The new 991 Turbo S is a very expensive car. So expensive it probably needs to fend-off more exotic machinery like a yellow McLaren. This could get messy.
No launch control used on the Turbo S to make it look even off the mark , this just seemed like Chris Harris was just trying to get into Mclarens good books to get a P1 test drive .
Absolutely pathetic, I can't believe Chris Paris would pulls such a lowlife move. Not only did they not use lonch control but the Mcclearn jumped. It's too bad the British can't prepare a proper, competitive race car to face the Porsche. Chris you lose a stripe, consider yourself demoted. LOL
"Some people are so thick. They assume because the Porsche is quicker from 0-60mph it MUST also be quicker from 0-200mph (which is the speed they reached in the race) . The Mclaren is 300kg lighter and has much more power. The Porsche never stood a chance against that Mclaren over a long distance (like the one in the race). But, the Turbo did win from 0-120 mph (like it should've done). There was no cheating in that race." - Hamzah Mirza
Finally, someone with a brain. Why people think 0-60 times mean anything in a race like this is beyond me, because such times don't mean anything. Speed attained by these cars are hardly ever linear so you can't use straight line math (or thought process) to even come to the conclusion that the 911 would win a race with any kind of distance involved against a 12C. I'd buy the Porsche between the two though.
The 911 Turbo is probably the best sportscar/supersport in the world. Yes, it isn't the fastest, but 0-60 can really be achieved in under 3 seconds, plus it's the best to live with every day including winters, the suspension is quite stiff, but still it rides very smoothly and it is very well made, which leads to a good reliability. Don't you agree?
+SRAMEK drove one when we left our Macan Turbo at the dealership for an oil change. Great car overall, a bit scary, but super fast and makes you feel great.
+SRAMEK Hell yeah fucking right....( I just saw the Drake video :=) I have a 911 1983 SC & I love it.....Haven't driven any other Porsche ( only because I really don't need more speeding fines & I can't go to water cooled ) yes I'm a purist / old fool ! Cheers SRAMEK !
Sramek: 911 Turbos don't really like snow ... the turbos sit very low, all that snow slush salt crap basting the hot linkage & shields ... not a good idea. The 911 T is 10X more practical though, simply because there is a usable trunk and TWO back seats .. in a pinch 4 people can fit or one could actually do a grocery run . but NOT in a Mclaren. This means the 911T can be used like most cars on any nice weather day, instead of just a toy to be pulled out on Summer Sunday mornings to justify the purchase with several laps around the block before parking it to take the kids to soccer practice with the mini-van.
The Porsche is heavier than the 12C and has less power, but is faster than the McLaren. Then, it is cheaper, but has better quality and drives better. I mean like serious, who would even discuss about which one wins?
Shane Nugget from a rational standpoint, you'd have to be an idiot to discuss that. the 991 turbo is a marvel of engineering, no doubt. but well, people don't buy supercars from a rational standpoint. in theory, if you stick to the speed limit, a diesel vauxhall astra will get you from A to B just as fast. it's all about drama, personal taste and emotion at that point. and for me, the 911's simply don't float my boat, and i wouldn't want one, in spite of it being an undeniable masterpiece. i'd much rather have a bright yellow 12c. or, even better, a ginetta g60, despite being worse than both of the cars here.
Shane Nugget yea this car isn’t that cheap lol. 200k. In the used market, in the high 100s. Still an amazing elegant beast. But mclarren is more expensive and less reliable and slower lol
ROCKETGUNS BOOMBS No i dont, i love GTR,i love all cars esp super cars, but nobody was talking about GTR's here.I was just sticking up for the Porsche on this video considering what a monster it was up against, i thought it hung in there really well.
I think it just doesn't... It looks faster but is isn't as stylish and elegant as the porsche! It's too spaceshuttle look alike to be a car that looks good on the road.. just looks kinda good in a proper race with other spaceshuttle supercars..
Tom Nowak I don't know, the Porsche looks like every other Porsche from the last 15 years with minor style updates; the McLaren looks like a proper super car and sounds great.
Never change a running system :D It's allright if you like it more than I do but just saying it's too fancy and less elegant for me... impressive jet but not pretty
Tom Nowak True: I would love to own and drive a GT, but I doubt people are giving those up for cheap :) I'm actually a huge fan of the Cayman S, which is probably more in my financial comfort zone at this point...the McLaren and Turbo S are reserved for youtube fantasies :D
To me the 991 looks more masculine whereas the curvy style of the 12c makes it look a little more cute instead of mean and angry. I'd pick the Turbo all day long if I had that kind of money, especially in the UK.
