Jon Snow's parents haven't been revealed yet in the books, but the show runners didn't make it up. R+L=J is the most well known book theory out there, and has essentially been confirmed to be true. George RR Martin, the writer of the books, was testing the showrunners when he asked them who Jon's mother is, to see how seriously they followed the books. The reason he ultimately he gave them the rights to make the show was that they guessed right.
It is pretty obvious right from book one, with how much it showed Ned htinking about his sister and how she made him make her a unknown promise. "Promise me, Ned..." That quote from Lyanna must go through Ned's head a dozen + times in book 1.
The Real tragedy is Ser Alliser Thorne, he was bitter towards Jon Snow because he was Ned Starks blood. He didn't like Ned because he lost to Robert Baratheon while fighting with Rheagar on the Trident. When Robert killed Rheagar, Ser Alliser was pardoned to the wall, where he conspired to kill the son of the Prince he served with his whole heart.
Ned was such a noble and selfless man 😢 he allowed everyone to think he cheated on his wife and fathered a bastard just to honor his sisters dying wish to protect her son ❤
As harsh as it sounds, Catelyn's hatred for Jon helped sell the lie. If she was too nice to him, people might start to wonder. Which is likely why Ned never told her, or even really tried to make her treat Jon better.
@@RavenStillBeguiling you're right, that is probably the primary reason. But I think what I wrote is still true: that her hatred of Jon ensured that nobody questioned the lie.
She was also a very impulsive woman. I think she might have blurted out the truth about Jon's past if anybody had ever said anything about Ned's infidelity to her face
Ned's confession was important because it showed he would lie to save his family.. and Rheagar is Danys older brother, which means Jon is the rightful heir to the Iron Throne. (Why Robert would kill him) Stark and Targaryen blood has never happened,. Starks are the oldest house, they aren't Andals, they are the Firstmen, their blood is considered magic (Wargs and Greenseers) the only other time a person had Targaryen and First men blood was a bastard named Brendon Rivers, he was historically important, he served as Master of whisperers, Hand of the King, and Lord Commander of the Night's Watch after he was banished,. eventually he went north of the wall alone and just disappeared.. he was known as "Lord Bloodraven" "The last greenseer" and "The three-eyed crow"
@@Gwenhwyfar7 1) what does that have to do with the representation of a battle? and 2) check your history books again, because it's not as rare as you think through the middle ages.
@@sodblitz3445 Nothing, but everyone needs to stop with the spoilers in this thread but...You claimed he was the rightful heir. He won't be if he's a bastard. Dany is next in line. Those are the rules of Westeros. I know it happens in real history. William the Conqueror was a bastard.
They fucking SCREAMED the truth at us all along. The two best clips: 1. That knowing smile Littlefinger gives after Sansa said Rhaegar raped Lyanna. 2. Measter Ammon saying a targaryan alone in the world is a terrible thing....and John walks in RIGHT THEN.
See why Ned was so adamant in Robert not pursuing the deaths of all the living Targaryens, because he knew in the back of his mind that Jon was one. The thing that gets me the most is that Ned was such a man of honor, and yet he'd rather live his life with his wife and everyone else believing he was unfaithful to her, than reveal the truth. That's how much he loved his sister and took seriously the vow to protect her son.
at the expense of his wife mistreating his son, tho. cat would never have said a thing about jon if she knew; she was a real one (excluding her treatment of her stepson).
@@thecavalieryouth I definitely hear what you're saying. It was really unfair to Jon, but would she have kept it a secret? Who knows what might have come up, I guess we'll never know for sure!
@@thecavalieryouth Cat actually treated Jon pretty well for a bastard living under her roof. She didn't love him, but she wasn't abusive towards him. Jon was treated far better than any pretty much any highborn bastard in the realm: he was raised the same as his legitimate siblings, he grew up as one of them and was considered an equal by all of them (except maybe Sansa). Arya, Bran and Robb all identify Jon as the sibling they are closest to, Robb makes him his heir. Jon really didn't have it bad as a kid.
