i study flamenco vocals n in flamenco you repeat the songs and lyrics from ancient times so many others have sang them in the past. good singers imitate at first but then progress to create their art n style which can be done through technique, voice metal, spirit,.. if you imitate you aint got no soul artistically speaking
Methaney was right: nobody will do Jaco better than Jaco. Once I was drinking with Jaco in a bar in the Village. Out of the blue, he told me that even though he told people he like to party and take chances, he wanted to quit drinking and doing drugs, but didn't know how. At the time I was struggling with the same problem (I'm 26 years clean now). I felt helpless; I wanted to help him, but couldn't.
Thanks so much for sharing this encounter...i saw Jaco w/Joni Mitchell in '79, which is still the most profound musical experience I've ever witnessed....& then in '87, while i was doing club dates myself, ran into a high school bud who told me that Jaco was dead; beat to death in a bar...i couldn't (& didn't want to) believe it...what a terrible disease addiction is, and has taken so many of the greatest talents...so awesome you're clean...
I have a particular dislike for most addicts because of the damage they’ve done to my life and to the world, because they’re often narcissistic sociopaths, but sometimes addicts really are the victims of the drunk sociopaths around them. I’ve studied the personality disorders and I can say with confidence that Jaco wasn’t at all narcissistic, but he had the opposite problem of having ‘damaged narcissism,’ which is probably why he would often be self-depricating to a fault, and probably why he pushed himself so hard. In my opinion, he needed rehab with a trauma specialist, and to be away from his bass for a year or so. Jaco needed a vacation, in my opinion - to go on the wagon and get his life in order, but I can understand why he didn’t. I think maybe the real addiction in him wasn’t drugs - it was musical mastery, and that’s a lot to deal with.
Man and woman in England developed a “cure” for heroin with a device you clip to your ear and it vibrates! They helped out Eric Clapton boy George Keith Richards and Keith moon was there and they were Christians, and they witnessed to the guys about Jesus and hopefully Keith moon accepted Jesus before he died because in his biography, the chapter before he died, the last sentence says “you need Jesus,” He goes “ yeah but how do I find him!?” Jesus has all power and authority over everything and blaming the ills of the world is blaming the wrong God, Satan is the god of this world!
@@Bikewithlove Jaco was bipolar and untreated. He wasn’t always into drugs and alcohol but that sent him spiraling further down. The man needed help, but no one could help him. He didn’t deserve to get beaten to death, and the guy basically got off with four months served for killing him.
Jaco sounded like Jaco because he WASN'T copying anybody else. Like all great artists. he took what came before him, combining many DIFFERENT styles, and made his own style out of that. I believe Les Paul himself said it best: "When you steal from ONE it's PLAGIARISM, when you steal from MANY it's RESEARCH."
This reminds me of how when Jimi Hendrix came, basically every guitarist started to try to mimic his style and abilities, then all of a sudden Led Zeppelin comes out with Jimmy Page doing his own thing blowing everyone's mind yet again. This is in a rock sense of course for rock music XD
LinkBulletBill I heard Page first, and liked him. Then I heard Jimi, and he left Jimmy in the dust, although I still do like Zep. Jimi was just worlds better in my book.
Greg Vinson Idk why as a musician I prefer the music of Led Zeppelin and the playing of Jimmy Page than Hendrix, yet a slight preference though. Led Zep as a band was solid, and they worked it in a way that blew me away. Hendrix's playing is something too. I hope you can understand me xD
LinkBulletBill The thing about Zeppelin's success is that it's very much a collaborative effort, for example listen to Black Dog and take away all the instruments except the guitar, now all you have is a badass riff but without those drums man.. playing on those first 4 notes of the riff... you get me? The song is just nowhere neeeeeeaar as effective as it is without the whole band. Jimmy had great ideas with the guitar at the time, all the tunings he used, I don't reckon Hendrix was as diverse as Page when it comes to the guitar and it's potential. But of course Hendrix was absolutely great in his own right and how he discovered his method.
Jaco played in disciplined Top 40/Funk commercial bands, 6 nights a week, 4 to 6 sets a night for YEARS, BEFORE he became the Wizard soloist of the Fretless bass. What I've observed as a professional drummer/band leader/producer in the last 42 years of my career, is that so many bassist want to go to that 'FREE' place that Jaco was so beautiful at, but they don't get the incredible discipline that combined with his obvious genius that made it so that ,whatever he did, it not only was beautiful Melodically and Harmonically, but it grooved it's motherf*cking ass off ALWAYS. That's what's missing from the Jaco clones who don't get it, if you ask me (lol, of course, no one did, but I felt compelled to mention it). People always want to skip to the brilliant and the genius and they forget about the 10,000 hours to mastery formula, which really works!
