I dont mean to be offtopic but does someone know a tool to get back into an Instagram account? I was dumb lost my account password. I would appreciate any tricks you can give me
@Aiden Pedro I really appreciate your reply. I got to the site thru google and Im in the hacking process atm. Looks like it's gonna take a while so I will reply here later when my account password hopefully is recovered.
Giving men the same legal rights as women would help men achieve a happier life and reduce male suicides. But feminists like Webb scoff at men's rights activists (as he does in his book). Like all feminists Webb wants men to cry like women, but without getting the same help, support and legal rights as women....... in other words he wants men to be stoic and manly, but do it in a way that frames men as the cause of all of men's issues so that feminists are not made uncomfortable for not lifting a finger to help men achieve equality with women.
I do believe, that some are actually happy about it. I mean noone would admit it, but the amount of hate some people experience just lets them believe, that the world is better off without them. Then when it happens everyone acts as if it's the biggest tragedy ever.
There's nothing wrong with emotional stoicism, but there is in expecting others to act the same when it's just not in their nature. The same goes for emotional expressiveness. Sometimes these characteristics are innate and sometimes they are enforced by society, forcing people to reject their nature.
Not nearly as much as Robert Webb has capitalised on his "fake comedian" certificate. "Second fiddle" is the term that leaps to mind on the very rare, and increasingly rare, occasions when his name wanders it's way into my brain.
Really like both Robert Webb and David Mitchell as men - if you are interested listen to David Mitchells description of meeting his wife. These are smart, capable men who are not one bit frightened of being exposed or vulnerable. Many British comedians are the same. Very honest of both of them. Great role models for all men but especially young men who are low in self esteem.
Lucinda Armour I guess they're role models for beta males. I would hope most boys would ignore this stuff and grow into men but I fear this is the kind of crap they're taught in schools by their teachers.
Chicot The Jester - good to know that nowadays alpha males sit with their laptops and search youtube for titles such as How Not to Be A Boy and spend their time posting comments degrading teachers. And here we were thinking they were busy protecting the weak, building bridges and leading the battle! Seems the battle is now played behind the safety of a keyboard.
Lucinda Armour It seems "the safety of keyboards" is where battles are fought these days. Unless you're talking about your Antifa buddies and those little pussies run away whenever anyone stands up to them. By the way I never said I was an alpha male. I'm just not one of those beta-cucked guys you feminists are creating.
You need to read the book mate. Feminists (and teachers and anyone you think is manipulating society) are not creating anything, its individual men making choices, like Robert Webb. You hate them. We get it. Take care.
I think a lot of people in the comments are missing the point that while stoicism and behaving generally masculine works for some of us, it doesn't work for others and let's be honest, which of the generally stoic of us here are going to change because of something someone says? That would defeat the entire concept of being stoic in the first place. What Robert is doing effectively is reaching out to the people who need to hear someone say these kind of things. Those of us who don't are not going to get hurt by someone trying to help others find a different way to deal with emotional grief. People deal with things in differently. We don't all need to be the same for humanity to function
Well put! I don't quite understand why people are feeling quite so defensive about it. No one is forcing you to change anything about the way YOU behave, it's merely making the box we place boys in less rigid.
It's not like "no men should be stoic or fit into a 'manly' stereotype," it's "we need to allow a larger breadth of emotions for men, instead of expecting them to always be stoic and extra 'manly'" (whatever that actually means). I live in the US, and when my dad was a teenager in the 1960s, he played (American) football all through high school even though he doesn't like sports, because it compensated for his sensitive nature, gentleness, and even playing guitar (for some reason not "manly" enough lol). Toxic masculinity is real, but it doesn't HAVE to exist.
The weak pieces of shit are the men who get smashed and act out violently because they have no idea how to deal with their emotions... and because that's how their fathers treated them. The alpha male macho bullshit will be consigned to history just like city walls.
