What is romance to socially conservative Christians? How does this relate to the Pureflix streaming service? Support Renegade Cut through Patreon: / renegadecut #pureflix #godsnotdead
As a former christian, now atheist, this kind of Christianity played a much larger role in becoming an atheist than any prominent critic of religion did.
@@thevinylbird2269 Ooooooh no. That movie is the worst exercise in Christian revisionism I've ever seen. That and the fact it's an agonisingly badly made movie. THERE'S NO COCOA IN THE MUG KIRK!
Yep. “Tell me you think men are incapable of controlling themselves and women should be locked in a tower to protect their virginity WITHOUT telling me you’re a rampant misogynist who grabs at any opportunity to shove responsibility for your actions onto the nearest girl/woman so you don’t have to address the shitty person you actually are”
One of the biggest problems with religious fundamentalism is that it stigmatizes pleasure, as opposed to advocating for moderating pleasure with healthy boundaries. When you hold people to a standard that is too high for any person to meet, they inevitably fail, resulting in an agonizing sense of false guilt.
The sense of guilt is important because then they come back to church and get their guilt validated with the whole "jesus is forgiving" deal, driving them deeper into the hole.
My Grandma was excommunicated and abandoned by her community after divorcing an abusive man who was going to end up killing her eventually. So I find those anti-divorce movies deeply angering.
That's awful. It sounds like various marriages I later heard about that a couple older family friends or relatives endured. People would phone and warn women when their husband was coming home from work drunk and angry. People were happy that an abusive husband died when the woman was still young enough that she could live a happy life without his oppression. In my case the women in this situation were usually Catholic, and of course the era they lived in didn't help, but it's so sad that women are required to stay with these men so they don't risk hell, but rather face brutality and possibly murder. The "loving" community that preaches about Jesus' love and forgiveness won't help women escape these relationships is not loving or forgiving. It's enabling.
I met a retired army man who was a pastor for Camp Lejeune, NC. He invited Marines to his gathering on the weekend and... he is so abusive to his wife... she can only stay in the kitchen and cannot speak until spoken to. I was like... wtf is happening... he yelled at her, "Woman, know your place!!!"
It’s so bizarre that most of these movies, even if the main character is the woman, it’s not about her. It’s never about her, always her “love intrest”.
@@ashwinp5518 Well, when your place as a woman in that culture is always belonging to a man, you'll always be a daughter or wife first, and a woman second. If you're lucky, you might get to be a person, but I'm not holding my breath.
Female love interests in Christian romances tend to fall into one of two categories: 1. The virtuous, perfect Christian lady whose only role is to coax the sinful man into behaving. She is merely a tool for his self-actualization. 2. The independent, non-Christian lady whose only role is to change herself to fit her Christian love-interest's view of the ideal woman. She has no value aside from her conversion. It's pretty upsetting.
The first movie reminded me of an old Onion article that portrayed a Christian couple who decided to be abstinent after marriage to be extra good with God. How prescient.
I know it sounds silly but it did exist in early Christianity they called it spiritual marriage like the one with Mary and Joseph according to catholic
On an episode of Wife Swap (it's on Hulu now) there's this conservative Christian family in which the mom is described as "she thinks children should be seen and not heard, and refuses to share a bed with her husband".... What a catch 😂
I feel like viewers who haven't seen Fireproof need to know that the questionable browsing history that they show in the movie is him looking at boats. Like, yes there's an implication of what it's actually standing in for, but in the actual text of the film he's hot and bothered hiding boat websites from his wife.
To us in the LGBTQ+ community, "antique shop guy" is already coded as might-be-gay, almost to the point of stereotyping, sort of like interior designer guy and hair stylist guy. To a more sophisticated film audience, he would automatically be relegated to the friend zone, to become the "Gay BFF" sidekick and confidant.
Ugh, while I appreciated the representation, the 2000's had this awful trope where we existed only to help straight people with their relationships; rarely giving us relationships, or when they did, it was just as common to dismiss our own personal lives (in sex and the city, carey's gay friend started to talk about his own relationship, and she just says, "gross").
@@foragegrasspause2gotoloop961 And when you did get a relationship, it's to the only other gay character on the show (if there even was one) because if two gay people exist on the same city block, OF COURSE they're meant to be! Who cares about interests or personalities or values? They have gay!
@@foragegrasspause2gotoloop961 It’s like that trope about the wise black man who only exists to reassure, counsel and assist the white protagonist. As a gay guy I’ve often been sighed at because I’m not good at dating advice or fashion tips. Films and TV shows have turned us into handbag chihuahuas for privileged people, only humanised by what we can offer our straight peers.
