Rediscovering Ancient Greek Music (2017) 

Great! Thank you.

Yesss. Thought I'd check back after a while

Assistido. Vânia Cristina.TTM

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With this info you have deserved a peace of land and a crown. Been looking for this piece of music for so long and given it up a year ago..thanks!!

‘After the failure of Athens’ campaign to conquer Sicily [in 413 BC], 6000 Athenian prisoners were kept in a sweltering Syracusan quarry. Only a few managed to save their lives - because they could sing Euripides’ music, of which the Sicilians were great fans. When they returned to Athens the survivors sought out Euripides to thank him for composing such memorable - and literally life-saving - music’. [Plutarch, Life of Nicias]. Their ghosts can now recall his music with new gratitude for the few extra years of life it granted them!

@@Demokritiades Um...Interesting recreation---but---Not sure about its accuracy. And I am not sure about if given the same instruments I wouldnt produce something FAR more interesting, rhythmically and in timing, yet of course I am a modern. To me, it sounds slightly like they are infusing a medieval music feel to the singing and playing. They have based their interpretation of ancient music based on early known medieval traditions that have come to us. I am not sure if we can guarantee that simply if we recreate the instruments and sing the songs, that we can do exactly as they ancients did. This certainty hasnt been provided and probably NEVER will, since, there are no recordings of ancient music. I am not sure that the basis of this recreation has merit if it is based on western medieval music, or medieval music in general. Do we have any idea about the sounds of ancient music other than mere notation. Just as today, as well, players may have had different ways of playing as well, and this might change over time.

@@devinreese1109 Dude, it's a common place that- if you listened to video rather than thinking up an (not) clever retort - the exact musical notation exists. You are aware of an invention called "the internet?" There is no reason therefore to appear an ass before 611,827 viewers (you're 828) as I say, this notation from Delphi and elsewhere, has been known for ages. You did stumble into one interesting point - about the possible relationship between medieval music and the music of "classical antiquity." It would seem the reverse is true, as some medieval music does indeed sound like some of the pieces performed in this video. This IS speculation, on my part. However, that the precise pitches of Greek music has been available for (ever practically) is not in dispute.

@@Demokritiades very very interesting research and results. Mr. D'Angour, is there some written document about your research work? I'd love to get depper in how you discover that symbols belongs to notation and how to translate it into tones, congratulations, great sound archaeology work!!

Stefan Hagel plays a kithara that he has designed. Barnaby and Callum play auloi built to replicate ancient instruments found in archaeological contexts.

Yeah, that's jaw-droppingly impressive. And I'm a mere pianist who's only heard of this technique in the legends of wind instrumentalists.

how is it possible, if you are breathing in and breathing out at the same time how is your brain/blood getting oxygen?

@@mcrettable Puff up your cheeks and try to breathe using your nose while keeping your cheeks puffed. That's it in the simplest terms.

That was beautiful

That tune is so much like the opening of this song here: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-hf1FpQxmOhQ.html

That's exactly why I want to major in it. History is never dead!

Optimism is cawardic. Ancient Greece disappear 2000 years ago. Listening today's Greece music and all their culture, is a barbarians.

everyone's commennts are just just from years ago

All you people saying this probably isn’t what it sounded like need to get in touch with reality. These guys are from Oxford university and the last 2000 years have been recorded near meticulously from various accounts in nearly every year. They have the instruments and a good idea of how the songs sounded. These people study these things with the utmost intent on being factually correct; they are not easily swayed by the corrupt pushing some nationalistic agenda. I know it’s hard to believe some people actually know a lot of things. And just so, there are seemingly endless historical accounts over the last 2000 years that help very well educated people such as these construct a clear picture of history that you average fools will never be capable of perceiving. Keep your ignorant comments to ourself. Philosophical doubt is useful in the hands of someone intelligent but offers the common fool a false sense of contentment in a world they never put a real effort into understanding. So they doubt and cast shame on scholars assuming they are ingenious.

Can you explain why?