Where has this "brainwashed to want to be a weak piece of shit" nonsense come from? Just like Robert Webb and many others who feel as he does, it's come actually from being brainwashed to be stoic masculine men that hide their emotions, and some of after looking deeper into that upbringing have decided it's not for us. I'm still happy to bet that so many of those that are staunchly defending the idea of masculinity in these comments are also emotional men who somehow think they can have an edge over other men if they bottle their feelings up and attack those that have decided not to. Emotionally crippled men trying to hold on to masculinity as they think it defines who they are, when in the real world the person who actually cares the most is themselves. Some of us have decided we'd rather lead happy lives than ones where we bottle everything up in the name of being a masculine man. Personally I've never seen myself as overtly masculine or effeminate, sometimes I'd do something or feel something that would stereotypically be considered "manly" but in other occasions I'd want to be more emotional and express myself. Personally I don't see this as me being any less of a man, if anything being the master of my own destiny and choosing how I want to deal with situations in my life past a set of social constructs already built for me, in my opinion makes me a very manly man. My choice to do this is based on not only my upbringing of masculinity being pushed on me by my dad and leaving me feeling depressed and closed in later in life because I felt like I wasn't able to talk about my feelings to anyone, but it's also based on me seeing how uptight and repressed my own father is through his own stoicism. When I catch glimpses of that man in rare moments where his true feelings come out, you see a frail old man who has his own ideas and feelings and all I can do is feel sorry for him as he's decided that to share those things would make him less of a man. It's made me personally vow to not put myself in that position in my life.
It's actually almost "funny" that a man who is violent, an alcoholic, angry and absent for his kid. can say to anyone that he should "man up" and take responsibility. To me, you aren't much of a man if you can't take care of your own kid. I have the same problem, my father (I have a great relationship with him now) always got angry when things were looking down. Driving off angry, destroying stuff. And now I do the same sometimes, I get angry when things go south.
I had the same sort of childhood in the seventies (possibly much worse), so I decided to be very gentle with my own kids. My approach proved to me at least that not only do you not have to hit your kids, you don't even have to raise your voice for them to turn out very well because both my sprogs have turned out to be lovely, caring and hard working.
yeah you're LUCKY, but some kids need a smacking of love for their own good, and the good of the world in general. my nephew is growing up as a lying entitled little spoiled turd. i love him dearly and i held him the day he was born which makes it harder to watch. throwing a hissy fit anytime his demands aren't met and a complete lack of empathy. and all reasons fall on deaf ears. it's on the family to not raise assholes into the society. recently when visiting, the little shit threw away food his grandmother made especially for him cause he didn't LIKE THE PLATE!! i'll tolerate a lot of things, wasting food isn't one of them.
Real men beat the weak men down. Then get the trophies. House, car, woman, bangin holiday in Ibiza. If you cry like a bitch I will beat yo ass and take away your fridge and 4k telly
His self awareness, and what it took to get there is really profound and honest. I didn't know he wasn't from a posh background so it makes me like him even more.
andy mane, is it fun being so cynical? Taking the most pessimistic and negative view to everything in your life? Assuming that nobody can say anything and mean it, it's all for some other cause and not just because they mean it.
It was hard for him to perform the mental gymnastics of defining 'The Patriarchy' as both the social pressures placed on men to sacrifice themselves for women, AND the system which prioritises men over women. Huh? If you want to see 'hard', look at the struggles Cassie Jaye has had to go through to get her documentary on the Men's Rights Movement (The Red Pill) aired in cinemas and also to get a fair interview on TV. Every interview she has done has been hostile and full of lies and slander. By contrast, Webb has not been challenged on a single thing he has said, despite most of it being completely illogical, inconsistent and self contradictory. He is defining male roles as oppressive and harmful to men ..... but then defining men who react against this unfair treatment as somehow toxic or bigoted or stupid or selfish. He is like a slave apologising for being upset about being a slave ....... and then saying that proves he is the master and his masters are the slaves.
There's a time to let yourself cry and be vulnerable, and there's a time to man up and get over things. I've never heard anyone say man up to say show no weakness ever, only to say that in a particular situation it's time to get a grip on yourself. seems like most people criticising the phrase man up have no idea how it's even used
I'm not the kind of person who would normally subscribe to this view but a) its Robert Webb b) it makes so much sense c) wow what a hero for putting himself forward. Have ordered the book just now,
really enjoyed that interview with Robert Webb. The gender issue extremely well handled with his girls... and the loss of a loved one at a certain age and the impact it has emotionally. very sincere and honest I'll be certainly looking out for this book.
