Check out the Merch Store: teespring.com/stores/growling-sidewinder-store Just having a little fun in this one but it kind of weirdly showed the other perspective pretty well I imagine the real thing would be very similar with the mig-29 unable to retaliate in any way. It was actually quite an experience to be so helpless in a BVR fight amazing what the difference in technology can do. Anyway I hope you guys enjoyed the video Thank you for watching and your support with the channel. Much Love.
You got really near, maybe with a wingman things could have taken another route, in fact it would be much more realistic. How many mig-29s are needed to take down a single F22? How about rugged terrain? Niiiiice video.
@@lawrencemenzel354 my point is this U.S. military does NOT want a fair fight. We spend billions so we dominate and end confrontations quickly and decisively. Think of the North Korean pilot as the blind kid with his shoe laces tied. In the big picture it saves U.S. lives. Dam good strategy by my way of thinking. He'll of a deturent too.
Hunter, I like your quirky since of humor. It's the truth it saves lives for U.S. to dominate. Sucks if your a N.Korean pilot. The world will just have to learn going up against a Rapter is not going to end well for blind pilots with their shoelaces tied.(hehe)
There is a channel here on RU-vid where two former North Korean soldiers (one from the army and one Airforce) talk about and react to random things made in and by the US. When the former Airforce dude was talking about North Korean fighter jets he said most of them are very old and only still in service because it isn't easy for NK to acquire more of them. Both him and the army dude agreed that if NK and the US went to war that the US would win very easily. The Airforce dude was shocked outright when the interview guy began reading the specs on the F-22 and the army guy seemed impressed even though he admitted that he didn't know much about aviation.
Did the guy in charge of GCI went for a coffee break after scrambling the Mig29? No way you would scramble one fox1 interceptor giving him only an initial BRAA and telling him "good luck with it bro" . Would be interesting to repeat it with 2 Mig29 scrambled and GCI. You could ask ATE to be your wingman in the second Mig29, that would be interesting to watch.
Mustering all the blind faith in me to appreciate whomever may be in office. Still isn't enough. Could we have given the reigns to a more gullible sucker?
Yep. Trade blockage in another attempt at genocide an entire country can do that to its economy. Still, people there tend to live like people. Communism ftw, despite sometimes strange leadership.
@@MikoyanGurevichMiG21 I would just defect at that point the moment I lift off il hit the afterburner screaming I defect on open coms best strategy against an f22.
@@bomber6258 hey evading north korea sam with my north korea plane trying to land in us or her allies airbase is a far better combat plan then actully fighting the f22 at least this plan of mine have some chance of sucess taking my mig 21 or early mig29 up against a f22 is pure suicide.
Actually, the North officially has only 26 MiG 29s. How many of those are operational? You may actually have lost the only flying example in the North Korean air force.
Long band radar can detect stealth fighter pretty easily. They just are too "slow" to be paired to fire control systems for missiles. These radars are cheap and used in many private airfields in america. NK has a couple from russia most likely
Because "our Dear Leader" is so special he can see an F-22 over the horizon with his special super vision. Don't forget his father hit 11 'Hole in One's' the very first time he ever played golf.
That's actually legit scary. From someone who doesn't play fight sims and only really reads about this stuff to see this concept of stealth combined with the strength of AMRAAMs, seeing it in practice in DCS really puts into perspective for me of how dangerous of a fight this is.
Yeah, though... like others have said, its not a fair fight. Not even a little bit. Its not exactly because of vastly superior tech, but then again it kind of is. The big difference here is that the F-22 is not a REALLY a fighter, despite its F designation. Its in intradiction aircraft. They were specifically designed to take out enemy aircraft from as far out of visual range as possible. Very few aircraft have a chance vs an F22 because of this. They were the first 5th Gen "fighter" jet to come out, and its only been until recent time when Russia and China even came out with theirs... The PAK FA (russia) and the J-20(china). Before these aircraft, the F-22 was a legitimate Bald Eagle in a sky full of sparrows. The first aircraft to even be able to take one out in wargames was 5-10 years ago(i believe), when a french Rafale barely squeaked out a kill. Ima leave you a link to the real world "dashcam" of this happening. Notice how stressed the pilot is in this Rafale to be able to do this. /watch?v=KOswfrc7Xtg
@@Kiba69420 Well it was a great training scenario, but what people dont understand is a fully combat load 4th gen will not be able to maintain the same performance as a f-22 because it has no parasite drag of missiles. The british typhoon is considered one of if not the best dog fighter, and it can barely hang with the f22. Parasite drag.
