I just love how loyal and sweet Tama and Sadaharu are; it's no small wonder they share the sign of Pisces, being these little sparks of hope that help Gin at his lowest point when others tend to leave him behind. (It's why they're in my Top 15.) I've mentioned it previously in the Tama Quest Arc, but i really love the fact that she develops an almost "little sister"-like relationship to Gin where she still smacks him for his stupid antics from time to time. And yet, is his most loyal bond to the end. The super underrated "Imouto" trope among the more blatant imouto tropes in Shounen that truly stands out with a unique diversity to her character as more than just the cutesy & sweet cheerleader for "Oniisan."
It is super sweet. Especially later into the arc when Sadaharu cries as he leaves behind Gintoki for the distraction move. It is something special because the relationship between Gintoki and Tama is a rare loving relationship between 2 opposite genders that is also platonic. You can tell that Tama and Gintoki care deeply for each other without it ever coming off romantic when it pretty easily could. Though I say that but it's just as likely someone takes it in a romantic way. I just see it more as like a super fan or as you said a little sister type of relationship!
@@PurpleWokeyOh, for sure. You just know there's a group, and I can understand that and respect their choice. But personally I see this as one of the better framed platonic relationships between two people of the opposite sex, who really care a lot about the other. It's very similar to the relationship of Harry and Luna in Harry Potter; where she is the one who helps him in times when he needs it most, just like Tama. And when you consider the fact that Gin more than likely didn't have a family prior to Shouyou finding him, he really does take in a lot of the residents of Kabukichou as his family. And that bolt with the ribbon was such an appropriate "lucky charn" of Tama's, as it was Gin's first present to her on their little day off together. (Still a very cute episode even now.) And yes, the way Kintoki assaulted Tama was very rage-inducing and shows that he's far more cold-blooded than Gin because he really does desire these connections to the point of hurting detractors; even if they're built on false memories that he took advantage of in a slight "accident." In retrospect, it reminds me of the Otto character in Wall-E, who became obsessed with his directive to the point he feared to lose his sense of purpose as the people realized they needed to return to Earth; therefore not needing him. Still would tear the the guy a new one for what he did to Tama though, lol.
Yeah I get it because what is romance but like two good buddies. I just choose to see them as buddies because I think it's a great example of platonic love! Which just doesn't get that much screen time Yeah exactly. I actually think while reading those books back in the day and was glad that there was 1 woman in Harry's life that had 0 romantic ties to him and was just there to be his weird buddy. We all need that! Yup Kintoki had turned into a robot who understood they had a prime directive but didn't care who he hurt to maintain it. If Gintoki did anything less than rip off his dick and nuts for what he did to Tama it would have been not enough!
I found the metaphor Otae used for Gintoki when she felt like something was wrong was a little sad, and probably the best way to describe when you feel like you're forgetting someone you were very close to; like a pair of comfortable work gloves you always used, but for some reason you feel like you misplaced it despite how often you had them around. Also, the Hasegawa and Zura interaction was a great little gag to slip in there since it's basically true. The only few times I think they've had kind of an interaction was the Ryugyujou Arc and kind of the Public Pool incident with the Shogun. They had a few more interactions in the earliest seasons, where the first time Zura met him he was trying to recruit Hasegawa while he was trying to get a new job after being fired from his prestigious Immigration Bureau position.
What she says did remind me of when I talked to my friend who got amnesia and forgot me. They try to remember but they can't. Very sad. It was a good bit because it made my brain scan all memory I had of Gintama and was like oh yeah they barely do talk to each other lol
As this continues after thorny arc, it explains gintoki’s absence for 6 months lol he was with that joui group and why he bought shinsengumi special sausages for the kids.
