"Brace" for impact haha lololol Please consider donating to a firearms advocacy group of your choice. Here are two options: www.firearmspo... www.gunowners....
My Dad only knew about this ruling recently, and only cause I told him. He doesn't follow gun news and bought his CZ Scorpion with an arm brace, not knowing it wasn't even a stock. Imagine the thousands if not millions of people out there who are about to become felons without ever knowing it.
Those are the folks who are going to get bound up. Someone like your dad bought it not really knowing anything but it was cool/worked/was what they needed. They happen to be the unlucky victim of a home invasion and use the braced pistol to defend their lives…. And now they’re in court for federal charges
I can imagine. And we need those people to not know. The more of those people who get arrested, the better our chances of shutting this down for being over reach in violation Constitution, an attempt at entrapment, and at worse demonstrate that braced pistols are widespread, and at best if the ATF is right and these are SBRs then there are millions of SBRs in use and use it to kick a couple legs of out from under NFA34. This is lawfare.
Me prior to this video: _"I would never send a dick pic to anyone. That's lewd and disgusting."_ Me after this video: _"Dear ATF, Please inform me if my gun in this picture counts as an SBR."_
@@SP-ny7lw SBR's are defined by laws. The ATF just can't suddenly say something is a NFA item. If that were the case... the ATF can just say AR-15 needs a tax stamp and be registered. Which they very may well try if the pistol brace thing withstands court challenges.
Just simply say you lost them, and just so you know when they serve a search warrant they don't excavate or dig up your property. And there are plenty of good methods for storing firearms underground. Bury em boys. Never hand them over.
Can we stop pretending as if this word game makes a shit bit of difference? One side has a monopoly on violence and is willing to use it to enforce their will and then there is everyone else online saying akshually this technically x instead of y. It doesn't matter if they call it the pretty pink pony compromise of 2023. If they aren't challenged in the courts and they can send armed individuals to your house with the implicit threat of lethal force without any other legal entity that can not only determine it is unlawful, and enforce that determination their own agents, the technically correct legal definitions don't make a lick of difference.
It seems everyone is eternally missing the point...stop demanding to be allowed pistol braces, start demanding to be allowed unrestricted SBRs. Gun people are always bitterly clinging to their legal loopholes
I think people cling to the loopholes because until recently, the Supreme Court didn't take up many, if any second amendment cases, so anything anyone wanted had to be trick shots around arbitrary rules and vague language.
It’s not a loophole though it’s following the law. Following the law is not a loophole. If people did not want the law to be written that way they would write it a different way. You’re buying into anti-gun nonsense and assuming that loopholes are even a thing. Being able to privately sell another individual a firearm is not a loophole. But the gun show loophole people who are anti-gun say it is. Why are you using antigun logic. If you care about the second amendment at all.
What's crazy isn't all of the people who've done pistol builds, but the random people who have literally walked into a store and bought a braced gun as a pistol and now they have NO idea about any of this.
If this move doesn't get SBRs removed from the NFA- Bruen and Heller should be all that's required for a legal argument in that case -then I'm going to be genuinely disappointed in the 2A organizations. They've literally 'made' them common use items with the stroke of a pen.
It's hard to get shit removed once it's on the books... Look at machine guns, suppressors, SBRs and now bump stocks. They're taking away our 2A rights one small step at a time. It's a slow and long game to them and they know how to play it well...
The ATF isn't a regulatory body voted into power, they are an enforcement agency (executive, they execute the will of the legislative branch), they are taking it upon themselves to interpret unclear laws in a manner that suits their political beliefs, which is outside of their purview. They believe they have precedence to do so under Chevron Deference, which was established by courts for unrelated cases/laws.
@@rustyshackleford4438 .... The entire point of our Judiciary system isn't suppose to be a bias. The ATF is responsible for enforcing the completely pointless and outdated NFA. Braces are yet another blatant attempt to bypass the NFA. Instead of working to repeal the NFA.... LIKE WE SHOULD HAVE BEEN TRYING TO DO FOR 60+ FUCKING YEARS.... people just went "Herr durrr it a peestol. ATF man stewpid" and then shouldered the fucking thing on every social media site possible. This never would have happened if people didn't feel the fucking need to plaster their stupid fucking faces shouldering braces. Every anti-gunner who doesn't know a damn thing about guns would have went about their lives but no... people had to be fucking stupid and here we are.
The document states what is unsaid by nature. We have the right to self defense and can only remain free with the ability to commit violence against our leaders should they step out of line. We all know what needs to be done, but how many of us are willing to throw ourselves into the fire for eachother?
