Pershing Lecture Series: The Italian Army in WWI - Louis A. DiMarco 

This man called the commander of the Italians Cordova, his name was Cadorna. He doesn’t come even close.

The point about a potential advance of the Italian army towards Germany through Austria in November 1918 is well taken. But (as Ron Wilson has also pointed out in another comment) there was another army which had retaken Belgrade on Nov. 1st 1918 and had already entered Hungary on Nov. 10th to go up the Danube towards Vienna. This was the “Armée d’Orient” under General (later Marshal) Franchet d’Esperey ; this army was made of French (210’000), British (138’000), Greek (157’000), Serbian (119’000) and Italian (48’000) troops - with a contingent of White Russians ; it had broken through the Central power’s armies (essentially Bulgarian with German & Turkish support) in a series of victorious battles between Sept. and Nov. 1918 (Dobro Pole, Doiran, Uksub/Skopje). The Armée d’Orient war on the Macedonian front has been dubbed “the Forgotten war” by historians, but its role in obtaining the Armistice should not be forgotten!

I like the background he gave about Italy itself. Most of the stuff from 1914-on I already knew, but the background stuff isn't something you encounter in WW1 history books. Having that knowledge really puts 1914 into perspective.

I am a research scientist and have listened to many academic lectures. Your lectures are the best because you formulate and present them with your years of military experience and intilectual insight. Grazie per il vostro servizio

Informative lecture on a front of the war that many people don't know about. It wasn't all about the Western Front, crucial as that was; there were others theaters as well.

Austria here. Thanks for posting.

Not very deep lecture, for example the Schliffen plan in the first edition included 5 italian corps and 2 cavalry division in front of the French army in Alsace, so more German division could provide the outflanking of the allies troops, and the rest of the Italian Army attempt to pass thrught the Alps in France so some French troops should have been far from the Marne in 1914. With the Italian Ottoman war of the 1912 this collaboration was modified with only 2 corps sended to France. The French Chief of staff would have great trouble to play a 2 front war in 1914 and when in 1915 Italy choose the Entant this was a great relief for French, English and more for Russians because 100k Imperial soldiers moved from eastern front to italian border. The Italian Army according to the numbers didn't suffered for defection more than all the others army during the war. After Caporetto the devensive lines where based on the Piave river and the Monte Grappa fortified mountains according to war plans written around 1880 by the italian major Perrucchetti. Cadorna at the beginning of the war, according to Napoleonic campaign in my modest opinion, was sure that the war coud be win on the Italian front because the Austro Hungarian Army was already exausted by the heavy casualties in the Russian front. A breakthrought on the Isonzo front will open the gates of Vienna and the Empire will surrender very soon opening a new front for the Germans that had to defend the Bavaria, and in 1918 Germany ask for the armistice when the Austro Hungarian ended the war. It's correct that the Italian Army was far less armed than the German, French and British but was on the same level of Austro Hungarian, moreover after Caporetto British officer had to admit that the italian soldiers were brave but the lack of liutenents and sergeant was a problem during the fight, unfortunatly the more trained of them were buried on the Isonzo river during the first 2 years of war. In conclusion as Italian I can read a lot of books on the Italian front and western front as well due to my basic english, the real black hole is the eastern front mostly the Galicia and Austro Hungarian Army.

Thank you. Great lecture.

Thank you for your service, thank you also for that lecture. In 2020 I visited Ljubljana for a fe months to study fortifications in the Ljubljana gap. Very interesting.

Whilst I agree with most of your conclusions, ignoring what was happening on the Balkan front in 1918 was a poor omission. After the collapse of Austria on both it's eastern and southern fronts it wouldn't have just been Italian troops on Germany's southern border.

Fascinating, great lecture

[05:55] Start [12:41] Lecture starts

How can it be that he mistakes the name of the Italian Army's CinC whilst lecturing as an expert on the Italian Army?

Lol yeah the allies had a habit of forgetting about italy after that check was cashed

Just a few quibbles. The Battle of Adwa, when all things are considered, was not a humiliating defeat. The Italians inflicted many more casualties than they suffered, the General and troops on the ground knew it was a bad idea, the Ethiopians were all armed with firearms and at least decently well organised - most enemies the British and French faced had at most outdated firearms if not just spears. And it was a vanity thing for PM Crispi. And finally instead of being annihilated most of the Italians either escaped or were taken prisoner. As the British especially were not exempt from losing some battles, this was hardly some horrible incompetent debacle like the Battle of Annual. The Italian Army was and is underestimated and when you look more closely, has a better combat record than what stereotypes say.

Genuinely interesting lecture! Worth the time to take in.

i watched Dr.DiMarco's lecture at the Bob Dole Center, on the Italian Home Front in WWII where he spoke about the dislocation of Italian communities from north to south. it made me laugh. My father was Sicilian from near Palermo; my mother is Swiss Italian from Ticino, which is about as far apart geographically and culturally as Italians get. Both of my parents were born in America but neither spoke English when they started school so at the start of their lives they were cultural European - my mother spoke Italian, German & French; my father only Italian. My home life was a daily lesson in Italy's cultural chasm. That was also an excellent lecture. It is gratifying to listen to a lecture where the lecturer simply elucidates the question without needing to interrupt the flow to show off how smart he or she is. After both lectures, I went away understanding the subject far better than I did before. Thank you, Dr. DiMarco. P.S. Being an Italian speaking American soldier helped my Uncle Dom in an action for which he was awarded the Silver Star in Italy after the battle for Rome around Monte Cassino.

