Underrating Byzantines here as everyone sleeps on how good their camels are in castle age. The math on it is insane, they are the 2nd best camel civ in the game in castle. You beat all other heavy cav and all other camels (yes, including Berber, gujara and Saracen camels).
Their camel spam in Castle Age is definitely a plus, but a ton of flaws still exist (generic scout opening, no all-in feudal with scouts, knights without bloodlines, no blast furnace late) to the point where I still feel justified in their placement. To me the real question is how you factor in cataphracts, because when they get massed up in a 1v1 with full upgrades, you really only stop em with arbalests (and for that you get cheap skirms to counter).
Nothing shoking here but I would change 2-3 small things. - Magyars should go in S I think. Cheaper hussars, paladins and Magyar hussars (the best trash cavalry in the game) that destroys siege. Their paladins are generic but you can screw your opponent with Magyars. You can go the crossbows at the begining of the game and when you reach imperial with blast furnace for free, you can mass Magyar hussars or cavaliers (I don't think that paladins are realistic in this scenario) and take your ennemy by surprise because it is unlikely that he would have prepared pikemen. - Lithuanians in S tier too. The winged hussar is just better than a generic one (not the best overall for me but top 5-10 and better than all the light cavalry of all your S tier). For the knights it becomes more difficult but if you get only 1 relic in castle age, you still have one of the best knight of the game. In imperial it all comes down to that. 0/1 relic => paladins are not worth paying for 2 relics => ok 3/4 relics => you now have the best paladins in the game. You also have your leitis if you don't get relics. They can have such a huge impact. - Teutons in A for me. In feudal, you have a good scout rush with their cheaper farms. From castle age it's all about knights but they are great. Some scenarii for you (fully upgraded castle age units). Teutonic knights take 3 more shots to be killed when they face other knights. They also take 3 more shots to be killed by an eagle warrior compared to a generic knight. In imperial age, the Teutonic paladin falls in 6 haleberdier hits instead of 5 for a generic one. They are not S tier of course because of their lack of variety and the lack of husbandry.
- Regarding Magyars, I hear ya. I wanted to put them in S-tier, but that needs to be an exclusive club. It really comes down to lacking a proper economy bonus. But it's close, for sure. Magyars are one of my fave civs, so my heart is with you, for sure. - Regarding Lithuanians, they do have a decent number of options, but it's the riskiness of the relic bonus. It's hard for me to call them an S-tier civ when their cavaliers in Imp run the risk of losing to generic cavaliers, ya know? - Regarding Teutons, if this were a heavy cavalry tierlist, I could buy arguments that Teuton knights are S-tier even without husbandry. But when your only other cavalry unit are scouts? Plus the scout rush with Teutons is not that interesting either. Light cav raids are massive in a lot of 1v1s, so it's a pretty big strategic limitation.
@@jimmyjames5953 Do you take free blast furnace for an eco bonus? - For the Lithuanians I agree. They can be in A as in S to be honest. So it's hard to judge. - I see. But it's funny anyway that Teutons scouts can beat a decent number of light cav from other civilizations 1vs1
@@divicospower9112 So, while I think most people don't consider the free attack upgrades for Magyars as an eco bonus, I consider it something like a conditional eco bonus in that it only works on the condition that you play melee units. To me, the only reasons that Magyars aren't S-tier is because the meta has gotten so fast and once other civs invest in upgrades, it's an even fight. Magyars do a great job of fighting in those power-spike windows, but when that window closes it's kind of a push because you don't really have a performance bonus that gives you an advantage. Regarding Teutons, to me this issue is more that slow, 65 HP scouts are so poor at raiding at being a meatshield, which are two important functions for light cav in the mid-to-late game. And it's not like they can go for punishingly fast scout openings either. And light cav with bloodlines and all their attack upgrades should still win in 1v1 fights.
I do agree it's underrated, I just think between lacking a proper eco bonus, a performance bonus or cost discount for any cavalry, and then also not really having that much versatility, i dunno, it just doesn't quite move the needle for me into the A-tier. It's still a good decent cav civ, it's just I think it's categorically distinct from some of those A-tiers.