True a bit unpleasant a bit frightening and epic

I think that's to do with the use of harmonic dissonance as produced by instruments like the dual pipes which are tuned only one note apart (hence lots of second intervals which tend to sound harsh to modern Western ears).

Well there is a reason Orthodox Christians believe dancing to music is devil worship. You'll hear that music is black magic, or that spells are contained within the music. Its a relaxed suggestive state, a trance. Like playing a note and getting all nearby flies to spin around clockwise. Just food for thought :P

@@Paid2Win christians are known for calling whatever they don’t understand demonic, its kinda their brand haha

@@ceilingeye entirely 🤣

That young man was born for this - like a messenger

Callum Armstrong-- pantastic!

@@NotMyName888 sort of like a modern day Hermes, maybe?

It has finally been posted as a separate song, here: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-6JFa8BZt2B0.html

Master Armand D'Angour it will elevate my spirit if one day I meet you and get some of your wisdom.I am also based in the UK

Your culture is the bomb! 😃 😄 lol

ευχαριστώ. θα χαρούμε να σας συναντήσουμε και να μιλήσουμε για το έργο.

Man you should really be proud, your ancient culture is the foundation of western culture...

totally agree @Marco Gardini

yes, or in the theatre of Dionysus in Athens - wonderful to imagine...

The music for sure wouldve been more rythmatic than we think. From all the people who studied the matter Mr D'Angour seems to have a more realistic aproach to what I personaly think the music of classical Greece sounded like. And if people wanna listen to an echo of the past I recommend them taking a look at the launnedas of Sardinia or to the music of mijwiz, yarghoul or arghoul of the near east.

Yes, it's truly incredible.

Athens and Korinth yes. As for Sparta, I doubt it. They were far too busy fighting and training for battle and left hardly anything behind them in terms of culture.

theo9952 Sparta was famous for its beautiful choruses and dances, so much so the rhythm and synchronism they developed actually aided them in battle. Spartans always raised the paean (victory song of Apollo) before and after a battle too. There would have undoubtedly been a lot of emphasis on music in Sparta, even if they weren’t as theatrical as the Athenians.

lucky you to be a Greek!!😘

The University of Glasgow has been trying to reconstruct ancient roman music found by Hadrian's Wall, and even older music from the early Gaelics. It's easy to think most instruments after a while start looking like this

You're not the same as the ancient Greeks

@@fayereaganlover There is not a single country/culture in the world that is still "the same" as their ancestral predecessors but we still feel a connection to those that lived on the same land and spoke a similar language more than 2000 years ago. Not sure what your issue is.

Greek men are among the most handsome one’s , literally.

I completely loved it, wow

Same

Same, not stoned, but drunk. Would love some of that fine kush tho lmao.

This is the most hilarious way to put it. I love it.

I’m so pleased to hear this and wish you the very best in your own historical pursuits. In fact I share your excitement (and I feel similar excitement about a forthcoming project of mine on Socrates).

Adrasthe Well, I admire you. I am currently student of history at uni, but I don’t “feel it”, somehow this kind of life within the history is lost in the methodical learning-only-data approach and when you feel amazing I am happy for you :)

Epoxygleu yes but it’s sad because I am then demotivated to pursue history in my life. But you see the cruel paradox - school is demotivating you and then forcing you to field you don’t have an interest to study anymore :D

Update but I got accepted into classical studies and history at the best uni in my area. I'm tremendously excited to begin (especially since I got mostly greece oriented classes for my first semester) ^_^

thank you - it is a marvellous collaboration and great fun

Dual piping is part of modern Middle East music... i imagine current Mid East music retains elements of Greek music from Hellenic period

Brought a tear to my eye

@@chrischammas1 My thoughts exactly, folk music is surprisingly conservative and should not be discounted .

Deku Palace theme from Zelda

gJb 1 Alrighy then...stay classy

Enthusiasm is always appreciated...

@@Demokritiades hello, this sounds like Albanian folklore songs played on clarinette.

Thank you for your lovely comment.

Enchanted

Yes - I’d prefer the word ‘medieval’ though!