Jon is Daenerys’s nephew her brother Rhaegar is his father! You should also record your reactions to the history & lore videos! A lot of new reactors are doing that & it’s received pretty well
So I completely forgot, since you already finished s5, I was going to say you should watch the Samuel Jackson narration of game of thrones lol there aren’t spoilers past s5. It’s just for jokes, when watching it you can imagine the people who haven’t seen game of thrones reactions to the way it was narrated 😆 ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-6N4gEJ_ED98.html Feel free to check it out:) if even not for a reaction What pisses me off is Cat will never know that Jon didn’t deserve the hate she gave him, and that Ned was never unfaithful. Ned didn’t lie, Jon does have Stark blood in him. Jon is Dannys nephew technically, his dad is Danys brother. So Jon is both Targaryen and Stark- POWERFUL AF. “If your father would choose honor on one hand or someone he loves in another which would he choose” Jon: he would choose what was right. - this is important to Jon’s character arc put a pin in that. Jon is very much like Ned, and he always chooses what actually is right but not just what’s right for him and the family but what’s right for everyone, in that sense he’s actually better then Ned
Rhaegar didn't just run off with Lyanna because he felt like it. The title of the series is not Game of Thrones but is actually a Song of Ice and Fire Rhaegar believed his son would be the Prince that was Promised and the "Song of Ice and Fire" Only one woman could be the "ice" and Rhaegar himself was the fire. Jon was conceived not because of some love affair but because Rhaegar believed Jon would be the one to save Westeros from the White Walkers, in fact while Lyanna probably was not raped, its more than likely she was manipulated by Rhaegar into believing that he loved her. For Rhaegar sacrificing thousands was worth it to save millions.
Lying to protect Sansa was a large foreshadow as well, as it showed Ned, even though he cared so much about his honour, was willing to dishonour himself to protect the people he loved (lied about cheating on his wife and having a bastard child to protect his sister's son and keep his promise to her to protect him). R + L = J was an incredibly popular theory. It was somewhat harder to see coming in the show though. In the books it was a lot more obvious.
The last book ended with Jon's death. But yes, all the clues and evidence are laid out quite clearly in the books. Us readers knew who Jon's mother and father were before the end of season 6. It was rather clear to any intuitive reader, but the show helped confirm it.
You should definitely watch Jon Snow The white Wolf by Zurik 23M. Have you watched any extra videos besides the history and lore vids? A few others that I think are great for reactors to film are the 3 honest trailers for the show(of course you would have to wait to watch the 3rd one as it would spoil the last 3 seasons), also the Bad Lip Reading for GOT called "Medieval Land Funtime World" the extended version, as well as the Red Nose Day video starring the band members from Coldplay
Knowing this makes Neds story even more sad. Constantly having to lie to his friend Robert. Constantly taking the burden of being seen as dishonoring his wife in order to keep his sisters son safe, and keep peace between their houses. Giving a false confession to being a traitor to give Sansa and Arya a fighting chance to stay alive in the city. Eddard is still probably my favorite character of the series still, even tho he was just in the first season.
If you were watching GoT in real time, you more than likely knew about this. It was the most talked about theory of the whole series. That's why the reveal was done like that without saying a word. Anything else would've been redundant. Most of the audience knew. They were just waiting for the confirmation. The transition to Jon's face was basically that moment of exhilaration. The easters were never really meant to be clues for a whodunit. They were too vague for that. They were more a wink wink to viewers who were actively looking for it. Of course when you're going into the series blind years later, it's pretty hard to pick up on those.
In the books, the Tower of Joy scene when Ned finds Lyanna in a bed of blood, and her last words are "promise me Ned", happens a lot sooner than it does in the show. So that, plus the books coming out years before the show, lots of people had a lot of time to speculate about Jon's parentage. You having just watched the show and not looking into any of those theories, it is understandable you didn't get it until they showed that scene on screen, and actually included more dialogue and them handing Ned a baby
I always wondered if the actor who played Ned was told about the R+L=J theory because of that last scene between him and Jon. When he talks about Jon’s mother, his voice wavers like he’s about to cry and it’s so clear that he’s thinking of Lyanna. Beautiful scene.
So basically I think Ned kept the secret from everyone (cat especially) because what Noble woman would love their husbands bastard? It’d seem weird. Cat also could’ve told little finger, because she trusted him, and than the word could’ve spread so quickly. The only people who knew were Ned, Holland Reed (Meera’s father), most likely Benjin, and the midwives at the tower of joy. Jon would’ve been killed if Robert ever found out
I'm surprised this didn't include Jon's conversation with Benjen before he took the black. Benjen was seemingly the only person who knew the truth. He tells Jon that if he joins the nights watch he could never have children. Jon say's he doesn't care about that and Benjen says, "You might, if you knew what it meant..."
@@cinesoda2082 His comment alone is enough to suspect that Benjen knew. To just dismiss it like he was just telling Jon he may want kids one day is silly.
@@cinesoda2082 there was a month or two period between the tourney at harrenhal and when Lyana was supposedly abducted and Benjen was there with his siblings . I think he felt guilty about it and that's why he joined the night's watch .
