Recording a grand piano is TRICKY - here's what I learned. 

*Timestamps for mic-tests:* 05:37 Zoom H5 05:44 DPA 4011A 05:52 Soyuz FET 013 05:59 DPA 4006A 06:06 Soyuz FET 013 06:14 Rode NT2-A 06:21 boths DPAs 06:29 DPA + Soyuz* 06:36 Soyuz + Rode 06:44 Zoom H5 06:54 DPA 4011A 07:03 Soyuz FET 013 07:13 DPA 4006A 07:23 Soyuz FET 013 07:33 Rode NT2-A 07:43 boths DPAs 07:53 DPA + Soyuz* 08:03 Soyuz + Rode 08:13 Zoom H5 08:33 DPA 4011A 08:48 Soyuz FET 013 09:07 DPA 4006A 09:21 Soyuz FET 013 09:41 Rode NT2-A 10:00 boths DPAs 10:14 DPA + Soyuz* 10:33 Soyuz + Rode

I like how you use octave as a unit of spatial measurement. "eerrr it's about an octave away"

You know you're a pianist when you measure lengths in intervals 4:51

As a sound engineer, this only is a testament to the fact that at the end of the day, the artist makes the sound. You can have $5000 worth of a mic locker but if the musician can't play, then thats just a pure waste of money. I loved the sound from ALL the mics tbh. My personal favourite are the Soyuz FET Omnidirectional but even the Zoom was beautiful. Thank you!

I was a sound engineer in another life, so my observations are based on my older experiences. Yes, recording a piano is tricky and so many artists have different ways of approaching it. For example , did you try placing a cardioid mic about 2 feet behind your head? One artist I worked with liked to have a track where he could hear the sound from his POV. Sometimes the track gives a slight presence to the overall recording. I have also placed a mic *under* the piano to get the ambient presence as a solo track to work with. The artist and the engineer can have two completely different concepts of what makes a good recording and this is where a good Producer can be a godsend. Also, looking at the room, you have a lot of glass to work with, which is not at all great for recording. All kinds of reflections and slap-back can occur that will spoil the recording. Besides closing the curtains, were you able to use any sound baffles, like big foam rubber patches you see in studios? This helps a lot, even for small home studios. I realize you were borrowing the space as well as the piano(thanks, Romano family), so things like blankets, foam rubber in key places to deaden echoes, etc, are one way to help control the sound of the room without causing too much chaos. You have a beautiful piano to work with, but your recording environment is at least as important, if not more so, to your end result. On headphones, I personally liked the DPA 4011s for their warmth and presence in overall sound quality. RU-vid compression really crushes the high frequencies, so it's sometimes hard to tell the difference in mics because the high end is rolled off so much. I think your mic placement is fine for your sessions but as you do this more, you will find the subtleties and sound qualities that you like best. Looking forward to listening to your new album when it's available. Best of luck.

I’m impressed by how good the Zoom H5 sounds. Either that or my “made-in-the-60’s” ears have achieved vintage status

It was very interesting to hear the different setups! I love nerding out like that! I think the double DPA pairs had an extremely acoustic sound, like you were right there in the room, almost like a documentary. But I agree about your remarks on the 013. Their involvement had a certain little shine appear in, that I’m finding hard to explain. I have used the Soyuz 013 in a crappy room on my small upright piano. I tried a lot (with pretty blurry outcomes), but for my situation they really opened up when I used Hypercardioid capsules and put them close to the strings. I somehow had to end up fighting the room, instead of making use of the room. Mic’ing a grand in a nice room though is mysterious to me. I’m So happy for you that you got to have this close collaboration with your engineer!

