Ray is strolling into irrelevant (Rob Parker) territory here. We all plead our own case better than the case of others but don't become deranged. Great quarterback... success. Great defensive player... anywhere from bottom of the League to middling. If he keeps making obviously outrageous statements he'll no longer be someone anyone wants to listen to.
Marrick Batiste at least you get it. If only skip understood everything isn't an importance contest. Whenever he argues about who's better he says who would you rather have, insert this player or a quarterback. That measures importance, not how good he is.
Saints have a QB and no Defense.. how 's that working out? they dont even make the playoffs. Saints pretty much have the best offense in the league for years now, Drew can score 45, the other team is gonna score 50.
There is many ways to look at this. You see A. Donald can't win more the 2 games without a good QB. Then you have D. Brees can't win more the 7 games without a good DEF. I would take a all around decent players then one dominant player.
Irrelevant argument in this context through, because we're talking about the impact of a single QB vs. the impact of a SINGLE defensive player. All the arguments here seem to miss this point and keep referring to how important an ENTIRE defense is...I completely agree that a strong defense is key, but in the context of the video, I'd have to say that a top tier QB is more important than a top tier SINGLE defensive player.
C Dev even in the case of an entire defense, a QB is still needed. Remember how ESPN ran analytics on the best defense and got the '91 Eagles as first? They didn't even make the playoffs since Randall Cunningham got injured. There's also the Houston Texans for the last three years with the #1 defense and having no shot of getting out of the AFC. If you look at the best defenses people celebrate, they were always accompanied by good offenses too. The '85 bears had Walter Peyton, possibly the best running back of all time. The Steeler Curtain had Terry Bradshaw, Lynn Swann, and Franco Harris. People like to point to the 2000s Ravens, whose offense was "only" 13th in points scored, but even if you consider that a "bad" offense, that's the exception, not the rule.
they had no running game though, cunningham led them in rushing yards. You put a Jamaal lewis, marshawn lynch, we saw tom brady lose twice to a excellent D with good running game to compliment it. You can go back and time and look at dominant defenses and they are always at their best with a dominant running game, you can win without a qb.
bsstyle123 Once again, an excellent D is important...no one questions that. But this entire video is about a SINGLE defensive player vs a SINGLE offensive player (QB). People need to stop citing examples of dominant defenses. We are talking about ONE defensive player. ONE. Not an entire defense.
Peyton Manning threw for 141 yards, a pick, and 0 touchdowns and the Broncos won in SB50. Don't try and tell me that Ray is wrong here. He's simply trying to add value to defensive players, which are usually underrated, when rankings like the top 100 come out.
That's the whole defense. The argument here is that one defensive stud, is more important than an offensive stud (which simply isn't true). If you took JJ Watt and put him on the Browns, they would still never make the playoffs. If you took Aaron Rodgers and put him on the Browns, they would win at least 9 games.
The fact that Ray Lewis was able to win 2 championships with quarterbacks who have a worse career QBR than Baker Mayfield speaks volumes to his point about a dominant defender over a great quarterback. That being said there are few defensive players in history that can elevate everyone else on the defensive side of the ball like Ray Lewis did.
TiK Progress look at the 2002 ravens best defense ever and the defense got them the win. The ravens offense scored 7 but the defense had 2 other scores to beat the other team.(I forgot who)
@@deangeloj4349 sent him to his retirement? Brady still displayed signs of great play even in his last year. He isn’t scared of anyone. NOBODY sent him to retirement
Yeah defense wins championships you can't really name a Super Bowl team that won that was dominant offensively besides the saints but most teams that won a championship had the best or one of the best defenses in the league tom Brady's first Super Bowl was won with only 145 or so yards passing Peyton mannings last championship was won and his offense only had like 200 yards offensively the greatest offenses ever only won one or two chips usually with a very good defense the greatest show on turf only had one and scored 17 in their next one the 07 pats had only 14 points the 13 broncos scored 8 points
Skip tryna argue with Shannon Sharpe one of the best Tight ends of all time 3 rings and 8 pro bowls 10,000+ receiving yards And Ray Lewis in my opinion the greatest linebacker ever 2 rings , 13 pro bowls 2,000+ tackles
Just 5yrs from this clip, Ray Lewis claim was actually right, Aaron Donald has simply changed the way he’s marked and how the position is viewed, Elite.
