Religious caller vs James O'Brien on homosexuality and the Bible | LBC 

That sounds familiar and I'm so glad you used quotation marks. Cool saying, do you know who said it?

@@doccarter5283 I don’t remember but I know I didn’t think of it. Not wishing to claim the work of others I always put things like this in quotation marks.

@@ShaunieDale You're an honourable man or woman. You have my respect. Respect is earnt.

Scientists make dogmatic claims really often. Shoutout to Darth Dawkins for demonstrating the incongruent positions of the "ignorant" scientists at large and shoutout to Dr. Ray Peat for exposing their insanities.

Yes Christians only read one book, ever. Of course if they read the Bible then that consists of many books, so even a Christian who only read the Bible would have read many books. Very "scientific".

Where do you think our modern ideals about human rights, welfare for the poor and vulnerable in society, upholding the rights of the oppressed and excluded come from? What do you think modern secular humanism has its roots in? Whether we believe or not we should all be thankful for the influence of "Christian love"

The opinions about homosexuality is in the Old Testament which has a tenuous link with Christianity.

@@stephenreeds3632 it's not "tenuous." The new testament is meant to be a continuous narrative, Christ comes to fulfill Old testament law etc...I think this is where the common confusion is coming around the OT food laws etc (which make no sense to sustain after the coming of the promised Messiah) and the Judaic and Christian understanding of marriage that comes from Genesis (which Jesus continues to affirm). There's no contradiction for those who have actually read the bible and tried to understand the narrative sweep. Further, the obsession with this issue is actually fuelled by the media/contemporary discussion, you will rarely if ever hear sermons focusing singularly on homosexuality in a church.

​@@conandeckard5541None of it came from the Old Testament. That's the point

@@Neil070 none of what? (Genuine confusion)

No, it doesn’t.

​@@badmanpace7228 when it comes to arguing with zealots, yes it does.

There are three types of laws and the moral laws still stand as confirmed in Galatians and Romans. Paul then uses the words of Lev 20 to reiterate the Apostolic teaching against homosexuality. James says you should just ignore half the New Testament which is exactly the point conservative Christians are making. Pope Jimbo doesn't even realise...

And your context disagrees with my context and the context goes on on on on and on 😂

Had me in a coughing fit 😂

That was hilarious 😂😂😂

But in the bible there aren't things which supports women, LGTBQ+, love, culture, logic, morality or however something positive and moral. What have they heard that turbated them?

@@luigipetrosino7831 Misogyny: “I do not permit a woman to teach or to exercise authority over a man; rather, she is to remain quiet.” - Timothy 2:12 Homophobia: “You shall not lie with a male as with a woman; it is an abomination." - Leviticus 18:22 Endorsement of Slavery: "Your male and female slaves are to come from the nations around you; from them you may buy slaves." - Leviticus 25:44 The bible is full of barbaric nonsense and immorality....

@@luigipetrosino7831 Oh sorry went over my head...🤣🤣🤣

@@amac9044 I had noted it, don't worry. 🙂

Tbf could have sounded like a Muslim too. They argue like that at speakers corner

Nobody can follow the Bible literally as it isn't compatible with modern society.

That's true for everyone following religious texts since most religious texts are collections of myths and stories and are self contradicting.

Not so. There are a few who actually try to live the gospel of Jesus Christ. Just because the vast majority of so called Christians behave that way, it doesn't mean that everybody is the same.

@Anne-Marie Marshall And what is that "true" gospel of "Jesus" and how do you know it's the true one. Is it the Biblical Jesus who tells people to turn the other cheek and love their neighbour or is it the Biblical vandalising assaulting Jesus that threatened eternal torture? Or is it a version of Jesus that didn't even make it into the establishment version of the testament at the council of Nicaea?

​@@carpediem5232 all the books selected of course were never written in his supposed lifetime and are multiple generations of hearsay

Like when he just said that Jesus did away with the old testament, when Jesus multiple times states the exact opposite.

​@@LamirLakantryexcept the new covenant does exactly that. It's almost like an arbitrary collection of self-contradicting often unrelated texts collected from deserts across a span of thousands of years passed down and (often intentionally) mistranslated for millennia isn't the best guide book for enforcing a functioning society

@@LamirLakantry I feel it's prudent to ask, why do you think Jesus was executed? It was because he offended the religious conservatives of the time by going against the Old testament and working on the Sabbath and preventing them from killing people who the Old testament said they should. If he didn't come to overturn the Old testament, he sure didn't come the lead by example...

Every single Christian has to pick and choose which bible verses to live their life by.

