Cutscene version of the complete banter between Secret Companion and other companions from Dragon Age: Origins. Created using toolset. #dragonageorigins #dragonageoriginsbanter
Another reason I love this game so much is that they wrote all this cool dialogue between Loghain and the other companions despite you not even having him for all that long before the game finishes.
Old BioWare>any game company I mean just the rp alone makes the games S tier, I hope in DA4 that the main protagonist is the warden again cuz 1: imo the morrigan romance is the best so yeah 2: It’s undeniable BioWare hasn’t been what they were ME Legendary edition saved em somewhat but it was only a remaster if DA4 fails we may potentially not even get a ME4 and if that fails as well BioWare is finished so I’d say let us use any of the protagonists we want whether it be DAO, DA2, OR DA3 the MC is 100% our choice and the team is made up of everyone from the 3 games that can be there, leave it off with no cliffhangers however leave room for a sequel meaning don’t leave it on a “we’re done with these guys” ending but also not like a “the story isn’t over” ending same goes for ME4 since it’s possible shep will return
@@jarrett3556Sadly the protagonist cant be the warden nor cant it be hawke. You can either have the Warden alive or dead, so it wouldn't work to make a game based around them unless they completely retcon the Warden dying making your playthrough in Origins worthless since you would have no control of the story, the most they can do is have a cameo if your warden is alive in your story. It cant be Hawke cause you can also have him killed in Inquisition you cant based an entire game around him either cause then you would also have to retcon Hawke dying, how would he survive literally getting eaten by a giant spider demon and getting stuck physically in the fade. Most they can do is a cameo if he lives in your story. The Inquisitor would make the most sense as a returning protagonist but the end of Tresspaser clearly indicates that it will be another new protagonist. But unlike the other games I hope the Inquisitor appears regularly since our new character will be working for them in hopes of defeating Solas I also hope that we get a lot more new companions mixing new ones with olds ones from all the other games
@@deadx0092 they could make something like awakening where if your warden lives he's the new commander but if he died the commander will be a warden from Orlais
i think it's because the game wasn't supposed to end so soon after we defeat Loghain. The overall siege of Denerim feels rushed, as in the plot itself feels different from the others, especially the decision for darkspawn to attack Denerim and expose their flank. Either the connection between Origins and Awakening was supposed to have a path for which you would take loghain and others or the ending of the game was to be longer but they decided to maybe tell it in DLCs or future games which never really happened cause blight becomes lesser plot despite all the lore dumps
@@deadx0092 In fact, there is an option, which - by the DA:Inquisition - is canon, and let all Grey Warden stay alive. And there were other examples for long-living Grey Wardens. There could be a side game with the Origin's Warden as the main character to solve it's own problem, and then it could come back later in a continuity.
I must say I appreciate that you titled this "secret companion" rather than name him, most probably would've thought "it's an old game, everyone knows everything about it by now" but I know for a fact that there are still people out there only just now starting their first play through. :D
@@33rd_Dunadan Especially because the game itself spoils it! You can pick up gifts that say they're for Loghain before you've recruited him. I always thought that was so dumb.
I love that the origins community is still alive and love this game just as much in 2022. I personally love origins. Best dragon age game ever, if it was remastered to 60fps and tweaked the textures👌 so much lore and such a great community
I just got origins on steam last month, just because i missed playing it.. Downside is i never make til the ending because the damnclass and race choise matters!
Loghain surviving the Landsmeet only to die striking the killing blow on the archdemon is a poetic end to a great antagonist. I had no idea he had all this banter though
it's also a way to reclaim justice. he did save Ferelden, but also almost destroy it as well. Killing the archdemon is a sentence and a way to reclaim his name.
I am not a fan of him. But it is rather touching the interaction he has with the dog. I personally am Team Alistair forever 🥰😍😘 but I can see how Loghain became consumed by his bitterness to the point of self corruption. I honestly would have loved to see the animosity of Loghain and Alistair working together in the party. Loghain begins a path towards redemption and slowly but surely Alistair comes to forgive Loghain for his ignorance and his betrayal. But that didn't happen. I don't think ill ever swap out Alistair for Loghain...I just can't do that to Alistair.
After reading the books and allowing yourself to see him as more than just a traitor, killing him feels like such a waste. He’s a *very* well written character. For me it’s either giving him a change to redeem himself by dying killing the Archdemon or keeping him alive even after that through the ritual. I’m glad we can harden Alistair.