Hi Nahre, I'm a pianist who discovered and developed the most accurate piano recording technique. It's based on some simple solid principles: 1. The piano is a stereo instrument, not a monaural instrument. 2. The sound does not emanate out the side of the piano. 3. A propped up piano lid does not act like the bell of a large brass horn. 4. The only person in the room who hears the piano correctly is the pianist. I made these discoveries by walking around a grand piano, lying underneath it, and sticking my head in it while it was being played. Here is what I discovered: 1. The true stereo sound of the piano emanates off the top of the strings, not out the side of the piano. The pianist hears high notes in his/her right ear, middle notes with both ears, and bass notes in the left ear. This is stereo. 2. The audience hears a monaural sound, not stereo, because they sit at a 90 degree right angle to the hammers, whereas the pianist sits parallel to the hammers and strings, hearing true stereo. 3. Propping up the lid only funnels the monaural sound toward the audience. It doesn't help the audience hear stereo piano a single bit. The monaural sound is a mixture of all notes with no separation between lows on the left, and highs on the right. 4. The funnel sound point on the side of the piano is exactly where the prop stick is positioned. This is also where the hammers line up at 90 degrees in a straight line to the audience, so the audience is actually hearing all the 88 strings lined up like train cars, one behind the other, all coming toward their ears. This is why they can't hear stereo piano, like a stereo sound system. Instead of a left and right speaker, both speakers are stacked on top of each other and the audience hears a funneled mixture of monaural sound. 5. The articulation of each note emanates from each hammer striking its strings. This articulation, particularly in soft passages, is lost when sitting in the audience, because the audience can't hear any separation between strings which are being played and strings which are already sustaining notes. RECORDING TECHNIQUE: To record the true stereo piano, you will need at least two microphones (expensive or not) and at least two recording tracks in your recorder on which to record. The mics should be on boom stands so they can be positioned, suspended above the hammers, and placed facing down toward the hammers and strings about 12-18 inches above them, depending on the intensity and volume level of the musical work being recorded. Closer micing for pp and farther micing for fff overall volume levels. Depending on the intensity and volume level of the music to be recorded, the right mic should be about 12-18 inches in from the right side of the piano rim, and the left mic also about 12-18 inches in from the left side of the piano case rim, both suspended above the strings facing down toward them. If you have a third track on which to record, and another mic, place it in the middle of these two mics, 12-18 inches above the hammer of middle "C". THE ESSENCE OF THE PIANO'S SOUND: Keep in mind that the key to understanding exactly where the piano sound emanates, is knowing that it is completely dependent upon the hammer hitting its strings. The "hammer-string" relationship is the equivalent of a violinist using a finger to pluck a string. Your finger's extension is the hammer. It is the thing that articulates your expression upon the strings. The soundboard is only an amplifier of this. So understanding that this "hammer-string" event is the essence of the piano's sound, results in a conclusion of placing microphones, directed at the hammers and strings. This sound is what you listen for when you play, and it's what you expect the piano to produce when you touch the keys. Now, these mics will hear exactly what your ears hear when you play the piano. After you make your recording, you should mix the tracks appropriately according to your natural hearing. Right track panned fully right, left track panned fully left, and center mic dead center. You can E.Q. the tracks as needed for richness in bass on the left channel, and crispness of treble in the right channel. This technique is the most accurate way to record piano. If you have extra tracks and extra mics, you can place a couple inside the piano over the strings, but they will only be a redundancy of what the "over the hammers" mics have already recorded. For decades, engineers have been incorrectly recording piano, mostly because they falsely believe that the raised lid of a piano is like the bell of a large horn where the sound comes from. Wrong. Secondly, engineers don't know how a piano is supposed to sound, since they don't play piano, and they don't sit on the bench when listening to it. Conversely, pianists are not recording engineers. Neither understand what to do, because they live in different worlds. If I hadn't been a pianist who learned recording techniques and then experimented with both, I would never have discovered how to accurately record piano. MICROPHONES: The cost or quality of your microphones is far less important than your placement of them. I've made great piano recordings with inexpensive mics, (dynamic or condenser cardioid pattern costing less than $500 each) because the piano was rich in tone and well tuned. I've also made lousy recordings using very expensive mics ($1,500 - $3,500 each) because the piano was not well voiced or regulated, and it was out of tune. I recommend cardioid pattern mics, but keep in mind that the world of microphones is similar to the world of pianos. Some people believe they can only play well on a concert grand Steinway, Bosendorfer or Fazioli. Others, who are really good musicians, can get a great sound out of a baby grand Yamaha, or even a vertical piano because they are skilled musicians. You don't need expensive mics to make good recordings. It is your recording approach and technique that is most important. PIANO TUNING: One thing that is critically important is the fact that the piano MUST be in tune to get a good recording. Everyone who listens to professionally recorded piano music has listened to a piano which was freshly tuned before the recording session. If the piano is out of tune, the mics will pick it up and the recording will amplify it. The human ear is very forgiving when listening to live music, and it adjusts to and compensates for out-of-tune instruments. Most pianists and piano students are not real familiar with what a tuned piano sounds like, since piano tuning can be expensive, and most pianists are less concerned with the piano's sound and more focused on playing the musical work. They are used to playing on out-of-tune pianos. But if you intend to make any piano recording which is going to be played for public consumption, you must make sure the piano is freshly in tune. If it is not, your recording will sound cheap, sour, and bad. In this case, I recommend using an electric piano which is in tune, over an acoustic piano which is out of tune. Regarding your Zoom recorder, which has a built-in X/Y microphone pattern...it can make very good piano recordings if mounted to a boom stand which can suspend it about 12-18 inches above the hammers facing down toward the strings, above middle "C". It won't be quite as full as using two separate mics described above, but it will still represent the true stereo sound the pianist hears. In summary, I suggest you try this recording approach. It took me several years to discover and perfect it, and it won me a Grammy nomination. It will be the best approach to deliver the true stereo sound of the piano, which is exactly what you hear when you play it. Good luck !!