@@tonberry2670 That's the most dangerous part... anyone can interpret it however they want & justify it

Like the Tel Dan stele that mentions The House of David or the Seal of Isaiah being found or Caiaphas bone box or the cyrus cilinder or the pontius pilate stone or the Shroud of Turin that has three D information on it

@@christiancelticwarrior1222 there have been countless davids and most of them had houses, so which specific one did your friend dan talk about? and why exactly? in what context? what exactly was said? once we're done with the first one we can proceed with the rest. if your whole point about the first one is that someone somewhere once wrote "house of david", that's a big nothing.

It lost me when I was expected to believe that a dead guy came back to life three days later, then wandered off into the desert without so much as trying to find his mates.

@@christiancelticwarrior1222No one doubts that there existed states called Israel and Judah. People doubt that the histories given for them are accurate.

​@@christiancelticwarrior1222 I'm not going to into everything you mentioned but almost none of that is legit. For example the shroud of Turin has been proven multiple times by forensic analysis to have been artificially created around the year 1200 or so. Not when Jesus would have been alive, IF he existed

So HILARIOUS xD he's brilliant

Also brilliant: Caller: "Do you not understand what I'm saying?" James: "No, I don't have a clue and that makes two of us."

I nearly choked on my drink at: “do you have any slaves?” 😂

The part that got me was when he humourlessly answered "I'm wearing one garment all of one thread". Haha. He knew exactly where it was going and decided being a liar was a better option.

At least he’s bring specific 😂

totally agree

Amen Rick

And in some countries are still paying.

​@@patxi601coming from the US, I can verify that.

Paying it as we speak

It's why when someone asks: why can't we have politicians that are honest and informed? The answer is truly: The voters don't want that.

@@colinhubble6667 Sad but true (yes I typed that in a James Hetfield voice).

There are three types of laws and the moral laws still stand as confirmed in Galatians and Romans. Paul then uses the words of Lev 20 to reiterate the Apostolic teaching against homosexuality. James says you should just ignore half the New Testament which is exactly the point conservative Christians are making. Pope Jimbo doesn't even realise...

they usually don't even read the whole book

cite

But also, there is no better way to demonstrate illiteracy than by using words that you have never read.

@@321bytor thanks

Just wondering, how do you (any of you) know the caller has never read the scriptures .I myself have read them on more that one occasion but would be hard pressed to recall much of what I have read. Why then could this not be the case with the caller, and there lies the problem. He is trying to make a point when he lacks appropriate understanding of scripture. That doesn't mean however that he has never read the scriptures.

@@anne-mariemarshall Nor does it mean that the 'scriptures' have any value at all in discerning what's true.

That was a classic put down.

Zing!

I wanna like this comment but it’s at 69 likes. Nice

O’Brien was talking about his only listener here.

😂😂😂

Religious thought is really harmful to one’s and it’s no substitute for real morality.

IKR!!!

Religion os amazing, people are just lazy and comfortable.

@@bwilliamson3887 I'd love to hear how you think it's amazing.

like scientists suddenly claiming: Ooopsie we "forgot" 95% of reality ... (dark energy & dark matter)

😂😂😂

Hey now, let's be fair. Most of them have a reason. It's just that the reason is almost always: "I personally benefit from believing this and from other people also believing it. Please stop attacking my meal ticket."

Your comment doesn’t make sense

There are three types of laws and the moral laws still stand as confirmed in Galatians and Romans. Paul then uses the words of Lev 20 to reiterate the Apostolic teaching against homosexuality. James says you should just ignore half the New Testament which is exactly the point conservative Christians are making. Pope Jimbo doesn't even realise...

😂

Do you think it's difficult to prove religious extremists wrong? Absolutely any idiot can do it. It's really not that clever.

old testament is for the jews.

The technical term for this I think is they're "full of sanctimonious 💩"

@@rhyfeddu full of sanctimony. They are sanctimonious!

Not per se, but when it is in flagrant opposition to God's Word, yes, it is harmful. James hasn't got a clue what he is talking about. He was just firing the same liberal elitist debating points that wokies have been using for many years.

Just being yourself too, somehow frowned upon in this day and age.

@@theperson8539 Indeed, it's not easy being a Christian sometimes.

@@Da_Big_G How so?

@@theperson8539 people like James O'Brien and the rest of the liberal elite attacking us.

I really wanna hear the context where its ok to sell your daughter to slavery 🤣

So true. I love James' response in that "I'm literally reading it right out of the Bible". 🤣

I’m still waiting for the context that it’s okay to purchase slaves 😂

​@@Random-gp3tlif you have to contextualize and reframe every single passage of a book, you might need to find a different book. The one you have is full of mistakes.