Excellent presentation, well done. The presenter seemed a little distracted a few times but very informative.

Thanks a lot from Italy.

why does he pronounce "Cadorna" as "cordova"?

Great story teller, if he could just not say "uh" every other word, Lord have mercy!

Too much on family. 30min mentions AXIS ???! 40.30 min Caperetto it was a GERMAN attack!? not Austrian. Not GOOD!

12:41 starts Aviano Air Base "Return with Honor"

It's nice to see someone talking about this front. But i have to say that there are some details you got wrong. Firstly, there were several major offensives in the apine regions, not only on the Isonzo river. And people were so unwilling to fight in Italy that my greatgrandpa enlisted at 17 years old after stealing his older brother's ID. Also very bad description of why many italian soldiers surrendered after Caporetto. It was because an encirclement with austro-germans troops cutting off many italian divisions, not because of bad gas masks. Also, austrians were "unable to take this hill"? It was Monte Grappa and they didn’t pass because of the tenacious italian resistance. Also the "backing up" by France and Britain during the itallian retreat didn’t have any strategic relevance. This is a bit of a caricatural version of the war. You should have also talked about "vittoria mutilata" when talking about the consequences of the war on the fascist arousal. I should add that, after 11 battles on the Isonzo river, italian plan was actually going accordingly to what expected and desired. Austrians were on the edge of collapse, they wouldn't have most likely been able to face another italian offensive. That's why germans came to help and they had a crucial role in the battle of Caporetto. That said, the conclusions are pretty agreeable. Overall, thanks for lecturing people about this shamely less known decisive front. Simone

The fact that in 1918 they did gain South Tyrol and did not loose it in 1947 is outrageous