For real. I was thinking this same (similar) thought the other day. Jaco had it all, his ability to compose, his innovativeness with harmonics, his melodies, his chops, and the list goes on and on. One thing which is overlooked is his ability to groove and shape a song from the inside out. If your ears are listening very closely you can actually hear it in pretty much any song he ever played but for the most part, you feel it if you're not actively looking for it, hence the word "groove". When you feel it you don't necessarily acknowledge it directly. You acknowledge the piece sounds amazing on account of melody, tone etc. but the groove is hidden away doing more for the tune than what meets the ears. It is certainly there if you really search for it but to decipher what exactly is happening is beyond replicable. It is easy to hear melody and tone. It is easy to replicate melody and tone. But to discern, let alone replicate, such nuanced groove is a hell of a task. I've never heard a Jaco cover that was 100%, always missing some nuanced groove/feel. I know you know what I'm talking about, I thought I'd try to put it into more words for others.
exactly, I kind of went that route as well, I played keyboards all the time, both in a local group, and every morning and sometimes evening with the highschool stage band, and with a buddy of mine who recorded on his portastudio, and out of the hours and hours of playing, you know, you become pretty proficient.
this is so true, and it goes for almost any artist, regardless of discipline...what should be mentioned that in addition to his amazing talent, hearing him live was just mind blowing.. I heard him play in Osaka, Japan back in 1982 with his big band and Toots Thielemans..after Toots came on and sat on a barstool and crushed a funky tune with Jako, the crowd went wild and the other 30 guys woke up and they all ripped a hole in the sky that burned like the sun. I listen to Jako and others all the time but there is nothing that comes close to that experience...even the Weather Report at the Whiskey in LA was even close...
You have to know where you are as you go too. When I only had like 4-5 years of playing behind me I started believing I could play anything that comes to mind, so I played badly quite often. It's been 18 years now and I've toned down the complexity a bit in general, but I like how I sound. If anyone's thinking of getting greedy - this only served me well in the punk band where bad playing actually sounded better for the songs. It's not just putting in the hours but also pacing yourself. I'm sure that, for example, playing bpm's I wasn't ready for slowed me down a bit as a teenager. Or maybe just have fun, I have no idea.
@@SkateSka Your point "It's not just putting in the hours" needs to be included every time anyone mentions the '10,000 hours to mastery formula'. 10,000 of noodling won't get you there but ongoing desire and action to improve will.
I agree . Many record anothers song , and everyone say's the new guy is better . Many have painted the Mona Lisa , yet only one painted it,,created it ...
I was thinking the same thing about Grant Green and Jerry Garcia...you can spend a lifetime studying these amazing artists body of work and never come close to producing that unique sound we all love. It is their soul print, that can't be replicated. The good news is we all have our own so build on it and enjoy the fact that nobody else will sound like you.
There was one Charlie Parker, there was one Miles Davis, there was one Mingus, there was one Jaco. Nuff said. These men were players, composers, conductors who found a voice for their SOULS. There is plenty of territory left for remaining souls, and my advice would be to EXPLORE.
"There was one Charlie Parker, there was one Miles Davis, there was one Mingus, there was one Jaco." What you wrote, here, reminds me of when, a little over a decade ago, I went to a Sonny Rollins concert, and the announcer said something along the lines of, "There was Bird. There was Monk. There was Miles. There IS Sonny!"
I was walking out of the Mass Ave building (Berklee) back in 1973 or so. This was Pat's comment about Jaco, "He's going to be the Bird (Charlie Parker) of the Bass, he's that good".
Philip Chen Actually I started there in winter of '74 doing 1-2 and then 3-4. All that study before I moved to Boston paid off. I stopped going at the end of fall 77.
@@znmaf we are all connected and there is a wealth of interpretation showing one how to soar. But when its time to fly, YOU decide how far, how high, the destination and how much of your secret do you wish to reveal.
Pat knows, and there will never be another Metheny either. Jaco inspired multiple generations of bass players, which is so awesome. He redefined the instrument forever , and his unique genius is unquestionable.
@@jeffmorrison5695 Oh, forgive me Jeff, I used the wrong article..."a voice..." is that better? Have you ever even listened to Pat's lectures and commentaries on every aspect of music and musicians? Have you studied them? And from your lofty, unlimited viewpoint, which 'voices' would give similar or higher credit to?
@@jeffmorrison5695 And for some reason, you don't think one can do and fully inhabit both?...like, Pat, for instance? You seem to compulsively generate asinine, uninformed opinions for the sake of trying to one-up someone you know nothing about. Is it that darn pathological narcissism acting up again or is it just because you are a frustrated and failed musician and are trying to eek out some form of random authority where no one can actually test you?
@tracy Smith there's alot of guitar players better than hendrix... its really all up to preference and no one is cut and dry better when we get into these level of performers
@tracy Smith Dude its a damn opinion, but you want me to name a few, Frank Zappa, Robert Fripp, Steve Howe. Whats funny is all of them are incredible and not one of them would ever claim to be better than the other, and none of them are.
I used to turn on all the little high school bass players my kids brought home, to Don Juan's Reckless Daughter...I would put on "Talk to Me" and watch their jaws hit the floor...but it is all good, a couple went out and bought the album, one boy actually started working on fretless bass. That album is 35+ years old and I still can't get enough of it...besides Mitchell's brilliant wordscapes, Jaco turns his bass inside out, gets every tone you can think of, from sub-octave stuff to the sound of a trombone...