I always more got the message that Christian men didn’t trust themselves to be alone in a room with a woman without assaulting/harassing her. Probably based on the staggering number of scary admissions I’ve heard from Christians that this is what they’d do if they weren’t guided by the teachings of the bible
I've never understood that mindset as well. It's literally saying "I have no self control that nobody can be safe with me outside of the person who is bound to me by legal law." I cannot understand having that amount of little poor self respect for ones self
@@sidneyadnopoz3427 That's a core problem of their teachings. They claim that everyone, literally EVERY PERSON ON EARTH is so terrible that they rightfully DESERVE being tortured for all eternity. Although, of course, they are saved by Christ. So, they who are "saved", have to believe that without it, they would just be monsters like the rest of humanity. They don't actually open their eyes to see that most people, also non-Christians, aren't monsters at all. That would turn the God they believe in into a liar, it must be true.
@@doloreslehmann8628 I feel like this is also later inventions, but also I have only the lightest understanding of the original stuff, and know fuck all about the gibberish that was added when they became more inclusive, but the original stuff didn’t even call for following the rules if you weren’t a Jew (or on Jewish land), let alone whatever cannibalistic nonsense Christians added
When I was in college I took a course on the Old Testament/Jewish Bible, and my professor (a Lutheran pastor, I think) was adamant about stressing the importance of cultural, historical, and narrative context. My extremely fundamentalist boyfriend at the time was very dismayed that I was "questioning his faith." I've rarely experienced more un-Christ-like treatment than from the hands of his family and their church.
(Not all Christians of course), but I've seen some Christians get pretty nasty when their deepest, most core religious beliefs get challenged or are even questioned / doubted with skepticism out loud.
It isn’t the “Old Testament” or “Jewish Bible.” It is the Torah (5 Books of Moses). Or, perhaps you also studied the Nevi’im (Prophets) and K’tuvim (Writings), in which case you studied the Tanakh (TaNaKH = acronym for Torah, Nevi’im, K’tuvim). Jewish people rarely refer to the Torah/Tanakh as our “Bible.”
The thing about the results not mattering also applies to abortion. Rationally, the best way to low the number of abortions is to lower the number of unplanned pregnancies by improving access to contraception. But the people that see abortion as a sin often also see contraception as a sin so they would rather try to create some fantasy world where people only have procreative sex.
Add to that the idea that wives should be available to their husbands for sex 24/7 regardless of whether they’re interested or not, and basically you’re risking spending your life pregnant (also chafed and violated). I wouldn’t let people who think of women as fleshlights and broodmares or whores set the terms of morality.
There are a lot of scientifically-unsound claims circulating in pro-life circles against contraception. The usual stuff - dubious stories about hormonal contraception causing cancer, heart-wrenching stories about people who underwent surgical sterilisation and changed their mind, devastated that they will never have the child they could have had. One conspiracy theory saying that condoms don't work, and are secretly promoted by Planned Parenthood as a way to create more unplanned pregnancies they can abort for money.
@@elpretender1357 not to mention, education is the death of organized religion. And a kid or two can but a hold on someone's education, at least LONG ENOUGH for them to get old enough that they're more set in their beliefs.
@@elpretender1357 also, they ( the catholic church in particular,) like their congregations to stay JUST poor enough that they're working too hard to spend much time contemplating the validity of their beliefs. Poor people NEED God more than secure, educated people, is the idea.
@@vylbird8014 oh but if you tell them that women are being forced into being sterilized in prisons it's a blank stare. Like at least be consistent in your beliefs. They don't even want to support welfare which would help people have more kids but you know why 🤡
"I can't be near a woman that isn't my wife without succumbing to _her_ seduction" translates to _I'm weak and need privileged protection and any woman found near me must be punished!_
It's just a way to be a sexist while also feeling good about yourself. "You call me a sexist because I refuse to hire any women and won't even engage them in casual conversation? No, it's because I respect woman so much that I don't want them to be employed and won't let my wife ever speak to another man without me."
This made me flashback to my time at an all-girls Catholic high school in religion class. We sat through several Christian romance flicks to teach us about chastity. And then we watched "Taken" to learn about sex trafficking. Good times 🤣
@Katherine Pagan a friend of mine who had been sex trafficked hates movies like Taken as it's mostly based on urban myths. She told me she never encountered any girls that were abducted into trafficking except for some that had been taken from third world countries. In that case the parents gave them up, thinking they were going to get a job and go to school in the US, but they were "taken" for sex trafficking instead. The majority of trafficked people wound up being coerced into it through someone they know as my friend had been given a "job" at fourteen by a "boyfriend" after she had been kicked out of the house by her drug addicted mom.