People often say A Song of Ice and Fire is the tragic love story of Rhaegar and Lyanna. But I look at it as the tragic love story of Robert and Ned. Ned had a choice. He chose his Brother in Arms, he took the fall for Robert's vindictiveness, and for the rest of his life he was tormented by whether he had made the right choice. There's that description where a young lean and fierce Robert caving in Rhaegar's chest with the Warhammer, as the rubies that made up the Prince's dragon sigil scatters into the wind turning the water of the river Trident blood red. It's such brilliant description. The conflicting inner monologue that Ned has throughout the first book about his sister,Robert and Rhaegar has to be some of the best fiction I've read. "Look at us, Ned,” Robert said. “Gods, how did we come to this? You here, and me killed by a pig. We won a throne together…”
There are some GoT parody videos that are well worth watching (and reacting to on your channel); Westerosi Rhapsody, the GoT musical from Coldplay, Jon Snow and Toothless (the dragon from How to Train Your Dragon), the satirical song "If GoT Had Lyrics", and "A Character I Used to Know". They are all on RU-vid, very entertaining and funny, and none of them have any spoilers for seasons 7 or 8.
ngl, i have a hard time accepting rhaegar as a good guy. until the last 2 books come out, i'm gonna be a hater because that war destroyed his family and broke the realm. how many ordinary commonfolk had to die when ultimately these games the rich & powerful play had nothing to do with them? it often makes so little difference to ordinary folks' lives who takes the throne, but they experience the worst of it when these great houses have a falling out.
Not sure why people recommend this video. It was a fan theory at the time, since it took so long between seasons, and the true answers are actually revealed in the show...
I don't remember if you watched the Histories and Lores for each season. If you never watched those then this is a good time to watch the "GoT Conquests and Rebellions" video. It's an animated summary of the Robert's Rebellion part of the lores. It's like an hour something long, you don't have to react to it. But it's pretty cool stuff to watch in your spare time.
Ned Not telling Catelyn Stark Was the Best thing because, 1) He Spent 1-2 days with her to MARRY & consummate the marriage , he didn't know her too trust her with that secret. 2) It was good that he didn't tell her because , YOU saw what Catelyn Can do to save her Children. The lengths she'll go to. If Questions arose that Jon was Rhaegar Targaryens SON , the whole House Stark and Cat's children would be in Danger from Robert and She could just Throw Jon under the bus , to save her children. Ned would've failed to protect Jon from Robert as he Promised to lyanna.
Immediately after 6x10 I had to rewatch the entire series again. And it is quite remarkable. Sean Bean does a TREMENDOUS job dealing with Robert's talk of Lyanna and Targaryens. And keeping that secret, that promise to his sister. Knowing that she was not raped and all the other stories. And that scene when he's watching Arya learn to sword fight & thinking back to the Tower of Joy.
No spoiler* not sure if u know ab this already buuuut There’s a story in the books that I love… before the rebellion happened, idk where this took place but Rhaegar was singing at a dinner I think and Lyanna was listening and started crying bc i guess he sang so beautifully.. her older brother Brandon Stark was laughing at her and she punched him. Nobody suspected anything about them at the time I believe.. I might’ve got parts wrong but that’s what I remember the most. 🤍🤍🤍🖤🖤🖤
The books weren't finished when the series came out, and in fact, they still aren't finished to this day. The reason so many people dislike the last few seasons of game of thrones is because with the first handful of seasons the writers worked from the storyline already laid out in the books. But the last few seasons the writers basically had to finish the rest of the story with no reference material. So it starts to feel disjointed because you essentially have two different story tellers. Theres George RR Martin's GOT and then there's Weiss' and Benioff's GOT. Of course George RR Martin helped them write the series, and he already had a general plot line laid out for the last of the books...but most people feel the last few seasons are missing that level of detail the earlier seasons have. Also, almost every single person agrees that the ending was completely out of line with the books and how the series should end. No one liked it. I dont even think George Martin liked it...
They literally tell you who Jon is when all the Stark kids find the wolfs in season one. His wolf is off to the side hiding (secret) and it’s a white (Targaryen) wolf (Stark)
Did this happen in the books? The short answer is "we don't know". George hasn't finished the books. And also in the last book there are some hints that I don't want to spoil that indicate that there might be another Targaryen with claim to the throne, but the show never developed this storyline.
Jon is the descendant of the former prince of the whole of Westeros and a member of the strongest northern family. He has a stronger claim than any of Roberts "children", Roberts wife or the sister of the prince.
When Aemon asked him "if your father was forced to choose between honor, and those he loved, what would he do?" Jon replies "he would do whatever was right, no matter what." He's kinda wrong. Ned chose his family over "honor" both times 💔
@DisLB obviously choosing his family was the right thing to do. That's not what I'm saying. Jon still believes that Ned would choose honor IF it was the right thing to do. That's what his answer to Aemon literally implies.
@@Oswald_Thatendswald I actually always interpreted it as Jon believing that whatever choice Ned makes would be the right one, not necessarily that he’d choose honour.