@AgirlnamedMichael I disagree. There always is redemption if there is a will to obtain it. It’s not about belittling what he did, it’s about working to be a force for something better
-Long post(Loghain is complex) and possible spoilers Its childish there is a Blight. If you just look at it as entertainment you fail to grasp the weight of the matter. You must immerse yourself as if you are living in the universe. Ferelden is almost wiped out and you would kill your/the best military commander and doom people and damage other nations for the sake of "justice/revenge"? The world would remember you as the idiot who let the best opportunity pass up. Killing Loghain only makes sense if you believe in the deus ex of The Warden. Real life is not like that though. Some people enjoy tall tales, I guess. Alistair should know better than most that Grey Wardens are made of people with terrible pasts, not everyone is a noble lordling. I mean, they do try to keep from messing with noble bloodlines if it can be helped. They don't want to antagonize nobility. Furthermore, Duncan kills Ser Jory in cold blood- implying GW do scummy stuff. So its okay if GW do scummy stuff and if non GW do scummy stuff its bad? You may argue well it's a Blight- well nobody knew but Duncan and Ferelden GW and they kept it a secret (big WTF) They were purposely vague in describing the situation to King Cailan...which made Cailan overconfident, more than his usual laid back personality would. Loghain was right for being serious and wary about the situation. Cailain pissed on every of Loghain's military strategies/counsel- the soldier at Ostagar tells you they have been fighting for weeks, he somewhat mistakenly thinks it's over queen Anora (foreshadowing of Return to Ostagar) But really it's about Cailain rushing the military operation just because he can't get his Orlesian wardens if he waits. Loghain wants to wait but not for Orlesian reinforcements but instead Fereldian. That's why Cailan rushes the operation since he isn't aware it's a real Blight because Grey Warden bs Moreover, one of the GW motto is: whatever it takes to win the Blight- Loghain has all the makings of GW, he is both honorable and cutthroat. The Orlesian wardens were aware of Ferelden and Orlais history and didn't trespass until they were summoned directly Ferelden. They were massively respectful despite the Blight granting them authority to steam roll through Ferelden. In Return to Ostagar, if your bring Loghain he learns Cailan was actually against Orlais helping (just like him) but still diplomatic towards them. Anora, Loghain's daughter, was the one conspiring with Empress Celene and manipulating Cailan into being pro Orlesian. If you spare Loghain in both Landsmeet and Archdemon he becomes pivotal in stopping Corypheous and preserving the legacy of the GW. 10 years after the events of the 5th Blight Loghain is a respected Senior Warden and a man wise from his mistakes, he admits his decisions in Fereleden were bad and despite his dislike of being reminded; he still takes all the flak thrown at him even 10 years after the events like a saint. He also becomes friends with Hawke from DA2. Loghain is arguably the most complex character in the series.
I think my favourite part about Loghain is that he is fully accepts everyone's contempt. He is an aggressive character sure but everyone's hatred of him barely phases him. Except for, and here's what I love, the conversation where weyn accuses him of not caring about the soldiers he lost at Ostagar. The venom he drips in retort to that remark alone makes him one of my favourite characters ever written.
This give you a different view of Loghain. What he did was awful but I guess he's not completely evil, just blinded by war. I never had him as a companion when playing DAO but I just finished a DAI story where he joined the party and Alistair left to become king. He seems to be a better person.
@@johnherrera5261 you can, if you harden Alistair in his personal quest, you can convince him to be a king and stop whining, allowing you to marry him to Anora and keep Loghain.
It's really interesting to take Loghain with you on the "Return to Ostagar" DLC and get his reaction when he hears the contents of the letters between Cailan and the Empress of Orlais
@@markpreston8854 yeah I watched that on RU-vid. He's real ass. That's said Calin marring Celene may have made sense on paper, but it would have been a political disaster for him in Ferelden.
There are also the banters with Wynn during Return to Ostagar DLC that are very interesting and gives more insights on his decisions to abandon Cailan. And of course, his little apparition in Awakening if both him and the Warden survived killing the archdaemon, it gives a little more closure to his character and briefly explains why he was sent to the grey wardens of Orlais.
Cailan was going to divorce his daughter, and marry the Empress of Orlais. Orlais. The country that did all that dog kicking, and much more. I cannot blame him for leaving that rat to die.