Me too! The players were all made for each other on this album! Very complimentary styles and sounds. Genius on their part! In that sense a masterpiece, for sure. I'm so glad that was captured on this unforgettable album!
Aside from Pat's great phrasing and musicality, it was his guitar sound that truly propelled him to the jazz guitar stratosphere along with that still amazing Roland GR-300 guitar synth sound he used on "Are You Going With Me?"
I was totally smitten by Jaco when he first came out , haunted by his unique sound that I couldnt quite place. Then I walked into the apartment of a ladyfriend of mine who was into classical music, and Pablo Casals was playing cello, and it all made sense.
John C ...Most of us from the great USA don't use the metric system and have a huge dislike for it. We like the Imperial system.They're both just measurements and neither is better than the other.
Mr. Black I know! I’ve never cried over a celebrity death either. The closest I came to crying was when Vince Flynn (my favorite author) died. If Pat Metheny had died, I’d be a basket case! I love his music so much. It’s kinda morbid, but I’ve told my children to play his music at my memorial service when I die. I’m convinced that if there is a happy afterlife, Pat Metheny’s music is played there. I hope that’s where Lyle is. RIP, Mr. Mays.
@@gwendolynbien-aime1536 keep in mind pat's music has always been skinned by lyle's majestic composition structure and unique improvisation. Truly one of a kind.
As Joni Mitchell once said, " No one ever went up to Van Gogh and said, paint A Starry Night again man! He painted it, that was it." Thank You Pat, I completely agree.
Imitation is a useful tool when you’re learning an instrument, especially if you don’t have a real teacher. It can help develop your musical vocabulary. If you play bass, and try to play like Jaco, then good on ya. You will probably learn something. The key is to take all the bits and pieces from all your influences, and then make those things your own. Discover who you are, and what your musical voice sounds like. Similar to Jaco, there’s a lot of Geddy imitators as well and it makes sense; these were/are talented, unique sounding dudes who were bound to inspire others. Imitate and learn, then move on and make your own way.
Yes your favorites are like intuitive guides that define a direction you are attracted to or become a marker, so to speak, that lead you to your own voice and from there into the future with it. Yes the idea is not to become better than whomever is influencing you (its not a competition) but to let them guide you to yourself. A great example of that is on the Layla album with Derek and the Dominoes. You will be hearing Eric Clapton and Duane Allman inspiring each other. The love of the music itself. There's no competition here! And that is what makes a great musician.
I'd rather think of Jaco LIKE Hendrix: he evolved the instrument by "miles". No, imitators are never going to "do the Jaco thing", but the point is they're evidence of Jaco's huge influence of how he affected the state of the electric bass. Like Hendrix, he was also a phenomenal composer and performer, but his evolutionary impact is what he'll be remembered for, primarily.
Oh, stfu. To compare Jaco to Jimi is an insult to Jaco. Jaco could walk in circles around Jimi, when it came to knowledge of applied music theory. Jimi even stated that he knew nothing of reading, or writing music, yet Jaco openly declared that he was a reader and writer of actual musical notation.
I've heard several interviews with Pat and he always bottom-lines it in a great way and cuts through the b.s. I've always loved, adored, his music and when I read or hear things he has to say I respect him even more. Here he didn't proclaim outright his deep love for Jaco but I feel it emanating from him. I don't think I would have really discovered Jaco if it weren't for Pat Metheny.
People can diss Metheny but he is right: Jaco was a musical force of nature like Charlie Parker or Louis Armstrong or Jimi Hendrix--not likely to be repeated, at least not within our lifetimes.
@@kevinismawayoflife4660 Duh. Someone disses Pat Metheny every seven to ten minutes. Look it up. (BTW: To ask if people diss Pat Metheny is to diss Pat Metheny. I urge you to retract your question and thereby disdiss Pat Metheny.)
Thats because not only is Jaco brilliant, but he had found a way to let each note he played speak for him, represent him, revealing a part of his soul and also our flux as we move through human life.
Jaco is one of my top two electric bassist of all time, the other being the Brazilian Godfather of bass Luizão Maia.. No one can ever "be" anyone else... Great musicians are able to display their own soul.. and since each soul is unique, it's impossible to duplicate... WITH THAT SAID, there are 3 bassist that I have listened to consistently over the years that made me turn my head a little thinking of Jaco. The first has the genetic gifts, his own son Felix (he does a lot of Wooten/Marcus Miller stuff, but when he sticks to just tonality he sounds awfully a lot like is dad). The second would be a young Victor Bailey (R.I.P.) his first record or two with Weather Report gave me some definite Jaco vibes.. Finally, the bassist who most reminds me of Jaco is Tetsuo Sakurai formerly of Cassiopeia, this Japanese brother has CHOPS!! Definitely the closest to Jaco that I've heard. Check out "Time Limit" by Cassiopeia, you will hear it ;o)
Victor Bailey may be the best sounding bassist since Jaco, I think. He has that rare transcendent element too. I also love Oteil Burbridge and Janek Gwizdala.