Having another really rough day, so you know what time it is! Thrones with Miya! I took my chill pill, made dinner, got my coffee, time to hang out with the coolest girl on the internet. 🤗 I hope you're having a great day.
I'll never stop screaming "NED SHOULD HAVE TOLD CAT" because that alone would've changed so much. And Cat never would have betrayed Ned by spilling it.
They cut out a ton of content from the books. Many characters from the books were never in the show. Characters that were killed in the show are still alive so I think there are still many surprises to come.. he is just a huge procrastinators and he's getting older and keeps taking more jobs with shows. But Stannis still fighting the Bolton's . Euron attacking the reach. Victarion his brother taking the dragon horn and attacking slavers bay to aid Danny. Aegon or faegon attacking the stormlands . There is so much happening that the show left out and that's just off the top of my head at 1am so I think we still got a lot coming if he finishes it.
In my personal opinion I feel like Ned did the right thing in keeping the secret of Jon being a Targaryen because had Robert found out about it he would have killed Jon just because of the Targaryen blood that run through his veins that really would have thrown a monkey wrench to Ned and Roberts friendship cause I know Ned would not let that happen so they probably would have become enemies but I feel like he should have at least told Catlyn cause then maybe she could have raised and loved him as her own even though regardless she should have even believing that was ned’s bastard he was a mother less child that needed a mom and love and in that sense cat was being selfish and putting her feelings first which I get trust me I’m married but that child had absolutely no say so In being born to a “ married man “.
Remember when Kat went behind Robbs back and freed Jaime? Ned did the right thing not telling anyone although I suspect that Uncle Benjin knew by the look on his face when John calls himself “the bastard.
@@TheMightyOdin you are right I remember that but maybe by knowing she would have never had to free Jaime cause Ned would not have been imprisoned and maybe he would have still been alive and Robb would not be fighting a war lol…. I guess we would just always have to imagine the what if’s lol
Lord Stark permeates through GOT. All his children - blood and otherwise (Theon) remember the lessons and sticks by them eventually. Jon is constantly noble and tries to live by a code of honour. Even Sansa remembers when she sets Ramsey’s hound on him - pass the sentence - swing the sword. Facts!
No, you figured it out just fine. The first book was written in 1996 so book readers had years to piece it together. This show literally started youtube reaction videos. The first were a few Ned Stark's death from the book and the show. Then it really took off from the Reigns of Castamere episode aka The Red Wedding because the book readers were setting up their cameras for when their friends watched that episode. The crazy thing is the last series book, A Dance with Dragons, was released after the first HBO season aired. So the book readers were sitting on Jon Snow's death for 4 years with no resolution.
My absolute favorite tribute video is one for Arya which I will link below. I am for sure biased because she was always the character I felt the most affinity with. But I think this video does a really good job of capturing how far her character has come. Don't watch it until after season 7 though as it does include some clips from that, but its very much spoiler free for season 8 as it came out years before. - ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-p7R8uAuzrss.html
I had started watching Game of Thrones a lot later than when it first aired. I never believed that Ned cheated, but I never got the chance to figure the rest of it out on my own. Early on when I was still on season one, I was spoiled by a book fan with the whole R+L=J hypothesis.
i just binge watched all your GoT reactions from s1 to now and omg your reactions are amazing, i definitely think you should start playing story based games with how invested you become with characters it would be such an interesting playthrough!!
While you were sick, you probably should have grabbed these books! It's so worth your time because there is SO much more detail in them than the show. I hope you do decide to read them one day. 😊
honour was the most important thing to ned but he sacrificed his honour to defend Jon (claiming to have had an affair) and then sacrificed it again to defend Sansa (confessing to treason)
If Ned hadn't of died...I wonder if he would have tried to install Jon as the rightful king. He might have gone with Stannis as it was just simpler, but one can always wonder.
I think it’s great Stannis was skeptical about Jon being Ned’s bastard. Ned spent a lot of time as a kid with the Baratheon Brothers. Remember his warm reaction to Renly in Season 1. Even Stannis suspected it was unlikely.
No. It went downhill hill because GRRM didn’t finish the books like he promised he would and the HBO dipshits believed he would because he told him that the final two books were coming. Eventually the makers had to go on whatever information he gave them. I do think they should have had him in the writer’s room for the final 2 seasons. The fact they didn’t was their (HBO) ultimate failure.
No, they guessed it from the books, but I think it gives more clues than show watchers got. Out all the reactors I have watched, only 1 figured it out before the reveal, I think it was toward the end of season 5.
I think the show gave plenty of hints, it's just that it's spread out over 6 seasons and even more years. Unless you're binge watching it like she is, most people were not going to remember that type of stuff.
Seth Meyer’s Late Show has a very funny video with Kit Harrington that came out after season 5 where Jon Snow comes over for a dinner party. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-BabsgCQhpu4.html