@@LordScrambles1 fr

Fr 😂

Sorry about that, we’re kind of messed up 😂

It was brilliant lol, from another atheist.

I find it both hilarious and sad, sad that these people exist in the 21st century

Me too, this was brilliant.

More like, I get to run red lights but not THOSE people. I get to drive but not those type people. I get a car but those folks over there only get bicycles. Ever notice how their interpretation of the rules always works to their advantage?

More likely to their "leader's" advantage and possibly his as well if he's manipulating a lot of people like this.@@101perspective

I feel like I’m in medieval times when some people speak

Absolutely! This Liberal Jew remains flabbergasted that these heretics hold up a "book" they have never read (and have misinterpreted from the start) as a cudgel against others. Speaking about context, that is most DEFINITELY not the bit to be held up in 2023! 🤦🏻‍♀️🤦🏻‍♀️🤦🏻‍♀️

Depressing not more people are having the conversation

​@@085cur1ty I feel like I'm in a snowflake generation

Imagine how it feels in Scotland, where the Tories have basically opened season on anyone LGBT

There are three types of laws and the moral laws still stand as confirmed in Galatians and Romans. Paul then uses the words of Lev 20 to reiterate the Apostolic teaching against homosexuality. James says you should just ignore half the New Testament which is exactly the point conservative Christians are making. Pope Jimbo doesn't even realise...

Also if I live in the US, do I have to go all the way to Mexico or do neighbouring states count? 😂😂

TYT ain’t far off

The Atheist Experience and Truth Wanted are probably the closest thing we have

What about Sam Seder?

James is one of the best. But there are quite alot of left-wing progressive shows in the US. Mostly on SM but they are still worth far more than a subscription. I think there has been a bit of an awakening happening lately (past decade+) both here in the UK and US when it comes to standing up to the rhetoric coming from religious conservatism which has filled the heads of their electorate with non-sensical crusader notions. Evangelism is big business and clearly more of a friend to commercialism and segregation which is why they were tapped by big-oil to be their political wing. That has not gone unnoticed which is why despots like tfg seek to break the chain of communications within social media by fighting against laws like section 230. Clearly a desperate move but one which shows how progressives are beginning to make a change for the better because of this medium.

He's not a reporter..and we do have people like him

I so wish he presented newsnight lol.

Yes

I wish American journalists would take notice how it’s done.

This is how ALL candidates running for office should be questioned on the campaign trail.

I meant I wish he presented Question Time not Newsnight 👍

James was clever as when he mentioned the Sabbath you could hear the caller ready with “ah but Sunday isn’t the Sabbath”

@@robertfreeman6082 I was thinking that too, he was so ready for his gotcha! but James was way ahead of him

How is this not the top comment? I lost it when James asked if he might have to go outside the UK.

Many American Christians would demand people work on the sabbath for their post-sermon McDonalds

That was my favorite bit.

What he meant to say was “you’re taking my out of context claims out of context “

The bible is a collection of works taken out of context though, if it included all the writings (non canonical) nobody would believe it, too self contradictory, even more so than it already is.

Also, these people are the exact same people who are taking quotes out of the Quran out of any context (and often translated wrong on top of it) to justify their Islamophobia...

I've noticed this being used as an excuse/deflection attempt more and more in the digital age, I think it's because there are more often receipts. You can't claim you just didn't say something when it was caught on video, or stated in a tweet, or said in an interview. So instead of just outright denying it they're forced to claim "out of context", even when it's directly in context and cannot be taken out of it.

Most not some

What parts of the bible do you ignore?

As a pastor, how do you choose which bits are important and which aren't?

I am very sorry but your bible was only written and created by men over many centuries (6 BC to 2AD) and multiple reductions

​@@rudyardganuelas6254 how about all of the lunatic Old Testament?

It's very difficult to do when your opponent is just making stuff up as they go. That's what's great about religion is you can just say whatever you want and as long as you believe it it's true.

I'm no scholar, but isn't hypocrisy also specifically denounced in the bible?

​@@ibieiniid4240Probably not.

I agree. It was travel and receiving hospitality from strangers, often poor, and of different religions made me see what was important.

Of course it closes your mind, that is by design for most religions as a means of control alongside suppressing education, people that don’t think for themselves tend not to question the authority of those in power.

Are you open-minded to the idea that open-mindedness is a poor strategy for life?

@@Da_Big_G In what way Graeme?