Lawrence taylor is a once in a lifetime type of player, best defensive player ever. But look at it this way; there have been great defensive players (jamaal adams for example) who play for terrible teams with losing records. There have also been great QBs to play with a bad supporting cast and have little success, but it's better as a whole to have an offense that can score points than a top 10 defense. Even a top 10 defense lets up points in a game.
@@palereaper The Giants were an average team until LT arrived. His play elevated the play of the entire team. Great players turn terrible teams with losing records to Super Bowl champions. That's the impact LT had on the Giants and the rest of the league.
My guy A Donald played the Super Bowl against 42 year old Tom Brady and couldn't even get close to his his face. He was defeated by a simple adjustment of double teaming him on the line and when the time came for him to be on the 1v1 he was already frustrated and out of the game. You take the QB over a single defensive player.
Ray Lewis is definitely being biased here. Defense does win championships, but they don't score every game. A QB matters way more than any defensive player, unless there's a defensive player who can intercept every pass and return it for a touchdown every single game.
Having played with Sapp in college, Ray certainly saw firsthand what a dominant DT can do. As a Husker fan, I saw it too. Even against the #1 oline in the country in the Orange Bowl, Sapp was a monster.
If the argument was dominant TEAM defense, like the 2000 Ravens, 2013 Hawks okay, it makes sense. But ONE dominate defensive player over a QB ? Are you serious ? 😂
A single defender can affect the game I remember Derrick Thomas in the 90s record seven sacks against Seattle and completely dominated the game if a QB is getting hit all game the ball starts to come out too fast since the QB is shook worrying about getting hit. I watched football my whole life and I agree with neither but I have seen a defender bee so dominate he takes the offensev players heart
The way I view it, a Quarterback is the leader of a new revolution leading their team to the crown. A defense is responsible for protecting the castle. Offense scores, However DEFENSE really holds the floor.
I would take a qb first but after that, the pass rusher or linebacker is very important. The best defenses always have solid linebackers cause then you cant run on a team. After that offensive lineman. Then Id take a skillposition
The problem is that a defense can't be carried by a single person; whereas, an offense can be carried by a quarterback so quarterbacks should be put into a different category because they are just more important so we don't have this conversation all the time
Defense needs lots of players to collectively be dominant. A dominant QB on his own can lead a team to a championship with probably half the salary cap space taken up
Put Brady/Rodgers on the browns and see if they ever see the playoffs again. QB, next to WR,is the most dependant position in football, meanwhile Donald,LT,JJ,Von,Khalil can ruin your whole game by themselves
Peyton Manning was below average his last year. Carried by that #1 Rank BRONCOS D#. You can win a title with an average or Below QB, only if you have an ALL-TIME RANK DEFENSE.
Johnathan Clark u can never win with a below average qb. Probably average tho. Put Ryan tannehill on broncos he prolly win but osweiller wouldn't be able to do anything
That doesn't prove his point. You're saying an entire defense carried for Peyton Manning. Ray's point is that 1 good defensive player could be as dominant as a good qb.
I love Ray Lewis so much (and really the whole late 1990s to early 2010s Ravens I love) but I feel he overshadowed the greatness of possibly the best safety this game has ever seen, Ed Reed. You never hear any talk about that man and I know it's because Ray Lewis caught everyone's eyes, while Ed in the background leading the league in interceptions for 3 seasons as a safety.
Ray is being a bit bias. ( I mean he is one of the greatest "defensive" players ever lol) He has a valid point if you're talking about a few years ago. The league has changed so much now though. Now it seems that having a ok defense and a offense that can simply bombard you and out score you is more the makeup of the NFL. Teams that can easily put up 30 or more points a game make it tough for teams who don't have a dynamic quarterback and offensive playmakers to overcome those sort of attacks. Defense does now and will always matter but defenses wont consistently put up the points to win week in and week out. They both need each other to some extent. Always remember the game is decided by who has the most points on the scoreboard.