@@katie5998 Of course there are. Your people. My people are heroes. Even if they do bad things that I disagree with, they're still my people and I still want what's best for them, especially against other people. My people produce heroes. Less of them now than before, but still, we do. I don't belong to a fictional nation, so I don't really care about that fictional nation. But in the abstract? You're quite wrong.
@@katie5998 Probably no point in trying to explain it. There aren't any spelling or grammatical errors there. Your people, my people, anyone's people, we all owe it to ourselves to value our people, especially against other people. In this story, Loghain did exactly that, and Cailan actively betrayed his people. He got what he deserved.
The story about Loghain and his dog always makes me see him differently. As well as his conversation with Wynne about his men. Great writing. The newer games never make me feel like this
In my first play through all those years ago I beat Loghain and opted to kill him. Then he said his final line to his daughter and it hit my like a freight train. So I reloaded and saved Loghain at the cost of Alister who my warden had romanced and I was quite fond of. But… his words just hit me and ever since Loghain has been my favorite character in the franchise. His story about his dog is just so… painful
I think killing him is a huge waste. He’s a very well written character and has even more depth through the novels. Giving him a chance for redemption feels right to me.
Agreed. I love Loghain, so complex and interesting. I actually prefer him to Alistair and didn't feel all that bad about losing him when I recruited Loghain. Also, his voice actor is marvelous.
The dialogue between him and Wynne is the best 👍. I find it amusing everyone says Loghain murdered Cailan but in truth Cailan really did rush to his own demise due to using a bad strategy for that battle against an immensely larger force that would have annihilated everyone even if Loghain did charge. Loghain did many terrible things but he is still one of my my top five favorite characters :)
If that were true why would Duncan go along with it? He was a practical man, if he believed the plan wouldn't work he would have spoken up. Instead, he endorses it and tells Cailan point-blank "The plan will work". Furthermore, Teagan also tells us that he doesn't believe Cailan would have risked his life on a plan that wouldn't work. Cailan would have survived if he had not led from the front, but that does not mean the plan itself was bad from beginning to end.
Loghain was the one who came up with that ‘bad strategy’ since he was the General of Cailan’s army and we see this in game. So yes, he did murder his King and Son in law.
It always bothered me having to choose between SC and Alistair. Sten is right (like often), why waste ressources and kill one of Ferelden's greatest generals, loved by a large part of the nobility and the common people, only to please Alistair ? And at that point, there were only three Grey Wardens remaining in Ferelden ! THREE ! One more against the Archdemon couldn't have hurt. Alistair being like "to be a Grey Warden is an honor, blablabla" is completely beside the point.
The worst part is, if you don't make the right dialogue choices with Alistair at one specific moment of the game, and during the landsmeet questline, then choose SC over Alistair, he ends up being a useless drunk, never to be heard of again... I'm really glad they made it possible ***SPOILER*** for Alistair and Anora to get married after you recruit Loghain, it's really the best way to end the civil war in my opinion, even if it's at the cost of Alistair's friendship.
Bioware really have some strange views about right and wrong sometimes. Like, in Mass Effect 2, ***SPOILER*** the good ending is to destroy the Collectors base, Shepard says stuff like "millions of people died because of this base" But in the same game, at the end of Mordin's loyalty mission, to keep Maelon's data is the good ending, and when Shepard tells Mordin that Maelon's research was sickening, Mordin says "the Krogan females died for this. Keeping the data gives a meaning to their sacrifice". The same thing happens in Mass Effect 3. After the mission at the Sanctuary, Hackett himself acknowledges that, for all the horror that happened there, the data that Cerberus have gathered will be invaluable to finish building the Crucible. So how is destroying the Collectors base the good ending ? I will never get over this.
If he stood by Cailan and gave the orders for his men to not intervene beforehand, I would've believed his words about him loving his men. He is his king's men and family. It's part of his role to die alongside him. But no, he decided to pussy out and used his men as an excuse. Literally, no honor and credibility. I wouldn't want someone like Loghain to watch my six. Ostagar showed how much of a coward he was.
@@kaidanthecursed3534 super old comment I know but actually the full paragon decision is to destroy the data because Shep says it is wrong to use the data that so many lives paid for. It's a neutral or renegade decision to tell him to save it. It ends up being the correct decision of course, since it decides Eve's fate (she dies if you destroyed the data), but it's consistent- paragons always want to destroy it and grab the high ground morally, even if its not the greatest choice tactically.
