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Piano Recording - 2 mic setup's compared with audio examples to listen to

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Taken from the production workshop that we recorded at Rimshot Studios with Nigel Powell performing and several excellent recording engineers and producers recording - this short section covers the Piano Recording part of the day. A range of techniques were used including M/S and the mic outputs can be heard.
This video is about trying to capture a piano at its best so please only comment on the recording/placement please, this is NOT a piano playing video.
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26 авг 2024

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Комментарии : 27

@foothandman 6 лет назад

I had to listen to the beginning twice in order to get the dry british humor, haha.

@studentjohn35 2 года назад

OMG! A rare Bechstein Model III!

@bt8406 3 года назад

Thank you. i found this very helpful. Tuned piano with good artist in place, pair of Behringer C-2's on the way, for a start. I was going to separate the two over the low keys/high keys just back from the hammers, kind of where yours was, but separated a tad more, then aiming away from each other instead of near parallel like you have them, to control the tone in the mixer, and to record. the ORTF Method looks attractive to this. The C'2's are not omni though, that i know of. not sure if it will work with them. (recording for personal,and performance, not pro) Hearing the first recording it sounded (whats the word) too throaty or maybe too much bass in the chamber, maybe simply turning down the bass mic side of the pair a bit may have fixed that, im not sure if it was coming from that, or inside the box altogether. sounded a bit closterphobic. Then the remix at the end sounded maybe a tad too flat, althought i was impressed by the improvement in freq response, althought the lows dropped considerably and i would have brought them back up a bit. So darn, you only had those two samples. I was hoping to now hear all the combinations after you connected up all your mics, that you were going to make with your mixer, so i can best decide where to place these 2 mics. Another reason thats helpful is because im purchasing the equipment and need to know so i can decide which kind of mic boom to buy, wether a dual array, an orbit mount to a flat dual bar, or a mounting bar on the piano. The piano is coming in kind of loud to the player because of the studio setup, so i thought maybe if. closed the lid down on the mics that may help, but im thinking that may be a bad idea recording/performance playback wise. Any suggestions on an initial placement for the dual mics for Contemporary worship music and hymnals? Any chance you can upload your downmix combi samples from all 6 mics and leave a summary of best placement from what you learned?

@fujisnail7525 5 лет назад

1. Get a decent instrument 2. tune the instrument 3. get a decent pianist THEN talk about mic placement.

@djembesoloshorts 4 года назад

That's what I thought, thanks for pointing this.

@joelweber3462 3 года назад

Haha, exactly !

@swilhelm3180 3 года назад

Its ironic that I ran across this now after hearing Tiffany Poon do the exact opposite with Liszt. If you think I'm being unfair, first listen to a master that cares about each note. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-InKk1aowFZ4.html Now I know what he's playing doesn't equate to Liszt. What I'm pointing out is the style of playing and how, when you just pound the keyboard, its just so dull and uninteresting to listen to. Maybe the performer didn't want to put in a lot of feeling if he was playing it over and over again for them to set up that hardware. If so, ignore what I'm saying here. I've been there. Playing things robotically to get the technique is a necessity so you don't get tired of playing it. In this case he may have had to repeat it many times for their recording setup. You just can't put feeling in over and over and over again in a short period of time. They seem to be recording in a rather reverberant room. This will magnify the hardness of the piano. Treat the walls and use a thick, dense carpet and it would be a lot nicer. I bet a real time analyzer in there would show some huge peaks. Yes you can equalize some out but its much better to fix them at the source: The room. He mentioned the difficulty of recording a grand piano sounding so wide. Why not just move the mics farther away and stick with 2 mics? (I know nothing about recording so fill me in please.) Or does that make the room's imperfections far more noticeable?

@joelweber3462 3 года назад

@@swilhelm3180 The piano in this video is not a Yamaha, but a very nice old Bechstein (German). Looks like a 7' (maybe 7'4) and could be from about 1900. In this case the issue is not original piano design or quality, but worn out parts. The hammers are hard and likely worn small from use, the strings aged and tuning poor. Most Asian pianos (Yamaha, Kawai, YC etc...) do use very hard hammers which end up producing an overly bright and harsh tone. The hammers can be voiced down (softened) or even replaced with natural felt German varieties for a very nice tone.

@swilhelm3180 3 года назад

@@joelweber3462 Thank you for that correction: I've edited my comment. I was careless - didn't notice it wasn't a 9'. For some reason I thought someone else had mentioned it as a Yamaha. in the video its very hard to actually see the make. Hard to get good midrange out of most any piano that small though some manage. Your explanation of the hammers is very insightful. Thank you for that. I think they use harder hammers now for a more impressive, brilliant type sound but it does wear on the ears after a while I find. Oh well, that's what pecking at those hammers with those pin tools are for! :)

@EndOfEntertainment 7 лет назад

Cool stuff :)

@fdschuler7863 5 лет назад

ORTF or spaced pair but always with an omni ambient pair.

@nfexec1312 2 года назад

Interesting results - but.... the pianist concentrated in the middle of the keyboard and neglected the treble. How about trying this again with more breadth across the instrument? Also - that piano is VERY bright and the recorded sound is missing the true quality of a well voiced and tuned instrument that is not so terribly bright. Unless that wasn't a criteria for your experiment. At lease you did compare apples to apples and I applaud you for that.

@KosmasLapatas 4 года назад

Hi! Perfect video! If you could borrow 4X AKG 414, 2X Neumann TLM 170i, 2X Neumann U 87, 2X Gefell M930 and 2X AEA R44C mics which ones would you use for a yamaha c3 on a livingroom?

@GestattenWinnetou 2 года назад

Hey, you can‘t go wrong with the 414‘s. I‘m assuming you could borrow all, so why don‘t you try them all out and go with the ones you like? It depends on so many parameters, the piano itself, the room etc.

@issamchabaa45 6 лет назад

the tune played is so boring you could as well not record it at all...

@dwarrenharewood 5 лет назад

What Fuji Snail said.

@underwoodstudio1821 4 года назад

What Fuji Snail said..aweful...

@EleazerFilms 4 года назад

Truly awful playing.

@RecordProduction 4 года назад

Truly awful comment.

@EleazerFilms 4 года назад

@@RecordProduction We both have different criteria. No disrespect.

@RecordProduction 4 года назад

@@EleazerFilms In this video we showed piano recording techniques, so, in order to demonstrate the differences, someone stepped forward to help out. The video is titles '2 Mic Setups Compared..". The site was not "virtuoso performer shows off..". Your unkind comment missed the point of the video entirely. I must add that briefly watching some of the piano pieces on your channel the recording methods that we demonstrate would clearly be of benefit to you...

@FlorianScharnofske 4 года назад

@@RecordProduction "I must add that briefly watching some of the piano pieces on your channel the recording methods that we demonstrate would clearly be of benefit to you..." true - haha

@ctld5266 3 года назад

@@RecordProduction Lack warm though in the low mid though

@KosmasLapatas 5 лет назад

Awful piano, doesn't make a difference if you record it with the mics in the world.

@studentjohn35 2 года назад

Sacrelidge! The Bechstein III model grands from around 1900 are legendary. But having it well maintained by technicians devoted to their craft is a whole other ball of wax. Sadly, this is a neglected gem of a piano. Here's a slightly larger Bechstein from the 1890's, in a very high-powered classical recital: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-vgecQ1uytSA.html