Reimagining SPACE MARINES with  

What did you think of my reimagined version? Grimdark enough for ya? Don't forget to grab your 1 month free trial of Skillshare on me, use code MIDWINTERMINIS or follow this link: skl.sh/midwinterminis04221 Also, want a print of that artwork? Here's the link: www.midwinterminis.com/shop

I like how the anatomically accurate space marine is just fabius bile.

Really fits into how 'Horus Rising' describes marines as being "horse faced" due to the cocktail of growth hormones.

In preparation to the Horus Heresy in plastic I've begun listening to the audibooks of these events, and while watching your video one particular moment was constantly coming to my mind - in the first book, Horus Rising, there's a moment when our protagonist retells the story of how he took part in the war against super-advanced robots. He tells that robots took great care to prtotect the city around them, sometimes ignoring incoming fire only to repair some structures. After marines destroyed all robots and conducted investigation, it turned out that this city was once before a human colony, all humans died, and these robots remained as loyal custodians of the place. When the remembrancer who was listening to this story asked him: "Why did they attack you? Why didn't they think you are their former masters returning home?", he answered: "They did not recognize us as humans".

In regards to the size of the proganoid gland, scale in miniatures (especially GW ones) are often exagerated so it is still quite likely the proganoid isn't that big, however everything else feels spot on

Quite a few times in the Horus Heresy, Space Marine faces are described as "horse-like", and I think you have really captured the twisted, distorted version of humanity those descriptions conjure up.

Honestly apart from the face being gaunt and bald along with the neck protrusion, this is how I've always imagined Astartes being. Overall function over form, just as a living weapon should be.

Now my headcanon is that most marines do look like this, and is why so many lieutenants and sergeants and the like go without helmets - the one in several hundred who don't look like a Souls NPC have to represent. That might even be how they got their rank.

I'll make a guess that when they remove one of the Gene seeds they do in fact take the one in the neck and leave the one in the torso for once they die. Reasoning for it is that the rib cage would help protecting it instead of leaving it vulnerable on the side of the neck.

This is awesome! One thing to consider is that the models and figures created by GW seem to 'balloon' up in order to make printing some fine details possible. For instance you can think of the new Horus Heresy marines. If they were true-scale their bayonets would be thinner than toothpicks or paperclips. They would look like stiletto knives if they were able to produce details like that. So perhaps the gland that servant of chaos is holding also got the balloon treatment? Relying on them for scale may carry that over into future diagrams

i always liked the idea that it's all meant to be covered in armour so the attractive face is for properganda like everything under the hood is fucked but they need to look like perfect warriors

I'm on crap mobile data and I am DESPERATE to watch this, it's only my two favourite 40k creators collaborating!!

I always imagined Thunder Warriors would be like this with how crude and disposable they were made. With how aesthetically obsessed the Emperor was with propaganda I'd imagine the hormonal stuff in the early years was tinkered with a lot alongside minor cosmetic correction surgeries to not make the astartes too hideous. Something you wouldn't see in chaos legions leading to even more abhorrent looking chaos legionnaires. The remembrancers would have had a hard time making propaganda with mutated brutes for their picts

Somr astartes legions may have unique traits that can affect the "level of handsome" you could say. I would say the blood angels, ultramarines and emperors children are probably the lucky ones. However the rest of the legions are often described as having ugly features. Aspirants are also often said to look horrible. I can also guess some space marines under go facial reconstruction.

Man you weren't lying when you said this was gonna be a good video, this is seriously my jam, well done man, this was brilliant. My one addition would be that a space marine has to be much much wider than a normal man, to have any real articulation in heavy armour plate, your shoulders have to stick out much much father than your waist, with minimal lats, just to accommodate the thickness of plate

I always figured the Betcher’s Gland was similar to those salivary glands under the tongue that allow you and I to “glick” and squirt saliva like a cobra.

as a fellow MD (say hi to Penny please) I find this quite interesting and I love your anatomical drawings. One little minor, maybe over critical thing is the missing or inaccurate portrait of the duodenum in most of them which should be better visible in this view. But really, the drawings and the background makes this highly enjoyable, very authentic and yells high production value all over.