You mean teaching his girls to fear the "evil patriarchy" when none exists? They have even more simplistic minds than most feminists, they're going to grow up thinking men are unfairly advantaged in society when that's one of the grossest lies ever told.
did you pay attention to anything said at all? the whole point of this interview and the book was that the patriarchy hurts both men and women in different ways, men aren’t allowed to feel anything except anger and women aren’t able to achieve much.
@si That's not fair, I take it up the ring piece and I can identify that Webb said a lot of stupid shit and passed it off as intellect. @Nx Doyle I'll grant you that there is some cancer in this comment section, but if you're scrolling through the comments and wincing you can't handle an opposing point of view and it's time to stop pretending you deserve a seat at the grown up table.
The issues Robert raises are very common based on my professional experience. People would be surprised I think by the volume of men that are trying to process feelings behind a mask that has been created based on a traditional idea of what being a man means. This is also evident in other countries. I do a lot of coaching on this subject with companies and it never ceases to amaze all involved the issues that are uncovered and how many men report being so grateful to being able to understand they are not alone.
to all the angry commenters...you can still be stoic and "manly" and all that stuff. I personally am not the sort to get all weepy when something doesn't go my way, I'm more the take care of things myself sort. But the point is being in control of your emotions. Not a rage beast who gets easily confused when something new happens and ends up angry...like all the angry comments that missed the point. You can be the sort that wants to talk everything out. Or be the sort that deals with it on their own. Just be in control of yourself. Otherwise, no, you're not fine. You're negativity affecting yourself and the people around you. *that*'s the point of this. not to change what you're comfortable with but to make sure you're in control of yourself.
I knew for a while that he was struggling with something. This is so relatable. Its not the pain that makes us weak, it's suppressing those feelings that makes us feel weak because it takes ao much energy to hold it in.
Here's a man who is funny and intelligent and insightful all at the same time, and I'm proud to be a fan. I like that he's such an interesting person off-screen. And if you haven't seen his Flashdance video, you need to check that out!
From the first time I saw Robert Webb #BackInTheDay , I always had a crush on him. Seeing this interview and his intelligence and sensitivity just helps me understand what I appreciate in him. I think that many of us could learn a lot from his story.
There is nothing profound in growing up as a victim. What makes men sad? A lack of responsibility. What makes Women get 'rubbish jobs'? simply put - they don't. Women on average decide to work service jobs (teaching, nurses, social care), the trouble is we call them 'rubbish' because they pay less. Blaming the patriarchy for your problems is tin-hat level stuff on the same level as 'the Jews...'
I would argue that the jobs are paid less becuase they are valued less. If the jobs that are seen as female are valued more than the jobs that are seen as male there might be an issue there.
Just an example but I have worked in engineering not a skilled man but I was still earning 9 quid an hour roughly. My female colleague who was qualified and a year out of her apprenticeship was the only woman in the company and was on about 20p an hour more than me and was earning less than some of the unqualified guys in the shop. I have also worked in the care sector which is a minimum wage job and female dominated. There is a huge difference between recognizing issues that people face and blaming all your problems on those issues because to be blunt anyone who blames all their problems in life on those issues can sod off. As for the what makes men sad, having to turn yourself into a damned robot and ignore your feelings and have no bloody clue how to build a decent relationship because you are expected to hold everything in so can't reach out to people. that might do it. I don't see how responsibility or lack thereof has any bearing here.
Anyone with half a brain can see the pain sitting there. Just gently behind his eyes waiting to fall out as tears. Hopefully the book has helped him exorcise some of the demons. Met him working on a show, very subdued and very quick to leave. Socially awkward but always polite.