Taken made me so mad (don't actually remember if I saw number 1 or 2) because she essentially gets kidnapped because she was written to be so freaking stupid - like, no twenty-something would ever be as dumb as she was, but the film is like "look at this hot chick, shame they got no brains and now she got kidnapped, what did she expect". I would have actually liked it a lot better if they'd portrayed it more accurately, like a series of misfortunes that all happened so fast that she couldn't get out and just kind of fell into it. But I guess that wouldn't make for a fun action movie.
I love how Old Fashioned is presented as the counterpoint to Fifty Shades not only in its subject matter but also its style, by being aesthetically bland and uninteresting, thus dashing any hopes of “romance” it might’ve sought to inspire
Ironically the 50 shades movies are also aesthetically bland and uninteresting, making both media oddly similar despite supposedly being two extremes. (Can’t help but feel that there is a great contemporary art history / cultural anthropology PhD thesis in that tension)
@@intheorigin0728 that soulless corporate attempts to be "transgressive" for profit are equally sterile as religious fundamentalism? that using these behaviors as a marketing demographic stigmatizes them in a other side of the coin way as outright paranoia about it?
I'm only two minutes in and that "family viewing guide" is already a massive red flag, its existence pretty much says "forget the text of this piece, here's the Good And Correct interpretation"
Yeah, from my experience growing up as an evangelical, those kinds of guides were endemic in Christian media. It likely stems from an audience that expects to be told what they should believe (like, say, every Sunday morning)
this is something I’m against in consuming any piece of art. people come from different backgrounds and have many beliefs, and to claim that there is just one right way to interpret a movie, book, etc is blatantly wrong
What kind of business could survive under the main character’s self righteous misinterpretation of the Bible? What if a woman (shudder) actually came into his antique store? Does he have a “no girlz allowed” sign like his workplace is a lil rascals tree house?
I was wondering that. Does he kick her out if there aren't any other customers in the store to act as a chaperone? That's pretty clear grounds for a discrimination lawsuit.
Old Fashioned; the movie that says dating is bad, then advocates for people to date. Because apparently they don't know that dating and hookups are different things, I guess...
Ah, but you see, you literally cannot get to know a person better or feel emotionally closer to them through dating. That can only be achieved through spending time with them, laughing with them, talking with them deeply about their goals and expectations in life, maybe getting into some adventures together… it’s kind of a long list of activities for a complex process, we should really come up with a word for it.
@@intheorigin0728 Well, in a sense I can understand this position, though it may seem very illogical. For me it was the same when I was a young adult, even if I never thought of this b****hit of "not being with someone before marriage". But I never wanted to "date" or "be dated", because for me that implied a very specific goal, to start a sentimental relationship, or even a sexual one. And I didn't want to be viewed JUST as a potential love/sex interest. I wanted to be seen as a PERSON, I wanted to be appreciated for what I was, and not by someone who only wanted to kiss me or end up in my bed. For me, friendship has always been the door to romance, a first inevitable step on the road to a durable relationship. Obviously, I fell for good looking men also, and felt flattered when found attractive by someone, but it always, ALWAYS had to be matched by an equal "asexual" sympathy, I had to find him interesting and a pleasure to be with also WITHOUT any sex or physical attraction being involved.
@@Laurelin70 that is interesting. my approach is almost the polar opposite. For some reason, and im honestly Not Sure why, i make a very Sharp distinction in my head between friends and people that i date. If you are my friend first, i will probably never be romantically interested. It does work the other way around and i am friends with people i used to Date, but dating someone who is a friend First is foreign to me. Though.... It might be because i dont necessarily believe in the Love of my life. To me, the risk of dating a friend and then hurting them If the relationship doesnt work is too great. I dont want to have the risk of losing a friend if a romantic relationship ends. Losing that relationship is already bad enough. It's interesting because i can totally See the logic in your Point and i do think friendship is an important part of romantic relationships but to me it is sth that develops simultaneously to the romance rather than preceding it, while for you it's a prerequiste that needs to be established first, If i get that right.