I think taking Fabius Biles henchmen for scale is a little bit unfair. Especially as the scale of the models is wildly inconsistent across the range (there is no way 8 Terminators fit inside a Land Raider Crusader). Progenoids could also be walnut size or similar, but scaling that down to 32 mm would make it barely visible.

I LOVE the space marines, i love how badass and cool they look. But I really wish there was more games related to other factions. I'd love to play a whole game as a Necron Overlord, Tau Battlesuit or Aeldari Farseer etc.. Playing from the view of other factions and how they see other factions

Love this Guy. Not much of the literature identifies how seriously messed up marines could actually be given what they go through... I believe the first series of 40K novels (the ones with Inquisitor Jaques Draco) featured a marine (Imperial Fist if I recall) who practiced scrimshaw on his own finger bones by peeling the flesh off and engraving the bones underneath. He later removes one of his own eyes and inserts the “third eye” of a navigator to find his way to the Aeldari Black Library

18:23 In retrospect, I thought it would be easy for the apothecaries to harvest the progenoid. Also, screw you for questioning my work! I'm the Emperor of Mankind! I can do what I want!

this is great guy. thanks! The HH novel "Pharos" has scout marines in it. The book constantly describes the strangeness of the appearace of developing astartes that arent hidden in their power armour. That helped drive home the body horror of the space marine development really well.

Horrifyingly fantastic! Absolutely love it. I had no idea how scary they would actually look, thanks for the insight, Guy! Rest in peace Steel Angel John. You will forever be missed

I'd imagine that the hormones that promote their muscular growth, also causes hyper virilisation on top of the acromegaly. So visually some lateral jaw growth, strong masculine hair growth, and the male pattern baldness, which you absolutely nailed.

So...are we saying the lumpiness of the old 80s sculpts may be partially intentional (old less accurate techniques aside)?

As an anatomist/physiologist and 40k fan, this was super cool to see! Definitely did your homework! I wonder if the mucranoid gland secretions might protect the mouth from acid in the same way that mucus protects our stomach lining.

Not super much into 40k usually but this was super interesting and I have to say that it perhaps sparked something inside! Well done Guy and Ian! 👍🙂

After this, they’d better keep their helmets on. Edit: Also, if they’re a Raven Guard or Imperial Fist, they won’t have any problems with the Betcher’s Gland, since it doesn’t work.

Fantastic video. Someone pointed me in your direction in the comments from my latest video and I am glad that I ventured over. Wonderful work!

Wouldn’t it be a stretch to assume the gene seed is the size of the proportions in a miniature model? Cause some compromises have to be made usually make some elements bigger so people can see them better or it’s easier to paint.

This is awesome but strikes me as strange for a few reasons. The Space Marine went through many variations, in the lore, and we know that Terra was covered in horrific genetically modified supersoldiers as well- grotesque and unrefined in ways the space marines were not. While earlier gene-hanced warriors were basically just enduced growth conditions, the DNA of the marines were modelled after the Primarchs, shifting to better represent them. Its why, I think, the space marines don't look overgrown, but just as bigger humans, specifically because the growth is to a pattern, not just for the hell of it. Further, I would imagine the teeth would be fused to the jaw, strengthened in similar ways or replaced. The Blood Angels are an excellent example- their bodies are modelled after the Primarch so they are all stunningly beautiful. But in ways that'd worse because all the horror is hidden away, just under the surface. RT marines feel like what the Thunder Warriors became, so I'd think this final drawing is closer to what a thunder warrior would lilook like. But still, fantastic work as always my dude

I really love these drawings, reminds me of cross between John Blanche and Quentin Blake. Would be great to see them in some official 40k content. Definitely buying a copy of that "Post-Vitruvian Man" print; It's going to have pride of place on wall above my painting bench :)

Wow, Midwinter Minis/Arbitor Ian collab, that's two of my favorite WH-related channels working together! Now, one thing you definitely should do - record a combined WH candles and beer review, while playing some WH. That'd be a pinnacle, nothing will get better than that. Ever.