@@KJV0812 F-22 max speed is somewhere close to Mach 3, not too many fighter jets can hang with it in general. The F-22 isnt a dog fighter, its an interdiction fighter. Its purpose was/is to be on call to intercept threats first. To get to engage distance (somewhere around 500-600miles max) and splash the threat before the enemy even knows they are in danger. They are perfectly capable dog fighters, but it isnt their purpose. Same thing with the A-10. Its not meant to dogfight, it can if it needs to, but its far more superior at attacking ground based targets.
@@Kiba69420 Well it is one of very few aircraft that can hit their max speed; rafale could not with combat load. I mean I hear pilots say they wont ever see max speed anyway.
@@Kiba69420 you just said the f-22 wasn’t designed to be a fighter and the A-10 can dogfight if it need to i don’t think you know anything about these jets
@@AtomicBlastPony I don't think so. That was a really optimistic statement from GS. In the review you could see there was a point he was looking, literally, directly at the F22 but his sensors had nothing. Being forced to stay that aggressively defensive, I doubt he would've ever actually seen the F22 to attempt a merge.
I remember an F15 pilot who was pitted against an F22 at Red Flag exercise a few years ago (the f22 got 8 F15s before it left). The pilot said "your first indication that you are in a fight with an F22 is looking up and seeing a deployed parachute."
@@julienrooknizan5711 I know, just a bit of sarcasm. During that conflict, many Yugoslav's N019 had passed their MTBF life cycle. Also note for the F-117 incident: Technically correct about those factors into account. Actually the F-117 opened his bay and the modified SA-2 can faint painted and pin point her using multiple radars and basic trigonometric and so on.
This is why the stealth pilots call it "clubbing baby seals" when they fly against non-stealth aircraft... You actually did really well considering how much of a disadvantage you were at. Also, in real life the low probability of intercept AN/APG-77 might not have enough radiated energy dwell time on any particular part of the sky to trigger a RWR - even in an aircraft that's actually being actively tracked. And, given cooperative engagement and data link, the AMRAAM (or the successor: AIM-260 JATM) will often arrive from an off axis direction. All together, it's really not possible to accurately model the capabilities of the F-22/ F-35 without making DCS completely unbalanced.
Well, realistically, what can actually rival the F-22 or F-35? Assuming, of course, that China doesn’t have some sort of magic equivalent to them that we somehow haven’t heard about.
@@theorangeofallahpbuh1840 Su-35S can, easily. Muh stealth is a gimmick never demonstrated by those two you mentioned against any capable adversary, especially with the monster of a total power product 35S radar has, and he can rain not just R-77s, but R-33/37s down on their burger asses. Chinese, I'm sure, have their own options.
Nah, maybe with another mig and a capable pilot things might have gone wrong for the f22. In fact it would be much more realistic. There are much more migs than F22s avaliables.
@@XimCines Yeah sure,the number of Mig-17s combined with 21s and 29s is probably higher than the F-22As that the US has available. And in reality those missiles would´ve been way more dangerous, and with a competent F-22A pilot yeah, that fight was over before it begun.
I actually wonder how many north korean soldiers know about huge tech gap. The infantry propably dont but speacial forces and pilots might be told that in the event of war braking out they might be faceing a stronger enemy.
@@baltulielkungsgunarsmiezis9714 The tech gap is even larger than you can believe it is. Most of North Korean military technology is from the sixties. It is not just Uncle Sam but all the rest of the world, too, are laughing at them. North Korea might as well scrap most of their military for good raw resources and to ease their military maintenance cost because it hardly has even a deterrent value anymore. South Korea would beat them to pulp even if Uncle Sam did nothing but twiddled his thumbs aside. Oh wait! No they cannot scrap their military after all. They still have their own unhappy and disgruntled civilians to fear.
