Dear Herb. Thank you for the video. I was an engineering student of yours from 14 years ago and stumbled upon this. I'm rebuilding my 1978 Horse II and this was a huge help! The circle of knowledge never ends!
Thank you for this video. I replaced my tine shaft seal 2 yrs ago and refilled with new 140w gear oil. After tilling for 1/2 hr it locked up. I did not realize that the PTO (mine is a PTO) has a separate fill for the rear. The bronze gear basically melted cause it was dry. Now thanks to this video I ordered a new bronze gear and put oil in the rear this time. Ran it for 3 hrs straight last night.
I have a Bronco Axis 2015 tiller. Got some red hay bale twine around the left tine. It developed a significant leak. The angle is different due to tines being vertical instead of horizontal. I used 30 inch concrete form slick pins with pre-drilled holes and two sheet metal screws. Drilled pilot holes for the screws. Placed the slick pins in the same fashion as your square tubing. Beware that there are ball-bearings in proximity to the seal so don't use extra long screws. Just enough to get about 1/4 inch of the screw inside the seal. The force of gravity and the weight of the slick pins combined to bring this oil seal right out without tapping on the pins. Excellent tutorial and use of ingenuity! Thank You!
I just purchased a horse yesterday and I'm gathering information because this tiller is so old the mechanic don't even want to work on it. I admit I have a bit of a basket case, but a little love and it will be fine.
Ok, I feel like a goof. I had to fully disassemble the tine gear box because I just boogered up the seals trying to remove them. Wish I had searched up this video sooner. Nice repair. 👏👍
My neighbor just gave me a pony that doesn't run. After I clean all the crap out of the tank and get a carb kit I also need to replace these rear seals. This is exactly what I needed. thank you.
Herb my Troybilt Bronco is an 80's version and it needs both seals! I had a wooded lot originally back then and my tiller along with myself landscaped my entire building site. It served me well and now in it's old age it tills a veggie garden and berry patch. I have to top off "transmission" area before every use and it would extreme leak on my usual doubled up cardboard piece that it parked over. The way you explained repairs I think I can do it with tools like you made. Thanks for taking the time to explain it...
JUST WANTED TO SAY THANKS FOR A FINE VIDEO.YOUR INNOVATIVE seal removal tool worked like a dream. Tried hardwood first. Broke. Cut two 6inch pieces of 1/4" thick by 1 1/2" wide steel bar stock. Worked like a dream. My only problem was the shaft and tine assembly on one side were really frozen solid. Removed the shaft bolt, layed the tiller on it's side and half filled the shaft hole with WD40. After 30 minutes of gentle tapping and soaking she broke free. Really appreciate your video. It sure simplified the whole process. Grampa Joe Pero, bought mine back in 85 too.
+Joseph Pero Thanks for your email and congratulations on repairing your tiller. It's enjoyable being able to repair classic older machines and keep them running. I was pleased how well this simple method worked.
Thank you herbcrosby! And thank you Allison! My right side seal began leaking a few weeks ago. I thought I would have to disassemble the entire tine gear box to drive out the bad seal from the inside. Your method works great! As Allison Uhl stated below, I didn't have metal stock lying around, so I drilled two 1/8 inch holes across from each other, ran the screws in about 3 threads and used a cats paw nail puller to slowly pry the seal out. Bearings are in great shape. Cleaned the shaft with fine sandpaper and carb cleaner on a rag. Drained all oil from the tine gear box. Installed the new seal, topped up the gear oil and I'm back in bidness!
Does it stop going forward when it leaks oil?? Mine was working great then it stopped going into gear I checked and oil was pouring out the rear seal..Hoping it wS just low on oil.
Great video! 👍. Puting the seal in the freezer for a few hours will help with installing as well. If it's really tough; ( assuming you've cleaned and sanded the housing really well) heating up the seal housing with heat gun or hair dryer helps as well. Just be careful beating the crap out of it. It should go in with light to medium tapping .
great tool use, if you don't have the square rod just drill the 1/8" hole in the seal, fasten screws to seal and I used a flat pry bar on each screw alternately and the seal came out just like that. thanks Herb.
OK. I've watched about all the videos on this on youtube I can find and THIS IS THE BEST ONE!!! Thanks so much Dr. Crosby, you are a consummate Pro, in both the mechanical and video work.