11:56 I agree, but there was this novelization of the Wolverine Weapon X story, where because of Wolverines healing factor, it was making it harder for them to sedate him, or to operate on him, or even keep him shaved so they just sort of stop trying and just have to butcher into him. So maybe that’s why? I’d figure the apothecary would have drugs to prevent it from going off since if they are hit with some kind of toxin that instant clotting would be bad (like what if those clots came loose and then got stuck in the hearts or lungs? Sounds like a bad time)

love the reimagining of space marines, where lore meets realism. i would love to see other content from the lore reimagined like this! keep up the amazing work!

14 operations between age 10 and 18... the first thing that came to mind was my nephew with Scoliosis, who will have to endure 36 spine correction operations by the time he is 18 or 19 I believe. He has already had 18, he just hit the halfway point this year. He is 12 years old.

I like how we can take this image and think that this is the “cannon” way they look like but the marine’s we see today are actually in universe imperial propaganda of what they want the people of the galaxy to think their stoic champion’s look like

Noice, really drives home that grim, dark future vibe. I would have been tempted to push the grotesqueness even more to be honest, but they have to look like they fit in the armor, don't they.

I remember reading about the making of a Space Marine in the 8th edition Space Marine codex and imagined the designer as something like the medic from Team Fortress 2 jamming organs into bodies like Orks building their ramshackle guns and vehicles

Really interesting, and quite fitting with the "mutilating hand of war" aesthetic that is almost completely absent outside of 40k fiction. However I think we can also safely argue that the "corrective surgeries" that Ian pointed out in the early videos, as well as the more controlled nature of the interventions, would be in part designed to eliminate or at least ameliorate the problems you've pointed to. But as someone else pointed out, this does have a very strong Thunder Warrior vibe

Awesome, would love to see a mini sculpted in this brutal fashion, like mid-armor assembly or something, 75mm perhaps? :)

Probably my 300th skillshare ad, first one that actually made me click the link. Well done

see the old art work my mind "BOLT THROWER!!!" turns on through the eye of terror and cracks its to full then moshes for the emperor

Ah, rest in peace, John. Such a fun chap, always had something positive to say.

That was amazingly unnerving well done.

Really amazing vídeo!! A different look at the style of space marines that is always refreshing!!

I always imagined them as having relatively normal sized heads completely disproportionate to their massive bodies. The Emperor, beloved by all, solved for acromegaly when making his Astartes.

Excellent video on what Space Marines could be compared to how they are represented in models and art. Makes sense that the legend masks the reality of their existence. Really enjoyed all the drawings and the Vetruvian Marine illustratoin is awesome. Well done.

I’m perfectly fine with a lot of space marines looking like this, but like emperors children, blood angels, salamanders, world eaters, I feel like all of them look like exactly how they should

Yaaaaaay. I love Arbitor Ian! He does great videos on 90's Warhammer.

This is an incredible reimagining, especially with the size and musculature. I was surprised by your version of the Lyman’s Ear, making it a grafted machine instead of a grown human ear. In the lore of the space marines, the organs working in conjunction would also improve the aging of the space marine to be able to live significantly longer. This might be the reason that most are also seen as handsome and rugged, their gene seed working to stop the premature aging from the beginning and getting better as more implants are… well, implanted 😂

That's funny how I discovered Ian the other day, and here he is in this channel! A pleasant surprise 😁

I love the sketches, it feels more at home with the original artwork. It's sad that GW these days wants to clean up the look and remove the grungy aspects of the game. I think those aesthetics is what makes the setting more interesting. It would be like removing the grungy aesthetics of Bladerunner's LA and expecting folks to vibe with its noir overtones in a bright or sunny visual aesthetic.