The funny thing is that I think the anime changed it to be like Shinsengumi Manju specials to match the "traditional" obligated gift your supposed to get your coworkers (who you TOTALLY didn't forget to get souvenirs for). 🤣
I honestly didn't think about the fact that Tsukky managed to instinctively follow along Gintoki's joke so effortlessly because of the fact that he's the real protagonist of their world.😲 Is it any wonder she's considered his one true waifu in the series? Reminds me of the natural comedic chemistry of another couple from a sitcom series, where she always seemed to know exactly how to cheer up the guy or follow up his antics when everyone else raised an eyebrow or rolled their eyes. And then for him to still manage to flirt with her with that pick up line and for her not to quite retaliate afterwards, keep up with her in a midair fight (which is pretty badass), and followed by his natural instinct to shield her when she was hurt. It really gets harder to deny they've got a great compatibility. Oh, and speaking of their sick midair tango, someone pointed out that if you followed the way in which he moves and evades, Gintoki is still trying to ensure that he not only doesn't hurt Tsukky, but also that he was making every attempt to cushion her fall; someone showed slow motions of how he used his leg to support her back as they were falling to the ground, putting her safety before his own.
It's a good early way to tell they still on a deeper level know it's him because they only really do bits with Gintoki and never Kintoki. I noticed it with Tsukky first because it reminded me of when they first met. Even when they barely knew each other they had that back and forth built in. I mean yeah get yourself a waifu that remembers you even when a robotic clone of you takes over your life! It will come in handy and you can reflirt with her all over again until she fully remembers! Oh shit I didn't notice that! That is a good ass detail!
The sad thing that both Sadaharu and Tama realize about Gin that some people don't catch on is how very lonely he is. Sadaharu actually showed this once before back in the Umibozu Arc, when Gintoki was trying to push people away the first time,. But he revealed how he knew Gin was trying to help others at the expense of losing their bonds. And it's a lot like what he was doing in the Four Devas Arc, where he feels this need to do things alone as if he has to "take responsibility" for his failure, to ensure he doesn't lose anything again. Even if it means to push people away (when that isn't what he really wants), Gintoki will do whatever it takes to protect what matters to him; even if it means being alone. And something that really shows how much he doesn't want to be by himself was when he was committing seppuku to basically factory reset the world in order to save everyone. When his small group promised they'd find him no matter where they go, you can actually see Gin break down crying; just like when he cried in front of Otose when she was wounded by Jirocho. ｡°(°¯᷄◠¯᷅°)°｡ The few times Gin ever sheds tears it's easy to miss because of how well the animators/Sorachi handle it. He's honestly one of the most endearing protagonists who can have so many great layers to love about him.
It reminds me of the memory loss arc where it seemed like Gintoki lost his memories but his friends never left him and they were able to reunite. So in that moment where he's with them and he says they will find each other again he knows they will because they already have once. It's great emotional stuff! It was between the head rip or the hug for the cover for this ep. I ended up going head rip because I didn't feel right covering up the subtitles of what he was saying in that moment
The one in the wheelchair that leads Yoshiwara is Hinowa. (You'll probably remember her more later, for sure.) Also, the thing she said about Sacchan wasn't that she liked failures, but that she's the kind of woman who's drawn to toxic relationships with no future. And then Sacchan took a deep dig on her by answering "she's one to talk," and makes an implication of her potentially toxic relationship with Hosen when he was alive. 😂
The worst feeling is I typically DO remember her name but we recorded super late that day and just mind blank... Ahhh ok I remember Sachan saying she was afraid of having a thing for failures and then Hinowa comes in and basically confirmed it. So it was muuuch stronger of a put down lol
Ahhh Kintama arc, so nostalgic, gonna listen the episode right now. Quick question, are y'all considering doing a tier list of the characters and a tier list of all the arcs after ending the series? I love listening your opinions and how it changes throughout the series!
