Another media anti-gun talking point. Anyone that knows how ballistics works knows how dumb that is. The only way I would agree with “shoot him in the leg” is if the heart or brain was located on your kneecap.
@@esotericksoul7156 try hitting a moving target in the leg, when they are charging at you. When it comes to you vs someone trying to take your life, you have to stop that person. Shooting at legs doesn't stop a threat.
@@esotericksoul7156 It's only in the movies when you shoot the leg, or shoot tires out of a moving car. Experience has proven that when seconds count, you don't shoot to "stop". You absolutely shoot to kill. That's the hard reality.
Jimmy's argruement sums up to: Zimmerman should have known he was dealing with a wild animal and never got out of the car, and once he did he deserves what he got, especially because he got attacked from behind. Think about it, Jimmy's argruement only makes sense if you are dealing with a wild bear. Civilized people don't and never should have to watch thier backs around eachother. How can he blame Zimmerman for getting caught off guard and still say Trayvon is not a criminal? Again, his logic only works if you replace Trayvon with a wild animal.
In 2009, Roderick Scott walked out the front door of his NY home after hearing noises at 3am. There had been reports of vehicle theft in the area and he found himself facing a group of 3 suspicious teenagers. Scott, carrying his .40 caliber handgun, confronted the group and told them to wait for police to arrive. It was then, when 17 year old Christopher Cervini began charging forward to attack Scott when Scott fired 2 shots, killing the teen instantly. Scott was later acquitted of manslaughter charges when a jury found that he acted in self-defense. This is in spite of the fact that NY has no stand-your-ground law and Scott was never physically harmed. This case is an almost carbon copy of the Zimmerman case with one glaring detail, *Scott was black and the dead teen was white.*
I will say that only two people know what happened between Trayvon and Zimmerman. One is Trayvon, he's dead. One is Zimmerman, who, I think didn't testify. We don't know what happened. And I'm not ready to hang Zimmerman. If I was on the jury I'd hesitate and then acquit Zimmerman. But I think Zimmerman got overly involved in the situation, and I think that was Jimmy's point.
@@jackmunch6978 I disagree, I don't think Zimmerman got overly involved with the situation. At first I was on the side of Trayvon, but it wasn't until the real evidence came out, not the doctored phone call and everything else in the media, that I changed my position. While it's true that they're the only 2 people to fully know what happened, there was one very credible witness who saw the entire altercation. Granted he didn't see the events leading up to it, but he definitely had a good view of the fight and shooting. However I think with a little deductive reasoning we can assume what most likely transpired. The area clearly had a problem with break-ins, and one had just recently occurred that week. Zimmerman, who was driving to the store, saw a shadowy figure walking in the rain through the backyard next to the house that had just been broken into. Assuming this to be another break in, he stops his vehicle, calls 911, and exits on foot. Martin on the other hand is on the phone with his girlfriend, who testified in court that he said a "creepy ass cracker" is on the phone looking at him. Correctly surmising that he's likely calling the cops, Martin ends the call and takes off running. Zimmerman then starts to follow him at which time the 911 dispatcher says "we don't need you to do that" and so he stops following and goes back to his vehicle. It's at this time that Martin calls his girlfriend back. We don't know what is said during this call as she "doesn't remember", but soon after the altercation will begin. Zimmerman tells the 911 dispatcher that someone is approaching him with his hand down his pants like he has a gun. Both calls end and the fight is on. I think Martin's girlfriend egged him on to go back and confront Zimmerman. He was already running away at that point, why would he turn around and go back to the person he thought was calling the cops on him? That seems awfully stupid if you ask me, unless of course you have a girl in your ear berating you for being a coward. So he approaches Zimmerman with his hand down his pants acting like he has a gun. We don't know what happened in those few seconds between then and Zimmerman on his back, but suffice to say Martin got the upper hand. With his head being bashed into the pavement by someone he thinks has a gun, Zimmerman pulls out his own gun and shoots Martin in the chest.
@@mosipdI think his girlfriend egged him on" you might be right about that, she was certainly nasty in the trial and she didn't go to the funeral. Maybe felt guilty. But that wasn't his girlfriend though. But I think the break-ins is accurate, something like over 200 calls to 911 to that neighborhood in one year.