Yes, amazingly like so much medieval European music.

D B this is true. Western medieval music has Ancient Greek music features for example the usage of Doric Minor scales in medieval music (which were used in Ancient Greek music)

You got it right

@@olbiomoiros Dorian in modern times, is not the same mode as what you think it was and therefore you cannot possibly know if it was used in a minor progression as it is today.

Sounds kinda like some songs in my church.

Greek musician here. The ancient ones of us that you all love played strictly in modal music. Those modal patterns were spread to all over the world and of course many other cultures adopted them and made stuff with them. We even have things like that in contemporary music. So thats why you find it familiar. You heard all of those things before in your life you just don't know it

@@cozasful it's more because the more famous Turkish and Eastern European modern popular music have very similar sounds

It sounds more familiar

It sounds middle eastern, that's why.

Thank you. It was a collaborative effort with many dedicated musicians and researchers.

John, with all due respect, ancient Greek is NOT a dead language because it cannot logically be distinguished from modern Greek as it is the very same language evolved through the ages. Dead languages are languages like Latin which are not spoken by common people on a daily basis. This is an important distinction. Armand, thank you as well for blocking my main account because I pointed out a fact that the Erasmian pronunciation that you're using is most likely FALSE with evidence like the name "ΑΡΙΣΤΕΙΔΗΣ" written also like "ΑΡΙΣΤΙΔΗΣ" which should not have happened due to an ancient Greek who wrote it not knowing how to write it properly, surely if the letters ΕΙ were pronounced differently than Ι he would've known how to write it correctly! But no, it's easier to block my main account "Proud2bGreek" and most likely this one as well so that people won't be able to see legitimate criticism and make up their own minds! You claim you have evidence that the Erasmian pronunciation is correct, you have yet to provide such supposed evidence so I will keep pointing out false claims!

I’m afraid you’re mistaken, as any Greek scholar can tell you. Why not ask Stelios Psaroudakes or Chrestos Terzes? Why insist on repeating your ill-informed prejudices on this site? Try reading Allen’s Vox Graeca at least to look at the ancient texts that support correct pronunciation - not ‘Erasmian’. The pronunciation differs from Euripides (5th cent) to Athenaios (2nd). If you really believe it didn’t change over 2500 years, there’s no point prolonging this discussion. I cannot persuade people who think they have evidence for the earth being flat - after all, we don’t lean sideways when we walk.

@@Demokritiades 1. I never said it did not change with time. 2. ALL those scholars you've suggested take into account Erasmus work to reach the conclusion that "this" is the way they pronounced the attic dialect. This is circular reasoning. The Erasmian pronunciation is, according to you, correct because those scholars claim that it is because they all derive their conclusions from Erasmus work.Why are you constantly rejecting the fact that all that you know derives from this single person's work? I'm not talking about how I supposedly think the moon is made of cheese or the earth is flat, I'm talking, with EVIDENCE, that ALL this knowledge all those scholars have derives from that Dutch person who lived in medieval times called Erasmus! If you don't like to call it Erasmian call it what you wish, it doesn't change the essence of what I'm saying anyway.Also this claim is no less false if Greeks were to support it so I don't get why you think it would be more convincing to me to hear fellow Greeks repeat a falsehood. I care about evidence, not the ethnicity of the person who utters falsehoods! Here are a couple examples people who support this version should consider, if you or someone else manages to explain these 2 errors then I'll accept that I was wrong. In Aristophanes' "The Wasps" he writes the word "of nature" - "φύσεος" with the letter o instead of ω, the word "φύσεως" is written with the omega instead of the omikron but he used that instead. Also from "The Wasps" the word "δεξιος" - (δεξιοτέχνης=skilled) is sometimes written as δεξιος and sometimes written as "δεξειός". Again, same meaning, same pronunciation but a written error. So if the letters ο and ω, ι and ει are pronounced differently how could Aristophanes make those errors?