@@Cybernaut76 "South Korea would beat them to pulp even if Uncle Sam did nothing but twiddled his thumbs aside." No. North Korea has nukes and this would make it so the South would have a very hard time.
just run to south korean border if i was a mig pilot that recieved and order from supreme leader to go fight f22 ill just fly over to south korea and eject there
It has an LPI mode. Maybe they didn't use it to be sporting :D But yes, in the LPI mode, older RWR has no chance to detect it. Only the most modern systems on select 4+gen fighters and 5th gens can reliably detect radar emissions from LPI mode AESAs.
@@jellypowder3325 Hehe. LPI: low probability of intercept. Means the radar is changing frequency several dozen (or several hundred) times a second, and is almost impossible for older RWR (radar warning receiver) systems to detect against background clutter, let alone lock onto for a return shot. It's one of the F-22's tricks to maintaining stealth, when more traditional radars are like a flashlight in the dark. You can see, but they can see you back. Not with LPI, as it's like a flashlight that's constantly changing colour, when the person looking back can only look for one colour at a time.
I can only imagine how nerve wracking it would be trying to fight an invisible enemy. Random shots coming with only a extremely vague idea of where they might be.
10 points to who knows this quote. "How do we find him if our radar can't see him?" "When a plane in your formation goes down, you'll know you're in the ball park."
Ah yes a legendary battle I'm just waiting for the F4 vs F-14 Tom Cat Edit: ok wtf I didn't expect this much of a response saying stuff like it's unfair like c'mon it's just a game anything is possible
What’s exceptionally scarier is the fact that the first raptor was mission capable in 2005… the last raptor went mission capable 2011…. So our pilots have had 17 years to perfect their skills…. Skunkworks has had 17 years to improve this platform and develop something better
I don't think forcing a merge would've worked either. The Raptor simply won't let you. I bet with AIM-120Ds plus AWACS support, the Raptors wouldn't even have to enter North Korean airspace to splash bandits in the event things went hot over there.
@@galaxymyt4834 wrong wrong wrong The F22 is better then the J20 F22s Stealth Perfomance is better then the J20 Chinas Airforce will lose to USAF s airforce the sukhoi cant even handle the f22
@@galaxymyt4834 Nothing beats that F22......You should see its kill rate against 4th gen aircraft, tests done in real war simulations out at sea by the airforce and Navy, nothing more accurate other than real war, the F22 is over 70 to 1, the F35 is over 30 to 1, the biggest problem these planes have, not being able to carry more missiles, they literally have to launch more planes in the simulation, but being US carriers are always at such a high level of readiness, launching a dozen extra planes is totally doable, so in that scenario the kill rates were incredible, in that sim it came up against F18's, F15's, F16's, Griphen and Rafeals from French carrier group who were involved, and there were a few others I forget all of them plane models, but nothing even came close to having the ability to knock out an F22 or F35 in the attempt to attack a carrier group, EPIC fail on the behalf of Gen 4 planes, now whats REALLY interesting is this, after that rimpack event, a heap of nations around the world, now all of a sudden have increased how many F35s they are buying......... Both of these Stealth planes are literally the ONLY TRUE stealth fighters on planet Earth, Im not American by teh way, but the truth is the truth, they are, right now, almost unstoppable and it would terrify any of our enemies to have them on the border, as Israel have proven, by flying 2, F35s over Iran for hours collecting target data, Iran only found out about it, months later through a spy who found a data trail on it, oops Israel, anyway, them planes are so much more effective than the media EVER let on......
@@Piddlefoots I agree with you but like it’s a 5th gen vs a 4th gen it’s like a bazooka vs a stick who would win? Jsut that Russia and China and other enemy countries are incapable of perfecting their 5th gen fighters before we get our 6th gen
"...we're going to kill the shit out of this F-22... Oh no, there's a third missile. Mistakes were made, mistakes were made." I just shot my soda out through my nose! ROTFLMAO...
It's a honor for me. I started watching and subscribed a few months back. I have always enjoyed talking to and listing to the stories of pilots and tactics. Your channel gives an excellent insight into tactical analyses and the joy of just blowing shit up(hehe) it's been my pleasure.