@@Lily-Bravo , it is a paradox I am hoping you can untangle.

That's not a contradiction, midbrain.

@@inkwyvern5171 Yes it is, stop lying.

You should get on the line with some “evangelicals”

People like trump and MGT and Lauren boebert

France, obvs.

But think of the paperwork, bringing slaves out of the EU into the UK.

@@andrewallan6802 The most horrific consequence of Brexit.

I spilled my coffee there! 🤣🤣🤣

Lol that was my favorite part too

I see James has watched the West Wing

Like most who have no love of it's hatred, James has actually READ the Book of Infanticide, Batshittery, Lies and Exaggerations. Once you do that, arguing with the idiots who "believe" in it isn't very hard to do.

What does the book of Exodus refer to, do you even know?

@@ericdellinger6260 No he definitely has not read the New Testament.

He is cracking me up

We would all love to see O'brien shut down permanently.

You haven't seen much then!

Yes listening to a bully talk over someone with a different point of view, pathetic lefty

You probably need to get out more if you get so excited by a well educated radio presenter who went to public school outwitting a foreigner with weird religious views who is also clearly very dumb.

shutdown or not, he will not change his mind on homosexuality.

Hook line and sinker!!! The hypocrisy flares up immediately!

Leviticus is an instruction manual for a caste of Jewish temple hands (the Levites) to stay "clean". The first question to anybody citing Leviticus should be: "Are you Jewish?" The second should be: "Why is that even in the bible?"

Things are getting rough over there, stay safe, friend 🤜

@@NWard1210 The whole thing with Nicola Bulley reminded me how different the US is from the UK. That would've never made more than the most local news here in Texas.

@@NWard1210 IKR, senility at the highest level, what could go wrong

Jesus had two dads and he turned out fine. Jesus was our first woke celebrity.

@@jeffsimon9594 The even more effed-up senile guy could get elected again.

I think many British people are allergic to screaming. It's why we've made tutting and shaking our heads in disapproval an almost venomous attack on an activity or a person's character. Also, James is spot on here. There's nothing like feeling confident in your argument by knowing things like that the word 'homosexual' didn't exist in the English language until the 1600s and that it would have been nigh impossible to translate hebrew, Greek and Latin into English without corresponding words/ideas/phrases already being in place. Context and language and audience and style of writing are key when trying to understand a book that spans several millennia like the Bible, and screaming doesn't leave a lot of room for nuance.

@@gangstadrz9326 Because the caller was ignoring all of James' rebuttals, and so James was attempting to make him acknowledge them. If one takes Leviticus seriously, why is this guy still choosing which parts of Leviticus, and much of the rest of the OT to ignore?

@@gangstadrz9326 Then why do so many homophobes quote those texts when justifying their own homophobia? Why is that part in particular taken seriously but the part about shellfish not? Because of your own biases, nothing whatsoever to do with your religion or what is written in those books.

He's non-league at best. His knowledge of the subject is poor.

​@@gangstadrz9326 It's called holding their feet to the fire. These apologists will attempt to wiggle out of these questions if you don't aggressively direct them to answer what's being asked.

Control over others is vital for rightwingers or "religious" people. Rgr

You have some! E.g. matt dillahunty. Slam dunks theists with ease.

I love to troll the religious rightwingers by pointing out Jesus was a brown-skinned, Middle-Eastern, hippy, anti-capitalist Jew. It hits all their buttons and makes them apoplectic.

@@avaggdu1 half of that is untrue

@@avaggdu1 okay, just because he had long hair and no job doesn't automatically make him a hippy

@ Graham Paul Kendrick "I see London, I see France, ..." 🤣🤣🤣

Cognitive dissonance writ large in the caller

Like our government exactly like our government if I think about it

Nor is a working knowledge of their holy text. That's where James really nails them.

TBF any one remotely rational will have dismissed the idea of inviable friends and enemies as soon as they left childhood.

Yep. That is why they had to invent religious "faith" in a cynical attempt to trick gullible people into believing the literally unbelievable. Unfortunately, in backward, uneducated countries like the USA, it works a treat!

​@@unanimousanonymity1836 explain why it's seen in animals then

@@jamespicksley5781 the comment you replied to isn't showing anymore, I assume they said something about homosexuality not being natural? And so your response is that animals do it therefore it is natural. Am I right? If so, I'd remind you that some animals also eat their own kind, some force themselves upon others, some force themselves on the young and some on their siblings. So does that mean if humans do those acts it's also natural? Animal behaviour shouldn't be our frame of reference. This is what happens when a society loses its moral compass. The west is absolutely degenerate.