@@petr9672 It has been attested that ο and ω, ι and ει are pronounced differently. The errors you mention are rare. The majority of the time they are not mistakes and just because different spellings are used it does not mean they are standardized the way we think of language is now. The most common sensical rationale is, if it's the same sound, why created two different sets of spellings for it? It's not logical. It must be that throughout the years, these initially different sounds merged. Modern reconstructions do not all stem from Erasmus, contrary to your assertion. However, it is very very clear that reading Ancient Greek using Modern Greek pronunciation exactly the way it is now is not correct if your goal is to attempt at pronouncing it as it was in the past. Certain poems don't even sound right when read using modern pronunciation. Erasmus is one attempt at reconstruction

Very true Sir , some how brought tears to my eyes . The Aulos by Callum was beautiful .Thanks to the whole team .

The aulos (Αυλός) is like an ancient flute, with a less smooth texture, like sand, and the name itself is used nowadays in Greece, instead of the word φλάουτο (flute).

Your comments are much appreciated. It’s a delight to share these discoveries with people who can appreciate both the project and its results.

@Armand D'Angour Thanks for replying. Perhaps more music will be discovered once the ancient carbonized scrolls have been transcribed. I think you will have a lot to do when that happens. What remains to be discovered will be epic. I'm looking forward to hearing more. Regards... - Dave

ira branov Thank you.

The aulos is particularly evocative.

It’s the Pentatonic 😉.

I like the way you think

Hugo Desrosiers-Plaisance you and I stood together on the streets of Greece thousands of years ago listening to the same piper play the same song..... have you forgotten already, old friend?

You're into something, Hugo. I'm not sure, but I've read somewhere that your genes store the memories of your ancestors. Well, it kind of makes sense. If your ancestors fwlt cozy and protected near fireplaces, then you will feel the same way, because that's a great trait. Same thing probably happens with music: we've heard it for such a long time, generation after generation, that we feel like it's something lost a long time ago, but it feels so incredibly familiar. It's fascinating, I feel the same way

Yes and let's put a bouzouki in there. That is real Greek music, isn't it? And what you are really saying is let's pronounce Greek like the the modern Greeks do because that is so much more authentic.

Great comment. I can enjoy your region by watching ‘better call saul’ and ‘breaking bad’, also from that other side of the world.

@@Ravi-fx6vf ​ Lol, both filmed right where I live, in Albuquerque. The odd thing is, I've never seen a single episode of either one. 😂

@@ClearTheRubble7 the wonders of the 21st century :) enjoy New Mexico, much too hot for me. -From Amsterdam, The Netherlands

@@Ravi-fx6vf Love Amsterdam! My sister and I visited there (in 1989, I think) after having been detained by East German border guards shortly after the collapse of the Berlin wall and the Iron Curtain. It's a long story how we got stuck in that situation, but we saw the freedom and liveliness of Amsterdam as a way to regain our sanity. We were treated very nicely there!

@@ClearTheRubble7 Hah! Great story, those are the type of stories you travel for. I'm glad you enjoyed this city, even if I wasn't born yet. Can definitely imagine it was a good place to recharge after that! Enjoy life my friend - I will try to do a cross USA roadtrip one day, and think of New Mexico

Jannerson Xavier yes - Athenaios’ Paean is the best preserved long ancient score

Yes he is, you feel it. Hail pan.. io pan

@@Fizzing-Amperage what don't you know?

Martin Krauser Thank you. This is the report of a research project rather than an attempt at polished and professionally recorded performances. Properly recorded musical reconstructions should be available in 2019.

@@Demokritiades Where might I look to keep updated on this? Is there a website that might keep us informed on official reconstructions? I would very much like to be able to listen to true Ancient Greek music on a regular basis.

Thank you!

A kind comment - thank you. Credit to all the musicians and scholars, and to the film-maker Oxford Digital Media.

Delighted with your response, thank you. It's a truly exciting project - and there is a lot more to come!

Thank you - as you can see, it was a huge collaboration with wonderful scholars and musicians. My main contribution was understanding the function of ancient microtones better, I think, than previous scholars.