This book is a must - read ! I found Robert through a fave, David Mitchell, ( who I found thru the wonderful Alan Davies). Loss, love, defining yr. identity are so wonderfully & honestly explored. Too many parallels - except he pursued his dream. L.A. transplant here, LOVES his solo work & heralds his work with D. Mitchell. This book is so hard to contain in definition. He reads it on AUDIBLE as well, & gosh, it comes alive. He really grabs your full attention. Truly wonderful.
Really love Robert Webb I think he's always made me open my eyes and change my thinking and I think this book should probably be studied in secondary schools, just bought the book can't wait to read
Webb makes valid points but sadly he falls into ideaological dogma, by referring to a patriarchal society. It invalidates his insights by bringing in conspiracy theories, much like a religious zealot refer to their god as proof to their argument. He then tells story of his indoctrination of his daughter into their ideaology. And has her so conditioned, she has come up with her own political response to her classmates. For laughing at her in Spider-Man outfit. No Robert, they're laughing because spider man is a man. The clues in the title.
ZPSBestProfileName you don't need to be gay to be drawn to someone. People were drawn to Mother Teresa, MLK, JFK, et al. From what I've seen his is a real contrast to Mitchell's book.
I feel for his struggle as it has seemed to have left its mark on him, but a six year old being told that there's some overarching suppression as a patriarchy seems a tad too much.
Read a review of the book, just watched this clip and am looking forward to reading it. Disappointingly half the comments seem to be from blokes who would do well to read a book like this with an open mind. Landrover driving train driver motorcyclist who can cook sew and sharpen a chainsaw . And I'm not interested in football, or gay ( before the nasty comments start rolling in)
really smug final comment 'i suspect there's another book on the way'... basically telling robert he doesn't understand himself as well as he thinks. Kind of thought that was mean, considering the nature of the book...
I don't se why it needs to be reinforced, I never got told to "man up" by my parents but I have exhibited typical masculine behavior anyway. If someone is different that's just them, let them be them.
Actually, making women think that looking after their children (and their home) is rubbish and that they should do a meaningless 9 to 5 job is 'the trick'.
Isn't there a statistic (seen it somewhere) that still today about a half of British people think that physical punishment should be allowed in schools?
The nature of masculinity is to recognise problems and face them. This includes your feelings. Manage them don't deny them. Face fears like Robert Webb has clearly learned to do.
i saw him talking of his father on the BBC . At first i must say he came across a bit whiny ....But he did qualify his comments by saying he loved his father and appreciated he worked hard for the family . Speaking from experience when i was younger i really bought into the mantra of opening up to your feminine side letting your feelings show ....And from my experience i can only say i became a victim to my own feelings and insecurities. In my relationships i always let them know how much i loved and needed them (and they took advantage) i was an emotional wreck for every sob story on TV always fighting the under dogs corner (and they took advantage)....Eventually i woke up started treating people the way they treated me ( had better and much more rewarding relationships) Encouraged people to toughen up accept what you can't change and get on with it, stop feeling sorry for yourself (no guilt complex).....For me in life you have to find away to live that suites you. What works for me is this.... life is unfair get used to it , it isn't going to get easier or better by being weak....Love your family, tell them. support them to be strong because the world can be a really tough place and even tougher if your going to be an emotional wreck, constantly internalising, putting yourself through an emotional ringer. If i met mister Webb i would encourage him to ask why his father was the way he was (maybe he mentions this in his book). Mr Webb remember your father was from a different generation and maybe we've got it wrong and his generation had it right, we certainly seem to have far more problems than past generation despite all the benefits the modern world as brought.
I think its important that all men are brought up in a way that explains the differences in each individual, and in a way that allowed emotions to be felt and discussed without fear of the repercussions. That's not to say that men shouldn't be encouraged to be strong or physically fit, but the fact that people feel insecure about their own personality because it doesn't meet societal standards is horrible. It's important to learn about emotions, and not to feel that you can't have particular feelings. Luckily we are on an upward trend and many are a lot more open these days, but there is still a stigma attached to the male gender (much like there is a separate stigma for females) that makes life harder for those who can't be a stereotype. I grew up with little interest in football, which in England is like admitting to eating live lambs and pushing old ladies in front of buses. Strangely enough though it was a girl in school who made me feel like I wasn't manly enough, picking on the way I rubbed my eye and the fact I had a denim backpack.... Then again thinking on it, it might have been because I dated both her best friends... Maybe she was jealous she never got a shot.