You ever seen belgian blue cattle? That has always been my headcannon of what a space marine looks like under the armour. Just a swollen mound of ugly, functional muscle. I absolutely love this take though! Absolutely horrifying in the best way. I especially like the idea that their scars don't heal properly. It could be used as a rare, in-universe admission that Big E isn't 100% infallible.

I can imagine these emperor's angels saying "be not afraid"

almost like a space marine de-imagining since it's based on the old 80s & 90s lore

Given their immense size and weight, their knees would be in absolute agony, I’d imagine they’d also need a new type of knee to help support their weight and maybe even have more elephantine shaped feet. Of course I dunno if that’s in the lore or not but something I thought about

Absolutely one of the funnest videos I've seen. I watch both of your channels. It's helped me through some pretty rough days. Thank you so much.

This is SO fucking awesome, I wished space marines were actually like this because this is super grimdark

I see your point, this was great to see pieced together and drawn so well by yourself! But I do think if the Ad Mech and ol' Fabius are able to double the organs in a genetically manipulated and augmented body they can do a little bit of plastic surgery touch up after the fact so the symbols of the Imperium aren't drooling, gaunt, nightmares.

The new mixing of the End Credit Theme is brilliant. Last year in a stream you mentioned you might release the End Credit Theme in its own album with some remixes. I'm here to tell you, once again, I would buy it :)

Loved the new jingle/remix!

Early Space Marines were basically Sardaukar, which is understandable as the 40k setting is basically a mash up of Dune, 2000AD and Michael Moorcock books, distilled into its own distinct flavour.

Seeing as their Spitting acid gland isn't working, I can confidently say that the Imperial Fist are now the most handsome Space Marines there is. All jokes aside, I think for once the mini's heads are much more accurate than people give it credit for. Yes they aren't as emaciated and their mouths aren't that destroyed but most of them are bald with heavy jaws, heavy cheek bones, and heavy superciliary arch (without the eyebrow) witch are quite reminiscent of people like Andre the Giant. Most of the heads barring the Blood angels ones, are Bald or with very short hairs witch are quite realistic in an (albeit sci-fi) army where you have to learn to tend your hair and hairs. Sure with GW prime and proper paint scheme they look quite nice (that and the fact that all their head looks like space marines ones whether you look at a Marine an Imperial Guard or a Sister of Battle), but with a little bit of shadows and a more proper Grimdark/Blanchitsu paint job anyone can easily achieve that battered look on a regular SM head. But everyone uses Helmets anyway so who cares ? ^^.

Imperials: "You bunch of ugly xenos, mutants and heretics!" Literally everyone else in the universe AND in the Warp: "YOU BLOODY HYPOCRITE!" Nurgle: "Looks fine to me..." Fabius Bile: "Amateurs..."

I truly never expected this crossover

Absolutely fantastic! That's how I see a chaos space marine more than an Imperial. However, I understand where you're coming from on all this. Reminds me of when I was in school to be a parametric, before my first ambulance run to a friend's car wreck.

Fascinating! A lot of the current imperium does look like something the imperial propaganda came up compared to the old RT lore, or some of the fluff so It was lovely to watch it reimagined in such dark and grizzled way. It is quite refreshing in general to see frequently used things (like the current space marine) reimagined in curious ways. PS: truly tough 16th’s. I am past 16 years for a good while and I still can’t quit complaining about dentist appointments. 😅😄

Great collab and idea. Some of the lore in wh is absolutely nuts and yall did an awesome job

Fantastic video! Been following Ian for some time now - in fact it was him that got me interested in 40K again - so it's wonderful to see you guys together.

I'm a simple man. I see Arbitor Ian, I click like.