Marine Vet your argument just validate Lewis point, the NFL make it so easy for teams to score, that you don't a grea qb to win, but if you have a monster in your defensive line that can anchor your defense, I would take the defensive player all day. any decent qb can put big numbers in todays nfl
QB's can't take over a game by themselves, they need their Offensive Line to block for them and they need their receivers to make plays for them. I seen Von Miller basically CARRY the Broncos on his back to a Super Bowl by Dominating the AFC Championship Game and the Super Bowl! Also I'm Bias Lawrence Taylor is my favorite Player Ever and he also DOMINATED and took over games! So I'm GLAD Defensive Players are praised in this ERA! QB's are for people like Skip and Colin Cowherd to Drool Over but you don't win without a good Defense. Brady doesn't have the rings he have without a good Defense!
OTKP No he did not carry the broncos lmao. You forgetting they have the two best corners in the league and a great safety? They averaged the 2nd most turnovers in the league that year. And they were number 1 in passes defended. You're also forgetting he has Demarcus Ware on the other side of him as well who gets double digit sacks
Brady took a defense ranked 31st overall to the superbowl and almost won it despite them and his bad O-line. a single great defensive player cannot make the impact of a single great quarterback. they just can't. you remove the great bronco secretary in 2015 and von miller doesn't win the afc championship game in 2015. Lawrence Taylor was in a unique situation. offenses had always used a running back to block corner rushers and it worked for a long time until LT came around. now outside rushers are respected and blocked properly.
OTKP That's true that a QB needs a defense... but a defense is 11 starters plus depth. Hall of Fame has many defensive players that rarely got to the playoffs: Aeneas Williams, Cortez Kennedy, Lee Roy Selmon etc.
My list- I'm going to guess that the differences in importance with the positions are marginal, with the importance depending on the game situation 1.QB- biggest impact on high leverage moments, and can open everything up if dynamic as a scrambler too. 2. 4-3 De/ 3-4olb- puts pressure on all game so the QB doesn't have time to read/think 3. WR- one that can go up and get it and with soft hands can take 2-3 people to guard, and a fast one can demand stretching the defense to protect against the home run 4. C- if they can get a push for 2 running gaps, then that's 2-3 yards for your rb untouched. Leader of the O-L 5. LT- give the qb time to operate and protect from unseen hits 6. HB- Critical in short yardage and goal line situations, if capable as a pass catcher, then can cause responsibility issues for defense 7. MLB- middle of the field in the box, an area that a lot of action occurs, leader of the defense 8. Nose Tackle- 3-4 D-Line will get man handled without a true NT 9. TE- Creates mismatches/move the chains target for the QB, big bodied target in the red zone, if they can block, then can create a lot of plays from a single formation. I think cbs and safeties can be average if you've got some shared responsibility in coverages. Guards don't really have much to worry about besides creating 2 gaps up the middle. Pass rush not really a threat 4-3 DT/3-4 DE- just be there and protect your gaps, not much expected 4-3 OlB - just expected to cover their man or the flats zone And if I forgot to write about you, then I guess you're not that important
Here is the thing about defensive versus offensive, if you have the best qb in the nfl, your wide receivers will improve automatically. But with defensive players, it's different
Ray Lewis knows how to cancel out Tom Brady??? He is literally like 4-12 against Tom Brady. Show some respect. You want to talk about high standard, look at the standard Brady is held to.
Ryan Petley that doesn't mean tom Brady's team won't win it's a team game he's saying Tom Brady won't dominate us and be the reason they won. A la turnovers special teams etc
In no way did Ray Lewis's talent or leadership, match or limit Tom Brady's. It is a team game absolutely, but it is no coincidence that Brady's team beat them so often. Ray Lewis is fantastic and happens to be my favorite defensive player of all time, but it is flat wrong to say he neutralized Tom Brady. He won games against Brady, including 2 in the playoffs I believe but the record speaks for itself.
ray lewis was a freak of a defensive player.when they called the team out it wasn't a qb's name but ray's that they called out as ray lewis's falcons.i can not recall any other defensive player so honored.so they'd have to be on ray's level or better to be more important then the qb.i haven't seen any player that honored as to be seen as leader of the team and winning a super bowl did they win twice or three times i think twice but more then one was due to ray.few if any men can do that today because you can't hit qb's anymore.