You can't wiggle out of that. Just because someone owes you money you shouldn't just be allowed to own and beat them. And yes there still existed the classical form of slavery.

Christian’s abolished slavery

Cut straight to the chase.

@@SteveHewittMusic The UN's human rights declaration prohibits indentured servitude under the exact same article as slavery. The difference between them is mostly a fantasy

​​@@SteveHewittMusic saying that you can morally enslave people because they owe you money is not the out you think it is.

I am embarrassed for O'brien's cult like followers.

I really do think progressive Christians need to start speaking up for their religion lest folk like these cause Christianity to derive a bad name.

@@Coelacanth1 Yeah because after 2000 years of religious persecutions, crusades, genocides, witch burning, forced conversion, religious wars, paedophilia, torture all committed in the name of Christianity, it's going to be people like that caller who gives Christianity a bad name. Where have you been living?

@@Dale_The_Space_Wizard There are those that aware of history and those that are not for it to be the latter to which I refer, for you will notice the history of the church is not exactly mainstream to educate modern folk is it..

@@Coelacanth1 The history of the Church is so entangled with the history of the West that the history of the Church is extremely mainstream. We are all fully aware of the history of Christianity. We are not all as dumb as you think we are.

No he is always Left!!!!

@@philipholt6184 Well.... if by "Right" you mean asserting a personal point of view as "Truth" then I don't understand the reason anybody would support that. Rather someone should be asking questions that require someone to be articulate and explain the reasons they are asserting something. O'Brien seems to be asking questions, trying in vain to get people to clarify the reasons they believe these statements they are so spun up about. When they can't, it's problematic. No matter where you are on the political spectrum. One should be able to articulate why you believe in X, Y or Z. Justify your reasoning. Seems like most can't. That can be compared to cross examining a witness at a trial. A whole lot of questions are off limits and the ones you do ask can't be leading. they have to be open-ended so the witness can speak their truth.

That notion predates religion, so everyone should follow this principle regardless of their religion / no religion.

Is that not empathy? Being able to understand how someone else might feel or be affected by your actions by putting yourself in their place?

yes while she was covering up what the priest done

己所不欲 勿施於人

And THAT is Christianity!

Not to mention feeding the poor and not looking down your nose at "sinners"!

Don't forget to give away ALL your possessions. Do not save for the morrow. It's pretty clear.

I think you meant " If they actually read the bible from front to back skeptically with intelligence"

No shellfish.......

He said slaves to follow their masters? So we keep slavery?

The scary part is that with the way these people "think" it probably wouldn't take that much of a push by religious or other leaders to convince guys like this that slavery is okay. Heck, he might already think it is okay and only represses it because he hasn't been given the okay yet by those leaders or others at his church, etc.

😂😂😂😂😂😂❤, oh dear!

@jenny hubbock The show is hypocritical? not the caller? wow, it must be crazy to be you.

​@jenny hubbock how? Details please.

@@tomwithey711 I think she's read only the Wikipedia page.

The latter sounds a lot like James. He was repeating the same old lines Christophobic wokies have been throwing at us for many years that I could easily refute if I were able to speak on equal terms with him (i.e. without him shouting over me every time he disagreed with me). He hasn't got a clue about biblical teaching.

@jenny hubbock Wait! was that YOU on the phone!??? ROFLMAO 😅😂🤣🤡

Agreed.

They also ignore much easier things to follow, like not eating shellfish, not wearing mixed fibres .. I could go on

I worked at a pig slaughterhouse that was hard work I can' imagine the time and energy to sacrifice a bull, some of them weight as much as a medium sized car.

If he could be bothered to sacrifice a bull on an altar I'm sure that all you NPC types would also attack him for that.

@@Dale_The_Space_Wizard Watch the dehumanising terms, please.

@@Dale_The_Space_Wizard not at all, it’s just the picking and choosing element that comes along with these kinds of beliefs. Saying ‘it’s about context’ over and over again isn’t an argument. The context is somebody imposing their homophobic beliefs because of their picking and choosing invisible sky man. I also love the irony of referring to people criticising a religious zealot for his homophobic views as being NPCs. Surely a man incapable of questioning the bizarre nature of his own beliefs would be more likely to constitute and NPC? Or does it make you feel individual and edgy to imagine other people as somehow being more devoid of personality? We can keep having a discussion about it if you’d like, my programmer is updating my code as we speak.

False information/ religion does Gods word is life .

@@unanimousanonymity1836 Ever hears of chimpanzees?? Check´em out... Rgr

I'd marry him