Hop shall forever be in the Federal Registry (as a reference). A huge feat that almost no one can boast about or get credit for. Keep up the awesome content.
@@Puca_Patchworks I have my criticisms of him, especially in the latter years, but at least when they talked about banning things by EO or a “rule” back in 2013 he didn’t just advocate compliance as an option like many are doing now.
It seems that the best advice so far is to wait 30 to 60 days into the "amnesty" period to see which legal challenges take hold before doing anything, compliance or otherwise. The Washington Gun Law channel has some pretty good breakdowns of it
@StEvEn420BrUlE I probably should have said at least 30 to 60 days, a common number I've seen is 80 days. The 119 days is a good option for the, "well, you idiots asked for it" malicious compliance option to overload the ATF en masse. The advice I've seen takes into account people who for whatever reason being in compliance with the latest silly rule makes sense (even if it doesn't, but whatever)
Just simply say you lost them, and just so you know when they serve a search warrant they don't excavate or dig up your property. And there are plenty of good methods for storing firearms underground. Bury em boys. Never hand them over.
This isn't happening because ATF suddenly decided that braces are dangerous, it's being done to specifically target political enemies of the Federal government, who happen to have a large overlap with people who own braces
If you someone isn't willing to get in a gunfight with the ATF I don't see what doing either will really accomplish. We already know the ATF will selectively enforce this rule and only go after their political enemies.
@@newerest1 which is everyone who owns a brace, among others. They’ll go for the high profile ones first of course, but don’t mistake for one moment if an easy opportunity comes by they’ll bind up an average Joe and ruin his life for kicks
Good to have friends and communities that stand together. Get with your local PDs, start making the effort. If you dont, then no one else is going to. Communication is key here. Find out what the sheriff or chief is going to do and if theyre against it, then you need to get the entire town or city thats a gun owner on your side and educated. The ATF is just a group of people, and they arent highly trained. The taliban would eat them for a snack
And im in federal prison means some donut stuffer did a traffic stop after range day and decided to search the vehicle. This "rule change" is meant more to penalize and spite pro 2a folks than it is to enforce the sbr law that is a remnant loophole closing to a pistol ban that never made it through.
No, they don't, but their willy-nilly interpretations and re-interpretations have the same effect, so what's the difference? Until this gets challenged in court (and until it is struck down by a court), then it is, for all intents and purposes "the law" by which you will be prosecuted if caught with an "illegal" firearm. As for chevron deference, it only applies in cases where the law is ambiguous. The ATF, and indeed, the definitions and laws made by congress in this case are anything but ambiguous. The ATF's copious letters to that effect are evidence. I hope the entire SBR thing gets tossed from the NFA, if for no other reason than "common use"...use that the ATF has clearly allowed for a couple of decades. DOn't forget, the bump stock ban was recently over turned, so it's not impossible.
@@beardly0121 nothing is for free, stop being so gullible. Founding fathers are rolling in their graves right now with how their countryman have gotten so weak
Thanks for talking about this Hop. As a gun person, I don’t like the motto, “Guns, not politics.” If major influencers don’t get involved, there is no hope.
You bring up a lot of valid points. It’s not a law it’s a rule change and we will have to see how this plays out. Our community has to stick together and quit eating our own.
I believe this issue could accidently end the SBS/SBR regulations due to the vagueness of the 1934 NFA. Those regulations were part of a section intended to ban handguns that was struck from the bill before it became a law and therefore are just junk language that doesn't apply to anything. The ATF has been making and changing rules based on this junk language for almost 100 years. Using the "void for vagueness" court doctrine, the constant changing interpretations from the very agency meant to regulate items using the 1934 NFA as its guide can only mean the SBR/SBS language in the 1934 NFA is too vague to enforce and must be struck down in court.
@@sgt.lt.mjr.pepperface4627 Rule of Lenity. The ATF has put it on their own shoulders to create all the vagueness necessary to count. If the ATF can't even agree with itself on what the different vague language is supposed to mean, then a citizen cannot be reasonable expected to. Such vague bits must be corrected by Congress, not judges or law enforcement, as per SCOTUS.
Yeah I want to hear the argument about how SBRs are unusual and dangerous compared to a non braced pistol. The lies that are forthcoming are going to be ridiculous.