As someone who is not a man, but has loved and been in love with men, I have very much witnessed how harmful the pressures of masculinity can be for some men and this book helped me understand that so much better. There's nothing wrong with gender, but there is something wrong with gender expectations so powerful that they oppress us.
Makes a great deal of sense. Us men really don't talk enough about our feelings. I am currently going through the transformation from being a 'tough' guy, who brushes everything off my shoulders like it doesn't matter. I am starting to realise it DOES matter and I have always just suppressed so much over the years. I still have a long way to go. It's tough to get out of the way of thinking that I can deal with it alone... And as Rob says.... pretty much every emotion turns into anger. I hope I get there.
I didn't see him doing that at all. On the contrary, I heard what he said to be empowering males to be themselves rather than having to fit into an archaic macho system.
I don't know what you are talking about. We all live by our own code. You can live by yours and other people can live by theirs. If you like the macho culture then you are at an advantage because it is still the one that is dominant in society. You can't change that lots of people, men and women, believe in embracing all their emotions. I don't know why that is such a problem to you or how you equate that with demonising men.
I find you to be coming across as angry and lacking a coherent point whilst making assumptions and seemingly wanting to attack a stranger on social media for liking a comedian who's being open about his emotions and speaking up for his right to express those emotions. I stand by my original comment that for me Robert Webb is a man. That in no way demonises men of a different ilk to him. I do not want to interact with you any more.
I don't think he was "demonizing" men at all. It was about saying there is nothing wrong with being more open and honest about their emotions. Which makes sense really, don't always have to be the tough guy that just sucks it up.
Hear, hear. Allowing men to emotional diversity can only help. Repressing your emotions outside of just anger never works. Rethink when you say "man up", "grow a pair", "don't be a pussy", etc. Can't wait for 65 year old Robert Webb!
Michael Brent If you're Ill and are physically weak that's a lot different than being being a weak person. I know people with cerebal palsy, muscular dystrophy and other debilitating diseases that in spite of being physically weak are the strongest people I've ever met. Being strong isn't about how much one can lift, but how one handles thereself in the face of hard times.
I've suffered from depression, anxiety, and bipolar disorder all my life. I'm aware that there is a such a thing as mental illnesses as well as physical. If i allowed my mental demons to get ahold of me I'd literally just be in bed all day watching peep show and father ted reruns. I have to fight those demons, as we all must, and go about my day and be a productive member of society as difficult as can be. My therapist said it best, the cure for depression is doing the opposite of what you feel like doing. It's easier said than done but it works. Trust me, I understand depression and mental illness well, I suffer from, but one has to grab by the horns.
There's nothing wrong with being vulnerable. I'm just now going through a nasty divorce and have lost my house due to hurricane harvey, if anyone is to understand vulnerability its me. The fact is i have friends that have had similar experiences and have more or less just used hard times as an excuse to become drug addicts. There's nothing wrong with having emotions but one must realize that the world is a rough place and at the end of the day, it's up to you to take care of yourself. Staying in bed all day drinking wine and watching tv is the easy way out but in the end it only makes things worse. I'm preaching as much to myself as i am anyone else. But please tell me again how twats like me don't know what it's like. Fact is you can cry all day, that's fine, but one must take action.
Being a hero used to mean something. Now just show how vulnerable you are and people shout “he’s so brave”. Anyone can cry like a little bitch over their feewings. I have a feeling that once masculinity has been destroyed the loss of it will be felt by everyone.
Despite being a big fan of Rob, I came into this thinking 'ohh ffs not another load of progressive snowflake bollocks' but tbf he's absolutely spot on with this. Comes down to one thing with me, be whoever you want to be and true to yourself, but be respectful about it and onto others. Also can't wait for BACK
the absence of the father in a boys life doesn't mean.... as they 'mature' into men....all other men have to be stereotyped & hated.....you are who you are because of your unique experiences of 'mother' and 'father' .....all the sorrows and the gifts given .....keep healing....and acting.....