I watched The Last Temptation of Christ the other day and was struck by how, even with its so-called “blasphemy” in daring to depict Jesus as a human who felt human emotions and temptations, it was infinitely more successful in affirming and glorifying Jesus than I’m sure any film on Pureflix is. We need more filmmakers like Scorsese and Malick making films about Christianity tbh
Last Temptation of Christ is such a good movie because as it points out, if Christ had to live as man, he had to go through everything mad did which includes temptation and culminates in one of the worst ways to die at the time.
I was raised in a former Fundamentalist environment for a huge chunk of my life and was born two years after Last Temptation. I was told it was a blasphemous movie and I didn’t get to watch it until after college. I loved it, watched it a few times and I still have the Criterion DVD. Dafoe plays a great White Jesus and the film itself was such a great introspection into the humanization of the Man called Christ (the Anointed). I think so many Fundamentalists (I’m sure other Christians too) didn’t catch the (SPOILERS) end Temptation as a mental daydream and they also *really* latch onto the Divinity of Jesus while throwing out the fact that 1) he was a man and 2) most men/women/non-binary people experience temptations.
I thought it was an expertly pulled off depiction of the "dual nature of Christ." But I grew up in a Catholic household, so I didn't see it until I was an adult...but I sure heard about it beforehand!
16:55 "These movies are not converting anyone to christianity, they are merely reaffirming socially conservative christianity for socially conservative christians" I would think this would be evident from the fee for access - usually the materials and actions meant to convert people are far more sinister and rather than opting in, one must opt out. I would love to see something focused on mission programs which pretend to be more mundane things without agendas like campus comedy shows, self-help seminars, etc.
That is exactly my problem with those types of movies, they are not inspiring or have the power to move someone so much that they become a believer, they are merely preaching to the choir. Compare a Pureflix movie to The Prince of Egypt, people can’t stand Pureflix movies and they love The Prince of Egypt, that movie is so good that there are even atheist fans of it just because it is a good movie that just so happens to be a Biblical story.
@@morganyoung3557 I'm not religious at all, and even I love The Prince of Egypt! Great music, complex characters, a strong moral lesson, and some genuinely powerful imagery make that movie absolutely incredible
Was not expecting actual Bible quotes being used to refute evangelicals; I knew that was something that existed, but don't see it used enough. Just goes to show, evangelical Bibles have well-worn covers, and pristine pages.
@@swagmund_freud6669 Well no, it would. Even they didn't like to get into fights about the borders of Christianity, but they had a perfectly good word for people whose interpretation of Christianity is this tainted by non-Christian beliefs. Heretic.
As someone who grew up in christian churchdom but is not longer christian it can become really useful to have said “quotes” or understanding of the Bible. It often helps defuse foolish Bible thumper arguments of the Bible’s perfection and only the way of God. If it can be interpreted from an outside perspective 1 million ways then what’s to say that the truth of your church is the only “One Truth”. Though some will pull the even the devil can quote scripture line and immediately you know they are standing proud in the house built on the sand. 👏 👏
One of my favorite small business clothing designers used to work in the film industry designing costumes and worked on a few conservative Christian movies made by a rich businessman. She said management treated workers poorly and severely underpaid, which seems to go against the tenets of Christianity. Moral purity is just for show.
I've read somewhere that there have been labor lawsuits regarding Christian film productions. I can't find the articles, but they related to the hostile work environment and a variety of other labor violations.
@@jospinner1183 Sounds exactly like what the person was saying. They demanded long hours but refused to pay overtime. The only reason she made enough money is because she had a budget for costume materials and she was able to find old receipts for fabric.
Jesus would probably be completely against most of what conservative Christians stand for. He was a poor probably illiterate preacher who sounds pretty socialist or communist, with the talk about not being able to serve money and God. How unlike his warlord dad.
Or that their dogmatic adherence(in some denominations) to the King James Bible could/will be considered heresy by orthodox Christians and catholics. I still think blues Brothers is more Christian than the whole of pureflix together
I've never seen Old Fashioned-- it looks terrifying--but oh you went easy on Fireproof, man. I love how Caleb conveniently doesn't tell Catherine about the Love Dare till late in the story. It's supposed to seem romantic that he did it without her knowing, but the bare truth is that if he told her early on she would have said "I don't want to be married, stop trying to keep me here, I mean it" and we might actually see how his efforts dismiss her entirely. Because in order to be a truly "biblical husband" he would have had to say, "But God told me to love you, so I'm gonna love you, screw your thoughts and feelings."
