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Kendall - better at public speaking Roman - better on one on one talks Shiv - better at shiving people in the back Connor - better at being interested in politics from a very young age
Because it's objectively true. People naturally self segregate. From Churches, to cookouts, to the lunch table. People like people who look and act like they do. This is a universal truth across all races.
Roman in these "side meetings" is the most capable of all the kids. He's not great in the board meetings but he shines one on one with some of these powerful creeps.
that’s kinda why i hope the kids stay together ; they all have their strengths. Kendall is the boss but he can’t close deals. Roman can close but he gets rattled sometimes. Shiv isn’t clever as she thinks, but her public face is stone cold .
A small part of me thought they were going to fuck or something the first time I watched this scene. And then the same thing happened when I watched the show again about a year later.
@@littleoldmanboy I thought the same thing. I didn't think that they would actually fuck, but maybe Mencken would make a pass at Roman. The idea that this far-right politician is also secretly gay, and only Roman knows ... would have been hilarious.
At first I wasn't sure why exactly this scene had so much sexual chemistry between them but like they're literally mirroring each other, that's attraction 101
It’s so fascinating to see Roman in his element and actually being competent, when he’s actually focused I think he’s actually the most capable of the children
He also almost blew up the Pierce deal before it ever started. I know it blew up in the end anyways, but regardless...just having good instincts doesn't make one qualified. He also had to have Gerri explain to him why digging up the homeless guy with the dicc tattoo from Ken's bachelor party could be bad for him too, not only for Ken. Roman's an idiot. And a terrible idiot at that. Let's not overthink this. Having no shame and telling people whatever they want to hear is easy... a la Donald Trump. There is no effing way that Logan hands over keys of the company to Roman, who he thinks (to quote him directly) "is a moron". Plus he secretly hates all of his kids anyways...they're utilities to him. So none of them are just having that seat handed to them. They'll need to take it, and "it'll be hostile, hostile, hostile."
@@chrismcgroarty350 In a talk show, Brian Cox was told by the creators that Logan LOVES his children. It's Roman's lack of fear, inhibition, lack respect for tact that makes him appear brilliant. Except for his sexual ineptitudes, and the Japanese rocket he has been skating fast and loose knowing that he exists within a shiny billionaire's bubble.
Could you please elaborate what you meant by this? Just curious. Was it about the ending of season 4 ep 8, or something else you were thinking would be set up?
@@lazzalazuli8457i think it s about how america will possibly have a fascist candidate after trump/biden s next term. like how simpson predicted trump
There was so much tension between them. I don’t know if Succession would make them…happen but honestly the chemistry between the two of them was something
@@goodfortune4317 pipe down, it’s never that deep. It’s a tv show and we’re allowed to speculate, if you can’t tell that there’s an obvious chemistry between them then you’re not concentrating. Plus if you think the world is homocentric now then you’re just flat out wrong, most things are still heterocentric which is why things like this are so concentrated on when they cross our screens, cause they’re rare
"I think you could use our push" "I think you could use mine" *intense eye staring while in a bathroom* Don't think there's been an interaction with more potential double meaning than this one.
What do you mean, the whole point is that they’re doing Coke. Logan tells him to bring up a coke for him and Mencken is high the whole time which is why he gives Logan a literal coca-cola which not only surprises him but he doesn’t drink.