Unfortunately this lecture is not on the level I've seen from the WW1 Museum. I hope that this part of the war shall receive another lecture that does it right. Here are some things that I believe should be corrected: - Cadorna's name!!! Not so hard, just read it in English as it is spelled, you won't miss much, he's not a Polish general (no offense towards heroic Poles intended, of course). Not only that he sacked hundreds of generals and colonels, he actually openly encouraged death penalties for soldiers, not only for their specific misdeeds but decimation for the misdeeds of the regiment!!! Italy had the highest number of both trials, death penalties and also extrajudicial killings and decimations of any belligerent! - omitting the opponent in the 11 battles of Isonzo: general Svetozar Boroević (yes, you can freely bumble his name, it's much closer to Polish since it is Serbian, no one will take offense as it's common to mispronounce). This since there is a meme that Austria Hungary had two great military leaders: Boroević AND Cadorna ;) Yes, the bulk of other AU military leaders on other fronts were more aux pair to Cadorna (see Potiorek i.e.), but Boroević was a master of defense warfare that really saved Austria in 1915. - twould be nice to pronounce the name of a NATO capital at least somewhat correctly: it would be Lyub-lyana for English speakers (Ljubljana, the capital of Slovenia), since the plan was to get through there into southern Austria and then Vienna. At least try... - in the conflicts prior to WW1 no mention of the much bigger Italian loss than the battle of Custoza (some 8k KIA, WIA, captured) is the loss in the battle of Lissa, a naval attack by the Italian navy into the Adriatic with superior numbers and ship quality. An Austrohungarian fleet hastily scrambled on defense decisively won over a fleet of better and more numerous Italian ironclads using the ramming technique for the last time in modern naval warfare. A decisive win, and quite interesting too, which resonated through Italy much more than the loss at Custoza, forcing the Italians to lower their expectations (Trentino e Trieste later promised in 1915. by Entente). - the battle of Caporetto was not won due to the gas attack, only the most frontal positions on the Isonzo were gassed by imported German engineers, the bulk of the Italian army got surrounded without orders and thus surrendered. The main thrust was by the elite German stormtoopers, of which one was Erwin Rommel as a very successful company commander that took the decisive heights overlooking the gassed valley, thus allowing the full breakthrough. - the Italians after replacing Cadorna with Diaz changed completely into a modern force that accomplished the defense of the Piave. The battle saw the first employment of the Italian counterpart of the stormtroopers, the Arditi, and these guys were also crucial to the later breakthrough storming the river along the British troops in the battle of Vittorio (yes, British troops were also spearheading that battle, not in reserve as stated). - the last batte of Vittorio on 24th October 1918. (Veneto was added later) was actually kicking a dead cow (other than the first breakthrough). This because the AU troops didn't even try to fight back after the first day of fighting, disobeying orders given by the command and deserting en masse. The soldiers just threw their weapons and started walking home, and a lot were taken as POW's during their efforts to return by advancing Italians. In fact, 10 days PRIOR to the battle the AU foreign minister sued for armistice and the Hungarian parliament voted for terminating the union 7 days PRIOR to the battle, and the troops very well knew that. BTW, the other front the AU held (Salonica) was broken a moth prior to the Vittorio. The battle that won it for the Italians was their defense on the Piave, but that really didn't contribute enough to gain all the promised territories since it was achieved with Allied help. - the dealings in 1915. with the British, French and Russians, sealed in the secret Treaty of London were done without knowledge of the other minor Entente allies, and included not only south Tyrol (populated 90% by German speaking population) and the city of Trieste (main Austrian port), but large chunks of the east Adriatic coast (populated mainly by Croats and Slovenes, with significant Italian minority, mostly in Istria), Istria (but not Fiume aka Rijeka! later unlawfully occupied by force!!!), huge area around Zara (practically half of Dalmatia), Vlore in Albania, the Dodecanese islands and Turkish Antalya in the Aegean (no Italians at all!). Some 200k German Austrians and 500k Croats and Slovenes in those territories! - half of this plan floundered when Woodrow Wilson requested that all secret plans be null and void (otherwise USA would not really step in), and since the Italian army failed to deliver. Vittorio Veneto really doesn't count, since the Salonica front was already broken in September, Bulgaria out, Ottomans out, Entente Armee d'Orient closing on Belgrade, AU Army in complete disarray and full retreat and AU itself dissolving internally. - Mussolini (a socialist and opponent to the war in 1914.) and many other later fascist served in that Italian army fighting the 11 battles with horrible results, and were extremely unhappy by the end of the war due to sacrifices made and minor gains from the promised by the Treaty, and this had a major impact into building of the national myth of "vittoria mutilata" pushing Italy into the early fascism already in 1922. (much much earlier than Germany and the stab in the back myth). And this as the Italians still acquired both Trentino e Trieste (Tyrol and Trieste) along Istria and the city of Zara with several islands... never enough... - if talking about families, my Slovene part of the family lived as farmers in the norther Isonzo area close to Gorizia, the village Števerjan exactly in the front positions. My grandmother born in 1912. was carried off in 1915. by the grandgrandmother and the whole family were displaced into eastern Slovenia, never to return as they were not allowed to by the after WW1 Italian goverment. My other grandfather, born a Croat in 1919. in Dalmatia, would either been born as Italian Slav(e) or also likely another refugee deeper in Croatia. The Italian rule towards the Slovenes and Croats was quite harsh even prior to the fascists, let alone after they came to power. Libyans had it even worse. - the southern Alps are not granite but dolomite, which is a sedimentary rock (not igneous like granite), much much softer and easier to dig into. The armies dug the dolomite extensively, forming entire military camps under the mountains, i.e. Col di Lana or Monte Piana, even mining whole mountains under their opoonents... The "castles" were built mostly prior to WW1, and to be honest "castles" were built also everywhere else, Verdun was surrounded by those type of "castles", or Przemysl fortress, or many others... so no, the castles weren't built cause you couldn't dig the "granite rock"...

Is the presenter really saying "calvary" or am I just hearing poorly.

I like listening to you speak, would love to hear you break down more of the countries involved from the start. Only one thing, The Schleiffen Plan was pretty much mucked up my moltke the younger nephew. I wish you all would stop dragging a good name like Alfred Von S. thru the mud.

aaahhh

The mispronunciation of Luigi Cadorna's name was really annoying as was his failure to build upon the fact that Cadorna probably had more to do with the Italian setbacks than anyone else--including the Austro-Hungarians. I was also annoyed by the nearly 10 minute bio on his family at the start. Look, the he is a great man and we thank him for his service. He has a great family of which he can be justifiably proud. I just didnt tune in to hear that. I was disappointed that he didnt --I dont think--bring up the role of Erwin Rommel in the German campaigns in Italy. And I think the discussion on Victoria Venuto left a good bit to be desired. The Austrians damn near won that fight. I could go on about the effect of the geology of the mountains on the battles and more. The man is obviously very smart and this isnt disrespectful. I just think it could have been more.

The Italians should have stayed out of this war all together. Just like the Spanish and the Swedes. It would have saved them rivers of blood and tears.

Also the awful Italian General is Cadorna, not Cordova or Cordoba like he's saying

Not a brilliant lecture. Shows the signs, like some other lectures at the WWI Museum, of getting an American to talk about a topic rather than seeking out an international specialist, e.g. the guy who wrote "The White War" . Having a personal connection to the war is not enough. He skims some interesting issues. Mussolini fought and was wounded and never forgot Caporetto. The "arditi" a successful storm trooper sort of group would go on to have a bit influence on the Fascists. That said, many of these lectures are great, but when they take the tops in the field.

I would respectfully suggest that when you have someone do an introduction they know the difference in pronunciation between Calvary and cavalry. It’s cringeworthy to watch and almost made me click away from an otherwise very engaging lecture.

WAY too much info about you and your family. We came to hear about the Italian army, not waste so much time on YOU. Very unprofessional presentation. Too bad, the subject itself should be interesting.