Chris, Thanking you for one uping the F40-episode. You and your crew have found the preverbial sweet spot with the current mix of your talents, the track, and photography. Epic!
Some people are so thick. They assume because the Porsche is quicker from 0-60mph it MUST also be quicker from 0-200mph (which is the speed they reached in the race) . The Mclaren is 300kg lighter and has much more power. The Porsche never stood a chance against that Mclaren over a long distance (like the one in the race). But, the Turbo did win from 0-120 mph (like it should've done). There was no cheating in that race.
0-60 in 3.2 seconds for the 991 Porche Turbo S ??? I guess that's why the Mclaren won in Harris Drag Race. My times are around 2.8 - 2.9 seconds 0-60 mph for the Porsche Turbo S when in Launch control mode. I know because I own one. I wonder why he didn't make a track comparison. Maybe its because hmmm I guess the Mclaren would have no chance against the Porsche. Seems to me that this video does not give neither an accurate nor comprehensive comparison.
Kareem Al-Amoudi That surface always produces shit numbers for cars...did you hear the 12C 0-60 he got? 3.7 seconds. Even those cars can do it in about 3 flat on a good sticky surface. The Turbo S on a proper surface is like 2.6. The McLaren will always pull up top though due to more hp.
Kareem Al-Amoudi The McLaren would have no chance on track? Please, you complain about accuracy but I think you're prejudged because you own a Turbo S. They're both brilliant machines, but the Turbo S is more of a GT car than the McLaren. The McLaren is lighter and more powerful. More track focused. The Turbo S isn't build to race on racetracks, Porsche make the GT3 (RS) for that.
xgelmirx Absolutely. The whole comparison is kind of off to me. The Porsche is a (slightly) low-key GT car that you can drive around and not have people taking pictures of you that also is delightful on a track day with the buddies. The 12C and now the 560C.570S/650S are about looking exotic and going really really fast on the road and the track, but they aren't made for long relaxing drives like the Porsche is. I may be biased because I own the Turbo S, but I know I bought it because it is a joy to live with all the time. Now I just need to find a lightly used Cayman GT4 at a good price that can sit in the track garage!
Chris, did you use the launch control with the 911 in the drag race? It's amazing how the 911 keeps up with the McLaren despite the huge power disadvantage
Exactly the way I like to see Chris Harris! Informative and yet fun. These are the reviews I would turn to were I to actually buy a supercar / proper sports car.
In a video containing the 911?? The car which has looked the same since the day it was born! Not to mention how all Porsche models look broadly the same. There is no one more lazy than Porsche's design department.
I really enjoyed the camera over Chris' right shoulder. Gives a sense of the speed as well as possible through a computer screen. Great vid as normal. Thanks guys
I think a comparison between the R8 V10 Plus and the 991 Turbo S would have been more interesting to watch, as the outcome of this video was a bit obvious in my opinion. Or maybe even one between the 12C and the 991 GT2 in the future.
911 991 turbo S: $150k Mclaren mp4: $232k The real competitor for the MP4-12C is the 991 GT2(RS), which would be about 220 kg lighter (1460kg) and 90hp stronger (650hp).
John Smith I don't want to say this but i really don't think they will make one, they just have never been as good as a GT3. But i would like to see them try to make a new GT2/RS.
Club Bmw Amg Depends on you country and taxes (VAT). In the US a 911 Turbo S cost ca. $ 185 grand and the S version has the most features basicaly included. Burmester Sound System would be extra. PDK, SPC. etc. is all serial.
opmike343 Probably not but Ferrari are the worst case of it. In some cases they won't even allow you to test their car at a track without first sending a team of engineers to fine-tune the car to that particular course at that particular day. Chris Harris himself was "banned" by Ferrari (they wouldn't supply him with any cars and they forbid magazines they send cars to from letting him drive them) because he wouldn't keep quiet about this.
Imagine the 12c with 200kg's less and we're back to square one. You just can't think like that as it is what it is! I love the Porsche and to 120 mph it is still the king of the road!
Modelo Super he said "imagine". Anyway, the rumour is that Porsche will not make a new GT2/GT2 RS because they are working on a mid engine car slotted below the 918, a 918 light, if you will.
It did get a head start but the Porsche almost instantly caught up. If they started at the same time, the Porsche still would’ve been overtaken, considering the gap.