Its not even close a dominate QB is worth about 3-4 defensive players. Look at Deshawn Watson and the Texans. Clowney is a 1st overall pick playing at a high level QB went down the season was over. Watt playing as good as can possibly be expected couldn't make up for Brock Osweiler. Its the same for every other position. Joe Thomas best in the business OT can't win a game with mediocre QB play. Would I rather have a lights out defense and special teams with an Ok QB or a lights out QB and an Ok defense and special teams is a different question. The answer is in on that question too Ravens Giants Buccaneers Bears Seahawks Broncos won SBs with avg QB who didn't make mistakes and great D.
When Brady won his 1st Super Bowl he was carried by an elite defensive unit. Mcginist, Law, Seymour, Milloy, etc. 2001 Patriots was a defensive team. So, really it all depends on the structure of your team at the time and how players progress during their careers.
Ray killed that dude. SMH. Great player but we would have never seen it had it went the other way. 52 got bodies on and off the field. LMAO people they built a statue of him.... Liked him to so definitely no hate but I remember when that happened clearly and it was real shaky baby. Right after came a Super Bowl title and a HOF career with another Super Bowl title... Ray is a Lucky dude...
Think about it if your defence locks up and allows 0 points the entire game (I know this dont happen but I'm trying to keep it simple) then all your offence has to do is go up to the 35 yard line and score 3 points and thats it you win
you mean when you are talking about one single individual and not a whole defense as a unit. What dominant defensive player would have single-handedly stop the dominant Tom BRady in that game?
At 3:15, Ray Lewis nailed it. Dominant defensive players changed the game to where offensive players fussed for changes. The most notable was when Mel Blount (Steelers) was so dominant that after one season, they changed the rules on defensive coverage; leading to far more pass interference calls and the 5-yard rule. NOBODY on offense ever changed the game so much, that the opposite happened.
I agree with him. I've watched it for decades with the NY Giants, no matter how many offensive stars they have they can't be a dominant team without having at least one superstar on defense. Lawrence Taylor, Michael Strahan, Sam Huff, Rosie Greer etc etc
No way Khalil Mack is a better football player then Derek Carr overall. But as great as Mack is and he is good we can win games without him. Derek Carr I'm not sure we can win one game without him.
Charles Haley was the guy that made me realize what Ray Lewis is talking about. That dude changed the complexion of so many games on that Dallas team. I saw that dude on Dallas reach over and grab the QB on a double team. Then the next play grab the running back and throw him like a rag doll. Incredible to watch.
I mean look at the panthers in 2015 and the packers(ish) 2016, they're offense alone carried that team, a defense matters more in post season then regular and only if all pieces mix together.
Even in Madden, defenses wins championships….it’s very rare that you get a qb that is as good as pat Mahomes and Tom Brady that can score consistently on the toughest defenses.
If Ray had said dominant DEFENSE over a dominant QB, I'd agree with him. But one dominant defensive player can't change your entire team the way a MVP-caliber QB can. The '14 Seahawks, '16 Broncos, and '00 Ravens are all great defenses overall that overcame below-average to average QB play with absolute dominance from their defenses, but imagine if the Ravens only had Ray Lewis, or the Seahawks only had Richard Sherman, or the Broncos only had Von Miller. Still potent, but not the game-changers those teams were as cohesive, complete defensive units anymore. To illustrate my point a bit more-imagine a trade between the Rams and the Packers. Aaron Donald for Aaron Rodgers. The Rams are instantly in the running for a wild-card spot in the NFC. The Packers, even though they just got arguably the best defensive tackle in the league, are now probably also just a wild card team at best.
I agree with ray Lewis though I've seen defensive players impact a game bigger then any offensive player I've seen. Lawrence Taylor and ray Lewis would literally put fear in your heart when you went against them. Something that dominant offensive players cant really do.
QB is the most important. Indy and Denver are the best examples; when Payton Manning was playing for both, they were super bowl contenders while today, the stadiums are empty.
Your defensive player argument is invalid when you said he cant win with that QB, that is the point, you can with TB12 with a rank 30 defense, but #1 defense such as jax, Minnesota still cant win with bortals. The Ravens only won 2 rings and the 2nd one was because of flacco throwing up. Ray Lewis is just bias, we get it.