I've watched my kids watch RU-vid videos of other people playing video games. I just shook my head and laughed. Now here I am eating lunch at work, and watching RU-vid videos of other people playing video games. Love the channel!
you know, I never understood why the F-22 was THAT good, until I watched this. this is why I love simulators; they help me understand what I normally can't. Also, you should do a dogfight with C.W. Lemoine
@@hudsonr.218 The RCS wouldn't be accurate at all. To accurately model the RCS you'd have to have access to the sort of very secret information that the USAF doesn't readily hand out. RCS isn't a static thing. It changes based upon the direction of incoming emissions. Most "stealth" aircraft are optimised for emissions hitting the airframe from the front and even then it will depend upon the angle (above, below, level). It's not as simple as saying F-22 has (for example) 3× smaller RCS than an F-15. That number could be an average, or it could be in certain aspects or a specific aspect. I find it really difficult to believe that even an old MiG-29 with 1980's radar wouldn't have got some sort of return on a maneuvering F-22 at similar altitude with radar pointing straight at it 20km away. As it maneuvers it will show different angles to the enemy radar, so some signals are bound to return to the antenna, even if it's only momentary. The whole advantage of stealth is to position yourself out of the way of radar emissions and ambush from the blind spots. It isn't an invisibility cloak.
@@maverick8697 Yeah that's probably a fair comment, but at 20-30km it would be getting hit pretty hard, so I'm sure RWR would detect at those ranges. But yeah, who knows how far away effective LPI is? It's another thing that the USAF isn't particularly keen to share!
3:46 RWR tells you that the radar that's painting you is roughly at the same altitude as your plane. It's these two pieces in the center of RWR. They are both lit.
The only inaccuracy I can think of in this engagement is the knowledge of the pilot. An NK pilot is only likely to know much about the 22s it seems like. My understanding is defectors regularly talk about how they are kept in the dark about the capabilities of the West though it is assumed that the NK High Command must know something about the technology. For the most part, most of the NK military don't have a clue as to what we have and what it can do. One NK colonel talked about her shock when she learned about the 117a penetrating NK air space after she had defected. It was unheard of in North Korea. The propaganda machine there is reportedly very aggressive.
Probably been indoctrinated to think they have the very best weapon systems and that americans will eject the moment they know an enemy plane is in the air.
Against a Russian Mig-29 which receives full upgrade packets, the F-22 might need to be concerned, however North Korea has never upgraded their Mig-29 fleet since the got them in the 80's.
The price of technology to those who can afford it or create it. That’s real world. And why we train so deeply and seriously. Things just might show up that leave you at a disadvantage. Or a primary offensive/defensive system fails. Some many factors must be checked good to go before stealth truly works. A mistake or error in any of these you must still rely on the fact you are still fling a very capable Gen4 plane. That in depth training and maintenance is what keeps it great, but damn, the price tag is steep.
@@michaelwong4303 Every country has its ace’s that perform outside the envelope of their standard of training. Who knows. The USA has 2-3 times the class room and theory. And 4 times the flight hours. And if any are fling Tier 1 aircraft have been fling for years. All highly respected and top notch in their field. But even with that you still get a top 10% and a bottom so to speak. And we still have people whom train others, and still fly from the last 3 campaigns. But somewhere their is a somebody with that sixth sense. Can kill and down planes like some aerial automaton, always outside the box. You could have true real life aces that couldn’t play a very similar game. Or a world class gamer that couldn’t taxi or take-off going down the runway.
Steath craft like the f-22 b-2 and i think f-35 are all build to have both less rader cross section and infrared by minimizing the exhaust. Thats why the b-2 engines look a bit odd inside the body of the plane.
Also can we have a dogfight with a Carrier F-14A and a Japanese Zero? I saw it in the movie Final Countdown and I’ve always been curious how that would work out irl.
@@mohammadrezaghorbani3137 I don't think the problem was the MIG's radar. The problem is that the cross section of the F22 is significant smaller, no matter what radar is painting it
The only differences are the RCS of the Tomcat is much larger than the MiG and thus easier to target from farther away and the MiG slightly more agile.
"When I saw those Mustangs over Berlin, I knew that the war was lost." - Herman Goering. "I knew the war was over when I heard F-22s were on their way in." - Any future leader of choice.