Thank you, great video on how to replace the seal. I'll replace the seals on my tiller another day, what I need to know was how to check the fluid level.
@@herbcrosby Great video! I'm a little confused about putting oil in my gear box. My manual says the same thing as yours but if you go to the next page it says if the gear box has been drained to raise the drag bar up so the tiller is resting on the tines. Then fill and check the oil level. The manual also says the gear box will hold 16 ounces. I put 14 ounces in it and it is way over full when checked with the drag bar down and sitting on a 3 1/2" block of wood. Am I missing something?
@@terrysykes4615 Good observations. The book is not totally clear here. It appears some oil should first be added to an empty tine gear box with the tines on the ground so the viscous oil runs to the rear. Final filling is then done with the tiller raised with the drag bar down sitting on a 3-1/2" block. Marks on the dipstick then govern to fill to final level. Suspect that the 16 ounce capacity shown may be total capacity, not oil needed.
Herb, Thanks for the great video. You were like a friendly neighbor showing me how to do it. I just replaced my seal. I used my flat pry bar with success on the screws. I couldn't see the setting for the drag bar when checking the oil level with the 2x4 under the gear box. Is it the same gear weight for the transmission box ? Thanks again, George
Hi Herbcrosby: Thank You for the great video. This is the second time that I watched it. We appear to have the same tiller. I would love to see how to replace the main shaft oil seals on the tine transmission and of course the wheel transmission as well. Any suggestions? Again Thank You.
I filled mine with corn head grease... It's the lightest grease just a step up from the heaviest gear oil. In fact I fill most my implements gear boxes with it. Liquid enough when under load and warm/hot to do it's lube job. But solid enough when cool to not leak out.
I have an Older troybuilt with a Kohler 7HP engine, My problem is with the tiller Is in Low gear, all of a sudden it will take off like in had a super charger on it, an then starts to spit and sputter until I can get the tiller back under control What would cause this?
I just took mine off. Gentle heat and penetrating oil was the answer. I used the bearing buddy formable coil with my induction heater on the tine holder. Or a heat gun if you dont have that....then a few taps with a mallet and aluminum or brass bar on the tine holder and the both came off pretty easily. There's a couple nice flat flanges on the tine holder where the tines ride that gets a good purchase for something metal and punch like.
DATE SERIAL NUMBER Apr - 1962 101 Apr - 1963 372 Apr - 1964 721 Apr - 1965 1132 Apr - 1966 1526 Oct - 1966 1825 Apr - 1967 2221 Trojan Horse production ceased with serial #2712 Jul - 1967 2713 Oct - 1967 2912 Jan - 1968 3433 Apr - 1968 4060 Jul - 1968 4663 Oct - 1968 5359 Jan - 1969 5993 Apr - 1969 6650 Jul - 1969 7556 Oct - 1969 8480 Jan - 1970 9513 Apr - 1970 10839 Jul - 1970 12501 Oct - 1970 14189 Jan - 1971 16108 Apr - 1971 18428 Jul - 1971 21840 Oct - 1971 24540 Jan - 1972 28528 Apr - 1972 32140 Jul - 1972 38000 Oct - 1972 42000 Jan - 1973 49821 Feb - 1973 51417 Mar - 1973 53530 Apr - 1973 56017 HORSE SERIAL NUMBERS COMMENTS/REMARKS Trojan Horse - 4.5 HP, all stud tires, and cast iron spoke wheels Garden Way Manufacturing Co. formed and began production of the Horse I, two speed, two belt, 6 HP Tecumseh engine. Bar tread tires and cast iron hubs optional before Serial #31040. 