I'm very intensive cars fan viewer, but i couldn't see anyone can drive a car confidently same like you.... I like everything in your briefing way.. Keep it up
Amazing video as always! Just curious, how can Drive afford to make such high quality videos? Do you guys have a magazine? Sell merchandise? or do manufacturers pay to display their cars? Thanks!
I think all the new 991 911s are pretty good looking, especially from the rear. And especially the GT3, looks and performance-wise. It has a naturally aspirated 3.8L 6 making 475 hp! It's like whaaaat? And the PDK in that car has the stick fixed, and now it shifts like a proper sequential 'box. Pull back for an upshift and push forward for a downshift. And the super cool feature where pulling back on both paddles at the same time is like putting the clutch in, and letting go is like dropping the clutch, unlike on every other paddle shift car where doing that would just put the car in neutral. I am surprised more car makers didn't think of making the simple change (probably with the electronics) to enable their cars to do the same thing. And the 12C is well, the 12C. Amazing when it first came out, but quickly got overshadowed by the 650R and of course the P1 if someone has that kind of cash to invest in such a car that is bound to appreciate in value. But I doubt anyone on here would get out of a 12C after a drive and not have a smile on their face and talk about how much fun it was. But McLAREN!!! Please put a proper mechanical or clutch-type limited slip in your cars. I know about the whole individual braking of the inside rear-wheel to give a limited slip effect, but if you do track days at tracks with predominantly right hand corners, the pads and ceramic brakes on the right rear are going to wear out way quicker than the lefts. Just go with a proper limited slip diff and awesome torque vectoring you have and call it a day. No worries about uneven pad and ceramic rotor wear. Just do it McLaren. If any McLaren worker reads this, which I doubt they will, tell your boss about it and have them go up the chain all the way to Ron Dennis and let him know that I and many I've spoken with would prefer a proper limited slip diff over the individual rear braking system.
No matter how much power this Porsche has, no matter how good looking it is, or what else, at 1600+ kg it is not the real deal. They should build a Cayman Turbo.
Personally I think the cayman is just too ugly, but you can get a turbo version from TPC racing. Their stage 3 kit, which is about 15K in parts, less if you supply your own headers and boost controller, makes about 505-515 BHP in a Cayman S or Boxster S with the 3.4L engine. That thing whoops Z06s and C63s on a track.
I used to drive the Nordschleiffe almost every weekend, a friend of mine had a Boxster with a 996 GT3 engine. That was quite an impressive car :) I believe it would fit without much trouble.
***** My personal favourite is the people who got screwed by porsche because of the problem with the engine and swapped it for an LS motor. That would be a fun car.
The advantage of the porsche over any other sportscar is its everyday usebility. Its easy to service (doesnt even need a lot), doesnt mind snow and rain, has relatively high mpg, the most luxury extras (sound system, cooled seats etc.) and a alot of space - 2+2 seater with a good trunk
very true. My mother owns a 911, the 997 model and she uses it everyday. They're comfortable enough when you want them to be but are also incredible performance machines when you want them to be.
Like Chris said, the 12C is a more comfortable street car... McLaren is known for their daily drivability... I would much rather have the 650S due to its impressive abilities both on track and street...very very few cars can compare.
I'd rather have a car that's does a quicker 0-120mph because 196 mph in California is not going to be fun. The Porsche is a daily driver and won't breakdown like a typical British car.
Stephen Lowe That's because McLaren uses a German Mercedes engine and will switch to Honda in the future. Have you ever wondered why every car company compare their cars to Porsche. Because there is no substitute. My cousin 2014 Jaguar FX with less than 2000 miles has been to the dealer 4 times due to stalling and check engine light.
One car going back to the dealership means nothing.. My mates 3 series coupe went back to the dealership several times with the same problem.. Does that mean bmws have reliability issues? Of course not
Stephen Lowe 24 hour LeMans history shows Porsche followed by Audi with the most wins. Please google McLarenand read about the Mercedes engine which is modified in Sussex.
That drag race is a little weird... usually the porsche is capable of doing 60 in 2.6 sec and 100 in about 6.2 sec on a dry surface like this... I don't really get it
He said it. People spending this kind of money for a super car do it for the drama and not just the numbers. And that is why MP412C lost to 458. It was not the numbers but how much more elegant and beautiful 458 was and the drama it offered in form, sound and function. 12C in comparison offered only function. And the fact of not being able to turn of the nannies in 12C broadcasted all over dug a hole for 12C that it never recovered from. And McLaren is doing the same mistake with P1.