I could listen to these sound test all day. Your playing is such a treat and really gets right to my heart. Can't wait to check out the album when it drops. Good luck!

So grateful for your efforts in putting out this video! Learned a lot. Can't wait to listen to your album too!

Nahre, I look forward to the day you release your album. Each and every piece you've put out has inspired me, and this album will undoubtedly be a highlight of the year for me. Good luck with wrapping it all together! :)

I’m currently in the same boat and was glad to see that I’m not alone in these challenges. The four mic setup that you decided upon sounded the best to me out of all of them. Your music sounds super dope and I can’t wait to get the album when it comes out!

This demonstration is gold. Clearing up so much stuff. Thanks Nahre!

Excellent video Nahre! I think your album will be great! I’m really looking forward to listen to it.

The end result for me is that those Soyuz miss are fantastic = They sounded way more lively to me, especially place further away they are the most musical of the lot - the DPA 4011A sounded more analytical, and the Rode had more of a room sound, but the notes just seemed to bloom more with the Soyuz. Great video !

After I listened to all songs with headphones, I was happy to see (and hear) that you chose the same configuration as I did (DPA 4011 A and Soyuz FET 013). Excellent video. Thanks for the upload.

I love your devotion and the curiosity for learning new stuff! Respect☺️👍🎼 As a fellow pianist I found this very interesting, I am also taking my first steps with recording my grand at home. And - I also preferred the combination you chose, it had both warmth and clarity. Thumbs up, looking forward to hearing the album!

I’m a huge fan of yours, can’t wait to hear the album. Also really appreciate the knowledge and the sharing of the process

Very excited for the album. I agree with the choice you guys made on the microphone setup. Sounds great.

Fascinating - always an elusive perfection. Thank you for sharing your thoughts and examples. And your performance(s) are wonderful.

So glad I found your video! Helpful - but also, I just love your style as a musician! Thanks for putting yourself out there into the world.

This video makes things seem so much more attainable. It’s still stressful and I feel like I’m going in blind because my “recording technology” courses as a music major were “here’s Sibelius and Finale and this is what they look like”, but this gives me the energy to just go for it and do my best!

The DPA + Soyuz setup gave those key actions and its sound sparkle. It’s the sweet spot in my opinion. This is a very thorough video. I appreciate your efforts for giving us all the audio set up comparisons. :)

Thank you! This has been bugging me for a while now, and seeing the notification pop up with you explaining was a no brainer. Not only is it quite educational for a non engineer, it's fun to watch.

While watching I decided the 4011A / FET 013 combo was really special and my first choice. So glad that's what you went with! Great video, really helpful as an engineer to be able to share this with my musician friends.

Thanks for sharing this amazing journey. AND for providing all the details about height, angle, distance, levels etc. Super helpful for other pianists struggling with this black art of recording!

Great clips @Nahre Sol, I can’t wait to hear the album. The prepared piano track sounds awesome, I love that sound! You’re fast becoming my favourite pianist, such great percussive attack, precision and sensitivity. Great channel too!