@@w12ath040211 Girlfriend or not, I think it's obvious that she was egging him on. She could remember the entire conversation she had on the first call but then conveniently forgets what was said during the second call, which was the pivotal moment of the night. Martin takes off running because he obviously saw Zimmerman looking at him with suspicion while talking to someone on the phone. Common sense tells you he's probably calling the cops, else why would you take off running? And then there's the fact that Martin goes back to confront Zimmerman. Why would you go back after getting scared and running away? Because the girl you're on the phone with is telling you to go back and beat the shit out of the creepy ass cracker calling the cops on you. I mean you're not doing anything wrong, you're just walking home, so what's the problem? Well the problem is that Martin felt justified to go back and confront Zimmerman. To make a show of force in front of the creepy ass cracker, Martin sticks his hand down his pants pretending like he has a gun. The two then get into a fight, and Zimmerman now finds himself on the ground with a person he thinks has a gun straddling him while bashing his head into the pavement. So fearing for his life Zimmerman draws his gun and kills Martin, stopping the threat. This is an open and shut case in my opinion. You can call Zimmerman weak, you can say he purposefully didn't fight back, and you can even say maybe he started it, whatever, all of that is immaterial. Once Martin gains the upper hand and escalates the situation to lethal levels, that's when lethal force is justified.
Yea so when you're being followd by someone (who might be armed) its always a good idea to sneak attack them rather than get away from the person. Come one people use your common sense
I'm glad that Jim changed his mind as the trial went on. His views right now showcase what happens when you listen to the news and believe everything they say without any research.
Each time I start writing a comment pointing out Norton's insane logic, he says something that tops the last idiotic point he made. I wouldn't even know where to begin pointing out how wrong Jimmy is in every way possible.
I love both these guys, but I couldn't disagree more with Jimmy or agree more with Ant on this one, because Jimmy's logic seems to come from a place of ignorance in regards to both common sense and the law, while Ant's reasoning is based solely on those two things. One of Jimmy's main arguments here is that Zimmerman was at fault for the incident escalating to physicality because he had a gun, and according to Jimmy, anyone who is armed should never find themselves getting their asses kicked when they could have just showed their attacker that they have a gun before the fight even started. Here's why that's wrong: imagine you were a concealed weapons holder, and one day, you found yourself in a situation where you suspected another person might try to fight you, so you showed that person you had a gun and convince him/her that starting a fight is a bad idea. Yes, that would eliminate the possibility of a fight, but then that person could call the police on you, at which point you would be charged with brandishing a deadly weapon, which is a first degree misdemeanor. His other main point, that it was Zimmerman's fault Treyvon attacked him because he shouldn't have been following him in the first place, is also completely incorrect, because it ignores the fact that they were both in a public place, and that Treyvon had as much of a right to walk around the neighborhood as Zimmerman had to follow him. You are never entitled to privacy in a public place, and, no matter how much you may want to be left alone, no one is required to give you any privacy. In a public place, you can follow someone as much as you want and still be well within your rights. You could walk 2 feet behind someone while goosestepping and making fun of their weight, and you wouldn't be infringing on their rights or breaking any laws. If they would like you to give them some privacy, they can try to convince you to go away, or they could escape to a private place, or if they were worried you might try to harm them or otherwise infringe on their rights in the future, they could call 911. But no matter how much they want to be left the fuck alone, physical assault is never justified. No matter how his actions may have been interpreted, Zimmerman never did anything wrong when he chose to follow Treyvon, just as he was not at fault for being unprepared for a physical altercation. I'll never understand how someone could find themselves in a perfectly legal, non-confrontational situation with another person like Trayvon did with Zimmerman, and find an abrupt jump to violence like that to be a perfectly reasonable reaction.
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Ant's reasoning is based solely on loving guns and hating black people. You are either wildly naive about him, or are deliberately ignoring plan reality.
Dumb ass thought he'd blindside some citizen for the fun of it, and got himself killed. That was private property Travon was prowling around on, he didn't have any legitimate reason to be there. Then when Zim was messing up his plans for stealing some stuff Travon decided to mess him up, Zim had every right to defend himself. You don't have to let a animal beat on you.
douglas787 how is it neighborhood private property ? Explain. If its a private neighborhood it would've had a gate around it. Also its not against to law to go down a street you don't live on. If thats the case everyone would be arrested for not living where they're travling through.
hahahah. It just got way funnier that Jimmy said to Ant, "I don't see you getting caught in a situation where a guy doesn't know you have a gun on a dark street and starts hitting you". Well, he was right about the "guy" part.