We could do something near the end. We try to do popularity poll updates for characters in time for when they came out with the manga but an end of series character standing would be cool. As for Arcs tier list we could! I'll write it down for a future thing to talk to zen about
I think when Sorachi made this it was still up in the air on if this series was going to keep going or not. And one of the questions that came to mind is the purpose of an MC in Shounen. Naturally most protagonist in Jump are the flagship that the progress of the story functions around, along with the characters. So Gorilla addresses the idea of "If you were to replace the main character with another, will it matter to the series?" It's funny how you guys were talking about it in either the character poll arc or a random musing in one of your intros, about how more often than not it's the side characters that are favored over the protagonists, and yet Gintoki is one of the few who remained at the top of people's favorite characters for the years it ran serialization. And yet he is one of the few protagonists to address this thought by humbly expressing that it's the cast that truly makes this series shine. Even if somebody like him is replaced by another, the people who truly help him to shine the best were the people he surrounded himself with over the course of time. And when you think back on previous arcs, this definitely feels like a sort of "call back arc" to the Memory Arc from season 1 or 2; in which the protagonist forgets everything and questions on whether he truly matters in this world that didn't really seem to need or want him in the first place. It's both reflective of this series and just in general storytelling when you consider the protagonists, and sometimes it's nice to be reminded of how you need both elements (a good protagonist and cast) for a series to work in the end.
It is an interesting topic for sure. I think it's because in a lot of shonen the side characters when they get their moment are writen like Main characters. Which results in people wanting others to shine because there can typically only be 1 shining star in a shonen. Gintama is different where each cast members complements the others in same way. Allowing each to shine and keeping Gintoki pretty high up their for a MC which isn't typical in most character polls. It does remind me of the memory arc! (I actually made the previous comment about the memory arc before reading this I swear!) This feels like a 200 ep later check in on that idea now that even more memories between them have been made.
3:13 the scene with gintoki taking a look at the dvds that had kintoki took his place in the previous epsiodes. I think that was fourth wall breaking in a refreshing way because you dont see a main character reacting to the changes on a dvd. With gin being replaced by kintoki in previous arc sums up on what goes on in remastered movies or shows nowadays. When a studios company decide to remaster an existing movie or show, not only they make the visual quality more better, but they would sometimes cut out bits of scenes, change a scene (most famously among star wars fans the han shot first controversy in the 1997 star wars remastered version), or replace actors with post production edits. Think of the numerous remaster sof original trilogy star wars,
I didn't think about that but you make a good point. It actually reminds me of the terrible job James Cameron has done with his recent restorations. They have polish but it's all fake and look way worst than how they were originally intended to be seen
It's a very subtle running gag, but every so often the classic J-Pop/Rock band, B'Z is brought up in the series as Otae's (and most likely Gorilla's) favorite band. Though tbf B'Z was a very popular band in Japan where a lot of their songs kept making the "Top" something list. I think in the Rakujyou Arc (with Otohime, the amanto queen) Otae's secret was exposed that she tended to sing B'Zs music out loud when no one was looking, and Masao tried to comfort her saying, "Hey, it's a pretty catch song. I end up singing it from time to time, too." Such a fourth wall thing for Sorachi to do by self-inserting his personal preferences in music. 😂
Man, when you consider the fact that if Kintoki 'was' a real person and not a robot, the way that Gin savagely tears out his package and shoves it into his eyes and mouth is damned brutal; and it kind of makes me wonder if perhaps those were some brutally feral tactics that he used while living on the battlefield as a kid. Or even as a soldier when he was backed to a corner with no allies to lean on. Ita kind of like what they often say about Gin in the series how he feels like a washed-up loser, but when he taps into his dormant instincts of the past to survive, he's way more savage and unhinged than your average shounen protagonist; let alone their mentor figures. Hes almost a seinen protagonist, really.
It reminds me a bit of Samurai Jack where Samurai Jack typically held back from going too crazy on living people but as soon as a robot came his way bro went full demon on them. Gintoki is basically a walking demon that is only held back by his friends existing. It's why when it looked like Otose died he went back to that. The way he fights isn't human, it has no grace, it has no tactics, it only kills.
It's funny how K-Drama generally felt like the "romance bible" of most women (that range a spectrum from teens to elderly), particularly in Asian countries. I do believe Kagura tends to use Otose's dramas (as well as her own) to usually frame her seemingly "innocent" playtime, which is honestlt how it goes for girls growing up. Not surprisingly Tama would also save this to her data bank as useful info.
They are! I have a friend deep into K-Drama and if you get him started he will let you know about them. He's how I got access to a place with super sentai eps on it because he's that srs about em. If that many woman follow em they got to have some good ideas in em. Might be worth looking into a bit... for research!