This is absolutely gruesome. My god. I usually like to depict my marines as more sympathetic creatures, but very easily swayed and tainted by... chaos or the influence of the Eccliesiarchy. This though? This is truly the most darkest depiction of Marines ive seen, youve always been an utter machine with these depictions. I must ask though, with how horribly disfigured the marine has become, would his armour change at all? Would his armour act more like an iron maiden/casket or is he allowed to remove his pieces?

Probably one of those unamed marines who keep their helms on all the time Aside from that, I love the illustration

i've never understood the fusing of the ribs, in doing this you loose almost all flexibility in the torso. Why not have a second set of ribs that is offset from the originals to fill in behind the gaps where the muscles are thus making the equivalent of a solid plate but retaining flexability

I love the look! In lore, I imagine this is how the Thunder Warriors may have looked; considering the Emperor took a much longer time perfecting the space marines into the giga chads we know them as today.

wow this look wayyyy better than what gw makes and what you made is what they should be great job this is inspiring me to make kitbashes or modifications on spacemarine faces

First of all, great video, love the idea and content, and REALLY love the artwork, so please don’t think I’m criticizing your work, Guy. But I thought of a couple things in regards to your comment at how Space Marines appear to all be gigachads in the grim darkness of the far future. One, it’s not implausible to think of the video games and books where they are described and shown like this as Imperial propaganda. The Imperium as a whole would want their citizens to look upon the God-Emperor’s creation in awe, rather than horror, and considering how few and far between Space Marines are, it’s not too big a stretch to say that the people exposed to said propaganda would never get the chance to see a real Space Marine to compare it to. Because, remember, the Astartes are the God-Emperor’s angels, reflections of him, so the Imperium would want to portray them as beautiful. Two, and this one is a bit more in universe, consider the following. We know that the Emperor himself was the ultimate gigachad, chiseled features, glorious hair, physically beautiful to look upon. We know the same is true (mostly) for the Primarchs, especially ones like Sanguinius, Guilliman, and others. Since Space Marines are made from the geneseed of their Primarch fathers, it could be possible that, once the process is complete, the geneseed actually seeps in and makes the Space Marines look more noble and beautiful than they ought to after so many surgeries. And we know this is possible thanks to the Horus Rising novel, where one of the Luna Wolves is described as looking almost like an exact clone of Horus Lupercal.

love how the old lore gives it a more grounded look. also no wonder so many chapters "lose" the belcher's gland haha

That was an amazing video. I think it REALLY sums up the grim dark nature of the space marines and makes them that much more awe-inspiring. A job well done!

Those space marines go through nearly as much as that turtle neck! Great video

I always preferred the description of space Marines in Horus Rising. Relatively ugly, evidence of gigantism and, of course, the smell... Always seemed more realistic and grim. Unlike the supermen of today

Doesn't the primarch's geneseed space marines get implanted with cause them to look more like their gene-father, thus perhaps negating some of the horrible exterior looks?

This video was great. Nice to see Ian in a collaboration. I have been watching his videos not long after he stated. It makes me laugh when they say that the rib cage fuses together in the lore. If that happened then I'm pretty sure they would suffocate as the ribs are no longer able to pivot slightly up/down to allow the lungs to deflate/inflate. There is a reason your chest sticks out more when you take a deep breath.

One interesting thing to keep in mind is that not every Marine would look entirely like that due to chapter geneseed mutations. For example, Imperial Fists and their successors don't have the Betcher's Gland so they wouldn't have to worry about acid burning their lips.

Good fun exercise Guy! One thing you did miss though is that the Astartes develop to look a bit like their Primarch. e.g. the blood angels look like Michelangelo's David, Raven Guard look like emos, etc.