Context collapse is ENDEMIC to Christianity, intensified by fundamentalist evangelical doctrine. I'm not sure how much of a problem this is in other religions (I know Islam gets abused a LOT but not sure if it's in this specific way) but it's especially noticeable here.
@@Gloomdrake nailed it. Ironically, and I mean this in the fullest sense of the word, therein begins a toxic parasocial relationship with the dear pastor because he's the leader of the church and congregation. They forget about their own core beliefs in their god because they start to elevate the leader to a level that is toxic.
It's interesting. To a socially conservative Christian these romantic movies might be profound, but to most other people these relationships are pretty toxic.
As an exvangelical, these movies DID feel profound. A standard I (nor anyone else) could never live up to and if only I could be more devoted. My relationship with Jesus did have a lot in common with my marriage to my emotionally abusive ex.
I Once approached a pastor or priest who had been protesting abortion for years outside a park near my home. I pointed out all the passages condoning abortion in the bible (there are a lot of them). I brought my own bible for this purpose and did my best to be respectful and never raise my voice. He accused me of loving murder. Pointing out that his book condoned abortion did not make him quote a passage I had overlooked, possibly one that could be interpreted as stating the opposite. He just Stated That I must love murder and Satan and I would burn in hell. That day made me realize that reasoning with someone who has no ability to, is not worth my time as the task is Sisyphean. I'll leave it to someone who is truly masochistic to argue with the cultists.
To be fair, the bible is so inconsistent in its messaging that there are passages that could support any position someone was to take. The problem is when people don't bother to try to reconcile contradictory instructions and instead just ignore all the passages that don't support a preexisting position. It's really, really frustrating.
@@ttthecat I'm a fan of Numbers 5, it's basically a magic spell to make a woman miscarry, though that's somewhat open to interpretation and my Catholic New American translation fudges the text so it doesn't quite say the same thing as my King James or NIV says. Go figure! I don't know of other verses, but I too would like to hear about them. I'm sick of the forced birth movement cornering the market on the bible.
@@ttthecat That was not the first time I talked to him. That park was on my walk back from work... my previous conversations with him went better than that last one. @Kate Friend already pointed out Numbers 5 : 11-21 Then there's Hosea 9 : 12-14 and Deuteronomy 28 : 18 (sorry for not using the proper "bible formatting"... If I do YT thinks it's a timestamp). One point about translations (so all bibles not written in a dead language) euphemisms, idioms, metaphors, ect. do not translate well. For instance, a woman's thigh is a euphemism for the womb... just ask a rabbi. In fact, if you have any questions trying to clarify the old testament any practising Jewish person will know better than an evangelical priest... from my experience anyway (it's their books). As a final point: Be careful who you argue with... some religious people are fine and caring people who don't bother anyone... some are cultists who will find any justification to cause you harm for disagreeing with them. Please stay safe. 0:D
@@Mr_December Sisyphean is an adjective related to the ancient Greek myth of Sisyphus, who was cursed by the gods in his afterlife to perpetually roll a boulder up a hill, only to lose control of it near the peak and see it roll all the way down again. So a "Sisyphean" task is one that is burdensome and pointless: you work hard at it and only end up back where you started.
(SA warning) Did you find a movie on there called "Loving the Bad Man"? It's about a woman who gets r-ped, and the r-pist goes to prison... before he is forgiven and then killed in prison while the woman has his child. I was forced to watch that as part of my youth group in middle school. it was fucked up and even my christian foster parents were confused as to why we watched it lmao
holy shit wtf I hate that "you must forgive everyone, even your r-pist" bs conservative christians love to force of survivors. such a messed up thing to teach young people
2:23 This creeps me out so much. This basically implies that Clay shouldn’t be alone with another woman, lest he be “unable to control himself”, which is quite alarming. Spoiler alert: if the only thing stopping you from taking advantage of someone else is the possibility of divine punishment, then you need to seriously evaluate your life choices.
I work at a bookstore and 90% of 'inspirational fiction' is romance. Mostly Amish, with the authors' understanding that no one from the Amish community is gonna get on their case about accuracy.
Complete truth. When I worked at a discount bookstore a full quarter of our mass market paperbacks were evangelical or Amish romances; women would come in and buy 5 or 10 of them at a time.
Fiction is all about giving people what they want - a compelling fantasy. Some people like a fantasy of fighting against evil, and they read thrillers. Some people want a fantasy about adventure on a grand scale, and read fantasy or science fiction. But a lot of people want a fantasy relationship - a partner who truly loves them, and a promise of a happy-ever-after. For those, there is romance.