Great video, Nahre! It was so fun listening to all those mic setups. Anyone looking to start a channel ought to see that the zoom is a great place to start. I liked the Rode pair the best!

You have inspired me! I compose, produce and love music and now I'm even more inspired to do what I do. Thank you for the fresh air!

You're not only a great pianist and student of many styles, you're an excellent communicator and moderator in life. A very special personality and hearr.

Oh man, thanks so much for this video. I’m in the process of doing some piano recordings but am at a loss of the many choices in microphones, digital recording program…you are so amazing. Love what you do ❤ thank you thank you for sharing your time and talents.

Yeah, the DPA and Soyuz resonated well with me too, and that's just listening on my cellphone. Thanks for sharing technical info! Looking forward to hear more performances with these new mics setup.

Thank you Nahre. What a wonderful test! OMG, love love love DPA. I do realize that these are very expensive, but wow - incredible width and depth and tone. Plus super nice playing too... :)

Great video, I love when the piano sound is captures by the two pairs of DPA, sounds glorious.

Love your videos. Always informative❤❤❤

Yay! So glad you chose the DPA and the Soyuz! Sometimes mic setup can be dependent on the recording artist's style too, I think it brought out more of your personal touch compared to the DPA combo

What a great video, thank you Nahre. I NEED THIS ALBUM!!!

DPA 4011A + Soyuz is my favorite setup of every whom you showed. Harmonics gave me shivers with this one. Glad you decided to go for it !

Nahre thanks for this resource! Absolutely appreciate your input and sharing your learning experience.

Wow. I’m just about 5mins in and you are blowing my mind. I don’t know where to begin. Your playing is amazing. You want to capture every sound coming from the piano. Keys to creaks of the pedals. And your knowledge on recording sound. I’m seriously impressed and admiring.

This is so incredibly helpful! This came out at such a perfect time

What a fantastic video! Thank you so much for sharing the results in such an easy to follow and very detailed way all of your work! Your story resonates so strongly with where I’m at in my own journey right now! I have a good friend who is an audio engineer, and he and a few of his music friends have just started helping me make a plan, set up what I’ve got, pick ideal new equipment/mics and work in what I’ve already invested in for recording and streaming piano. My setup is similar to yours .. beautiful sounding grand piano in a very acoustic open room. Watching this has really helped me figure out my next few steps, and I feel like they are much better steps than the ones I’d have made before watching this. 🙏🏻

Sweet, I'm super excited for this album. I've been wanting this for awhile!

Thanks! Useful video and audio! Without knowing what the room sounds like, for me, I really started hearing tonal differences on your 'soft pedal' performances, especially once the Rode mics got introduced, and in the later DPA/Soyuz mic combos. But for me, I always thought it sounded better whenever the Rode mics came in. Appreciated your insight.

Thank you so much for this! I have been playing grand piano my whole life but recording, audio mixing, etc is new and intimidating to me.

As a film composer i'm recording piano quite often. Everyone has there option own how to achieve the best results. Mic placement is everything and i'm happy to see you testing. So many great classical performances out there with not so great recordings. I prefer using 5 mics. To pencil mics in the piano close to the hammers, my modified u47 at the the feet of the bass strings, and two additional pencil mic outside the piano pointed at the piano (one behind the other at different lengths). Main thing to watch for is phasing and the mic outside the piano would be placed based on the natural acoustics of the room. Without that u47 i find most piano recording to lack the low end growl. Looking forward to buying your album and happy to hear it's being made.

Love this video! I am happy that the mic combo I liked the most turned out to be the one you picked lol

Great to see this journey from the perspective of a musician! As a audio engineer myself (recorded a decent amount of piano throughout the years) it is interesting to see what you were looking for in sound and practicality. The solution you ended up with fits both! The only thing I personally am missing from this setup (preference) is a good Tube or Omni cardioid LDC miced at the center of the piano, relatively high. This for me has always been the mic i used the most to get the full ambiance and power of the piano and get a bit of natural room harmonics and reverb into the recording. The combination of the pair of SDC's like you had setup close with the center mic is close to how I generally start my piano setups (when not doing spaced pair or 'musicians perspective')

Un vídeo para agradecer. Muchas gracias por el esfuerzo. All the best!