I play this game for many years now,and i always killing Loghain at lands meet,but i tried many playthroughs recently and then tried the option to letting him live and making him a grey warden, funny thing that such difficult character bioware decided to make him escape goat and then at the very end not killing the man but sparing him,great character voice by the great Simon Templeman aka the voice of Kain,long story short its more rewarding to spare him rather than just killing him imho.
It would be amazing if there was a mod that incorporated these cut scenes into the game somehow. They even have context-appropriate body language in some parts.
Loghain is not a bad character, on the contrary once you read the book and play the DLC The Wardens Keep you can understand a lot about him and his vision of the Grey Wardens and Orlais (of course the Wardens happened hundreds of years before but it is very referenced in the book as a reason for distrust of the Order). Moreover, there is content cut from Dragon Age Origins that shows that in the beginning there was an option to incorporate him into the party without losing Alistair...there are interactions between them that have been rescued via mods, supposedly it was repressed to give more drama to the Landsmeet and the confrontation between Alistair and Loghain for what happened Ostagar, but the option existed and the idea is that they forgive him and he recognized in our favorite blond a worthy heir of Maric. These interactions and his loyalty to the Grey Wardens confirms that he is a very interesting character, I always play DAO 3 times a year and always in one of them I choose him...I prefer Alistair but I don't fail to see that as a character Loghain is very deep and well built.
I didn’t even know these existed. But then again, I have never EVER let this man live. I’m 100% Alistair as I always romance him too. It’s interesting how decisions like these can make for such differing narratives. I’ve never not had Alistair as king. And I LOVE Wynne’s grilling of Loghain. And I’m chuckling at the idea of Loghain and Morrigan having to consummate for the god child. 😅
It gets worse. (Spoilers ahead for The Stolen Throne book) in the book his mother was raped by Orlesian soldiers which led his father to take young Loghain and flee to the forests after his vengeance where he raised him and they took in Fereldans hiding from Orlais and its abuse, refugees. His father died buying Maric to flee coming soldiers as the camp was destroyed.
As much of a bastard as Loghain is, I like that he has a soft spot for the mabari. We also share a hatred of Orlesians although I hate them for the silly mask and game and that they are insufferably French
The dog banter was incredibly enlightening. I can imagine a teenaged Loghain holding the corpse of his emaciated, beloved Mabari and swearing vengeance on those who brought his proud spirit-sister so low.
Loghain is one of my favorite video game characters, I always spare him. It’s quite rare in a game to be able to become best buddies with the « main » antagonist after defeating him
So... One big reason why Loghain hate Orlesian is because they took his dog and pushed it to death? And then the guy assembled an army and repel them from his country? John Wick?
My favourite outcome is always hardening Alistair's resolve so he'll marry Anora, and then recruiting Loghain and making Kieran the Warden's son so that Loghain, Alistair and the Warden all survive to Inquisition, at which point Loghain sacrifices himself to save a Ferelden Refugee who was forced to leave his home because of Loghain's actions at Ostagar.
If they plan on doing a Dragon Age 5 they should set it during the rebellion have Loghain as a companion. It would really let players understand Loghain for those of us who killed him during the landsmeet.
The Rebellion is mostly described in the Book „The Stolen Throne“ which makes Loghains Hate Boner for Orlais so much more understandable. He is one of my Favorite Characters in the Franchise
Morrigan morph (version 1) www.nexusmods.com/dragonage/mods/4663 Leliana, Wynne and Zevran morphs www.nexusmods.com/dragonage/mods/5639 Morrigan's staff www.nexusmods.com/dragonage/mods/1579 Leliana's armor and weapons www.nexusmods.com/dragonage/mods/1660 Warden armors and weapons www.nexusmods.com/dragonage/mods/3258 DA2 clothes and armor (Wynne's robes is from this mod) www.nexusmods.com/dragonage/mods/3914 That's about it :)
i don't understand WHY Loghain Mac Tir called "secret companion"? you just have to marry Anora and Alistar, or marry on Anora yourself, and you will have him, this is not a secret to anyone
There are still people playing DAO for the very first time, even today. Those who had finished the game know the Secret Companion is Loghain. And those who haven't will not be spoiled by video's tittle or thumbnail.