@@JETZcorp this is also one reason why the f-22’s rcs simulation is most likely inaccurate. Since its rcs will vary greatly when viewed from different angles. From head on for example the rcs is very tiny, but when viewed from behind (can see turbine blades) or directly below (entire belly) the rcs is much larger.
@@VyarkX It's obvious that the RCS in this model will be in accurate - everything about it is highly inaccurate. It can't be otherwise because the plane is so highly classified. No one should expect anything else. If the RCS is less than an F-15 then they're already beating expectations for a free mod.
This did a really good job of demonstrating how it must feel to face a stealth aircraft, its not '"invisible" you know its somewhere in front but you don't know range, velocity or any useful parameter. Kind of feels like you sit there and wait for your faith
What’s it feel like to fly against a Mig 21 controlled by AI (or 8 of them?) Great show btw, really appreciate the educational aspects as well as the competition. Also, somehow I wonder if the missile logic is not representing state of the art.
Whenever it launches a rocket, the F22 loses the stealth characteristics so the Mig could, in theory, catch it on the scope, especially when he was right with his nose on it. Hope they can fix it in the future...
The brief opening of the missile bay can get it lit up, but it is so quick that the signal is easily lost. And stealth doesn't make you completely invisible, but it does drastically reduce the range you can be detected at. Closer in a stealth aircraft can be detected, but it's still difficult because the return signal is muddied and scrambled. Basically what I'm saying is that you can get an idea of where a stealth aircraft is, but you'll have to engage it either with IR or WVR because the radar returns won't be reliable for effective tracking.
Christ, that was nerve-wracking! You had GREAT instincts regarding that first missile-that was good. I mean, considering how freakin’ spooky the whole engagement was. Great show, mate; I was on the edge of mi seat.
Thanks, I took my kids to meet a Raptor pilot up in the control tower at Elmendorf afb and this video gives you a great idea of what the Raptor could do and what that pilot was trying to explain.
Is there a video or somewhere I can go to either read/watch/learn all the different terminology you use in these simulations by chance? The area of military aircraft, hardware, military aerial defense/offense, & the weapons & weapon systems used plus their abbreviations, terminology, etc I have very little to no knowledge. Videos of these simulations in DCS have sucked me in as of recent & I’ve really been enjoying them, but having no idea what anything means does take away from the experience. I google things it does a good job muddying things up since I’m not sure if I’m even reading what is relevant. Is it possible to point me into the right direction?
Mistakes were made mistakes were made 😂 I almost spit my coffee on the dash and windshield of my Mustang. As a former Boeing Space and Defense employee I’m very proud of the F22
This was a fantastic video! Seeing the decisions you have to make with such a disadvantage is fascinating. Naturally my next thought is what happens if two Mig-29s are faced with the same situation? Do you just have to YOLO it after defending the first missile and hope he can only kill one of you before you merge?
@@GrowlingSidewinder Also with two aircraft you might be able to triangulate the location of the F-22 by comparing radiation sensor readouts. Not a huge improvement but at least you wouldn't be stuck with just a proto-eye and your photon whiskers.
This video actually demonstrates a good point. If you have 2 MiG-29s with skilled pilots going against 1 F-22 they might have a chance at beating it. And these MiG-29s are the oldest variants. Imagine putting 2 modern F-16s or 2 MiG-35s against an F-22 with all their jamming and more powerful radars.
@@kwkfortythree39 You can lock on to any stealth aircraft. If you or it comes close enough. The more powerful the radar the further the detection distance. That’s in real life of course. But, idk if they modelled it so it is completely invisible, If so I don’t think its realistic.
@@scudb5509 that's a big "if", a one stealth plane will not allow to do. Also the more powerful the radar, greater the distance stealth plane can detect and locate you passively.
@@scudb5509 Detection =/= Tracking. Old F-15's with mechanical radars had F-22's right in front of them, seen by the pilots eyes and yet they couldn't get a lock on them.
Look at 9:50. GS is totally blind, he has no further information than that an active radar is pointing at him. The F-22 fires the first AMRAAM and GS goes defensive at the same time. That is an experienced DCS fighter pilot. To estimate the moment of an enemy fox launch down to a second.