7" cast spoke wheel changed to 8" steel wheels with Serial #31456. May - 1973 58533 Jun - 1973 61361 Jul - 1973 63881 Sep - 1973 67867 Oct - 1973 70421 Nov - 1973 74232 Dec - 1973 77834 Jan - 1974 80945 Feb - 1974 84721 Mar - 1974 88708 Apr - 1974 93038 May - 1974 97244 Jun - 1974 101527 Jul - 1974 105491 Aug - 1974 108388 Sep - 1974 112373 Oct - 1974 116909 Nov - 1974 121972 Dec - 1974 126927 Jan - 1975 131034 Feb - 1975 136006 Mar - 1975 141231 Apr - 1975 146981 May - 1975 153066 Jun - 1975 158433 Jul - 1975 163222 Aug - 1975 166417 Sep - 1975 171230 Oct - 1975 176853 Nov - 1975 182749 Dec - 1975 187490 Jan - 1976 193030 Feb - 1976 198420 Mar - 1976 203735 Apr - 1976 210574 May - 1976 217266 Jun - 1976 223064 Jul - 1976 228669 Aug - 1976 229790 Sep - 1976 235432 Oct - 1976 240369 Nov - 1976 245622 Dec - 1976 250148 Reverse disc mount changed to single bolt with large washer from three Allen head screws. Jan - 1977 254282 Feb - 1977 258957 Mar - 1977 262948 Apr - 1977 267597 May - 1977 271446 Jun - 1977 274882 Jul - 1977 278612 Aug - 1977 280141 Sep - 1977 284743 Oct - 1977 289375 Nov - 1977 294577 Dec - 1977 299725 Jan - 1978 304562 Feb - 1978 309976 Feb - 1978 314150 Feb - 1978 314151 Begin Horse II production. Four speed, one belt, 6 HP Tecumseh. Mar - 1978 314320 Mar - 1978 315296 Apr - 1978 320330 May - 1978 325435 Jun - 1978 331138 Jul - 1978 336870 Aug - 1978 338749 Sep - 1978 345189 Oct - 1978 350985 Nov - 1978 357514 Dec - 1978 363052 Jan - 1979 368621 Feb - 1979 375440 Mar - 1979 380828 Apr - 1979 388355 May - 1979 394015 Jun - 1979 400854 Jul - 1979 406077 Aug - 1979 409378 Sep - 1979 416629 Oct - 1979 422959 Nov - 1979 430460 Dec - 1979 435848 Jan - 1980 439736 Feb - 1980 446898 Mar - 1980 453023 Apr - 1980 459525 Last Horse I produced. Total production 311,437 units. Begin production with 7 HP Kohler engine available. May - 1980 467761 Jun - 1980 474363 Jul - 1980 480283 Aug - 1980 484627 Sep - 1980 491122 Oct - 1980 498098 Nov - 1980 505891 Dec - 1980 511381 Jan - 1981 518348 Feb - 1981 525202 Mar - 1981 531211 Apr - 1981 539361 May - 1981 546751 Jun - 1981 552154 Jul - 1981 559140 Aug - 1981 563747 Sep - 1981 569130 Oct - 1981 574187 Nov - 1981 579458 Dec - 1981 584797 Jan - 1982 590135 Feb - 1982 594649 February 27, 1982, Lyman Wood left Troy-Bilt. Mar - 1982 599434 Apr - 1982 606277 May - 1982 612944 Jun - 1982 617088 Jul - 1982 622295 Aug - 1982 626257 Sep - 1982 629618 Sep - 1982 634138 September 15, 1982, Last Horse II produced. Sep - 1982 640000 Oct - 1982 640099 Nov - 1982 642381 Dec - 1982 649518 Jan - 1983 650220 Feb - 1983 654743 Mar - 1983 660705 Apr - 1983 665117 May - 1983 670891 Jun - 1983 674427 Jul - 1983 678407 Aug - 1983 681698 Sep - 1983 685462 January 28, 1982, Dean Leith becomes Company President Horse III PTO Tine Clutch begins production with 6 HP Tecumseh, 7 HP Kohler, and 8 HP Briggs and Stratton engine options. Oct - 1983 688574 Nov - 1983 692962 Dec - 1983 697866 Jan - 1984 702873 Feb - 1984 707715 Mar - 1984 712492 Apr - 1984 719751 May - 1984 725255 Jun - 1984 730791 Jul - 1984 735958 Aug - 1984 740247 Sep - 1984 746020 Oct - 1984 749814 Nov - 1984 754103 Dec - 1984 759889 Jan - 1985 762559 Feb - 1985 765766 Mar - 1985 772021 Apr - 1985 778419 May - 1985 782176 Jun - 1985 787776 Jul - 1985 791185 Aug - 1985 794581 Sep - 1985 797525 Oct - 1985 800185 Nov - 1985 803053 Dec - 1985 805145 Jan - 1986 806595 Feb - 1986 810470 Mar - 1986 814811 