@@hopefullyhelping6664 It's so hard to just Exist Without Romance because it's EVERYWHERE and reminding you of this thing you're supposed to feel/do/be but aren't. Ads, stories, movies, freaking billboards 💚🤍🖤🤍💜
He was sleeping with her to comply with an ancient Hebrew practice- her husband died before they could have children so as the brother he was supposed to give her a child (I know I know- so weird...it was a very different time). But the point still stands is that Onan was not masturbating, he was pulling out, which, interestingly enough is also what conservative Christians call "natural family planning."
Due to old rules if she didn't have a child she couldn't keep her husband's things and she would basically be homeless with the brother in law owning everything. G asked Onan to get her pregnant since as her husband's brother the child would be from the same bloodline and all her husband's property would be safe. Onan used the opertunity to fuck his brothers widow while basically intending to scam her out of property which is why G is pissed.
I feel fortunate Pureflix was not around between high-school and enlisting. I was in a spiritual place way too close to their worldview at the time, and my stepfather would have absolutely subscribed.
I grew up in Orthodox Christianity and was very devouted to prayer&reading the Bible and other texts as a kid. However, no Christian education ever gave me as much knowledge on the Bible as atheist youtube. No longer a Christian, I continue my studies because of my interest in European culture&history. So I really enjoy videos like this. Good job!
As a self-taught student of comparative theology I have been frankly shocked on numerous occasions at how little American Christians know their own holy book. It's like they don't read it at all, or at least only cherry-pick the bits they want to hurl at others.
@@stevepittman3770 Yeah, like what Bart Ehrmann always tells about his theology classes. When he asks: "How many of you think the Bible is the infallible word of God?" most hands raise. When he asks: "How many of you have read the Bible cover to cover?" He only sees a single hand here and there. Then he says: "Wow, I don't claim this book is God's word, YOU claim it. I think for someone who believes this, it would be interesting to know what God has to say!"
This reminds me of the time when I regularly watched movies like God's Not Dead, Fireproof, Courageous and October Baby. I think I went to go see Courageous in theaters with friends (also Evangelicals) and we all stood up during the call to action at the end... Ugh I'm cringing so hard right now. Yeah this video is spot on.
"the bible is a series of books and letters of sometimes barely connected topics combined in one tome." so well said and would have saved me so much time and rediscovery if i had it before 18 years of catholic school
This isn’t really like a point but I find it interesting that this IS a rule in Theravada Buddhism for monastics, not to be alone with a man/woman (depending on whether you’re a nun or a monk). It’s specifically so that people don’t question the celibacy of the monastics.
Thank you for specifying "socially conservative Evangelicals" - as an Episcopalian in an open and affirming church, it gets annoying when people say "Christians do/think this awful thing" when they really mean that Evangelicals have those beliefs.
Liberal Catholic here, feeling the same thing. Of course, I know there are devout Catholics who have been sucked into the mainstream evangelical machine, but I'm not one of them, verdammt! The conservative evangelical Christian movement is actually a (noisy) numerically minority nation-wide, last I knew. Very noisy.
@@katefriend4085 but with the states being a hub for evangelicals , with its cultural influence, the rest of Christendom gets compared to them. Which is infuriating to an extent.
My Christian friend came over last night and wanted to watch a religious movie with me, we wound up watching Tortured for Christ and it wasn’t great but one of the other movies he brought was a pure flix movie and I ALMOST wanted to watch it. Sean Aston was in it. Prolly bad but I love that guy
I'm not being sarcastic. This puts The Handmaiden's Tale and its critique of our society entirely into perspective for me. There are plenty of adults I know whose beliefs probably don't stray too far from the guy in the movie mentioned. Yikes
Exactly! The Bible isn't exactly a book; it's an anthology of works around a specific culture, chosen by committee. (Well, committees, plural. The Catholic Bible has a different canon from the Protestant Bible, and I believe the Orthodox Bible has its own separate (overlapping) canon.) To think of it as unified in support of late-20th-century/early-21st-century yt American evangelical fundamentalism, you have to come at it with your conclusion already intact, ignore or dismiss any dissonance, and, preferably, scapegoat anyone with a different view as "worldly"
even within the Protestant camp (Presbyterian for me), I remember there being a King James version, the New International version and just as I was leaving the church a New American Standard Bible was released. Though i'm pretty sure it's the Star Wars Special Editions business model of boosting sales that explains this.
eh, can we not? the GOP is far worse than the Taliban. we shouldn't have to bring up brown people to scare others into realizing American conservatives are bad. I feel this only contributes to the stigma
My man over here taking multiple shots for the team. You're doing the Jarls work, sir. I'd embrace you and give you two sidewinder European kisses but I would need us to talk through a screen door for at least 4 or 5 days. Well done.