@@roronoasam1 no he brought the Coca Cola specifically because the last politician (who everybody initially thought would be the prime candidate) didn’t bring the coke to Logan, he questioned Logan. Bringing the coke was a symbolic gesture saying “I’ll do what ATN wants, I’ll play ball. You want me to help with tax relief for your campanula, you got it. You want me to bring you a coke, you got it”
0:30 onwards is where the dialogue goes nuts on how vague yet... communicative it is. I'll try to translate: R: "Fascism is on a rise, but it's also generally unpopular. Can you handle balancing that?" M: "Look, I have a lot of Fascist beliefs. I'm sticking to them".... "and I hate the liberal belief that democracy is perfect" M: "See, we white people/ruling class have had a stake in controlling the nation for years, and then immigrants show up and vote me out. Maybe they should contribute first before they do that." R: "Then who gets to be a part of America?" M: "White people. Maybe someday others, but not now." R: "Okay. How does ATN play into this? We know we're old and you're getting attention from young people, but you still need our base of old conservatives" M: "Are those old conservatives really going to vote against me?" R: "No, but the vote could swing. We can help with that". M: "And I can help you bring in young viewers" .... M: "Where do you stand in Logan's empire" R: "I'm not gonna answer that and deflect: I think ATN needs to, going into the future, pull in the youth crowd away from tech and stop relying on the old conservatives. We'll do it with a delicate touch: and ideally you, Mencken, will be in the centre of it" Succession is so great because, if it were my dialogue, it would be a dry boring peace of crap. Instead, it layers what people say with subtext and metaphor.
I can't quite decide the motivation behind Roman's speech. Either he's saying what he thinks Mencken wants to hear (and nailing it) or he feels like he's finally found someone to talk to where he can really speak freely. I find the latter a lot more interesting and a LOT more frightening.
He is basically lubing him up for his Dad. Both Menken and Logan were too proud to talk to each other, Menken was catching Logan's attention by insulting him, but also cosying up to Roman, and Logan found Menken a good face for his network who would be too dirty to stand to Logan in case of any problems with the GA, but yet Menken was too small for him to approach without losing the upper-hand so he sent Roman. Roman here just showed him how profitable would it be if he basically submits to Logan, they would let him do whatever he wants ideologically, he just have to answer to one man and make his fathers life easier. And we see Menken bringing him a can of coke as a sign of submission "anointed with a coke"
Roman is looking ahead and thinks Jaryd is the kind of shot in the arm that ATN News needs to appeal to the new-age younger conservatives. Fox news has an average viewer age of around 50 - 60 and its commercials are aimed towards them which is why you always hear jokes about bedpan and catheter ads. Meanwhile, the main push for younger conservatives and more far-right consumption is on the internet and social media. Think the Proud Boys and Alex Jones viewers. Roman wants ATN to be the driving force behind these people and wants ATN to "modernize" to attract them back. Jaryd is their candidate and if ATN becomes the epicenter for all things new-wave right-wing with him at the center. Those commercials stop being about bedpans and start being about dick pill and bone broth because ATN will have tapped into the wingnuts that watch TickTok and RU-vid political nutjobs all day by giving them the "deepstate conspiracy hour" that they like on Facebook all-day already. Roman isn't pushing this because he believes in it. He doesn't believe in anything, because he's grown up 1% and this shit won't ever effect him (just like he said to Shiv in the episode). No, he wants to straddle the country with a pseudo-fascist and send the Republican party's discord into the gutter because it will boost ATN. That's the only thing he cares about, which is what makes him so dangerous.
I do think the writers chose to leave Mencken's potential presidency ambigious was a conscious choice. The fact that he doesn't have any allies in Waystar Royco anymore can't be good news for him.
Shiv fan boy 🤣 they were both used an manipulated cause they both think they are so much smarter than they truly are. That applies more towards Shiv cause Roman knows he's bullshit 😂😂
@@alfoul If you care about a show maybe stay out of online discussions ABOUT the show man, it’s the internet. Snape kills dumbledoor and Logan rises from the dead in the last episode.
LMAO this fucking clown is going through every comment to whine at everyone who calls out fascists. Imagine calling someone else soft while being the biggest bitch here. 😂
@AL Your projections are as hilarious as they are absurd and off the mark. Quit screeching buzzwords you heard your daddy say and go play some more Call of Duty, you actual fucking child. Lmfao. 👶🍼
This season had so many subtle, power scenes. It didn't look like much was going on, but plots were literally being rewritten in these seemingly throw-away conversations. Amazing writing and delivery.