Apr - 1986 819802 May - 1986 824527 Jun - 1986 828042 Jul - 1986 830648 Aug - 1986 832923 Sep - 1986 832923 Oct - 1986 835437 Nov - 1986 837628 Dec - 1986 838827 Jan - 1987 841756 Feb - 1987 845342 Mar - 1987 847287 Apr - 1987 849978 May - 1987 855053 Jun - 1987 855639 Jun - 1987 855697 Jun - 1987 856107 Jun - 1987 856127 Jun - 1987 857306 Jul - 1987 857307 First O.P.C. production. Aug - 1987 858609 Sep - 1987 859652 Oct - 1987 860380 Nov - 1987 861823 Dec - 1987 865489 Jan - 1988 866039 Feb - 1988 870240 Mar - 1988 872310 Apr - 1988 876018 May - 1988 881723 Jun - 1988 882966 Jul - 1988 884637 Sep - 1988 886504 Oct - 1988 888299 Nov - 1988 890115 Dec - 1988 892915 Jan - 1989 895069 Feb - 1989 897842 Mar - 1989 901396 Apr - 1989 903808 May - 1989 905524 Jun - 1989 00906827 Jul - 1989 00907732 Aug - 1989 00908629 Sep - 1989 00910812 Oct - 1989 00912139 Nov - 1989 00913963 Dec - 1989 00918299 Jan - 1990 00919667 Feb - 1990 00922104 Mar - 1990 00923346 Graphic models start at 00923347 Apr - 1990 00926914 May - 1990 00929326 Jun - 1990 00931877 Jul - 1990 00933944 Aug - 1990 00934693 Sep - 1990 00936672 8 HP Kohler engine replaced 8 HP Briggs and Stratton Last Horse III produced. Total Horse III production 217,306 units. Test Run of first Operator Presence Controls (O.P.C.) Oct - 1990 00937563 Nov - 1990 00938904 Dec - 1990 00940749 Jan - 1991 00942768 Feb - 1991 00942768 Feb - 1991 00944684 - 00944858 International Mar - 1991 00946753 Apr - 1991 00948616 May - 1991 00950330 May - 1991 D0000001 - D0000523 Black 25th Anniversary Edition Jun - 1991 D0000524 - D0001998 Black 25th Anniversary Edition Jul - 1991 00953276 Sep - 1991 00955222 Oct - 1991 00958067 Oct - 1991 00944858 - 00956555 International Nov - 1991 00959797 7 HP Electric Start Nov - 1991 00959842 7 HP Pull Start Nov - 1991 12058100564 8 HP Pull Start New Serial Number Format Nov - 1991 00959077 8 HP Pull Start Nov - 1991 12059100735 8 HP Electric Start Nov - 1991 00959138 8 HP Electric Start Dec - 1991 120560100385 7 HP Pull Start Dec - 1991 120570100334 7 HP Electric Start Dec - 1991 120580101065 8 HP Pull Start Dec - 1991 120590100940 8 HP Electric Start Dec - 1991 120510100100 8 HP Pull Start Briggs & Stratton International Jan - 1992 120560100750 7 HP Pull Start Jan - 1992 120570100940 7 HP Electric Start Jan - 1992 120590101245 8 HP Electric Start Jan - 1992 120510100154 8 HP Pull Start Briggs & Stratton International Feb - 1992 120580200399 8 HP Pull Start Feb - 1992 120560200409 7 HP Pull Start Feb - 1992 120550100134 8 HP Pull Start Made for Sears Feb - 1992 120590200499 8 HP Electric Start Feb - 1992 120510100314 8 HP Pull Start Briggs & Stratton International Mar - 1992 120560200699 7 HP Pull Start Mar - 1992 120570200354 7 HP Electric Start Mar - 1992 120580200993 8 HP Pull Start Mar - 1992 120550100179 8 HP Pull Start Made for Sears Mar - 1992 120590200724 8 HP Electric Start Apr - 1992 120560300422 7 HP Pull Start Apr - 1992 120570300204 7 HP Electric Start Apr - 1992 120580300455 8 HP Pull Start Apr - 1992 120590300363 8 HP Electric Start May - 1992 120580301000 8 HP Pull Start May - 1992 120590300958 8 HP Electric Start May - 1992 120560301143 7 HP Pull Start May - 1992 120570300455 7 HP Electric Start Jun - 1992 120580301590 8 HP Pull Start Jun - 1992 120590301768 8 HP Electric Start Jun - 1992 120560301888 7 HP Pull Start Jun - 1992 120570300824 7 HP Electric Start Jul - 1992 120580302060 8 HP Pull Start Jul - 1992 120590302206 8 HP Electric Start Jul - 1992 120510200134 8 HP Pull Start