Awesome cars and I will never be able to afford them but The Porsche Turbo S just does not do it for me...I am a GT3 person through and through I have found out.
The Porsche costs 60.000 € less than the Mac Laren is has 60 HP less. Those two cars can't be compared. A real comparison would have been the GT2 vs P1.
Actually what you use in an equation for top speed is Kw, or horsepowers. And you take that together with frontal area and drag coefficient, and then youll get your theoretical top speed. If you put a torque number in there you wont get anything out of it. Horsepower equals speed. Torque equals broken shit
You sure? Do you mean the Nurburgring. I haven't heard of any testing at SA. There was a car looking like a 991 GT2 seen at the Nurburgring. However because of the exhaust arrangement which is different from normal turbo arrangement it is suspected that it is a GT3RS with the fake scoops on the rear wings.
thank you so much ... i been asking for this comparison along time in alot of car channel.. thank you that why you are my favorite .. good job.. like always.
that went as expected. even the 592bhp engined mp4 could have beat the this car. with that being said, the 911 turbo s will always be the alternative standing in between regular sportscars and elite sportscars.
Indeed, Sir. I think an entertaining comparison would be between the 12C and its ancestor, the F1. Both Carbon everything, 1 HP difference. Let's see if there's been any progress in 20 years :)
I am quite aware of, as well as counting on that. I must confess, I very much enjoy seeing older technology take out the mound of electronics that today's vehicles have effectively become. Replaced cars' souls with machinery :(.. I know they are machines to begin with, but the older ones feel closer to a kind of humanity than anything coming out nowadays.
I initially wanted a post a comment which sounded like "the drag race wasn't fair...etc.". Now I looked up the specs for both cars (both do 0-62 mls in 3.0 s AWD vs. RWD) and all that is left is the question: How the fuck did McLaren manage to build such a car? I'm stunned btw...
I was hoping to meet you at the launch event here in germany, Chris, but had to live with Carlos Lago instead :) Something tells me you would have been more postive about the Turbo if you had driven it at the Bilster Berg, which is a fabolous track where the four-wheel steering and the PDCC really come into play. Not the review I expected from you, Sir...Too much McLaren praising, not enough valid informations about Turbo S...
Spoken like a true German Mein Herren."not enough valid informations about Turbo S...". I think for us Brits and yanks alike, there was enough positive feed back here to make me want to buy one. (if i could) ...Ach yah
I think Chris praised the 911 very much. But he also mentioned one important aspect about super cars. People buy them as much for the drama as for the numbers. The 458 maybe lost to 12C when comparing numbers but offered all the drama and function when 12C only offered function. 911 turbo offers no drama, it's just a faster 911. People spending these kind of money want something special. You notice a 458 a mile away by it's shape, curves and that heavenly sound. In comparison 12C is not noticed and 911 turbo even less. In conclusion, wealthy people (actually even us spending 30-40K) don't just want to buy a fast car, they want a special fast car and 911 turbo is not that special. Specially when most don't no the difference from a normal 911. And there are so many of them.
And he already said the porsche was the better over all car. He said it gives the driver more confidence than the 12C. He said it feels like it weighs about 1300kg instead of 1600 plus because of rear wheel turn in. He said it was more characterful than the older 911 turbo. He said it felt more natural to drive than the mclaren. And the reason he didn't give the turbo the praise you might expect is because Germans always make great cars, it's so boring *yawn*. He liked the alfa 4C too or tried to and he even said he was possibly being a little too kind to it because he wanted so much for it to be a hit or maybe he just wanted to like it so don't go thinking it's a England vs german thing. It's not. It's a germany makes great cars and other countries don't always thing and we (me and chris) want other countries to do well too. So he likes underdogs, deal with it ok? Why u need so much praise anyway? Read between the lines and all the information you want is still in this video.
And before you say he's not a good reviewer, if he is indeed, a little biased then take a look at your own youtube video's pal. They're fine but they're no "Chris Harris on cars". Emotions are messy, mine are for sure and if you can create videos as engaging and enjoyable to watch as chris's with 100 objectivity then you truly are a master of making car review videos.
To be honest, in a 1/4 mile the 911 may be able to take it with launch control, but at the length they're running in the video, the Mclaren is going to take it 10 times out of 10.
A genuinely awesome video Chris & Neil. Some interesting results from both cars. Reminds me some of the various stuff you use to do for Autocar, then DR then Evo and now Drive. Also happy to see the Mclaren win you over a bit more, massive fan of that car and your considered opinion is interesting to hear.