I played in a band with JACO protégé for years, doing top 40, funk, disco, rock, jazz, R&B and it was the most enjoyable time of my professional career. As a drummer, I've mastered Rush, VH, Led Zepplin, but honestly, playing funky 70's and 80's music made me feel great. He and I were the kings of improvs. I'd start a beat, he'd come in, and we'd go off on a funky journey that everyone would think was already an existing song. He really admired Jaco and his style was much like his, which I really enjoyed grooving with.
joefunk76 I agree, I’ve been confused for 20 years how Lagrene can sound like that. And that live cover of I Shot The Sheriff, the bass solo and also guitar is nuts. Other unbelievable live gem is with Hiram Bullock, Teen Town live on that bootleg NYC recording. The group jamming and sound is NOT LIKE anything else on record.
There's a kernel of truth to this...don't make it your goal to BE someone else musically...at the same time, imitating what you hear is part of being better at your craft, and this is what most musicians have done at some point...eventually, (hopefully) we assimilate those influences, and arrive at our own musical style and voice...
There is NO WAY any jazz or electric bass player could just move on! Could ANY saxophone player just "move on" from Charlie Parker or John Coltrane? Pat was/is innovative in his own way, just not as influential or innovative on his instrument as Jaco was and still is. This sounds more like ego talking to me. Pat does not do Wes Montgomery as well as Wes, but he pushed on. So Pat, I say to you, all these bass guys should have the same opportunity to explore, emulate, copy and steal from ANY source, just as Jaco and everybody else does. As you did!
+brianderek It's about creating your own voice. It's not so much the notes you play, it's how you construct them in your "vocab" as an improviser. it's one thing to take ideas and mold them into something fresh, innovative and original. But to directly steal riffs & licks and play them without any context of personal connection is different. So ya, move on. Learn from those transcriptions, but move on from them, create your own voice.
Well said. It's actually funny seeing you in the comments. I've heard you play in real life and you've blown me away every time. I was the bass player for North Sides Jazz band throughout my high school years. (currently a sophomore at ball state next semester). I respect your opinion on Jaco and agree with you 100%.
CooManTunes Well, well, well, LMAO!!! I'm sorry you couldn't do withOUT the word just that once, GotDANNIT!!! Thanks for the laugh. And I'm thinkin pleximanic is wise to not try to approach JP.
Jaco was an original, like Charlie Parker, Coltrane, Miles, Carl Fontana, Louis Armstrong, etc. Its impossible to completely duplicate what they all did, but what they each gave us builds on the future of the instrument each one played. Electric bass was forever changed after Jaco.
***** But the point is that is impossible. Jaco was a great artist, just as original as Van Gogh. Nobody who understands art would talk of someone "ripping out" Van Gogh paintings "way better". Jaco's music was original, and died with him. Just like Jimi. The fact that people can duplicate their riffs or play faster means nothing, and takes nothing away from the immense value of their artistic statements, a value you have yet to grasp, judging by your comment.
Part of what you're saying, I agree with, but I think you misunderstood me, and why I disagreed with you. I didn't remotely imply that nobody equally significant and wonderful exists now or will in the future, or that I long for some past time period when "music was great"; it is still, and always will be, and more amazing talent will arise as long as there is a human race. I don't equate greatness with the past, or with fame at all, but at the same time, I appreciate many of the greats of the past, all the way back to JS Bach, and it's ridiculous to speak of someone in the future nullifying their greatness; we are talking music, not sports, although even in sports, Roger Bannister's record setting achievement, although I believe it stood only briefly, is still remembered and appreciated. While fame and greatness often don't intersect, my point would more likely land if I used examples like Jimi, who most people recognize, than say, U Srinivas, who is a contemporary prodigy far fewer people would recognize. Nobody in the future is going to take anything away from Srinivas, or Jimi, or any other great artist, just because they can do a cleaner version of "Hey Joe", or play faster blues riffs on "Red House", or whatever. By the same token, Jaco's performance on "Heavy Weather" will still be his own beautiful statement, regardless whether someone plays it "better". Nobody is going to come along and write a better Steinbeck novel, or be a better Jaco; his contributions will be there for those who appreciate such things, and most good bassists today recognize that they stand on his shoulders in many ways. We may all have a spark of originality, but that doesn't mean we are all worth listening to, unless you're a friend or family member. Some people have extraordinary talent, like Jaco, or are well organized and work very hard on a clear vision, like Robert Fripp, and it takes some combination of either talent or a lot of work, or (usually) both to produce great art. It takes a lot of work to play copies that might be as good or better than the original too, but it isn't art; it's skill without the creativity of an original artist.