This is cool but your missing some key information. Even though I disagree with what you have surmised, I LOVE THE IDEA and topic. Once again you rock, Guy. Acromegaly is an uneven growth of bones, hands, and face. IT literally kills many people that have it over time because a lack of homeostasis that is so important in humans and most biological beings. Acromegaly more often takes a huge toll on the heart, that did not grow large enough to compensate for the huge overgrowth of the rest of the body. The uneven growth would be the problem but with all the surgeries it, crafting they would grow evenly Many of the of diseases that would be considered overgrowth (Simpson-Golabi-Behmel syndrome, Proteus syndrome, Beckwith-Wiedemann syndrome) could be fixed if the body actually had its natural homeostasis and the body compensated for it. Considering they live hundreds of years, it seems safe to assume the bodies would have a natural harmony. More likely with there advanced healing or rapid healing, would leave slight weird discoloring and their overgrowth would be more similar to mild "Simpson-Golabi-Behmel syndrome" attributes, such as enlarged mouths, widening of the eyes, etc. Some of the more aggressive disorders would be closer to chaos where they affect the homeostasis and have discoloring and growths. In general if you looked at the space marines from a distance they would look like large humans, but when closer they would seem completely alien. It would be very disquieting, because humans without knowing it, look for certain physical dimensions and they would all be off. The progenoid gland is good call out, but I have a problem with this. Having such an important seed, one that is responsible for growing new space marines hanging so far out would be illogical. If you were going for the whole grimdark angle, it's right in front of your face. Although they are the "Emperor's Angels" Looking at them would be the most "Uncanny Valley effect," for humans. It would disturb you seeing them.

Love it. Cracking work guys

I love the moth-eaten woolen jumper. I love the whisky by the drawing tablet. I love so much about this video and I'm only at 2:33

I always loved the idea that the progenoids were these tiny, delicate little things that were very unassuming and yet held so much potential power... and then they made them the size of cricket balls and covered in Cthulhu willies

Snipe & Wib also make great vids on all the old 2nd edition codexes. The codex compliant series

Great video, also the ambient music in your videos is always on point. Thank you

This was an amazing production and really interesting, I can just imagine how terrifying the space marines in this concept would be.

Considering they can do all this amazing biological stuff I don’t think it would be too hard for them to make sure that the things they do don’t end making a monster. Also the thing that makes them heal instantly probably does a good job of it not just rubbish as you say, I think you’re assuming that things are done badly or without thinking of the consequences when I’m sure they thought through things a lot. But this video is super cool none the less, definitely horrible to go through the process though ahah

I would love to see some STLs of custom unhelmeted heads designed with this grotesque, hormone-induced, surgically disfigured aesthetic in mind. Would be a pretty cool and grimdark addition to any space marine army.

Best collaboration ever. Quality channel!!!!!!!!!!!

I appreciate the real genetic conditions of giantism, to shape a "marine" And people nagged at GW for the plastic Scouts having huge jaws? Critics were wrong: the sculptors where right.

Me (at the beginning) - Come on Guy, you've had some interesting takes but I don't understand this one Guy - Space Marines are too heroicly portrayed and over done. Me - MOTHERFRELLER YES!!!!!!!! THEY AREN'T TODD DAMNED HEROES, THEY ARE KILLING MACHINES!!!!! Why does GW keep trying to make them appear like they are Batman or Captain America or.......(sees a pile of money) that's why. Edit - I absolutely love the design in the end, my one question though is what about chapters like those of Sanguinius where a defining trait is looking as beautiful as their primarch? Or is this not considering that and going off IRL stuff? Cause either way, I would rather this be the depicition. Imagine playing a Guardsman in a video game and every once in a while a Space Marine roles up and saves your ass. At one point its helmet gets ripped off and it is more horrifying than the Orks it is tearing apart. And notice I said IT instead of HE. That isn't a human anymore. That is an Astartes.

Incredible! What a great and creative project! I hope you continue to be inspired to do something like this! There is never too much darkness in Warhammer!

I just chacked your channel this morning wandering when will you upload and there you go! Great video guy!

Space Marines are Cool, everyone who says they aren't are just biased 😂