Regardless of who you agree with, this conversation is a million times better than any discussion you see on the news with people yelling over each other
Fast forward a year later, knowing Ant was armed and his confrontation in Times Square, and the fact that he didn't show his gun like Jimmy says GZ should have, shows Ant was absolutely correct, and why Jimmy should never own a gun. Now... I wish Ant wouldn't have gone on Twitter.... but still.
Ironic how Jimmy tells Ant that he couldn't see him being caught in a situation like that, but a year later, Anthony "followed" a black chick, who then ran up on him and assaulted him and never did he even hint that he had a gun. I know it's MUCH different than TM and GZ, but it kinda goes to show that you just dont go to the gun in fear of something escalating, you go when in fear for life. I love Jimmy, but it's embarrassing how wrong he.
Zimmerman might have over reacted but he was legally sound. Martin escalated the situation and paid the price. The entire thing became a gun debate too which pisses me off.
I'm surprised Ant didn't mention that George Zimmerman WAS correct in his assessment of what kind of person that he was alarmed by. No he wasn't a house thief, but he WAS the type of person to assault someone for nothing. Being followed? Gosh, thank God Trayvon didn't live in a metropolis... people are behind you all the time.
How hilarious is it that the whole "getting beaten up by an unarmed stranger who doesn't realise you're carrying" thing happened to Ant with a streetwalker and led to his firing? Then Jimmy gives him kudos for not going full Zimmerman and admitting he wouldn't have had the same restraint. Feels like time travelling how we get to chuckle at the irony of an otherwise insignificant political conversation.
Trayvon did not have to go home. He could have walk around that neighborhood 20 times if he wanted to. He has the right to walk around with being harass. I have been follow before going home, it is one of the most scariest things ever. And my first notion is to not let this guy know where I live! THAT WAS NUMBER 1!!
true. but Trayvon shouldn't also have immediately jumped to violence too. you never know who is crazy out there, and people on the receiving end of your "justified" beating never know if you aren't going to try to murder them by stomping their head.
Love Jimmy having an argument that isn't the discussion... yes Jim... cops are better trained than normal people. The first time he said it an Anthony agreed. He didn't need to keep going for 15 mins.
Jimmy's arguments were really weak. Everytime he referenced Zimmerman, he had to call him a wannabe cop or a dummy. Which indicates his arguments are emotional rather than rational. Having a gun doesn't make you omnipotent. Zimmerman got jumped by a violent person. He only had fractions of a second to react. It doesn't make him a dummy.
Listening to Jimi talk about how George Zimmerman should have handled himself with a pistol is aggravating. This is obviously a New York dude who's never carried a gun or handled one does not understand the law you can't just brandish it at somebody he wouldn't have his hand on the gun it was concealed in the first place is not wearing it on his hip like a cop. Weather Zimmerman should have been in that situation in the first place is a whole nother story
...and every time i hear him say "these assholes they always get away" i just feel in my gut that he was prepared to do something foolish but thats just me
For anyone here who is defending Jim's opinion....did any of you actually see the pictures of Zimmerman's head when he was brought into the police station? Those pictures SCREAM "self-defense"....if those wounds had gotten any worse he could have easily died.
@danhagen How about not playing tough guy, acting like he is Martin Riggs, following a guy in the dark after being specifically told to NOT follow him? How about not needing "self defense" if he would have behaved as he should have and was told to?
Incredibly topical, current situation.. very polarizing.. everyone had an opinion.. Opie was silent the entire time. He added literally nothing to this show on a daily basis.
Ant needs to stfu about "Zimmerman called the police." Yeah, Ant, and THE POLICE TOLD HIM TO *NOT* FOLLOW THE PERSON. He ignored the instructions and did wtf he wanted. Zimmerman WANTED a confrontation. HE caused the death.
I love Ant's comedy, but his inability to accept at least some of Jimmy's argument is crazy. There are only two people that know what happened that night, and one of them is dead and can't tell their side of the story, so any opinion, speculation, scenario, or theory from an outside party is going to be littered with that person's bias. What I think happened that night...a battle of egos gone terribly wrong. Both people wanted to be a hero(in their own right)...Zimmerman wanted to catch a criminal, and Martin wasn't going to be punked by some white guy. We were/are teenagers at some point, and are influenced by coolness and peer pressure...and when we look back, we realize how goofy we were trying to earn stripes for some dumb reason. Everyone is a genius when looking back at a mistake and thinking "damn I could have done this instead of that".
you can also tell the tone difference. Jimmy is talking in a nuanced, neutral tone to a guy who he spends 5 days a week hanging out. Anthony instantly goes high decibel, emotional.