Yes,we need to teach our kids that being emotional is okay. However, I think it's important to also teach them that being too emotional is also a hindrance. For example, having a tantrum because you don't get your way. There needs to be a balance.
People get offended by this rhetoric of "be an emptional man" because their experience dictates that this is a falsehood. What the message should be is "understand the time and place to be emotional, and secure such a space for yourself if you're lacking one." Being emotional and vulnerable as a man around women will leave you divorced and/or reviled. Asking "society" to care that you're emotional and vulnerable is a waste of time and will likely result in suicide. Instead find some guy friends you can trust and talk to them. Everywhere else, be tye stoic rock if you want to get ahead. It really is that simple. People get angry because this line of "always share your vulnerabilities" is a red herring that they have been burnt by.
dorkus malorkus I would hate to have a husband who felt like he couldn't talk to me though and open up at least sometimes. I mean what would be the point in a partner whose emotional world was absent from the relationship? Our vulnerabilities can be the most tender and endearing things about us as humans, when shared with a bit of perspective. It sounds like what you fear is being judged, misunderstood and rejected emotionally. But if they're right for you and you have a bit of patience and empathy when communicating too, they'll understand. Not that they should be the only person you can talk to either. 'Always' and 'never' are extremes, but i think if you have a healthy relationship with your partner and your own emotional world, there's a balance that can be maintained. But it is actually not fair on a wife, to not trust them with a bit of vulnerability. That is emotional absence.
Katie Stolealltheunicorns maybe I'm too cynical - but I genuinely don't think it would prolong the relationship if I expressed vulnerabilities to my partner that were unrelated to her. I have zero problem expressing my vulnerabilities to male friends and my exwife - but current partners and/or female friends... just no. Anger and happiness are permissible but anything else will be met with derision and eventual disgust. I'm not complaining about this either. I don't think there's anything wrong with this. I have a responsibility to maintain my partner's attraction to me, otherwise she will rationalize cheating or leaving. Understanding what it is appropriate to share just forms part of this attraction maintenance.
Not all women are like your "partner." It is a huge relief for me to have a long term boyfriend who trusts me and respects me as a true equal (as in like you would think a man should be, but I say his human equal) to talk about his feelings, instead of both of us increasing in stress without resolving it. Currently his mother is in fact, just like the comedian above, dying of cancer. It is a great joy for me to be his rock in this trying time (he's very upset about it, every day basically) and to return the favors for times he's been a listening ear to me. Not only that it's an honor and a privilege to have this window in to his amazing heart and dreams even when he is suffering. Many GIRLS are not emotionally mature and only seek status in relationships. Grown ass WOMEN (and Men too) know that to be trusted is the most beautiful and attractive thing. My SO and I are 3 going on 4 years together. He broke up with his last girl because she never let him feel and treated him as an object.
dorkus malorkus Well yeah, women don't cry openly to society either, duh. It's about allowing yourself to be emotional and express and understand your emotions where it matters
dorkus malorkus Exactly. Robert Webb is a brilliant comic but he's missing the point that many have already been down this road only to their detriment. I grew up with a strong sense of feminism. The idea of being a "manly" man seemed daft and well past its sell-by date. It wasn't until my twenties and long stretches of loneliness that a couple of female and gay friends took me aside and pointed out that my emotional openness was deeply unattractive. I was baffled, I'd grown up being told this was what women wanted. Heterosexuality is the reason we are all here and to deny its deep rooted gender norms is naive at best and dangerous at worst.
There are about 3 people who care if a little girl wears a Spider-man outfit, I work in a school and the young children get dressed up constantly in all different dress-up clothes. Boys will sometimes try the princess dress on and the girls dress up as Ironman and what not and no body cares.
Keeping emotions in check has great benefits. It can make people less impulsive. It can allow people to form plans or solutions to issues in a logical way. It does not mean you don't take responsibility. It means you take a great deal of responsibility by ensuring you don't cause problems for others because of behavior that is emotionally driven.