***** you are missing the point, nothing to do with putting people on pedestal, the fact is, the guy has gone down in music history for his contribution to the evolution of bass playing, there is more to such an achievement than being a "great" player or being "better" that someone else, he was widely acknowledged at the time as being a revolutionary bass player, and his influence on bass playing is comparable to the influence Bird or Coltrane had on saxophonists. There are some truly awesome bassists around today, and they are technically superior to Jaco, but will they have as big an impact on others? I'm not so sure they will, because people will keep looking back, looking for something special, something that transcends the mere "playing" of an instrument.
Pat and Jaco were coming up at a time where there was a lot of opportunity to play gigs And lots of wide open territory to develop your own voice or sound. Trickledown economics was not in play. So making it before 1980 It Was a huge advantage. Apartments in Manhattan were affordable. If pat and jaco were coming up today? I am not sure they would make it. When opportunity to play and the standard is low And you have what it takes? You could become a legend. John Lennon said We were lucky because we were kids, with no experience, weren’t that good and the Germans didn’t know rock and roll😝 we could grow and improve in every way. Today the standard is so high if you can sound like Pat or Jaco or Miles or Bill Evans? Or Bird? Coltrane? Thank God!😀
It's true, and I often think about how these changes in the way we experience music affect the development of young musicians. Kids today have other advantages, they can listen to nearly infinite amounts of music from all times and places whenever they want. They can collaborate online. But they're playing more for their teachers, friends, anonymous online listeners, or just alone in their room, than for live audiences. It's more difficult than ever to make a living as a musician, I think--for most it will have to be something they find time for in their spare time. They don't have the same opportunity to get the kind of real-time, visceral feedback you get from a live audience. I think this must affect the kind of musician they become. Although I'm not sure, I suspect it might lead to musicians who are able to make use of a wider variety of styles and influences, but who are less able to shape and develop their own unique sound and voice. In other words, musicians whose knowledge and skills are broad, but not deep.
elhombresfbay ...The prices of apartments were just as unaffordable then as they are now. Economics was always in play and still is . They were lucky and the Cream did rise to the top. I can't say if they'd make it or not... I'm not prophetic' but I. Pretty sure they would.. There is something that has made the music industry Very Different. Everybody has a Daw and can get their music out there, no matter what any damn record company thinks. I'm not sure if this is bad or good. Most of the unsigned bands putting out albums, think that they don't need producers, engineers and someone that knows how to mix it to perfection . 90% of the great studios have closed . No one wants to sign anyone .
in australia we had a girl who couldnt play any instrument before a year 2 ago and she had a worldwide hit with "dance monkey"..talent has nothing to do with making it in music, its just a lottery and luck, always has been, probably more chance of winning the lottery than making it in music however
Well, he's right. It's not even a matter or who's best because once a player reaches a certain status, there is no best and it's all a matter of personal preference. Jaco was never my favorite, but he had his style and, being a bassist for 25-30 years myself, I have never come across another player who sounds like him no matter how hard they try. And they do try. A very unique individual and player with his own personal approach who added so much to the world of bass. He made a difference and I think that's the biggest compliment I can give him.
I used to practice bass religiously, until someone said I was trying to sound like Jaco. Unfortunately, my heroes were and are Stanley Clarke, Bootsy Collins, Larry Graham, Verdine White, and Steve Arrington. I never needed to copy Jaco and I never will need to copy Jaco.
Fundamentally, nobody is ever going to play exactly like anybody else. The point, however, is that by trying to seek a sound, you evolve in your own playing and sound. It doesn't really make sense to try to "just move on"....Move on to what? If somebody's playing is considered a pinnacle of achievement, then the idea is to try to achieve that pinnacle...then maybe you could move on to some other peak. As Leo Kottke once said, everybody when they begin playing plays "through" somebody else. Pat Metheny has noted that in his early playing he was strongly influenced by Wes Montgomery...well, there you go. Who doesn't have huge respect for Pat Metheny? This comment of his, however, doesn't really seem well thought out.
That's my kind of comment, what you wrote. Is he recommending that these "Jaco imitators" just stop doing what they enjoy doing--what they have likely spent much time and effort training themselves to be able to do? But why? Why should they? And what should they be doing, instead? One of the problems is that Pat doesn't really define what he means by "that", when, at the end of the clip, he says "nobody will ever do anything like that"; and what's more, he'd likely not be able to define it to anybody's satisfaction. I take him to mean really nothing more than to express, emotively, that no musician will ever take the special, Jaco-shaped place in his heart that Jaco takes in his heart. Which, though understandable and easy to empathize with, is really not all too informative a thing to say. I love Pat Metheny's music, and his guitar playing--just about more than any other music I can think of--and his smiling face and personality. But, if I, for whatever reason, want to try to play exactly like someone whose playing I love, why, anybody's necessarily gonna be preaching to a brick wall who tries to tell me not to. As it turns out, though, I don't really want to try to do that--and I'm far too lazy to try to do it, anyhow. Heck, it would be hard enough to perfectly imitate, say, Grant Green, even though Grant's playing is comparatively simple and easy to figure out, note for note. Not only that, but, I have never heard a single player (including all of my favorites) whose playing I'd want to perfectly emulate in its entirety, since, here and there, there'll inevitably be elements in their playing that, to my taste, ever so slightly mar their otherwise perfect ability. I have long been intrigued by the idea of, in guitar playing, trying more to emulate the sounds of experts at non-guitar instruments (especially sax or piano) than to base one's playing predominantly on one's favorite guitar players. I've seen a number of guitarists in jazz whom I admire extoll that idea. It would be funny to hear someone tell a guitarist who loves, say, Joe Henderson's tenor sax playing, "You should not try to emulate Joe's playing, since you'll never be able to sound exactly like him, anyway."