Not really good with public speaking, though. He can speak circles around you but his failure is relating to the audience or even attempting to do it. Kendall can do this (based on Living+ speech)
Also, Roman is a good negotiator. He's always being friendly to his opponent first and then talk casually and then persuade them to change their mind. Shiv is mostly too direct and she talks whatever she wants to say even cursing which is not professional. Kendall on the other hand is too agressive, likes to interrupt and won't let his opponent to speak.
Homoeroticism is weirdly a semi regular occurrence in super manly spaces. Toxic masculinity is about worshipping and aspiring to manliness, so some men end up admiring masculinity in an intimate way even if they’re not technically gay
Roman wanted this guy and he made it happen as opposed to his siblings who spent the whole episode throwing tantrums and expecting someone else to make their wish happen
What the hell are you talking about? Logan made it happen...Roman didn't do anything, much like his entire life...he does nothing but gets everything from his dad in exchange for his dad slapping him every now and again
@@romanmarshall602 I can't see Logan taking a hard (center) left turn unless there was great incentive, it was either the boring vp or the spicy fascist and Logan wanted someone he can play ball with and to chastise shiv
Yeah, Roman was the only one that actually worked that night. Shiv’s whole play was “this guy is quite fascist, let’s go with another one” without actually selling her option
Personally this was very uncomfortable to watch but it is also so good. Always looked like Roman didn't care but now we know it's not an act, he really doesn't. His strategy here checks out though, hate sells, but he's messing with things he can't possibly control and it's gonna be funny when it all blows up in his face.
@@stevenobrien557great point! Kinda funny how they set up these patterns with the characters but still keep you in suspense about where it will go. In real life we put ourselves in the same types of situations and similar problems over and over too.
Do people in the comments not realize this character is literally a fascist. None of the candidates were good but as much as I love Roman he is just as evil it seems
I love that Roman his rubbing lotion on his hands as he initiates the conversation. Nice callback to season 1: "I'm not good at corporate flirting, I prefer to just fuck"
god i love this show... i love how the writers are (either consciously or unconsciously) subverting typical 'hee hee ha ha fascists are bumbling and stupid' trump era entertainment which has been so prevalent over the past couple years. the subtle commentary on entertainment news whether its from the 'left' or the right is such gold, and they seem to have found a good balance between keeping the characters charismatic and alluring while still making the realism so effective it almost makes the show kinda scary. i could see succession going to some pretty dark places in the next couple years, but i know im in good hands and im here for it
Definitely. It keeps making sly commentary on the virtue signalling of the left and makes the left-right politics seem meaningless. Then it closes the episode of one of the most harrowing, and dark, depictions of right populism rising and the family empire undermining democracy.
@@sergiosalazar8702 Bro the president guy literally says that he won't change his beliefs when Roman asks him about fascism and then he goes to talk about the farm he tended that was taken away by 40 guys with boom boxes. Pretty simple metaphor
@@goodfortune4317 i interpreted it as them feeling the power through their libido. as in the thrill they get from just being there, making some big choices makes them feel insatiable. what are they supposed to feel? happy? excited? that's not enough man
@@goodfortune4317 What a chronically online take. Please interact with people offline, you’ll quickly see that you’re whining about a strawman. Kieran Culkin said it himself in the official HBO podcast: Roman Roy has been written as bisexual from season 1 ( it became “more complex than that” as his psychosexual desires were explored). The writers likely intended for there to be a degree of sexual tension between these characters as to a) elude back to Roman’s confusing sexuality, and b) encapsulate the seduction and radicalisation of predominantly rich white men into alt-right mindsets, and c) further their interesting power dynamic.
I love how Roman is listening to everything Mencken says from the standpoint of how good it'd be for ATN. He's both taken aback and weirdly delighted as to how much red meat they have on their hands now.
Giving how all the things worked out at the end, it’s crazy that roman was the one who made all the deals went well in the first place with mattson, mencken etc but at the end of the also he was the one out of all the cast suffered most from these exchanges.