Fantastic video as always! Love the spirit-just keep leaning!

Soo interesting thank you! Excited to hear your album:))

Really appreciate what you are doing here to share!!! I just became a youtuber a year ago and still experimenting with different settings of mic and i only use H2N ... so far i learn i love the omnidirectional, the XY is to dry ... i can hear now different setting (without having headaches of setting up and moving around) from your numerous sample! Again, really appreciate! Thank you. I prefer for my taste the omnidirectional, richer, sweeter while still carries the articulation.

So grateful for content like this

Thank you so much for sharing those experiments! This video is really precious!!

I'm not a pianist, but I am trying to figure out more about microphones. I really appreciate you sharing your process of learning. I love what you're creating and I'm excited to see more what you will do. Cheers!

Thanks for showing your experimentation with us. So interesting. DPA 4011A + Soyuz FET 013 sounded quite nice.

So far 2020 has been an avalanche of prolonged stressors, roller-coaster of emotions, a true game-changer (not in a positive way 😀), and hallmark of all sorts of uncertainty but your album is about the save the year from all of this Nahre! The long-awaited pain reliever and therapeutic release of the year! Its timing is just perfect for all of these reasons! I love the fact that it has no exact predetermined release date because I already know that this waiting period and predictable unpredictableness will bring wonderful elements of surprise along with the exquisite sound of a dreamer's optimism when it's most needed! :)) I'm literally counting down and I really CAN'T WAIT! Looking forward to experiencing it! :)

There is nothing such like "the perfect setup" it's very much how you want to you use sounds as colours and paint, your red is never going to be like mine due to micro variables that at the end are not important, and also makes the whole thing special. As musician and music producer, I think this proves that at the end of the day the artists will make the sound he likes, and experimenting with sounds makes music worthy to make and live with the joy of creation. I follow you since a while and I very much like your expression and mindset which you use to experience music and live about it, it's always a pleasure to see you videos

This interaction now makes sense Jake - "What happened to the Bluesmobile?" Elwood - "I traded it for a microphone." Jake - "..ok"

As a pianist who also records, this was a fun insight into your experiences! I've gotten experiment with a lot of different set ups over the years, and this was certainly enjoyable to watch!

Wow! What a great video. So comprehensive.

Love this nahre! Next time I play at a concert I'll keep this in mind because the piano always sounds quiet and bassy. Thanks so much! Love your videos always!

Nahre, you channel is the coolest, thanks. You seem super cool. Sending the best vibes

Thanks or the consistently high quality content Nahre =] Can't wait to hear your project!

another fantastic video. so good as always, thanks!

Love this educational/process content Nahre. Keep it up and keep experimenting!!!!!!

The Soyuz in omni sound amazing in basically every example. Awesome video, Nahre!

thank you SO MUCH for this!!!! I've been struggling on how to improve my own recording situation and this was so invaluable!!

Great video and great music!! I’m impressed how the Zoom stood up to the competition!!

Great video Nahre! Thanks for sharing!

Can't wait for the album!!

Hands down, nothing was able to come close to the DPAs. Here in my Contour's/Bryston/Van Den Hul room, the 4006's made me feel like I was in your room with the piano right in front of me. Sooo 3D, detailed, deep, sweet transients, and beautiful tone, OMG. With both DPAs together, what a full sound (and the phase is perfect), congrats for achieving it. Not easy at all!

@Nahre, I have always struggled with the mic'ing thing. It's even trickier mic'ing an organ. Thanks for the video. This is a topic that needs more discussion within the music community.

Absolutely fantastic and exactly what I was looking for. Thank you 🙏

Great dedication - there is so much to learn

Thank you for sharing this experiment with us. I basically liked all the mics. Even the Zoom. The technology for microphones has really advanced. I’m a newbie at recording so Really appreciate you posting this. 😊🦅🎸

Thank you for sharing to such detail!

I like the chimniness you get from the what you settled on-that’s a very beautiful piano tone.

Great video! And amazing playing.

I'm a trained pianist and an IT guy, two different careers I pursued independently. But this puts it all together, I love it! Thanks a lot! And I must add that I REALLY enjoyed the choice of music you put in this video, different, very nicely interpreted. I will buy your album. Good luck!