My favorite podcast is "God Awful Movies", a podcast making fun of these kinds of movies in detail, so I heard about most of the movies you talked about. And oh man, Christian Movies (tm) are an endless pit of horribleness.
Yes...but, unfortunately, this is only a small sampling of the greater nightmare realm of Christian ""cinema"" about "romance" and even "love." Like, so much of it boils down to the segment at the end about never considering divorce (even when the husband is a cheating, abusive, potentially homicidal man-child) (see: War Room), viewing any abusive/toxic relationship as just needing a little more prayer (like how that "I Can Only Imagine" film framed the singer of that song as needing to reconcile with his a-hole dad), or, perhaps the worst of these, trying to frame a victim getting together with their rapist as a good, romantic thing ("Loving The Bad Man"...I shit you not). And then they turn around try to frame Muslim and atheist families as particularly abusive, toxic environments you need to flee from (see: God's Not Dead).
Are you a theologist by trade? I’ve learned a lot about biblical texts and their various translations and contexts from you over the years, and it’s a topic that you are always very well researched on!
I don't know about Leon, but if you're looking for more biblical stuff from a historical/academic/secular perspective, you might like Religion For Breakfast. Really well researched and some cool archeology!
Well said. It took me a very long time to recover my faith from years of this kind of abuse. If I get into a dispute with a fundamentalist on subjects of purity I like to remind them that God will forgive them for being merciful to themselves and others.
Geez, I grew up as an evangelical Protestant, and I never even heard of avoiding _kissing_ before marriage, let alone not being alone in a room with a woman. Have evangelical relationship standards somehow gotten even more conservative in the past 20 years? Or have expectations of self-control slipped so much that single Christian men should live a cloistered existence until they put a ring on it?
ive heard readings of the 'looking at a woman with lust is adultery' one as a colourful way of saying that disrepecting women and viewing and using them as objects of lust is a sin.
Gosh, I LOVE your deconstruction of christian ideology. Thank you. And yes, as a catholic-raised atheist, I do take waaay too much glee in owning dem christian conservatives XD Thank you for creating the media I can indulge in. It's hella interesting to learn all this stuff. Would love that knowledge to be more mainstream!
Jesus, Old Fashioned sounds like conversations I had with my conservative Muslim friends who had to be careful with being alone with a woman. Even they thought it was annoyingly extreme.
mike pence’s favorite movie. i missed the patreon release, too busy at work earning riches for the capitalist owners on a weekend supposedly dedicated to honoring the workers. Im 2/3rds of the way into the weekend, and i do not feel the least bit honored. seeing an upload from renegade cut helps a little though. Actually it helps a lot. Thank you.
This is the first I've heard of the term and origins of the Modesto Manifesto, though I've seen its principles echoed by creeps such as Dennis Prager before. Also, the names Amber and Clay in a movie called OLD Fashioned? As in fossilized tree resin and ancient ceramic pots? Such theme, very metaphor.
@@jospinner1183 I actually bet they had a different message in mind, OR put a lot of effort into finding the 'right' names, if only because, as noted, this was supposed to be a rebuttal to 50 shades of Grey. Where the leads are Anastasia Steele and Christian Grey. So Christian Grey becomes Clay Walsh, and Anastasia Steele becomes Amber (no last name given).
Have you seen the Maggie Mae Fish video about the movie Fireproof? That was an incredible video, I'd highly recommend it for a more in depth take down of the "Love Dare" philosophy.
Sometimes i wish evangelicals would just talk to some rabbis about tanakh instead of going off on weird supercessionist interpretations of the """"old testament,"""" but i know how those conversations would go. -_-
I have to say, the idea of a romance film where one person refuses to be alone in the room with another person (though due to a quirk or misunderstanding rather than religion) would make a really interesting premise.
0:26 I recently watched all the Apocalypse films for a project I finished a few months ago, and for some reason I was so stoked to see that footage of that guy digging up his father's grave. I love the line in the movie that's all, "His grave was empty Helen! It was incredible!" Also, the "A Thief In The Night" series goes places.