Briggs & Stratton International Jul - 1992 120560302160 7 HP Pull Start Jul - 1992 120570300894 7 HP Electric Start Aug - 1992 120580302460 8 HP Pull Start Aug - 1992 120590302585 8 HP Electric Start Aug - 1992 120560302455 7 HP Pull Start Aug - 1992 120570300984 7 HP Electric Start Sep - 1992 120580303084 8 HP Pull Start Sep - 1992 120590303000 8 HP Electric Start Sep - 1992 12060302940 7 HP Pull Start Sep - 1992 120570301243 7 HP Electric Start Oct - 1992 120580303518 8 HP Pull Start Oct - 1992 120590303260 8 HP Electric Start Oct - 1992 120560303552 7 HP Pull Start Oct - 1992 120570301532 7 HP Electric Start Nov - 1992 120580303769 8 HP Pull Start Nov - 1992 120590303520 8 HP Electric Start Nov - 1992 120510200159 8 HP Pull Start Briggs & Stratton International Nov - 1992 120560303787 7 HP Pull Start Dec - 1992 120580303995 8 HP Pull Start Dec - 1992 120590303848 8 HP Electric Start Dec - 1992 120560304039 7 HP Pull Start Dec - 1992 120570301640 7 HP Electric Start Jul - 1976 P10001 Jan - 1977 P12184 Jul - 1977 P17239 Jan - 1978 P21736 Jul - 1978 P27504 Jan - 1979 P33557 Jul - 1979 P40287 Jan - 1980 P48773 Jul - 1980 P58906 Jan - 1981 P68034 Jul - 1981 P80423 Jan - 1982 P89466 May - 1982 S101843 Pony III Jul - 1982 S105606 Jan - 1983 S117319 Jul - 1983 S129028 Jun - 1981 M1001 Jan - 1982 M1378 Jul - 1982 M8204 Junior II Jan - 1983 M17012 Jul - 1983 M25639
I stuck the tine holder with a heavy crow bar while standing on the other side of the tiller. Several sharp blows knocked them free. My tine holders had been off before so you may need to soak with penetrating oil. Good luck.
I"m having this issue also. Will try hitting it with a rubber mallet to see if that helps. Otherwise penetrating oil time if I can figure out where I'd put it.
If you have an air chisel / hammer and use a very blunt tip it usually vibrates that tillers right off the shaft. Be careful, not trying to hammer it off, just trying to vibrate it.
Did not seem to be a problem. The rubber seal behind the thin metal bearing housing apparently stopped any chips. Am impressed how well this older tiller now works with new tines and seals.
I bought these seals from Amazon:Troy Bilt Horse Tiller Tine shaft seals set 9618, GW-9618 GW-9602 GW-9618099. They apparently are currently unavailable but there are equivalent seals offered.
Yes do it way it designed to work. Get your proper seals. Then the bearings and or bushing. Now you have to clean it . Now you need shims to set the proper play side and end play. Carefully paint put back together. Then retouch the paint and repair any covers . Now you have a fix that don't leak. Last and work as it should.
@@herbcrosby Just pulled a PTO Horse w/Kohler 8 out of a barn that has been sitting for 25+ years. Got it running good and have replaced motor and trans oil. That rear is the only thing left. I may leave it if that is the case.
I saw a video that showed you remove the bottom bolt of the 5 bolts of the COVER-Tiller housing, after taking off the tine holder on one side. Also, prop the opposite side up to allow more complete draining. You can see the 5 bolts in the video when Herb is applying grease to the shaft.
It takes money to pay somebody . Or you to know how to do . In my mined a better way . You see the bearing has sloppy. Ok now you find out how and get the parts bit at a time . When done you will have a great machine for a fair value and know how it done . Cause it happens when in use .the older ones were made to repair. Not just get a new device.