I am coming to the party very late as far as Jaco Pastorious is concerned, I just watched the documentary on Netflix and he was a very interesting guy to say the least. I think what Pat Metheney says is true, just move on. There will only be one Jaco, one Jimi and one Bonham etc. I think every generation is going to have that one person who comes along and changes how you approach an instrument and turns it on it's head, they are out there they just need time to rise to the top.
Its never too late. We are like sponges in that everything we hear has made an impression on our souls the minute we hear it, even sounds and music we do not like. Letting artists influence us is never a bad thing. Musicians put it out there like a box of paints. You decide what color or shade you can make that reflect your innermost sensibilities. To copy a style or technique is just copying notes, a great learning tool, but after so much study and exploration, you will really want your own voice to put out there or you will always be interpreted as a parrot. But the nuances of those before you have already been recorded in your heart to draw inspiration from. Music is so beautiful.
Hey Dudes! Pat is Right On ! I’ve yet to hear anyone replicate the syncopated stanza that is so mesmerizing at the end of this tune. It just wants to make you jump, move and smile. I wish that it would keep repeating for another and another...till a fade-away... Dynomite 🕶 !
All due respect to all the greats of all the instruments, but if the current musicians keep getting blasted for playing notes of that the previous generational heroes played, we might as well all stop playing instruments and become sampling rappers. I am tired of being accused of "stealing" when in fact those whom I am accused of stealing from, actually got their influences (whether you like it or not and whether they admit it or not) from the greats of the generation before them. So, I keep practicing and no longer pay any heed to the critics.
Well, here's the thing about your dismissively ignorant "become sampling rappers" comment, I really don't think that Jaco Pastorius, Joni Mitchell, Bob Dylan nor Miles Davis would ever be able to do what become "sampling rappers" have done or still do. Secondly, your term, "sampling rappers", is wrong on its face and makes no sense and obviously, you know absolutely nothing about great rap music nor sampling. So, why don't you go listen to Lauryn Hill rap and SING GREAT, Queen Latifah RAP and SING JAZZ STANDARD GREAT and is a fin actress, Mos Def (aka Yasmin Bey) rap GREAT and watch HIS GREAT ACTING ABILITIES in the films like "Something The Lord Made", etc., listen to the masterful and powerful lyrical content of Black Thought and rapping ability with The Roots or the "Message" by Grand Master Flash and The Furious Five. "Sampling rappers", Sheesh! (smdh), what an ignorant comment. Why did Herbie Hancock come out with that hit tune "Rockit" and work with DST.., the turntable specialist?
Skin EyemIn ...Talk about ignorant comment. Never compare or equate anyone who plays with a turn table, samples or who raps... to an actual MUSICIAN who plays an instrument. It’s okay to like it. It’s art. That’s fine. But it’s nowhere near the craft of an actual musician or instrumentalist. Writing lyrics, reciting/speaking them monotone, cutting and pasting samples, sound fx, noises ...while a creative endeavor that you’re free to love and enjoy... is nowhere near the greats of Armstrong, Monk, Parker, Miles, Clifford, Sonny, Coltrane, Correa, Jarrett, Jaco, Metheny etc....producing expression of touch, tone, melody, harmony and rhythm from an understanding and mastery of a physical instrument designed to produce pitches of sound. Playing jazz is analogous to learning/speaking a language at a high level. Rap/hip hop etc is not. Like I said... nothing wrong with it. Its just not the same craft. At all.
@@Composer19691 It's crazy, I'll sit and deeply listen to the different approaches of Cannonball and Trane's respective solos on "All Blues" from Miles' "Kind Of Blue" album, then, I may closely listen to a 1920s recording of a Louis Armstrong singing and playing while laying the groundwork for the future of everything, analyze what seems to be a composed solo on the original version of Mingus' "Goodbye Pork Pie Hat", or, trying to convince myself that what Dexter Gordon was playing was easy until I started learning it, etc,, then, I'l' listen to the genius of Black Thought's, Rakim's or Mos Def's verses over hip beats connected by multiple genres of sampled beats, bass or violin lines. Then, I'll listen to a bebop solo my father played on a old recording, then, I'll listen to Hendrix soloing on a Band Of Gypsies live performance; it never occurred to me that each one of those individual performances or recordings were more or less superior to the other. So, there is no argument, there is only someone who has the ability to listen to different genres music and give equal levels level of respect, because, one actually listens. Maybe you only possess the ability to "hear" just traffic, another may have the ability to deeply listen to the traffic from the streets, on the sidewalks and from the bodegas behind those sidewalks.
very interesting statement from pat.......... i sort of agree............ you can not duplicate that........ you can only give tribute and respect....... so, so many great musicians have pass thru this world.............. God gives tremendous gifts to many............. let's learn and move forward from that......... (:
You reach a certain level in your playing where you develop/define who you are. It's no longer a matter of being "the next Jaco", but being "the first (me)". "Never be another Jaco" is like there'll never be another Squire, Graham, Geddy, Entwistle, Myung, Clarke, Harris, LaRue, ...