Jimmy, I love you to death, you are amazing (And I know jimmy will NEVER see this) But if you pull your gun, and show it, it's called Brandishing, and is a crime.
The guy was following a man at night time, unannounced. That would piss anyone off and make you want to confront them. He should’ve called the police and waited for them. You don’t own the neighbourhood, let the police do their job. Protect your house and your belongings but don’t play vigilante thinking you’re serving the neighbourhood. I could give two shits about the colour of each person, the point still stands.
Right... Treyvon certainly played no role in his own demise. Not saying Zimmerman isn't guilty of anything, but evidence does appear to show that Treyvon attacked Zimmerman first, out of nowhere.
The evidence 100% showed that Zimmerman deliberately followed around a total stranger in the dark after being told by the police to NOT follow him, and ended up shooting and killing an unarmed person who had been doing nothing wrong.
There's a giant hole in this story. I would like to know what happened before the altercation. I know if someone is following me, I'm turning my defenses up 100%, I don't know if he is going to assault me or not, but I'm running full speed away from that person.
Wow. Jimmy said he should have drawn his gun immediately more or less. The fact he didn’t shows that he was in the right. You know a great way to show you’re not a threat? To call the cops yourself or to say politely to the guy “hey man is everything okay? Why are you following me?” Not to beat his ass
If you’re not a cop and you see a suspected crime, you call the police and detail where and what you saw then walk in the opposite direction. Plain and simple. “Neighborhood watch” means literally that.
9:04 THIS is the main problem with Anthony. He's a racist and he can't even empathize with someone who was being stalked and killed. Glad his career is over.
@@w12ath040211 so you're justifying the murder of someone who was defending themselves against a crazed, racist stalker? You need to go outside and touch the grass. You're not in touch with reality.
@@pffilms2522 Trayvon punched zimmerman, zimmerman shot Trayvon, in that order. What's confusing about that? I'm not justifying it btw, it is just objectively. The natural right to defend yourself against an attacker is not morally ambiguous.
Anthony says Zimmerman was getting his head smashed into the sidewalk . . . anyone seen the pictures of a dead Trayvon? No sidewalk around. He died on grass. So unless he rolled 20 feet from the sidewalk after a mortal shot, it is impossible for him to be on a completely grassed area. Something the prosecution failed question in the story by the defense. Regardless of the racism or prejudice against Martin, it was a failure by the prosecution. People were able to say OJ did it, but few people (outside of my friends thankfully) are able admit that Zimmerman was the likely aggressor. I wonder how his head got a little cut but he probably hit on the top of car door when he jumped out to pursue the kid.
***** John Good testify that he did not see Zimmerman and his head touch the concrete. Was their any other witness who actually seen his head hit the concrete. You said marks on his head. He did not receive any brain damage at all, no concussion. Did he even have a headache? Those marks could have been backing his head in the bush or while on the ground his head could have hit rocks? The man require to 2 bandaids. All hitting the head on the concrete is just speculation. Also it don't hurt to have a shave head.
Dexter Buchanan I can't see mousebudden's comment. Apparently you scared him off and he removed it. But thank you. You are correct, there is no evidence what so ever of a sidewalk head smashing. I would think there would be blood evidence on the sidewalk.
It's hard smashing someone's head when there is hair to pull, plus Trayvon fingers would have been bruise. Those injuries could have happen by hitting his head on rocks in the grass. I mean something that did not require one stitch tells you that injury was very minor.
Precisely, security at Walmart or any other store aren't packing. They are trained to physically restrain, if possible, without being harmed until police arrive.
@ahiai barnes You're right. He should've been locked up for not being guilty of the crime he was charged with. Meanwhile one of your kind would've no doubt gunned Trayvon down eventually or he would've gunned down another black person and went to prison. In which case, you would've never heard of his name or give two fucks about him. BLACK LIVES MATTER...(only when they are taken by a non-black person) Hypocrite.
By Jimmy’s logic Zimmerman is even less guilty or at fault. Jimmy says that he was completely unprepared or unqualified to take the actions he did, and that he was a dope for letting Trayvon get the jump on him. If that’s the case then it completely exonerates Zimmerman because it means he’s an unsuspecting victim of an ambush attack. Ant is arguing that Zimmerman was adequately prepared and that his actions were properly assertive - which would mean that Zimmerman is more culpable in anything. So for Jimmy to lay out his logic and then to claim that Zimmerman is in the wrong is just beyond reason.