One point that is getting overlooked about the entire “free tax stamp” thing is how it then locks you into the inability to freely travel over state lines with your new SBR. In order to do that, you again have to request to do so from the ATF. And I know the argument to this is often “How would they even know?” which is sort of a question that could be posed to the registration thing. I think the best option right now is to wait and see how this plays out. “In chess, the pawns go first”
Yeah, but the interstate travel permission form can be up to one year, and they give automatic approval unless it would be illegal. For example, they won't give me approval to take a SBR into CA, because it's against CA law. Plus, most of us don't travel with our guns much, and even if we do, a lot of us have something that's interstate legal. If I can't take my AR SBR across state lines, then I can get an unbraced pistol lower for like $200. Me? I live in PA, near the borders to Maryland and New Jersey. I'm not leaving the state with ANY of my guns!
Just SBR man the tax stamp is pants on head retarded and it's not like people go around sniffing your gun at the range... nobody cares. The only complaint I ever get is that it's loud and spits fireballs.
I don’t own an impacted product. I support your right to keep yours. But please for the love of all that is good, I’d wish people would stop the tough guy on the internet act. All you’re doing is giving them exactly what they need to charge you.
Each and every one of us is not complying with federal laws every day because it is not possible to comply with, or even know, all the many thousands of federal laws. The majority of those laws are only enforced when someone annoys a politician or an enforcement thug.
Yeah, but local enforcement thugs routinely patrol the public range where I live. The last time I was there, I saw them give a guy a $250 ticket for using his own target stand instead of the rickety stands put up by the state.
Because they’re college kids. And they refuse to listen to reason. They say it’s time to have an honest conversation but when we start kicking their ass with facts and logic they cry and scream and sometimes throw in a “you’re a racist” card for good measure.
@@andrewsanford2020 Too bad what the ATF says doesn't mean jack shit in a court of law. The ATF can't just take back their governmental approval, regardless of how much they just want to say they can. SCOTUS precedent says otherwise, and the ATF doesn't prosecute or rule on procedural law. They don't control what is valid or not, statutory contract law does.
Thanks Hop I watched because you were serious and that concerned me as you usually have a straight low key comedic delivery of your content. It was sobering to see you in this concerned state. You are an asset to the 2A community for concerning yourself with our struggles and issues. Everyone else start thinking about stepping up and joining and/or donating to the hardcore legal 2A advocacy groups to fight this b.s. in court. It's the only thing the Alphabet boys understand.
When you say "hardcore legal 2A advocacy groups" which ones do you mean? I'm a lifetime member of the NRA, and last time I checked they were pretty much hopeless. Is LaPew still in charge there?
BS. The so-called "civil rights movement" was successful ONLY because it was an excuse to do what the federal government and mass media supported already.
@@noway6633 you can't really call somebody a parrot without getting any details about what they believe and why. Ironically, you're parroting the "parrot" insult, i.e. repeating it without understanding what it means.
@@tissuepaper9962 See the funny thing is: I literally don't have to do any of that. The fact he is a parrot, just like many in these comment sections is self evident. And the fact of the matter is that repeating platitudes in a comment section is basically all most people do to stand up against this crap. It's parroted wishful thinking and I'm tired of seeing it. It does nothing to aid the cause but it gives retards their dopamine hit so they can pretend they did something.
@@noway6633 OP's comment isn't a "platitude", I don't think you know what that word means either. You're just making assumptions, why can't you assume that OP is a reasonable person who can justify their opinion and work from there, instead of starting with the insults? Could it be that trolling "parrots" gives you the exact same hit of dopamine you're deriding? What, in your opinion, is so valuable about the ATF that you think the idea of disbanding it is _prima facie_ ridiculous? You think the idea is so ridiculous that the person repeating it couldn't possibly understand what they're actually saying, so, tell us, what is OP actually saying? What are the negative consequences preventing that from being a reasonable and beneficial course of action?
A legal fund for people who use illegal firearms in cases of self defense might not be a bad idea. Consider the hypothetical case of: a home invader breaks into a person's house. The home owner defends himself and his property, but with an unregistered, fully automatic, SBR, with a suppressor attached. Is the homeowner wrong? No. He's exercising his second amendment right to self defense with the best tool for the job: Arms. Uninfringed and unadulterated arms.
So here’s how it played out with me: The ATF already has my info for a supressor, so I went ahead and form 1’d my 11.5. The only photos I needed to submit were of the engraving already present on the lower. I didn’t show them the upper, buffer tube, or brace. 29 day approval and $200 tax was exempt. I could understand the issue with interstate travel for someone who travels a lot. I’d personally not fret over it. Now that it’s seemingly been thrown out, I’m still glad I did it. Free SBR and I don’t have to deal with keeping up what’s “ Legal” for a pistol anymore.