John Scofield also had a funny anecdote about Jaco. "How can you tell if someone is a country bumpkin? When they unearth their car when mowing their lawn. Jaco was a country bumpkin, I went to his place after a session and he cooked sausages in a can over an incense burner in his living room."
Well said Pat, as Jaco used to say rightly, he was the best bass player in the world! As hard as anyone may try, nobody will ever be able to play a quarter of half of what Jaco was... We miss you and love you Mr Pastorius, you really didn't deserve to leave so soon in the way it happend... ❤️
I agree. It’s just sooooo, painful listening to bass players try and imitate Jaco, it actually ruins the experience of looking for THEIR talent while also trying to cut through the noise of their “fake Jaco” efforts .....
I for one can't even come close to explaining my respect for Jaco. Amazing. But there was no education in music with Jimi. Very natural player without knowing theory of harmonies or having reading skills. He played from the heart and that was great also. Anybody who grabs respect from major contributors of music such as Miles and Gil Evans who were days from making an album with him but his untimely death prevented that. As far as saying one was ions ahead of each other may not be just that. Even though I think Jaco was beyond belief.
David Holliday Bob I appreciate your opinion (I may be a fool), but I did play with Jaco before weather report and I saw Jimi live and in my (foolish) opinion Jaco was eons ahead of Jimi and Jaco never set his bass on fire.
David Holliday Jimi clearly was great artist…drop the comparisons…anyone whose music lasts as long as Hedrix' has, especially with the fickle current population, is most likely headed for musical immortality. His music still speaks to me since I was a kid. No one is "eons ahead" of him. It was a foolish comment.
Robert Giles If you consider a player out of his head on LSD and walls of amps feeding back and on fire I guess compared to a true musical genius like Jaco ( who also was drug influenced) is just beyond me . I guess Jerry Lee Lewis should be compared to Herbie Handcok because I saw him set his piano on fire once also. Don't get me wrong I am not ragging on you personally I am just stated my opinion having played with Jaco and haveing met and seen Jimi live I stick to my beliefs..
Reducing a genius like Hendrix to a drugged out pyro lets me know all I need from you. Think I'll listen to Santana, Miles, and others who think he was great. He was. The amps were not on fire...why make shit up? The guitar was burned at the end of one concert but sure, you just spew out what you want.
He makes a good point in a way, but does not articulate another very valuable and related point: You learn from getting inside the playing of other people, and even... imitating. It’s not a crime. I did it. You did it. Metheny did it. You pick up licks, perspectives, musical pathways, ideas, etc... and helps your playing and ability grow and improve. The main thing is learn Jaco. Try to be Jaco. Give it all you’ve got. But don’t STOP with Jaco. Keep going. Find new and other things to keep inspiring you and helping you grow.
To say Jaco was the Jimi Hendrix of bass is an insult to Jaco. Jimi didn't know anything about music theory. Jaco was a wizard at everything that had to do with music because he actually STUDIED it. Love Jimi, but he's nothing like Jaco.
Justin Metcalfe It's stupid to dislike his music for that reason. People just should NOT compare the two. Jaco could run circles around Jimi when it comes to knowledge of musicianship and theory.
8 лет назад
Plus jimmys music isnt as complex and clever as jacos
As a musician you have a choice to make. You can either be an imitator or an original. If you choose to be an imitator the very best you can hope to be is in second place. The original is always in first place. Be yourself. Even if it means you can't do what the other person can. Similarly, they can never be a better you than you are. You're even on that score. Concentrate on being the best you that you can possibly be and let others try to figure out how you do it.
That’s true. They never capture his sound. The people doing it right after he debuted should have just left it alone, quite frankly, but everyone wanted that “Florida sound.” Pat’s right. It’s flattering but move on.
It was Michael Manring. I'd add: James Jamerson, Jerry Jemmot, Scott Lafaro and another bunch of wonderful bass players opened the door, and Jaco walked through it :-) .