Now this is not necessarily applicable to all of American Christians, but I find that American (extreme) 'Christian' culture more or less fall from the Puritan virtues. Puritans perceived that dancing is seductive, the projection of 'iconographic' people (aka visual art and dolls) are as similar to some voodoo shenanigans or some sort of séance. These perceptions may have come from a conservative era, but in truth, these ideas came from the extreme misconceptions of what they think what the bible says. Just as there are the Isis, Christian puritans have a knack to be more controlling over their populace; cherry-picking verses that suit their own agenda. As a Christian. nothing is more maddening than people weaponizing the bible into blunger people into submission.
I've thankfully never watched Old-Fashioned, but I've watched Cinema Snob's review of it, and the funny thing is that I can see some potential in a character like Clay. However, instead of showing him as deeply flawed and in need of change, the movie frames him as like 99% correct for the entire runtime. So I guess it's a good analogy for conservative Christianity in modern times and how it views itself, in that sense.
As a person who goes by Clay in his daily life and rarely ever hears it except when people refer to me, this video was jarring. As a Clay watching this video and hearing his name used to refer to the protagonist in some romantic Christian propaganda film, this video was horrifying.
Regarding the King James bible: I went through the Confirmation process at my church and was given a KJ bible as a present, so I show my pastor. He looks at the cover, goes to the church business officer and asks her why she ordered that version. He says, "That is the worst interpretation of the bible..." The officer's explanation was, "Well it was the cheapest..."
"Two people dating do not learn about each other." I'm sorry, but isn't that the whole dang purpose of dating someone? I mean i get the fact the man was sheltered his whole life, and mommy most likely raised him to hate all women, but dang man.
Since when did the contents of a religious text actually inform the behaviour of fundementalists? We all know these texts are to be used as a post-hoc justification for our preconcieved bigotry
I find it funny that secular sitcoms that we're used to with the characters would make fun of the person who chooses no sex before marriage but then in the end the character explains why he made this decision and ultimately earns respect for that decision why can't Pure Flix do the same thing with their movies
I love the way you discuss religion. It’s always so multifaceted and I genuinely learned so much and gained an interest in real theology thanks to you(and a couple others). I had no idea how wrong most Christians were!
Here I was thinking one of the big draws of Protestantism was being able to get divorced. I mean a certain English guy named Henry went to a lot of trouble to be able to do just that.
Great video. Maggie Mae Fish also did videos covering Fireproof and I'm in Love with a Church Girl. I highly recommend the one for I'm in Love with a Church Girl because it shows that earning a fortune through drug trafficking is ok and the cops will even let you go once you convert to Christianity.
Growing up, I was encouraged by parents and church to never be alone with a woman if I wasn’t married to her. The problem wasn’t that I’d be tempted by her, however. The reason I was given was that you never want to give the appearance of sin, even if none happened. So, going to a liquor store or bar, staying too late at certain friends’ houses, etc we’re all painted in the same light. I’m still trying to get over this paranoia about how others are judging me.
@@listman3865 The problem is that causing another Christian to doubt is, according to the folks who raised me, itself a mortal sin. As in, if someone sins and I’m the reason that they sinned, I’m an accomplice to their sin and due to my maturity in faith I am more responsible because I should have known better. Or something. It all gets very muddy. Point is that if someone else fucks up, you’re at fault for their failure, and by extension the loss of salvation of whoever that person might have saved. Nowadays, if you rarely leave the house and don’t have many friends then you can’t fuck up someone else’s trip to heaven. So that’s what I do.
Thanks for making this one, my dad pressured my sisters and I to watch Old Fashioned and I hated everything about it, but had a hard time figuring out how to articulate it. The way he forces her to stand out in the cold while he fixes her sink and they try to make it seem romantic and cute? 😬😬😬 No thanks
Great video! I’d love to see you do one on Bella, I saw it there on the Pureflix page. It’d be very topical because it’s an over-the-top anti-abortion film that my class was forced to watch in Catholic school. Literally everyone walked away joking that if you don’t want your baby, don’t have an abortion, just give the baby to a man you barely know who looks like Jesus.
Thank you for subscribing to Pureflix so I dont have to. I had the same idea as you, out of curiosity more than anything, but since you did it, I don't have to give them any money. Thank you for suffering for us.
Thank you for all you do. I thoroughly enjoy your content and appreciate the work it takes to research and engage these topics from a thoughtful and grounded perspective. You're doing good work and it deserves to be recognized. Thank you.
It's very human to turn to media content one finds comforting. The popularity of these films (and Hallmark romances) is evidence of people's humanity. It may not be a productive human trait, but it's not like it's a new one.