1:23 The fact that they were having a conversation while looking at a mirror says it all, but I still got a feeling that it was a bit too much for Roman.
"i don't think this scene is gay" ok well maybe you're watching wrong bc succession frequently ties business and sex together and conflates them. the way the characters speak and act during business deals is extremely psychosexual. that's like roman's entire thing.
It’s weird how Jaryd was completely dropped from the rest of the season. In fact, my biggest issue with season 3 was how quickly new characters would come and go (see also: Sanaa Lathan and Adrien Brody’s characters). At least Alexander Skarsgard got a substantial role
Makes absolutely no sense how they used some of these secondary characters. Like I understand it’s a lot to jam into 9 episodes but then don’t create so many different compelling characters? Idk. Mencken was a beast and deserved more screen time.
I think they're setting up characters for season 4. Mencken will be back because Logan is backing him in politics, and Mattson will be back because he owns Waystar now
"I don't have a lot of boundaries" as he moves closer. "I think you could use our push"..."I think YOU could use mine" as they stare and wink at each other. I was so sure they were gonna make out by the end of that scene lol. Roman found his other half and might be in love 😂
@@joewithajay Really? You screamed? H wasn't as evil as the banksters and history has made him out to be. H was given a boatload of money to start a world war, against the Caucasian Christians, but instead, H used it to make Germany great again and succeeded wildy beyond their dreams. Churchill, the drunken druid, was the true war monger. If you turn history inside out, and upside down, you get closer to the real truth.
Lol guy became President of the United States while everyone mocked him saying he didn't have a chance. Jeb Bush came from a family with 2 previous presidents, plenty of money, had a good head on his shoulders, and all the connections and still got beat out by a guy who said he 'grabs em by the pussy' when #MeToo was in it's prime. People make fun of the guy all the time but would never get anywhere near the success he's had. People don't realize that he was clever because he was one of the first candiates to talk to the people like another person and not talk to them like politician.
@@safirouhi1651jordan peterson isn’t remotely close to 2016/17 richard spencer. Never heard peterson say “hail victory”. Also, peterson loves israel.
It's nice to see Justin Kirk getting a juicy role and he did well as fascist Mencken, I hate his guts already. Hope we get to see more of him in future episodes. What I don't get is why would Logan pick him as his presidential candidate, when it's heavily suggested that Mencken is a loose cannon that won't be easily manipulated.
Because he’ll draw in the ratings for his networks. Also Logan finally settled on him because his assistant/fuck buddy gave the nod of approval. She sees something in Mencken and it’s scary.
The thing I find so fascinating about this scene is how their approach to fascism isn’t based on their actual beliefs. The only desire they have is power, so they use the fears of the layman to get it. SPOILERS The scene with Kendall and Logan where Logan says “I know things about people or I wouldn’t turn a buck, not necessarily nice things,” ties into this. What Logan knows is this: humans are fearful creatures of survival, who have always had an enemy to defeat in order to stay alive. In the past two elections, it’s been shown that voters have chosen to vote against a candidate instead of for one, on both sides of the aisle. If we want to move forward, we have to stop using hate as our way of expressing love.
Any political movement will contain a spectrum of motivations. Look at the upper echelons of the Nazi party - Goering the ruthless and cynical pragmatist vs Himmler the ideologue. One of Hitler’s talents was in balancing these interests.
Very well said, you can never lose on betting on our worse instincts. Good people and intentions dry up and change but people will never not have the ugly side. Roman is the bootleg Logan for real.
@@BoogieDownProduction I think the real vapid sentence is your response which included no elaboration whatsoever. My point is that love is commonly expressed through means of exclusion or discrimination, both acts of hatred.
amid infectious humor and easy banter burns a provocative idealism... also love the meticulous attempt to mollify the aridity of probing questions with sexual innuendo. Great Performance! Bravo!