When I started out on bass I picked up that Jaco instructional video. After putting my jaw back in its hinges I quickly realized Jaco is to bass whatever Bruce Lee is to martial arts, Michael Jordan to basketball or Michael Phelps is to undercover dolphins (you know he is). In other words, I had to be realistic and ask myself: "Could you EVER play like that?" The answer is this: With enough talent and time, perhaps. But would you be happier taking your talent and time to play your own way? The answer is this: Resoundingly, yes, since talent and time are two different things. I've never seen or heard another Jaco Pastorius before or since he walked this Earth.
the truth is....that Jaco gave all bass players the ability to be the best they can. He created an approach to the bass that has not been surpassed. I think the day of the Jaco, "clone" is gone. Bass players get it. They will never be Jaco & are not trying but they are taking what Jaco gave them & expanding. Will there be a certain element of any bass player after him that sounds like him? of course , it will be impossible to not be....Jaco changed the bass & music forever. & I feel bass players have begun to understand what he did & take it to make them who they are & give them their own voice.....anyone interested in the day Jaco took his frets out ck out on youtube..."allyn robinson discusses Jaco Pastorius"
hendrix shmendrix... Jimi knew there was a much more skilled player around and his name was john Mclaughlin. Naturally, hendrix caught on with the masses, simply because he was a better dancer. period.
Storyfilms1 Not an insightful comment. Of course McLaughlin had greater guitar chops, but Hendrix' contributions can't be dismissed on that silly basis. His music was remarkable, not just for his guitar skills, which were great within his genre, but for his amazing, imaginative compositions, arrangements and colorful soundscapes. Since you like McLaughlin, you might be interested to know that he has great respect and admiration for Jimi, and called him a "musical revolutionary". Maybe you're a jazz snob, but most great jazz players I've ever met, and many I haven't, have shown a lot of respect and appreciation for Jimi whenever his name comes up. Jaco was a great admirer of him, as was Miles Davis, Les Paul, and many others. To put him down as a "dancer" is ridiculous.
With geniuses like Jaco, it's the creativity, originality and soul which made him so unique and amazing. The level of technique he developed was merely to express all of these things. Bassists who have since woodshedded and achieved a "better" level of technique can't ever be rated in the same way, unless they have all the other vital aspects that made Jaco such a legend in the first place.
The problem is...there are tonnes of Jaco imitators.....yes everyone can play like him now....but they can't write.....or as one music teacher from a college said 'They simply don't have any music in them'......they have the 5 string bass...but no music inside themselves.....just a robotic Jaco sound.
Many commenters in this thread: "I can't hope to imitate the brilliant musical talent of Jaco and Pat. So, I'll do the best that I can do, and imitate Pat by merely uncritically echoing the non-informative cliché he has handed us in this video clip!"
I saw Jaco at the jazz festival in Montreal with the band Weather Report around 79. What a show of musicians and he really blew the roof off the joint!
I totally agree with what Pat is saying because I hear all the fantastic bass players like Victor and Marcus which I think have their own style but never coming close to what JACO has done. Remember JACO started it with an electric fretless base and got that awesome sound. I only wish and wonder what Jaco and Miles Davis would have sounded like.
This was likely recorded before he played with Richard Bona. Richard Bona is probably the one player who actually can sound like Jaco. The beauty of Richard is, he’s not a Jaco copy by a long shot. . . But the man learned by listening to Jaco’s albums and years later I saw Pat and Richard do Bright Size Life on stage together and Jaco’s ghost was definitely in the room. It was awesome.
After reading some of the comments here, I'll just say you argumentative fellows should be practicing instead. (I'm assuming you're musicians) Make some cool music.
Wow,right? The rhythm section is everything the way Teymur Phell could keep an intense jam going all night on every tune is downright scary. Pushing stern right along with intense drums . Pat is telling it from the perspective of a soloist playing off. The rhythm section
The lesson of Jaco, Miles Davis, Jimi Hendrix, Bob Dylan, Joni Mitchell - be yourself. Find your own sound. As he said, be inspired. But be yourself...
As with most things in life, this issue can't be adequately discussed in 32 seconds. Nobody is going to argue with Pat's basic point that trying to completely replicate the playing of a stylist like Jaco is a dead end. There's a lot more to be said, however, about the degree to which it is appropriate to incorporate the techniques and harmonic innovations of your musical heroes.
Pat Metheny's view is that the jazz player's 'voice' is an extension of his being, which I agree with. So if anyone tries to "be" Jaco, they will of course fail. But what about the sound of a Fender jazz bass, fretless? It's unfair to accuse users of that type of bass to be "copying" Jaco. Sooner or later, that equipment combination will enter the larger context.
he didn't like people copying his tone and technique, and while he was alive I wouldn't but once he passed, I think it's important to keep his influence alive by sprinkling it in my own style from time to time, as homage. he changed the world.
Im a pro bassman, been hearing and tryin to learn jaco since i was 13, now im 40, and i still dont have the hang of it, and never will. Hehe, its a fact. As a subject of study and technique it's a unique source. We all should dig it... but from there, like pat says, move on, if you can... hehe
It’s because of Jaco that the fretless bass is as much a jazz bass as the acoustic double bass. He revolutionized the instrument, set the standard for how it should be played, and like Pat says, no one has ever come close to replicating his sound.
I would say the same thing about Elvin Jones for drummers. Everyone has a sort of "fake elvin" thing they do, some better than others, but no one even comes CLOSE to Elvin's incredible sound.
It's called "Unique", he was an original, break the mold after creation type. What he thought at the time of playing his bass was an translation of his emotions, so like Pat said "stop trying".