You inspire me because you are so calm and good at what you do. Thank you!!

Loved all of this! ❤️

Fantastic video !! just subbed, and it's a great learning experience, thank you for going through this and posting it!

I agree with the setup you settled on. It sounds by far the best to my ear! Thanks.

You are so great! She did such a great job! Very useful, thank you)

I agree with your assessment of the combo. The Soyuz sound really good to my ears. I've spent the last year or so learning about sound engineering because my group is looking to do our own recording as well. There is... A LOT to it, to say the least. This was a really helpful video Nahre Thank you for taking the time, always love your content. Also, you probably have looked into this, but if not your friend Rick Beato has older videos on his channel covering these kinds of things. This is where I learned about frequency ranges of each instrument and where they fall. One thing I did find REALLY interesting is the distance you set the mic and height determines what part of the sound wave you catch. You can do a quick equation and figure this out to position the mic close to the exact frequency you desire. I wish you luck in your endeavors and eagerly await your music!

Cool music. Great playing. Thanks.

I'm enticed. The best for your new album Nahre :)

Thank you for this informative video! It will definitely help with my projects!!

Thank you very much for your sharing. Looking forward to your new pieces by new setting!

4:51 - Haha, only a pianist would measure distance in octaves. (I love it!) This is really cool. I was mic-ing a grand piano in our church once, and of course I was limited to the mics we had on hand, and was mic-ing singers and other instruments as well, and of course they had very limited attention spans… so the best I could come up with before everyone got there (i.e., maybe an hour or two to set up my computer and experiment with the mics and resulting recordings) was to stick one of the vocal mics by that curve of the piano similar to what you had -- but only one mic, and I put it in farther, inside the piano, not too far above the strings (maybe half an octave to an octave… haha). The sound quality actually turned out pretty nice for what we were doing, and it was just a one-off recording, so not as big a deal as if we were doing something on a recurring basis. But it's really nice to see these specifics if you have more equipment and need a more professional recording. And I love that you have all the different options with the stats and images on the screen while we hear the recordings. Very nice way to compare them! This lets us get a better idea of what we can do, even if it's not the same choice you make -- others may want a different sound or might have budget limitations. (And, as you mention, the room makes a big difference in the sound, too. I feel like the closer you get the mics to the piano, the less difference you get from the room, though. Obviously, you have to turn the gain down, too.) You ended up mixing mics together. I've also found (in my very limited experience) that can give you a good "best of both worlds" sound mix. (I've also found that's true for mixing speakers and even speaker enclosures for setting up a home theater system.)

Interesting video! The DPA 4011a sounds magical in your room. The Soyuz is great price to performance.

Thank You, I really enjoyed the video. Recording 24bit / 96k for grand piano was the correct choice. The microphone choice was smart using the x-y configuration and the high boomed stereo bullet microphones. I would say to use a larger capsule condenser microphone but you did try that with the NT 2’s. Your sound is clean and I did not hear any phase or cancelation. It’s a good idea that you got a second set of ears on the project with the engineer. The room itself is always the biggest struggle but you have a clean recording that captured what happened as far as I can tell. Brava!

Can't wait to hear the album!!

Your videos are so well done!✌️

Another great video Nahre! I always enjoy watching them since they are helpful and informative and like the way you put them together. As someone who has worked around sound and music for many years you are completely on the right track with DPA mics and positioning which are both tried and tested methods and choice of many professionals. I would also add that your other choices are also good too and there are also lots more options from makes such as AKG, Scheops, Neumann, etc. It's an endless but fascinating quest as you have found but someone with your talents needs to capture your artistry as best you can especially with a fantastic instrument like the one you have available.

The setup you chose was probably my favorite. That said, the Zoom was VERY good for the cost! I was impressed!

I ABSOLUTELY CAN'T WAIT FOR THE ALBUM!!!!!

Really cool to hear the sound samples, makes me appreciate "sound engineering"! I am neither a producer nor a player. But I like the insight people learn from various hacking projects. The demonstrated process of learning an unfamiliar domain can come handy in surprise circumstances.

Thanks for sharing this. Very illustrative.