Oh, Benizakura 'truly' will reach it's peak soon enough. 😏 Or at least give a little more context to what some of those characters said. Like you once mentioned, when you're watching Gintama you cant escape that arc. And yeah, i think we did talk about how Zura really changed a lot from Benizakura, and how it was one of his big character developments. Funny how incredibly consistent he is since that point.
We will be there making note of every #Benizakuramentioned moment! Ah ok I know it was with someone I talked a lot of Gintama with. So it was either you or Zen lol He really is. Which is impressive because it's not like he's in every episode but he still has his own arc and I can follow it even though he sometimes leaves for 5 eps at a time
What an irony that the person who plays Kintoki Sakata is none other than the infamous Satoru Gojo (fellow sweet tooth and mentor); the anime ikimen everyone idolizes as much as Cinnamonroll who's practically flawless in his universe.😂 Coincidentally Yuichi Nakamura (Gojo) is one of Tomokazu Sugita's best friends. And much of the goofy side of Gojo stems from the inspiration he got while working with the cast of Gintama. I think him and Sugita tend to joke around a lot, and even went as far as to switch places during recording sessions to see if people could tell when one was Gintoki and the other was Gojo. (In retrospect it makes me hopeful Nakamura will be casted for a role in Sakamoto Days, just so we can see him and Sugita banter off each other again. 😂)
Holy crap it was! They picked the right VA because he is good at playing those types of characters lol That's Awesome! He could play Nagumo from Sakamoto Days. It would be fitting since he's a friend of Sakamoto and kind of fits the pretty boy character type. Plus it would let them play off each other
@@PurpleWokeyThat would be amazing if he makes it as Nagumo. 😄 Right? And this was before JJK got the green light to have an anime, so they were probably already sizing him for the role in the end. I feel like he learned a lot from Sugita to polish up this charismatic type of character who has this underlying "annoying" later that get under people's skin; even more so because he's got a devil-may-care attitude.
It would be sick... can't wait for when get to cover that on the show! Makes sense to me. If your going to learn how to play that type of character you may as well learn it from Sugita
When I read and watched this arc, I was dying from laughter. 😂 Naturally I laughed even harder when this came out in the anime because the VAs make a big difference for the comedy routines and timing. Some of the parts that made me laugh hard were Gintoki internally cussing everyone out for forgetting him after 6 months, Otose & Catherine getting emotional when Kintoki gives the rent on time + vacation money, the DVDs/"Oops! Sorry!!" Gags, the competition between the Yorozuyas, and the Mantama shoujo mock up series at the end. Hilariously, the Mantama thing is even funnier when you were in Japan when it was on air. Because apparently when it was running, the TV guides and stuff that announced the series and their time slot showed the title "Mantama" instead of Gintama. And this really got people riled up (particularly adults and the Shueisha/Bandai company), because the title translates to "Vagina & Balls." So that cute and shoujoesque theme song they made is simply chanting Vagina & Balls over and over again for the kids. 😂 (Sadly, I think the editor at the time had to get called in the office for Gintama's stunt; yet again).
@@PurpleWokeySo true lmao. Even adult animated series in the West have yet to take the plunge, where tv guides and such say vulgar words. 😂 Gintama is like Japan's Deadpool; can't filter this person, even if you tried. Oh, and something else to suggest on looking back at the Mantama Opening Theme is the fact that there I'd a brief moment you see a K-On reference; But it's actually the gender bend version of the Joi Four; Gintoki, Takasugi, Sakamoto, and Zura. 😂 I failed to notice it so many times because it happened so fast. But when I paused it one time, I couldn't help noticing one girl (the keyboardist) had an eye patch, and another had similar hair to Sakamoto. It's such a funny and cute detail; and perhaps somewhat of a subtle means to ensure we get our Joi Four quota, even in an AU opening theme. 😅
Absolutely top level joke for sure. That would get you some kind of fine over here lol I actually did notice that! I forgot to bring it up because it was a super late recording. We are planning something with OPs and I'll be sure to bring it up when we get to Mantama!