The best advice I’ve heard was from Washington Gun Law, which was (paraphrasing) to give it 30 or 60 days before making a decision on how to proceed. A lot could happen between now and then (like injunctions, clarifications from ATF, etc.) that might impact that decision.
If one waited 60 days and their application went the 88 days it can lay there untouched that’s over the 120 day amnesty and will get you sent to federal prison.
@@victorygarden556 that’s a myth and the original RU-vidr who said it has already walked it back. And the ATF specifically called it out as untrue in their webinar.
Love your vids man! Straight to the point with facts. Appreciate you taking all the time and effort to produce your content. It is greatly appreciated here. 👍🏼👊🏻
important difference between brace ban and Rosa Parks: Rosa Parks did not just one day decide to not give up her seat and then happened to win. That city and that date were chosen for her to intentionally make her protest with the intention of that being the best place to have that fight and with the full backing of organizations that were gonna fight for her. They prepared and were ready. Do not think the same is gonna happen for you if you do not already have legal backing, FPC has already filed, let them at least have a preliminary injunction hearing before making a call. Planning and picking winnable fights with broad public support were the cornerstones of the civil rights movement. Learn from successful movements, they are almost always well organized, well led, and well funded.
"Thus the right of nullification meant by Mr. Jefferson is the natural right, which all admit to be the remedy of insupportable oppression." - James Madison
Let me make the recommendation for you, DO NOT COMPLY. I will not comply, I will not take my pistols down from my set, I will not stop using them. The ATF has ZERO authority to do anything and they cannot make laws. Congress has not passed a law saying braces are illegal.
The first lawsuit against the pistol brace law has been filed in Texas. It seems only a matter of time before it gets shut down. The supreme court are in the process of firming up 2A rights while the Democrats and atf are doing everything they can to take those rights away. Everything but what they should be doing. If they want to infringe on 2a rights they have to amend the bill of rights or their "laws" are unconstitutional. I don't have an AR pistol brace, but I'll be buying one after the atf loses in court, and our rights are preserved.
Hop, we're all already in trouble. The only thing is that they aren't coming for us wholesale yet. You're on the list too. You know what these guns are for. I know you cant come out bare faced and say it, but we ALL know they'll only keep pushing and pushing. All we can do is push back or be pushed.
@@MrNonzi i have harmed no children and neither has anyone in my circle. Why do we have to give up the right to self defense? Call the police? So they can stand in their tactical gear with their weapons you wouldn't let us have and listen to us get butchered instead of saving our own lives? Uvalde showed the only person you can depend on in a world of violence is yourself.
@Nonzi, if armed guards can defend marijuana dispensaries, they can defend schools. The children's blood is on the hands of criminals, school boards, and the government. Not law abiding citizens.
"Noncompliance is for cowards" - James Yeager. Don't let them take your guns or your neighbors guns. Lastly, don't go silently into the night. Godspeed brothers.
Or maybe we stop stressing about a “rule” written by an administrative arm of government trying to pass as legislation. The first step is stop calling it a “law”…
Damn yeah they quoted your ass, tough The only way to get the atf scared and to back down is by open non-compliance. Which is like the most dangerous option for us
when has this tactic ever worked in human history? they'll just lock up everyone who is dumb enough to get caught, and keep building more prisons until they run out of idiots
Or... For this to get struck down by the courts...which is what is going to happen. The supreme court are not goi6to allow this BS by the ATF. It takes time though. I hope, for those who own braces, that an injunction is put on this soon. It could totally happen.
Here is that thing, the ATF is a law enforcement agency not a law making body. By literally definition they can not make up laws or rulings period. This is a blatant over stepping of their purpose and powers. This is overlooking the very fact the ATF is it's self a massive violation of the Second Amendment that should by all legal rights be abolished with all firearm laws.
Seems like everyone will just wait until the lawsuits shake out. Bumpstock ban compliance was like 600 turned in of the 580k in circulation, so like a .1% compliance rate.
The odds of this getting shot down by the courts, particularly in light of two other recent Supreme Court rulings (the Bruen one and the EPA one) is extremely high. For anyone that is considering trying to get a free tax stamp, an option to consider is to wait until the last few days of the "amnesty period" before trying to register. This has a couple of benefits: 1) It gives time for the courts to stop it before you bother telling ATF anything about what you have, 2) if out of tens of millions of owners only a handful apply for months, it will look a lot like non-compliance is in the minds of the people, and 3) if tens of millions of people (or really probably tens of thousands to be honest) suddenly flood the E-Form system on day 120 the system (which is known for constant downtime) will crash and burn so hard from the sudden demand that it makes the case that complying is impossible. I know there was some case in California about people being physically unable to register "assault weapons" by a deadline set by the state, and the courts intervened to extend deadlines for people who tried to comply but couldn't.