Commonsense on either side could have avoided all of this. I don't think Zimmerman was some racist looking for blacks to murder, I think he was some incompetent Barney Fife with delusions of being an 80's action hero. Zimmerman called the cops and was told to let them handle it, which he refused to do like some dumb ass. Failing to have listened to the cops, this was still avoidable. Even if Trayvon were a thief, Zimmerman introducing himself from a safe distance would have been enough to detour most thieves, as their element of surprise was broken. You would think even an armed thief would walk rather than invite the attention a murder would bring, just so he could get caught breaking in a home right after. That said, Trayvon should have simply turned around and asked "Who the are you?", and explain where he was headed after seeing it was only neighborhood watch.
He got shot WHILE he was beating up George Zimmerman... thats what I know, with as much certainty possible in a situation like this because nobody has disproved this part
Anthony criticizes Jimmy for as he puts it "getting his news from the news", where does Ant get his information? No one knows what happened, why is Ant so sure he knows exactly how it happened?
Jimmy is going off of what he heard on the news plus what he feel like should of happened or might have happened. Ant is going off of what he heard on the news plus what the laws are and what is legal vs illegal.
listen up! if gz's jacket was zipped up and gz lay flat on his back ther's no way sides of it can move. i made an experiment. i hav a jacket w a zipper. so i put it on, zipped it up, lay flat on my back & then sidled, slid, slithered for a 20 secs or so & neither side of the jacket moved a bit. this wld prove that tm h not seen the gun previous to gz pulling it. & and if gz jacket was open, then, tm may hav seen it long before he was shot. this fact will sink gz: jacket cld not move!
Even though witnesses disprove George's account of the situation? The fight was on the grass, no head banging, no threat against his life. Just a threat against his pride.
This whole scenario can be summed up with, if you feel you're life is in danger you have the right to defend yourself. Therfore both Martin and Zimmerman are guilty of multiple wrongs. Trayvon should have gone inside and locked his door. Zimmerman shouldn't have followed trayvon at all. In a perfect world both men would still be alive and well talking shit about one another because of that night Zimmerman called the cops on a black man buying fruity snacks.
So he tried to buy a few swisher sweets and that's important to the whole situation how? and I wasn't taking either mans side here. Just pointing out how neither one of them handled the situation correctly and someone got killed over it. Mental history or use of marijuana doesn't mean the kid needed to be killed...Trayvon at the same time should have just gone home and locked the door. Zimmerman was well with in his rights to kill trayvon the moment he was being assaulted... zimmerman shouldn't have followed the kid in the first place but if both men were level headed this would have never happened at all .. its a catch 22 of sorts and i love how morons like you can't see that while spouting bullshit like the post above. Do you feel superior to everyone because you're clearly such a squeaky clean individual yourself..wonder whats hidden deep within your harddrive...some files marked "for uncle pauls eyes only"
He had stolen goods in his locker. How about maybe Travon not someone’s head into the pavement and he wouldn’t be dead. Every time this crap happens. The black boy can do nuffen wrong while other guy has to ace the situation. Gotta be perfect in all your decisions
Didn't even know Opie was there until 34:00 mins in... It's too bad these guys didn't get paid by the word so opie would be as rich as he deserves to be which is not at all
Zimmerman wouldn't have shot me, not because of my appearance, shit we share some ethnic dna similarities, but the manner, maybe im an adult, even as a 17 year old I would have diffused, used words, gageing the depth of the other persons crazy level.
i like to think that i'm not taking sides--i judge the sit'n only on facts. mind u, so far, i know only a few facts. fbi must have more, i assume. most of the time when i take a guess, i try to remember to posit it as such and not as a fact. eg, i suggest gz had a MOTIVE that eve. but which? jury will want to find out y tm picked on an innocent teen [and black, to boot] i think gz wanted to play hero by delivering the boy to police. but that's only a theory.
Regardless of who you like of dislike, if you accept as what happened what these guys do, then it was legal self defense. The law says that if you're facing imminent bodily harm then you can protect yourself with deadly force.
jimmy got owned in this argument. Ant is absolutely right. it's too bad someone died, but they can't get zimmerman on 2nd degree murder. this is classic self defense.
question to all the GZ supporters.. if its true that TM was covering his mouth yelling at him "shut the fuck up" (tm was yelling in gz's own words) then why can't we hear him saying that on the 911 call? was he whispering it in his ear?? and how was gz nose bloody & being covered by tm but none of gz blood/dna found on tm?????
