, it seems apparently not. It seems discounts are past history, I'm glad to say I now own only 3 watches, a Rolex SeaDweller 43mm, AP Royal Oak chronograph 39mm (that I've owned since"99) and a VC OverSeas gold 35mm white dial. The world has gone mad!!!
As far as boutique vs AD...ADs provide more flexibility as to pricing (discounts) and variety of brands. On the other hand, brands are probably following the model of hype companies and limiting quantity to market exclusivity and brand prestige, but your point is taken many just frankly aren't there yet and will probably never be lol...
Boutique only , should not be hold line , be honest, retailers been helping the manufacturers all these years, I personally think all dealers should entitled to one piece or more accordingly to the KPI
Good to see another contents all what you see is mostly Rolex reviews. I've seen lot's off new stuff on watches and wonders and my opinion is Rolex has become a hype brand!
My top 3 (Honorable mention as I'm not sure it was at w&w) Baume et Mercier riviera perpetual calendar 3. Rolex GMT master 2 yellow gold 2. Rolex Daytona platinum 1. Tudor BB41 update Hell those 3 pieces could be your 3 watches from now to the day you die and then your kids and grandkids will be able to enjoy them. My top 3 worst pieces 3. Rolex bubbles and puzzle (disgusting) 2. Iwc ingeneur (pricing is ridiculous, should've been a 6k dollar watch or thereabout) 1. Hublot full ceramic toy watches but well that's not a surprise. (And I even like some hublots)
Shopping trends have changed. Christopher Ward, Fares etc are selling straight to clients. I bet the others are dipping their toes in the water to see if a straight to client option is open for them. If Rolex adopted this tomorrow they would succeed. They could miss out all dealers and increase there already huge profits. If anything the last. 3 years have proven that they don’t need the dealers because we haven’t be able to go in a buy a Rolex.
Boutique, boutique and boutique only. There is a pattern here, higher prices and less legibility. The Cartier skeleton is nice but it's so difficult to read the dam time, it belongs in their fine jewelry catalog.
I do feel for ADs, but I think their future or at least the future of the majority of ADs are bleak. Maybe 20-30 years ago, ADs made sense but now with online marketing SNS etc brands can just market themselves and with luxury watch demand so high, does not make sense to go through ADs. Furthermore now with "exclusive" models requiring purchase history, relationships etcetc and all that BS, it makes even MORE sense to buy at boutiques to make sure you're first inline if a cool edition comes out.