Honestly who gives a fuck if the ATF knows about a few of the guns you own? They already know you OWN guns if you've ever done a 4473 which 99% of us have. The only additional information they'll be getting is what barrel length you chose. They'll get your prints too which is also not new information for many of us because A)tons of people already have NFA devices and B)many states require finger prints for a ccw and C) tons of people with braced ARs are veterans. Oh and they get a pic of your face too which they already have. It's not that big of a deal for them to know about a few guns you own. Them overstepping the bounds of their power and declaring millions of Americans felons overnight is the only aspect of this that matters.
Oh shit I love this idea of everybody registering on the last day. hahaha. Great idea. IF (and that's a really big IF) I consider registering or going along with this rule I'll wait until the last day.
When challenged in court, the ATF is going to have a very hard time making most judges understand their position. "Your honor, we've gone on record consistently, with hundreds of letters written, that explicitly have said for the last ten years that pistol braces are legal, but you just have to accept that we've changed our minds and now we say that they're illegal because we say so." Yeah, that'll fly....
“You’ll get there one day” shut up man. Other people live different lives, hard to imagine…..but you’ll get there one day champ. Or you wont and no one will care either way.
The ATF doesn't have the authority to modify the letter of law. Chevron deference also doesn't apply in situations like this. However, the government has also made it almost impossible to take them to court in any meaningful way. The NFA, GCA, and the Hughes Amendment need to be done away with
If I read the rule correctly, there is no actual criteria for just how much surface area an accessory mounted rearward on a buffer tube would be deemed acceptable. That means a tennis ball affixed to the back of an AR-style pistol would likely still be illegal. The founders of this nation would be absolutely repulsed by the clown world it has become.
according to their q and a you can't have anything whatsoever on the buffer. No foam nothing just a plain buffer tube and if you have a stock no attached to a rifle in the area they have stated it could be viewed as constructive possession
This is not a law it’s an opinion published by BATF. The Supreme Court ruled last year in WV v. EPA that executive branch agencies cannot rewrite or reinterpret a law only congress can do that
The more politics keep getting thrown into our lives, the more often that a road trip into a different state will feel like driving to Mexico or another country with the difference of laws alone.
do put a stock on your gun, do not pay $200, and probably never go to jail. on the off chance they show up to take you to jail, I hear TNT is a very effective PVP weapon in Minecraft
I am a member of the FPC and I have donated money to help them Sue for our rights! If you like your right of gun ownership I would suggest you donate money to the FPC do help them Sue the ATF pursuant to the pistol brace fiasco the ATF has caused! God-bless America!
It won’t be the ATF that comes looking for you. Once the “amnesty” period is over, you will be in possession of an NFA item that you didn’t get a TAX stamp for, so those 87,000 new IRS agents will be the ones to come looking for you.
History lesson: Prohibition was essentially defeated by mass non-compliance. People simply violated the 18th Amendment and the laws that sprang from it in mass. Just saying. Yeah, people went to jail for it until it was clear the law (and Amendment) was just hot garbage and unworkable, but civil disobedience was not what defeated it.
True, but mass non-compliance is one form of civil disobedience (disagree with Hop on this). And although in my opinion alcohol prohibition was a mistake at least it was done the right way, by passing a constitutional amendment. Now rules are changed without even passing a law through Congress; everything is done by executive order or by decree from unelected bureaucrats. That's why it is clear we are living in a dictatorship, not a constitutional democracy.
If they are functionally required you are ok. People going on about what kind of tube etc. are talking out their backsides. Constructive intent bs also. It's probably the most never enforced aspect in the history of enforcement. Why? Because the whole concept is so utterly toxic and counter to about every right we have in this country. They don't want it tested in court because it will really fail. It's a threat to scare people period. Constructive intent is beyond Orwellian.
@@hiwayhighway9925 I would add how something is used = re-manufacture of the firearm equally Orwellian. I checked the final rule and it appears they removed the language regarding tubes in the final submission. However, I think we still are not supposed to be able to put a foam tube on, because it has no functional intent. Lol. I am in total agreement with you, but I also believe we need to understand the ruling as completely as possible so people can be informed and make their personal choices.
I feel like this would be far less of a problem if the ATF didn't take over a year to approve NFA items and charge you extra for that tax stamp. Like if you only had to wait like a week for your new SBR or suppressor or what have you to be filed by the ATF then this would be a much smaller deal and they wouldn't have so much pushback on this thing.
